posted
marie thanks for advice. she raced around last week to get the money out to her father inlaw in cash so he could take money to military. the money was stopped because they thought she was laundering it. it didnt meet the deadline. over the weekend she received call from a brother(who is in the military and is in contact with her husband)saying that she could send the money to his account by this friday and his sentence would be reduced.the only way i can convince her not to send the money is to find out the truth.
Posts: 28 | From: england | Registered: Apr 2004
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posted
anthropos how can i hire someone i will end up getting ripped off also. i will speak to her later but i think she will still send it and then we will have to wait untill september before we find out the truth.
Posts: 28 | From: england | Registered: Apr 2004
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posted
Marina, You can not try to show to her how common this is? Asking money for diferent reasons in this forum? Doing some reaserch we probabilly could find a bunch of posts. I read some, haven't you? You can print and show to her.Maybe she would think twice. Did she call the Egypt Embassy, at least?
Posts: 106 | From: Florida, USA | Registered: Jan 2006
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2000 LE as a medium salary, wow!!! No, unfortunately, it's much less than that! it's around 500 LE. A teacher gets 300 LE. 2000 LE is an extremely good salary.
Posts: 531 | Registered: Jan 2006
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I just read the ages of the people involved and said "DOH!" (Homer Simpson voice) out loud at work.
quote:Originally posted by marinab39: she is too much in love to think straight and has been made to feel guilty by his family .they have been married for 2 years, he has been in uk for only 4 months, she is 47 and he is 27.
posted
marina, take citizen's offer. if this is a scam, it will scare the daylights out of them to know that you have someone like citizen in cairo who is looking out for your friend's behalf.
Posts: 2182 | Registered: Oct 2002
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posted
Seems as if he didn't really care for the climate in the UK. Married 2 years, but he is only in England 4 months? Was your sister living in Egypt all this time? Or was she in the UK, sending him money and expecting a traditional marriage at some point? Really it sounds like he got there, realized the gravity of his situation (being married to a much older woman, in an English speaking country) and decided it wasn't for him. Now with this "cock and bull" story about prison... well it could be because his Gravy Train will end when he comes clean and ends the relationship. She may end up sending the money, but if she does I doubt she will see him again. (unless he needs more money)
Im offering my opinion based on my assessment of the situation, certainly not as an authority. It makes no difference the ethnicity of each player, what is more compelling is the heart of the story and the motivations of BOTH of them.
Posts: 1071 | Registered: Aug 2005
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quote:Originally posted by marinab39: HI CAN ANYONE HELP US? OUR SISTER IS MARRIED TO AN EGYPTIAN HE HAS BEEN SENT TO PRISON FOR TWO YEARS IN EGYPT FOR BRIBERY GETTING SOMEONE TO STAMP HIS MILITARY PAPERS TO RETURN TO ENGLAND WHERE HE HAS BEEN FOR THE PAST THREE MONTHS. OUR SISTER HAS BEEN TOLD BY HIS FAMILY THAT IF SHE PAYS £6500 HIS SENTENCE WILL BE REDUCED TO SIX MONTHS. WE ARE UNABLE TO GAIN ANY INFO ANYWHERE, CAN YOU HELP.
It certainly sounds like a scam. It is unfortunately very common that men escape military service by payment of a bribe in the right place. Therefore the chances of him being sent to jail for this are very unlikely. Even if he was caught the payment of another small bribe would sort it out. £6,500 is a huge amount of money in Egypt,way way more than would be necessary. Add to that the age difference and that she met him on a boat all adds up to this being yet another scam to get money out of a European woman.
Posts: 3809 | From: Paradise | Registered: Mar 2003
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thanks to all that have replied my sister is now logged on to this site and is reading all that you have to say lets hope that she can sort things out thanks again.
