posted
Hello All ! I'm a 23 yr old American college student recently married to an Egyptian in Cairo. My situation is alot different I think than the majority of people posting here. My husband's (he's 27) family and mine have been friends for over 20 years. My husbands family had arranged a marriage for him in order to bring him to the USA. It fell through the girl ran off with a guy she met in school. Then his family tried to pay someone to marry him for "papers". During that time I was in Egypt visiting "family" and saw what was going on. Basically the female was trying to fleece him, she wanted alot of money for the marriage ($ 10,000.00 US Dollars) plus a monthly allowance of $1,000.00 (US Dollars). Due to her greed the family didn't trust her and his mother and sister approached me about marrying him. This was my first time meeting him in person although all through my childhood we spoke on a weekly basis because of the friendship between our families. I adore his mother I've seen her many times while I was growing up and his sister is like an aunt to me. In a nutshell I felt I could not deny them this favor given our families history. We spent about a month together getting to know each other and traveling all over Egypt. We have a great friendship and it shows, all of his friends and family are hoping that this turns into a real marriage. As for me I know it wont I dont see him that way I see him more as a cousin than anything. Plus I have so many plans for my future...I've got grad school in a year and then an internship in another country working with a human rights organization.
For his part he adores me, eventhough he flirts with me I'm pretty sure he sees me as a friend as well. He has one serious girl friend out here and several "play buddies" what we call "booty calls" in America.
Now here's the thing eventhough I married him to get him into the USA I like to do things honestly. His family doesn't approve of his girlfriend, they downright hate her. I think he should be allowed to make his own choice and if this is the person he loves then let him be it's his life. I feel I should be allowed to meet his girlfriend so that she and I can be friends and she can see that I have no design on her boyfriend/ future husband. I feel since I am going to be married to him for a few years that I should make it easy on him and her and become friends with her as well.
His family refuses they think that she is beneath me and do not want me to meet her. Until last week he did not even know that I knew about the other girl. He thought that if I knew that I would not marry him. Which to me makes no sense since we went into this knowing full well it wasn't a real marriage in the conventional sense. Now am I leaving for home in several days, I've got to get back to school and it looks like I am not going to meet the girl. His family thinks I'm nuts for wanting to introduce myself to her and he just doesn't know what to make of me period. In his words, "I have never met a woman so confusing as you." lol
So you tell me people am I wrong for wanting to meet this girl? I know a few of you are going to chew me to pieces of this marriage thing.. but hey it was done for all the right reasons..and No I am not getting paid for it the family offered but I refused. I did it out of love for the family not to increase my bank account.
quote:Originally posted by Tiny_Bubbles: So you tell me people am I wrong for wanting to meet this girl? I know a few of you are going to chew me to pieces of this marriage thing.. but hey it was done for all the right reasons..and No I am not getting paid for it the family offered but I refused. I did it out of love for the family not to increase my bank account.
Yup some may chew you to pieces about the 'favor' you are doing, but most won't be bothered by it.
Yes its creepy, the 'favor' let alone wanting to meet his main booty call.
Honestly, I don't think he's serious about of those girls including the 'girlfriend'. I'll be brave here and think that is family wants him hitched before he makes an ass of the family or gets AIDS. Better he's 6,000 miles away.
And I will offer my opinion even though I know most will disagree with me, but I think you're doing this for all the wrong reasons. Watch out, he might just end up becoming attached to you and keep you. And since he's a whore, by your 10th aniversary you might be sporting herpes or syphilis at the very least.
By the way what faith are you and this whore (opps fiancee)? I know that the local Mosques here have issued an opinion in the sermons that this type of arrangement is unIslamic.
Posts: 5744 | From: Minneapolis, Mn USA | Registered: Mar 2004
| IP: Logged |
By the way what faith are you and this whore (opps fiancee)? I know that the local Mosques here have issued an opinion in the sermons that this type of arrangement is unIslamic.
No matter the faith, the case is crystal clear fraud and perjury. People shouldn't compromise their principales for the sake of doing favors, you get to lose yourself this way.
posted
Thanks for your reply... here are the facts:
1) They are both Muslims, though honestly I never saw him pray or go to the mosque the entire time I was here including Eid Al-Adha.
2) I am Catholic
3)No, No my friend, no herpes or syphilis down the road for me ...this marriage has not been consumated nor will it be. He knows better than to "try to keep me" his family spoke with mine and they are honorable people. The very first thing discussed by my father was the fact that he was not to attempt anything sexual with me and that this was a marriage in name only.
He knows my plans for the future and he is well aware that they do not include being tied down by marriage. Not to say that marrigage isn't a good thing, my parents have been happily married for over 30 years. It's just that for me marriage isn't something I see happening until I am done with med school and until I do some volunteer work over seas.
As for the man whore aka my husband, he knows that his charms do not work with me. Several weeks after we were married he asked me for a kiss, and I told him, "what are you crazy?"...and he got the hint from there .... I sincerely hopes he lives up to the promises he made to his girlfriend because she's been with him for 7 years and it would be a shame if he broke his word to her. This is the reason I had wanted to meet her so that she could see the type of person that I am and that I posed no threat to her and that her position in his life was secure.
Okay so I guess some would think it creepy that I'd want to introduce myself to his main squeeze..lol
posted
I understand what you're saying about compromising my principles. Yes I did feel guilty about it at first. But then I remember the plea from his mother and family and see it as compromising myself for the greater good. I don't know maybe it just helps me sleep better at night to think of it in this manner.
