posted
I am a black female and I'm engaged to an egyptian man. I have a few questions. My first question is what are the requirements for marrying in Egypt. I have read on this site about the Orfi marriage. We are NOT doing that. We are getting married at the Ministry of Justice. But, I don't know the requirements. Also, since we are both christians I know there is no divorce in egypt. We will live here in America. What are some of the things I should be aware of while I'm there. I plan to be there for about two weeks. And then he is planning on following me here to America. Your insight would be helpful. Thanks Laura or anyone that can help us...my fiancee has not fulfilled his military obligations...if I go there and marry him will he still have to go to the military?? Will this prevent us from marrying? I researched and found out that if we marry before then he won't have to go. PLEASE HELP!!!
[This message has been edited by enalesi (edited 13 November 2003).]
Posts: 16 | From: america | Registered: Nov 2003
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posted
Dear Enalesi, you can find any infos for your marriage on the website from your embassy. good luck from aischa with love
quote:Originally posted by enalesi: I am a black female and I'm engaged to an egyptian man. I have a few questions. My first question is what are the requirements for marrying in Egypt. I have read on this site about the Orfi marriage. We are NOT doing that. We are getting married at the Ministry of Justice. But, I don't know the requirements. Also, since we are both christians I know there is no divorce in egypt. We will live here in America. What are some of the things I should be aware of while I'm there. I plan to be there for about two weeks. And then he is planning on following me here to America. Your insight would be helpful. Thanks
I am a bit confused here. If you are going to be married at the ministry of Justice why would it be impossible to get a divorce? It is less possible in the coptic church but there are ways out like if the marriage has not been consumated and such. And if you want a coptic marriage you should get baptized and become coptic too. If that is the case you should prepare yourself to take along all the necessary papers (ask you're dhtb) or did I miss something here?:-)
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Demiana, thanks for your reply. Yes you missed something but, that could well be because I didn't state that I understand in Egypt there is no divorce between christians in Egypt. We are not living in Egypt..we will live here in America. I am not planning on him divorcing me or me divorcing him. I was just stating that I am aware of this. That's all. And thank you so much Aischa for your information. I have read that info as well. Since I have been researching and reading information from this site..I was wondering if anyone could give me knowledge from their experiences. If they had married an Egyptian and what entailed during the course of their journey. Once again..thank you for your replies. Posts: 16 | From: america | Registered: Nov 2003
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Yes Aaliyah....I know this. But thanks for your reply as well. If anyone else can please share there experiences with me I would really apprieciate it. Thanks
Posts: 16 | From: america | Registered: Nov 2003
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quote:Originally posted by enalesi: We are not living in Egypt..we will live here in America.
I just want to ask, has he been to America yet? Are you thinking that getting married is his ticket to America? If so, don't rush into this. There are SOOOOOOO many Egyptian men here waiting to get a visa to America to be with their wives that did that exact thing. They assumed getting married was the only thing they had to do and America would grant them the visa. It doesn't work that easy. If you really are in love, then I suggest you look long and hard at what life in Egypt will be like for you incase America never lets him come.
If he has a visa already, then consider getting married in America where the rules are easier to understand and will apply to you when you are living there.... not that the Coptic rules don't apply, but with the American marriage license, at least you understand the rules.
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Good Luck with your marriage plans, you should find most of the information you require about marriage on your embassy website.
Like Debbie I am concerned that you think he can follow you to America easily. I think you should make plans to live in Egypt for a few years. Not only is it likely to take some time to get a visa but you will also get a much better understanding of him and his culture by doing so.
I live here and love it. Personally having also lived previously with an Arab in the Uk I would not advise anyone to expect an arab to be happy outside of his native land.
------------------ UK Co-owner of www.toursinluxor.co.uk Accommodation and Tours in Luxor
posted
Thank you Debbie for your reply. First let me say that it is me that does not want to live in Egypt...I've researched extensively about women living in Egypt. I DO NOT want to live in Egypt..but, if that is what I have to do I will do just that. I am not marrying this man just so he can come to America. I am marrying him because I love him and he loves me. Not that I have to justify anything for anyone but, to make my situation a little more clearer. He and I are not "playing" with one another. I have met his entire family(they don't want to come to America). For the past year and three months he and I have been corresponding with one another. He has sent many presents and many letters. He has been there for me emotionally as well as finacially as well as I have been for him. This is a man that watches me sleep and writes to me while I'm sleeping and he is watching me. This is a man when I needed money and didn't tell him about it.. not only was he extremely upset about this but, sent the money while he was "fussing" at me. *(He is NOT rich by any means.) Nor am I. And No...he has never been to America just as I have never been out of the country. We are in love plain and simple. I have an appointment with a lawyer to find out what needs to be done. It is me that wants to know about other peoples' experiences...so that I can have an idea about what I am facing. Once again thank you for your reply. Once again if someone can tell me their experience about marrying an egyptian (male or female) I would really apprieciate it. Thank you
Posts: 16 | From: america | Registered: Nov 2003
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I copied below the information from the US Embassy site here in Egypt concerning marriage requirements. The only thing I would add to this is be sure and have passport size photos (color) as they are put on your marriage certificate. When you go to the Embassy to get permission to marry here they will take you aside from your fiance and start asking you very personal questions as to how you met him and why you want to marry him. Be prepared for this as there is quite a bit of fraud going on as to regards to Egyptians marrying foreingers and they are just looking out for your best interest though they may seem very very nosy about the whole thing.
