posted
Hi, I am new to this forum. I am aN American woman living in an European country since I was 22..moved here(Europe) 16 years ago. Recently, about three months ago I came in contact with a young Egyptian man via a popular Canadian dating site. He was going to be visiting the country I am living in to take part in a recruiting procedure for a new job and was looking to make new friends and find someone nice to show him around. he stated in his profile that he was intially looking for friendship but was open to more...apparently, because his profile is listed in three different sections--dating, relationship and intimate. The difference in cultures and background caused me to feel some caution but because he seemed to be a nice guy and because I knew that the few days that we would share togther most likely would be our first and last encounter. We started chatting, every now and then at first and gradually the frequency and intensity of our conversations increased from a chat every few days to chatting almost everyday and for a few hours at a time. His intellect, knowledge, sense of humour and the respectful manner in which he behaved towards me impressed me to no limit. He is only 24 years old but seems wise beyond his years and very sincere. I am going thru a divorce at the moment and somehow, I don't remember exactly how or what but we were discussing this my friend mentioned (or I asked) that he was married but seperated from his wife. We had be chatting for a few weeks now and I was under the impression that he was single because of his age I think and also because he listed himself as 'unattached' in his profile. Instantly, red lights started to flash in my head---it felt weird because he had 'hidden' this from me or you could also say neglected to mention it. He explained the situation with his marriage and assured me that there was little chance that they would be getting back together. Again, the thoughts of our encounter being no more than temporary were telling me that it was ok, after all I was also still legally married--would be a bit hypocritical of me to turn him down because of this. We proceeded to chat and were getting emotionally close--we shared intimate aspects of our lives and I'm not referring to sexual ones---actually the topic of sex only came up about once or twice in our conversations and 99% procent of these conversations on sex were general--talks on morals and religion and customs----only towards his arriving here did we disclose(quite innocently, I might add) our attraction and desire for each other. I was really looking forward to meeting this wonderful, intelligent, eloquent Egyptian gentleman...I was counting the days to his arrival and I know that he was anxious to meet me as well. We met, and hit it off instantly...we were relaxed and ourselves...the online chemistry existed offline as well, he felt to be the very same person in cyber as in real-time. In person he carried himself very repectful and polite towrds me. He was staying at a hotle in the city but came up with me to visit me where I was staying. That same evening we kissed but after three minutes he applogized for being forward and siad that he felt as though he was forcing himself on me and said that it wasn't right even though I said that it was ok but he decided to leave to go back to his hotel. My thoughts were that he was feeling guilty---we are not married to each other. The next day we meet again, he comes up to get me and we spend the most incredible time together--talking, walking, holding hands--it felt very sweet. We get back to my room and we become physically intimate but before we go any further he tells me that we would need to get married first---he said that we needed witnesses, to obtain those he sent text messages to a few of his friends. I was thinking, ok, this is strange but this is probably some Egyptian custom, I was thinking this but had no idea of this concept and what it means. My first thought was that he needs to do this to clear his conscious. Without going into details I'll say that we shared an incredible experience. He leaves again and we meet again the next day. Only this time, no repeat---he tells me that he decided to try to work on his marriage (although he does not love his wife)and because of this it would not be right to be intimate with me. he says that he would like and was hoping to remain friends, platonic friends. At this point I am totally confused...I mean I went into this with the mindset of this being a sweet, fun but temporary thing but I really expected these few days to ours. I felt disappointed because it wans't what I had expected but also because I was starting to feel very attached to him. In his demeanor and in his eyes I could see how torn he felt--I know that he was feeling very attracted to me, I could also see that there was more there than merely physical attraction. So, again he leaves but it is I that send him on his way and at that moment I really didn't care to see him again. After having a nap and doing some thinking I decided to spend the last evening and day with him---I genuinely liked him and was having a very nice time with him--it was like we were old pals and I felt a level of respect for him for not caving into his desires (a second time) but felt confused as to his sense of timing and as to what happened to first time---how could it be ok one day and the next day not? The rest of the time we spend together--we laugh, we talk and share the most wonderful moments together and feel ourselves becoming more and more emotionally attached. We discussed our feelings of attachment he mantions again how much he regrets not meeting me before he got married, that I am the perfect woman for him and how he could fall in love with me. All the while I felt the the same attachment and had crazy thoughts of having this man coming to live in my country but on the other hand I forced myself to remain grounded and detached---what are the chances of this becoming reality? That afternoon his eyes were tearful upon saying goodbye and my feeling at that moment was that I would probably never see him again. It has been almost a week since he went back to Cairo. We chat almost every day, talk on the phone and exchange text messages. The feelings are deep and raging and I feel torn between not wanting to give up on this and facing reality's bite. He is feeling doubtful about the future of his marriage but have given me no promises for the future. He would like to be able to share time together every now and then and to in any case remain special friends. My savior is my responsibilites to my family here..if it wern't for my kids I would maybe doing something crazy like travelling to Egpyt to be with him. I had planned a short vacation to Egypt and I keep telling myself that the purpose is and will not merely to see and be with him but reading the stories on this forum has placed me in great doubt. Egypt is drawing me in, thanks to this man, my interest in this strikingly beautiful and facinating country is sparked. But at the same I don't want to feel disappointed and hurt by the temptation of being near something that I can't have. The negative stories on this forum have me also doubting the sincerity of my friend, they have me doubting my own judgement and have me weighing spoken words, expressed emotions, thoughts and actions. My rational tells me that my friend was not out to deceive me or take advantage of me---My friend himself is very well educated and from the upper class. I'm in no way rich and he actually turned down sex with me! Yet, I feel the doubt...I know that I never ever want to be second best and never the 'other' woman....my common sense tells me to let him go athough my heart wishes to hold on tightly. I think that the chances are very slim that he will get divorced, I realize this even more so now that I have taken the time to inform myself regarding the Egyptian Islamic culture. I also really don't want to be a part of some crazy love triangle.