Posts: 21 | From: NY,USA | Registered: Feb 2005
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by Tiny_Bubbles: I understand what you're saying about compromising my principles. Yes I did feel guilty about it at first. But then I remember the plea from his mother and family and see it as compromising myself for the greater good. I don't know maybe it just helps me sleep better at night to think of it in this manner.
I understand your point and as you said you did it for no money but only to help which speaks of your good intention, yet I do believe that was a mistake (don't worry we all do mistakes). I think such a thing can be justified if you were saving a human life of a serous danger which I can't see here.
And believe me, you never lose good people by doing the right thing, atctually eventually you gainmore respect and trust from them... Guess this is not the topic anyway, So I will stop preaching ...No more chewing
posted
Thank you for your kind words. I do understand what you're saying in terms of it being a mistake and justifiable if a human life were in danger. I have a soft heart, always have it's my downfall really. During my stay here my Egyptian friends have had to restrain me from giving away my money to the people I've seen begging. If they hadn't I'd be broke by now. It's the same thing where I live I purposely carry loose change and dollar bills to hand out to the homeless people I encounter on my way to school or work. Last winter I got in trouble with my parents because I took off my new coat and gave it to a homeless lady shivering in the park. Hey she needed it more than I did, I had another one at home. It drives my friends crazy when I do stuff like that. I guess I need to learn restraint, and something about his mother and sister crying to me just weakened me. Perhaps as I get older I will learn to be stronger in that sense.
Posts: 21 | From: NY,USA | Registered: Feb 2005
| IP: Logged |
posted
Tiny, the line between goodness and weakness is thinner than we may think. It took me a very long time to place the word NO in my 'social dictionary', but when I finally succeeded, my life become dramatically less dramatic... Now I can concentrate more on the goodness side without being sidetracked into the weakness land. Think about yourself first: it is the best way out of selfishness, despite the popular belief.
posted
As a pysch major I can tell you this, talking to your sofa is not the problem. If your sofa talks back to you then you got some real problems.
Posts: 21 | From: NY,USA | Registered: Feb 2005
| IP: Logged |
posted
Your a psych major and next medical school. Your marrying a dude in order to cheat your country and commit treason, let alone break several federal laws.
Yup a psychiatrist in the making.
Not everyone can be a good American or a good Christian. But hey your Catholic, rules don't apply to you.
Posts: 5744 | From: Minneapolis, Mn USA | Registered: Mar 2004
| IP: Logged |
posted
Holy **** . Now that I think of this the INS will never let you get away with this. Plus the paperwork alone you'll definately f*ck up.
Enjoy the marriage interviews. Now the INS is requiring 3 interviews. And they started inquiring with your family and friends. Plus if this becomes a permenant conviction on your record and you manage to not go to jail, it will affect future employment. Any kind of Government or NGO position requires a background check and this will prohibit you from advancing.
The beginning of the end.
Posts: 5744 | From: Minneapolis, Mn USA | Registered: Mar 2004
| IP: Logged |
posted
Yes a psych major,it's actually forensic pyschology and yes med school is next.
As for me not being a good American, that's your opinion and your free to express it without fear of reprisal. So I say go for it. Treason, that's an "iffy" if I were bringing him to my country to upsurp my government then you'd be in the right but that is not the case.Am I plotting to stage a coup and bring in a dictorial regime? Nope.
Ahhh yes and as for cheating my country, how so? Am I conspiring to sell nukes? Nope. Mee treasonous? What blasphemy!!I smirk in your general direction at that accusation! Breaking several federal laws? My country was founded by law breakers!
My Christianity? Oh my lord in heaven you cast dispersions upon my christianity?! Rules don't apply to me as a Catholic? Padre Nuestro santificado sea tu nombre,Dios Mio! In your eyes I may seem like a horrible Christian, forgive me I will do some sort of penance maybe skip the communion wafer next time i'm at mass. If I'm a bad Christian then it's for God to judge. I'll just add a codocil to my Will instructing them to throw some sunblock, lip balm and a bottle of water into my casket before they bury me. Just in case the big guy sides with you and decides that I'm a naughty Christian and condems me to eternal life in Hades.
All I can say on my behalf is this; I drink milk, take my vitamins, excercise, am kind to animals and children. I buy Girl Scout cookies during the annual drive, enjoy hot dogs, apple pie, love mom, baseball and stand for the National Anthem during sporting events. I also remember to thank God for what I have and pray for those who aren't as lucky everyday. I do this not because it was taught to me. I do this because I truly am grateful, and it comes from my heart to do so.
Yes, I can look at myself everyday in the mirror and be proud of who I am. That you not agree with this marriage, well what can I say you're not alone. I felt I did it for the right reasons and I can live with it. If I hadn't been able to I wouldn't have married the dude. But as I said you have a right to your opinion feel free to express it. That's the great thing about life we can all agree to disagree...
"I sometimes think that the saving grace of America lies in the fact that the overwhelming majority of Americans are possessed of two great qualities- a sense of humor and a sense of proportion. " Franklin D. Roosevelt (1882 - 1945)
posted
Obviously you haven't had your first marriage interview. Are even living together under one roof?
What paperwork have you filed so far. Have you hired a lawyer? Signed any forms yet?
The green card fantasy doesn't work.
Cripes this is the flip side of the sex tourism charades and it just had to happen.