Good Luck and Best wishes on your upcomoing marriage Laura
Bureau of Consular Affairs The only legal marriage in Egypt is a civil ceremony performed at the local marriage court, which is in accordance with Islamic practice. Persons wishing a religious ceremony may arrange for one separately, but it is the civil ceremony that establishes the legality of the marriage. It is possible for foreigners to marry in Egypt.
The following documents are required:
1. Proof of identity (a passport).
2. Proof of termination of any previous marriages. The original or certified copy of the divorce decree or death certificate must be authenticated at an Egyptian Embassy or Consulate in the United States and the Ministry of Foreign Affairs in Cairo. Alternatively, the divorce decree can be authenticated by the Secretary of State of the state where the decree was issued. This is then authenticated by the Department of State, Authentications Division, Room 2815 NS, Washington, D.C. 20520. Failure to have the divorce decree authenticated in the U.S. can lead to long delays. (see paragragh 5 regarding translations of documents.)
3. Sworn statements of the parties involved that they are free to marry, and that they are of the Moslem, Christian, or Jewish faith. Interfaith marriages are permitted except in the case of a Moslem woman and a non-Moslem man.
4. A no-objection statement from the parties' Embassies. NOTE: This is a formality required by the Egyptian government. It does not guarantee that the U.S. Embassy will issue an immigrant visa to an alien spouse.
Items 3 and 4 are included in one document. The blank form is available from the Consular Section of the U.S. Embassy in Cairo (Sunday through Thursday, 8:00 a.m. to 12:00 noon). This document must be notarized by a U.S. Consul. (Notarial fees are listed on the Fees for Selected Consular Services page.) It must then be certified at the Egyptian Ministry of Foreign Affairs along with the proof of termination of any previous marriages.
5. Forms and questionnaires to be completed at the marriage court. These can only be obtained on the spot on the wedding day or the day before. Applicants should have original versions and photocopies of all documents, as well as notarized Arabic translations for all documents not in the Arabic language. (Translations should be done and certified by the Egyptian Embassy or Consulates in the U.S. or the Egyptian Ministry of Justice in Cairo.)
Any two male witnesses with identification documents (passport or I.D. card) must be present to sign the marriage documents. It might be better to have your own witnesses, such as a travel agent or a friend.
A routine physical performed by an Egyptian doctor is sometimes required.
In addition to the notarial fee, fees to complete the marriage at the Ministry of Justice:
If both parties are Moslems, the fee is two percent of the dowry (not less than 40LE).
If both parties are Christians, a dowry is not required, and they will pay only 40-45LE.
Additional fees:
Translation fees, plus authentication fees if required.
The marriage certificate is recognized as a legal document in the United States and many other countries.
NOTE
To use the marriage certificate in the U.S., it should be translated into English by the Egyptian Ministry of Justice, authenticated by the Egyptian Ministry of Foreign Affairs and certified by a U.S. Consul.
Ministry of Foreign Affairs: Gameit el Dowal el Arabia Street, Mohandessin, Giza; Ahmed Said Street, Abbassia; or Sabak Street next to the Maryland Gardens in Heliopolis.
Civil Marriage Registration Office: Ministry of Justice Annex (Office of Marriage of Foreigners), 4th floor, Lazoughly Square, Abdin, Cairo. Open Saturday to Wednesday from 9:00 a.m. - 1:00 p.m. and 3:00 p.m. to 5:00 p.m.; Thursday from 9:00 a.m. - 1:00 p.m.
Ministry of Justice's translation office: Ministry of Justice Building, 13th floor, Lazoughly Square, Abdin, Cairo.
