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Author Topic: The Truth About Dr. Clyde Winters
R.Havoc
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Clyde Winters
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The colorful pseudoscience


[edit] Background
[edit] Education

His listed[2][3] academic credentials include:

1973 - B.A., Sociology/History (University of Illinois)
1973 - M.A., Social Science (University of Illinois)
1994 - M.S., Education (Chicago State University)
2000 - Ph.D., Educational Psychology (Loyola University)

None have anything to do with genetics or deciphering ancient scripts which he claims to be an expert in.

[edit] Uthman dan Fodio Institute

Winters says he is "Professor of Education, Anthropology and Linguistics, Uthman dan Fodio Institute (UdFI)", as well as a "Faculty Member, Archaeogenetics", an "Associate Professor" and "Director" at the same institute.[4] The problem is this institution with an archaeogenetics department does not exist. Records show the UdFI is a private home school in Chicago, which only has a history of enrolling and teaching African-American students of the 8th grade (13 - 14 year olds).[5] UdFI's staff or faculty members all seem to be one person: Clyde Winters. The private school also appears to be his own house.

Stephen Howe, Professor of History and Cultures of Colonialism, University of Bristol has noted:
The tendency to claim or imply grand-sounding academic careers and affiliations seems to be quite widespread among Afrocentrists.

He refers to Clyde Winters as an example.[6]
[edit] Race discrimination case

Winters filed a race discrimination action against Iowa State University in 1991. He was employed as Director of the Black Cultural Center at Iowa State University from August 1974 to May 1975.

The case was dismissed.[7]
[edit] Afrocentric historical revisionism
[edit] Ancient civilizations as black

Like Egmond Codfried, Winters spends his time online trolling forums and blogs, posting his crazy historical revisionism: all ancient peoples and civilizations were black people from Africa (including the Sumerians, Celts, Vikings, Romans, Greeks, Samurai, Olmec, and so on...) and that white people and light skinned Northeast Asians are recent albinos or "mutants" from caves with no ancient history:

The Ancient Celts and Vikings were Black People
The Sumerians were Black
The Black Greeks
The Blacks of China's First Civilization: The Xia
Ancient African Kings of India

When confronted and asked to provide evidence for these nonsensical claims, it is noticeable that Winters alters his position from asserting all or most of these peoples being "black" to arguing there were just a small number of Sub-Saharan African migrants in these civilizations through trade contact etc (which no one denies). So it not as if Winters holds a consistent position, and even admits to trolling.

[edit] Medieval European kings as black
An early 17th century portrait of James I of England (VI of Scotland), with pale skin and a blonde beard, somehow "Black" according to Winters.

Winters has resorted to further trolling on the Egyptsearch forum and has posted King James I of England was "Black".
[edit] Decipherments

Winters claims to have deciphered:

Indus (Harappan) script
Meroitic language
Sumerian
Olmec script

According to Jason Colavito: "Winters then claims that not only Sumerian but the Olmec and Indus Valley scripts can be understood with reference to something called the Vai writing system, which he takes to use identical syllable-sound pairings to these other tongues [...] This is because, he claims, Black Africans were the inhabitants of Atlantis, which was in modern Libya, and spread its culture and people around the world, bequeathing Black civilization to all the other continents. This is why he feels all the ancient world languages are merely versions of Black Atlantean language."[8]

Bernard Ortiz de Montellano, Emeritus Professor of Anthropology, Wayne State University has debated Winters online the Afrocentric forum Egyptsearch regarding the ancient Mesoamerican languages. He points out that: "The person in this forum who is the biggest liar, misquoter, and provider of false or missing references is YOU- Clyde".[9] Winters is known to distort data and misquote sources; when he is shown to be a liar he spams the forum so no one can read what was posted.[10]

Winters has said that the Fuente Magna Bowl, a stone bowl that surfaced in the 1950s from South America is a genuine "proto-Sumerian" text. However, archaeologist Carl Feagans noted that the bowl is dismissed as a hoax by scholars and described Winters as "a pseudo-historian".[11]
[edit] Publications
[edit] Books

Winters publishes, and sells his books on Amazon Kindle, or self-prints copies from Uthman dan Fodio Institute his home:

African Empires in Ancient America (2013)
The Ancient Black Civilizations of Asia (2013)
Atlantis in Mexico: The Mande Discovery of America (2013)
Meroitic Writing and Literature (2013)

Reviewed by a customer who wasted their money:
Total Afrocentric trash from a pseudo-academic. Made-up linguistics. The ancient Meroitic language has not been translated.[12]

Dravidian (Tamil) is the language of the Indus Valley Writing (2014)
We Are Not JUST Africans: The Black Native Americans (2015)

[edit] Peer-review controversy

Winters has published letters and comments in response to peer-reviewed articles in academic journals. However his responses while appearing in journals are not peer-reviewed, despite him claiming the contrary. B. Ortiz de Montellano points out: "articles you [Clyde Winters] claim in journals like PNAS are your letters commenting on a legitimate article. These letters are NOT reviewed and just published-- i.e. like the vanity press Current research Journal of Social Sciences which has no review and published your article full of typos so it was not even proofread. Similarly, the talk that is mentioned at the start of this thread, is NOT peer reviewed. Talks at regional meetings, particularly those that not part of organized sessions on a particular topic are NOT reviewed or given academic approval."[13]

Most of the peer-reviewed work Winters has actually had published are confined to fringe and pseudo-journals, examples include the Journal of African Civilizations[14] and the Mankind Quarterly.
[edit] See also

David MacRitchie - crank 19th century folklorist who Winters often quotes from
Paul Marc Washington
Ancient Egyptian race controversy
Realhistoryww

http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Clyde_Winters

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Clyde Winters
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This is my response to the rationalWiki page.

  • Dr. Clyde Winters is an Educator and Anthropologist. He taught Education over 11 years at Governors State University-University Park, Illinois; and Liguistics at Saint Xavier University-Chicago.. Over the past 13 years he has taught Bilingual Education (courses: Educational Linguistic and Bilingual Language Assessment) and Educational Administration (courses: Educational Psychology, Curriculum, School Law, Leadership and Educational Research). He has contributed to the development of the revised editions of Allan A. Glatthorn, Floyd Boschee, Bruce M. Whitehead, Curriculum leadership: strategies for development and implementation http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1412967813/ref=s9_simh_gw_p14_d0_i3?pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_s=desktop-1&pf_rd_r=0J8HEWHCA4335TFD71PD&pf_rd_t=36701&pf_rd_p=207947 5242&pf_rd_i=desktop
    and ; R. G. Owens and T.C. Valesky , Organizational Behavior in Education: Leadership and School Reform (10th Edition) http://www.amazon.com/Organizational-Behavior-Education-Leadership-School/dp/0137017464/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1438478829&sr=8-2&keywords=Organizational+Behavior+in+Education%3A+Le adership+and+School+Reform (See: Prefaces).
    [edit]Education

    His listed[1][2] academic credentials include:
     1973 - B.A., Sociology/History (University of Illinois)
     1973 - M.A., Social Science, Minors: Linguistics and Anthropology (University of Illinois)
     1994 - M.S., Special Education Education (Chicago State University)
     2000 - Ph.D., Educational Psychology (Loyola University)

    Dr. Winters has a Masters degree in Anthropology and Linguistics. This gives him the background to decipher ancient languages and write on population genetics.

