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DJI Member Posts: 76 |
As I was checking out the members directory for hotmail.com, I started to view some of the pics that were posted there. I was strictly in the directory for Alexandria. I was very surprised by the attire of the young egyptian girls. Either they were showing cleavage, or showing their bellys, wearing low rise jeans, or wearing spaghetti strap tops. I thought this was not permissable of Egyptian ladies. Granted, these girls were between the ages of 16-30, but still I was very surprised. Meanwhile, it has been recommended that when I visit Egypt, in order not to be harrassed I should be covered. Can someone please explain this to me? I have read on this site and many others, that foreign women are viewed as sluts, not only because of their behavior, but also because of how they dress; but it looks to me that those Egyptian girls do not dress any differently than the girls in America. IP: Logged |
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Debbie Member Posts: 2030 |
DJI - Yes, it is very confusing. Egypt is a contry of contradictions in many ways. We have women that are completely covered to the point of not even being able to see her eyes clearly, to what you saw on the web site of the Britney Spears wannabes. What you have been told still holds true regarding how YOU should dress. Keep in mind that Egypt is this country of contradictions. It is made up of all sorts of types of people, and keep in mind unless you know the language extremely well, you still need to be safe. The way to remain as safe and unbothered as possible is to be respectful to the people. There are those that would say all those young girls in the pictures are sluts as well, and if you dress like them you will be considered trashy. The differences lie in a couple of areas... first, no matter how trashy anyone thinks these girls look, most of the people would defend them regarding their virginity. Egyptian girls are just held in higher regard that way than western women are. It may not be right or fair, but that is the way it is. If a western woman looks like a whore, she probably is a whore. If an Egyptian girl looks like a whore, she is probably sexy virgin.... go figure. IP: Logged |
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DJI Member Posts: 76 |
Dear Debbie, thank you for your very insightful reply. I should have realized the double standards. Before my boyfriend went back to Egypt, we went shopping for what seemed like his entire family, nieces, nephews, so on. Most of the clothes we bought the girls were indeed American style clothes; however, he has informed me many times that when I come to visit I can not wear the clothes that I normally wear. Still, I was very surprised, especially when I saw cleavage. IP: Logged |
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Sylvia Junior Member Posts: 4 |
But Debbie how do you tell if a piece of cloth is thrashy or not?? In Italy we dont consider females who wear shorts to be '''whorish'''' or thrashy!! let alone in 40C heat! The Egyptian perceptions about what is 'trashy' and what is not is different to the Italian! Many Egyptians would consider thrashy even a conservative dressing!! (by italian standards) we in Italy consider thrashy complete different clothing than the egyptians do. Do you agree? IP: Logged |
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Debbie Member Posts: 2030 |
quote: And therein lies the problem. Yes, the definition of "trashy" or "whore-ish" is different. THAT IS WHAT WE ARE SAYING, and a woman that comes to Egypt as a guest needs to educate herself about what is customary in THIS country, not follow standards from her own country. Wearing more clothes rarely would offend anyone, so if a Muslim woman travels to Italy and dresses in a conservative manner, she is probably not going to offend anyone. If an Italian woman travels to Egypt and dresses in the same manner as she dresses at home, there will be lots of people offended (because of what you said... your standards for "conservative" are quite different from the Muslim definition). That may not be exactly "fair", but it is the way it is, and to be a responsible traveler/guest in a country, one should make some attempt to understand the customs and not offend the hosts. Does that make sense? IP: Logged |
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Sylvia Junior Member Posts: 4 |
That is only partly true Debbie! I know many people in Italy who would get offended to see women covered from top to toe!! I know people who have changed neighbourhoods because of that! As for educating yourself on clothing i believe that you can only ''''educate'''' yourself up to a certain degree!! Even wearing jeans might be offending to some in Egypt!! My advice is be yourself!!! You can't please anyone! You can only respect the customs of a country as long as your own are not infringed upon! Sometimes there is no compromise! Sometimes there's nothing you can do to avoid people from getting offended! Sometimes your very own existence might be offending to some! The nice Egyptians will respect you, but some others you just can't please! Try to care to show respect for the customs of a country, but don't worry or think too much about it! IP: Logged |
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freeman Member Posts: 433 |
debbie you seems very busy replying on every single topic don't youhave a better thing to do I see you have a company , why don't you go and run it ,if business is not rolling .why don't you find me a good hotel rate for both of us at Elshokhna for the weekend IP: Logged |
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curious Member Posts: 40 |
Hotel Portrait has 250 LE for double bedroome but on negotiating, they can come down to 200 LE, they have very nice rooms, swimming pool and beaches, try it, its not that costly i guess, the Ein Sokhna Hotel is under rennovation and i guess they offer the same service in 70 LE per night. My opinion about sea lovers is that they are more concerned about sea rather than the standard of hotel in terms of furniting etc. IP: Logged |
