As one can see. Even the Steppes Nomads are not your blue eyed blondes but brown skinned Asians ….according to the DNA
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quote:Originally posted by xyyman: When I get to my other computer
Thanks
.
google
41586_2020_2378_MOESM3_ESM
-------------------- Without data you are just another person with an opinion - Deming Posts: 12143 | From: When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable | Registered: Jun 2007
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A long time ago someone had told me the mound builders in Europe were Africans.....
quote: Interviewee: Lara Cassidy
Yes, and as unusual as that is to find, his burial place is also extremely unique. He is within one of the most grand megalithic structures we have from across Neolithic Europe and not only that, he’s in the most beautifully decorated recess, the biggest recess at the end of the passage. So, yeah, it’s very hard to imagine that his parentage was not socially sanctioned given where he was buried. Most of the time, if you do find sibling matings that are accepted, they’re half siblings. Full siblings are very rare. And these societies all have a lot of things in common. The first-degree incest is restricted to an elite – typically, only a royal couple or royal clan. They’re highly stratified societies. They take multiple wives. The throne has patrilineal descent. So, there are a lot of markers that appear again and again and again that seem to accompany the exceptions to this universal taboo.
Interviewer: Geoff Marsh
You’ve been thinking about this find at Newgrange presumably for quite a long time now. Do you have an image of your head of who he was and what he looked like, and is there any genetic evidence for what he looked like?
Interviewee: Lara Cassidy
Yeah, so we did pigmentation prediction. So, he would have been on the darker end of skin tones that we see in the Irish Neolithic – black hair, dark eyes and very dark skin. It’s hard because we didn’t get a complete skeleton so we can’t do a height profile or anything like that. We don’t have the remains for it.
But here is the funny part. I am not sure if these folks are trolling by making up "dark skin" genes or if that is truly something found from the evidence. If so, then that shows once and for all that there was no massive migration of white Eurasians into Africa to settle the Nile Valley and create Egyptian civilization. But they won't give it up....
quote:Yeah, so we did pigmentation prediction. So, he would have been on the darker end of skin tones that we see in the Irish Neolithic – black hair, dark eyes and very dark skin. It’s hard because we didn’t get a complete skeleton so we can’t do a height profile or anything like that. We don’t have the remains for it.
TBH, I'm rather surprised this Irish Neolithic guy is as dark as he apparently is. I knew British WHG could be dark-skinned (albeit with blue eyes), but I was under the impression that EEF like him were lighter-skinned. Is he mixed with WHG, or have I been wrong about EEF this whole time?
Tukuler
multidisciplinary Black Scholar
Member # 19944
posted
quote:Originally posted by Doug M:
quote:Interviewer: Geoff Marsh
You’ve been thinking about this find at Newgrange presumably for quite a long time now. Do you have an image of your head of who he was and what he looked like, and is there any genetic evidence for what he looked like?
Interviewee: Lara Cassidy
Yeah, so we did pigmentation prediction. So, he would have been on the darker end of skin tones that we see in the Irish Neolithic – black hair, dark eyes and very dark skin. It’s hard because we didn’t get a complete skeleton so we can’t do a height profile or anything like that. We don’t have the remains for it.
But here is the funny part. I am not sure if these folks are trolling by making up "dark skin" genes or if that is truly something found from the evidence.
quote:Originally posted by One Third African: TBH, I'm rather surprised this Irish Neolithic guy is as dark as he apparently is. I knew British WHG could be dark-skinned (albeit with blue eyes), but I was under the impression that EEF like him were lighter-skinned. Is he mixed with WHG, or have I been wrong about EEF this whole time?
.
Cassidy et al are independent of the Reich factory.
You’ve been thinking about this find at Newgrange presumably for quite a long time now. Do you have an image of your head of who he was and what he looked like, and is there any genetic evidence for what he looked like?
Interviewee: Lara Cassidy
Yeah, so we did pigmentation prediction. So, he would have been on the darker end of skin tones that we see in the Irish Neolithic – black hair, dark eyes and very dark skin. It’s hard because we didn’t get a complete skeleton so we can’t do a height profile or anything like that. We don’t have the remains for it.
