personally i wouldn't because i find dealing with one man is more than enough!

oh and men, would you agree to be the "second husband"?

quote:

---

Originally posted by 7aya:
if you lived in a culture or believed in a religion that allowed you to marry more than one man, would you do it? why? what would the advantages and disadvantages be?

personally i wouldn't because i find dealing with one man is more than enough!

oh and men, would you agree to be the "second husband"?

[This message has been edited by 7aya (edited 30 August 2005).]

---

Dr Naik explain some good point as to why it dont really work the other way:
[Question #2]
http://www.drzakirnaik.com/pages/qanda/index.php

-If a man has more than one wife, the parents of the children born of such marriages can easily be identified. The father as well as the mother can easily be identified. In case of a woman marrying more than one husband, only the mother of the children born of such marriages will be identified and not the father.
Psychologists tell us that children who do not know their parents, especially their father undergo severe mental trauma and disturbances. Often they have an unhappy childhood. It is for this reason that the children of prostitutes do not have a healthy childhood.

-Also when she is pregnant, what will the guys do
I made this one up, it not on his site

-Man is more polygamous by nature as compared to a woman.

- Biologically, it is easier for a man to perform his duties as a husband despite having several wives. A woman, in a similar position, having several husbands, will not find it possible to perform her duties as a wife. A woman undergoes several psychological and behavioral changes due to different phases of the menstrual cycle.

Some interesting perspective from different cultures:

________________________________

Some forms of polyandry appear to be associated with a) the perceived need to retain aristocratic titles or agricultural lands within kin groups, and/or b) with frequent male absence, for long periods, from the household. As to the former variety, consider that in Tibet where the practice is particularly popular among the wealthy Sakya priestly nobility as well as poor small farmers who could ill afford to divide their small holdings. As to the latter variety, as some males return to the household, others leave for a long time, so that there is (was) usually one husband present.

Polyandry has occurred in Tibet (see Polyandry in Tibet), Zanskar, Nepal, India (Zanskar, Ladakh, Toda of South India, Nairs of Kerala, the Nymba and Pahari of North India), and Sri Lanka. It is also encountered in some regions of China (especially Yunnan- the Mosuo people), and in some Subsaharan African and American indigenous communities (notably the Surui of northwestern Brazil). In other societies, there are people who live in de facto polyandrous arrangements that are not recognized by the law.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polyandry

Its a common belief that men with extra strong sex drives are allowed to take another wife for that purpose in Islam.

If thats the case, I have a sex thirst that isn't being quenched by my lazy husband why can't I take a second husband to provide me with the sexual relief I need?

I am sorry here, I have always remained monogamous, but the main reason why I have left fiances in the past is due to their inability to keep up with me sexually.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Samia:
Clean up after more than one?????
NO WAY....I DONT EVEN WANT ONE!!!!!!!

---

This is the biggest disappointment about men, the mess!

Why can't more men be like my father and gratefully pick up after themselves?

If you aren't confident enough to satisfy him and vice versa, you shouldn't be together.

When the heart and soul has joined as one, the answer is simple.

What happened to the days from our parents,?? my father helped out around the house,my mother was given utmost respect from him. Marriage is helping each other out, not one as the maid! Thank god , my husband is like my father, great cook also, will help out, you don't even have to ask.

quote:

---

Originally posted by 7aya:
if you lived in a culture or believed in a religion that allowed you to marry more than one man, would you do it? why? what would the advantages and disadvantages be?

personally i wouldn't because i find dealing with one man is more than enough!

oh and men, would you agree to be the "second husband"?

[This message has been edited by 7aya (edited 30 August 2005).]

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by sonomod:
Personally I have a strong sex drive, and I know my current husband cannot provide what I need.

Its a common belief that men with extra strong sex drives are allowed to take another wife for that purpose in Islam.

If thats the case, I have a sex thirst that isn't being quenched by my lazy husband why can't I take a second husband to provide me with the sexual relief I need?

I am sorry here, I have always remained monogamous, but the main reason why I have left fiances in the past is due to their inability to keep up with me sexually.

