posted 04 October 2004 01:42 AM            

Well there are more others that we cannot eat....like emulsifier 471 which is known as non halah animal fats

posted 04 October 2004 06:12 AM            

But the Quram does say that if you are hungry, then its okay, 'IF' it can't be avoided.

Here's a good site for further references of what foods are halal:
http://www.ifanca.org/halal.htm

And here is another site of some of the 'hidden' animal products in food. (so read ingredients )
http://cyberparent.com/eat/hiddenanimalsinfood.htm

posted 04 October 2004 07:48 AM            

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Originally posted by fahdyassine:
Where do you live Ebru ?
if you live in an arabic country then all the food will be 100%halal unless you specifically chose to eat pork and that wont be available probably except in Egypt and Lebanon probably. Other than that , meat has to be slaughtered according to the islamic Sharia'a , and that is by saying the Tashahod when slaughtering it , and it has to be slautered by the neck and left to bleed completely , as much as that might sound rough to you , it is actually proven to be healthy , cause blood in teh meat is dangerous. YOu dont eat animals that have claws basically because they eat other animals . you only eat vegetarian animals or birds .and by the way the fat thing is not right . you are misinformed. you just dont eat fat from pigs that is all.

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I'm sorry but I disagree that just because you're in an arabic country to food is "100% halal" thats inaccurate. There are thousands of international food chains, and you DO NOT KNOW what ingredients are in the prepared foods such as macdonalds, pizza hut, Kfc, just to name a few. And there are Christians, and other non muslims living in these countries as well. For all you know the dough used in apple pies could have been cooked in Lard which contain pig fat, or the ice cream there could have gelatin, which is made from pig skin, some French restaurants prepare food with wine, etc, etc, and all these resataraunts are in "muslims countries" NOTHING is 100% when dealing with fast food that caters to non muslims as well and I can almost guarantee that you dont know how the animals used to prepare the meat were slaughtered.

Unless you stick to one of those establishments Jane described in Luxor, where the pluck the chicken right there on the spot. ( I thought that was cute Jane, I really liked that story )

posted 04 October 2004 08:05 AM            

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Originally posted by AnotherNewMember:
Unless you stick to one of those establishments Jane described in Luxor, where the pluck the chicken right there on the spot. ( I thought that was cute Jane, I really liked that story )

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Yes I must admit it does take a bit of getting used to seeing dinner running around and squawking.

I know from personal experience that resturants in Egypt do serve non halal dishes. I was having lunch in the Sheraton with my daughter and some tourists guests. My daughter gave the order in Arabic for everyone. The waiter then engaged her in conversation and eventaully wrote it down and went away. Aparently one of dishes was not halal and because she was obviously a local he was warning her in case she was having that particular dish. Now if you were a muslim that didn't look like a local you would not have got that same warning.

PS I thought it was really nice of him to be so thoughtful and concerned for her.

So as has been said it is better to prepare the food yourself if you want to be sure. And when in resturants ask the staff if the dish is halal and when buying food in supermarkets read the ingrediants carefully

posted 04 October 2004 01:54 PM            

I agree with those who are saying you cannot believe that all food sold in Muslim countries is halal, you have to be particularly careful of any imported food, e.g. meat or meat products are the obvious ones, unless they specifically say halal on them and also candies/sweets and ice cream are the worst offenders for having animal source gelatin in them.

But its not only the imported stuff, Fairouz (? spelling) drinks still have a small amount of alcohol left in them so they are out, as a Muslim cannot take a little of something that is forbidden, even if it would take a large amount to cause a negative effect. Also nutmeg is sold here without any precautionary warning along with Vanilla essence.

posted 05 October 2004 03:41 PM            

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Originally posted by MohdAnwar:
there is a Clear answer about that in Quran which is:
1- everything died (birds , animals)
2-Blood
3-wine and everything contain alchol
4-Pigs
5-eagles, Lions, tigers,...etc (i don't know what it means in English but in arabic means "goarh")
6-Anything u sacrificing it and willing gratification anyone else God

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posted 06 October 2004 03:11 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by TheMark:
Sorry, I'm not muslim, so can you also explain me WHY the Quran says you can't eat such foods?
thanx