But here is the funny part. I am not sure if these folks are trolling by making up "dark skin" genes or if that is truly something found from the evidence.
quote:Originally posted by One Third African: TBH, I'm rather surprised this Irish Neolithic guy is as dark as he apparently is. I knew British WHG could be dark-skinned (albeit with blue eyes), but I was under the impression that EEF like him were lighter-skinned. Is he mixed with WHG, or have I been wrong about EEF this whole time?
.
Cassidy et al are independent of the Reich factory.
So they would have been a heterogeneous bunch with regards to pigmentation. Thanks, Tukuler!
Tukuler
multidisciplinary Black Scholar
Member # 19944
posted
Here're the factors in pigment predictions from the blackest and whitest Irish Neolithic samples NG10 & CAK533 both being from the Passage Tombs.
Tukuler
multidisciplinary Black Scholar
Member # 19944
posted
How the abstract refers to the dark black skinned individual NG10:
quote: The nature and distribution of political power in Europe during the Neolithic era remains poorly understood(1). During this period, many societies began to invest heavily in building monuments, which suggests an increase in social organization. The scale and sophistication of megalithic architecture along the Atlantic seaboard, culminating in the great passage tomb complexes, is particularly impressive(2).
Although co-operative ideology has often been emphasised as a driver of megalith construction(1), the human expenditure required to erect the largest monuments has led some researchers to emphasize hierarchy(3) —of which the most extreme case is a small elite marshalling the labour of the masses. Here we present evidence that a social stratum of this type was established during the Neolithic period in Ireland.
It all makes sense. Who said it. Paleolithic Iberians were similar to Paleolithic South Africans. I know morphology can be misleading. We also see that Sandwe has a close connection to HG Iberians. Africans have been migrating through Gibraltar since the Paleolithic times es.
This will be more apparent if more “unsupervised” Admixture analysis is performed.
It is clear that there was a Paleolithic migration OOA and a later Neolithic migration about 8-10K ya. The Neolithic migration virtually wiped out or replaced the older population both in Africa and Europe to as far as India.
Keep in mind what you are seeing is a select few SNPs being compared. If the analysis covered the entire genome it will be very clear.
That is why we need more independent labs and analysts.
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I am not into personal opinions without out data to back it up. So some of her personal views I would take “with a pinch of salt” as my grandma used to say. But she did provide data. Her test results are her test results. The fact is she is 1000%, yes, 1000% African. Nigerians do not have a monopoly on what is an African. I know some of the brothas may disagree with me but some North Africans such as the Berbers are 100% African also. This shows up in their CODIS STR Analysis. I had to point that out to Swenet many times
Similarly Europeans do not have a monopoly on blue eyes or blond hair or even light skin.
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I think the issue for some with regards to North Africa is color than facial features, at least of the projected images of what North Africans look like.
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For sure, having never been to Africa I rely on the research data. The visuals from Hollyword and the MSM is the traditional “Arab” terrorist type. But whoever is sampled based upon the genetic data these people are as African as those south of the Sahara in fact they maybe “more” African than the Nigerians….keeping in mind E1b1b(predominant North Africa lineage) is much older than E1b1a(predominant South of the Sahara lineage).
quote:Originally posted by Thereal: I think issue for some with regards to North Africa is color than facial features, at least of the projected images of what North Africans look like.
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I am not into personal opinions without out data to back it up. So some of her personal views I would take “with a pinch of salt” as my grandma used to say. But she did provide data. Her test results are her test results. The fact is she is 1000%, yes, 1000% African. Nigerians do not have a monopoly on what is an African. I know some of the brothas may disagree with me but some North Africans such as the Berbers are 100% African also. This shows up in their CODIS STR Analysis. I had to point that out to Swenet many times
Similarly Europeans do not have a monopoly on blue eyes or blond hair or even light skin.
I don't disagree. I might do a vlog on how Africa produced whiteish people.
Posts: 1254 | From: howdy | Registered: Mar 2014
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quote:Originally posted by Forty2Tribes: I don't disagree. I might do a vlog on how Africa produced whiteish people. [/QB]
Name an indigenous African ethnic group, one as specific as possible, that is an example of Afro-whites
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I guess you did not look at the video? Is she “afro-white”? Are some Berbers Afro-White? As we said. We don’t have visuals of what a person carrying E1b1b looks like. Hitler carried E1b1b didn’t he. If these researchers took pictures of Berbers carrying E1b1b with African/”Negro” CODIS STR some maybe “afro-Whites”. Didn’t Sergi state that the “Ref(sp?)” Berbers who are blonds with blue eyes are indigenous Africans?