Posts: 28 | From: england | Registered: Apr 2004
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posted
Could be a problem to find out yourself. If there is a scheme anywhere, either the prison or the family might come up with an even larger sum of money to be payed, since you are a westerner.
quote:Originally posted by marinab39: HI CAN ANYONE HELP US? OUR SISTER IS MARRIED TO AN EGYPTIAN HE HAS BEEN SENT TO PRISON FOR TWO YEARS IN EGYPT FOR BRIBERY GETTING SOMEONE TO STAMP HIS MILITARY PAPERS TO RETURN TO ENGLAND WHERE HE HAS BEEN FOR THE PAST THREE MONTHS. OUR SISTER HAS BEEN TOLD BY HIS FAMILY THAT IF SHE PAYS £6500 HIS SENTENCE WILL BE REDUCED TO SIX MONTHS. WE ARE UNABLE TO GAIN ANY INFO ANYWHERE, CAN YOU HELP.
If he has been in England for the last 4 months, then he already had his visa stamped and his military sorted. They would not have given him a visa if he still had to do his military. Why is he back in Egypt? Had his visa been revoked or something? Had he got a spouse visa for the UK? Or just a tourist visa and he overstayed his welcome? And you can bribe your way out of a jail sentence. I know someone who did it. And £6500 sterling would not be out of the question if the corrupt official taking the bribe knows that he is "married" to a foreigner. My recommendation would be that your sister goes to Egypt herself. She would be able to visit him in prison if she is his wife. Many families of poor inmates would take food etc in for him, so she would be allowed to go.
Posts: 1196 | From: www.spiritofthenile.com | Registered: Jun 2002
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posted
it sounds like a scam to me .....if his visa wato have ur visa stamped by the british embassy u have to go for formal interview they check ur passprt and ur id to check if ur in the military or army first ...they only way he got a visa if the officer in charge at embassy was corrupt im doubt ful .or he had a tourist vissa then u have to have a certain amount of money im sure of that ..if not i wud like to know how u did this when concideraly i payed over 2,000 for my husbands entry ....i wud go to egypt with a member of ur family to have has back up ..or ring egyptian embassy to investigate for u if he was arrested they will tell you cus thats ur rit now has married to an egyptian //and by the way my husband is a teacher and he is only on 500,not bad for him ..he will be earning here 24,000 when he strts in august ..good luck to you wish you well in ur findings and hope that he is telling you the truth ..ALLAH HAFEEZ
Posts: 1602 | From: the banana island shake me tweeeeeeee | Registered: Jan 2006
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posted
I find it a very strange story and I don't believe 1 word about the whole situation. A lot of poor families are looking for an easy way to make some money to get a better life. And the age 47/27 is also not a good sign......... Be very carefull and DON'T SEND ANY MONEY, whatever they say. If I understand well, she is living in the UK and he in Egypt, has she spent a lot of time with his familiy, friends, collegues etc. How well does she know her husband...... Be very carefull!!!
Posts: 29 | From: Amsterdam-Holland | Registered: Jan 2005
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posted
It's very difficult to travel once you reach the age of military service. My son's passport expired on his 18th birthday for that reason. You can only get it renewed for short periods if you are a full time student. So we are sure of the following:
1. He couldn't get a passport unless his military service status was OK with the Egyptian authorities.
2. The British Embassy would not give him a visa unless same as above.
3. LE 65,000 is a huge amount, more suitable for the Minister of Defence himself than anyone lowlier.
4. Families visit relatives in prison regularly.
Our company lawyer was in the office today so I took the liberty of asking him about your sister's situation. He says he's not an expert on this kind of law but he knows you can pay a fine instead of doing military service after the age of 30, not before. He also said that you can bribe your way not to get into prison but once convicted and behind bars, you can't bribe your way out.
Therefore we can conclude from all of the bove that it is definitely a scam.
Anyway, my reckless offer still stands (I can't take the tragic gullibility of these poor women any more!). Send me the names of all concerned and I'll call them. I could pretend to be Embassy staff contacted by the bank about suspicious transfer, or a lawyer or whatever...suggestions are welcome.
