This is what make communicating with you a thankless task, your innate talent to insult and bully whenever anyone disagrees with you and then turn around and say your victim brought it on themself.
Anyone observe this em oh?
Putting words into people's mouth, i.e. virtually lying, doesn't constitute a 'disagreement'. It is just some unintelligent, desperate and scandalous attitude, nothing more or less.
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posted
And by Jingo you damn sure should know your own tactics (minus the projection) in their imagined use by others.
A lotta bark and woof and blah blab and still hours later not a shred of supporting documentation for your stupid egotist's convoluted Sam opinion.
Now what you will do is rant on with more baby strut just as predicted, slave to the rhythm of your M O.
Just watch you now (stall for more time. Go ahead I'm not debating you. Take your time just drudge up something ... clinical, that is.). Posts: 8014 | From: the Tekrur in the Western Sahel | Registered: Feb 2006
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And by Jingo you damn sure should know your own tactics (minus the projection) in their imagined use by others.
This is just another of your occasional random psychological jumping off the cliff; meaning, total nervous breakdown.
quote:Originally posted by alTakruri:
A lotta bark and woof and blah blab and still hours later not a shred of supporting documentation for your stupid egotist's convoluted Sam opinion.
Some of us work for a living, while others [the decedant ones] like you natter all day long over the internet, like an incessantly whining little child who just got its pacifier ripped off its mouth, about not getting replies instantly. Please put that pacifier back on, shall we!
quote:Originally posted by alTakruri:
Now what you will do is rant on with more baby strut just as predicted, slave to the rhythm of your M O.
You see, this is how you behave, and then when put in your rightful place, you whine like that little child I just described.
quote:Originally posted by alTakruri:
Just watch you now (stall for more time. Go ahead I'm not debating you. Take your time just drudge up something ... clinical, that is.)
You bet ya! I respond according to the timing of my own choosing, however much that pains or disturbs you; matter of fact, I care not what you personally think of me. In the meantime, go and buy yourself some guts.
Now for the perceptive ones out there, this might be of some interest:
Are we to assume in the case of children, parented by reasonably well-income earning 'straight' parents [who are usually just as shocked about their child‘s ‘psychological development’], feeling that they are of the sex opposite of the assigned 'physical gender', are doing so 'by choice'? ...and that should they grow up wanting to have 'sex change' surgery because of such feelings, that they are doing so "by choice", and no biological element to this condition?
From the bulk of the human genome that has been identified, the 'specific' functions of a great deal of its chunk has to this day yet to be identified. Very little has been associated with anything specific. For instance, while skin color genes have been identified, no definitive gene has been identified for let's say, 'dark skin'. We see the shapes of physical body parts, yet no 'definitive' genes have been identified to account for such. So just because it hasn't been yet identified, i.e. a 'definitive' genome for gender disorder-related behavior in transsexuals, doesn't mean there is no biological accounting for such. Look at the Y chromosome, which is a subject of much genealogical study, and yet little is known about the specific functions of its in situ genes, other than that the chromosome itself is one of the two signifiers of 'male gender'. What we largely study, are what is presumed to be 'junk DNA', mainly because the specific functions are yet to be discerned.
Given the controversial nature of 'sexual identity disorder' issues, and is considered a taboo subject in many societies, reservations about deeply looking at biological explanations which may lend any semblance of legitimacy tp the condition isn't surprising. Nonetheless, several studies have been done in the past to examine the possible biological explanation behind 'transsexual' condition. Then comes the question of if and when a specific genetic identifier(s) is discerned, whether the biological condition can be reversed. Having said that, here is the latest attempt at investigating what might lie beneath behavior related to transsexual types, from a biological standpoint:
posted
If you didn't care what I think then why you come out explaining what took you so long to do nothing?
After a bunch inane oral diarhea and more of your pop-psychology self-assessment (laugh gas). Your slow response is cause you were quite simply lost without a clue and sucking like a fiend on your pacifier while cooking up more of your baby swagger to spill. Don't keep crying and whining all the time just learn civility and answer a question to its point and disagree without being distemperedly disagreeable.
No nobody does nothing by choice. I know you're biologically predisposed to be the rude, inept, back stepping, spread natter that you are. You can't help it. It's biology driven. One day they'll isolate the responsible gene for it. In the meantime try sticking to your med sched.