Let you know there's ten of thousands of couples in the USA right now that have had their civil rights disrupted and lives reorganized by BCIS regulations and new laws to avoid exactly what you are doing.
[This message has been edited by sonomod (edited 09 February 2005).]
Posts: 5744 | From: Minneapolis, Mn USA | Registered: Mar 2004
| IP: Logged |
posted
I posted this in another thread but it is relevant here as well.
Why are Egyptians so keen to get to the West? You have so much more here that gives quality of life and the life in the West is so stressful, materlistic, superficial and commercial.
Lots of people having lived their lives in the West are rejecting it and coming to Egypt and lots of other less developed countries for the quality of life. Time to spend with families, unspolied countryside, loving neighbours, no keeping up with the Jones. Seriously I think your fella is stupid for wanting to leave egypt. it won't bring him happiness.
I also think you are stupid being used like this, you are setting a pattern for your life. Being used and manipulated. Next it will be have a baby for him because the authorities don't believe the marriage.
Your post was interesting. You are obviously well versed and educated- though, what your years do not show you is the experience of life. Everyone in this life have thier own crosses to bear-- thier own lessons in the life. Nobody can lessen this and nothing comes free and easy. Your husband and his family were looking for a solution that will not be solved by marrying thier son. Working for something and struggling for it --makes it all the sweeter. When you recieve things in this way, you do not value them. You will not see this now but in years to come and in reflection-- I am sure you will. In no way, I am not saying that we as people should not help each other-- I, myself, am a humanitarian --doing field work in Palenstine, Afghanistan, and so forth -- so I am know first hand when and where to lend myself. Sincerely, good luck to you.
quote:Originally posted by akshar: I posted this in another thread but it is relevant here as well.
Why are Egyptians so keen to get to the West? You have so much more here that gives quality of life and the life in the West is so stressful, materlistic, superficial and commercial.
Lots of people having lived their lives in the West are rejecting it and coming to Egypt and lots of other less developed countries for the quality of life. Time to spend with families, unspolied countryside, loving neighbours, no keeping up with the Jones. Seriously I think your fella is stupid for wanting to leave egypt. it won't bring him happiness.
I also think you are stupid being used like this, you are setting a pattern for your life. Being used and manipulated. Next it will be have a baby for him because the authorities don't believe the marriage.
According to research done by the Erasmus University and Ruut Verhoven. He compared 90 countries. On a scale from 1 meaning total depression etc to 10 meaning total happiness, Denmark, Switzerland and Malta reached highest score of 8.0. Difference is that Denmark is going up while the two others went down!
According to the research, Denmark has the five conditions that makes the ultimate happy society:
Democracy "High Income Country" Well organized and low corruption Personal freedom which creates every posibility to make yourself a happy life Tolerence regarding sexuality and religion http://www2.eur.nl/fsw/research/happiness/index.htm egypt is 4.5
quote:Originally posted by asiaq: [QUOTE]Originally posted by akshar: [b]I posted this in another thread but it is relevant here as well.
Why are Egyptians so keen to get to the West? You have so much more here that gives quality of life and the life in the West is so stressful, materlistic, superficial and commercial.
Lots of people having lived their lives in the West are rejecting it and coming to Egypt and lots of other less developed countries for the quality of life. Time to spend with families, unspolied countryside, loving neighbours, no keeping up with the Jones. Seriously I think your fella is stupid for wanting to leave egypt. it won't bring him happiness.
I also think you are stupid being used like this, you are setting a pattern for your life. Being used and manipulated. Next it will be have a baby for him because the authorities don't believe the marriage.
According to research done by the Erasmus University and Ruut Verhoven. He compared 90 countries. On a scale from 1 meaning total depression etc to 10 meaning total happiness, Denmark, Switzerland and Malta reached highest score of 8.0. Difference is that Denmark is going up while the two others went down!
According to the research, Denmark has the five conditions that makes the ultimate happy society:
Democracy "High Income Country" Well organized and low corruption Personal freedom which creates every posibility to make yourself a happy life Tolerence regarding sexuality and religion http://www2.eur.nl/fsw/research/happiness/index.htm egypt is 4.5 [/B][/QUOTE]
posted
Whoa@Akshar don’t hold back. Am I stupid, being manipulated/used? I don’t think so. A stupid person doesn’t realize they are being used or if they do they don’t care because of what they perceive to be beneficial to them. For example maybe they are lonely and the person that is using them gives them the attention they crave. I don’t fall into that category I am simply repaying a debt, my conscience and heart dictated that this was the right thing to do. I can understand why you’d feel that with this act a pattern of being used and manipulated can be established. However as I have said I don’t believe that manipulation is the case here. And my friend whether you choose to believe it or not I am a very strong and assertive woman, secure in who I am so I doubt it that a pattern will be established here. As for your assertion that my friend is stupid for wanting to leave Egypt, I agree I think if one dedicates and applies themselves to their goal a good life can be had in Egypt or anywhere for that matter. But he feels his destiny lies here, I’ve told him that it will not be easy but he does not care. This is where he wants to be.
Now as for a baby, wow that’s a whole different chapter. He and I entered into this agreement of our own free will producing a child for the sake of appearances is just a ridiculous assertion.
posted
A thing to bear in mind, when it comes to your actions, no-bodies opinion is more valid than your own. if you feel you have done the right thing, eyes wide open, then you proberbly have. no need to justify your self to the rest of the planet. as far as loyalty to one country is conserned... hell honey i'm a child of the planet, so are you
Posts: 21 | From: london,england | Registered: Feb 2005
| IP: Logged |
Please tell me sonomod what is it exactly that you think I’ve got coming to me in due time?
