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Son of Ra
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Note: No trolling...You'll just be ignored.

Anyways I already asked this on the Facebook groups, but nobody could answer.

Mali Empire/Timbuktu inventions? In Mali empire people were studying MANY things and the population was quite wealthy and educated, actually it was the wealthiest empire during its time. But what inventions came from this empire is what I want to know, since it was so advanced for its time.

Anyone?

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Brada-Anansi
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Inventions that's a toughie all the manuscripts have not been cataloged much less translated as of yet and there are thousands of them so we just don't know i hope the rebels didn't do too much damage when they invaded.

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Bilal Dogon
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Yeah I haven’t been able to find anything on this either, but it’s something that interests me too. With Timbuktu and other cities producing scholars known all over Africa and the Islamic world, it’s odd that there’s no record of inventions.

The Malian and other Muslim African scholars seemed to be brilliant as theologians and philosophers, but while they knew a lot in areas like science, mathematics, astronomy, etc... it’s not really known how far they advanced the already established concepts to make new technical breakthroughs.

I’m sure there were inventions, but even with literacy, there’s a lot of history that African states did not record. Unfortunately.

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The Great One
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^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ [Roll Eyes]

--------------------
Chairman Mau

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the lioness,
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some of the early inventions are the wheel and plow. No one knows who invented them

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zarahan aka Enrique Cardova
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Very few empires can claim to have "invented" anything.
The Roman or Greek empires did not invent plant and
animal domestication, nor mining, engineering, gearing,
metallurgy, or writing. All these things were already
in place, BEFORE said empires arose in significant form.
All of the above arose outside Rome and Greece too.
Writing for example was first pioneered in Africa-
the Nile Valley.

------------------------------------------------------------------

Recap from earlier thread - MALI more prosperous than
numerous nations of Europe in its heyday, including England:

Mali in the same 1200-1300 time period most likely
exceed numerous kingdoms in contemporary Europe
in terms of wealth, extent of territorial dominion,
and size of its armed forces. And this is before the
Black Death was to begin to ravage Europe. For example,
by the beginning of the 14th century,
Mali was the source of almost half the Old
World's gold exported from mines in Bambuk, Boure and Galam.
(--Stride, G.T & C. Ifeka. Peoples and Empires of
West Africa: West Africa in History 1000-1800".
Nelson, 1971)

Other historians point to the impact of Malian gold
in economic development of the Mediterranean:

The most important foundation of Malian power,
however, was control of gold, and it is as a man
of gold that Mansa Musa is still remembered. His story
is quite important to world economic history, since
the supply of gold he commanded played a crucial role
in the economic growth of the Mediterranean."
--Merry E. Wiesner 2002. Discovering the Global Past

and

"It should be remembered here that
during the fourteenth and fifteenth
centuries there was an acute shortage of
precious metals in Europe and in the
Muslim lands and that the only really
important source of gold was in the
western Sudan and its hinterland."
--M. Ma³owist (1966). The Social and
Economic Stability of the Western
Sudan in the Middle Ages. Source: Past
and Present, No. 33, (Apr., 1966), pp.
3-15. Published by: Oxford University
Press

"From an examination of Omari's writings, which
come from the same period and are based on Sudanese
accounts, it may be concluded that particularly a
agriculture and fruit-gathering, and also, in certain
parts of the country, hunting and the rearing of l
livestock, assured the Mali peasants of a relatively
prosperous and independent life, satisfying their
needs without much contact with the outside world."

Arab travelers from the fourteenth to the sixteenth centuries
all tell us that Mali towns Timbuktu, Gao and lesser places -
were in general well supplied with victuals, and there is no
doubt that the towns obtained some of their provisions by trade
with the peasantry. The rural areas had a surplus of agricultural
and animal products which was dispatched for sale in the towns.
Ibn Batoutah and other sources indicate that the western Sudan
even exported a certain amount of millet and rice to the Sahel r
regions, not only to Walata but also farther towards the districts
where rock-salt and copper were exploited for import into the Sudan.

