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[QUOTE]Originally posted by Israel: [QB] [QUOTE]Originally posted by sultan.org(In Makka not here ): [qb] Why did the GOD of Islam allow for the "original" Bible to get corrupted or lost? Before I answer this question from the Islamic perspective, we must first know that the Bible itself admits that it is a corrupted Book from the introduction above. Please visit [URL=http://www.answering-christianity.com/authors_gospels.htm]Just who were the real authors of the Bible?[/URL] and [URL=http://www.answering-christianity.com/sake12.htm]History of man's tampering with the Old Testament.[/URL] Let us see what Prophet Muhammad peace be upon him said regarding the validity and the reliability of the Bible: Narrated AbuNamlah al-Ansari: "When he was sitting with the Apostle of Allah (peace_be_upon_him) and a Jew was also with him, a funeral passed by him. He (the Jew) asked (Him): Muhammad, does this funeral speak? The Prophet (peace_be_upon_him) said: Allah has more knowledge. The Jew said: It speaks. The Apostle of Allah (peace_be_upon_him) said: Whatever the people of the Book [Jews and Christians] tell you, do not verify them, nor falsify them, but say: We believe in Allah and His Apostle. If it is false, do not confirm it, and if it is right, do not falsify it. (Translation of Sunan Abu-Dawud, Knowledge (Kitab Al-Ilm), Book 25, Number 3637)" The following two Sayings of our beloved Prophet Muhammad peace be upon him were sent to me by Yusif 65; may Allah Almighty always be pleased with him: Narrated Ubaidullah: "Ibn 'Abbas said, 'Why do you ask the people of the scripture about anything while your Book (Quran) which has been revealed to Allah's Apostle is newer and the latest? You read it pure, undistorted and unchanged, and Allah has told you that the people of the scripture (Jews and Christians) changed their scripture and distorted it, and wrote the scripture with their own hands and said, 'It is from Allah,' to sell it for a little gain. Does not the knowledge which has come to you prevent you from asking them about anything? No, by Allah, we have never seen any man from them asking you regarding what has been revealed to you!' (Translation of Sahih Bukhari, Holding Fast to the Qur'an and Sunnah, Volume 9, Book 92, Number 461)" Narrated Abu Huraira: "The people of the Book used to read the Torah in Hebrew and then explain it in Arabic to the Muslims. Allah's Apostle said (to the Muslims). 'Do not believe the people of the Book, nor disbelieve them, but say, 'We believe in Allah and whatever is revealed to us, and whatever is revealed to you.' ' (Translation of Sahih Bukhari, Holding Fast to the Qur'an and Sunnah, Volume 9, Book 92, Number 460)" As we clearly see in the above Sayings of our beloved Prophet peace be upon him, the source that the Jews and Christians use (i.e. the Bible or any other religious source such as their Popes', Rabbis or other religious people's verdicts) must be ignored because it is not reliable. As we've seen in the above introduction, the man-made scribes (laws) had corrupted the Bible and turned it "into a lie" (Jeremiah 8:8). According to Islam, Allah Almighty (GOD Almighty) in the Bible promised those who try to tamper His Words in the Bible to face hell fire, because He knew that it was going to happen. He gave the people of the book (Jews and Christians) a chance/test and they simply blew it!. Today, there is no one Bible!. The number of Books/Gospels in the Roman Catholics Bible for instance is different from the King James Version Bible, which is different in the number of Books/Gospels from the Jehovah's Witnesses Bible, which is different in the number of Books/Gospels from the Mormon's Bible, etc... Look at Noble Verse 5:13 from the Noble Quran: "But on account of their breaking their covenant We cursed them (Jews and Christians) and made their hearts hard; they altered the words from their places and they neglected a portion of what they were reminded of; and you shall always discover treachery in them excepting a few of them; so pardon them and turn away; surely Allah loves those who do good (to others)." Israel, when it lost Allah Almighty's grace, began to sin against truth and religion in three ways: (1) they began to misuse Scripture itself, by either taking words out of their right meaning, or applying them to things for which they were never meant; (2) in doing so, they conveniently forgot a part of the Message and purpose of Allah; and (3) they invented new deceits to support the old ones. Let us look at Noble Verse 5:41 "O Apostle! let not those grieve thee, who race each other into unbelief: (whether it be) among those who say "We believe" with their lips but whose hearts have no faith; or it be among the Jews,- men who will listen to any lie,- will listen even to others who have never so much as come to thee. They change the words from their (right) times and places: they say, 'If ye are given this, take it, but if not, beware!' If any one's trial is intended by God, thou hast no authority in the least for him against God. For such - it is not God's will to purify their hearts. For them there is disgrace in this world, and in the Hereafter a heavy punishment." Please visit History of man's corruption in the Bible for more details. Allah Almighty in the Noble Quran on the other hand, did promise that He will personally guard the Noble Quran from corruption. He never promised hell fire to anyone who tries to tamper His words in the Noble Quran. He will guard it Himself; "We (Allah) have, without a doubt, sent down the Message (The Quran); and We (Allah) will assuredly Guard it [from corruption]. (The Noble Quran, 15:9)." Today we have only one Arabic Noble Quran. Visit: The lie of 1 John 5:7, where it was later discovered to be a man made corruption inserted into the Bible. "Son of GOD" conflict between the Bible and the Noble Quran. How is Allah Almighty telling the Jews and Christians to follow their Books when these Books had been corrupted? Do the errors in the Bible prove that the Noble Quran is not from GOD? What parts of the Bible do Muslims believe are closest to the Truth? and Why? Did Prophet Muhammad recognize the Bible as an error-free book? A continuation to my answer from sister Jacqueline S. Waheed; may Allah Almighty always be pleased with her: The above question has [THREE] parts, so let us see the