** It will take at least two business days for a marriage certificate to be issued. This does not include translation.
** Marriage certificates should be picked up in person.
Posts: 3291 | From: I DO believe in Karma! | Registered: Apr 2002
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Laura THANK YOU SO MUCH!!!!!!!!!! THANK YOU!!!! THANK YOU!!!!! THANK YOU...REALLY WE BOTH THANK YOU!!!! THANK YOU!!!! This information that you have given us..when he and I were researching...we DID NOT see this information. We both know it will be hard for us but at least now we have more vital information to help us. Once again. THANK YOU LAURA for helping us. May God bless you!!!
Posts: 16 | From: america | Registered: Nov 2003
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Laura if you can please tell us how much does it cost to have the forms translated and authenticated? Once again we both thank you! :-D
Posts: 16 | From: america | Registered: Nov 2003
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quote:Originally posted by enalesi: Laura THANK YOU SO MUCH!!!!!!!!!! THANK YOU!!!! THANK YOU!!!!! THANK YOU...REALLY WE BOTH THANK YOU!!!! THANK YOU!!!! This information that you have given us..when he and I were researching...we DID NOT see this information. We both know it will be hard for us but at least now we have more vital information to help us. Once again. THANK YOU LAURA for helping us. May God bless you!!!
laughing...Enalesi you're VERY VERY welcome Pleasure was all mine Here is the consular website in Egypt that I got this information from, it also has information about visas and other American citizen services. http://www.usembassy.egnet.net/consular.htm
Laura
Posts: 3291 | From: I DO believe in Karma! | Registered: Apr 2002
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quote:Originally posted by enalesi: Laura if you can please tell us how much does it cost to have the forms translated and authenticated? Once again we both thank you! :-D
Enalesi,
I think the translation was about 200 or 300 Egyptian pounds, not sure as my husband took care of all of this without me present since I don't speak arabic, I will check with him later on this and the Embassy fees amounted to about $50 USD if I am not mistaken. The embassy will give you a list of "authorized" translators which are the only accepted ones.
Laura
Posts: 3291 | From: I DO believe in Karma! | Registered: Apr 2002
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Thank you Rebecca for your reply. Rebecca since you have been in my situation please please e-mail me at ennalesi_me@yahoo.com there is so much I need to know..I'm assumming you are American? Do you live there in Egypt or do you live here in America? There are alot of questions that maybe you can answer for us. Thank you Rebecca
Posts: 16 | From: america | Registered: Nov 2003
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hi i found some where u could ask post ur questions at amoranos@masrawy.com and after 24 hours u get the answers 2 marriage things.
Posts: 6 | From: spain | Registered: Nov 2003
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THANKS SO MUCH...ALL THE PEOPLE THAT HAVE HELPED US AND NOT JUDGED US....THANK YOU SO MUCH WE REALLY APPRIECIATE IT. IT'S VERY HARD WHEN WE DON'T KNOW THINGS AND TO COME TO COMPLETE STRANGERS WHO GIVE THEIR KMOWLEDGE WILLINGLY IT'S JUST TOUCHING....AND YES I AM CRYING LOL BUT FROM HAPPINESS...BECAUSE NOT ALL PEOPLE ARE OUT TO GET YOU OR MISTREAT YOU. THANK YOU ALL SO MUCH!!!! THANK YOU!!!
Posts: 16 | From: america | Registered: Nov 2003
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I will tell you what happened to us. We married in Amsterdam (wanted to in my parents village but that is another story), but at the request of my dh's parents we persponed the church-wedding til we got to Egypt. Unfortunately our son was born in the meantime and that made a priest joke to the parents of my husband. That made my husband mad, caus he had tried to give to everyone what pleased them and came out criticised and obstructed. On top of that I was baptized in Amsterdam and when we went to Egypt the priest overthere wanted a signed paper from our parish priest that we were not married in our own church (as some obviously do to avoid being denied a church-wedding after a divorce). They appointed some priests to attend to these international weddings and when we were in Egypt they were all gone to some international meeting. No way we could get married then! And never did since!LOL
Our priest in Amsterdam does take his time to be convinced that you are really serious, since so many new brides were never seen in church again! You have to take lessons first. You will need brandnew underwear to wear when you will go into the water (it will be heated). Maybe you want new clothes to wear after it. You need something to give to the participants of the service. In Egypt they usually throw sweets in the crowd or behind the baptising party (after the baptism they will show you around the church 3 times after a group of musicmaking priests while everyone is cheering). In Amsterdam they can hand out white lillies at the door with little cards of saints, like that. You will need a baptismname, one of the saints. My husband was not overly generous in telling me these things so I had to found out at the stand! Gratefully some of my dh's nieces were as good as to take some sweets to throw at the baptism of our children, thats when I found out. You need a godfather, probably you're dhtb. When you're children get baptised you need to stress that you are the one that is giving them the religious upbringing (that is the mother in general). My first child had my MIL answering for me, no-one asked me but it occured as very peculiar to me and I quickly started to answer the words she did! And insisted on answering myself the next time. You're husband can pay for it all!LOL
quote:Originally posted by enalesi: I am a black female and I'm engaged to an egyptian man. I have a few questions. My first question is what are the requirements for marrying in Egypt. I have read on this site about the Orfi marriage. We are NOT doing that. We are getting married at the Ministry of Justice. But, I don't know the requirements. Also, since we are both christians I know there is no divorce in egypt. We will live here in America. What are some of the things I should be aware of while I'm there. I plan to be there for about two weeks. And then he is planning on following me here to America. Your insight would be helpful. Thanks Laura or anyone that can help us...my fiancee has not fulfilled his military obligations...if I go there and marry him will he still have to go to the military?? Will this prevent us from marrying? I researched and found out that if we marry before then he won't have to go. PLEASE HELP!!!