What do you guys think?
Cheers,
S.
ps Sorry about the length of this post!
pps That thing with sms witnesses..was that some variation on an Orfi union?
S.
[This message has been edited by sirena (edited 11 July 2004).]
[This message has been edited by sirena (edited 11 July 2004).]
[This message has been edited by sirena (edited 11 July 2004).]
posted
I think you already know what we think and you, deep down, think it yourself. Otherwise you wouldn't have posted what you did. You know it is a story that has appeared on these forums before and will do again. And you know what the likely outcome is.
Time to move on
------------------ Jane Akshar UK Co-owner of www.flatsinluxor.co.uk Appartments and Tours in Luxor
posted
he cheated on his wife with you...so...what do we think about what, exactly? i don't know how many 24 year old men from your country leave their young wives for a woman they had an affair with, when that woman is an older married woman with kids...but i have a hard time imagining an affluent egyptian from a good family causing this kind of scandal.
Posts: 2182 | Registered: Oct 2002
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posted
I think that not many would do so depending on the circumstances, of course but as far as cheating goes....I'm sure that is it done on all levels regardless of wealth or background but it could be that the tendency to keep it underground is more prominant in certain societies.
As far as my query as to 'what do you guys think', this not only has my interest on a personal level but on an academic one as well. Before this I had no knowledge of Ofri and very little knowledge of Egyptian beliefs and customs surrounding marriage, sexuality and divorce.
So, enlighten me, if you will.
S.
ps Interesting that the scandal rests not in the cheating an zich but in making a calculated decision.
[This message has been edited by sirena (edited 11 July 2004).]
posted
i am sure reading here has enlightened you and prob more than you wanted.
i am no agony aunt or expert but your post said it all to me. Full of doubt and uncertaintity. Your instincts have kicked in and you would be wise to listen to them.
i am really sorry but wouldn't your prefer to know it now rahter than later (and poorer)
------------------ Jane Akshar UK Co-owner of www.flatsinluxor.co.uk Appartments and Tours in Luxor
Sirena: You seem like a very nice, warm and actually logically thinking lady. The guy charmed you and probably would (or maybe even did) a lot of other nice women. I know this irresistible flair they possess (I am married to one... ) which works to their advantage over 'beer and football/soccer game' fellows from the 'Western world'. However, the more charming the guy is (and by all means not only Egyptian) the more we should watch out for the red light alerts our common sense is blinking at us. I am not saying not to enjoy being a 'princess du jour' (it is such an aristocratic feeling after all... ), just not expecting to become the queen of his Kingdom the day after. I know it sucks (boy, do I...LOL) but reality sucks, period. My red blinkers in your situation are as follows: are you certain he is separated, not just hunting for a 'away from home for a week' fling? What is the real reason for emotionally charged emails/messages to you if he DID decide to patch up things with his wife? What is the deal with a marriage and sex if he wants to stay with his wife; have you read posts here that some men's dowry to their Egyptian wives is a visa 'into the world'? These are just my thoughts after reading your post; since you asked for advice I humbly decided to open my mouth, however not all that comes out of it must necessarily be right 100% (actually, it is right 99%. Fine, I am kidding. ) It does seem like you already know the answer in your heart; follow it, but in the direction of your own well being. I wish you ALL the best, 100% K.
[This message has been edited by Karah_Mia (edited 11 July 2004).]
He was very charming, indeed. You know, previous to this I really had no knowledge of the wooing guiles of Egyptian men. I've had negative experiences with western men as well so, to be honest I am always on my guard...whether the men be Egyptian or not. This guy is not after my money, I know that because I have none--he knows this as well. He IS well educated and from an upper class. I considered the the question of visa, true the man that marries me gsins access to two western countries, one being the US and the other a progressive north European country. I think he feelings for me are genuine regardless of whether he wants a visa or not. My head is in the right place---I would never leave to move to Egypte or continue an affair with a man who is attached to someone else. Besides, even if he would decide to come to live heree with me, I am not sure I would want this myself--I love my freedom.
It is just too bad that the beer drinking soccer watching western men don't have more of the charm of their Egytian brothers--w/o the extra wives, BTW!
S.
[This message has been edited by sirena (edited 12 July 2004).]
posted
Sirena, you can still travel to Egypt, it is a magical place after all, and unforgettable experience. Just do not wear 'form fitting' garments... I did. Good Heavens. LOL
Posts: 2238 | From: Mother Earth | Registered: Jun 2004
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) which works to their advantage over 'beer and football/soccer game' fellows from the 'Western world'. However, the more charming the guy is (and by all means not only Egyptian) the more we should watch out for the red light alerts our common sense is blinking at us. I am not saying not to enjoy being a 'princess du jour' (it is such an aristocratic feeling after all... 
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