In response to your questions:
1)We’ve already had our first marriage interview 2)Yes we live together 3)Yes paper work was filed visa was just issued 4)Lawyer was not necessary, if we need one we have one.
Also while I understand the whole ballyhoo about this not being a marriage in the conventional sense I really don’t see how this is any different than an arranged marriage. Marriage is an “iffy” thing not all of them work even when based on love.
At least he and I have a shared history; we’ve spoken and written to each other ever since we were kids. We admire and respect each other and are the greatest of friends. We’ve helped each other through some difficult time in our lives. The terminal illness, and subsequent death of his father. The loss of my friends, family members and job in the 9/11 tragedy. We’ve encouraged each other through high school and college, reveling in each others triumphs and achievements. Our friendship and bond will endure the test of time. I will dance at his wedding, and when the day comes he will dance at mines. And if God permits it our children will grow up loving each other as family just as he and I did.
So you may not approve of what I did. I’m not asking for your approval. I knew people were bound to disapprove. I know why I did it and am okay with it. If you recall the whole point of my posting was about my desire to meet my husbands’ girlfriend and assure her that I posed no threat to her. My husbands’ family did not want us to meet and my husband couldn’t make head or tails of my request.
Any opinion on that or am I a bad Catholic as well for wanting to meet her?
quote:Originally posted by Tiny_Bubbles: Hello All ! I'm a 23 yr old American college student recently married to an Egyptian in Cairo. My situation is alot different I think than the majority of people posting here. My husband's (he's 27) family and mine have been friends for over 20 years. My husbands family had arranged a marriage for him in order to bring him to the USA. It fell through the girl ran off with a guy she met in school. Then his family tried to pay someone to marry him for "papers". During that time I was in Egypt visiting "family" and saw what was going on. Basically the female was trying to fleece him, she wanted alot of money for the marriage ($ 10,000.00 US Dollars) plus a monthly allowance of $1,000.00 (US Dollars). Due to her greed the family didn't trust her and his mother and sister approached me about marrying him. This was my first time meeting him in person although all through my childhood we spoke on a weekly basis because of the friendship between our families. I adore his mother I've seen her many times while I was growing up and his sister is like an aunt to me. In a nutshell I felt I could not deny them this favor given our families history. We spent about a month together getting to know each other and traveling all over Egypt. We have a great friendship and it shows, all of his friends and family are hoping that this turns into a real marriage. As for me I know it wont I dont see him that way I see him more as a cousin than anything. Plus I have so many plans for my future...I've got grad school in a year and then an internship in another country working with a human rights organization.
For his part he adores me, eventhough he flirts with me I'm pretty sure he sees me as a friend as well. He has one serious girl friend out here and several "play buddies" what we call "booty calls" in America.
Now here's the thing eventhough I married him to get him into the USA I like to do things honestly. His family doesn't approve of his girlfriend, they downright hate her. I think he should be allowed to make his own choice and if this is the person he loves then let him be it's his life. I feel I should be allowed to meet his girlfriend so that she and I can be friends and she can see that I have no design on her boyfriend/ future husband. I feel since I am going to be married to him for a few years that I should make it easy on him and her and become friends with her as well.
His family refuses they think that she is beneath me and do not want me to meet her. Until last week he did not even know that I knew about the other girl. He thought that if I knew that I would not marry him. Which to me makes no sense since we went into this knowing full well it wasn't a real marriage in the conventional sense. Now am I leaving for home in several days, I've got to get back to school and it looks like I am not going to meet the girl. His family thinks I'm nuts for wanting to introduce myself to her and he just doesn't know what to make of me period. In his words, "I have never met a woman so confusing as you." lol
So you tell me people am I wrong for wanting to meet this girl? I know a few of you are going to chew me to pieces of this marriage thing.. but hey it was done for all the right reasons..and No I am not getting paid for it the family offered but I refused. I did it out of love for the family not to increase my bank account.
I dont know what to tell you < but I can tell you what I did when I was in a situation similar to yours, I knew this family who are the greatest family ever, KNow them for almost 20 years, they have a doughter who suddnly got sick, and wen to the states for treatment, but he visa Expired and she had to come back to Egypt, having to contenue her treatment in the states she had to go 3 times a year and every time sge applyes foe a visa, and shen she goes to the states, her treatment is very very expensive because of her they aproched me one time and asked me if I can do a BIG favor fo her, To marry her and give her the American citizenship and solve all her traveling and treatment problems, and they would pay me for my effort, Dont get it wrong, she is absolutly adorable, but anyway I refused, and told them Marriage is not a game, and I cannot put on papers what isnt for real, and it is out of the question, later they told me, how about if you married her for now,and if you wanna make the marriage real, so be it, and I also refused, and insisted that I am alittle bit more than Just a GREEN CARD opertunity, even for someone I deaply care for. (it is a mater of prenciple)
you have agreed to be a green card for someone with a despereat desire to FLEEE his country, and wast couple years of your life. you know for a fact you dont want him as a husband, and he doesnt want you , then you shuld not allow the situation to progress more than that, keep it as is < and dont get involved in his life, because you are the only one who will get hurt, and dont forget something, you have allreadya record of being married, I dont know who would seriously belive you when you tell them I was never married before, but there were just this little thing,I married this guy on paper. I belive you have put your future in danger, and you shoudl pray to get out of this situation un harmed, as soon as posible. and no one could ever blame you, you have offered to help out of your kindheart, just be vigelant and dont let anyone abuse your kindness
posted
I understand what you’re saying about working for something and the satisfaction gained from it. I’ve worked my way through college, holding down 2 part time jobs while going to school full time. I chose to do it this way. I could have had it easy my parents wanted to pay for my education but I wanted to try it on my own. I now am working on my Masters degree and can honestly tell you that doing it on my own made it mean more when I graduated. I also think it meant more to my parents as well. My husband has always had things handed to him his whole life (including this marriage some would say) a result of being the youngest child I think. Prior to getting married we spoke at length on why he wanted to do this. He wants to a new start in life a chance to build his life, be successful and emerge from the shadow of his older brothers. He wants to start assuming the role of a man in his family no longer be the child who everyone looks after. Why he feels he can not do this in Egypt is beyond me, but I know that it is in my power to help him and I felt I couldn’t refuse. Thank you for your words. Posts: 21 | From: NY,USA | Registered: Feb 2005
| IP: Logged |
posted
hey bubbles, if i recall correctly, you were asking why his family has the attitude. i'm not egyptian, but i will give it a shot and try to explain.