[This message has been edited by enalesi (edited 13 November 2003).]
enalesi, I too am black female who wants to know what is the process for marrying an egyptian man. Have you done it and what, if any, problems did you face? Please help me; I am serious and would appreciate any advice you could give. Thank you
Posts: 3 | From: austin, texas, united states | Registered: Sep 2005
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Laura, You are a fount of information! Thank you, I hadn't the slightest idea of where to begin; after scrolling down here trying to find my post, I ran across all of your responses and they are the answers to questions I hadn't even begun to contemplate Thank you again.
Posts: 3 | From: austin, texas, united states | Registered: Sep 2005
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posted
On my flight back to America from Egypt a few weeks ago I was sitting next to an American woman that was in the same situation as you. She had never left America and she had met an Egyptian man through the internet and she went to Egypt to get married to him. She also stayed with him in Alex for about 2 months so they could get to know each other better because their age difference was immense. She was 45 and he was 25. They married as soon as she arrived in Egypt and the whole process took about 1 full day. She mentioned that it was'nt difficult however, it was a lot of running around to different locations in Cairo. You should at least try staying there for one month if you can. Within this time frame you can get an understanding about his culture, family and the status of the women there.
You are wise to know that Egypt is not a female friendly place. Many women will tell you that it's the perfect land for women, with full equality etc. etc., but really it's not. Being a Westerner it's much too difficult to live there when you really don't have to. I've been there twice already for several months at a time and I still could never call it home. Plus, they are really racist. I'm triracial, (Hispanic, Asian and Black) However, I look S.East Asian. Many guys would blurt out "japanese" and point there finger like I was some zoo animal. Ignorance is too prevalent over there.
As for bringing him here to America, do you have an immigration lawyer that you will be using? It's take quite a bit of time if you are doing the immigration papers on your own. The process is much more quicker if you use a lawyer and they charge about $2,000 for the whole process.
Good luck!
quote:Originally posted by enalesi: THANKS SO MUCH...ALL THE PEOPLE THAT HAVE HELPED US AND NOT JUDGED US....THANK YOU SO MUCH WE REALLY APPRIECIATE IT. IT'S VERY HARD WHEN WE DON'T KNOW THINGS AND TO COME TO COMPLETE STRANGERS WHO GIVE THEIR KMOWLEDGE WILLINGLY IT'S JUST TOUCHING....AND YES I AM CRYING LOL BUT FROM HAPPINESS...BECAUSE NOT ALL PEOPLE ARE OUT TO GET YOU OR MISTREAT YOU. THANK YOU ALL SO MUCH!!!! THANK YOU!!!
posted
Just the last one I think as you have to prove that you have been divorced for at least three months (this is due to Islamic law and also Egyptian law). But you should check with your embassy in Cairo, not rely on my information.
By the way, this thread is two years old, so i think enalesi may have made her decision by now!
[This message has been edited by newcomer (edited 14 September 2005).]
posted
I finally got in touch with a friendly and helpful egyptian at the embassy who told me that final judgements on EACH divorse need to be authenticated and as far as the islamic rule of "IDDA" is for egyptians only. I made sure of this today---even if you are muslim it doesnt pertain to you if you arent egyptian!
quote:Originally posted by newcomer: Just the last one I think as you have to prove that you have been divorced for at least three months (this is due to Islamic law and also Egyptian law). But you should check with your embassy in Cairo, not rely on my information.
