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Brada-Anansi
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PYONGYANG, North Korea (AP) — Kim Jong Il, North Korea's mercurial and enigmatic longtime leader, has died of heart failure. He was 69.
In a "special broadcast" Monday from the North Korean capital, state media said Kim died of a heart ailment on a train due to a "great mental and physical strain" on Dec. 17 during a "high intensity field inspection." It said an autopsy was done on Dec. 18 and "fully confirmed" the diagnosis.
Kim is believed to have suffered a stroke in 2008, but he had appeared relatively vigorous in photos and video from recent trips to China and Russia and in numerous trips around the country carefully documented by state media. The communist country's "Dear Leader" — reputed to have had a taste for cigars, cognac and gourmet cuisine — was believed to have had diabetes and heart disease.
"It is the biggest loss for the party ... and it is our people and nation's biggest sadness," an anchorwoman clad in black Korean traditional dress said in a voice choked with tears. She said the nation must "change our sadness to strength and overcome our difficulties."
South Korean media, including Yonhap news agency, said South Korea put its military on "high alert" and President Lee Myung-bak convened a national security council meeting after the news of Kim's death. Officials couldn't immediately confirm the reports.
The news came as North Korea prepared for a hereditary succession. Kim Jong Il inherited power after his father, revered North Korean founder Kim Il Sung, died in 1994.
In September 2010, Kim Jong Il unveiled his third son, the twenty-something Kim Jong Un, as his successor, putting him in high-ranking posts.
Traffic in the North Korean capital was moving as usual Monday, but people in the streets were in tears as they learned the news of Kim's death. A foreigner contacted at Pyongyang's Koryo Hotel said hotel staff were in tears.
Asian stock markets moved lower amid the news, which raises the possibility of increased instability on the divided Korean peninsula.
South Korea's Kospi index was down 3.9 percent at 1,767.89 and Japan's Nikkei 225 index fell 0.8 percent to 8,331.00. Hong Kong's Hang Seng slipped 2 percent to 17,929.66 and the Shanghai Composite Index dropped 2 percent to 2,178.75.

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Grumman
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I guess his adversaries won't have to look at his pompadour hairstyle anymore. [Wink]
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The Explorer
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The "west" will now have to contend with heir to the thrown, Kim's son, Kim Jong Un. If that guy is anything like Kim, then it will be business as usual.

Interesting bit in the article, is word that people in the streets were in tears upon news of Kim's death. Could it be possible that he was not as repressive as his 'western' enemies made him out to be, or is this just misinformation?

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HabariTess
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North Koreans were raised to praise this men their whole life. It isn't a surprise that there will be people who will be mourning him. Now, the real question is, whether or not some are faking it.

This dictator has been starving, killing, oppressing his people for a long time. Many North Koreans have been trying to escape that hell hole. South Korean entertainment has also been smuggled to North Korea, something that the North Korean government have been trying to stop. These people may be kept completely isolated from the world, but I would not be surprised at all to find that many of them have found ways of seeing the truth.

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Djehuti
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^ Habari, you hit the nail right on the head. The guy was a menace to his own people but those very people were raised from birth to worship the guy! Even in the capital people clean pigeon sh|t on his statue as if he were a god. In fact, that is exactly it-- people who have defected from North Korea (and lived) say that Kim Jong Il merely replaced all religion with worship of himself. The nation is a bankrupt basketcase where even the military is suffering from malnourishment. It's a wonder why Bush invaded Iraq to topple Saddam but not North Korea.

To Explorer, your skepticism of the 'West' with regards to North Korea is disturbing. Whatever wrongs the West has done in the past it is the freest most functional area of the world today. If you don't believe what Western governments say about North Korea then feel free to talk the Korean peoples themselves.

By the way, why is this thread not in the political section?

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The Explorer
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quote:
Originally posted by Djehuti:

To Explorer, your skepticism of the 'West' with regards to North Korea is disturbing. Whatever wrongs the West has done in the past it is the freest most functional area of the world today. If you don't believe what Western governments say about North Korea then feel free to talk the Korean peoples themselves.

My "skepticism" of the "west" would be disturbing to whom; you? You of course, wrongly read my post, and levied an unwarranted emotional reaction. I referred to the content of the Associated Press article, which begged the obvious question of whether what the article says is authentic or whether 'western' corporate media had exaggerated about the deceased leader. Note that I ask this question, in the know of the interesting fact that the article is from a "western" source.

As it relates to HabariTess claim: North Koreans were raised to praise this men their whole life. It isn't a surprise that there will be people who will be mourning him. Now, the real question is, whether or not some are faking it.

Why would anyone be faking tears, if they did not really think the deceased leader is worthy of it?

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The Explorer
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Also Dejuti, with regards to your glorification of the "west", when you said: Whatever wrongs the West has done in the past it is the freest most functional area of the world today

Really?

You must not have heard about the brutal thrashing of occupy protesters in the U.S. as of recent, and similar stamp out of riots in London recently, even going as far as labeling the occupy movement in the Kingdom a "terrorist" entity, ditto for Greece and the French riots involving immigrant communities. You must not have heard about the U.S.'s Guantanomo Bay. You must not have heard of the "western" savage violation of Libya's sovereignty. You must not have heard of the weapons made in U.S.A. continuously supplied by the U.S. government, in the full know about how they will be used on Egyptian citizens. You must not have heard about U.S. government assassinating U.S. citizens and even thinking about passing laws that would effectively remove Habeas Corpus for citizens in the future. You must not have heard about wiretapping of U.S. citizens and the increasing use of surveillance cameras in almost every place citizens set their foot in the "west". You must not have heard of the recent killings of Senegalese immigrants in Italy and the abandoning of Libyan refugees to drown in the Mediterranean on their way to escaping to Italy, when Italy was one of the active participants in turning the country to rubble. You must not have heard of the "western" controlled IMF and World Bank concerns that preside over the impoverishment of millions across the globe.

Is the "west" any freer than say, its south American counterparts like Brazil, southeast Asian counterparts like say, Japan or South Korea, south Asian counterparts like say, India, African counterparts like say Senegal and the so-called "new" South Africa?

--------------------
Your best defense is FACTS!