first, it seems this is a respectable, 'good' egyptian family. we are not talking about someone from a small village with a father working in a resort whom your parents befriended years and years ago on vacation, and now your families are friends, right?
the simple answer is that they are trying to protect your reputation.
you are doing them a very big favor and they are very grateful to you.
the last thing they would want to do is to go around and tell the world that it's a "fake" marriage because in egypt, it would put you in the spotlight as a source of negative gossip. first, it would get you a 'reputation' that you'll marry anyone for a visa. i know, i know. but you know how a small minority of idiots thinks...if you have an egyptian boyfriend, you'll do it with any egyptian guy who just has enough courage to approach you.
your family doesn't want to tarnish your reputation. they are trying to show you their respect by keeping up appearances.
same is true for your "husband."
i think what you should do is simply have an understanding between you "young people" and leave his family out of it.
you are now part of their family, his girlfriend is not. you never know if his relationship will last, etc.
second thing you should consider carefully is the girlfriend's attitude. maybe his family does have reason to be concerned. egyptian women - despite how demure they may appear in public - are anything BUT. if this girl is still hoping to get married to this guy and he married YOU, and told her it was for visa only, she should be demanding to meet you immediately. the fact your 'husband' didn't ask you to meet her and verify that it's a pseudo marriage is something to be considered. who knows what their relationship is, really. who knows what kind of girl she is, if she's sneaking around with him when he's married to you?
yes, yes, fake marriage and all, but really...you're a woman. if the situation was reverse, you'd insist to meet the 'pseudo wife' no? so if you hadn't met her yet, she hasn't insisted on it, maybe she's hanging on to him, real marriage or not. which may be why his family questions her character?
i'm just throwing things out there. obviously you don't want to give out too many detail on the net about your situation, so it's hard to suss out.
but my suggestion is, you married into the egyptian culture and part of it is keeping up the appearances. keep his family out of it and if you want to meet her, let it be a private thing btw the 3 of you.
posted
Waddup Girly! Professor Martinez told me you posted up here. Man I see the flack you're catching! Can we expect to see this drama in literary class? lol I got back to work on Monday and Kris told me you were still out there. How did you swing it with work and school? What have you been doing out there and girl why haven't you checked your mail. I been trying to e-mail you! Do you miss your music? lol Yo Give my love to Mahmoud and tell him thanks for the earrings. Love ya girly and miss you like crazy we all do come on back home kid. Freak these peeps up in here they don't you or your heart your way above them little one way above.
Muahzzzzz
Posts: 11 | From: Bronx, NY | Registered: Feb 2005
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by Tiny_Bubbles: Whoa@Akshar don’t hold back. Am I stupid, being manipulated/used? I don’t think so. A stupid person doesn’t realize they are being used or if they do they don’t care because of what they perceive to be beneficial to them. For example maybe they are lonely and the person that is using them gives them the attention they crave. I don’t fall into that category I am simply repaying a debt, my conscience and heart dictated that this was the right thing to do. I can understand why you’d feel that with this act a pattern of being used and manipulated can be established. However as I have said I don’t believe that manipulation is the case here. And my friend whether you choose to believe it or not I am a very strong and assertive woman, secure in who I am so I doubt it that a pattern will be established here. As for your assertion that my friend is stupid for wanting to leave Egypt, I agree I think if one dedicates and applies themselves to their goal a good life can be had in Egypt or anywhere for that matter. But he feels his destiny lies here, I’ve told him that it will not be easy but he does not care. This is where he wants to be.
Now as for a baby, wow that’s a whole different chapter. He and I entered into this agreement of our own free will producing a child for the sake of appearances is just a ridiculous assertion.