Keep in mind Sergi was the one who started me off on this Trek. Now the genetic data I am dissecting has proved him correct.
The only thing Sergi got wrong was maybe the timeline. He said the “Asians” replaced the EurAfricans in early Ancient Greece. But it was maybe the reverse. The EurAfricans replaced or met the “Asians” in Greece and went on to develop ancient clasical Greece.
quote:Originally posted by the lioness,:
quote:Originally posted by Forty2Tribes: I don't disagree. I might do a vlog on how Africa produced whiteish people.
Name an indigenous African ethnic group, one as specific as possible, that is an example of Afro-whites [/QB]
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quote:Originally posted by xyyman: [QB] I guess you did not look at the video? Is she “afro-white”? Are some Berbers Afro-White? As we said. We don’t have visuals of what a person carrying E1b1b looks like. Hitler carried E1b1b didn’t he. If these researchers took pictures of Berbers carrying E1b1b with African/”Negro” CODIS STR some maybe “afro-Whites”.
Belgian journalist Jean-Paul Mulders said he had investigated Hitler's DNA after managing to lay his hands on a serviette (table napkin) dropped by the dictator's great-nephew Alexander Stuart-Houston in New York. He said he got a second sample from an Austrian cousin of Hitler, a farmer known as Norbert H., the report said.
The DNA tests revealed a form of the Y-chromosome that is rare in Germany and the rest of Western Europe, but common among Jewish and North African groups. Experts now think that Hitler had migrant ancestors who settled in his homeland. Mulders said both the test samples had a form of genetic material known as ‘Haplopgroup E1b1b’, proving an "irrefutable link" to the Nazi leader.
A DNA test on a man in Austria has proved that he is one of the last living relatives of Nazi leader Adolf Hitler.
The 46-year-old farmer, thought to be a cousin of the former German dictator, was horrified to learn the blood of the ‘greatest criminal’ is in his veins.
But the man, tracked down by Belgian journalist Jean-Paul Mulders, is not alone.
Mr Mulders, who persuaded the man to take a mouth swab test, says there are as many as 39 others living in the remote Waldviertel region of Austria where he comes from.
The area was home to Hitler’s grandmother, Anna Schicklgruber, father Alois and mother Klara.
The journalist had previously garnered some Hitler DNA covertly by taking a serviette dropped by one of three known Hitler descendants who live on Long Island, New York.
One of them, Alexander Stuart-Houston, 61, a grand-nephew of Hitler, was trailed for seven days before the dropped the litter which Mulders said led him to the relation in Austria.
Mr Mulders doesn’t say what his relationship to Adolf Hitler was but he is probably a cousin.
Called Norbert H by the publication - not his real name – he is running in a local election for the Austrian People’s Party.
He said he had no reason to doubt the findings of chemist Ralf Vermeulen in his biotech laboratory in Zwjmaarde close to Gent where the DNA matches were made.
But he added: ‘I wish I had never done this. Hitler for me was the biggest criminal of all time - there is no argument about that.
'I did the test without really thinking and regret it now.’
Alexander Stuart-Houston (now aged 61), a grand-nephew of Hitler
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https://www.eupedia.com/europe/Haplogroup_E1b1b_Y-DNA.shtml The American actor and producer Nicolas Cage (born 1964),has been found to belong to haplogroup E1b1b-M84. His real name is Nicolas Kim Coppola, and his paternal great-grand-father emigrated to the U.S. from the South Italian town of Bernalda in Basilicata. He is the nephew of screenwriter, film director and producer Francis Ford Coppola, who shares the same haplogroup.
Sir David Attenborough (b. 1926), an English broadcaster and naturalist at the BBC explained in the Tree of Life how the Attenboroughs belonged to haplogroup E1b1b1. In 2002 he was named among the 100 Greatest Britons following a UK-wide vote. His brother is the producer, director and actor Richard Attenborough (b. 1923 - pictured), who won two Academy Awards for Gandhi in 1983.
