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Hora Woman lived during the West African Monsoon maximum. Vegetation then
From el Maestro's African Variance ADMIXTURE graph.
xyyman Member # 13597
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"OOA" DNA in LSA 8000BC!!
funny! Mota has no OOA
Elmaestro Member # 22566
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Might've jumped the gun... a new graph w/ taforalt qnd maybe even the abusir mummies (if coverage isn't t bad after merging datasets) is on the way.
Xyyman.. you keep pointing out the same thing on everygraph but you never really elaborate on why you think those Eurasian signals are important.
Tukuler Member # 19944
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8200 BP monsoon maximum Malawi aDNA shows there was 6-way African substructure in southeast Africa at that time.
• Khoe • San • Nuba (ie, joint NigerCongoKordofanian & NiloSaharan) • Atlantic West African • East African A (long before any proposed 'Bantu') • East African 'Mota' (almost 4000 years before Mota).
Also, there are 2 supposed outside Africa elements • West Eurasian in general • Anatoli in particular.
xyyman Member # 13597
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Nice...
quote:Originally posted by Elmaestro: maybe even the abusir mummies (if coverage isn't t bad after merging datasets) is on the way.
xyyman Member # 13597
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LuxManda was the distraction .....appetizer. The main course is LSA Malawi_Hora_8200BP. Again Europeans outthinking themselves
quote:Originally posted by Elmaestro: [q]
Xyyman.. ... elaborate on why you think those Eurasian signals are important. [/q]
quote:Originally posted by Tukuler: [q] 8200 BP monsoon maximum Malawi aDNA shows there was 6-way African substructure in southeast Africa at that time.
• Khoe • San • Nuba (ie, joint NigerCongoKordofanian & NiloSaharan) • Atlantic West African • East African A (long before any proposed 'Bantu') • East African 'Mota' (almost 4000 years before Mota).
Also, there are 2 supposed outside Africa elements • West Eurasian in general • Anatoli in particular. [/q]
Tukuler Member # 19944
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Hey U make em & I'll break em
BTW Your Natufian shows a minor Amazigh element besides minor San and Mota ones. It's major African component peaks in Bataheen, runs throughout North and East Africa and the Levant. Luxmanda got it too.
To economize a run with room for new pops you could pool Nankam and Kasem or leave them out. Akans and Mossi, as White Volta River nodes, cover the middle.
Kauma and Chonyi (East African B) can jump in a pool. Or maybe Giriama can fill in for them with Kambe covering the loss of late migrant 'White Volta' yellow ('Bantu'?).
Even with suggested trimmings your run is robust with the new Taforalt and Abusir. Personally I think Oman you might consider adding Oman, the best bang for the buck southeast 'West Eurasian'.
Tukuler Member # 19944
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quote:Originally posted by xyyman: "OOA" DNA in LSA 8000BC!!
. That's 6000BCE. 8000BP.
But yes. Amazing. Non-specific West Eurasian is way way down in Malawi just when the Cardium and contemporary cultures were beginning in Europe. What is it, really?
I could cut Anatoli some slack. Intrepid explorers leave Çatal Höyük by the 1000 in search of the source of the Nile all the way to the southernmost Great Lake, 3800 miles / 8100 kilometres from Turkey?
Ain't got the foggiest what these Eurasian signals represent. I mean nothing from archaeology, linguistics, or what not pops out in my mind.
If Anatoli shows up in Taforalt I'll shhhh
Elmaestro Member # 22566
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The san signal in the natufian samples is way to minuscule to make inferences, other than that, there isn't much that hasn't been seen in other studies using he right aDNA samples... particularly NA signals in Natufian and Luxmanda. (Shriner, sheuneman, Fregel.)
Secondly being mindful that we're fitting old populations with modern ones I feel that the Malawi specimen might be highlighting substructure among the San-HG as well as showing remnants of shared ancestry in representative pops. The Holocene Hora is fitted best as Mota x South African 2000bp.
Eurasian signals can be two things ...Mt R0a linked or residual OOA-like components initially more wide spread in Africa thousands of years ago.
xyyman Member # 13597
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"Xyyman.. you keep pointing out the same thing on everygraph but you never really elaborate on why you think those Eurasian signals are important."
quote:Originally posted by Elmaestro: [Q]I feel that the Malawi specimen might be highlighting substructure among the San-HG as well as showing REMNANTS of shared ancestry in representative pops. The Holocene Hora is fitted best as Mota x South African 2000bp.
