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good day to all! this is my continuation of my post last time.. last night i spoke to my EGY Guy and to ask whats going on between us. he told me i already told you the problem that we have. just we need a time to think about what we want in life. and he also mentioned to me if ull be converted to muslim i can easily convince my father.. oufff! when i hear that i dont knw what to say.. honestly, im now reading about islam since last year because of curiosity and who knows one day ill be shift my religion. but im just upset when i heard what he say.. i just closed the line and texted him saying that "all things are now getting complicated between us and saying that u want me to convert so that u can easily convince ur father its just only for the religion not about who i am or what i am nor because you love me" then when he received my message he called me and he say that i understand it wrong and he also told me its a good point for us if ill be converted
my question is: who among you guys have converted to muslim just because of him and what happened?!
Posts: 49 | From: in the dessert | Registered: Apr 2008
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noone converts to please a man thats stupid!!u would only convert if yr heart is in bein a muslim! u must want this never do it for a man!!
-------------------- your ass is so tight when you fart only a dog can hear it.when you queef only a cat can hear that one. Posts: 9776 | From: You like If only mosquitoes sucked fat instead of blood. | Registered: Jul 2007
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Listen I replied already yesterday on your other thread. Let him go, he has other things on his mind. And believe me it's not your bf who's deciding who's he gonna marry eventually but his family in specific his father.
Finish this relationship; the much you will be hurted right now about the ending don't think about the last five years together as a waste of time. If it wasn't meant to be it wasn't meant to be.
There are often foreign women out who take up Islam to please their soon-to-be Muslim husbands and their families but I just think it's the most foolish thing to do.
Posts: 30135 | From: The owner of this website killed ES....... | Registered: Feb 2004
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quote:Originally posted by tina kamal: noone converts to please a man thats stupid!!u would only convert if yr heart is in bein a muslim! u must want this never do it for a man!!
thanks TINA! as i was saying even before i was reading about Islam.. but ill not use it to please him nor his father Posts: 49 | From: in the dessert | Registered: Apr 2008
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quote:Originally posted by Tigerlily: Topic: would you convert for him
No.
Listen I replied already yesterday on your other thread. Let him go, he has other things on his mind. And believe me it's not your bf who's deciding who's he gonna marry eventually but his family in specific his father.
Finish this relationship; the much you will be hurted right now about the ending don't think about the last five years together as a waste of time. If it wasn't meant to be it wasn't meant to be.
There are often foreign women out who take up Islam to please their soon-to-be Muslim husbands and their families but I just think it's the most foolish thing to do.
thanks TL.. yeah.. thats what im doing now after i heard what he say. but its not easy as i said because he already been part of my everyday routine. maybe ill need more time. BTW, ur husban is Egyptian?! what is ur religion now?!?
Posts: 49 | From: in the dessert | Registered: Apr 2008
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Never convert if that's your reason. I would have kicked that "boyfriend" of yours hard and out of my life if that was me. No one should force a private thing as religion on you. My hubby is also muslim, and sometimes we talk about religion but not often beause we simply dont agree. He never asked me to convert,- and he would never do so. Thats a private matter and should not stand in the way for 2 peoples love. - "i can only love and marry you and you can only be accepted by my family if your a muslim" - pass me a bag i can puke in.......... I had a girlfriend who had a fiance that said a thing like that. The ring went of her finger in 2 seconds.
Never give a muslim man to much "power" over you, - always fight even the smallest fight or he will eat your free will forever. Thats the leason i have learned and my lovely hubby knows by now that he cant force or manipulate me into anything i dont want- so he has lllloooooonnnngggg time ago given that sort of games up and everything in our house and life gets payed and desided by both of us. Uh that just reminded me how much i love him - better call and see if he wanna go on a lunchdate Posts: 281 | From: Denmark | Registered: Feb 2008
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My Muslim husband would be overjoyed if I converted but in 7 years of knowing each other and 5 years of marriage he has never asked me. We both feel that if I do it will be for myself and not for him otherwise it would not be right.
I know a lovely lady in Alex who converted after about 10 years of marriage and I totally respect her because you know it was her decision and not forced.