Just another reason why I cannot take my shaddah.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by sonomod:
Personally I have a strong sex drive, and I know my current husband cannot provide what I need.

Its a common belief that men with extra strong sex drives are allowed to take another wife for that purpose in Islam.

If thats the case, I have a sex thirst that isn't being quenched by my lazy husband why can't I take a second husband to provide me with the sexual relief I need?

I am sorry here, I have always remained monogamous, but the main reason why I have left fiances in the past is due to their inability to keep up with me sexually.

Just another reason why I cannot take my shaddah.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Troubles101:
Sono, Is this the typical story of women not getting enough from men and after many years they find a new inspiration telling them they are meant to be lesbians?

---

Ermm. No. I don't think so. This is two people with different sexual appetites.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Kamal211:
Dr Naik explain some good point as to why it dont really work the other way

---

Besides, Dr Naik writes a lot of stuff that is not only scientifically wrong but often simply ridiculous:

Pig is one of the filthiest animals on earth

The pig is one of the filthiest animals on earth. It lives and thrives on muck, faeces and dirt. It is the best scavenger that I know that God has produced. In the villages they don’t have modern toilets and the villagers excrete in the open air. Very often excreta is cleared by pigs.

Some may argue that in advanced countries like Australia, pigs are bred in very clean and hygienic conditions. Even in these hygienic conditions the pigs are kept together in sties. No matter how hard you try to keep them clean they are filthy by nature. They eat and enjoy their own as well as their neighbour’s excreta.

Pig is the most shameless animal

The pig is the most shameless animal on the face of the earth. It is the only animal that invites its friends to have sex with its mate. In America, most people consume pork. Many times after dance parties, they have swapping of wives; i.e. many say "you sleep with my wife and I will sleep with your wife." If you eat pigs then you behave like pigs.

http://www.drzakirnaik.com/pages/qanda/11.php

quote:

---

Originally posted by Troubles101:
Sono, Is this the typical story of women not getting enough from men and after many years they find a new inspiration telling them they are meant to be lesbians?

---

And I would love to buy so many shoes too ... they serve in many ways you know ... specially when fighting against 40 ppl family LOL

[This message has been edited by Corvinous (edited 07 September 2005).]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Corvinous:
I would love to be the twenty first husband, 21 is my lucky number ...

---

Well, there's always Liz Taylor.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Snoozin:
Well, there's always Liz Taylor.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by sonomod:

Never said anything about Lesbianism. Are you reading ES while surfing porn online again?

---

You been watchin me again?

quote:

---

Originally posted by Chocolat:
For me , one enough, tab3an if one day i found it,

but i have a question that comes alawys on my mind but dont have answer
why Allah give the chances to men to marriage 4 women.
i know why Allah did not give us same privilege , because of kids etc...
but Allah alawys care about our soul too . Allah knows the future as well, He know we will be as women hurt, and Also he do care about us? How He gives the men the chance to hurt women,
plz dont misunderstand me, i need only to know the concept of it, for sure Allah knows and i dont have a good religion knowledge
but anyone knows??

---

If women were allowed to marry more than one, it will be chaos. How you shall know the offspring belongs to whom of those men, or we shall name the kids after the mother, with out knowing who the father is.
It is an instinct in a woman to give her love for one man, if she loves another, divorce is the only better solution here. Loving 2 then is bizarre.

The man is the one responsible for the family, and to avoid adultery and ruining families, men were given that right. If a man married more than one, no chaos will occur in the family, and that would not mean that he hates his first wife, but the other is complementing something that is missing.
If a woman could not satisfy a man in some aspects, she did not make a crime, and the man did not sin to marry again. Or it is better to have betrayal and broken families.
But if the man did not do his best to be fair and just among them, it is only one wife; that is the rule. So the choice given to marry another is not an easy right given; it is a right holds huge responsibility. However, in gulf countries that right is really abused.
In Egypt a woman would feel that the man insulted and hurt her when deciding to marry another.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Sam on line:
If women were allowed to marry more than one, it will be chaos. How you shall know the offspring belongs to whom of those men, or we shall name the kids after the mother, with out knowing who the father is.
It is an instinct in a woman to give her love for one man, if she loves another, divorce is the only better solution here. Loving 2 then is bizarre.