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Brada-Anansi
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He was a dick! and deserved to go the way of the Dodo bird,he like his daddy had this cult of personality like no other,folks crying may well reflect that or maybe those of the elite are the ones shedding tears in earnest for they were the one being taken care of, I only hope his son may prove to be more enlightened and conscientious than he was.
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Djehuti
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quote:
Originally posted by The Explorer:

My "skepticism" of the "west" would be disturbing to whom; you? You of course, wrongly read my post, and levied an unwarranted emotional reaction. I referred to the content of the Associated Press article, which begged the obvious question of whether what the article says is authentic or whether 'western' corporate media had exaggerated about the deceased leader. Note that I ask this question, in the know of the interesting fact that the article is from a "western" source.

As it relates to HabariTess claim: North Koreans were raised to praise this men their whole life. It isn't a surprise that there will be people who will be mourning him. Now, the real question is, whether or not some are faking it.

Why would anyone be faking tears, if they did not really think the deceased leader is worthy of it?

[Eek!] [Eek!] Are you serious??! Why would they fake tears?! You realize that in North Korea if anyone is suspected of not adoring the "Dear Leader", they are immediately arrested and sent to a concentration camp for treason! You do realize that thousands of people have been sent to concentration camps or executed for disobeying the rules of the "Dear Leader" like tuning in to other radio stations outside the official regime station or watching TV shows from outside North Korea. Now I'm really disturbed. Takruri, do you even know anything about North Korea and its regime?? And I'm not just talking about what the Western Press says but what South Korea, Japan, and even North Korea's ally China says let alone what people who have escaped that hellhole have described themselves?!
quote:
Also Dejuti, with regards to your glorification of the "west", when you said: Whatever wrongs the West has done in the past it is the freest most functional area of the world today

Really?

You must not have heard about the brutal thrashing of occupy protesters in the U.S. as of recent, and similar stamp out of riots in London recently, even going as far as labeling the occupy movement in the Kingdom a "terrorist" entity, ditto for Greece and the French riots involving immigrant communities. You must not have heard about the U.S.'s Guantanomo Bay. You must not have heard of the "western" savage violation of Libya's sovereignty. You must not have heard of the weapons made in U.S.A. continuously supplied by the U.S. government, in the full know about how they will be used on Egyptian citizens. You must not have heard about U.S. government assassinating U.S. citizens and even thinking about passing laws that would effectively remove Habeas Corpus for citizens in the future. You must not have heard about wiretapping of U.S. citizens and the increasing use of surveillance cameras in almost every place citizens set their foot in the "west". You must not have heard of the recent killings of Senegalese immigrants in Italy and the abandoning of Libyan refugees to drown in the Mediterranean on their way to escaping to Italy, when Italy was one of the active participants in turning the country to rubble. You must not have heard of the "western" controlled IMF and World Bank concerns that preside over the impoverishment of millions across the globe.

Oh wow! You must be serious. The "Occupy" protestors here in U.S. as well as the malcontents in Europe like the U.K. and especially Greece as well as the Muslim immigrant upstarts in Spain have ALL gone beyond their rights of protest when they violate the rights of others through destruction of property and VIOLENCE! Or is YOUR dose of news and journalism only come from the left-side of the West?? All these groups have resorted to violence and vandalism, yet no doubt you accuse the Tea Party of doing this. LOL Mind you Greek malcontents are angry that they have bankrupted their own country since 95% of the jobs are government jobs and ALL are unionized and now that they ran out of money they want other European nations via the EU to bail them out? Mind you the U.S. is in a similar situation albeit way down the road and not as bad. People like to blame the banks, and not the politicians who pressure them or influence them with things like hedge-funds. It's funny that Occupiers blame Wallstreet when their very movement was funded by George Soros who has made the most money off Wallstreet and has invested in Obama's campaign. It seems funny how they only blame Wallstreet and the Banks while Congress and the Whitehouse get away scot-free.

quote:
Is the "west" any freer than say, its south American counterparts like Brazil, southeast Asian counterparts like say, Japan or South Korea, south Asian counterparts like say, India, African counterparts like say Senegal and the so-called "new" South Africa?
Of course those regions are free because of Western style free-market and constitutional rights.
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Djehuti
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quote:
Originally posted by Brada-Anansi:

He was a dick! and deserved to go the way of the Dodo bird,he like his daddy had this cult of personality like no other,folks crying may well reflect that or maybe those of the elite are the ones shedding tears in earnest for they were the one being taken care of, I only hope his son may prove to be more enlightened and conscientious than he was.

LOL I've seen the fotage. And they were NOT shedding tears. Plenty of wailing and crying noises yes, but no tears. I won't be surprised if many of them will 'disappear' because they produced no tears in their acting job. That's how f*cked up North Korea is.

Hey, if you want the true story of North Korea watch it and hear it from the people who actually escaped from there. There is an excellent documentary that came out back in 2010 called Kimjongilia.

http://www.kimjongiliathemovie.com/

I knew North Korea was messed up, but I had no idea how bad it was until I saw this movie.

You can see a peek here.

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vwwvv
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Kim Jong Il may be dead, but his illustrious great spirit lives on in police state USA

(NaturalNews) Kim Jong Il officially died yesterday, according to mainstream news reports. Perhaps he did. Or maybe they finally decided to end their charade of pretending he was still alive by propping up his corpse at public events or parading around a body double.

Either way, his death is official now, which means that hundreds (if not thousands) of North Korean citizens will be committing suicide this week. Their "illustrious great leader" has died, you see. Yeah, the one who ran North Korea as a police state, who maintained a huge array of secret prisons filled with political enemies, and who routinely kidnapped young women to use as sex slaves. North Koreans are "the most enslaved people on Earth," writes Paul Joseph Watson (http://www.prisonplanet.com/north-k...), and even their public display of crying and wailing over Kim's death is conducted under threat of arrest and imprisonment.

If you want to see a video of some of the most mind-numbed brainwashed zombies on the planet, watch this jaw-dropping compilation of North Koreans crying over the death of the very leader who imprisoned their family members, stole their wealth and raped their daughters: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pSWN6Qj98Iw

Delusional worship of big government

I cannot think of a more stunning example of mass delusional thinking by human beings. North Korea's citizens will no doubt soon be told some mythological fairy tale such as "a thousand cranes descended from the sky to carry away Kim Jong Il's body and raise it to the heavens" or some other such nonsense. The North Korean people have no way to know whether it's true or not, of course, since the entire North Korean media is completely controlled by the state, and it tells people whatever lies and myths it wants them to believe.