Never change your religon for someone else
Posts: 2791 | From: www.flatsinluxor.co.uk, Luxor, Egypt | Registered: Jan 2003
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Akshar, your principled approach is one that I admire. It seems to me that some women on ES convert simply as their husbands want them too. Their conversion is blinded by 'love' or the pragmatic need to be part of the community (in Egypt) and not make life difficult for their spouse. I have even heard of one woman who has converted religions twice - each time to marry a man. I am amazed at how little these women seem to know about the religion they so readily converted to. There are women who have chosen Islam for themselves here too and their marriages have the best chance, as they are being true.
Posts: 1157 | From: Censor - Edit - Delete, but you will never take away my FREEDOM! | Registered: Dec 2007
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Never convert for anybody or anything. For that matter, never believe in anything (even if you are born into it) for anything other than your OWN thought and reason. I practiced a religion I was born into for years and it always felt so fake and uncomfortable and I hate the fact that I ever did it.
As a child you do what you are told, but when you become an adult you have to use the brain that you were given and think for yourself. If it is religion so be it, if not, it is still YOUR choice...never let anyone take that away from you. Life is too short. Posts: 13440 | Registered: Feb 2006
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quote:Originally posted by Almaz.: sneaky girl, change your everyday routine! Try it. It is very possible!
You change your watch from one wrist to another and in 3 weeks you will get used to it
I can't imagine anyone converting to any religion to impress or please someone!
Religion is pretty heavy and serous stuff.
YOU need to be convinced and want to convert for your own inner peace.
thanks ALMAZ! yeah i know everything is possible maybe i just need a little time. we dont have a formal break up its just like that we just giving a time for each other.. but for sure there is no good end.. maybe let see what will gonna be happen
Posts: 49 | From: in the dessert | Registered: Apr 2008
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quote:Originally posted by Tibe-at-work: Never convert if that's your reason. I would have kicked that "boyfriend" of yours hard and out of my life if that was me. No one should force a private thing as religion on you. My hubby is also muslim, and sometimes we talk about religion but not often beause we simply dont agree. He never asked me to convert,- and he would never do so. Thats a private matter and should not stand in the way for 2 peoples love. - "i can only love and marry you and you can only be accepted by my family if your a muslim" - pass me a bag i can puke in.......... I had a girlfriend who had a fiance that said a thing like that. The ring went of her finger in 2 seconds.
Never give a muslim man to much "power" over you, - always fight even the smallest fight or he will eat your free will forever. Thats the leason i have learned and my lovely hubby knows by now that he cant force or manipulate me into anything i dont want- so he has lllloooooonnnngggg time ago given that sort of games up and everything in our house and life gets payed and desided by both of us. Uh that just reminded me how much i love him - better call and see if he wanna go on a lunchdate
thanks TIBE-AT-WORK as i said in my ealier post even before i was reading about Islam. i was just upset because why they are using the religion so that his family can accept me or our relation. BTW, what is ur religion?! how about the kids if u have
Posts: 49 | From: in the dessert | Registered: Apr 2008
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quote:Originally posted by akshar: My Muslim husband would be overjoyed if I converted but in 7 years of knowing each other and 5 years of marriage he has never asked me. We both feel that if I do it will be for myself and not for him otherwise it would not be right.
I know a lovely lady in Alex who converted after about 10 years of marriage and I totally respect her because you know it was her decision and not forced.
Never change your religon for someone else
thanks AKSHAR! great HAPPY Marriage.. before when we was talking about the marriage we dont have a problem about religion.. we know that christian and muslim marriage is allowed.. but now things was change because the family is now involved. Aside from religion conflict about the place itself the EGYPT. he was saying maybe i cant find a job in EGYPT coz the major language is arabic. or maybe ill get bored then im running go back to my country.. some silly thinking Posts: 49 | From: in the dessert | Registered: Apr 2008
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I think it would be very difficult for you to find a job in Egypt, you would be better advised to get a job BEFORE you went. You have to be shown to have the skills no Egyptian has in order to get a work permit.
What he is talking about is what happens to a lot of people who move to Egypt for a person rather than because of a desire to actually live there. I started talking about moving to Egypt when I was 14, my husband was the catalyst not the reason.