The man is the one responsible for the family, and to avoid adultery and ruining families, men were given that right. If a man married more than one, no chaos will occur in the family, and that would not mean that he hates his first wife, but the other is complementing something that is missing.
If a woman could not satisfy a man in some aspects, she did not make a crime, and the man did not sin to marry again. Or it is better to have betrayal and broken families.
But if the man did not do his best to be fair and just among them, it is only one wife; that is the rule. So the choice given to marry another is not an easy right given; it is a right holds huge responsibility. However, in gulf countries that right is really abused.
In Egypt a woman would feel that the man insulted and hurt her when deciding to marry another.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Sam on line:
If women were allowed to marry more than one, it will be chaos. How you shall know the offspring belongs to whom of those men, or we shall name the kids after the mother, with out knowing who the father is.
It is an instinct in a woman to give her love for one man, if she loves another, divorce is the only better solution here. Loving 2 then is bizarre.

The man is the one responsible for the family, and to avoid adultery and ruining families, men were given that right. If a man married more than one, no chaos will occur in the family, and that would not mean that he hates his first wife, but the other is complementing something that is missing.
If a woman could not satisfy a man in some aspects, she did not make a crime, and the man did not sin to marry again. Or it is better to have betrayal and broken families.
But if the man did not do his best to be fair and just among them, it is only one wife; that is the rule. So the choice given to marry another is not an easy right given; it is a right holds huge responsibility. However, in gulf countries that right is really abused.
In Egypt a woman would feel that the man insulted and hurt her when deciding to marry another.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by 7aya:
hi sam, with all due respect i don't believe that this is the reason islam allows men to marry more than one. its not about marrying another who completes the first at all, because then as Keepitreal said, why wouldn't women be allowed the same. i believe that men are allowed to marry more than one woman in rare cases when women outnumber the men as happening in some countries, especially after wars

---

In this one part of the first chapter (in reality I was planning on bringing the book with me and typing all of this section out, but will do this at home tonight and then copy and paste tomorrow before class) where it is remarked that lower and middle class Egyptians consider or believe that the man's "worm" puts a fetus into the woman's womb. That women don't actually have eggs to fertilize with sperm, but that men's sperm is the egg and sperm making the two the man's contribution, a "worm".

That its men who do all the procreating and the woman just gestates the "worm" or fetus, and if a woman cannot be impregnated or carry a fetus to term its due to her infertility issues not in any way a male infertility issue.

I mean I grew up understanding that the woman's egg needs sperm in order to grow into a zygote, then a embryo, then a fetus and that the female egg dominates the DNA selection, the female genetic code is 80% of what the child becomes. The sperm is often the 20% of the genetic code if not less and if that 20% contribution cannot be compatible with the DNA charted by the egg the fetus either develops defects or is miscarried. over 57% of all pregnancies miscarry in the first 8 weeks due to DNA complications, which these DNA mishaps are directly conspired from the Y chromozone.

I learned all the this in biology class over a decade ago and due to increased surge in the fertility industry we learn that the egg is nearly indestructible, but the sperm is where the mishaps happen.

Yet Egypt traditionally believes the opposite. No wonder Islam and Egypt sees the children as a man's property. While in reality, in biology (the leading researchers in this field who discovered this are fertility experts in India, and since infanticide and selective abortions are mainly female fetuses, why on earth would these researchers feel the need to lie?)

The only prodominating element or privilage that the sperm has is in choosing the gender of the fetus. Which again fertility researchers in India and NY universities have discovered, researchers are trying to find a way of finding a sure fire means of selecting the gender of the fetus in a petry dish within the fertility clinic lab instead of the same couple coming back later only to abort a female fetus that they spent so much money to produce in the first place, so its not a wild rumor created by western feminists, its a business decision by Indian fertility labs trying to produce more male children for their customers. I saw this on PBS, quite a few years back by a male doctor with the Indian health department, tears in his eyes, proudly proclaiming that his has 4 daughters at home 3 of which are in medical school. So naturally he felt compelled to explain this 'business trend' to a western audience while he had a chance, and his last name was recognizably Muslim.