Of course, every nation has its own fairytales -- and its own gullible zombies who believe it. In North Korea, the nonsense is centered around the god figure Kim Jong Il (and now his son). In America, the nonsense is centered around false flag terrorist attacks like 9/11 or Oklahoma City, both of which are just as fabricated and silly as the claim that a thousand cranes will descend to carry Kim's body to the heavens.

Americans who believe in their false government are just as self-deluded as the North Koreans who now moan and weep over the death of Kim Jong Il. The one thing that's universal about modern human beings is that most of them are ridiculously gullible and will fall for almost anything if it's stated by an "official" source. Very few people have the courage and wisdom to question their government and think for themselves.

Do America's political leaders also worship Kim Jong Il?

As it turns out, there may be more in common between North Korea and the United States than you ever imagined. One of Kim Jong Il's great admirers must be, of course, U.S. President Barack Obama who has:

1) Advocated an "indefinite detention" bill that allows the U.S. military to secretly kidnap and "disappear" citizens just like they do in North Korea (http://www.naturalnews.com/034414_N...).

2) In doing this, he has thereby expanded the role of Gitmo and other secret prisons in the USA, even after he promised to shut them down.

3) His administration has modeled the TSA's "reach down your pants" police state searches after Kim Jong Il's illustrious sexual escapades involving the young women of his choice.

4) His administration plots false flag attacks against his own countrymen with hare-brained schemes such as Operation Fast & Furious, a failed government gun-running setup that was designed to cause escalating gun violence and a reactionary call for abolishing the Second Amendment (http://www.naturalnews.com/033628_O...).

North Korea would be proud... these are tactics right out of Kim's playbook! And in terms of making Obama look like a god, check out all the incredible propaganda found across mainstream media photos that try to place a "halo" around Obama's head, just like this Associated Press photo:
http://weaselzippers.us/2011/03/14/...

(Search Google images for "Obama halo" to find hundreds more...)

In fact, watch this hilarious parody video showing North Koreans weeping in the streets over Obama's delayed Hawaiian vacation:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kGFm...

Dear glorious leader of our righteous nation, we worship your great dictatorial power over the universe!

North Korea is, by any reasonable definition, a cultist state. It really is a nationalistic cult of worshipping Kim Jong Il, their "dear leader" who presided over a government which instructs all citizens how to run their lives. If we continue on our current path in America, we'll look a lot like North Korea in a few years, by the way.

If you've never actually seen videos of everyday citizens in North Korea running around kissing Kim's picture on their wall, uttering phrases of blind obedience to their "illustrious leader," and crying over his every move, then you don't know what fun you're missing. Watch some of these videos to witness the utterly bizarre depth of government brainwashing North Korean citizens have been subjected to:

Welcome to North Korea
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FJ6E...

Undercover In North Korea
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A_26...

Life in North Korea
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QSrc...

North Korea is a dictator love fest orgy of mindless obedience, carried out by a nation of total zombies who have lost any semblance of individuality or non-conformist ideas. That nation is the ultimate expression of fitting in and "going along." It's the status quo, expressed to the political extreme, and it's perhaps the world's best example of what happens when the People let their government lie to them, generation after generation, until the whole nation becomes some sort of pathetic mass of deluded worker slaves who are wholly incapable of standing up against tyranny. (At the same time, a FEW of the North Koreans actually realize they're living in The Matrix and they try to resist the system. Kudos to all those who have tried to resist government tyranny in North Korea. Real revolution may soon be within your reach...)

Many leftist Americans would love Kim Jong Il's policies
Here in America, some of the more extreme leftist "we want government to run everything" people would absolutely love to see Kim Jong Il's socialist policies rolled out across the USA. These Americans, you see, are acting more and more like North Korean every day: Mindlessly allowing themselves to be hypnotized by the state, spying on their own neighbors and family members ("if you see something, say something!"), and even worshipping some disingenuous political leader while he's stealing all their wealth. Get on your knees and kiss the photograph of our illustrious, glorious leader, you pathetic slave!

As America's freedoms are being stripped away by tyrants, the economy is imploding and unemployment is now approaching Great Depression numbers. We're inching closer and closer to a North Korea-style economy with each passing day, especially as nearly all industry has been moved to Mexico or China. Before long, all we'll be left with is a landscape of McDonald's, Walgreens, CVS Pharmacies and hospitals, where half the population works for the Department of Homeland Security, spying on the other half who serve up genetically modified cheeseburgers and doll out mind-numbing pharmaceuticals at the corner store. That's corporate-run police state socialism for ya!

Many Americans also seem to love Kim's economic policies, which were based on equality for everyone! This was achieved by making sure that every citizen was equally destitute and lacking in basics such as food, running water and even primitive health care. It's all about equality, right? We can achieve that in America, too: Just steal all the money from the people and give it to the wealthy banksters!

That's already been done, of course, with the banker bailout programs and the total takeover of the U.S. money supply by the Federal Reserve, a private institution run and owned by globalist bankers. All these globalist Goldman Sachs operators and Jon "the Don" Corzine wannabe crooks must look up to North Korea with great admiration. What a wonderful nation! No need to worry about pesky voters or rigging the electronic voting machines, since there are no elections in the first place. No need to deal with political opponents or free speech advocates -- you just arrest them and toss 'em in the state-run prisons under "indefinite detention" provisions (sound familiar?). And best of all, there's no worry about dealing with a population that might overthrow your government since all you have to do is cause a few crop failures and starve ten percent of your population to death every year. Keep 'em weak, and they won't march against you.

North Korea is every American tyrant's ultimate fantasy land! Toss in a tractor trailer rig full of cocaine brought in across the Mexico border or heroin grown by U.S. troops in Afghanistan (http://www.naturalnews.com/034289_A...), and you've got yourself a dictatorial socialist military police state extravaganza!