    [edit]Uthman dan Fodio Institute
    Uthman dan Fodio Institute is a private research institute founded by Dr. Clyde Winters. It began as a home school to teach students in Elementary and High School. http://olmec98.net/UdFI.htm

    Stephen Howe, Professor of History and Cultures of Colonialism, University of Bristol has noted:
    The tendency to claim or imply grand-sounding academic careers and affiliations seems to be quite widespread among Afrocentrists.

    He refers to Clyde Winters as an example.[3] Wim van Binsbergen (*1947), Amsterdam-trained anthropologist, proto-historian, and intercultural philosopher (various professorial chairs in Europe and Africa, Professor of Intercultural Philosophy, Erasmus University Rotterdam and Editor of Quest: An African Journal of Philosophy / Revue Africaine de Philosophie), commenting on Howe's work, in Black Athena Comes of Age, page 277, wrote: "Scholarly reputations are also readily sacrificed on the altar of Howe's indignation vis-a-vis Afrocentrism and the more readily so, the less Howe knows of their specialist field. The synthetic programmatic overview of Afrocentrism by Clyde Ahmad Winters is sarcastically dismissed (67), but no attention is paid to the same writers intriguing linguistic work published in authoritative international journals, tracing parallels between West African languages, Asian and native American contexts, and suggesting an unexpected Asian demension to African presence, thus challenging all accepted geo political wisdom".[36]

    van Binsbergen observes that Dr. Winters is the "leading Afrocentrist" http://www.shikanda.net/topicalities/martin.htm.

    [edit]Race discrimination case
    Winters filed a race discrimination action against Iowa State University in 1991. He was employed as Director of the Black Cultural Center at Iowa State University from August 1974 to May 1975.
    The case was dismissed because he failed to file his case in a timely fashion..[4]

    [edit]Peer-review controversy
    The author of this article claims Winters has published letters and comments in response to peer-reviewed articles in academic journals. However his responses while appearing in journals are not peer-reviewed, despite him claiming the contrary. B. O. de Montellano points out: "the articles you [Clyde Winters] claim in journals like PNAS are your letters commenting on a legitimate article. These letters are NOT reviewed and just published-- i.e. like the vanity press Current research Journal of Social Sciences which has no review and published your article full of typos so it was not even proofread. Similarly, the talk that is mentioned at the start of this thread, is NOT peer reviewed. Talks at regional meetings, particularly those that not part of organized sessions on a particular topic are NOT reviewed or given academic approval."[5]


    This is false. You can not make a presentation at a Conference if it has not been reviewed and found acceptable for the Conference by experts in the field.

    I have made presentation at international and national anthropological meetings, before my "peers" including AAA. For example Linda Schele attended my 1997 Olmec presentation.


     -
     -

    Friday, April 16th
    ... in Highland Chiapas. 9:30. Clyde Winters (Loyola U - Chicago) Olmec Symbolism in the Mayan Writing. 9:50. Nestor Quiroa (U Illinois ...
    www.aaanet.org/csas/mtg99/program/pfri.html - 47k - Cached - Similar pages

    Saturday, April 17th
    ... 11:15. Samuel Cooper (Bar Ilan U) The Classification of Biblical Sacrifice. 11:35. Clyde Winters (Loyola U - Chicago) Harappan Origins of Yogi. 11:55. ...
    www.aaanet.org/csas/mtg99/program/psat.html - 50k - Cached - Similar pages

    preliminary program csas98
    ... Mexican Villages. 4:10 Clyde A. Winters (Uthman dan Fodio I) Jaguar Kings: Olmec Royalty and Religious Leaders in the First Person. 4:30 ...
    www.aaanet.org/csas/mtg98/Prelimp5.htm - 39k - Cached - Similar pages

    Thursday April, 3 - Early Afternoon
    ... Russia [1413]. 2:30 pm - Clyde A. Winters (Uthman dan Fodio Institute) - The Decipherment of Olmec Writing [1414]. 2:50 pm - James ...
    www.aaanet.org/csas/mtg97/final.htm - 36k - Cached - Similar pages

    .


    The author claims that :Most of the peer-reviewed work Winters has actually had published are confined to fringe and pseudo-journals, examples include the Journal of African Civilizations[9] and the Mankind Quarterly.

    The author writes: Dr. Winters' work is only published in fringe publications this is false. Dr. Winters' articles in the Journal of African Civilization and Mankind Quarterly, were published 30 years ago. He has published over a hundred articles since then.

    It is normal science for scholars to write responses to published research letters. Dr. Winters is only doing what other scientist do.

    Dr. Winters has published many peer reviewed articles and they are not in "fringe" journals. For example, Dr. Winters has three articles recognized by the NCBI. The is the United States agency that only list peer reviewed science articles. These articles are

    1. A comparison of Fulani and Nadar HLA, by Clyde Winters, Indian J Hum Genet. 2012 Jan-Apr; 18(1): 137–138. doi: 10.4103/0971-6866.96686 PMCID: PMC3385173.[10]


    2. The Fulani are not from the Middle East, by Clyde Winters, Proc Natl Acad Sci U S A. 2010 August 24; 107(34): E132. Published online 2010 August 3. doi: 10.1073/pnas.1008007107. PMCID: PMC2930572.[11]

    3. Can parallel mutation and neutral genome selection explain Eastern African M1 consensus HVS-I motifs in Indian M haplogroups, by Clyde Winters Indian J Hum Genet. 2007 Sep-Dec; 13(3): 93–96. doi: 10.4103/0971-6866.38982 .PMCID: PMC3168144[12]

    ]b]As you can see many of the comments in this article are unfounded. Given the bias and lies published in this Wiki, it should be unlocked so that it can show a more balanced view. Power98 (talk) 11:41, 2 August 2015 (UTC)


    [edit]Afrocentric historical revisionism
    The author claims that this is historical revisionism. This is false Leo Wiener, in Africa and the Discovery of America, was the first researcher to write that the olmecs were Black.[13]. Africa and the Discovery of America is 3 volumes. Writing that Blacks founded the Olmec and Sumerian civilizations is Afrocentric Revisionism, the Afro-American historian trained at Harvard University, Dr. E.B. DuBois has been writing about this fact since publication of the Negro in 1915 [14]; he also discussed this historical reality in The World and Africa [15]. How is this historical revisionism when Afro-Americans have been stating these historical truths since 1915.
    Power98 (talk) 12:37, 2 August 2015 (UTC)
    [edit]Decipherment

    This Wiki page claims that Dr. Winters decipherments are wrong because of an article by Jason Colavito and comments attacking Dr. Winters by Bernard Ortiz de Montellano in a discussion group. This section is biased because Calavito and Montellano are not linguists—but Dr. Winters is a linguist who has a Master’s Degree in Social Science with Minors in Anthropology and Linguistics.