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Debbie Member Posts: 2030 |
quote: Freeman.... nice post. Now we know a bit more about you, don't we? Any questions anyone? IP: Logged |
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KT Junior Member Posts: 16 |
Upper class Egyptian girls mimic western culture not only because they are better educated, but they also have an eye on international media and it is considered the national living standard for wealthy Egyptians. This doesn't just happen in Egypt, it happens everywhere in the world. Any western woman should be able to go to Egypt and not have a problem dressing in her usual style of clothing from her native country. To avoid attention, make sure you are hanging out with the right crowd. AUC students in Cairo are liberal and open minded. Sporting clubs are full of western stereotypes as well as restaurants like Chili's where I'm sure you'll fit right in. If you go out into the countryside by peasant farmers you will definitely get strange looks. Also beware of taxi drivers. I would know, I'm a 20 year old guy, born and raised in Egypt for 9 years before moving to Florida in '91. I like to think I have a unique personality with an open perspective on all kinds of stuff that deals with cultural diversity, I have a knack for hackin away at east vs. west when it comes to ethics and morality. Peace, IP: Logged |
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moshko Member Posts: 121 |
NOW YOU ARE STARTING TO REALIZE WHAT I WAS TRYING TO CONVEY TO YOU EARLIER...lol...whoever gave you the wrong idea about Egyptian women and how they dress is either from the countryside of Egypt or don't live there!!!
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KT Junior Member Posts: 16 |
quote: ahahaha.. it's always funny when people find out Egypt isn't exactly how they saw it on the discovery channel. Oh well. PEACE KT IP: Logged |
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moshko Member Posts: 121 |
looool KT....Can you imagine DJI in Hard Rock cairo or Ritmo Semiramis or any of the boats on the nile river where on NIGHTLY BASES there is the most fashinoable crowds, the most beautiful attractive chicks...PURE EGYPTIAN mini and micro skirts waving the Salsa dance right and left...hahaha... too bad you had the wrong people telling you things about Egypt Dji, you need a guy like me to show you around...lol
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DJI Member Posts: 76 |
Dear Moshko, basically I think, you are full of ----! First of all it was my boyfriend who insist that I am suppose to keep my arms covered; when wearing jeans, my shirt must cover my buttocks, and definately no cleavage. I am sure no matter where I visit, I will feel comfortable in my attire, and basically I can keep up with any "chick" waving her booty. I wonder how well you can keep up? IP: Logged |
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KT Junior Member Posts: 16 |
Hey now, DJI, it's okay.. I'm sure you can get down with the best of 'em. I guess what we're trying to say is, contrary to what your boyfriend might have you think, most upper class Egyptians would have no problem with your style as long as you stick to upper class establishments. Don't go out into the country wearin that kinda **** or you might get some very unwanted attention. IP: Logged |
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DJI Member Posts: 76 |
Dear KT, I apologize for coming off a little hard, sometimes Moshkos' comments on quite a few subjects, really gets me going. I guess, until I actually arrive in Egypt, will I see for myself what is the most appropriate attire. I am sure, like anywhere else, it will depend on what we are doing, or where we are going that day. IP: Logged |
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moshko Member Posts: 121 |
To begin with, in order for your boyfriend to style you the way you described. Then he must be living either in the country or tepically from a lower middle class and nothing wrong with both. What I don't like is that he made sure that you think of Egypt in general this way and the prove of that is simply "this topic"... Regarding the language you used with me, it looks to me that you fit right with your boyfriend's class prefrence...lol
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moshko Member Posts: 121 |
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DJI Member Posts: 76 |
Dear Moshko, I seriously think that you owe me an apology. First of all, what kind of language did I use with you? Anywhere in any of my post, have you ever seen me write something bad? All you do is knock everyone on here, and then boast, consistently, about how you never have a woman longer that 3 months. I imagine that is how long it takes a woman to dump your butt. My boyfriend lives in Alex., owns his own construction business, as for me I am an RN. The reason I wrote to you that you are full of it, is because, consistently, people with knowledge, do tell me that when I visit, in order not to be harrassed, I should wear appropriate clothing. In fact, even your own Embassy along with the American embassy, has made this suggestion also. As for class, you think you have it? If I were you I would take a serious look at yourself in the mirror. Class has nothing to do with money, it has everything to do with how one presents themselves to others, and you, my friend; you know what, I will not lower myself to your level. IP: Logged |
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aly Junior Member Posts: 1 |
Moshko, this is man of DJI. Maybe you like to meet with me face to face, to talk about your answer you give DJI. Or will you continue to hide behind computer? IP: Logged |
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moshko Member Posts: 121 |
Dji, your really turned it into a fight already. I pity your low IQ...lol...by the way the American embassy is my embassy as well...as for you poor Ali...look at what you're doing...you sound like a clown...
