posted
I am posting this for those interested in Old Kingdom statuary rock crystal inlaid eyes. Let me add I acknowledge the obvious phenotypic diversity of Egypt from the Badarian down to today.
Indigenous dark skinned African phenotypes are the overwhelming majority. The other, minority, phenotypes can be Egyptian too. Their types range from indigenous lighter skinned coastal Africans to very dark skinned middle Nile Valley, Horn, and Saharo-Sahel Africans to Arabian plate and overseas naturalized foreigners dressed in Egyptian style and visiting foreigners sporting home fashion who are not Egyptian.
The foreign skin colour scale swings from very dark to very light and everything in between. Egypt since the predynastic attracted people looking for opportunities. All contributed to make the cosmopolitan first world power Egypt founded by indigenous lower Nile Valley Africans.
Non-brown inlaid eye irises are production faults. When eye coloring brown resin doesn't perfectly contact the crystal the result is partial to fully grey eyes. Crystal to resin contact can change with time. The eye color we see now may not be the eye color the sculptor intended.
Posts: 8014 | From: the Tekrur in the Western Sahel | Registered: Feb 2006
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posted
From a standard reference on AE materials and industry we learn the crystal was transparent having no color and that the intended eye color was brown effected by resin.
Posts: 8014 | From: the Tekrur in the Western Sahel | Registered: Feb 2006
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posted
This last page tells when intentional non-brown eyes were made, only in the late era of northern Mediterranean rule.
all 3 pages from
A. Lucas & J.R. Harris Ancient Egyptian Materials and Industries 4th edition revised and enlarged London: Edward Arnold LTD., 1962
Posts: 8014 | From: the Tekrur in the Western Sahel | Registered: Feb 2006
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According to alTakruri painted eye colours can change, but not painted skin colour.
If ancient egyptian artwork shows dark coloured figures alTakruri accepts them as genuine, but if they have light eyes suddenly they are not genuine...
The most pathetic thing is that alTakruri thinks he is a scholar. Posts: 1575 | From: - | Registered: May 2011
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posted
^ Are you mentally challenged?? Where has Takruri stated or where in the source he cited does it state that skin color does not change?! Of course the vast majority of painted portraits show paint loss or fading in various degrees. We've shown you plenty examples of this already! Apparently what Takruri is saying is that it is very likely the same case with the crystal inlaid eyes. That there were resins that made them originally darker but over time it was lost.
Posts: 26252 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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there is some interesting information here. I've only skimmed i. It's not necessarily direct;y related to this topic. However, mentioning something about blue eyed Phoenicians being mistaken for Hebrews and other stuff. I'm not up to reading it right now. See page 66 use magnifying tool.
The Friend, Volume 1 By Robert Smith (1829)
Posts: 42930 | From: , | Registered: Jan 2010
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posted
In this thread I'm not talking about paint nor am I talking about fading.
I'm talking about rock crystal, brown resin, and their degree of contact.
All inlaid clear rock crystal eyes were backed with a brown resin disk to impart eye color. Where contact is not perfect or where the resin has shrunk the intended eye color is lost and what's left is a more or less greyish eye color.
That's precisely what the quoted reference says on inlaid eye color. Nothing else is implied. Skin colour is not the topic or subject of this thread.
Careful perusal of the reference is in order for pyramidiots who erect "painted eye colour," "painted skin colour," and imaginary what "alTakruri accepts as genuine," strawmen.
Discerning folk can read what I wrote on skin colours and what I cited about statues' crystal eye color to easily see through wilful misrepresentations by those not here to learn but to twist technical facts, as laid down by professionals.
They only affect the slow to comprehend, skim readers, or those who feel the last word is the best word. Those last two kind are not my primary audience.
I see no need to answer misrepresenters or distractors or have others explain what I mean. I'm right here for any sensible questioning which pyramidiots and the like fit neither sensible nor questioning much less the wanting to learn category.
Posts: 8014 | From: the Tekrur in the Western Sahel | Registered: Feb 2006
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This is a perfect example of the effects of imperfect brown resin disk contact. Anyone can detect where the resin is not sealed completely intact to the crystal mat by the grey color. Likewise intact perfectly sealed disk onto crystal is revealed by the brown areas.
It's all precisely explained in the technical reference.
Any alternative speculations as to the cause of eye color must be backed by citation to technical sources about inlaid rock crystal eyes in Egyptian statuary.
Posts: 8014 | From: the Tekrur in the Western Sahel | Registered: Feb 2006
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quote:Originally posted by alTakruri: This is a perfect example of the effects of imperfect brown resin disk contact. Anyone can detect where the resin is not sealed completely intact to the crystal mat by the grey color. Likewise intact perfectly sealed disk onto crystal is revealed by the brown areas.
Any alternative speculations as to the cause of eye color must be backed by citation to technical sources.
^^^you can't tell anything from this view. It's too far away.
posted
The argument made in the text is that modern Egyptians have predominantly brown isris' and that brown glue was used adhere the transparent crystal in place, further that areas appearing gray are areas where some of the glue sooner or later did not make contact. Thus these areas would allow the back of the round crystal to be more reflective of what's in front of the statue appearing as gray or blue in the case of the seated scribe where in some photos you can notice a blue background and even blue light hitting the top of his head such as below:
I think it's a reasonable argument that his eyes are not gray or bluish gray, it's just surrounding color or even blue lighting It's somewhat convincing this is the case. If it's true about the seated scribe it looks like a lot of the glue had not been or later did not make direct contact with the crystal.
On another note, call me crazy but both King Hor and the seated scribe don't look very African to me, more like some of the non-African looking modern Egyptians.
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posted
King Hor looks African to me but the Seated scribe does look non African IMO.
Posts: 8804 | From: The fear of his majesty had entered their hearts, they were powerless | Registered: Nov 2007
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posted
_____________^^^right eye, white of eye whiter___________^^^^than left eye
quote:Originally posted by alTakruri: A caveat to the eyes in Hor's statue.
Is anything known of similar "fraud" in other statues?
If the right eye was a modern replacement I suppose it could be called "a fraud" in that the replaement was not reported. But the only significant difference is not in the eye color but in the white of the eye being less yellowed than the alleged original eye. So it appears the intent was to replace an eye but not that there is an attempt to manipulate and change the way it looked for an ulterior motive.
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