After hiss like a itch about no gene being involved while at the same crowing for "actual genetic disorder" you finally fall off the fence and opt for a genetic reason with the World Science article. Good boy.
However the article goes right back to what I posted about the brain and not a damn smatter about KS or any other intersex based matter. Maybe once you learn to read discriminately you'll realize you still ain't put up shis in support of your cockamamie KS boosts homosexual preference hypothesis.
So far what you've done, with too scrambled a broken egg pate brain to realize it, is back up what I presented. Ditto for the Henningson article.
So instead of digging up some clinical report in support of your previous doublespeak non sense, why does your best shot do no more than re-emphasize the reports I put up? Just so you can sit up and try to act like you the one who brought it here.
Ah yes psychological abberation is the root of many evils. Here, lemme give ya some a dat pop-psychology you like to dish out.
Your problem is your pride and thinking no one can or should make a showing other than you. You're only trying to get the attention missing from someone somewhere in your real non-internet life and when that internet attention gets shared among other posters, as it must and should, you lash out struck doglike at imaginary competition.
You got nothing to back your previous view and have swung like a pendulum from the start. Since you only back what I put down I really need not further respond.
Now go ahead and fulfill prediction number three and shoot back with a venemous child's emotion gutter snipe reply proving the reason they wouldn't let you watch the ball drop in Times Square is cos animals are dangerous in crowds. Well I tried to get 'em to let you hang anyway, maybe next year buddy boy. Posts: 8014 | From: the Tekrur in the Western Sahel | Registered: Feb 2006
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After a bunch inane oral diarhea and more of your pop-psychology self-assessment (laugh gas). Your slow response is cause you were quite simply lost without a clue and sucking like a fiend on your pacifier while cooking up more of your baby swagger to spill.
...and what can you do about my 'slow' response, other than whine in diapers for lack of helplessness to that figment?
quote: Originally posted by alTakruri:
Don't keep crying and whining all the time just learn civility and answer a question to its point and disagree without being distemperedly disagreeable.
Actually, you've been doing all that in this entire exchange, while I've been trying to get you to read postings done in simple English, but to no avail. For instance, you talk of 'homosexual genes', when it is quite apparent that this is just but a figment of yours.
quote:Originally posted by alTakruri:
No nobody does nothing by choice.
Like the type of senseless long-winded bitching and nattering exemplified by this post, that you do quite often, couldn't possibly be by choice.
quote:Originally posted by alTakruri:
I know you're biologically predisposed to be the rude, inept, back stepping, spread natter that you are. You can't help it.
You are 'biologically predisposed' to having no balls, and not coming out to admit your inability to read plain English and hence, deriving conclusions that only exist in your thick skull.
quote:Originally posted by alTakruri:
It's biology driven. One day they'll isolate the responsible gene for it. In the meantime try sticking to your med sched.
...it'll help if they do; we could reverse the situation in future for the abnormalities that you are suffering from. Lol.
quote:Originally posted by alTakruri:
After hiss like a itch about no gene being involved while at the same crowing for "actual genetic disorder" you finally fall off the fence and opt for a genetic reason with the World Science article. Good boy.
The ranting of a 'hallucinatory' figure, hooked on crack, thinking that an assessment from this crack induced state is a meaningful one. Folks, don't touch that stuff, as you can see the visible effects inherent in this crackhead's response. "Seeing" and reading into things that he alone can see: E.g. specific "homosexual genes" is confused with 'genetic mishaps', and yet, still believes that such a thing has been uttered. My post with corresponding link is pretty self-explanatory, requires no further comment.
quote:Originally posted by alTakruri:
However the article goes right back to what I posted about the brain and not a damn smatter about KS or any other intersex based matter.
Another product of your reading inadequacies and impaired vision [crack ain't no joke]. What was analysis of motif "sequencing" mentioned in the article mean to you; we know alright, it means mere socially "learned" psychological development to you. Meanwhile, crack has allowed you to miss the general point about some biological abnormality from genetic mishaps factoring into m-to-f or f-to-m situations, not merely a product of 'learned behavior'. The fact that studies like this have been and are being conducted, is testament to the point that it is dawning to scientists that even though no 'specific' genetic pointers have been pinned down, that biology's role in this is understood; what needs to now be established, is the nature of this biology. This quite different from your rationale.
quote:Originally posted by alTakruri:
Maybe once you learn to read discriminately you'll realize you still ain't put up shis in support of your cockamamie KS boosts homosexual preference hypothesis.