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first of all thanks for your interest about Islam.
second allthough i will give some brief explination about this food but i must ensure something that we beleive in islam and we are sure that anything that islam tell us is for good for us and we find out that day after day for example.
1-(Pigs) islam told us to not eat pork and the modern scince found there is a harmfull type of bacterial that live in his meats and kidney.
2-(Wine) allthough islam told us that there is some benefits in drinking wine but he order us to not drink is cause islam want the muslium always awake and not obey his body desires (control himself) to could worship and also manage his life and wine in many cases make u lose your mind when u are drunk and could be lose a lot of things during this hours u are drunk.
3-(Blood) I think u can see what happend about cow maddness when they mixed the blood with their food cause it contain protein.
4-(what anyone sacrificing for someone else god), I don't know if this customs in your country or not but up to now there is some ppl who sacrificing animals for Jinn and god always want us to not fear or ask help from anyone else God
5-(Died animals and Birds) you yourself would u like to eat died animals or birds. i don't have sources about the explination but i think it is (self-evident)

posted 08 October 2004 12:26 PM            

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Originally posted by TheMark:
I guess some day science will prove also that women MUST NOT have the same rights as men....

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Mark don't confuse cultural traditions with religion. The Quran say both men and women are equal in the following verses:

3:195 "I shall not lose sight of the labor of any of you who labors in My way, be it man or woman; each of you is equal to the other "

4:32 "Men shall have the benefit of what they earn and women shall have the benefit of what they earn; and ask Allah of His grace; surely Allah knows all things"

4:124 " If any do deeds of righteousness,- be they male or female - and have faith, they will enter Heaven, and not the least injustice will be done to them."

So some of the unequal things you see in places like Saudi is the work of man and not the work of God, as some have chosen Hadiths over the Quran, like the Hadith of Bukhary out of context which says:

""Women are naturally, morally and religiously defective". (Bukhary).

But you and I both know that there are things women can do men can't, like the natural ability to bear kids and endure child labor. But testorone gives men more physical strength in other areas... and as you stated Science has already proven men are physically stronger than women, hence there are jobs they can do that women may have a more difficult time doing.

posted 09 October 2004 02:33 AM            

TheMark, can u please tell me what u heard about islam exactly that not giving woman human rights. if u know something please tell and i can explain to u may be u miss understood something or u may be u mix up with some muslium behviour that not as islam as (As written before cluture issues).

posted 09 October 2004 04:34 AM            

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Originally posted by AnotherNewMember:
Science has already proven men are physically stronger than women, hence there are jobs they can do that women may have a more difficult time doing.

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In today's world physical strengh has become pretty much insignificant, men's advantage in this area doesn't really play a role any more, so why bring this up at all?

posted 09 October 2004 06:32 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by MohdAnwar:
Anyone who know about the western civlization and what gives to woman rights can he tell me what it gives about.

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posted 09 October 2004 06:55 AM            

I mean many ppl in west talking about Woman rights. can u give me what is the womans rights in western civilization

posted 09 October 2004 10:42 AM            

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Originally posted by Dalia:

Which jobs? I don't think many women want to be construction workers, LOL.

In today's world physical strengh has become pretty much insignificant, men's advantage in this area doesn't really play a role any more, so why bring this up at all?

And besides, women are physically weaker but proven to have more endurance.

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Well, well, since you're being cynical, I guess I can be cynical as well, how about convincing one of these renaissance women to go sign up to play football with the Dallas Cowboys, and see how QUICKLY she gets discriminated against! Let's face it there are some thing made just for a man. Whether we like it or not dear. It has less to do with human rights and more to do with human ABILITIES. As I stated before it has to do with PHYSICAL abilities, endurance is MENTAL my dear.

posted 09 October 2004 10:57 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by MohdAnwar:
Anyone who know about the western civlization and what gives to woman rights can he tell me what it gives about.

1- Woman name after marriage
2- Her inheritance and the finanical issues with her husband
3- Respect and keeping her

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1. A woman has the right to keep her own surname after a marriage if she chooses, there is no law saying she has to take her husbands name, its just a tradition.
2. In the states, if there is no WILL, the wife(widow) and kids under 18 has first rights, then all other next of kin if no wife and kids, all decided by courts.
3. Respect is a personal option not a law.

The major thing in the west different from Egypt, is employers can't discriminate on the basis of sex, religion, race, or age, the way they advertise for jobs. But it is still done covertly, there is a system practice called the "good ole boy" which is about WHO you know, not WHAT you know, and the preference is still for young white men for certain positions, whether people will admit it or not, its done.

But just as the west was not always free of discrimination, maybe more women in the Middle east will do something to fight for their human rights as they become more educated.

posted 09 October 2004 11:29 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by AnotherNewMember:
Well, well, since you're being cynical, I guess I can be cynical as well, how about convincing one of these renaissance women to go sign up to play football with the Dallas Cowboys, and see how QUICKLY she gets discriminated against! Let's face it there are some thing made just for a man. Whether we like it or not dear. It has less to do with human rights and more to do with human ABILITIES. As I stated before it has to do with PHYSICAL abilities, endurance is MENTAL my dear.