______________________________
^^ So at minimum the above men are half African
so Africa is a white, black and brown land, nevermind Eurasia
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Here is something that may ooddle your noodles.
Do these Neo-nazis and racialist types know Hitler is part African. Lol! . He carried an African lineage.
That is why racism and racialism makes absolutely no sense. What we have today is modern Europeans controlling and having a stranglehold on the rest of humanity especially on the darker colored humans.
And they did that with lies and stealing of other people’s knowledge and ……history. The Abusir is the latest example.
How did they do it? 1. Remove the CODIS STR from the dataset 2. Preferentially select SNPs with a strong frequency in modern Near Easterners. Of course Africans will carry these preferential SNPs albeit at lower frequencies. 3. Label West Africans as the “only” Africans 4. Manipulate the data with statistics 5. Then unleash a media blitz in academia
When there is a authentic and indisputable means of verifying if the Abusir are Africans. Either through CODIS STR or uniparental markers via a haplotree
-------------------- Without data you are just another person with an opinion - Deming Posts: 12143 | From: When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable | Registered: Jun 2007
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@the lioness. what is the percentage of lineage in those people? According to the STR how many generations are they removed from the original grand parent?
quote:"Outside Europe, E1b1b is found at high frequencies in Morocco (over 80%), Somalia (80%), Ethiopia (40% to 80%), Tunisia (70%), Algeria (60%), Egypt (40%), Jordan (25%), Palestine (20%), and Lebanon (17.5%). On the European continent it has the highest concentration in Kosovo (over 45%), Albania and Montenegro (both 27%), Bulgaria (23%), Macedonia and Greece (both 21%), Cyprus (20%), Sicily (20%), South Italy (18.5%), Serbia (18%) and Romania (15%). Ashkenazi Jews have approximately 20% of E1b1b, which falls mostly under specific clades of E-M123."
Posts: 22234 | From: האם אינכם כילדי הכרית אלי בני ישראל | Registered: Nov 2010
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quote:Originally posted by Ish Geber: [QB] @the lioness. what is the percentage of lineage in those people? According to the STR how many generations are they removed from the original grand parent?
They are not removed at all Their fathers were E1b1b an unbroken line going back to the original E1b1b mutation. SNPs define haplogroups
You don't like the result so now you are trying to bring up STRs that are used to determine relatedness between individuals
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“E-M78, like its parent clade E-V68, is thought to have an African origin. Based on genetic STR variance data, Cruciani et al. (2007) suggests that this subclade originated in "Northeastern Africa", which in the study refers specifically to the region of Egypt and Libya.[5]
Prior to Cruciani et al. (2007), Semino et al. (2004) had proposed a place of origin for E-M78 further south in East Africa. This was because of the high frequency and diversity of E-M78 lineages in the region of Ethiopia. However, Cruciani et al. (2007) were able to study more data, and concluded that the E-M78 lineages in the Horn of Africa were dominated by relatively recent branches (see E-V32 below). They concluded that the region of Egypt was the likely place of origin of E-M78 based on "the peripheral geographic distribution of the most derived subhaplogroups with respect to northeastern Africa, as well as the results of quantitative analysis of UEP and microsatellite diversity".
Cruciani et al. (2007) also note this as evidence for "a corridor for bidirectional migrations" between Northeast Africa (Egypt and Libya in their data) on the one hand and East Africa on the other. Because Cruciani et al. (2007) also proposed that E-M35, the parent clade of E-M78, originated in East Africa during the paleolithic and subsequently spread to the region of Egypt. E-M78 in East Africa, is therefore the result of a back migration. The authors believe there were "at least 2 episodes between 23.9–17.3 ky and 18.0–5.9 ky ago".
Another probable migration to the south from Egypt was noted by Hassan et al. (2008) based upon their survey of Sudan. Specifically E-V12 and E-V22, "might have been brought to Sudan from North Africa after the progressive desertification of the Sahara around 6,000-8,000 years ago".