answers accordingly. To answer the part ["Muslims believe that the current Bible is not all the true word of GOD, and only the Quran is"] Yes, Muslims believes that current bible [OT &NT] is not the one[s], which God [Allaah] almighty gave to Moses and Jesus [peace be upon them]. But it is also verified and confirmed by Noble Qur'aan, which is the main source of Muslims' belief. If you read OT, NT, and Noble Qur'aan, it will become obvious that all missing links in the bible are found in Noble Qur'aan and it makes undeniable sense. That is why once one explore the Noble Qur'aan with its entirety in almost all cases it is inevitable for him/her to not say the Shahada. To respond to the second part of question ["If so, then why did the GOD of Islam allow for His Words to get corrupted in the Bible?"] "If so" is hardly the case here, beside that one cannot blame the God [Allaah] The Creator, all Knower, and all Seer of all heavens and earth for allowing His words to be corrupted. Such blame ONLY represents a typical frivolous product liability lawsuit mentality. That will not work in this UNIQUE case, because the God [Allaah], has already replaced the abused and tempered [by human] product with far SUPERIOR [product] the Final Revelation *****THE NOBLE QUR'AAN***** Which by the way is another testament of God's existence that He not only can save His word, but again He can give mankind a chance to correct himself and follow his true word [The Noble Qur'aan] to be saved. Because God [Allah] is the Most Beneficent and Most Merciful. To answer the last part of question ["or why did He allow for the original copy of the Bible to be lost?"]. Again in this part we see the frivolous product liability lawsuit mentality. Having said that God [Allaah] did not allow [original] copy to be lost. It was the keepers of bible[OT & NT] who tempered it and hide many facts that resulted in current bible not making any sense. Which by the way is also confirmed by God [Allaah] in Noble Qur'aan and I quote: 005.015 YUSUFALI: O people of the Book! There hath come to you our Messenger, revealing to you much that ye used to hide in the Book, and passing over much (that is now unnecessary): There hath come to you from Allah a (new) light and a perspicuous Book, - PICKTHAL: O People of the Scripture! Now hath Our messenger come unto you, expounding unto you much of that which ye used to hide in the Scripture, and forgiving much. now hath come unto you light from Allah and plain Scripture, SHAKIR: O followers of the Book! indeed Our Messenger has come to you making clear to you much of what you concealed of the Book and passing over much; indeed, there has come to you light and a clear Book from Allah; Followed by God [Allaah] emphasizing in Noble Qur'aan [next verse]: 005.016 YUSUFALI: Wherewith Allah guideth all who seek His good pleasure to ways of peace and safety, and leadeth them out of darkness, by His will, unto the light,- guideth them to a path that is straight. PICKTHAL: Whereby Allah guideth him who seeketh His good pleasure unto paths of peace. He bringeth them out of darkness unto light by His decree, and guideth them unto a straight path. SHAKIR: With it Allah guides him who will follow His pleasure into the ways of safety and brings them out of utter darkness into light by His will and guides them to the right path. Bottom line is that as question itself indicates by use of [words] "original copy" which is highly inappropriate in this case. However, implication by virtue of question is absurd. Because FORENSIC AND EMPIRICAL RESULTS proves that MASTER COPY [or SOURCE CODE] was never lost nor tempered. It was and it has always been in possession of God [Allaah] the Creator of all heaven and earth. It further proves the existence of ONE and ONLY God [Allaah] the all Knower and all Seer who way ahead foretold to Jews and Christians in OT and NT about the arrival of Prophet Muhammed [saw] and commanded Jews and Christians to follow Prophet Muhammed [saw]. Noble Qur'aan 3:64! Say (O Muhammad SAW): "O people of the Scripture (Jews and Christians): Come to a word that is just between us and you, that we worship none but Allâh, and that we associate no partners with Him, and that none of us shall take others as lords besides Allâh[]. Then, if they turn away, say: "Bear witness that we are Muslims." Noble Qur'aan 3:85! And whoever seeks a religion other than Islâm, it will never be accepted of him, and in the Hereafter he will be one of the losers[]. [b]Example: If Johnny writes a letter to Marry Joe and saves it. That Marry Joe later edits and/or modify claiming to be original letter by Johnny. That can be proven wrong by Johnny because he got the master copy. So to make Marry Joe looks like a fool and a liar all Johnny has to do is to give another copy of Jean Doe to show the people that she [Marry Joe] is lying. It pretty bad, for Marry Joe, isn't it?[/b] source http://www.answering-christianity.com/que3.htm [/qb][/QUOTE]Sultan, I asked Batman a question. Maybe you can answer it. Here it is................... Batman, Dude, you don't know what you are talking about! Seriously! I asked you a while ago about the "abrogations" found in the Koran. How come you never answered me? I will ask you again. Why is it that the Koran tells Christians and Jews in Surah 2 that they will be ok as long as they do good works, etc., but then in another Surah, it then says that Islam is the only religion? Why? Why does allah change his mind? According to the Bible, the God says, "I the Lord do not change"...book of Malachi. God doesn't change his word. So why does allah change his? Why? Does that mean that prior to the abrogation of Surah two that Christians and Jews were able to enter the Muslim heaven and have 72 virgins? I mean, before Muhammad said that allah changed his mind, he told Jews and Christians that they were ok, yet he changes..............I don't understand? Acutually I do understand. But i am not here to disrespect you and or anybody here. But when you try to challenge my faith, I have the knowledge to challenge yours. We can go deeper than this simple argument if you want.........Salaam Please answer my question about your Koran..........If you can't answer my question about the incoherence of the Koran, then don't spew a pseudo-religious ideology about the Bible. Salaam. [/QB][/QUOTE]
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