U.S. tyrants secretly admire the power of Kim
It's so sad that our illustrious great leader of the world has suddenly died, but have no fear, my fellow citizens: There are many ready to take his place! Newt Gingrich, for example, thinks we should crank up the War on Drugs in America, turning every U.S. city and town into a reefer madness battleground that would require hiring one million more drug enforcement officers (job creation!) and unleashing them with TSA-style powers to molest innocent people over a couple of rolled-at-home whacky tobbacky smokes.

Newt also wants to arrest federal court judges who disagree with his illustrious great wisdom, as he has brazenly admitted in recent interviews (http://abcnews.go.com/m/blogEntry?i...). Add in a few secret prisons and a mandatory cultist worship of the President, and New Gingrich could actually pass for a white Kim Jong Il! And if Newt isn't elected to the presidency, there are always other tyrants willing to step in and get the job done, like Rick "Gardasil" Perry who thinks mandatory vaccine injections should be administered at gunpoint.

Kim Jong Il's illustrious soul must be in heaven now, looking down upon Rick Perry, Newt Gingrich, Barack Obama and others with a sense of self disappointment. "Why didn't I think of that?" he must be asking himself. "If I had only used false flag staged terror events, I could have achieved even greater power and control because my citizens would have enslaved themselves!"

Perhaps his illustrious "great leader" son, Kim Jong Un, will yet discover even greater tactics of total government mind control over gullible authority worshippers. He was officially declared "a great person born of heaven" by the North Korean mainstream media, which operates almost exactly like the United States mainstream media by lying to the People while parroting government propaganda. Kim Jong Un has been described as "the spiritual pillar and the lighthouse of hope" with the operative keyword being, of course, "Hope." Ring a bell? (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barack...) That's the word Obama ran on while being described as a "savior" by the government-worshipping press (http://www.realclearpolitics.com/ar...). Every nation of zombies, it turns out, needs to be presented with a god-like figure to believe in while they're being looted blind by their own government.

What's next for the great heavenly nation of North Korea?
Observers are closely monitoring the situation in North Korea, in the expectation that Kim's death may stir up strategic military trouble. North Korea has an army of 1.2 million half-starved soldiers, and they're armed with paintball air guns featuring Kim Jong Il's smiling face hand-painted on every paintball by the nation's 2+ million political prisoners. The soldiers have so far refused to fire their paintball ammo, claiming they do not wish to see an image of their "great leader" hurled across the battlefield at high velocity and splattered upon impact.

Is there a lesson in all this? Only that North Korea proves how cowardly and pathetic human beings can be in kow-towing to tyranny. Notice how North Korea has no Bill of Rights? No Free Speech rights? No Second Amendment? No protection of due process? Eliminating the rights of the people is the first step to enslaving them. No wonder the USA is currently following in the footsteps of North Korea by eliminating individual freedoms while ramping up the power and belligerence of Big Government.

Take a good, hard look at North Korea and its secret prisons, folks. It's all gonna look mighty familiar in the years ahead right here in the USA. Where did you think the "indefinite detention" NDAA bill was leading us to, anyway? ...Some sort of utopia?

Stop kidding yourself. Open your eyes and look around. What North Korea is today, the USA is headed toward at breakneck speed. Only a truly principled leader -- not some cultist false messiah -- can put us back on course to a future of economic abundance and individual liberty.

There is a person like that in our world today. He's not a god and he has no interest in being worshipped. His name is Ron Paul, and he's the total antithesis of Kim Jong Il.

If you want America to head in the opposite direction of North Korean, where we can restore our liberties, shrink the size of tyrannical government, and avoid the enslavement and "disappearing" of Americans into secret military prisons, there's only one person to even consider for the next U.S. President. www.RonPaul2012.com

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Swenet
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Anyone capable of analyzing human behavioral dynamics, who has seen the concerted weeping sessions Northern Koreans frequently engage(d) in, in front of statues/posters etc of Kim, knows there is nothing genuine about it.

A few years ago, the Taiwanese journalist Lisa Ling was allowed into N.Korea (which is higly unusual as foreign reporters and cameras are not welcome) with an Optometrist to perform Cataract surgery on hundreds of (near) blind poverty stricken N.Koreans for free. When the surgeries were performed, the patients were gathered into a large room to have the bandage removed from their eyes. To the surprise of Lisa Ling, all the patients, who just had recovered their vision, started to gather in front of a large poster in the room, to praise their ''great leader'', and thank him for what he had neglected to do all those years -- give them access to the medical care they needed.

Instead of thanking Lisa Ling and the Optometrist, they then proceeded to curse the enemies of their ''great leader'' (I distincly recall an old man volunteering to kill Americans). In fact, had I just tuned into that channel, I would have thought it was staged and some sort of parody.

If someone wants a good picture of how brainwashed/indoctrinated people act, I invite them to watch documentaries about N.Korea.

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Djehuti
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^ Yeah the best documentary available right now is 'Kimjongilia'. Another good trailer here.

To vwwvv, I agree with everything in your post EXCEPT the idiotically naivety when it comes to the threat of terrorism and destruction against the U.S. such is the case with Ron Paul. He would be highly electable if it weren't for his idiotic views on foreign policy.

Here is a review with the creator of 'Kimjongilia'.

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-Just Call Me Jari-
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quote:
Oh wow! You must be serious. The "Occupy" protestors here in U.S. as well as the malcontents in Europe like the U.K. and especially Greece as well as the Muslim immigrant upstarts in Spain have ALL gone beyond their rights of protest when they violate the rights of others through destruction of property and VIOLENCE!
You have GOT to be Kidding me. You are sadly misinformed and what is worse you seem to be driven by your devotion to Right Wing Rhetoric.

1) The Occupy Protesters have in the large NOT been violent, very few have resorted to destroying property.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MYQqiyR2THs


quote:
Or is YOUR dose of news and journalism only come from the left-side of the West??
What does this have to do with anything, where do you get your news from, Fox News??

quote:
All these groups have resorted to violence and vandalism,
You are being simply dishonest here. You are brushing the whole protests with a few isolated events.