Northwards from Egypt and Libya, E-M78 migrated into the Middle East, but additionally Trombetta et al. (2011) proposed that the earlier E-V68 carrying population may have migrated by sea ***directly from Africa to southwestern Europe***, because they observed cases of E-V68* (without the M78 mutation) only in Sardinia, and not in the Middle Eastern samples. Concerning E-M78, like other forms of E-V68 there is evidence of multiple routes of expansion out of an African homeland.
On the other hand, while there were apparently direct migrations from North Africa to Iberia and Southern Italy (of people carrying E-V68*, E-V12, E-V22, and E-V65), the majority of E-M78 lineages found in Europe belong to the E-V13 subclade which appears to have entered Europe at some time undetermined from the Near East, where it apparently originated, via the Balkans.
Coming to similar conclusions as the Cruciani and Trombetta team, Battaglia et al. (2008), writing prior to the discovery of E-V68, describe Egypt as "a hub for the distribution of the various geographically localized M78-related sub-clades" and, based on archaeological data, they propose that the point of origin of E-M78 (as opposed to later dispersals from Egypt) may have been in a refugium which "existed on the border of present-day Sudan and Egypt, near Lake Nubia, until the onset of a humid phase around 8500 BC. The northward-moving rainfall belts during this period could have also spurred a rapid migration of Mesolithic foragers northwards in Africa, the Levant and ultimately onwards to Asia Minor and Europe, where they each eventually differentiated into their regionally distinctive branches".
The division of E-V68 into sub-clades such as E-V12, E-V13, etc. has largely been the work of an Italian team including Fulvio Cruciani, Beniamino Trombetta, Rosario Scozzari and others. They started on the basis of STR studies in 2004, and then in 2006 they announced the discoveries of single nucleotide polymorphism (SNP) mutations which could define most of the main branches with better clarity, which was then discussed further in 2007.[2][6][7] These articles were the basis of the updated phylogenies found in Karafet (2008), and ISOGG, which is in turn the basis of the phylogeny given below.”
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quote:Originally posted by Ish Geber: [QB] @the lioness. what is the percentage of lineage in those people? According to the STR how many generations are they removed from the original grand parent?
They are not removed at all Their fathers were E1b1b an unbroken line going back to the original E1b1b mutation. SNPs define haplogroups
You don't like the result so now you are trying to bring up STRs that are used to determine relatedness between individuals
So you are telling us that they are 100% E1b1b? Do you know how irrational that sounds? Why is it they give estimated times based in STRs in genetic studies, as was posted by XYMan.
It has nothing to do with me liking results, it has to do with you not understanding the question.
quote: "Genetic genealogy works by studying the sequences of repeating nucleotide (the base components of DNA) patterns on the Y chromosome known as short tandem repeats (STRs). Each STR is considered a separate marker for potential genetic matching because the number of times it is repeated will be the same for related males. For example, a person may have one STR sequence that repeats 12 times, another 11 times, a third 17 times and so on. If another male has a Y chromosome with a high percentage of the same STRs, it is considered likely that they share a common ancestor. Accurately counting the number of repeats is a tricky task and the source of much of the error in genetic genealogy tests, causing genealogists to make incorrect matches or miss family connections altogether."
quote:Originally posted by Ish Geber: So you are telling us that they are 100% E1b1b? Do you know how irrational that sounds? Why is it they give estimated times based in STRs in genetic studies.
Yes 100% That is how SNP YDNA haplogroups work, you only have one paternal haplogroup
when you see the frequency of a haplogroup in particular country say 12%
it means 12 people out of that 100 are 100% of that haplogroup
STRs are a different part of the genome and they are good for matching living or recent individuals in families but not the deep ancestry
If you are interested in your ancestry that goes beyond where traditional paper trails end, you should focus on SNP testing. If, however, your primary interest is in the most recent generations of your family history (1 to 15), testing additional STR markers is a good investment.
SNPs offer a definitive answer to a potential relationship. When one person is positive (derived) for an SNP and the other person is negative (ancestral) for the same SNP, they are not related in genealogical times. On the other hand, if both men have matching SNP results, their STR (short tandem repeat) marker results determine how recently they are related.
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quote:Originally posted by Ish Geber: So you are telling us that they are 100% E1b1b? Do you know how irrational that sounds? Why is it they give estimated times based in STRs in genetic studies.