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DJI Member Posts: 76 |
Moshko, I turned this into a fight? It amazes me how you can actually believe you are superior to anyone, let alone me. Now that is something to LOL(as you commonly refer to in every single post). As for your comment to Aly, I believe he is right, you act like a big man on a keyboard, but in the real world...well I do not not even have to say it, your reply tells everyone exactly what kind of person you are. IP: Logged |
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moshko Member Posts: 121 |
Dji and Ali....you are so intertaining...please keep going ...don't stop...lol ------------------ [This message has been edited by moshko (edited 11 September 2003).] IP: Logged |
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Debbie Member Posts: 2030 |
DJI and aly - As aly probably knows all too well already, Moshko is one of several thousand Egyptians that think they are American because they have dual passports. Can't think of any other reason why he would claim the American Embassy as his own. They do seem to recieve a "tude" along with the little blue book when they get it handed to them. IP: Logged |
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DJI Member Posts: 76 |
Dear Debbie, I am sure you are probably right. I was, in fact, curious as to why he would say that the American Emabassy is his, and according to his profile, he list his home as US. I would think by now, if his home is in fact here, he would have at least learned how to spell properly. Being that he seems to feel superior, to just about everyone. Aly, is right, he is not worth anyones time, let alone ours. Who really knows if he truly is of Egyptian descent? IP: Logged |
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citizen Member Posts: 289 |
I think the question here is what is the 'real Egypt'? Is it the 'fashionable crowd' at the Ritmo or Hard Rock Cafe? Or is it the less fashionable crowd that are barred from these places? If we rely on statistics, the percentage of Egyptians who frequent these hot spots would be say 0.5% of the population, maybe 1%? Maybe Moshko needs to be shown around the Egypt where 99% of the population lives. IP: Logged |
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moshko Member Posts: 121 |
Debbie read above. This is what she has up there >>>"In fact, even your own Embassy along with the American embassy, has made this suggestion also" And Debbie, you don't know me, don't DJI, you're still entertaining... keep going ...don't stop!!!
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DJI Member Posts: 76 |
Moshko, you forgot something in your last post....lol IP: Logged |
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moshko Member Posts: 121 |
Dji, you can't fail me can you...lol...you really can't stop ...I love it... Debbie I forgot to remind you of the grand ma and the grand pa who once came to the US on a boat ...shoesless...lol
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Sandal Member Posts: 34 |
DJI: I think it is a mistake to think that Egyptians girls dress like the girls you are talking about. The photos that you see are likely not theirs to begin with. And Citizen is absolutely correct. IP: Logged |
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DJI Member Posts: 76 |
Dear Sandal, The photos that were on hotmail.com directory were indeed their own photos. I do not think bad of anyone for the way they dress and that goes for anybody, anywhere. I was just very surprised based on the info I was given by friends of mine who are Egyptian; however here in NY, especially Astoria, Queens, where there is a high population of Arabic people, all the young Egyptian girls dress according to American fashion. That being said, I do believe both Debbie and Citizens' replies were probably the most accurate.Moshko, as for you, no matter what I may think about you, I do find most of your post quite amusing. C'mon, why don't you come clean, you really are a lonely, old man who sits on his computer trying to make people believe that you are some young stud. I bet if I went to forums of other nationalities, I would find your post there as well, maybe trying to pass for some young hot Italian,or Spanish, or German stud. Egyptian? I do not think so! I was glad to see that this time on your last post you did not forget your signature mark... the LOL. IP: Logged |
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moshko Member Posts: 121 |
hahahaa Dji you are in Queens oh my oh my....I'm right across the bridge to the Island...so how about a cup of coffee with the old man and you see for yourself how old and pathetic I'm!!! The question is "how big are you"!!! I'm giving you a chance DJI, you don't even dream to date a guy like me. Ps: Ali will understand, he seems to be a modern gentleman.