    It also fails to acknowledge that Dr. Winters taught linguistics at Saint Xavier University—Chicago.

    People claim they have deciphered dead languages everyday—just because people disagree does not mean the decipherment should be ridiculed.

    The author of this page failed to acknowledge that Dr. Winters has published authoritative articles and books on his decipherments.

    Dr. Winters has published significant articles on his decipherments

    2009. Literacy Existed in the Indus Valley .Science Magazine. E-Letter. (2June 2009) http://www.sciencemag.org/cgi/eletters/324/5931/1165

    2011. Olmec (Mande) Loan Words in the Mayan, Mixe-Zoque and Taino Languages . Current Research Journal of Social Science Year: 2011 Vol: 3 Issue: 3 Pages/record No.: 152-179. http://maxwellsci.com/print/crjss/v3-152-179.pdf

    2012. Dravidian is the language of the Indus writing http://www.currentscience.ac.in/Volumes/103/10/1220.pdf

    (1999). The inscriptions of Tanyidamani. Nubica et Ethiopica IV \ V, 355-388.


    .

    Having published articles on his decipherments in Current Research Journal of Social Science, Nubica, Science and Current Science, illustrates that although Dr. Winters’ decipherments are controversial they are public knowledge.

    It also fails to acknowledge that Dr, Winters has also published books on his decipherment: Olmec Language and Literature, [19] Dravidian (Tamil) is the language of the Indus Valley Writing: A study of the most ancient Tamil Language [20] In addition, Dr. Winters has published 10 articles on his decipherment of the Indus Valley Writing that can be found at his webpage on Academia Edu [21]

     -  -  -

     -  -


    As you can see the section on decipherment is not neutral and fails to look at the issue without bias
    Power98 (talk) 12:19, 2 August 2015 (UTC) Power98 (talk) 12:45, 2 August 2015 (UTC)

    [edit]Publications
    Books The Publication section is full of lies. Author claims that “Winters publishes, and sells his books on Amazon Kindle, or self-prints copies from Uthman dan Fodio Institute his home”. This is false, Dr. Winters’ books are published by Amazon’s Createspace, not the Uthman dan Fodio Institute. The author makes it appear that there are no good reviews for Dr. Winters’ books. This is false.
    African Empires in Ancient America (2013) KNOWLEDGE2POWER.By TClark on February 23, 2013. Format: Kindle Edition Verified Purchase. “Excellent book to gain an even clearer, accurate & proper portrayal of just some of the many achievements of African people in the America's long before Christopher Columbus' erroneous claim to have discovered a land that was already occuppied & thriving!
    TRUTH2KNOWLEDGE2POWER”. [22] Before Egypt (2013) very good research. By Rathael G. Fambro on April 22, 2013, Format: Paperback Verified Purchase“there is very little research on what came before kemet/egypt. this is an excellent source that utilizes diopian methods of linguistics, culture, history, religion, etc., to get to the true origins. niger-kordfanian language family, is the language of all "adams".”[23]
    The Ancient Black Civilizations of Asia (2013) Great book on Black Asian by Clyde Winters.By Mena on June 7, 2013. Format: Kindle Edition Verified Purchase. “The Ancient Black Civilisations of Asia is a great book on the black Asian by Clyde Winters.The Author tell us in the old model of history the Graeco Roman historian tell us 1) that the Egyptian were black 2) The Kushite founded civilisation in Africa and Eurasia 3) the first inhabitant of Greece and Rome were black from Africa.”[24]
    Atlantis in Mexico: The Mande Discovery of America (2013) africans before slavery and the slave trade.By Rathael G. Fambro on May 14, 2013. Format: Paperback Verified Purchase’ “very good information on the african presence in the america's before slavery and the slave trade. main stream and academia, have ignored, misinformed, distorted, and lied, about africans for too long. very good scholarly work”.[25]
    {b]Ancient African History Primer{/b} (2014) Good. By Rathael G. Fambro on June 5, 2014.Format: Paperback Verified Purchase.winters always does a good job, but he comes off as cocky and arrogant in person. having said that, his research is sound. I have learned a lot from him”.[26] [edit]

    ↑ Curriculum Vitae
    1. ↑ ResearchGate
    2. ↑ Howe, Stephen. (1998). Afrocentrism: Mythical Pasts and Imagined Homes. London: Verso. p. 261.
    3. ↑ Winters v. Iowa State University, 768 F. Supp. 231 (N.D. Ill. 1991)
    4. ↑ Dr. Clyde Winters: The Decipherment of the Olmec Writing System (archive)
    5. ↑ [www.aaanet.org/csas/mtg99/program/pfri.html]
    6. ↑ [www.aaanet.org/csas/mtg99/program/psat.html]
    7. ↑ [www.aaanet.org/csas/mtg98/Prelimp5.htm]
    8. ↑ "Journal of African Civilizations [...] consistently promote a racialist and hegemonic view of the role allegedly played by 'black peoples' in the formation of civilizations throughout the world." (Haslip-Viera, G., de Montellano, B. O., Barbour, W. [1997]. "Robbing Native American Cultures: Van Sertima's Afrocentricity and the Olmecs". Current Anthropology. 38(3): 419-441.)
    9. ↑ [ http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/?term=clyde+Winters}
    10. ↑ [1]
    11. ↑ [2]
    12. ↑ [ http://www.amazon.com/Africa-Discovery-America-Leo-Wiener/dp/1617590029]
    13. ↑ [ http://www.amazon.com/The-Negro-W-E-Bois/dp/1602068143]
    14. ↑ [ http://www.amazon.com/The-World-Africa-W-Bois/dp/0717802213]
    15. ↑ [3]
    16. ↑ [4]
    17. ↑ [5]
    18. ↑ [ http://www.amazon.com/Olmec-Language-Literature-Clyde-Winters/dp/1507587244/ref=sr_1_6?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1438517071&sr=1-6&refinements=p_27%3ADr.+Clyde+Winters]
    19. ↑ [ http://www.amazon.com/Dravidian-Tamil-language-Valley-Writing/dp/1503117200/ref=sr_1_11?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1438517071&sr=1-11&refinements=p_27%3ADr.+Clyde+Winters]
    20. ↑ [ https://olmec98.academia.edu/CWinters]
    21. ↑ [6]
    22. ↑ [7]
    23. ↑ [8]
    24. ↑ [9]


--------------------
C. A. Winters

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Clyde Winters
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 -


.

The Wikirational page was written by a former poster styled Cass/Krom/Mr.Burton you suffer from extreme racism. You are sick and need professional help.