"Jaime Cortesao has drawn historians'
attention to Portuguese sources of the
early fifteenth century, according to
which Portuguese gold currency was at
that time based on importing from
Morocco gold which must have come
from the Sudan. The same author is of
the opinion that it was above all in
Sudanese gold that Morocco paid the
import costs for European and Levantine
goods brought by the Genoese and the
Venetiansl2 a suggestion confirmed by
several Italian documents. It should be
added that Sudanese trade was not the
only way in which Sudanese gold in
large quantities reached Egypt and the
Near East. Sudanese pilgrims, who each
year visited Egypt and the holy places of
Islam in Arabia, brought with them very
considerable quantities of gold to spend
on the journey and on arrival in Cairo,
Mecca and Medina."

----M. Ma³owist (1966). The Social and
Economic Stability of the Western
Sudan in the Middle Ages. Source: Past
and Present, No. 33, (Apr., 1966), pp.
3-15. Published by: Oxford University
Press.

"The rising European demand for gold, added to
the perennial market in the Islamic states, stimulated
more gold production in the Sudan, to the enormous
fiscal advantage of Mali. In the latest medieval
period overall, West Africa may have been producing
almost two-thirds of the world's gold supply."
-- Ross E. Dunn. 1987. The adventures of Ibn Battuta,
a Muslim traveler of the fourteenth century

----------------------------------------------

compare to Britain in the same general era:
-------------------

".. there was no English commercial revolution, no development of banks and credit facilities that can be claimed for thirteenth-century Italy. One consequence of this relative backwardness was that in the thirteenth century, an increasing proportion of England's foreign trade came to be in Italian hands.. In a very real sense late thirteenth-century England was being treated as a partially developed economy. Much of its import-export business was handled by foreigners (Gascons and Flemings as well as Italians. Its main exports were aw materials - wool and grain- rather than manufactured goods, There had been, in other words, no industrial revolution."

.. Moreover, despite the claims sometimes made for the cloth-fulling mill, there were no significant advances in industrial technology. Nor was there anything to compare with the highly capitalized development of the Flemish cloth industry in the twelfth and thirteenth centuries."

"..Above all, there was no agricultural revolution.. the technical limitations under which they worked meant no significant increase in yields was possible, neither from sheep in terms of weight of fleece, nor from seed in terms of yield of grain. Though the use of the horse as a draught animal was spreading, this was of marginal importance. ."

".. Thus in many respect England remained a stagnant economy. It can indeed be argued that by comparison with some of its neighbors, especially Flanders and Italy, England was less advanced in the thirteenth century than it had been in the eleventh.. In twelfth and thirteenth-century England, people felt they lived in a country which was economically advanced by comparison with the lands of their Celtic neighbours."

--John Gillingham, Ralph Alan Griffiths. 2002. Medieval Britain: a very short introduction.

--------------------------------------------------------------------

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zarahan aka Enrique Cardova
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posted

With Timbuktu and other cities producing scholars known all over Africa and the Islamic world, it’s odd that there’s no record of inventions.

There is nothing odd about it. Few cities can be said
to have "invented" anything. The great city of Rome
did not invent invent plant and animal domestication,
nor mining, engineering, gearing, metallurgy, or writing.
Athens did not invent them either, nor ancient London.
Such things were already in place before these cities
arose, and they derived from sources OUTSIDE of them.

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Son of Ra
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@Brada-Anansi

Yeah, I know which is sad.

@blingdogg

Agreed.

@zarahan- aka Enrique Cardova

Awesome post! Thanks for posting. But it really doesn't state a Mali invention though.

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Bilal Dogon
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posted

quote:
Originally posted by zarahan- aka Enrique Cardova:
With Timbuktu and other cities producing scholars known all over Africa and the Islamic world, it’s odd that there’s no record of inventions.

There is nothing odd about it. Few cities can be said
to have "invented" anything. The great city of Rome
did not invent invent plant and animal domestication,
nor mining, engineering, gearing, metallurgy, or writing.
Athens did not invent them either, nor ancient London.
Such things were already in place before these cities
arose, and they derived from sources OUTSIDE of them.