By the way, this thread is two years old, so i think enalesi may have made her decision by now!
[This message has been edited by newcomer (edited 14 September 2005).]
quote:Originally posted by Paint Me As I Am: [QUOTE]Originally posted by Samia: [b] Why are we digging up old threads again???
............................................. hey samia, anyways, i think someone was bored and felt compelled to dig up... ......take care Samia----Jannah
[/B][/QUOTE] Am new to this site, all this information is NEW to me and I am about to take this step; I needed to know about what it entailed...
Posts: 3 | From: austin, texas, united states | Registered: Sep 2005
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quote:Originally posted by nerminehassan101: [QUOTE]Originally posted by Paint Me As I Am: [b] [QUOTE]Originally posted by Samia: [b] Why are we digging up old threads again???
............................................. hey samia, anyways, i think someone was bored and felt compelled to dig up... ......take care Samia----Jannah
[/B][/QUOTE] Am new to this site, all this information is NEW to me and I am about to take this step; I needed to know about what it entailed...[/B][/QUOTE]
What would you like to know? Or did you post a question somewhere else....?
Welcome to the boards.
Posts: 8794 | From: 01-20-09 The End of an Error | Registered: Dec 2004
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posted
Hi Nerminehassan101: I am in your same boat. May I please ask your age/location? Also what is his age? Perhaps we can go through this process together.
quote:Originally posted by nerminehassan101: enalesi, I too am black female who wants to know what is the process for marrying an egyptian man. Have you done it and what, if any, problems did you face? Please help me; I am serious and would appreciate any advice you could give. Thank you
posted
so how does this story end, Did you get your Prince? I hope so. I guess there is a long line of black women waiting to go to egypt to get their husband. I too met someone on the internet who seems so sincere. He never ask me to go to Egypt though. I decided to apply to the American Univeristy of Cairo. I plan to attend a confrence in July. He and I talk almost everyday, and since I plan to make the confrence, we decided to meet. We talk about marraige and but he wants me in Egypt with him. I am ok with that. But, I have 3 children from a previous marraige. So what is the latest on this story? I plan to go see him either next month, or the summer. Is this normal for men to court potential mates over the internet?
Posts: 478 | From: USA | Registered: Feb 2006
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quote:Originally posted by Khadija_Diagne: so how does this story end, Did you get your Prince? I hope so. I guess there is a long line of black women waiting to go to egypt to get their husband. I too met someone on the internet who seems so sincere. He never ask me to go to Egypt though. I decided to apply to the American Univeristy of Cairo. I plan to attend a confrence in July. He and I talk almost everyday, and since I plan to make the confrence, we decided to meet. We talk about marraige and but he wants me in Egypt with him. I am ok with that. But, I have 3 children from a previous marraige. So what is the latest on this story? I plan to go see him either next month, or the summer. Is this normal for men to court potential mates over the internet?
How would your children feel about living in Egypt, having a pharoah for a step-dad?
Posts: 5744 | From: Minneapolis, Mn USA | Registered: Mar 2004
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of course I talk to them first. We discuss egypt alot. They are well aware of difference in culture and status. We have decided to visit, first, of course. If they are ok, then I will consider the move. If not, then we will have to make some other arragments. As far as having a "pharoah" for a step-dad, that shouldn't be an issue, but I will ask them, just to make sure.
Posts: 478 | From: USA | Registered: Feb 2006
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I would say that your biggest consideration should be your children, because as non-Egyptians they wouldn't be able to go to Egyptian government schools. They would have to go to private schools and that is not cheap, especially if you have 3 of them. If you are intending to be a student while you are here and therefore not earning, you will need to discuss whether their schooling can be afforded?
Posts: 4576 | From: Cairo | Registered: Jun 2002
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Good luck to you! Hope you have a great trip and that it turns out everything you want it to be. Let me know how you get on when you come back. Was he all you thought he would be? What did you think to Egypt, I like a good love story. Take care
Posts: 288 | From: UK | Registered: Feb 2004
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i have been told of some of the issues, although, I really dont understand this whole immigration thing. I would be willing to stay in egypt via AUC (see my post under research assistant). I am hoping to have all this figured out soon.
Posts: 478 | From: USA | Registered: Feb 2006
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it's partly the immigration thing but mostly the irrational fears that have developed in the U.S. that you will be up against..i, too, will be attempting to deal with it in the next year..I will be patient..and keep going to egypt in the meantime..when i can afford it..
-------------------- life life long, for it is short...pandora Posts: 98 | From: california | Registered: Feb 2006
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Pleasure was all mine 
Why are we digging up old threads again???
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