So now looking back on some of the classroom information I learned, in connection with a series on PBS on fertility issues, most of the research done within India (biggest protest against these 'fertility industry trends' come from actual Muslims, yeah I know the pagan Hindus really are an ugly bunch) I can't understand why Egyptian traditional beliefs are so, well, arggggghhhh!!!!

Now if this information was actually handed to Muslim clerics or Wahabist Mullahs, would it change their dogma?

quote:

---

Originally posted by Sam on line:
Hi yasmine,Don't you think that women here outnumber the men. And there are many cases in which a man has the right to marry another. If the reason is not vital, why a man sould carry a burden like that. For every thing there is a cause. And the woman doesnot have to turn her other cheek, she would either divorce or accept.

---

How is it more vital that a man has another woman, but not the woman to have another man. So basically the woman is given an ultimatum? You deal with it or leave? Isn't it worse for the woman to be divorced and "impure" in the society with the possibility she may never remarry. Either way she is "tarnished" and has to weigh which is better for her and her family. I believe the ultimatum is really never her choice. Do you really believe a woman is excited about the prospect of her husband having another wife? You've given no reason why it can't be equal.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Sam on line:
Hi yasmine,Don't you think that women here outnumber the men. And there are many cases in which a man has the right to marry another. If the reason is not vital, why a man sould carry a burden like that. For every thing there is a cause. And the woman doesnot have to turn her other cheek, she would either divorce or accept.

---

Oh boy are you off on the wrong track.

We don't out number men, we just live longer!!!!!

For all the men who die out of stupidity or war, far more women die from domestic abuse, childbirth, complications from FGM, and basically a shitty life.

No I think in the population under 55, there are far more men than women.

Its just if women manage to live through their childbearing years they live longer, because men are gluttonous and have indulgent habits like smoking and eatty fatty foods which women don't get to enjoy because they don't have the excess income. So women live longer.

quote:

---

Originally posted by KeepinItReal:
How is it more vital that a man has another woman, but not the woman to have another man. So basically the woman is given an ultimatum? You deal with it or leave? Isn't it worse for the woman to be divorced and "impure" in the society with the possibility she may never remarry. Either way she is "tarnished" and has to weigh which is better for her and her family. I believe the ultimatum is really never her choice. Do you really believe a woman is excited about the prospect of her husband having another wife? You've given no reason why it can't be equal.

[This message has been edited by KeepinItReal (edited 08 September 2005).]

---

I already gave the reason why they can't be equal, and the blood thing is not a mature logical reason for women to have that right. Otherwise we make clinics every where to see which kid belongs to who, so that your dream come true
Women are always jealous regarding their men, so of course she would be angry, but could be understanding for the reason for him to remarry.
So now you are speaking about a society, giving away generalization.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Sam on line:
I already gave the reason why they can't be equal, and the blood thing is not a mature logical reason for women to have that right. Otherwise we make clinics every where to see which kid belongs to who, so that your dream come true
Women are always jealous regarding their men, so of course she would be angry, but could be understanding for the reason for him to remarry.
So now you are speaking about a society, giving away generalization.

---

And men are just as jealous.

quote:

---

Originally posted by sonomod:
Oh boy are you off on the wrong track.

We don't out number men, we just live longer!!!!!

For all the men who die out of stupidity or war, far more women die from domestic abuse, childbirth, complications from FGM, and basically a shitty life.

No I think in the population under 55, there are far more men than women.

Its just if women manage to live through their childbearing years they live longer, because men are gluttonous and have indulgent habits like smoking and eatty fatty foods which women don't get to enjoy because they don't have the excess income. So women live longer.

There are not more women than men. Its a mirage you've created for yourself.

---

Actually women live longer, because they are the cause of why men live shorter

There are thousands of single girls here in Egypt that can't marry until late twenties or even mid thirties or not at all. To be precise, the number of men who are able to marry is far beyond the number of girls who want to marry .
It is my pleasure hearing your comment dear

quote:

---

Originally posted by Sam on line:

Actually women live longer, because they are the cause of why men live shorter

There are thousands of single girls here in Egypt that can't marry until late twenties or even mid thirties or not at all. To be precise, the number of men who are able to marry is far beyond the number of girls who want to marry .
It is my pleasure hearing your comment dear

---

First off I am not a 'dear' I am the hunter with the semi-automatic hunting shotgun with a heat seeking scope.