Posts: 1039 | From: Cairo | Registered: Sep 2002
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posted
thanks citizen for your offer, i will speak to my sister later and get back to you.
Posts: 28 | From: england | Registered: Apr 2004
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citizen you are a real diamond geezer!!! It is so refreshing to hear someone on this forum, actually offering some constructive help to a woman in this situation, than chastising her for marrying an egyptian man.
I take my hat off to you. You display the meaning of a gentleman. Some members could learn a lot from what you have suggested and offered !!!
posted
Thanks Citizen for your help. You can say that you are from embassady and that the english wife had an accident and you would inform him.
Posts: 38 | From: Germany | Registered: Mar 2006
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somebody helped us today and rang my sisters hunbands family pretending to be an egyptian friend of the husbands. they said he was in london. these nice people also gave her a number which she will ring tomorrow. hopefully from them she will get answers about where he is. thanks to all your help. she has told me tonight that she is not sending the money. she is ignoring all phone calls from egypt hurray!!! i will keep you posted.
Posts: 28 | From: england | Registered: Apr 2004
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posted
And maybe the family just did not want to tell to friend that son is in jail. Difficult, but good to see that no money has been sent yet. What a story!:-(
posted
its been strange these last few days i have found it hard myself to except that this is a scam. because i met her husband many times he was very nice, he spent christmas day with me and all our family he fitted in well.we all feel used and stupid i suppose to think that someone can treat us like that. so please if you are thinking obout a holiday to egypt and you are single(what ever age)and you get involved with an egyptian tell him that you are poor and have no money if he is still interested then he is probable a nice egyptian.
Posts: 28 | From: england | Registered: Apr 2004
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quote:Originally posted by marinab39: its been strange these last few days i have found it hard myself to except that this is a scam. because i met her husband many times he was very nice, he spent christmas day with me and all our family he fitted in well.we all feel used and stupid i suppose to think that someone can treat us like that. so please if you are thinking obout a holiday to egypt and you are single(what ever age)and you get involved with an egyptian tell him that you are poor and have no money if he is still interested then he is probable a nice egyptian.
Your sister will need you now more than ever. Take good care of your sister. It is really sad that things like this happen.
Posts: 523 | From: Finland | Registered: Feb 2004
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quote:Originally posted by marinab39: its been strange these last few days i have found it hard myself to except that this is a scam. because i met her husband many times he was very nice, he spent christmas day with me and all our family he fitted in well.we all feel used and stupid i suppose to think that someone can treat us like that. so please if you are thinking obout a holiday to egypt and you are single(what ever age)and you get involved with an egyptian tell him that you are poor and have no money if he is still interested then he is probable a nice egyptian.
if you have enough money to travel to egypt for a holiday, then you are rich by their standards.
Posts: 2182 | Registered: Oct 2002
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yes but in order to marry an english woman and come to england that woman must show that she has money. many people have money for a holiday dose not mean that they are rich.if woman say that they live with thier parents, and they are in debt, i am sure these con men will not be interested.
Posts: 28 | From: england | Registered: Apr 2004
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quote:Originally posted by marinab39: yes but in order to marry an english woman and come to england that woman must show that she has money. many people have money for a holiday dose not mean that they are rich.if woman say that they live with thier parents, and they are in debt, i am sure these con men will not be interested.
no, she shows she has money by simply being able to afford to vacation in another country. a really poor person doesn't fly 5 hrs to vacation in an exotic country, marina. living with your family until you marry is the norm in egypt so that's void. "debt" is also a foreign concept as egypt is a cash-based society and people don't have credit card debts. if you have a bank loan, you must have collateral/equity. poor people have neither.
i'm not sure why it's such a hard concept to grasp. it's not that the guys don't believe the woman when she says she has no money (they can figure out foreign class differences too, and can see if someone is a wealthy foreigner or a middle class one). it's simply that in terms of the local economy, a poor foreign tourist is still rich.