I want to say lots more but this time I will hold back. And when it goes belly up I promise I won't say I told you so.
posted
OMG Deeeee! Wassup ma aqui chilliando tu sabes como es la cosa! Well you know how it is ma fish gotta swim, birds gotta fly and peeps must voice their opinions. Nada ventured nada gained..lol I’m sorry about the e-mail thing; it’s all been taken care of so feel free to hit me up via e-mail. As for school and work it worked out nice everyone was pretty cool about it. The teachers have been posting the notes online, and I e-mail my work to them. As for work Mike was so amped about my trip he turned it into a working holiday for me. I had to bring out all my cameras and set up a dark room in the apartment out here. Mahmoud hired a few of the locals to help me schlep my cameras around, he has this thing about me walking around Egypt by myself. I e-mailed Mike the proofs of what I’ve been doing and he’s mad excited about the project. I also had to write a few pieces for the paper. Plus in order to soothe the big Kahuna I took over the CPK census project. So say “Hola” to your on site supervisor it’s gonna be you, me and a couple of hundred heads that night so bring the big coffee thermos.
I got my music with me! I brought my violin and Mahmoud had a guitar waiting for me when I got here. I’ve been giving lessons to a few of the kids that hang around. I’ve been off my feet for the past couple of days, I sprained my ankle and my mother-in-law won’t let me walk around for a few days. Samir decided to tell Mahmoud all about how your brother snuck up on me at the football game and carried me under his arm running down the field. For some odd reason Mahmoud can’t get over how small I am mind you his mom is only like 2 inches taller than me. After Samir told him the story Mahmoud decided to try it for himself. I was standing there minding my own business talking to Sofia when he ran up behind me and starts running with me in the apartment only thing is the jack ass tripped over the rug and BAM! We both fell and he landed on my ankle. The thing got as big as a 1950’s beehive hairdo. Mahmoud sends his best and says “you’re welcome.”
I miss you guys too! Give my love to all and hit me up via el correo.
posted
Well Jane, I don't feel people should ever hold back so if you need to spew go for it. And if it does go "belly up" you have my permission to say "I told you so." I mean after all you did warn me so it's only fair that you get to say "I told you so."
Posts: 21 | From: NY,USA | Registered: Feb 2005
| IP: Logged |
posted
Not much left to say.... all I can think of is if the INS doesn't catch them, no one will. The INS isn't that easy to fake out from what I hear.
Whatever floats your boat...go for it. So long as no one gets hurt and you don't bring children into the world that shouldn't be here.
posted
Hey EX ! Yea it’s a good family. My dad and his met when they were teenagers in NYC my husbands dad was in the US visiting family. My dad was shot during a robbery at work and my father-in-law came to his aid. He saved my dad’s life. After that they became inseparable. They used to say they were brothers in another life. I think I was like 9 years old before I found out that the our Egyptian relatives in New York and Egypt were not actually my blood family. Lol Thank you for your insight, it kind of makes sense to me.. lol And yea if the situation were reversed I would have wanted to meet the pseudo wife. I’ll leave the door open if she wants to meet me all she has to do is ask. Thanks!
posted
Thank you Debbie... thank you all for your advice, opinions, etc... thank you all for taking the time to post a response to my topic...I guess all that can be said has been said. May peace be with all of you.
Posts: 21 | From: NY,USA | Registered: Feb 2005
| IP: Logged |
posted
Yo Tiny Mike showed me the proofs! Good lord woman how did you take those shots?! They are beautiful he also showed me the roll from The Statue of Liberty! How did you do it? Hey your email is still tripping I keep getting it back. I'm sorry about your ankle babe tell that guy he is not allowed to pick you up anymore just because you're under 5ft tall doesn't make you a toy. although you are the adorable one and do resemble a doll my little munchkin !Lmao Muahzzzz muneca!
Posts: 11 | From: Bronx, NY | Registered: Feb 2005
| IP: Logged |
posted
Chacho at the baby remark. People are a little bit over the top aren't they chica? Hey you Tiny yeah you the treasnous girl do something about your email or log onto your messenger thingy. I miss you it's my day off and since your ankle has you homebound I wanna talk to you you adorable gidget you!!
Posts: 11 | From: Bronx, NY | Registered: Feb 2005
| IP: Logged |
posted
Hey Dee remind me to kick you when I get home for the gidget and munchkin remarks. For the Statue of Liberty shots I broke night, she's beautiful eh? For the rest I guess I was just at the right place, right time.
I don't know what the heck is going on with my e-mail account. I'm going to install AIM on my laptop give me a few minutes then hit me up. Talk to ya then.
[This message has been edited by Tiny_Bubbles (edited 09 February 2005).]
quote:Originally posted by Tiny_Bubbles: I am simply repaying a debt, my conscience and heart dictated that this was the right thing to do.
And very, very illegal. You're making it harder for people with real marriages to bring their spouses over.
C. Using a Fake Marriage to Come to the U.S.
It is illegal for anyone to get married solely for the purpose of getting, or helping someone to get, permanent residence in the United States. There are stiff fines and possible jail terms for people who are convicted of this crime. But we would be foolish not to address the fact that many people attempt to fake a marriage to obtain a green card.
If you are considering a fake, or sham, marriage, you probably already know that what you are planning is illegal. You should also know that this book is written with the assumption that you are marrying for love, not for a green card. We are not going to give you any special tips on making a fraudulent marriage look real. However, we will outline the risks for you.
1. What Is a Sham Marriage?
A sham marriage is one that is entered into in order to get around the U.S. immigration laws. For a marriage to be valid under the law, it is not enough that the couple had a real marriage ceremony and got all the right governmental stamps on their marriage certificate. They have to intend to live in a real marital relationship following the marriage ceremony -- and prove their intention through their actions. If the couple doesn't intend to establish a life together, their marriage is a sham. Even if it is a "friend" trying to help another "friend."