Now women don't push their men to smoke tobacco, eat rich foods that clog their arteries. No men choose to do that on their own. Women take better care of themselves, and thats a fact.

Now the reason why all those chicks in Egypt cannot find a husband is because they are picky. Its hard economic times in Egypt right now, and its better to choose a worthy husband instead of any old husband.

Eventhough its scandalous to not get married and have kids, it might be more socailly acceptable in the future due to the large burgeoning population of women who become spinsters.

And for all the men who are not married at the same age or older? What do you have to say about them. Its not like they don't exist.

My husband knows many friends in Cairo who are approaching 40 rapidly and don't ever want to get married. There are plenty of foreign women to f*ck and divorced or widowed women to have orfi relatioships with. Men in Egypt are learning that is scandalous for women not to be married properly and have no children. But if your a man, then if you don't mind rubbing your member against a zambour, a anal spinckter, or a looosened up canal then you can avoid the finanical strain of marriage.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Troubles101:
Remember, The human being survived till now coz of the old practice of polgyny by great grand parents, SO GIVE IT SOME CREDITS!

Don't you guys ever get bored talking of this subject over and over?!!!

---

polygyny wasn't practiced the globe over, you just think that way because you see your Middle-Eastern civilization as the only civilization that counts.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Corvinous:
She has been always my Idol specially with her outrageous eyes and ...

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by sonomod:
polygyny wasn't practiced the globe over, you just think that way because you see your Middle-Eastern civilization as the only civilization that counts.

No it doesn't get boring for us, like your approach to the discussion of bigamy doesn't change and neither does your support of bigamy change.

---

Sonmod, you do have a history of rejecting anything including facts which you can't stomach(remember the cousin marriage thing?), you can check whether it was only middle east thing or not and then come back and give us your results!

quote:

---

Originally posted by KeepinItReal:
Actually Troubles polygamy is illegal in the US and not in these mulslim coutries. The only people who are secretly doing this is the mormons in Utah and Idaho which is illegal for them also, and this is an extremely small minority. That was the mormons "old" testament, and modern day have only one wife. This practice has been outlawed for over a century(I want to say 1890) and any mormon who practices polygamy is excommunicated from the church. It's such a small group of polygamists that they're entwined and incest is their way of reproducing. This "old" religion being more archaic than actual following of their bible. So basically in the US we have approximetly 300 million people and there's approx. 50,000 people still practicing illegally and their marriage is not condoned or recognized. Hmmm, it's not nearly enough to compare us with Muslim countries in my opinion.

[This message has been edited by KeepinItReal (edited 09 September 2005).]

---

It doesn't make much difference whether it's legal or not in the US, many laws there are contradictory to the principles of law of the same country, look at how the west adress the subject of homosexuals and polygyny in different way.

The point, is that polygyny was very common almost all over the world which sonomod think it was only practiced in the middle east. later it was banned by Romans(?) which in return made its change into the Christian faith though early Christians had problems with such a law in the begining. It's true Most Muslim countries didn't ban it alongside some other non Muslim countries where the influence of the Roman law that was sucked by the west didn't affect the judaical system in those countries though it did affect the way people observe it nowdays.

Polygyny is practiced still in the world and in fact I would say it's more existant in the west than every where in the form of "modern polygyny" where many men maintain relationships with more than one woman at the same time,also not only mormon who do that kind of marriage but I have heared of others too but since such marriages are not registered you can't know how many are they but it seems to be a growing number , some atheists even do a kind of agreed relationship where firt woman accept another one in the house where the first one may not be able to take care of house and kids due work and second make a perfect house wife and they both become friends, according to them!

quote:

---

Originally posted by Troubles101:

Polygyny is practiced still in the world and in fact I would say it's more existant in the west than every where in the form of "modern polygyny" where many men maintain relationships with more than one woman at the same time,

---

Troubles we call those people fornicators and adulterers, the same as in pre-modern times. This is the first time I've heard of the term modern polygyny.