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DJI Member Posts: 76 |
Dear Moshko, first of all, I do not live in Queens, I live on Long Island. I use to go to Astoria quite often with Aly, because of all the Egyptian people who live there, he felt at home. Second, what do you me by " how big am I"? Do you mean body size or do you mean do I have the nerve to take you on? As far as Aly being modern, he is and then again he isn't, depends on the situation. As for him being upset if I was to meet you, he is very confident in my feelings for him, there is no male that is a threat to him. I don't even dream to date a guy like you? Well... you got me on that one!!! ( I am very funny, aren't I ) IP: Logged |
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schatze Junior Member Posts: 26 |
sylvia, i think you are generalising about italy - as an italian i can tell you that very much depends on where you go in italy - short skirts and excessive displays of clevage are not acceptable in rural areas whether in the north or south of italy or on the islands and italian women are indeed considered sluts if they wear them - foreign women in general have always been considered 'easy'regardless of what they wear - their appeal has always been more in the fact that they would engage in sex more easily than italian women who, even to this day, are forever caught in the dilemma of the madonna and the whore (same goes for the men i am afraid) - italy itself, with all its pretence of developed country, is a country of great contradiction, take as example the vatican on one side of rome and cicciolina (when she was an esponent of the radical party some years ago) taking her clothes off on the other end of the city - not to mention the much visual presence of nudity on posters and tv etc in contrast with the deep catholicism and bigotism of ordinary people - being yourself is not enough if it means insulting local customs - i think italians should stop moralising about other countries, especially those they consider "third world", and look more closely at what goes on in their own homes rather than pretent they are so advanced and open minded - just because italians are now more financially able to travel out of their own country does not mean that they have evolved culturally or emotionally - italian mentality, despite the country's economical development, remains extremely provincial accross the regions all over - as an italian who has lived abroad for many years, i am constantly surprised at this fact when i return to italy on my more or less yearly visits.
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moshko Member Posts: 121 |
Moshko is not well... ------------------ IP: Logged |
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DJI Member Posts: 76 |
Moshko, did you just chicken out? IP: Logged |
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Debbie Member Posts: 2030 |
quote: Excuse me..... HUH? IP: Logged |
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Bebe Member Posts: 75 |
quote: There is some great online 'chemistry' going on between 2 of you. And I am not kidding. This does not happen online so often, both of you would be crazy to miss this chance. quote: Ali, it seems to me that Moshko is a man. LOL. [This message has been edited by Bebe (edited 14 September 2003).] IP: Logged |
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moshko Member Posts: 121 |
The night was silent. Something was moving in the dark. Moshko is sleeping like an angel in his bed after a vicious accident. All of the sudden, a shadow of a small creature moving on the edge of the bed...a little Dinosaur called DJI (who is trying persistently to give Moshko nightmares), appeared out of nowhere and in no time DJI the Dinosaur jumped on Moshko's face grabing his lips left and right, trying to eat him alive. Looking at his eyes, DJI the Dinosaur for the first time wished if she was a human so she can drop the little "other" Dinosaur Ali and date human Moshko. [This message has been edited by moshko (edited 14 September 2003).] IP: Logged |
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Nefertiti Member Posts: 557 |
quote: Did Ali try to run you over! DJI why did you bring your boyfriend on the board anyway? Seeing as this is Internet you can easily ignore people you don't like.... that's just like school playground stuff! So Moshko, who are YOU gonna bring onto the board.... Big brother? DJI maybe you should take Mosko's email and you can get all your mates to send him emails challenging him to a fight, or maybe you could just be adult and ignore him IP: Logged |
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moshko Member Posts: 121 |
Nefertiti....who's the hell are u...hush
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Nefertiti Member Posts: 557 |
quote: Actually Moshy dear, it's 'who' the hell are you. I could ask you the same thing, but i don't care IP: Logged |
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moshko Member Posts: 121 |
Why are you commenting on my spellings...are you paranoid?...why would I give you importance and precisely watch what I'm typing. It's like you have nothing better to attack me with. Is that lame? vain? self insecurity? feminin insufficiency? Nice meeting you anyway.
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Nefertiti Member Posts: 557 |
quote: Yeah it was nice meeting you too IP: Logged |
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DJI Member Posts: 76 |
Dear Nefertiti, I did not bring Aly onto the board, he is an adult and does what he wants. As for Aly challenging Moshko, the Aly that challenged him on this forum, is not my boyfriend, I do not even know who that was; I assumed it was a mistaken identity and let it go. Also, just for your info, on another post, I have given Moshko my e mail address, so that he could send me his pic, (curiousity kills the cat), however; he has never replied. As for you Moshko, you really do have a good sense of humor, even if you are pompous. Maybe, just maybe, this little dinosaur could turn human, who knows; stranger things have happened. IP: Logged |
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moshko Member Posts: 121 |
DJI ...today is your lucky day ... check your mail quote: [This message has been edited by moshko (edited 14 September 2003).] IP: Logged |
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DJI Member Posts: 76 |
Moshko, I thought that was you in there, a little small aren't you? [This message has been edited by DJI (edited 14 September 2003).] IP: Logged |
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DJI Member Posts: 76 |
Moshko, why do you keep editing your post? IP: Logged |
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moshko Member Posts: 121 |
i'm typing with one hand...other one in cast quote: ------------------ IP: Logged |
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DJI Member Posts: 76 |
moshko, what happened? What kind of accident did you have? Are you okay? IP: Logged |
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