In my work I have never attacked another race. The definition of racism is:" prejudice, discrimination, or antagonism directed against someone of a different race based on the belief that one's own race is superior'.

My research concerns only the history of Black/African people. I have never stated in any of my papers that Blacka are superior to whites. I only state the historical facts.

If relaying the facts indicate the Olmecs and Sumerians were Black--that is not racism. The observation that these people were Black was first claimed by whites: Leo Wiener the former and Col. Rawlinson the later.

It is racism when you attack my research when it was whites like you who first acknowledged the Olmecs, and Sumerians were Black

Cass is delusional. Cass it appears that it is alright if whites claim a particular ancient group was Black--but racist if the same information is stated by a Black/African.

Whereas I have never disparaged a member of another race, You spend your time attacking Black people and their history.You had already admitted that you have trolled me for 8 years. This is evidence of someone being .sick

Cass’ racism has made you sick and you need help!


[list]
 Extreme racism indicates psychopathology

Yes

It can be a delusional symptom of psychotic disorders

Alvin F Poussaint, Professor of psychiatry1


The American Psychiatric Association has never officially recognized extreme racism (as opposed to ordinary prejudice) as a mental health problem, although the issue was raised more than 30 years ago. After several racist killings in the civil rights era, a group of black psychiatrists sought to have extreme bigotry classified as a mental disorder. The association's officials rejected the recommendation, arguing that because so many Americans are racist, even extreme racism in this country is normative—a cultural problem rather than an indication of psychopathology.

The psychiatric profession's primary index for diagnosing psychiatric symptoms, the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM), does not include racism, prejudice, or bigotry in its text or index.1 Therefore, there is currently no support for including extreme racism under any diagnostic category. This leads psychiatrists to think that it cannot and should not be treated in their patients.

To continue perceiving extreme racism as normative and not pathologic is to lend it legitimacy. Clearly, anyone who scapegoats a whole group of people and seeks to eliminate them to resolve his or her internal conflicts meets criteria for a delusional disorder, a major psychiatric illness.

Extreme racists' violence should be considered in the context of behavior described by Allport in The Nature of Prejudice.2 Allport's 5-point scale categorizes increasingly dangerous acts.[b] It begins with verbal expression of antagonism, progresses to avoidance of members of disliked groups, then to active discrimination against them,[b] to physical attack, and finally to extermination (lynchings, massacres, genocide). That fifth point on the scale, the acting out of extermination fantasies, is readily classifiable as delusional behavior.

More recently, Sullaway and Dunbar used a prejudice rating scale to assess and describe levels of prejudice.3 They found associations between highly prejudiced people and other indicators of psychopathology. The subtype at the extreme end of their scale is a paranoid/delusional prejudice disorder.

Using the DSM's structure of diagnostic criteria for delusional disorder,4(p329) I suggest the following subtype:

Prejudice type: A delusion whose theme is that a group of individuals, who share a defining characteristic, in one's environment have a particular and unusual significance. These delusions are usually of a negative or pejorative nature, but also may be grandiose in content. When these delusions are extreme, the person may act out by attempting to harm, and even murder, members of the despised group(s).

Extreme racist delusions can also occur as a major symptom in other psychotic disorders, such as schizophrenia and bipolar disorder. Persons suffering delusions usually have serious social dysfunction that impairs their ability to work with others and maintain employment.

[b]As a clinical psychiatrist, I have treated several patients who projected their own unacceptable behavior and fears onto ethnic minorities, scapegoating them for society's problems. Their strong racist feelings, which were tied to fixed belief systems impervious to reality checks, were symptoms of serious mental dysfunction. When these patients became more aware of their own problems, they grew less paranoid—and less prejudiced.]/b]

It is time for the American Psychiatric Association to designate extreme racism as a mental health problem by recognizing it as a delusional psychotic symptom. Persons afflicted with such psychopathology represent an immediate danger to themselves and others. Clinicians need guidelines for recognizing delusional racism in all its forms so that they can provide appropriate treatment. Otherwise, extreme delusional racists will continue to fall through the cracks of the mental health system, and we can expect more of them to explode and act out their deadly delusions.

Figure 1 : https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1071634/figure/fig1/


References
1. American Psychiatric Association. Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders. 4th edition. Washington, DC: American Psychiatric Press; 2000.

2. Allport G. The Nature of Prejudice. Reading, MA: Addison-Wesley; 1954.

3. Sullaway M, Dunbar E. Clinical manifestations of prejudice in psychotherapy: toward a strategy of assessment and treatment. Clin Psychol Sci Pract 1996;3: 296-309.

4. American Psychiatric Association. Diagnostic criteria for 297.1 delusional disorder. In: DSM-IV-TR: Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders, Fourth Edition, Text Revision. Washington, DC: American Psychiatric Press; 2000.

See: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1071634/

--------------------
C. A. Winters

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The rationalwiki page implies that the research claiming the Sumerians, Palesgian (Greeks), and Olmecs were Black is racist. These are not racist ideas.

It was the Greeks who first claimed Pelasgians were not white Greeks.

Homer wrote that the Greek heroes were Black.

Col. Rawlinson said the Sumerians were Kushites after his research into the origin of the Sumerians.

Finally, the Olmec called themselves: Xi, which means Black, and Olmecs mention their migration tradition in Stela #5.

It was Leo Wiener who illustrated that the Olmec artifact the Tuxtla statuette was written in the Vai script, and the Malinke-Bambara language is a substratum language of Aztec and the Mayan languages.

As a result, it was Rawlinson who proved the Sumerians (Akkadians and Elamites) were Kushites. Leo Wiener was the first to claim the Olmecs were Black--not me. This along with the Greeco-Romans claiming the first Greeks were Black, make it clear these paradigms were created by whites not Afrocentrist.

If the paradigms that the original Greeks were Black, the Olmecs were Black and the Sumerians were Black, blame these paradigm on the Greeco-Romans, Rawlinson and Wiener--not me and Afrocentrism. These paradigms were made by whites like you. They are all part of the Ancient Model of History developed by the Greeco-Romans.


The rationalwiki page is racist. You attack me because white scholars like the Greeco-Romans, Rawlinson and Wiener told the truth about the ancient history of Blacks. Its racist like you and lioness who attempt to deny the Ancient model of History, which maintained that Blacks have an ancient history.


Real scholars know my research is founded on the works of Rawlinson and Wiener. As a result, to prove me wrong they have to prove these scholars were also wrong, so they remain silent becaudse if they dare to attack me I will respond and show them to be fools. The only people who attempt to attack my work are trolls like you and Montellano.

Montellano published numerous articles attacking Afrocentrists, like van Sertima. He trolled me for twenty years trying to attack my work on-line--but he was unable to publish one article, I repeat one article debunking any of my research in either a peer reviewed journal, or magazine on ancient history.During this same period, my papers have been published in ancient history magazines and peer reviewed journals.