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posted 09 October 2004 11:38 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by AnotherNewMember:
Well, well, since you're being cynical, I guess I can be cynical as well, how about convincing one of these renaissance women to go sign up to play football with the Dallas Cowboys, and see how QUICKLY she gets discriminated against! Let's face it there are some thing made just for a man. Whether we like it or not dear. It has less to do with human rights and more to do with human ABILITIES. As I stated before it has to do with PHYSICAL abilities, endurance is MENTAL my dear.

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I'm not denying the fact that men are physically stronger then women in general, but the point I was making was that I don't really understand why this fact should play a role when discussing gender relations and -rights.

And, btw, I WAS referring to physical and not mental endurance.

posted 09 October 2004 11:46 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by TheMark:
or shouldn't she be entitled of the same inheritance as her brother? has it something to do with phisical power??

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quote:

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Originally posted by TheMark:
or shouldn't she be entitled of the same inheritance as her brother? has it something to do with phisical power??

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Islamic Inheritance

A source of significant controversy both inside and outside the Muslim community is the Islamic law of inheritance. This "law" is in fact a continuing process of interpretation of Quranic rules and principles to form the complex "laws" of inheritance under Islam. It is a dynamic process which, based on specific text in the Quran and traditions of the Prophet Muhammad, continues to be discussed in each Islamic age by Muslim scholars addressing changing issues and times.

Before delving into this complicated and controversial area, one must first realize that Islam revolutionized women's inheritance rights. Prior to the Quranic injunction -- and indeed in the west until only recently -- women could not inherit from their relatives, and in the case of Arabia at least, were themselves bequeathed as if they were property to be distributed at the death of a husband, father, or brother. Thus, Islam, by clearly stating in the Quran that women have the right to inherit for themselves, changed the status of women in an unprecedented fashion. The Quran states:

"Men shall have a share in what parents and kinsfolk leave behind, and women shall have a share in what parents and kinsfolk leave behind." (Quran 4:7).

Thus, whether women can inherit at all is not the controversy. Rather, the dispute centers around the "share" that is to be inherited.

The same chapter of the Quran goes on to state in detail the division of property based on the number of relatives and the level of kinship of the inheritor. (See Quran 4:11) The injunction that a male relative receives a share equal to that of two females applies only to the inheritance of children by their parents.

...

Bearing in mind that these verses were revealed in Arabia over 1400 years ago, when women had no financial security other than what was provided by men, these verses demonstrate the care and respect given to the family unit, and ensured that women's rights would continue to be protected. Hence, brothers with sisters were given larger shares than their sisters, together with the legal obligation to spend a portion of this wealth on those sisters.

Within the field of Islamic scholarship, there is much discussion on the topic of inheritance. There are scholars who argue that these rules apply only if no will was left by the deceased and that the division can be changed by a will. Presumably, the will would be analogous to a debt and would be paid prior to any other disbursement of property. (See Quran 4:11; Fathi Osman, Muslim Women in the Family and in the Society, at 24-25.) Furthermore, a tradition of the Prophet Muhammad states that a person can will up to one-third of his or her property in any manner, thus allowing equalization of gender-based default presumptions. (It should be noted that a majority of the Sunni schools of thought state that the one-third share cannot be bequeathed to natural heirs; however, others, including the Shiite school, disagree with this limitation.) Moreover, transfers of property can be made during the life of the testator.

The majority of schools argue that the verses provide guidance as to who should be provided for and at what level. Furthermore, there are scholars who maintain that these laws are applicable only in an Islamically-based legal system and government where a woman would have recourse against a relative who was obligated to provide for her but failed to do so. One may argue that in the absence of a complete application of Islamic law, where the rights of women will have no teeth, Muslims should turn to the spirit of that law, which is justice, and find ways to accomplish this goal. This is especially true where Muslims are a minority, as in the United States. Muslim scholars, legislators, and researchers must -- and are beginning to -- boldly address this issue to focus on these challenges. The Islamic laws of inheritance are, like all issues in Islamic law, a dynamic process that must respond to the many challenges and opportunities that world changes present.

posted 09 October 2004 12:12 PM            

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Originally posted by TheMark:
c'mon, don't be silly!
sure a woman can't play football against men, but isn't she PHISICALLY able to go abroad without her husband approval?? or is it a discrimination???
or shouldn't she be entitled of the same inheritance as her brother? has it something to do with phisical power??
a man can take up to 4 wives, but a woman can't do the same: why? she can't PHISICALLY endure four men?????
i'm not saying that in western countries women and men have equal rights, but sure they're closer than in islamic country

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Actuall I was not trying to be silly, I was purposely being cynical, didnt you read what I stated.