You are dishonest.

quote:
yet no doubt you accuse the Tea Party of doing this.
I like how you try to uplift the tea party to a higher standard, biased much.

quote:
LOL Mind you Greek malcontents are angry that they have bankrupted their own country since 95% of the jobs are government jobs and ALL are unionized and now that they ran out of money they want other European nations via the EU to bail them out?
Are you serious, The UNIONS bankrupted f-ing Greece?? How deluded are you?? The European Banks, mainly the German Bank Bankrupted Greece.


quote:
Mind you the U.S. is in a similar situation albeit way down the road and not as bad. People like to blame the banks, and not the politicians who pressure them or influence them with things like hedge-funds. It's funny that Occupiers blame Wallstreet when their very movement was funded by George Soros who has made the most money off Wallstreet and has invested in Obama's campaign. It seems funny how they only blame Wallstreet and the Banks while Congress and the Whitehouse get away scot-free.
Your post is full of Right Wing Drivel. The Occupy Movement has not given Congress or the White House a Pass. Many Members of Congress and even Obama have been targeted by the Movement. Further How in Hell did George Soros "Fund" the Occupy movement when the Occupy Movement is Grass Routes and has no Monetary affiliation.

Amazing how you will protect and apologize for the Banks and excuse blatant Police Brutality againt Americans using their right to Free Speech. Yet in the same breath claim that the west if the beacon of Freedom.

Turn Fox News off kid, come back to the real world.

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-Just Call Me Jari-
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Explain what Ron Paul has said reguarding foreign Policy that is "Idiotic"..

Explain..

quote:
Originally posted by Djehuti:
To vwwvv, I agree with everything in your post EXCEPT the idiotically naivety when it comes to the threat of terrorism and destruction against the U.S. such is the case with Ron Paul. He would be highly electable if it weren't for his idiotic views on foreign policy.


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The Explorer
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quote:
Originally posted by Djehuti:

[Eek!] [Eek!] Are you serious??! Why would they fake tears?! You realize that in North Korea if anyone is suspected of not adoring the "Dear Leader", they are immediately arrested and sent to a concentration camp for treason!

No, I didn't realize that ordinary North Koreans could immediately be arrested and sent to concentration camp for treason, if they were not seen crying for the deceased leader. What evidence of this do you have?

quote:
You do realize that thousands of people have been sent to concentration camps or executed for disobeying the rules of the "Dear Leader" like tuning in to other radio stations outside the official regime station or watching TV shows from outside North Korea. Now I'm really disturbed.
You must really be disturbed, if you prematurely conclude what you think I know or don't know, without confirming it first.

quote:

Takruri, do you even know anything about North Korea and its regime??

The moniker is "The Explorer", not "Takruri". Yeah, I know something about North Korea and its regime. How about you?

quote:
And I'm not just talking about what the Western Press says but what South Korea, Japan, and even North Korea's ally China says let alone what people who have escaped that hellhole have described themselves?!
I'm not sure what relevance this has to anything I've said herein. Care to identify?

quote:
Oh wow! You must be serious. The "Occupy" protestors here in U.S. as well as the malcontents in Europe like the U.K. and especially Greece as well as the Muslim immigrant upstarts in Spain have ALL gone beyond their rights of protest when they violate the rights of others through destruction of property and VIOLENCE!
You sound like a member of the corporate business media. Yes, I'm serious, but I doubt you are. What "destruction of property and violence" did say, Occupy protesters perpetrate; what "destruction of property and violence" did say, Greek protesters undertake.

What you call "malcontents" are workers, finally expressing their outrage at years of exploitation and oppression, and actually doing something about it, rather than sitting on their couches or typing on the internet all day, complaining about things.

The riots in England and France did not occur in a vacuum. They occurred after police-state brutality and violations of human rights. Next, are you going to convince folks that the Egyptian protestors, Tunisian, or even Syrian protesters have "gone beyond their rights of protest" and that they have "violated the rights of others through destruction of property and VIOLENCE"?

quote:
Or is YOUR dose of news and journalism only come from the left-side of the West??
No, my dose of news and journalism comes from objective reality, not that sewer called 'western' corporate business propaganda that passes itself as news. Where do you get your dose of news; from the Tea Party?

quote:
All these groups have resorted to violence and vandalism, yet no doubt you accuse the Tea Party of doing this.
Where! You must be undergoing your hallucinations again, like when you accused me of "skepticism of the 'West' with regards to North Korea is disturbing", without bothering to read what I actually wrote...not that I'm not skeptic of the 'western' propaganda machine, like any sane mind would.

quote:
LOL Mind you Greek malcontents are angry that they have bankrupted their own country since 95% of the jobs are government jobs and ALL are unionized and now that they ran out of money they want other European nations via the EU to bail them out? Mind you the U.S. is in a similar situation albeit way down the road and not as bad.
Yeah, workers need to take the wrap for the deteriorating economic situations afflicting the capitalist-driven markets across the world, for wanting to hang onto social safety nets that they have depended on for years and had fought for and won. Is it a coincidence that Greece is experiencing this, after Iceland, and now other European markets are heading towards, on the heels of the economic crisis that began to visibly surface in 2008?

Tell me; if the workers' dependence on social safety nets are the reason for the bankruptcy, why did this not happen sooner?

quote:
People like to blame the banks, and not the politicians who pressure them or influence them with things like hedge-funds.
You are out of touch with reality. People blame the entire system, from banks to the politicians.

quote:
It's funny that Occupiers blame Wallstreet when their very movement was funded by George Soros who has made the most money off Wallstreet and has invested in Obama's campaign.
How does George Soros fund the leaderless Occupy Wall Street, which by and large, does not support either the Democratic party or the Republican party?

What is Geogre Soros supplying the occupiers; tents, food, bail money, security against the police...? Please specify, with concrete documentation.

quote:

It seems funny how they only blame Wallstreet and the Banks while Congress and the Whitehouse get away scot-free.

You need to get off your keyboard and getting news feeds from certain internet and corporate media sources, and instead, actually socialize with the occupy general assembly participants, because you really do come off as being out of touch with reality. "Whitehouse get away scot-free" my ass! That sounds like something Fox's Bill O'Reilly would say...pulled right out of his ass, because interestingly enough, he also admits that he never socialized with the occupiers to get firsthand knowledge of their viewpoints.

quote:

quote:
Is the "west" any freer than say, its south American counterparts like Brazil, southeast Asian counterparts like say, Japan or South Korea, south Asian counterparts like say, India, African counterparts like say Senegal and the so-called "new" South Africa?
Of course those regions are free because of Western style free-market and constitutional rights.
Free in what way? Have you not listened to a word of what I just informed you about human rights issues in the so-called "free market and constitutional rights western" countries? What about brutally suppressing protesters and promoting homicidal xenophobia do you find so liberating, Djehuti?
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Oshun
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Ironically? Team America had been trending yesterday.
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Whatbox
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quote:
Originally posted by Grumman:
I guess his adversaries won't have to look at his pompadour hairstyle anymore. [Wink]

Lol.

quote:
Originally posted by The Explorer:
Interesting bit in the article, is word that people in the streets were in tears upon news of Kim's death. Could it be possible that he was not as repressive as his 'western' enemies made him out to be, or is this just misinformation?