Very true when you look at it that way.

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The Great One
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posted

--------------------
Chairman Mau

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the lioness,
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posted

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_historic_inventions

Timeline of historic inventions

Prehistoric

Further information: Outline of prehistoric technology
Note that the dates in the Paleolithic era are approximate and refer to the earliest discovered use of an invention, and may change as new research is created and older sites are found.

1.8 million years ago: Fire and then cooking [2]
500 thousand years ago (ka): Shelter construction[3]
400 ka: Pigments in Zambia[4]
400 ka: Spears in Germany[5]
200 ka: Glue in Italy[6]
160–40 ka: Burial[7]
110 ka: Beads in Israel[8]
77 ka: Bedding in South Africa[9]
64 ka: Arrowhead in South Africa[10]
61 ka: Sewing needle in South Africa[10]
60 ka: Bow[11]
36 ka: Cloth woven from flax fiber in Georgia[12][13]
35 ka: Flute in Germany[14]
28 ka: twisted rope[15]
16 ka: Pottery in China[16]
6000 BC: Kiln in Mesopotamia[17]
5000 - 4500 BC: Lacquer in China[18]
5000 - 4500 BC: Rowing oars in China.[19][20]
3630 BC: Sericulture in China [21]
3500 BC: the Wheel[22]
3000 BC: Cuneiform in Mesopotamia[23]
3000 BC: Bronze in Mesopotamia[24]
3000 BC: Papyrus in Egypt[25][26]

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mena7
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posted

The problem with Western list of invention is it is very Eurocentric. Africa is disowned of her inventions and European and Asian are credited with African inventions. Example African invented spears, glue, beads, flute, pottery, writing, two masted ships(forsail), crane but the European writers claimed Europeans and Asians did those inventions.

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PreColonialAfrica13
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I put the great one on ignore but his posts are still showing. This is really annoying, how have the moderators not banned him?

edit: Wow, you can only block private messages if you ignore someone? That is stupid, most forums let you ignore posts outright.

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the lioness,
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posted

quote:
Originally posted by PreColonialAfrica13:
I put the great one on ignore but his posts are still showing. This is really annoying, how have the moderators not banned him?

edit: Wow, you can only block private messages if you ignore someone? That is stupid, most forums let you ignore posts outright.

Egyptsearch forums is nearly unmoderated. ausar the only moderator comes around once in a whole but might disappear for weeks. He has no power to delete a thread or ban somebody. He only has the power to delete posts and will only do so sometimes if he is around at the time and receives pm complaints. The owners supposedly dont respond even to messages form ausar. Thats the way it is you cant change it

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PreColonialAfrica13
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Well someone needs to change it. How do you people put up with this waste of oxygen?

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Bilal Dogon
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posted

Why don't we all just go over to EgyptSearchReloaded?

It'll be better than staying here with moderators who are never here, and don't have any real power.

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the lioness,
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posted

quote:
Originally posted by Bilal Dogon -aka blingdogg:
[QB] Why don't we all just go over to EgyptSearchReloaded?

when everybody agrees on everything except minor details it becomes boring and people fall asleep

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Bilal Dogon
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posted

quote:
Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:
Originally posted by Bilal Dogon -aka blingdogg:
[QB] Why don't we all just go over to EgyptSearchReloaded?

when everybody agrees on everything except minor details it becomes boring and people fall asleep

True, but if we, the same people here, just post on that forum instead, it should just be a continuation of what we started on ES. We can post the same things, same debates etc. EDIT: We don't all have to agree.

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Tukuler
multidisciplinary Black Scholar
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posted

Disagreeing with facts is not the
antidote to boredom it is idiotic.

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the lioness,
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posted

quote:
Originally posted by Tukuler:
Disagreeing with facts is not the
antidote to boredom it is idiotic.

assuming you have a beline to God

-also Mike has more entertainment value than badumtish, what does that tell you?

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Son of Ra
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Bump.

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