I think he is being more realistic than you about the challenges you face and I suspect he is using the family situation as an excuse to finish.
-------------------- Jane Akshar UK Co-owner of www.flatsinluxor.co.uk Appartments and Tours in Luxor Posts: 2791 | From: www.flatsinluxor.co.uk, Luxor, Egypt | Registered: Jan 2003
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quote:Originally posted by akshar: I think it would be very difficult for you to find a job in Egypt, you would be better advised to get a job BEFORE you went. You have to be shown to have the skills no Egyptian has in order to get a work permit.
What he is talking about is what happens to a lot of people who move to Egypt for a person rather than because of a desire to actually live there. I started talking about moving to Egypt when I was 14, my husband was the catalyst not the reason.
I think he is being more realistic than you about the challenges you face and I suspect he is using the family situation as an excuse to finish.
yeah! he mentioned it about the work. how the life in egypt. he is thinking what might happened. im not pretty sure if he just only using the family situation. its not only about his family. its also about us. i mean like what he say if we already have a kid he cannot send us in my country every year or if ever we seperate hows the kids. all silly question that came in his mind. or should i say that he is just SCARED.
Posts: 49 | From: in the dessert | Registered: Apr 2008
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Sneaky, I'm not visiting the forum often, so I don't know your story. But have you ever stayed in Egypt? Or did you meet your boyfriend abroad? I don't know your story, I just see that your BF and yourself are a bit confused these days. What about learning more about his culture? What about learning Arabic? What about finding more about Islam, to understand better your BF's views? For how long have you been being together? If you're just starting this relation, then go and try to know how much as you can about his culture. If you've been with him for a long time, maybe that's the reason why he's doubting now, because you didn't make the effort to learn, learn and still learn. What about a trip to Egypt? Can you afford going there? But going alone, and see what's going on there, how life is for a woman, and if you would like to stay there forever, and if you can adjust to the culture. Ask your BF to search for a flat to rent there, and go there alone, and see by yourself. Imagine your parents' BF's reaction when they see you're really making efforts.
Posts: 78 | Registered: Dec 2006
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Sadly,many women believe that by reverting to Islam they will be more "loved" by their Egyptian husbands/boyfriends/fiancees.
Posts: 3833 | From: here,there,everywhere | Registered: Nov 2007
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EVERYGIRL I've ever heard of that converts for the husband always ends up leaving the religion when/if the marriage ends. I did know of a girl in the states who was married to a Palestinian guy for 7 years and they ended up divorcing. It was only AFTER the divorce that she converted to Islam.
I'm sure there are girls/women who convert for the sake of the marriage and stay, which is GREAT. But compare it to the numbers who don't stay with the religion because it isn't what they REALLY believe. What did they do I always wonder, fake it?? How weird is that??
Posts: 13440 | Registered: Feb 2006
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"What did they do I always wonder, fake it?? How weird is that??"
I guess that for some women religion gets packaged up with the romance, and rose coloured glasses are used to briefly examine their man's faith. They want to please and most get pressure to convert, even if it is subtle. It is far easier to get accepted in Egypt, if the women become Muslim, like their husbands. Some may not be terribly religious, but convert for community or pragmatic reasons. Kind of like those who go to church every Sunday, just to be seen going... but have no real interest in the faith; it's just community or family tradition. Faking religion is pointless, as hiding your real views will eventually poison the relationship and conflicts will come back tenfold.
Posts: 1157 | From: Censor - Edit - Delete, but you will never take away my FREEDOM! | Registered: Dec 2007
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believe it or not yall, i converted to it in 2004. BIGGEST MISTAKE OF MY LIFE!