Rationalwiki is Evil and a racist. If Cass were not an editor at Wiki, he would never have been able to write that racist and false rationalwiki page about me. No one would have published the rationalwiki page, because he wrote the attack on me without any supporting references to anyone attacking my work except Montellano, who has never published one paper debunking my work. If Cass hadn't been a Wiki editor they would never have published the rationalwiki page.
[b]
The rationalwiki page he wrote is full of lies. It is only a matter of time before he will be discovered to be a liar and racist and the illegitimate rationalwiki page is removed once the Wiki people learn you have been trolling me for at least 8 years.


White people lie about the Greeks.The Original Greeks were Black African people.

 -

 -


Aeschylus describes Epaphos as "swarthy of hue" or dark skinned and that he originally lived in Africa.

There are many light skinned Africans who have never mixed with Europeans. Apollo is chrysaeros 'bearing a golden sword'

Artemis is eustephanos which has no relation to fair


Neptune is kyanochaites 'bluish or Blackish like dark deep waves of the ocean

Achilles is xanthos 'brown'

]  -

Xanthos means red-yellow which equals brown: a group of colors between red and yellow in hue that are medium to low in lightness and low to moderate in saturation

 -

• The Mycenaeans were not white. Homer claimed that Mycenae was ruled by Agamemnon. In the Iliad Agamemnon is decribed as xanthos, which means brown in Greek, not white.Agamemnon is in direct descent from Epaphos, the Black ancestor of the Pelasgic house. Aeschylus in Prometheus Bound, describes Epaphos as "swarthy of hue" and that he originally lived in Africa. The Pelasgians were the first settlers of Greecian region.


• The first migrants to Crete were Garamantes according to Classics. The Garamantes were recognized as a Black tribe. They were known to the Greeks and Romans as dark skinned. In Ptolemy (I.8.5.,p.31) a Garamante slave was described as having a body the color of pitch or wholly black. The Garamante lived in the Fezzan/Libya, not Turkey.
The first AMH in Europe carried hg M, not R1b. The whites did not enter Greece until after 800BC from Asia minor.


Linguistic

• The Pelasgians did not speak Greek they spoke Achaioi or Achaean. West Greek was spoken by the Dorian the Ionians spoke a dialect of East Greek called Aeolic. Dr.Anna M. Davies,says "less than 40% of the words which have an Indo-European etymology".Davies, said 52.2 % Greek terms in Chantraine's Dictionnaire Etymologique de la langue Grecque have unknown etymology. This is due to the African origin of Greece.


J.A. Rogers in Sex and Race, Parker, Diop, Winters and DuBois have reviewed the writings of the classical authors, the anthropological, linguistic and historical evidence to reach the conclusion that the ancient Greeks were blacks and that the European Greeks learned the liberal arts and sciences from their "black ancestors" who first settled Greece and the Egyptians.

 -


For example, Parker used anthropological, archaeological, historical and classical sources to prove that blacks once lived in the Aegean. Parker used the Greek classics to prove that the Pelasgians were of African origin. He also discussed the origin stories about the Pelasgic founders of selected Grecian cities and proved that these men were blacks and not Indo-Europeans. Parker also observed that "the great Grecian epics are epics of an African people and Helen, the cause of the Trojan war, must henceforth be conceived as a beautiful brown skin girl" . These Africans sailed to the Greece from North Africa.

Using archaeological evidence and the classical literature I explained how the African/Black founders of Grecian civilization originally came from the ancient Sahara. I made it clear that these Blacks came to the Aegean in two waves 1) the Garamantes a Malinke speaking people that now live along the Niger river, but formerly lived in the Fezzan region of Libya; and 2) the Egyptians, Phoenicians and East Africans who were recorded in Greece's history as the Pelasgians See: http://clyde.winters.tripod.com/chapter6.html
.
The Pelasgian civilization has been discussed in detail by Parker .

 -

Blacks introduced arts, sciences, architecture and etc.


 -

Homer was Xanthos: a Black Man. The leading characters in his books were Negro/Black men and women.


 -


Aeschylus describes Epaphos as "swarthy of hue" or dark skinned and that he originally lived in Africa.

There are many light skinned Africans who have never mixed with Europeans. Apollo is chrysaeros 'bearing a golden sword'

Artemis is eustephanos which has no relation to fair


Neptune is kyanochaites 'bluish or Blackish like dark deep waves of the ocean

Achilles is xanthos 'brown'


[b] This rationalwiki page was written by a racist Euroloon.

--------------------
C. A. Winters

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Clyde Winters
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Kushites of Sumer and Akkad


Controversy surrounding the Kushite/African/Black origins of the Elamites, Sumerians, Akkadians and “Assyrians” is simple and yet complicated. It involves both the racism exhibited toward the African slaves in the Western Hemisphere and Africans generally which led to the idea that Africans had no history ; and the need of Julius Oppert to make Semites white, to accommodate the “white” ancestry of European Jews.

To understand this dichotomy we have to look at the history of scholarship surrounding the rise of Sumero-Akkadian studies. The study of the Sumerians, Akkadians. Assyrians and Elamites began with the decipherment of the cuneiform script by Henry Rawlinson. Henry Rawlinson had spent most of his career in the Orient. This appears to have gave him an open mind in regards to history. He recognized the Ancient Model of History, the idea that civilization was founded by the Kushite or Hamitic people of the Bible.

As result, Rawlinson was surprised during his research to discover that the founders of the Mesopotamian civilization were of Kushite origin. He made it clear that the Semitic speakers of Akkad and the non-Semitic speakers of Sumer were both Black or Negro people who called themselves sag-gig-ga “Black Heads”. In Rawlinson’s day the Sumerian people were recognized as Akkadian or Chaldean, while the Semitic speaking blacks were called Assyrians.

 -

Rawlinson identified these Akkadians as Turanian or Scythic people. But he made it clear that these ancient Scythic or Turanian speaking people were Kushites or Blacks.

A major supporter of Rawlinson was Edward Hincks. Hincks continued Rawlinson’s work and identified the ancient group as Chaldeans, and also called them Turanian speakers. Hincks, though, never dicussed their ethnic origin.

A late comer to the study of the Sumerians and the Akkadians was Julius Oppert. Oppert was a German born of Jewish parents. He made it clear that the Chaldean and Akkadian people spoke different languages. He noted that the original founders of Mesopotamia civilization called themselves Ki-en-gi “land of the true lords”. It was the Semitic speakers who called themselves Akkadians.

Assyrians called the Ki-en-gi people Sumiritu “the sacred language”. Oppert popularized the Assyrian name Sumer, for the original founders of the civilization. Thus we have today the Akkadians and Sumerians of ancient Mesopotamia.