Sure, women in islamic countries don't all have equal rights, this is why in the last comment that I made above (that you chose to ignore) I said, they will have to FIGHT for these rights the same way Black Americans and women in this country fought for them, as this was not always a country of equal rights, and still isn't. But the Bible didn't teach us to discriminate, just as the Quran doesn't teach them to discriminate, this is the point I was making to you, how many times do I have to say it. Do you know that once slaves who couldn't read accepted their fate, because they were taught that this was the will of God. Well the same can be said for some muslim women in countries where they are oppressed and not allowed to read and learn to become critical thinkers. Maybe one day they will decide to do the same. Remember most western countries are wealthy, and most would argue, their wealth is due to the fact theat they oppressed the other countries for their wealth (i.e. the British took over america from the Indians), but many of these middle eastern countries are only wealthy in oil, as most of it is just desert, and that oil was just discovered the last century, so their wealth is relatively new. Hence they are still catching up to western standards. Lets not take a superior type attitude and try to blame their position on their religion, as we know how many crimes of inhumanity were committed under christianity. One of the major reasons for my conversion is due to the fact that I personally belonged to a Catholic church that made headlines with our priest was accused of molesting several young boys. I became disgusted, yet I still don't blame all catholics for his actions, and I don't blame all muslims for the actions of a few extremists. And this is what I think you're trying to do... blame the religion, when we have continuously pointed out to you that its MAN (cultural) and not of GOD(religion), but man will twist the words of God to fit his own selfish needs, as is the case with my former priest.

But this is the last I will speak on the matter as it is clear you choose to believe what you want, and you are making a conscious decision to be narrow-minded towards islam.

posted 09 October 2004 12:33 PM            

quote:

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Originally posted by TheMark:
... but isn't she PHISICALLY able to go abroad without her husband approval?? or is it a discrimination???
or shouldn't she be entitled of the same inheritance as her brother? has it something to do with phisical power??
a man can take up to 4 wives, but a woman can't do the same: why? she can't PHISICALLY endure four men?????

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If an Egyptian husband wanted to stop his wife travelling overseas he would have to prove to a court that it was warranted to get a court order to stop her, as a husband in any other country would. The law giving that power was repealed several years ago. That was a man-made law anyway.

A woman’s brother has to support his unmarried sisters and any unmarried female relatives from his share of the inheritance, as was pointed out in Dalia’s article, and no one has any rights to ask her for any part of her share. I would say that was discrimination for women rather than against them!

It has been shown that women who have multiple sex partners are more at risk of cervical cancer. And can anyone explain to me how a woman is going to cope with her other three husbands when she is pregnant with the fourth husband’s child? Also can a woman’s body cope with the alternating pregnancies from four different husbands? I don’t think that any studies have been done on this, not many woman would be prepared to be the subjects for that research, but certainly having intercourse prior to implantation of the foetus in the womb can cause a spontaneous abortion, so meeting alternating husband’s needs could result in several miscarriages!

posted 10 October 2004 02:57 AM            

The major thing in the west different from Egypt, is employers can't discriminate on the basis of sex, religion, race, or age, the way they advertise for jobs. But it is still done covertly, there is a system practice called the "good ole boy" which is about WHO you know, not WHAT you know, and the preference is still for young white men for certain positions, whether people will admit it or not, its done.

Note :
i am not talking about Egypt or anyother country i am talking about Islam and human rights i know in Egypt and all countries there is discriminate. And concern the womans rights i am not talking about personal Behaviours as u respect or not respect (pesonal option) i am talking that u will be siner if u treat your wife with a bad way i am talking about what Islam said cause everyone is different in his behaviour

posted 10 October 2004 05:59 AM            

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Originally posted by Ebru21:
Well there are more others that we cannot eat....like emulsifier 471 which is known as non halah animal fats

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posted 10 October 2004 06:49 AM            

quote:

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Originally posted by Ebru21:
So we should point out the most obviouse....no pork, no animal fat that is not halal, no alchhol.

Well there are more others that we cannot eat....like emulsifier 471 which is known as non halah animal fats

just wondering if there are any other thing we cannot eat?

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