It felt that after I did that, God totally like, closed the book on me. EVVVERYTHING went to sh*t...things went bad, I suffered depresion and began to feel very guilty after a year or so. Well I started to get scared, so I decided to pray about it. (yes, bad ass me does pray) I didnt wanna go to to priest or an imam cuz of course they gonna wanna tell me what THEY want me to hear, so I went to God about it. I started having these wicked azz dreams about the end of the world, and being in church, stuck behind the cross and some of it was so scary. Well last year I took my daughter to church. I pulled up in an empty parking lot, got out and heard this faint, 'hello'. the priest like came out of nowhere and asked me my name and welcomed me in. i sat thru the sermon and they did something that i really loved...they asked us all to pray for the Iraqi people that we are hurting and to pray the war ends. once again i felt the love that i couldnt find in islam. the only thing i found in islam was extreme prejudice and hatred for anyone with their own views, and that really dont suit me well. i had my daughter baptised last summer and she is now going thru confirmation and since i iwent back to catholicism, my life has completly lifted itself off the ground and everything has been better since then.
huney, i belive all religions have a point. im not judging any of them. dont choose a religion based on what a man believes in....religion is supposed to be there to help YOU and to enrich YOUR life. what good will it do you if you are doing it for him? this goes for any religion. and as with any religion, if your heart isnt there, then you think God wont see that? as for family, well my mom was open to me sportin a hijab for a minute there, but my german army sargeant of a dad well, i walked in the house and he goes, 'i dont care what your reason is and im not even gonna give you a second to think about one, just get that fukkin' thing off your head in my house do you hear me? you are not muslim, and i dont want you bringing that devil in a prophets clothing ooga booga sh*t here...we dont need any more bad luck!!" so, watch out for your daddy cuz they get kinda psycho when they find out.
Posts: 460 | From: philly | Registered: Apr 2008
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I think many women are open to the idea of it. In trying to understand your SH's way of life you really look into it and I think some women might actually enjoy and find peace in it. Sometimes if your not exposed to something or new experiences you would normally not be exposed to then you try them and maybe you like them and maybe you don't. For example, I had a bf I started dating about a year after my marriage ended-he was great and taught me how to play chess and he taught me how to skeet shoot. I still enjoy doing those things now.However, if I didn't I would have tried it said no and when he went shooting or we went to the martini bar to play chess I would have stayed home.
It all comes down to you-what makes you comfortable, what is right for you. Converting for a man if it's really truly not in your heart just to please him is wrong, and you will suffer for it. You can learn about it, support him in it, but in the end if you don't do it for you then you will never have personal peace with it.
Some people are followers and some people are leaders- you just have to decide which catergory you fit in. Good luck!!
Posts: 1121 | From: Too crazy to look at a freakin map to find out.. | Registered: Sep 2006
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to answer the question ' would you convert for him? ' my reply, not a cat in hells chance for anyone! Posts: 3945 | From: ' Res Contr ' Amor non es guirens, lai on sos poders s'atura | Registered: Dec 2007
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as for the topic ? converting has to come from the heart not for a man i married my husband as christian and hes muslim and everyone knew that his family, freinds and they all totally accepted me 100% when we had the discussions about conversion he said u only do that cos u want to i dont want you doing it cos u think u have to or cos i want you to it has to be cos u want to in ur heart all i can say is learn as you are doing, i have been reading many books but still dont feel like i know a lot about it especially not enough to convert, if i did it would be cos i want to for my own reasons and no one elses!!
Posts: 477 | From: lancashire england | Registered: Aug 2006
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You cannot convert for him. You can lie and call yourself a Muslim, but it is nothing but a load of crap as long as it is "for him". As long as it is even partially for him, it is fake, and you won't be a Muslim.
Posts: 47 | From: PA | Registered: Mar 2008
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it's good that u are reading about islam and i hope u give the best interpretation if u also read a translation of the quraan. religion is something very personal but u must understand that becoming a muslim is a way of life not only changing u'r religion on papers. u'r "egy guy" should know that the word MUSLIM translates as SUBMITED TO GOD'S WILL so if u do it to please u'r guy, u'll only be a muslim by name. there is some women i met who became muslims in order to please their husbands and none of them ended up happily married because when problems arised in their couple life they turned back to their old religion and here is also their husbands fault because they ask of them to become muslims and they as "muslims" give a very bad example and a very bad image on islam by their actions. anyway, never judge islam by it's people, judge it by the book because there is a lot of born muslim people who r just muslims by name. im a convert for more than 8 years now and when i decided to become a muslim it was my own choice and i did it after 1 year of thinking and reading. i found islam is logic and it has an answer for all u'r questions. there is scientifical facts in the quraan that made me have no doubt i made the right choice.