The point about gender-affiliated disorders do arise from biology [ultimately via genetic mishaps], will and is not expected to 'crack' that thick crackhead skull of yours, much less the point about individual reactions to such disorders. Those familiar with literature from the likes of Bill Bucar, J. Walinder et al., will take home this point.
quote:Originally posted by alTakruri:
So far what you've done, with too scrambled a broken egg pate brain to realize it, is back up what I presented. Ditto for the Henningson article.
What you've presented, are distortions and lies built into your head stemming from illiteracy and impaired judgement [I'm sure crack has only help 'extend' it], and then hoping to set up a pseudo-counter argument for them.
quote:Originally posted by alTakruri:
So instead of digging up some clinical report in support of your previous doublespeak non sense, why does your best shot do no more than re-emphasize the reports I put up?
Yeap, in that "high" world you are living in, gene sequencing analysis lends some sense into what you 'put up' about 'psychological' [presumably 'socially' attained] devoid of any biological explanation; and oh, what is it that you said...do you know what you've said?
quote:Originally posted by alTakruri:
Just so you can sit up and try to act like you the one who brought it here.
As far as reality is concerned, I posted the link that I posted. Feel free to let your figment misguide you about this as well.
quote:Originally posted by alTakruri:
Ah yes psychological abberation is the root of many evils.
...and this is what you've learnt from the aforementioned link, that you claim backs you (?). LOL.
quote:Originally posted by alTakruri:
Here, lemme give ya some a dat pop-psychology you like to dish out.
...to stay away from drugs; yes ma'am ![salute]
quote:Originally posted by alTakruri:
Your problem is your pride and thinking no one can or should make a showing other than you. You're only trying to get the attention missing from someone somewhere in your real non-internet life and when that internet attention gets shared among other posters, as it must and should, you lash out struck doglike at imaginary competition.
...an internet crackhead playing the role of a 'psychiatrist'. Lord have mercy.
quote:Originally posted by alTakruri:
You got nothing to back your previous view and have swung like a pendulum from the start. Since you only back what I put down I really need not further respond.
Sure it "does". See the post, three posts ago.
quote:Originally posted by alTakruri:
Now go ahead and fulfill prediction number three and shoot back with a venemous child's emotion gutter snipe reply proving the reason they wouldn't let you watch the ball drop in Times Square is cos animals are dangerous in crowds. Well I tried to get 'em to let you hang anyway, maybe next year buddy boy.
...just hot fumes coming out of the rear end of an individual heavily under the 'influence', and a hypocrite at that, proclaiming to not come back with a reply earlier. Nothing mysterous about this really.
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posted
Now it seems to be a product of socialization despite the genetic component and choice(s). Enviroment and biology at its workings! Now it is more out in the open.
Here is an example of a double blind test (you can even make it a triple blind, etc to your wishes) Have a combination of 3 individuals give fellatio to 1 man and that man close his eyes and pick the best person who did the best after the test? WHo will he pick? Do the same with eyes open! There are levels of psychological and sensory stimulation as undercurrents. For diversity, add a few ugly women and a gay man/men!
Get my drift?
Posts: 1290 | From: usa | Registered: May 2005
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quote:Originally posted by yazid904: Now it seems to be a product of socialization despite the genetic component and choice(s). Enviroment and biology at its workings! Now it is more out in the open.
Here is an example of a double blind test (you can even make it a triple blind, etc to your wishes) Have a combination of 3 individuals give fellatio to 1 man and that man close his eyes and pick the best person who did the best after the test? WHo will he pick? Do the same with eyes open! There are levels of psychological and sensory stimulation as undercurrents. For diversity, add a few ugly women and a gay man/men!
posted
Molecular genetics has only began to scratch the surface of the complexities inherent in the biology of human sex, as exemplified by the following pieces:
On February 18, 1998 the following news was released by Reuters:
By Patricia Reaney
LONDON - British and Italian researchers said Wednesday they had identified a gene they believe causes sex reversal syndrome, in which people have the chromosomes of one sex but the physical attributes of the other.