2. Will You Get Caught?
Detecting marriage frauds is a top priority for the INS. INS officers still quote a survey from the 1980s which found that up to 30% of marriages between aliens and U.S. citizens are suspect. That survey has since been shown to be deeply flawed, but its legacy lives on.
In order to detect frauds, the immigration authorities require a lot of proof that a marriage is real, including more documentation than for other family-based immigration applicants. They subject marriage-based immigrants to a longer and more detailed personal interview and a two-year testing period for couples who have been married fewer than two years.
3. What Happens If You Are Caught?
The law pretty much speaks for itself on what happens to immigrants who commit marriage fraud. You can face prison, a fine or both:
Any individual who knowingly enters into a marriage for the purpose of evading any provision of the immigration laws shall be imprisoned for not more than 5 years, or fined not more than $250,000, or both (I.N.A. §275(c), 8 U.S.C. §1325(c)).
The U.S. citizen or resident could also face criminal prosecution, including fines or imprisonment, depending on the facts of the case. They are most likely to be prosecuted for either criminal conspiracy (conspiring with the immigrant is enough; see U.S. v. Vickerage, 921 F.2d 143 (8th Cir. 1990)), or for establishing a "commercial enterprise" to get people green cards (see I.N.A. §275(d), 8 U.S.C. §1325(d)).
[This message has been edited by PRchick (edited 09 February 2005).]
posted
[QUOTE]Originally posted by PRchick: [B] And very, very illegal. You're making it harder for people with real marriages to bring their spouses over.
How is she making it harder? If the marriage is real shouldn't it be easy to prove? It seems to me it's the fake ones that would be harder to make look real.
To the guy who attacked Tiny's christianity and patriotism. Dude that's low you don't know her or the type of person that she is. She's not a christian in the sense that she's in church everyday. But she is a spiritual person , it's part of who she is. You don't know the work she does on behalf of this country or the sacrifices that she has made for it. So don't judge her. She's the type of person that you instantly fall in love with. She's the type of person that you can call at 4 am with some drama going on in your life and she will stay up with you hearing you out never letting on that you awoke her from a deep sleep. If she sees you struggling she'll prop you up never letting on that she's the one holding you up. She is selfless, loyal and one hell of a girl. Everyone should be as lucky as us to have a Tiny in their life. She's everybodys mom eventhough she is the youngest one in our crew. She encourages everyone in their academic life, she's our own personal cheer leader. Always smiling and quick with a joke. So dude don't ever attack her motives cause they were good. This wasn't something that she did on a spur of the moment. She thought it about it long and hard. She discussed it with all of us, the friends she trusts. We gave her our feedback and in the end we all understood where she was coming from.
All she wanted to know was this was it crazy for her to want to meet the guys girlfriend and reassure her that it was all platonic. Any other woman wouldn't have givens a rats butt crack as to the girlfriends feelings. 'nuff said.
Posts: 11 | From: Bronx, NY | Registered: Feb 2005
| IP: Logged |
posted
[QUOTE]The U.S. citizen or resident could also face criminal prosecution, including fines or imprisonment, depending on the facts of the case. They are most likely to be prosecuted for either criminal conspiracy (conspiring with the immigrant is enough; see U.S. v. Vickerage, 921 F.2d 143 (8th Cir. 1990)), or for establishing a "commercial enterprise" to get people green cards (see I.N.A. §275(d), 8 U.S.C. §1325(d)).
Good post PRChick. I hope Maxine reads that and thinks long and hard about what she is doing. A criminal record in her file won't help with those plans for her future if she gets caught.
Citing where you got that info from would probably be helpful for her. Maybe I missed it, but if I didn't why don't you give us a link. Thanks.
[This message has been edited by Debbie (edited 10 February 2005).]
Dude you put your story up on the internet and ask for advice you'll get feedback, negative or positive.
And you make decisions based upon your value systems. You make bad decisions, weak value system; good decisions, good value system.
And this is exactly why the INS scrutinizes inter-national relationships so harshly. So frauds don't get past the system. Which this marriage is a fraud. And there are alot of restrictions on marriage petitions, obviously these restrictions only bring undue burden to authenic marriages and not fraudlent marriages.
Tiny bubbles made this decision thinking only of herself and the family she is "helping" she didn't even consider the effects on others. Very selfish.
Posts: 5744 | From: Minneapolis, Mn USA | Registered: Mar 2004
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by Deenize: [QUOTE]Originally posted by PRchick: [B] And very, very illegal. You're making it harder for people with real marriages to bring their spouses over.
How is she making it harder? If the marriage is real shouldn't it be easy to prove? It seems to me it's the fake ones that would be harder to make look real.
In case you didn't read your friend's post, Deenize, this isn't a real marriage. She said that from the beginning. She admitted she's only doing this to "help" a friend and they will divorce as soon as possible. A real marriage is more than a marriage contract. And,yes, she's making it harder on others because the INS catching people like her and her friend and then they work twice as hard to check out other couples to make sure others aren't doing the same thing. She may be a nice person but she faces five years in prison and a $250,000 fine if caught. And that could be at any time during the two years or so they have to stay together until he gets his green card. She'll be looking over her shoulder the whole time. And you don't think there will be neighbors or people at the university who won't turn her in? Come on.
quote:Originally posted by Debbie: [QUOTE][b] Good post PRChick. I hope Maxine reads that and thinks long and hard about what she is doing. A criminal record in her file won't help with those plans for her future if she gets caught.