just check out this video, it's going to let u see things differently but see it till the end.
quote:Originally posted by sneaky_girl: good day to all! this is my continuation of my post last time.. last night i spoke to my EGY Guy and to ask whats going on between us. he told me i already told you the problem that we have. just we need a time to think about what we want in life. and he also mentioned to me if ull be converted to muslim i can easily convince my father.. oufff! when i hear that i dont knw what to say.. honestly, im now reading about islam since last year because of curiosity and who knows one day ill be shift my religion. but im just upset when i heard what he say.. i just closed the line and texted him saying that "all things are now getting complicated between us and saying that u want me to convert so that u can easily convince ur father its just only for the religion not about who i am or what i am nor because you love me" then when he received my message he called me and he say that i understand it wrong and he also told me its a good point for us if ill be converted
my question is: who among you guys have converted to muslim just because of him and what happened?!
DO NOT convert to Islam for a man. If you find truth in it then okay, but if not, then you don't. God will see your heart. There are great expectations as a Muslim (i.e. fasting during Ramadan, praying 5 times a day, etc...) that are required. Sooner or later, he would know whether you are a true Muslim or not. If you stay in your religion, the one thing you have to think about is how you will raise your children. He will insist that the children are raised Muslim. In Islam, it is his right to do so.
Posts: 141 | Registered: Apr 2008
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quote:Originally posted by Tilutine: Sneaky, I'm not visiting the forum often, so I don't know your story. But have you ever stayed in Egypt? Or did you meet your boyfriend abroad? I don't know your story, I just see that your BF and yourself are a bit confused these days. What about learning more about his culture? What about learning Arabic? What about finding more about Islam, to understand better your BF's views? For how long have you been being together? If you're just starting this relation, then go and try to know how much as you can about his culture. If you've been with him for a long time, maybe that's the reason why he's doubting now, because you didn't make the effort to learn, learn and still learn. What about a trip to Egypt? Can you afford going there? But going alone, and see what's going on there, how life is for a woman, and if you would like to stay there forever, and if you can adjust to the culture. Ask your BF to search for a flat to rent there, and go there alone, and see by yourself. Imagine your parents' BF's reaction when they see you're really making efforts.
thanks TILUTINE! im just a newbie here.. ill answer ur all question so that ull not get confused
What about learning more about his culture? * about his culture, im reading online about the egyptian culture since we started the relation coz we came from different culture i need to adjust.
What about learning Arabic? * learning arabic is not only for him, in my office im the only one who is not ARAB that's im learning it but shuai-shuai
What about finding more about Islam, to understand better your BF's views? * as i said a while ago im reading about Islam since last year but im not saying that ill convert or no its just that i want to know about Islam.
For how long have you been being together? * we've been together for 1 year and 3 months
What about a trip to Egypt? * the time that we know that his vacation was approved in his company, he asked me to come to him for vacation but unfortunately i CAN'T because of my work..
i don't have a problem at all.. coz he knows that im reading about Islam he told me that he is not wondering if 1 day ill be converted coz this is what i want. i was just upset when he told me that "maybe if ull be converted ill easily convince my father". i was just thinking that its just all about religion.. Posts: 49 | From: in the dessert | Registered: Apr 2008
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quote:Originally posted by Sashyra8: Sadly,many women believe that by reverting to Islam they will be more "loved" by their Egyptian husbands/boyfriends/fiancees.
thanks SASHYRA8 he just mentioned to me that it will be a good point for us. he's not frocing me to convert or what. he told me at the end its my decision Posts: 49 | From: in the dessert | Registered: Apr 2008
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quote:Originally posted by With a name like Smuckers: EVERYGIRL I've ever heard of that converts for the husband always ends up leaving the religion when/if the marriage ends. I did know of a girl in the states who was married to a Palestinian guy for 7 years and they ended up divorcing. It was only AFTER the divorce that she converted to Islam.