Scientists had already suspected that the DAX1 gene played a role in the troubling condition. Now they believe they have proof.
"The evidence we have strongly suggests that DAX1 is the gene responsible for human sex reversal syndrome. Just a simple duplication of the gene in a double dose apparently leads to sex reversal," Robin Lovell-Badge, of the MRC National Institute for Medical Research, told Reuters.
DAX1 lies on the X chromosome. When it duplicates it causes an individual who is genetically male to develop physically as a female. Another gene called Sry, on the Y chromosome, is the main sex gene which determines whether testes or ovaries will develop in the embryo.
Lovell-Badge and researchers at the University of Pavia in Italy conducted experiments on transgenic mice to determine how DAX1 and Sry work. The research offers new insights into how sex is determined and identifies the underlying cause of the disorder.
In a report published in the scientific journal Nature, they showed that the interaction of Sry and DAX1 is vital in the early stages of sex-determination.
"We know that Sry is the gene critical for male development. If it's there you get a male, if it isn't you get a female," Lovell-Badge explained.
"Dax1 and Sry act in the same point in the pathway (chain of events) but in a normal male Sry wins. The normal function of DAX1, we believe, is to ensure that secondary male genes are turned off. It's an anti-male gene."
The XY chromosome configuration determines males and the XX females, but in sex reversal syndrome a male with XY will develop female sex organs or women with XX will have male characteristics.
"In this case with these duplications of the X chromosome including DAX1 the individuals are essentially XY so they should have developed as males but they developed (physically) as females," Lovell-Badge said.
The same things happens with Sry. If you have a mutation in that gene you develop as an XY female. In most cases those with sex reversal syndrome are not aware of the condition until puberty, when they fail to ovulate or have a menstrual cycle. "They are women but they are not fertile," he added.
There are also individuals who are chromosomal females with XX chromosomes but who develop as males. Again, the condition may not be evident until puberty.
Complete sex reversal occurs in about one in 5,000 people and partial reversal, producing a hermaphrodite with both testes and ovaries, happens in about one in 1,000 individuals.
The researchers' work was limited to physical sex reversal, but Lovell-Badge said that since DAX1 was found in other parts of the embryo, *including the brain*, it could have an affect on sex-specific behavior and might explain why some females feel trapped in a male body or vice versa.
“First, I wanted to point out the vexing difficulties confronting clinicians when faced with the birth of an intersexed infant. I thoroughly support ISNA’s fundamental demand that unnecessary genital surgeries end. However, as ISNA repeatedly emphasizes, sometimes certain hormonal or surgical interventions are life-saving. This is a newborn image of a patient of mine who is now 16 years old. He was born with what has been called “penile agenesis” and was first described in the French medical literature in 1702 (Saviard 1702, 518-19). He had undescended gonads, transposition of a fused scrotum and phallic skin tag, no urinary outlet, and an atretic anus. These are common features of this extremely rare condition. Only 60 cases have been described in the medical literature (Skoog & Belman 1989). Doctors quickly made a diagnosis of penile agenesis, and had to create a urinary outlet as well as dilate the rectum to allow for voiding. But then what sex to assign this child? For two centuries these children were assigned male. The advent of chromosomal analysis showed that the karyotype in these cases is 46XY, seemingly further justifying male assignment. However, the impact of Money’s work in the 1950s was such that there was a complete reversal in the approach to cases of penile agenesis. Therefore, my patient was assigned female at birth and his scrotum was refashioned as labia. Because of the risk of cancer, his undescended testes were removed a year later when he had to have a failing kidney removed. According to his mother, the female gender assignment led to constant conflict with the developing child. Finally at age five she decided to let him be a boy, as he wanted, and she enrolled him in a new school under a boy’s name…
Contrary to the popular vulgarization of genetic research on gender identity or sexual orientation, the molecular biology research of the past decade on sex determination points to the tremendous complexity and fragility of sex. I cannot review all of this fascinating research here, but let me focus on very recent work on one particular syndrome affecting another of my patients, who I’ll call Helen. She is a teenage girl who at age three and a half had entered into renal failure and within a year required a cadaveric kidney transplant. Helen had always been an athletic tomboy. As a teenager she was placed on premarin and provera, in addition to other immunosuppresant medications for her transplant. But it was only at the age of 15 that she learned of her diagnosis: the Denys-Drash Syndrome (DDS).