Oppert began to popularize the idea that the Sumerians were related to the contemporary Altaic and Turanian speaking people, e.g., Turks and Magyar (Hungarian) speaking people. He made it clear that the Akkadians were Semites like himself . To support this idea Oppert pointed out that typological features between Sumerian and Altaic languages existed. This feature was agglutination.

The problem with identifying the Sumerians as descendants from contemporary Turanian speakers resulted from the fact that Sumerian and the Turkish languages are not genetically related. As a result Oppert began to criticize the work of Hincks (who was dead at the time) in relation to the identification of the Sumerian people as Turanian following the research of Rawlinson.

Oppert knew Rawlinson had used African languages to decipher cuneiform writing. But he did not compare the Sumerian to African languages, probably, due to the fact that he knew they were related given Rawlinson's earlier research.

It is strange to some observers that Oppert,never criticized Rawlinson who had proposed the Turanian origin of the Ki-en-gi (Sumerians). But this was not strange at all. Oppert did not attack Rawlinson who was still alive at the time because he knew that Rawlinson said the Sumerians were the original Scythic and Turanian people he called Kushites. Moreover, Rawlinson made it clear that both the Akkadians and Sumerians were Blacks. For Oppert to have debated this issue with
Rawlinson, who deciphered the cuneiform script, would have meant that he would have had to accept the fact that Semites were Black. There was no way Oppert would have wanted to acknowledge his African heritage, given the Anti-Semitism experienced by Jews living in Europe.

Although Oppert successfully hid the recognition that the Akkadians and the Sumerians both refered to themselves as sag-gig-ga “black heads”, some researchers were unable to follow the status quo and ignore this reality. For example, Francois Lenormant, made it clear, following the research of Rawlinson, that the Elamite and Sumerians spoke genetically related languages. This idea was hard to reconcile with the depiction of people on the monuments of Iran, especially the Behistun monument, which depicted Negroes (with curly hair and beards) representing the Assyrians, Jews and Elamites who ruled the area. As a result, Oppert began the myth that the Sumerian languages was isolated from other languages spoken in the world evethough it shared typological features with the Altaic languages. Oppert taught Akkadian-Sumerian in many of the leading Universities in France and Germany. Many of his students soon began to dominate the Academe, or held chairs in Sumerian and Akkadian studies these researchers continued to perpetuate the myth that the Elamite and Sumerian languages were not related.

There was no way to keep from researchers who read the original Sumerian, Akkadian and Assyrian text that these people recognized that they were ethnically Blacks. This fact was made clear by Albert Terrien de LaCouperie. Born in France, de LaCouperie was a well known linguist and China expert. Although native of France most of his writings are in English. In the journal he published called the Babylonian and Oriental Record, he outlined many aspects of ancient history. In these pages he made it clear that the Sumerians, Akkadians and even the Assyrians who called themselves şalmat kakkadi ‘black headed people”, were all Blacks of Kushite origin. Eventhough de LaCouperie taught at the University of London, the prestige of Oppert, and the fact that the main centers for Sumero-Akkadian studies in France and Germany were founded by Oppert and or his students led to researchers ignoring the evidence that the Sumerians , Akkadians and Assyrians were Black.

 -

In summary, the cuneiform evidence makes it clear that the Sumerians, Akkadians and Assyrians recognized themselves as Negroes: “black heads”. This fact was supported by the statues of Gudea, the Akkadians and Assyrians. Plus the Behistun monument made it clear that the Elamites were also Blacks.

The textual evidence also makes it clear that Oppert began the discussion of a typological relationship between Sumerian and Turkic languages. He also manufactured the idea that the Semites of Mesopotamia and Iran, the Assyrians and Akkadians were “whites”, like himself. Due to this brain washing, and whitening out of Blacks in history, many people today can look at depictions of Assyrians, Achamenians, and Akkadians and fail to see the Negro origin of these people.

To make the Sumerians “white” textbooks print pictures of artifacts dating to the Gutian rule of Lagash, to pass them off as the true originators of Sumerian civilization. No Gutian rulers of Lagash are recognized in the Sumerian King List.

 -
Gutian .... Sumerian..


William Leo Hansberry gives a great discussion of the evidence of African Kushites ruling in Asia and Africa. Some ancient scholars noted that the first rulers of Elam were of Kushite ( Kerma ? ) origin.

Founder of Elamite civilization came from Kush in Africa. According to Strabo, the first Elamite colony at Susa was founded by Tithnus, a King of Kush. Strabo in Book 15, Chapter 3728 wrote that in fact it is claimed that Susa was founded by Tithonus Memnon's father, and his citadel bore the name Memnonium. The Susians are also called Cissians. Aeschylus, calls Memnon's mother Cissia.


William Leo Hansberry, African History Notebook, (1981) Volume 2 noted that:

In Persia the old Negroid element seems indeed to have been sufficiently powerful to maintain the overlord of the land. For the Negritic strain is clearly evident in statuary depicting members of the royal family ruling in the second millenium B.C.

Hundreds of years later, when Xerxes invaded Greece, the type was well represented in the Persian army. In the remote mountain regions bordering on Persia and Baluchistan, there is to be found at the present time a Negroid element which bears a remarkable resemblance to the type represented on the ancient mounments. Hence the Negritic or Ethiopian type has proved persistent in this area, and in ancient times it seems to have constituted numerically and socially an important factor in the population" (p.52) .

. Here is Cyrus

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 -

 -

 -





Check out my videos on the Asian Kushites: Click this Picture
.
 -


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qfzjgJ88Vr8


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p-2xjWIIxK8



Enjoy

--------------------
C. A. Winters

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Brada-Anansi
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While I might disagree with some of your conclusions and theories, you damn well earned the right to be called Dr, for me you are never simply Clyde or Winters, but Dr Winters.
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the lioness,
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Clyde's a doctor of Educational Psychology
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the lioness,
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10 myths about psychology: debunked | Ben Ambridge


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ce31WjiVcY0

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Clyde Winters
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quote:
Originally posted by Brada-Anansi:
While I might disagree with some of your conclusions and theories, you damn well earned the right to be called Dr, for me you are never simply Clyde or Winters, but Dr Winters.

Thanks for the kind words.

--------------------
C. A. Winters

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R.Havoc
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quote:

Stephen Howe, Professor of History and Cultures of Colonialism, University of Bristol has noted:
The tendency to claim or imply grand-sounding academic careers and affiliations seems to be quite widespread among Afrocentrists.


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Clyde Winters
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quote:
Originally posted by R.Havoc:
quote:

Stephen Howe, Professor of History and Cultures of Colonialism, University of Bristol has noted:
The tendency to claim or imply grand-sounding academic careers and affiliations seems to be quite widespread among Afrocentrists.


LOL. Euronut you don't know what you're talking about. I have two Masters Degrees, and a PhD.