[Big Grin] Or had he, before he died, told them to cry when he left? [Frown] [Confused]
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Djehuti
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quote:
Originally posted by -Just Call Me Jari-:

You have GOT to be Kidding me. You are sadly misinformed and what is worse you seem to be driven by your devotion to Right Wing Rhetoric.

1) The Occupy Protesters have in the large NOT been violent, very few have resorted to destroying property.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MYQqiyR2THs

YOU have got to be kidding! LOL You are sadly confused and mistaken if you think that somehow I'm the one driven by some political rhetoric. I am not a "right-winger" or any winger for that matter but someone who sticks to truth, but I can see that you seem to be blinded by left-wing rhetoric. I should have corrected myself earlier since in regards to the so-called 'Occupy' movement, I don't mean to generalize and paint the whole group as violent. But face the facts, there ARE violent elements among you.

And not surprisingly just as I get from my left-wing friends you bring up that strawman video of that a$$hole cop pepper-spraying those people in the faces. Yet nowhere do post videos of Occupiers attacking the police that are trying to keep order like these:

http://youtu.be/X6zsR6MQSMI

http://youtu.be/azMFdKOlo5Q

Unfortunately such examples above are much more common than your basic police brutality from a-hole cops. I have met and talked to many protestors and they even tell me themselves they try to instigate the police to achieve media martyrdom. What's more is the poor hygiene of many which leads to the outbreak of disease such as tuberculosis here in O-Atlanta or ringworm in O-Santa Cruz, or lice in O-Portland and STDs everywhere else. The only thing I agree with in terms of the Occupy movement is the corruption in Banks and Wall Street; however they leave the government out which is the largest and most crucial part of that corruption. It was the government who allowed such corruption to happen in the first place and folks like Obama gained most of their money from Wall Street. Also, the biggest investor and funder of the Occupy movement is George Soros who also made a lot of money off Wall Street.

This is the reason why the whole Occupy movement is not as legitimate as say the Tea Party let alone the Civil Rights Movement. It is an exploitation of the ignorant or at least those who are partially enlightened or aware what's going on. Further the movement has been further corrupted by anarchist who don't give a damn about anything but want chaos.

quote:
What does this have to do with anything, where do you get your news from, Fox News??
LOL Where do YOU get your news from, CNN or MSNBC?? For your info, I get my news mainly from the internet and radio. What little news I get from TV I get from PBS and BBC and not from the 'major' news networks that are controlled by one wing or another. If it happens to be a serious news event, then I might just tune in to both CNN and Fox to get a gist of what both sides say but other than that, NO.
quote:
You are being simply dishonest here. You are brushing the whole protests with a few isolated events.
In terms of the movements in Europe, and not the Occupy movement in America, no I'm not. The protests have quickly degenerated into riots in Europe and in the case of Greece have been riots all along!

quote:
You are dishonest.
How so?? Please prove me wring, since I like to think of myself as the most, if not one of the most honest person in this whole forum!

quote:
]I like how you try to uplift the tea party to a higher standard, biased much.
Last time I checked, they never got into any trouble with the police because they obey the laws. They don't trash the place, and they leave when their license expires. And last time I checked no disease have broken out among them nor were there any sexual assaults or deaths. Is this not a higher standard to you?? I don't know where the bias is in this??

quote:
Are you serious, The UNIONS bankrupted f-ing Greece?? How deluded are you?? The European Banks, mainly the German Bank Bankrupted Greece.
Let me get this straight. Over 90% of the jobs in Greece are all government jobs which feed off tax money. There are very few jobs that actually make money through profit. Add to that ALL of them are unionized and thus employees get deals with more benefits again from tax money, while the rich of that country hide their money, and you blame the problem on foreign banks like Germany???

Can you explain to me how Germany or its banks are at fault??

quote:
Your post is full of Right Wing Drivel. The Occupy Movement has not given Congress or the White House a Pass. Many Members of Congress and even Obama have been targeted by the Movement. Further How in Hell did George Soros "Fund" the Occupy movement when the Occupy Movement is Grass Routes and has no Monetary affiliation.
Yet, most Occupiers I talk to have said nothing about the Congress or the Presidency, only Wall Street and the banks. Of course there is the National Treasury but not the ones who control them. Of course the Occupy movement is grass roots but some of their money is not as seen from the Tides Center community funding.

quote:
Amazing how you will protect and apologize for the Banks and excuse blatant Police Brutality against Americans using their right to Free Speech. Yet in the same breath claim that the west if the beacon of Freedom.
Since when have I apologized or defended the banks let alone brutality of any kind??!! Perhaps you need to call me out on things I actually said instead of things you imagined me to say. You are beginning to sound trollish.

quote:
Turn Fox News off kid, come back to the real world.
Again, I don't watch it! How about you cut off CNN, MSNBC, ABC, or whatever your leftists providers is and look up the facts instead of attacking ME as some right-wing republican bush-bot out of blind emotionalism!! [Embarrassed]
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Djehuti
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quote:
Originally posted by -Just Call Me Jari-:

Explain what Ron Paul has said regarding foreign Policy that is "Idiotic"..

Explain..

Paul believes that if America becomes isolationist and stay out of foreign affairs the U.S. will be safer. The problem is we have too many enemies not including the Islamists so staying out is no longer an option. He claims Iran poses no threat to Israel or the U.S. even though they have nukes and that Russia is our friend even though the have set up bases in U.S. allied European fronts. You should get the drift. Other than that his domestic policies including lifting the ban on illegal drugs especially marijuana is very sound.
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-Just Call Me Jari-
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quote:
Paul believes that if America becomes isolationist and stay out of foreign affairs the U.S. will be safer.
How is he wrong??


quote:
The problem is we have too many enemies not including the Islamists so staying out is no longer an option.
How did we get these "Enemies" in the first place?? Do you have any information that disproves what Paul as said reguarding this, last time I checked he is 100% factual about why we have Enemies and "Islamists"..

quote:
He claims Iran poses no threat to Israel or the U.S. even though they have nukes
First off, Why should Israel have Nukes and Not Iran?? Explain..