Eurasian signals can be two things ...Mt R0a linked or residual OOA-like components initially more wide spread in Africa thousands of years ago. [/QB]
xyyman Member # 13597
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I love it when you ask and answer your own question......
anyways...
This looks promising over TreeMix…
Geographic population structure analysis of worldwide human populations infers their biogeographical origins Eran Elhaik, Tatiana Tatarinova[…]The Genographic Consortium The search for a method that utilizes biological information to predict humans’ place of origin has occupied scientists for millennia. Over the past four decades, scientists have employed genetic data in an effort to achieve this goal but with limited success. While biogeographical algorithms using next-generation sequencing data have achieved an accuracy of 700 km in Europe, they were inaccurate elsewhere. Here we describe the Geographic Population Structure (GPS) algorithm and demonstrate its accuracy with three data sets using 40,000–130,000 SNPs. GPS placed 83% of worldwide individuals in their country of origin. Applied to over 200 Sardinians villagers, GPS placed a quarter of them in their villages and most of the rest within 50 km of their villages. GPS’s accuracy and power to infer the biogeography of worldwide individuals down to their country or, in some cases, village, of origin, underscores the promise of admixture-based methods for biogeography and has ramifications for genetic ancestry testing. ----
Pluralities: Khoe (30%) with the near same amount of San (29%). 'Nuba' at (20%) is the next substantial part. Atlantic West Africa (8%) and East Africa A (6.5%) are substantial minorities. Even either of the 'Eurasian' contributions (4%; 2.6%) are at like twice that of Mota (1.7%).
How can the one least significant African element be one of the best fits for Holocene Malawi?
Accept the results of your own handiwork.
In a sort by K and ranked by region, Malawi aDNA naturally clusters with other Southern Africans south of 10°S.
And why is 1.3% San "too miniscule to make inferences" but 1.7% Mota is OK? Consistency?!?
I will continue analyzing your graph as best I can on its own merits and leave any a prioris out the picture when I catch 'em creeping.
quote: Originally posted by Elmaestro: The san signal in the natufian samples is way to minuscule to make inferences, other than that, there isn't much that hasn't been seen in other studies using he right aDNA samples... particularly NA signals in Natufian and Luxmanda. (Shriner, sheuneman, Fregel.)
Secondly being mindful that we're fitting old populations with modern ones I feel that [url=]the Malawi specimen might be highlighting substructure among the San-HG as well as showing remnants of shared ancestry in representative pops[/url]. The Holocene Hora is fitted best as Mota x South African 2000bp.
Eurasian signals can be two things ... • Mt R0a linked or • residual OOA-like components initially more wide spread in Africa thousands of years ago.
The latter is most plausible to me. Why? Consider Green Sahara Fula Amazigh signals. A no-show in the only available Holocene Malawi sample. No Malawi aDNA got 'em. All majority San modern pops do.
I want to open different posts for focus of different Ks, regions, questions, proposals, themes, etc., but is that too orderly for ES, to stay on topic in a thread? Lol.
xyyman Member # 13597
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Isolation By Distance...IBD
"Ain't got the foggiest what these Eurasian signals represent. I mean nothing from archaeology, linguistics, or what not pops out in my mind.
If Anatoli shows up in Taforalt I'll shhhh"
IBD. Increase of Mesoamerica or native American ancestry (blue component) with increasing distance from Africa. Let me guess “does that blue component in Africa mean anything”?. If I am a betting man my money is on Native American back-migrating to Africa several thousand years ago….wink! wink!.
IBD brother! IBD!
See that AKA-MButi component in Melanesians? IBD Brother! IBD! Mbuti did not migrate to the Papuan Islands.
Fourty2Tribes Member # 21799
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quote:Originally posted by xyyman: "OOA" DNA in LSA 8000BC!!
quote: The error also undermines the paper’s original conclusion that many Africans carry Neanderthal DNA (inherited from Eurasians whose ancestors had interbred with the group
Fourty2Tribes Member # 21799
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^^ that explains why the Mende woman had the native American haplogroup.
Tukuler Member # 19944
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OFF TOPIC REQUEST
Forty2Tribes
What report is that? Looking into the legend of Quetzalcoatl sailing to the east. The Mende woman with an American Hg, maybe she attests to a successful landing? The old default'd be Americans enslaved and shipped to Iberia. Maybe something in microsatellite variation or minor mutations can help date that Mende American mtDNA? 'Quezalcoatl' example may afford an American self-agency alternative.
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