Posts: 2182 | Registered: Oct 2002
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Marina, to tell that you have not money, that's not enough to stop them. Look, the most of the russian girls spending their holidays in Egypt are not rich, but they can serve to others things, travel and make truffic to Russia, to let them come to Egypt and earn money with them.
Or poor Western Women, they can serve to make truffic, and perhaps there are parents. You can press them. Or they have children.
You can't stop these conmen. You can ask a 'normal' honest Egyptian. He can confirm that they are not to stop.
The only what women can make is a big, big distance.
Posts: 38 | From: Germany | Registered: Mar 2006
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posted
How large a percentage would you estimate is conmen/playboys and how many is good men????
Posts: 1215 | From: Nowhere | Registered: Feb 2006
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in my sisters case he was still not happy when he got to england,he had a job and a nice house, yet he still wanted more.but through his greed he has lost. so nothing can be down to stop woman falling for these men its just so frustrating.
Posts: 28 | From: england | Registered: Apr 2004
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posted
I think that these conmen are probably very nice people within their own community - they respect their mother, family and are true to their friends.
They are probably all victims of poverty, ignorance and basically prejudice and false information about tourists and western people.
They see this as a way to try to improve their life and probably the lives of their loved ones.
I think that in a way they de-humanize us western women because of some prejudices and stereotypes about us - We are not decent people in their eyes - not even people maybe - we are just means to an end...
What amazes me is that they have such stamina - the scams go on for years, with all those sweet words and bending over backwards to make a good impression to fool everybody.
But maybe it is no problem because in their hearts they know that they are doing it all for their real people..
really someone should do some anthropological or sociological study on these people because it is obvious that these scams are a social fact in Egyptian society!
Posts: 2184 | Registered: Oct 2005
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posted
i suppose i can except that these men want a better life and we knew(my sisters family)that she had already paid out alot for this man and we excepted it and him. why couldnt he be satisfied for what he already had? why did he have to push for more and ruin peoples hearts.
Posts: 28 | From: england | Registered: Apr 2004
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posted
I don't know - it is truly difficult to try to grasp this kind of behaviour - maybe he was under pressure from his family? Maybe it was all a big scam to milk your sister dry completely.
Maybe he is saving money to marry some Egyptian girl - I have heard that the men have to buy them apartments and furniture before the marriage in order to get the approval of the bride's family.
Posts: 2184 | Registered: Oct 2005
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anthropos i think you know these people very well and i have read your last message a few times. it has opened my eyes to how other people live and think thankyou.
Posts: 28 | From: england | Registered: Apr 2004
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yes in your last message i think that this is the case. she told me last night that about a month ago he said that he wanted children. well my sister can not have any. and he knew that. he wanted to get another wife for breeding, my sister hit the roof and i think that this started off all of the recent things that has happened.
Posts: 28 | From: england | Registered: Apr 2004
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posted
Does this guy think his wife is that dumb to think she would agree to pay such a big amount? And the whole family being involved...wow, that's scary... But see, the guy got what he wanted: he's now living in the UK, I think his wife made everything to make him come. Now he's going to leave her, to go with a new woman... I hope she can do something and cancel her marriage. I know this kind of things can happen when the girl know it was eventually a fake marriage. Girls, beware!!!
Posts: 531 | Registered: Jan 2006
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I wish I knew these people well , unfortunately I am in a similar position of being tormented about trusting my Egyptian boyfriend or not.
My only option is going to Egypt and learning Arabic and thus getting some power of my own in that culture - infiltrating the society at least a little bit - the problem for us Westerners is that we cannot "read" this culture. The mentality is that different - we want to believe that there are some universal laws, some universal respect, love etc. that every human being understands but it seems that these ideas of our are shaped by our culture - and are maybe only western constructs.
I imagined that her age would be a problem for him - apparantly in muslim societies it is considered a genuine reason to get another wife, i.e. children are considered VERY important.