I'm sure there are girls/women who convert for the sake of the marriage and stay, which is GREAT. But compare it to the numbers who don't stay with the religion because it isn't what they REALLY believe. What did they do I always wonder, fake it?? How weird is that??
thanks SMUCKERS i know what you mean. i also heard a story like that.
Posts: 49 | From: in the dessert | Registered: Apr 2008
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thanks to all.. guys, i cannot reply you one by one its just all the same scenario. i understands your point of view and all opinion is respected.
if we want to do something is because we want it not because we want to please anyone
thanks for all the post its all appreciated Posts: 49 | From: in the dessert | Registered: Apr 2008
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quote:Originally posted by With a name like Smuckers: EVERYGIRL I've ever heard of that converts for the husband always ends up leaving the religion when/if the marriage ends. I did know of a girl in the states who was married to a Palestinian guy for 7 years and they ended up divorcing. It was only AFTER the divorce that she converted to Islam.
I'm sure there are girls/women who convert for the sake of the marriage and stay, which is GREAT. But compare it to the numbers who don't stay with the religion because it isn't what they REALLY believe. What did they do I always wonder, fake it?? How weird is that??
thanks SMUCKERS i know what you mean. i also heard a story like that.
I think this counts for all 'adaptations' which are desired of a woman for te sake of a relationship. I hear it often; kind of demands, done by the man, because of the rate of succes in a relationship. She has to adapt her way of dressing, she has to change her behaviour, and forget old habits and uses, because in Egypt they don't count any longer. When the man should go to HER country, the same is required. SHe has to change. And then I'm not even speaking about religion... Only yesterday I spoke to a young man who broke his relationship because she wouldn't obey. Obedience seems to be a first requirement...
Posts: 7202 | From: EU | Registered: Nov 2006
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[/qb][/QUOTE]I think this counts for all 'adaptations' which are desired of a woman for te sake of a relationship. I hear it often; kind of demands, done by the man, because of the rate of succes in a relationship. She has to adapt her way of dressing, she has to change her behaviour, and forget old habits and uses, because in Egypt they don't count any longer. When the man should go to HER country, the same is required. SHe has to change. And then I'm not even speaking about religion... Only yesterday I spoke to a young man who broke his relationship because she wouldn't obey. Obedience seems to be a first requirement... [/QB][/QUOTE]
yeah i know what ur talking about. even before he always say dress good so that no one will annoy u.. blah..blah..blah.. i asked my friend he is also an egyptian, he told me mybe ur guy want u to do that so that when u are now in egypt u can easily adopt their way. but still i can wear what i want but its in proper way. OBEDIENCE is the first requirements.. u need to OBEY them, sometimes im a stubborn and i like teasing him he easily get angry though its a cute one i like him everytime i annoy him and when he got nervous Posts: 49 | From: in the dessert | Registered: Apr 2008
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Obedience means different things culturally. Tell a Western woman to obey and it is an insult and the man is seen as barbaric. Tell a woman here to obey is much different, they see it more as respecting what the husband wants...not bowing to his every need. It's just different.
Posts: 13440 | Registered: Feb 2006
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Obeying used to be part of the Christian marriage service, when my mum married my dad she promissed to obey.
Think about it, the chips are down he wants a and she wants b, they have been argueing for days. So someone has to make a decision. The Christian marriage service said it was the man.
SO THAT IS WHY YOU PICK A MAN YOU RESPECT
-------------------- Jane Akshar UK Co-owner of www.flatsinluxor.co.uk Appartments and Tours in Luxor Posts: 2791 | From: www.flatsinluxor.co.uk, Luxor, Egypt | Registered: Jan 2003
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quote:Originally posted by akshar: Obeying used to be part of the Christian marriage service, when my mum married my dad she promissed to obey.
Think about it, the chips are down he wants a and she wants b, they have been argueing for days. So someone has to make a decision. The Christian marriage service said it was the man.
SO THAT IS WHY YOU PICK A MAN YOU RESPECT
And one who is fair. If you don't you're just begging for a lot of heartache.