Second, why should the U.S Support Israel, esp considering that a 2 state solution is inevitable....despite Right Wing Jewish Zionest attempts to delay the process. Paul is 100% fair and fairness seems to be the biggest scare for Israel other than the inevitablity of a 2 state solution.


quote:
You should get the drift.
Actually I don't. Examples??

quote:
Other than that his domestic policies including lifting the ban on illegal drugs especially marijuana is very sound.
I don't agree with majority of his domestic policies, esp. his idea to privatize everything, his views toward Drug Legalization is very sound..shocked someone of your calibur would support something as Liberal as Legalization of Pot/Drugs.
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vwwvv
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Kim Jong II dead: Heir Kim Jong Un's Swiss school days revealed

He is the heir poised to become the next leader of rogue state North Korea.

But a probe into the school days of Kim Jong Un - youngest son of dictator Kim Jong Il - proves he is little more than an academic failure who squandered his education playing computer games and basketball.

The baby-faced 28-year-old first stepped out of his father's shadow in September last year to appear in public in the capital Pyongyang as thousands of goose-stepping troops marched by to mark the 65th anniversary of the ruling Workers Party.

 -
School days: Kim Jong Un (circled) is pictured with friends during his time at school in Switzerland

 -
Father and son: A rare image of Kim Jong Il and his third son Kim Jong Un during his youth

 -  -
Obsessed: Kim Jong Un (pictured as a child left) was a huge fan of basketball star Michael Jordan (right)

'He left without getting any exam results at all. He was much more interested in football and basketball than lessons.'

A big fan of star Michael Jordan, Kim Jong Un - who was once caught with a bondage pornographic magazine in his school bag - proved to be a good player on the basketball court.. [...]

more

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Whatbox
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quote:
Originally posted by Whatbox:
quote:
Originally posted by Grumman:
I guess his adversaries won't have to look at his pompadour hairstyle anymore. [Wink]

Lol.

quote:
Originally posted by The Explorer:
Interesting bit in the article, is word that people in the streets were in tears upon news of Kim's death. Could it be possible that he was not as repressive as his 'western' enemies made him out to be, or is this just misinformation?

[Big Grin] Or had he, before he died, told them to cry when he left? [Frown] [Confused]

Jokes aside, actually tho I too wondered that when I first came across the "people in tears" part of your post. It then took about a split second though for my mind to come up with the joke I then made, immediately above (guess Grummam's post put me in the mood to joke).

But yeah though what I wondered too for a second was how it really is, and could it possibly be as bad as what we hear.

He certainly was as Brada says a dick / a bit neurotic judging by some of the stuff I've heard said of him.

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Grumman
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 -


Don't look like he's missed too many meals considering his people are supposed to be hungry all the time.

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Grumman
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 -


....same for this kid. The man next to him probably was forced to go the diet route because it don't look good for the cameras.

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vwwvv
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'The people are crying tears of blood': Millions of wailing North Koreans line snow bound streets in display of state-controlled grief for Kim Jong Il's funeral

Kim Jong Un walks beside father's hearse as he prepares to take power
Stage-managed funeral 'a message that family is still in control'

28th December 2011
North Korea carried out a meticulously choreographed funeral for its late leader Kim Jong Il today and affirmed that the country was now in the 'warm care' of his son.

Kim's youngest son and successor, Kim Jong Un, walked slowly next to his father's hearse as mourners lining the procession route in Pyongyang wailed in ostentatious displays of grief.

Live footage from the North Korean capital is rarely seen outside of the insular communist dictatorship.

 -
Passing the torch: North Korea's next leader, Kim Jong Un, front left, salutes beside the hearse carrying the body of his late father and North Korean leader Kim Jong Il during the funeral procession in Pyongyang, North Korea

The tightly stage-managed funeral seemed to be a message from the country's ruling family that they remain in tight control despite the death of their figurehead.

Dressed in a dark overcoat, the younger Kim - the focus of the proceedings - bowed his head slightly against the snow, and raised his right arm in salute to the late 'dear leader'.

Tens of thousands of mourners stood in freezing temperatures, wailing and holding onto each other for support as the parade passed by.

As the snow fell from a grey sky soldiers stood in lines with their heads bowed, many with tears streaming down their faces.

 -
Regimented mourning: The funeral procession makes its way past ranks of spectators in a highly-rehearsed and orchestrated ceremony

 -
Farewell: Weeping North Koreans lined the streets of Pyongyang to bid goodbye to long time leader Kim Jong Il

 -
Mobbed: Mourners crowded around the hearse carrying North Korean leader Kim Jong Il through the streets of the capital

'How can the sky not cry?' a weeping soldier standing in the snow said to state TV. 'The people ... are all crying tears of blood.'

Some of the pictures purporting to show grieving North Koreans at the funeral were actually released by the country's state media yesterday, to ensure they would be available for news agencies to illustrate their coverage of the funeral.

 -
No expense spared: The funeral procession of the late 'dear leader' Kim Jong Il in Pyongyang, North Korea today as his son and successor Kim Jong Un accompanies the coffin

 -
Tribute: A giant portrait of late North Korean leader Kim Jong Il was carried past mourners on the procession route

Like his father's in 1994, Kim Jong Il's coffin was wrapped in a red flag. A limousine carrying a huge portrait of a smiling Kim led the procession, and soldiers followed the hearse and lined the streets. The footage was accompanied by rousing military music.

The procession passed by a billboard with a slogan praising the 'revolutionary ideas of Comrade Kim Il Sung,' Kim's father and the country's revered founder. North Korean state media said the memorial route was about 25 miles (40km) long, though top officials did not walk the entire route.