Yes 100% That is how SNP YDNA haplogroups work, you only have one paternal haplogroup
when you see the frequency of a haplogroup in particular country say 12%
it means 12 people out of that 100 are 100% of that haplogroup
STRs are a different part of the genome and they are good for matching living or recent individuals in families but not the deep ancestry
If you are interested in your ancestry that goes beyond where traditional paper trails end, you should focus on SNP testing. If, however, your primary interest is in the most recent generations of your family history (1 to 15), testing additional STR markers is a good investment.
SNPs offer a definitive answer to a potential relationship. When one person is positive (derived) for an SNP and the other person is negative (ancestral) for the same SNP, they are not related in genealogical times. On the other hand, if both men have matching SNP results, their STR (short tandem repeat) marker results determine how recently they are related.
?
Something is off with your logic. If they are 100% E1b1b, how is it possible that the people with the founder effect aren't 100% E1b1b?
quote: "Outside Europe, E1b1b is found at high frequencies in Morocco (over 80%), Somalia (80%), Ethiopia (40% to 80%), Tunisia (70%), Algeria (60%), Egypt (40%), Jordan (25%), Palestine (20%), and Lebanon (17.5%). On the European continent it has the highest concentration in Kosovo (over 45%), Albania and Montenegro (both 27%), Bulgaria (23%), Macedonia and Greece (both 21%), Cyprus (20%), Sicily (20%), South Italy (18.5%), Serbia (18%) and Romania (15%). Ashkenazi Jews have approximately 20% of E1b1b, which falls mostly under specific clades of E-M123."
quote: Founder effect is a phenomenon in the work that we do that refers to the migration of a small group of people from a larger population to go settle in another environment. And they carry along with them a subset of genetic information that existed in the larger population. And because of that, carrying the subset, they actually reduce the amount of genetic variation that exists within a new population now. And as a result of that, they may emphasize certain phenotypes or certain genes, and all this may be deemphasized. So a founder effect can sometimes impact a population in such a way that they may have less of a particular type of gene or more of a particular type of gene. And it can change what we call phenotype, which is the things that we look at like your height, you know, your weight, or having a particular disease or not having a particular disease. So in effect that is what founder effect is.
Something is off with your logic. If they are 100% E1b1b, how is it possible that the people with the founder effect aren't 100% E1b1b?
It's unnecessary for me to use logic since this haplogroups 101
Your problem is indeed that you are stuck at haplogroups 101.
You are trying to tell us the joke that those people had/ have no admixtures, but were/ are solely 100% E1b1b. And that in no point in time this can be traced back. That claim is utter nonsense and trickbag, because when it comes to Africans you always do the back migration timing thing.
Posts: 22234 | From: האם אינכם כילדי הכרית אלי בני ישראל | Registered: Nov 2010
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Objectives: We investigated the genetic history of southern African populations with a special focus on their paternal history. We reexamined previous claims that the Y-chromosome haplogroup E1b1b (E-M293) was brought to southern Africa by pastoralists from eastern Africa, and investigated patterns of sex-biased gene flow in southern Africa.
Materials and methods: We analyzed previously published complete mtDNA genome sequences and 900 kb of NRY sequences from 23 populations from Namibia, Botswana, and Zambia, as well as haplogroup frequencies from a large sample of southern African populations and 23 newly genotyped Y-linked STR loci for samples assigned to haplogroup E1b1b.
Results: Our results support an eastern African origin for Y-chromosome haplogroup E1b1b (EM293); however, its current distribution in southern Africa is not strongly associated with pastoralism, suggesting more complex demographic events and/or changes in subsistence practices in this region. The Bantu expansion in southern Africa had a notable genetic impact and was probably a rapid, male-dominated expansion. Our finding of a significant increase in the intensity of the sex-biased gene flow from north to south may reflect changes in the social dynamics between Khoisan and Bantu groups over time.
Conclusions: Our study shows that the population history of southern Africa has been complex, with different immigrating groups mixing to different degrees with the autochthonous populations. The Bantu expansion led to heavily sex-biased admixture as a result of interactions between Khoisan females and Bantu males, with a geographic gradient which may reflect changes in the social dynamics between Khoisan and Bantu groups over time.
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