[DDS] Unfortunately it was blurted out to her by her mother during an emotional confrontation after discovering love letters from another girl. My patient also learned that in her first year of life she had undergone a laparotomy during which dysfunctional testes were removed to prevent later testicular cancer. She was found to have a vagina but no uterus. Two years later, she underwent so-called corrective reduction of her clitoris...
[DEWING] None of this even begins to address the issue of gender identity, which may very well have some congenital, organic, and neurological basis. Recent work from UCLA may shed new and controvertial light on the sex of the brain. Phoebe Dewing and colleagues in the lab of Eric Vilan, using microarray technology, have detected over 50 genes that are expressed at significantly different levels in male vs. female mice at 10.5 days of embryogenesis (days post-coitum). Since the 19th century, neuroanatomists have notied gross differences between male and female brains—these were largely relaed to differences in body size. But other sex specific difference in particular brain regions are more sex specific and have led to all sorts of speculation as to their functional significance interms of cognition and behavior. These neuroanatomical differences were assumed to be the result of in utero hormonal differences induced by the fetal gonads. What is striking about Dewings work is that the diffenertial gene expression was manifest before the embryonic gonads had formed and cold have produced androgens or estrogens. Her work argues that there are genetically induced sex-differnces in brain development. Again what the functional significance of these finding might be, if replicated, is up for speculation. Vilain, however, believes he is on to the genetic mechanisms of gender determination in the brain.
However, if genital sex differentiation is any indicator, the biology of gender identity will most likely be even more complex in its molecular and hormonal determination. Therefore, it could only be the most distorted and simplistic reading of the contemporary molecular biology of sex determination that would suggest that it leads to a dichotomized normalization of sex and gender. On the contrary, I find that this research deconstructs all prior representations of sex, indicating instead the tremendous diversity of even the anatomical manifestations of sex. Extrapolating from this, we would have to imagine that the expressions of gender behavior and identity will prove even more complex and multi-determinate...
In closing, let me return to Helen, who at just eighteen has had to contend with huge anatomical, medical, familial and social challenges. Although 46XY, her genital appearance was female and there was never any question of gender reassignment simply to follow the dictates of her Y chromosome [contrary to what Butler (2001) claims is Milton Diamond’s recommendation]. Her kidney failure and transplant were one of the unfortunate, defining features of DDS. The clitoral reduction, however, was medically unnecessary and has come under intense criticism thanks to ISNA activism (Chase 1998a). The stigma and secrecy surrounding her diagnosis and treatment, while intended to protect her from the shock of her condition and any gender ambiguity, is probably misguided. She has been and will continue to be under close medical scrutiny her whole life, if only because of the kidney transplant. Although in talking with me, she was uneasy discussing her anatomy, she had probably realized much earlier that her clitoris had been altered. Learning her medical history at 15 was probably more of a shock to her than having been gradually told about it in age-appropriate ways throughout her development. Whether it is because of this disclosure, or neurological loss of genital sensation, or other emotional, psychological factors, Helen reports no erotic drive, and complete aversion towards sex. In DDS, as in certain other intersexed conditions (like congenital adrenal hyperplasia), early medical diagnosis and certain interventions are essential. A lifetime of close medical attention is also unavoidable. ISNA is not advocating a simplistic “Just leave us alone” position, but the deferral of nonessential interventions until the individual is capable of being involved in those choices (Chase 1998b). For that informed consent to happen, intersexed individuals must also be made aware of their conditions without stigmatization.
Finally, to return to my original point, Helen’s experience of her sex, gender, and sexuality is intimately tied to her sense of her body--to what is evident on the surface, to what she understands to be her internal anatomy, and to her lost genital and gonadal flesh. At 18, she is probably less aware of the historical and cultural constructions of gender, intersexes, and sexuality that have influenced what has happened to her body and how she might construct for herself a new experience of her body that allows for sexual intimacy, erotic pleasure, and a fulfilling relationship with women, men, or both. “ - Vernon A. Rosario, MD, PhD, UCLA Neuropsychiatric Institute, The Molecular Deconstruction of Sex.
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