 -
Military salute: North Korean soldiers fired guns in honour of their late leader Kim Jong Il in Pyongyang

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vwwvv
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 -
High emotion: There have been enormous displays of public grief among North Koreans since the death of the dictator. The funeral service marked another emotional high point

 -  -
Salute: North Korean soldiers (left) stand to attention as a portrait of Kim Jong Il drives past (left) as Kim Jong Un pays tribute to his father (right)

Walking behind was Kim Jong Un was Jang Song Thaek, Kim Jong Il's brother-in-law and a vice chairman of the powerful National Defense Commission. Mr Jang is expected to play a crucial role in helping the young and inexperienced Kim Jong Un take and hold power.

Also escorting the limousine were military chief Ri Yong Ho and People's Armed Forces Minster Kim Yong Chun. Their presence indicates they will be important players as the younger Kim consolidates his leadership.

 -
Wailing: North Koreans fell to the ground in 'desperation' as the procession drove by

 -  -  -
Out of control: North Korean soldiers found it hard to contain their grief during the funeral procession

 -
Suffer little children: Girls in North Korea wail in this picture released by state media yesterday as they mourn the 'dear leader' who ruled the country for 14 years with an iron grip

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 -  -
Sobbing: The world has seldom seen such an outpouring of 'grief' after the loss of a leader

 -
Braving: Not even snow and sub-zero temperatures could prevent North Koreans from lining the streets of their capital to pay their respects

 -  -  -
Tears: Women and men were joined in their 'grief' of Kim Jong Il's death

 -
Tears: Soldiers cry as a procession carrying late North Korean leader Kim Jong Il passes through the streets of Pyongyang

 -
Mass mourning: North Korean military personnel stand in lines during a funeral for late leader Kim Jong Il, in snowy Pyongyang, North Korea

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 -  -
Gaggle: The snow continued to fall as North Koreans paid tribute to Kim Jong Il

Top Workers' Party officials Choe Thae Bok and Kim Ki Nam and senior military officer Kim Jong Gak also were prominent positions, according to Seoul's Unification Ministry.

'It shows they will be core powers in North Korea,' said Yoo Ho-yeol, a professor at Korea University in South Korea. 'Particularly, Jang Song Thaek and Ri Yong Ho will be key to Kim Jong Un's leadership.'

The military presence at the funeral Wednesday also suggests Kim will uphold his father's trademark military-first policy, Mr Yoo said.

Tribute: Top military and civilian officials walk beside the car carrying the coffin of Kim Jong Il

After the funeral, the young Kim is expected to cement his power by formally assuming command of the 1.2million-strong military, becoming general secretary of the Workers' Party and chairman of the party's Central Military Commission, Mr Yoo said.

Kim Jong Il died of a heart attack on December 17 at the age of 69 after ruling the country for 17 years in a brutal and repressive dictatorship. For 11 days since Kim's death was announced, hundreds of thousands of North Koreans have paid their respects to him round the clock.

In freezing temperatures they have visited portraits of the late leader to bow and lay flowers in a theatrical show of grief, similar to the one for his father in 1994. Kim's body had been laid in state in a glass coffin to which his son paid five visits. Kim Jong Un has rapidly gained prominence following his father's death.

 -
Tears for a tyrant: Kim Jong Un sheds a tear for his father as he lay in state in the in the inner sanctum of the Kumsusan Memorial Palace yesterday

 -  -
Paying respects: Kim Jong Un's face is contorted with grief as he looks on at his late father. Right, former South Korean first lady Lee Hee-ho (left) shakes hands with Kim Jong-un after paying her respects

Even as North Koreans mourned the loss of the second leader the nation has known, the transition of power to the younger Kim was already under way. The young man, who is in late 20s, is already being hailed by state media as the 'supreme leader' of the party, state and army.

State media declared the country in the 'warm care' of his young son as it extended the Kim family's hold on power to a third generation. Over the past week, state media has bestowed him with new titles, including 'great successor,' 'supreme leader' and 'sagacious leader.'

He is believed to have led a private ceremony earlier Wednesday in the inner sanctum of the Kumsusan Memorial Palace with top military and party officials.

A public memorial service will take place at midday tomorrow and include an artillery salute, three minutes of silence and locomotives and vessels blowing their sirens, North Korea's Central News Agency said.

Heavy snow was falling in Pyongyang, which state media characterized in the early days of mourning as proof that the skies were 'grieving' for Kim Jong Il as well.

According to reports, the heavy snowfall overnight forced authorities to delay the funeral for several hours, as Pyongyang citizens were mobilised to clear the route of the cortege.

Footage on state TV showed images of swirling snow, the log cabin in far northern Mount Paektu where Kim is said to have been born, and the mountain named after him, where his name is carved into the rocky face in red.

Earlier, state television also replayed images of missiles being fired and the April 2009 long-range rocket launch that earned North Korea strengthened U.N. sanctions.

The U.S., South Korea and other nations called it a test for a missile designed to strike the United States; North Korea said the rocket sent a communications satellite into space.

The funeral for Kim Jong Il's father, Kim Il Sung, was expected to serve as a template for how Kim Jong Il will be mourned.

In 1994, the funeral began with a private ceremony attended by Kim Jong Il and top officials before a long procession through Pyongyang to Kim Il Sung Square, the main plaza in the capital, where hundreds of thousands of mourners were waiting.

North Koreans lined the streets and filled the air with theatrical wails, many of the women in traditional black dresses and with white mourning ribbons affixed to their hair.

At the time, details about the funeral in a country largely isolated from the West were shrouded in mystery, revealed only after state TV aired segments of the events.

Most foreigners aside from those living in North Korea were shut out, and the same is expected this week. Footage filmed in Pyongyang yesterday showed long lines of people carrying wreaths and bunches of white flowers toward a building with a huge picture of a smiling Kim Jong Il on its facade.

They piled flowers beneath the photo, bowing and crying as they stood in the cold. Some pledged their loyalty to Kim Jong Un. Light traffic flowed through Pyongyang's streets while people drank hot tea at makeshift tents set up at the sides of the roads.

In the Chinese border city of Dandong, across the Yalu River from North Korea, dozens of people crowded into North Korea's consular offices in a high-rise building and into a North Korean restaurant across the street to watch the funeral on television.

Many were dressed in black and among them were North Koreans, identifiable by the Kim Il Sung badges on their lapels. Police shooed reporters away from both venues, keeping them behind cordons.

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