Wim van Binsbergen (*1947), Amsterdam-trained anthropologist, proto-historian, and intercultural philosopher (various professorial chairs in Europe and Africa, Professor of Intercultural Philosophy, Erasmus University Rotterdam and Editor of Quest: An African Journal of Philosophy / Revue Africaine de Philosophie), commenting on Howe's statement , in Black Athena Comes of Age, page 277, wrote: "Scholarly reputations are also readily sacrificed on the altar of Howe's indignation vis-a-vis Afrocentrism and the more readily so, the less Howe knows of their specialist field. The synthetic programmatic overview of Afrocentrism by Clyde Ahmad Winters is sarcastically dismissed (67), but no attention is paid to the same writers intriguing linguistic work published in authoritative international journals, tracing parallels between West African languages, Asian and native American contexts, and suggesting an unexpected Asian demension to African presence, thus challenging all accepted geo political wisdom". web page

--------------------
C. A. Winters

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the lioness,
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 -
Wim van Binsbergen is a traditional healer in Botswana,

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Clyde Winters
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quote:
Originally posted by the lioness,:
 -
Wim van Binsbergen is a traditional healer in Botswana,

quote:

Wim van Binsbergen

Wim van Binsbergen is an anthropologist. He is presently working on the theory and method of research on cultural globalisation especially in connection with virtuality, Information and Communication Technology, ethnicity and religion.
Another of his projects, on 'Africa’s Contribution to Global Systems of Knowledge: An Epistemology for African Studies in the Twenty-First Century', provides a link between his research at the ASC and his chair in Foundations of Intercultural Philosophy at Erasmus University, Rotterdam, where he gave his inaugural address in 1999. Wim van Binsbergen retired in 2012. He is still doing research and remains affiliated to the African Studies Centre.

http://www.ascleiden.nl/organization/people/wim-van-binsbergen




--------------------
C. A. Winters

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quote:
Originally posted by Clyde Winters:
quote:
Originally posted by the lioness,:
 -
Wim van Binsbergen is a traditional healer in Botswana,

quote:

Wim van Binsbergen

Wim van Binsbergen is an anthropologist. He is presently working on the theory and method of research on cultural globalisation especially in connection with virtuality, Information and Communication Technology, ethnicity and religion.
Another of his projects, on 'Africa’s Contribution to Global Systems of Knowledge: An Epistemology for African Studies in the Twenty-First Century', provides a link between his research at the ASC and his chair in Foundations of Intercultural Philosophy at Erasmus University, Rotterdam, where he gave his inaugural address in 1999. Wim van Binsbergen retired in 2012. He is still doing research and remains affiliated to the African Studies Centre.

http://www.ascleiden.nl/organization/people/wim-van-binsbergen



As usually we could witness the lioness trolling around white supremacy ideology..
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the lioness,
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Ish Gebor thinks everything is white supremacy
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quote:
Originally posted by the lioness,:
Ish Gebor thinks everything is white supremacy

You knew Dr. van Binsbergen is a full professor but you attempted to ridicule him. It hurts you to see a white scholar show me respect for my research. It is white supremacist when you attempt to lie about a great scholar to satisfy your desire to promote white supremacist ideas manufactured by other Eurocentrists like Howe.

--------------------
C. A. Winters

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the lioness,
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quote:
Originally posted by Clyde Winters:
quote:
Originally posted by the lioness,:
Ish Gebor thinks everything is white supremacy

You knew Dr. van Binsbergen is a full professor but you attempted to ridicule him. It hurts you to see a white scholar show me respect for my research. It is white supremacist when you attempt to lie about a great scholar to satisfy your desire to promote white supremacist ideas manufactured by other Eurocentrists like Howe.
He was a professor of philosophy in Rotterdam
He is also a traditional healer in Botswana. It is quite remarkable


quote:


http://www.quest-journal.net/shikanda/african_religion/diviner.htm

In addition to his scholarly and literary work, Wim van Binsbergen has been, since 1990, a certified spirit medium/ diviner/ priest in the sangoma tradition of Southern Africa. This page sets out the background, accesses Wim van Binsbergen's credentials as a sangoma, and enables you to initiate a private consultation with him



http://www.quest-journal.net/shikanda/african_religion/standard.htm

SANGOMA CONSULTATION REQUEST FORM
Wim van Binsbergen / Johannes Sibanda+
version October 2012

___________________________________________

https://openaccess.leidenuniv.nl/handle/1887/9675

2005

Chapter 15.
‘We are in this for the money’:

Commodification and the sangoma cult of Southern Africa by Wim van Binsbergen


.

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CelticWarrioress
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Clyde,

Pot meet kettle. You are as racist as they come and a liar to boot. You do & have attacked Whites right here on this forum. You have claimed Whites aren't human, how is that not racist and how is that not saying Whites are inferior to Blacks? You have stated Whites have no history, no heritage, no identity, how is that not racist & saying Whites are inferior also don't lie and say you didn't say all the above as I can pull up a video where you say just that. You claim Whites have built/achieved nothing in history and thus have nothing to be proud of as Whites how is that not racist & claiming Whites are inferior? You claim Whites have no homeland thus belong nowhere on earth how is that not racist? With all of that yes you have disparaged Whites & attacked our history. Take a good look in the mirror Clyde, you will see an Anti-White, Black supremacist,Black racist staring back at you.

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Clyde Winters
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quote:
Originally posted by the lioness,:
quote:
Originally posted by Clyde Winters:
quote:
Originally posted by the lioness,:
Ish Gebor thinks everything is white supremacy

You knew Dr. van Binsbergen is a full professor but you attempted to ridicule him. It hurts you to see a white scholar show me respect for my research. It is white supremacist when you attempt to lie about a great scholar to satisfy your desire to promote white supremacist ideas manufactured by other Eurocentrists like Howe.
He was a professor of philosophy in Rotterdam
He is also a traditional healer in Botswana. It is quite remarkable


quote:


http://www.quest-journal.net/shikanda/african_religion/diviner.htm

In addition to his scholarly and literary work, Wim van Binsbergen has been, since 1990, a certified spirit medium/ diviner/ priest in the sangoma tradition of Southern Africa. This page sets out the background, accesses Wim van Binsbergen's credentials as a sangoma, and enables you to initiate a private consultation with him



http://www.quest-journal.net/shikanda/african_religion/standard.htm

SANGOMA CONSULTATION REQUEST FORM
Wim van Binsbergen / Johannes Sibanda+
version October 2012

___________________________________________

https://openaccess.leidenuniv.nl/handle/1887/9675

2005

Chapter 15.
‘We are in this for the money’:

Commodification and the sangoma cult of Southern Africa by Wim van Binsbergen


.