There are also many women in the wet that have multiple sex partners, and several boyfriends as well. We even have a talk show (Maury Povich) dedicated to having parternal tests to discover the fathers of the children that resulted from some of these multiple male partners.

I guess if polygyny was legal in the US, it would probably be the same as it is here, some women will accept it, and some will never go for it. But I know for a fact, no man would ever go for being a co-husband, they are more selfish by nature.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Habiba1:
Troubles we call those people fornicators and adulterers, the same as in pre-modern times. This is the first time I've heard of the term modern polygyny.

There are also many women in the wet that have multiple sex partners, and several boyfriends as well. We even have a talk show (Maury Povich) dedicated to having parternal tests to discover the fathers of the children that resulted from some of these multiple male partners.

I guess if polygyny was legal in the US, it would probably be the same as it is here, some women will accept it, and some will never go for it. But I know for a fact, no man would ever go for being a co-husband, they are more selfish by nature.

An American filmaker, Spike Lee, made a movie several years ago, called "She's gotta have it" about a woman named Lola who had to have 3 male partners, because she couldn't get all she wanted in one. If the world didn't have as many double standards for women as it did for men, I think a lot of women would be like this Nola character. Of course if a man has many women, he's the man (in a cool way) but a woman, is quickly labeled as a whore.

---

Fornicator and a whore, well well...This will bring into question how exactly we define our ethics and the standard no which we decide what's fine and what's not...When Polygyny was very common in the world none accused those men of being fornicator and in socities where polyndry was practiced -which was very rare in history- those women were not called whores...Now what are the bases on which western ethics stand if we remove religious reasons behind banning polygyny?

quote:

---

Originally posted by Troubles101:
Fornicator and a whore, well well...This will bring into question how exactly we define our ethics and the standard no which we decide what's fine and what's not...When Polygyny was very common in the world none accused those men of being fornicator and in socities where polyndry was practiced -which was very rare in history- those women were not called whores...Now what are the bases on which western ethics stand if we remove religious reasons behind banning polygyny?

What I meant by modern polygyny is that after banning polygyny, those who wanted to continue the practice have done the same polygyny relationships still so it's not like if those relationships were not recognized by law the pratice is not there! Polygyny "practically" still common in the west in its worst forms!

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Habiba1:
Troubles we call those people fornicators and adulterers, the same as in pre-modern times. This is the first time I've heard of the term modern polygyny.

There are also many women in the wet that have multiple sex partners, and several boyfriends as well. We even have a talk show (Maury Povich) dedicated to having parternal tests to discover the fathers of the children that resulted from some of these multiple male partners.

I guess if polygyny was legal in the US, it would probably be the same as it is here, some women will accept it, and some will never go for it. But I know for a fact, no man would ever go for being a co-husband, they are more selfish by nature.

An American filmaker, Spike Lee, made a movie several years ago, called "She's gotta have it" about a woman named Lola who had to have 3 male partners, because she couldn't get all she wanted in one. If the world didn't have as many double standards for women as it did for men, I think a lot of women would be like this Nola character. Of course if a man has many women, he's the man (in a cool way) but a woman, is quickly labeled as a whore.

---

And yet Egyptian and Arabs continue to think that is kind of behavior is normal!

The reason why movies and talk shows dedicate themselves to this type of behavior because its salacious and it sells.

Its not everyday behavior displayed by everyday western women, yet Egyptians and Arabs are commited to the idea that these types of behavior are the mainstream.

Its like me a westerner insisting that when a woman is not desired by her husband anymore he torches her alive, or if a young woman is accused only once of being loose her male family members by the end of the day have her throat slashed. Which I know isn't the norm, but a exception.

You see how insisting on these sqewed, perverse stereotypes just don't help?

quote:

---

Originally posted by KeepinItReal:
We're not talking about the past, we're talking about today in this world in places where polgyny is condoned. You can't compare the two for that very reason. It's not accepted here in the US, it is over there. We may still have people who practice polygny but again it's an extremely small minority and it's illegal.

---