Posts: 2184 | Registered: Oct 2005
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Yes, totally out of the group. But that's the problem when you stay too long out of your country I think. When you stay one year, you still can go back to a normal life. More than one year, you already took too much from your host country, and you can't adjust right.Plus, there is the religion thing that makes me different from the others, but elhamdulilleh, things could be worse. So when are you leaving Bonbon? PS: Glad to talk to you Posts: 531 | Registered: Jan 2006
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there was this incident that happened while i was in the embassy ,and has my immigration lawyer told me the goverment has a percentage to meet its criteria every month to let men or women in to the country regardless they have money or not or the spouce is wrking or not .one man who had no income what so ever and his wife from british was not wrking at all had the interview when asked where are you going to live when your in england he cud not reply and still dint know his wifes surname..and was granted the visa .its all to do with percentages when and what time you get in for interview and is all do witha good day has well ,believe me my husband presented his file which cost me 1500 english and was a file without an interview was told now to bring file to interview and you know they have no to time to actually to read the file .i went back to my lawyer and he knew what was going on fax and my hubby was called and they apologised and issued the visa ,but its all down to percentage and statistics politics comes into it how many they have to let in each month from any country ..my cousin is an mp in the parliment and get s fed up with the goverment talking a bout immigration control and then point systeming the persons academic side when they create the problem .sumtimes i hav e no sypathy with the goverment cus they have prtrayed us when w e go to egypt or any country and there control sees on our passpport we have been 3time is 1year then they do presume we are rich ..but the embassy still has to pick one out to make it look like its doing to there actual system they havein place ...face fits then smile wider i say if you get in that was sheer good luck ..id say what you got to lose ..
Posts: 1602 | From: the banana island shake me tweeeeeeee | Registered: Jan 2006
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quote:Originally posted by Anthropos: really someone should do some anthropological or sociological study on these people because it is obvious that these scams are a social fact in Egyptian society!
Someone should do an anthropological study on the misconceptions and delusions of Western women with 3rd world boyfriends!
These scams are NOT a 'social fact' in Egyptian society; they are unknown and unimportant to the vast majority of the Egyptian population. I've been in Egypt 26 years, married to an Egyptian for 22 and had NEVER heard of these scams till joining this forum (3? years ago). When I tell people what I read on here, they are completely incredulous. Please remember that Egyptsearch is a sort of club or focal point for women who've lost their logical thinking skills as well as their hearts during holiday romances.
Egyptian men are the same as any other men,they know what's right and wrong, and the very very few that do these scams should not be excused or 'understood'. They are being dishonest and immoral and that's THAT. The tell-tale signs of dodgy relationships have been discussed on this forum over and over.... Just to remind you: they are: 1. Older woman, younger man (this is unusual in any society but specially so in Egypt) 2. Men will always want kids in Egypt 3. Men should not take money from women; splitting the expenses is OK. 4. Not introducing woman to family is extremely suspicious. 5. THere must be give and take as in any other relationship... culturally, socially, financially. 6. You are rich if you can travel. Full stop.
The giveaways in Marina's sister's case are 1,2 and 3 above.
A golden rule: if it's not right or normal in YOUR society, it's not right in Egypt either.
Posts: 1039 | From: Cairo | Registered: Sep 2002
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Marian, Your sister probabillt knows more than she is telling you.It is case of denial and very commom, they don't give you all the info or all their suspitions because in their minds, if nobody knows,didn't happen and they can continue with their 'love'. When Antropos mentioned something about kids and you went to talk to her about it,suddenly, she remembers a little detail that he wanted another wife. I hope everything goes well.
Posts: 106 | From: Florida, USA | Registered: Jan 2006
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santanesia you are right about my sister, she has only told us what she thinks we should know. she is still in a bit of denial she still cant believe that he could do this to her. she will only come to her senses when she finds out the truth. which will be soon hopefully.
Posts: 28 | From: england | Registered: Apr 2004
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