Citing where you got that info from would probably be helpful for her. Maybe I missed it, but if I didn't why don't you give us a link. Thanks.
[This message has been edited by Debbie (edited 10 February 2005).]
Debbie, I just did a quick internet search and came up with tons of stuff. I didn't mark this one. It's in all the INS material. Since I know several women trying to get their real husbands into the US and how hard it's been for them, it's really insulting to read this fake marriage scheme. I don't think she understands how serious it is and not only does she face prison and a fine but he'll be banned from ever coming to the U.S. again.
posted
Tiny bubbles made this decision thinking only of herself and the family she is "helping" she didn't even consider the effects on others. Very selfish.[/B][/QUOTE]
Sonomod,
Thinking of herself? How so? Isn't she the one taking the risk? Putting her life on hold for a couple of years? Oh yeah sounds mad selfish to me. We should all know somebody that selfish!
[This message has been edited by Deenize (edited 10 February 2005).]
Posts: 11 | From: Bronx, NY | Registered: Feb 2005
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by PRchick: In case you didn't read your friend's post, Deenize, this isn't a real marriage. She said that from the beginning. She admitted she's only doing this to "help" a friend and they will divorce as soon as possible. A real marriage is more than a marriage contract. And,yes, she's making it harder on others because the INS catching people like her and her friend and then they work twice as hard to check out other couples to make sure others aren't doing the same thing. She may be a nice person but she faces five years in prison and a $250,000 fine if caught. And that could be at any time during the two years or so they have to stay together until he gets his green card. She'll be looking over her shoulder the whole time. And you don't think there will be neighbors or people at the university who won't turn her in? Come on.
PRChick, In case you didn’t read my post; She discussed the reasons behind the marriage with all of us her trusted friends. We all sat down in her apartment and debated it and we support her. Yeah Sonmod we all have a screwed up value system, damn this western civilization upbringing! Prchick please tell me what neighborhood you live in so that I can avoid it. Damn people are in your business like that where you live? What are they like peeking behind drawn curtains with one finger on speed dial ? Honestly no one will snitch her out. People love and respect her too much. Plus in our world snitching is taboo, that’s something that’s real gringo like cheating on your taxes.
So basically PRChick what you’re telling me is that if you had a friend in Tiny’s situation you’d snitch her out?
Posts: 11 | From: Bronx, NY | Registered: Feb 2005
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by PRchick: Debbie, I just did a quick internet search and came up with tons of stuff. I didn't mark this one. It's in all the INS material. Since I know several women trying to get their real husbands into the US and how hard it's been for them, it's really insulting to read this fake marriage scheme. I don't think she understands how serious it is and not only does she face prison and a fine but he'll be banned from ever coming to the U.S. again.
Hey Chick, Thanks for the info, and yes I am aware of how serious this is. I'd like to recommend a book to you and Debbie since she was interested in the link for the info you posted. This book has all the info you researched on the internet plus additional post 911 Law and Policies. It's written by this fantastic immigration lawyer he writes a column on immigration for The New York Daily News.
Title: U.S. Immigration & Citizenship Your Complete Guide Author: Allan Wernick
Publisher: Prima Publishing ( a division of Random House)
You should be able to purchase it online via amazon.com or Barnes and Noble
posted
Hello Dee aka Killa, lol Thanks for watching my back. But it's not neccessary. You know me and since when have I ever needed, or wanted anyones approval? OKay well there was that time I got that mini skirt and wasn't too sure on which shoes looked better with it but other than that? When have I ever needed someones approval to validate my actions? Come on nena you know I march to the beat of my own drummer. Actually I expected it to be worse.. lol But everything they're saying about the risk factor is true so I can't argue with that. I did do something illegal, can't argue with that. The fact that my value system, Patriotism, and Christianity were questioned is par for course..lol Don't sweat it nena. I'm cool with it, it doesn't faze me an iota.
I suppose if he had romanced me, promised me the moon etc and I had married him all the while all he wanted was a green card (gasp) it would have been different. Then people would have been telling me to watch my back , my money etc etc.. lol But because I married him and am honest about the reason that it was done then I've got a horrible value system. But if he had been a cad (yeah I used that word chica) and hoodwinked me (like that one huh?) then it would have been okay because I would've have been getting his green card as a victim.
Mira nena the reason I did this post was to get an answer to a question and so far only one person has really addressed it. These people are stuck on the marriage thing. Dee if you're going to be here reading these posts take it easy on them. They know not what they do, mea culpa, mea culpa. Na just let them be they all have an opinion and a right to voice it. Some of them even have great advice, and maybe it'll be helpful to someone else sabes? So take it easy on them Killa (grrrrrrr) lol
By the way say word you got all ghetto up in here with "'hood" and "snitch" waddup with that "son" you been listening to DMX again? lol
[This message has been edited by Tiny_Bubbles (edited 10 February 2005).]
posted
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Tiny_Bubbles: [B]Hello Dee aka Killa, lol Thanks for watching my back.
Hey there Tiny! Always got ya back you know this. LMAO@ you recommending Professor Wernick's book! I didn't know you had him, what did he give you and when? Did he hit you up to volunteer for his clinic yet?
Posts: 11 | From: Bronx, NY | Registered: Feb 2005
| IP: Logged |
UBBFriend: Email this page to someone!
Now I can concentrate more on the goodness side without being sidetracked into the weakness land. Think about yourself first: it is the best way out of selfishness, despite the popular belief. 
Printer-friendly view of this topic