Posts: 13440 | Registered: Feb 2006
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I know it is different, but at the same time it is an very often (ab)used method to practise power and controll. Because there has to be a balance in this. Of course the most ideal situation would be that both partners want to keep each other satisfied, and find a way for both to reach that balanced situation. But what I often see, is the demanding man against the obedient women, while the satisfaction and feeling of wellness are only at the side of the demander, he has no eye for the comfort and wellness of the one who has to be obedient. On long term he will reach what he wants out of obedience, and because of the fact she has no other possibility, and not because she likes to comfort her husband! In a good relationship one will be pleased to comfort another, and obedience does not play a role in it.
-------------------- “Out beyond ideas of wrongdoing and rightdoing, there is a field. I will meet you there.” Posts: 7202 | From: EU | Registered: Nov 2006
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That's often what you see because the strong woman married to a kind husband isn't going to catch your eye. Of course the best recipe is where both make equal decisions and equally try to obey/please each other. It's impossible like that, sometimes you have to let him win and sometimes he has to let her win. The alternative is that someone is always the loser, and why would you want someone you love to lose?
Posts: 13440 | Registered: Feb 2006
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Of course, things are happening like they are because of the fact one is accepting him to behave like this! And THAT is a result of what has been teached to her, or because of what she has ad as an example... When mother accepts, daughter almost always will act in the same way. When father (ab)uses, son almost always will copy that behaviour!
It's a whole process: see what's happening, conclude this is considered to be 'normal', and in the end, things are like they are because both partners behave this way! Spouses who are complaining about their partners bad behaviour, but don't do a thing as only complaining, are not working problem solving. If I have an issue about my husbands behaviour, and I am complaining about him to my mother, to my sisters, to my friends, but don't take action... I don't know... I've asked once : What you expect ME to do about it? Do you expect me to agree that he is behaving badly and do I have to tell YOU that you have to kick him out??? I don't think so and I can't. Because the first person who is making decisions about what is acceptable and what ain't, is YOU!!! YOU are married to him, YOU accepted a lot of bad behaviour, and YOU make it more and more unlikely there will come a time that you don't accept anymore. He treats you bad, because you let him treat you badly, it's that simple! The same for women with questions about all requests for changings; no matter if it about religion, clothes or behaviour. If you don't want to change, DO NOT change! If you don't want to accept, DO NOT accept! Because you're handing in a little piece of yourself every time you have to feeling that you're acting against your own will, principles, norms, values and believes...
-------------------- “Out beyond ideas of wrongdoing and rightdoing, there is a field. I will meet you there.” Posts: 7202 | From: EU | Registered: Nov 2006
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posted
I'd also like to point out that I've been told so many times that no "decent, good" practicing muslim would ever ask you to convert "just for appearances" or his family's sake.
I think that he asks this of you says a lot about his and his family's religious beliefs. They are more what I call "culturally-motivated" then "religiously-motivated" muslims. In other words, his father cares about your religion because what would the neighbors say if his son married some foreign non-believer!?
He's shown you just how ignorant he is of his own religion, so next time he gets on this mighty, preaching horse (and he will)....remind him that a good muslim would never ask someone to convert. Full stop.
Posts: 2182 | Registered: Oct 2002
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posted
what I wanna know is if they get the virgins in heaven what do the women get??????????????????
Posts: 1369 | From: California | Registered: Aug 2007
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quote:Originally posted by ExptinCAI: I'd also like to point out that I've been told so many times that no "decent, good" practicing muslim would ever ask you to convert "just for appearances" or his family's sake.
I think that he asks this of you says a lot about his and his family's religious beliefs. They are more what I call "culturally-motivated" then "religiously-motivated" muslims. In other words, his father cares about your religion because what would the neighbors say if his son married some foreign non-believer!?
He's shown you just how ignorant he is of his own religion, so next time he gets on this mighty, preaching horse (and he will)....remind him that a good muslim would never ask someone to convert. Full stop.
he is not asking me directly even before he just told me MAYBE if ill be converted.. Posts: 49 | From: in the dessert | Registered: Apr 2008
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quote:Originally posted by sneaky_girl: last night he asked me be friends for a while to think what we want in our LIFE's.
That's what you stated in your other thread. So what do you want from him?
Are you considering to convert for him? Do you believe it will save your relationship? Is this the complication you are talking about or are there other things between the both of you why you agreed to spend some time apart from each other?