Introduction to Commodification and the sangoma cult of Southern Africa by Wim van Binsbergen

.


quote:


My argument on commodification, conceived along the lines set out in my Introduction to
the present collection, will concentrate on what at first would appear to be a clear-cut case
of the old in the new: the sangoma mediumistic healing cult, which offers major first-line
traditional diagnosis and therapy in the context of what in all respects must be one of the
most commodified places in Africa, notably the rapidly growing town of Francistown in
the Northeast District of Botswana.1 The argument situates itself at the very boundary
between the domestic and the market domain evoked above. The paper’s title derives from
the apodictive pronouncement of two senior members of the cult: ‘We are in this for the
money’ – as if it is only the promise of a lucrative undertaking that attracts adepts (all of
the prospective cult leaders, because of the chain-reaction or snowball-like recruitment
dynamics of these cults of affliction, started out as novice adepts).
However, the situation
of the sangoma cult will prove to be far more complex than merely one of cultic commodification.
Admittedly, the cult can be read as a celebration of commodity exchange
and even as an encoded historical precipitation of patterns of regional exchange that have
existed in the region for centuries. In this respect it shows an urban, cosmopolitan, commodified
version of a cultic complex that, although relatively alien and a recent introduction
in the (Kalanga and Tswana orientated) Francistown area proper, has constituted an
intimate ‘home’ tradition of centuries among the Nguni-speaking peoples of Southern
Africa (Ndebele, Zulu, Swazi, Xhosa). But on the other hand, in its sanctification of place
and person, and its construction of an intimate community which is effectively therapeutic
and identitary, the cult – whilst quietly affirming commodification as a fact.....


You should be ashamed of yourself lioness. Here you are trying to attack the character of Dr. van Binsbergen by only citing the title of one of his articles without explaining what the title meant.

As Ish said you are trying to maintain white supremacy. You are using deception to attack the character of a researcher who has tried over the years to investigate aspects of African societies. Deception is a major tactic of white supremacist.

.
 -

--------------------
C. A. Winters

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the lioness,
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There is nothing to expose I put up all the links so anybody can read the article or get a $70 spiritual reading


Current procedure is that, after the a prospective client's SANGOMA CONSULTATION REQUEST FORM reaches me,

I mail back to the client to ask for specific confirmation of the consultation request (the Internet remains an unsafe place where anyone may illegally adopt the client's identity and play tricks)
The client then explicitly confirms the consultation request by payment of US$70 into my PayPal account, in response to the invoice sent to the client:
After receiving payment, I ritually prepare myself, the shrine, the oracle, and the necessary offerings and sacrifices
I conduct the consultation,
I write out the results (i.e. the report on my reading, usually a document of 10 to 14 or more pages), and
I send the protocol to the client by e-mail;
the client is expected to acknowledge receipt of the protocol by returning (e-)mail, and is entitled to ask, within two weeks after receiving the consultqation report, a few additional questions to clarify the report.
The fees are partly used to buy sacrifices (in the form of animal sacrifices and alcoholic libations) for the shrine, and partly forwarded to the sangoma cult's headquarters in Southern Africa; and partly for maintaining this worldwide sangoma consultation service. What little remains may be retained by the sangoma for personal use.

client is requested to acknowledge receipt of the protocol by return mail


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Clyde you should get into this.


Also please also post some of van Binsbergen's writings we need
some examples of his scholarship. Which of his books do you own?

You could start a Wim van Binsbergen thread

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the lioness,
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.


.
quote:


There is the theoretical possibility that the overall direction of historical indebtedness is not east-west but west-east, with African models penetrating South East Asia -- but (contrary to the Afrocentrist Clyde Winters) I consider this implausible, especially in the face of Madagascar cultural history, where the Sunda element is overwhelming and testifies of a massive east-west movement; also see the recent work by Dick-Read 2005.

-- Wim van Binsbergen
Supervision fieldwork trip to Bandung, Indonesia, 1-14 August 2007


___________________

Afrocentrist educationalist and linguist Clyde Winters (1980a, 1980b, 1980c, 1981, 1983a, 1983b, 1984, 1985, 1988) has repeatedly stated the claim of extensive pre- and protohistorical West African influence on South and East Asia, and – not surprisingly, considering both the world politics of knowledge and the obscurity of his publicational venues – has attracted less mainstream attention than he deserves. However, as far as the Early-Modern Asian distribution of mankala is concerned, the extensive Islamic influence throughout South, South East and East Asia is probably a more likely explanation for mankala distribution than direct African influence can be. (Incidentally, the connections which Winters (1984, 1985) claims to exist Sumerian, Manding, Elamite and Dravidian remind us of the close links which also the prominent linguists Igor Diakonoff, and Paul Rivet (1929), saw between Sumerian and Austric, and on which I recently hit (in press (a) when finding a plausible Austric etymology for the name of the Sumerian’s paradisiacal island Dilmun; apparently neither Winters’ claim of affinities, nor the ‘Sunda’ trajectory in Fig. 15, are totally chimaerical – Winters’affinities, spanning the huge range from West Africa, West Asia to South Asia, could be explained as traces of Sunda / Austric influence.)

-- -- Wim van Binsbergen
The pre- and protohistory of mankala board-games and geomantic divination in transcontinental perspective
A fresh look at my 1997 analysis by Wim M.J. van Binsbergen
2012


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Ish Geber
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quote:
Originally posted by the lioness,:
Ish Gebor thinks everything is white supremacy

You don't speak for me. So no, I don't think everything is white supremacy. But when it is white supremacy I tell it like it is.
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the lioness,
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Clyde, van Binsbergen also says he is a Bronze-Age Mediterraneanist

what does that mean?

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the questioner
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quote:
Originally posted by the lioness,:
Ish Gebor thinks everything is white supremacy

lioness please define "white supremacy" for us

--------------------
Questions expose liars

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the lioness,
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quote:
Originally posted by the questioner:
quote:
Originally posted by the lioness,:
Ish Gebor thinks everything is white supremacy

lioness please define "white supremacy" for us
the belief that white people are superior to non-whites and should therefore dominate society.
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Ish Geber
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quote:
Originally posted by the lioness,:
quote:
Originally posted by the questioner:
quote:
Originally posted by the lioness,:
Ish Gebor thinks everything is white supremacy

lioness please define "white supremacy" for us
the belief that white people are superior to non-whites and should therefore dominate society.
A clear pattern can be traced.


Definition of domination
1: supremacy or preeminence over another
2: exercise of mastery or ruling power
3: exercise of preponderant, governing, or controlling influence


31. The essential elements that gave to Protestant Ascendancy after 1689 in Ireland and white supremacy in continental Anglo-America the character of racial oppression were those that first destroyed the original forms of social identity among the subject population, and then excluded the members of that population from admittance into the forms of social identity normal to the colonizing power. The codifications of this basic organizing principle in the Penal Laws of the Protestant Ascendancy in Ireland and the slave codes of white supremacy in continental Anglo-America present four common defining characteristics of those two regimes: 1) declassing legislation, directed at property-holding members of the oppressed group; 2) the deprivation of civil rights; 3) the illegalization of literacy; and 4) displacement of family rights and authorities.46


Origin of white supremacy

1865-70, Americanism

http://www.dictionary.com/browse/white-supremacy

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