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Defining Caucasian or white race
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[QUOTE]Originally posted by L': [QB] [QUOTE]The argument for an African origin of E is strong. However the frequency of E1b1a is more of what is at issue. It is not strong in some parts of Africa and at the same time shows up in the Arabian peninsula even Europe which is not in Africa.. Therefore you can't center a definition of a person being "biologically African around that.[/QUOTE]Not what I asked. I asked you to support your claim the haplogroup E could have a possible non-African origin (by that I mean recent studies) Just because it may appear elsewhere other than Africa, does not mean the term biologically African is unfit. Biologically African simply describes people who originated and evolved on the African continent. Asians with African lineages doesn't mean they are not biologically Asian if they developed on the Asian continent. [QUOTE]The premise if we must start with "African" and fit a genetic profile into it. If you want to use genetics to identify people the geography is a distraction. Why not go directly to the cluster and define people in that way alone?[/QUOTE]It is impossible to classify people in genetics, which is why genetics has dis-proven the concept of race. Biologically African is simply a term to describe people who evolved and developed on the African continent as well as originated there. Just because some Africans may have admixture doesn't mean they are less African, or not biologically African. [QUOTE]Alright, you want to stick with "African", go with the assumption that an indigenous African from any any region in African, including the North has more affinity to any other African than they might to a Near Easterner simply because we have these names "African" and "Asian" fine.[/QUOTE]It's not because of names, lol. North Africans DO have a greater affinity to Africans because they are predominately African genetically, (although they do have significant non-African mtDNA, perhaps contributing to their features) which is why Frigi et al., states: "Our results reveal that Berber speakers have a foundational [b]biogeographic root in Africa[/b] and that deep African lineages have continued to evolve in supra-Saharan Africa." Frigi et al If they originated on the African continent, then they are biologically African even if they do have significant non-African mtDNA. The name of the continent they are on is not the basis for saying they have a greater affinity to Africans, it's their genetic profile. In the case of the ancient Egyptians, we know they would be closer to an African genetically because there is no evidence for significant non-African input into ancient Egypt. [QUOTE]If you want to go that route then you must be consistent, profile and differentiate a "biologically Near eastern person" from a "biologically African person" despite the fact that, randomly the distance from Jordan to Egypt is is 676 miles while the distance from Angola to Egypt is 2769 miles away- over 2000 miles further away. How can you disregard the implications of that? It as if someone said "what's closer to Algeria Spain or Botswana?" and somebody else says "I figure Botswana because Spain is on a whole other continent".[/QUOTE]Not this AGAIN. Why must you keep making the same argument that you have been refuted in several times prior to this? What does distance have to do with anything at all? Provide evidence for enough migration into Egypt that would give them a connection to someone from the Near East etc., [b][i]there is none[/b][/i]. Now, take a minute to think, if there is [b]no[/b] evidence for significant non-African input into Egypt, than how could they have greater affinity to a non-African? Until you can provide evidence that there was such migration to give the Egyptians a greater affinity to someone in Jordan, or elsewhere than another African, I won't even bother going into more detail. You have made this remark so many times, each time getting shut down and then repeating it later. It's getting quite old. [QUOTE]Example, the people from ancient Columbia and Argentina are related genetically. The fact that Columbia has an lineage that goes back to North America does not change that.[/QUOTE]OK, now provide evidence that the ancient Egyptians were genetically related to non-Africans. Even though we know they shared a genetic connection to Africans via the PN2 transition of Y haplogroup E. Your comparison of Columbian s and Argentinians has no bearing on ancient Egyptians and other Africans. [QUOTE]Alright. you want to stick with this term "biologically African" ? You better be prepared to name the rest of the world in similarly "biologically this or that region" because I'm coming after you on that. Name the rest of the world in this manner I dare you.[/QUOTE]Not even necessary. Any indigenous people who developed in the region they inhabit are would fit that definition. Biologically African is simply another term for indigenous Africans. [QUOTE]How about "biologically Asian" do you really think that is meaningful?[/QUOTE]Yes. Meaningful to describe people who developed in the Asian continent. [QUOTE]You would place an Indian and a Chinese person in the same category genetically? isn't that a little too diverse to make a generalization "biologically[/QUOTE]Nobody is making the argument that they are genetically the same. They both did develop on the African continent though, so yes, they are biologically Asian unless they are recent immigrants (which they aren't) [QUOTE]Asian" - O.K. what about Africa then??? -that's even more biologically diverse than Asia according to what you folks always point out.[/QUOTE]And? We aren't saying they are all the same genetically or phenotypically speaking. Only that they developed on the African/Asian continent. Do you have a problem with that? [/QB][/QUOTE]
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