Posts: 30135 | From: The owner of this website killed ES....... | Registered: Feb 2004
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quote:Originally posted by sneaky_girl: he is not asking me directly even before he just told me MAYBE if ill be converted..
What you wrote in your original post was: "and he also mentioned to me if ull be converted to muslim i can easily convince my father.. oufff! when i hear that i dont knw what to say.. honestly, im now reading about islam since last year because of curiosity and who knows one day ill be shift my religion. but im just upset when i heard what he say."
You read about it because you're curious, not because you are thinking about converting for yourself at this time. So yes. He IS asking you to convert, but he knows he cannot say ad he will never directly say to you "Will you convert to Islam so that I have an easier time convincing my parents of our marriage" because he knows how WRONG it is for a practicing muslim to say this.
It's just as wrong to hint, suggest and manipulate - which IS what he is doing based on what you posted.
Posts: 2182 | Registered: Oct 2002
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posted
If he were a better man he would marry you and hope his good example as a Muslim would convince rather than pushing you to embrace something for the sake of his family knowing what he believes of those who embrace the faith and then leave it. I would not be impressed by this fish, I would throw him back. Posts: 13440 | Registered: Feb 2006
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quote:Originally posted by With a name like Smuckers: But compare it to the numbers who don't stay with the religion because it isn't what they REALLY believe. What did they do I always wonder, fake it?? How weird is that??
I don't know what converting means for these women who met their guy in Sharm and wanted to marry him after two weeks, but to me, part of being a muslim means to pray 5 times a day, to read the holy Qu'ran, to learn how many sourates as you can, which isn't easy for a foreigner, meet with other muslims, fast during Ramadan and 7 more days, at least, during the rest of the year, so how can a woman who doesn't believe in God and his Prophet can do all this? Smuckers, you say you know several women who left Islam after they divorce, do you know what kind of muslims they were? I mean, practicing Muslims, or only Muslims by word, I mean, did they pray at least?
Posts: 78 | Registered: Dec 2006
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quote:Originally posted by sneaky_girl: he is not asking me directly even before he just told me MAYBE if ill be converted..
What you wrote in your original post was: "and he also mentioned to me if ull be converted to muslim i can easily convince my father.. oufff! when i hear that i dont knw what to say.. honestly, im now reading about islam since last year because of curiosity and who knows one day ill be shift my religion. but im just upset when i heard what he say."
You read about it because you're curious, not because you are thinking about converting for yourself at this time. So yes. He IS asking you to convert, but he knows he cannot say ad he will never directly say to you "Will you convert to Islam so that I have an easier time convincing my parents of our marriage" because he knows how WRONG it is for a practicing muslim to say this.
It's just as wrong to hint, suggest and manipulate - which IS what he is doing based on what you posted.
The most manipulated request (in this case) I've heard of is: I want you to be in the same heaven as I am, after death, already convinced about the fact that there will be a place in heaven for him... Posts: 7202 | From: EU | Registered: Nov 2006
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posted
I have asked a question a little above, but I'm not sure people will read it. I was asking the question to Smuckers, but someone else can maybe answer me: for those who have met women who left Islam once divorced, were these women practicing muslims while married? Praying, fasting? Or did they just say their shahada and nothing else?
Posts: 78 | Registered: Dec 2006
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posted
Tilutine, I know muslims that were born into it, who don't pray, fast, drink and eat pork. And they still call themselves muslims. (Much in the same spirit, I suppose, that many Catholics call themselves Catholic but don't follow the preachings of the church/pope.) I think in certain countries, the religion is greatly influenced by the culture and the society and Egypt is one of those countries.
In my opinion, how someone practices their religion should be a private matter not a public display. If I have deep beliefs in a higher power but for whatever reason I chose not to physically display those beliefs to other humans around me by doing something symbolic such as getting on my knees, or crossing my heart, or spinning in a clockwise circle three times - it doesn't make my beliefs any less or worse than of those who do.
Women who chose a religion because of their partner are chosing to belong to a community and it's got nothing to do with practicing a religion, which - again in my opinion - one does in one's heart and mind.
Posts: 2182 | Registered: Oct 2002
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