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Author Topic: love or lie?
schatze
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on the subject of intimate relations with egyptian men, i'd like to hear your views about what happened to me.
i went to hurghada for the first time in april this year (with a friend from home) -there a met a local man and had what i considered at the time a holiday fling with him - he told me soon after we started seeing each other that he was married to an austrian (orfi marriage)who only visited him for the holidays and there were problems between them because she had not told her family about him (apparently because her family did not like black people), lied to her family as to where she was going when she took trips to see him in egypt and she would not have him going to see her in austria and she would not move to live with him in egypt - i did not bother much with all this as i did not think our fling would last beyond the holiday, especially because it was already married! - however, when i returned to england he kept texting me, declaring his feelings for me, asking me to go back, telling me that it was over with his wife etc etc - in short we maintained this relationship - although i was not planning to return to egypt at least until the end of this year (really liked the place and wanted to go back to see more of it), i decided to verify how true he was being and agreed to return in july - we had two lovely weeks, went to the sinai peninsula, really got close to each other and he really seemed very genuine in his feelings for me - in order to be together away from hurghada, we got married (orfi marriage - he ripped up the papers of the one with his austrian wife in front of me)and a few days before my return to england we went back to hurghada and stayed at his home with his family - when in hurghada he asked me to marry him properly - i said no because i am just about to embark in a 4 years of studying before i can move to egypt and, hopefully, make a decent living from running my own business - as i want to be living with my husband (not be miles away and only see each other for the holidays) i explained that i did not think it was fair to marry now because 4 years is a long time and anything can happen during them - we talked about staying friends and being business partners for when i am ready to move to egypt permanently - in this way, we could still have something together but also be free to make other relationships if that was what needed to happen to us - if we still felt the same about each other in the end, we were obviously meant to be together for real - after all, no marriage papers can be truer than the test of time - he was not entirely happy about this but seemed to understand and agreed - when i came back home he texted me for the first few days, usual amorous stuff, love, waiting for me etc etc - i daresay my replies were much the same - but in the last week everything has stopped - he has not answered my phone calls or my sms - this is highly unusual for him but i also know it is the way he behaved with his austrian wife at the end (although as far as i know he told her what the problem was and it did not include me!)- as we spent time together i got to know him a little better and i believed that he was a very honest person and would have told me if he did not want to continue a relationship with me - now i am a little confused but i know that this is likely to be me being upset about the events because i know that we are over - reading the replies posted here, someone said that a way for a westener to be considered cheap by egyptians is to sunbathe topless - when we went back to hurghada, he encouraged me to do just that - as a westener i do not have a problem with it especially because the beach was exclusively for europeans and others were doing it so i was not out of place and did not feel was offending anyone (which i am always careful not to do when i travel in foreign countries)- but there were egyptian staff and they were his friends/acquaintances - if the local mentality is as it is said, would someone who claims to love you and wants to marry you want you to be considered a whore by his own people? - no smartass answers please!

[This message has been edited by schatze (edited 03 August 2003).]


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warda_rosie
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there are guys in touristic places who have many "orfi-wives". i know a guy who is married to 7 women.
as long as you don't understand arabic you can't be sure what is going on. i know wives who have been visiting these guys' homes and have been introduced to egyptian wife thinking that girl is his sister.
i don't know how egyptian men (never seen anything like that in other countries) can be so manipulative and creative actors too.
you will find lots of stories similar to yours from different discussion boards.
when you know culture here in egypt, traditions etc it's easier for you to know what kind of man your friend is.
i advice you too keep your eyes, ears open and brains working (i know how hard it can be when you are in love). if you feel something is not right trust your feelings.
best luck for you

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Nefertiti
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Hi Schatze

I promised myself i wouldn't answer any more of these Hurghada "love stories" but i will answer yours.

Your story is pretty typical - it sounds like he was just trying to see what he could get from you. Sad but true. You were right to consider it a holiday fling in the beginning and you should have kept it that way. The story about the Austrian woman could be part true or completely true... maybe (hopefully) she uses him the way it sounds he deserves to be used!! He may have tried to get to Austria and she rightly refused him. Who knows. Him tearing up the Orfi paper means nothing!! It could have been a copy and anyway it only costs about 100LE to get another one!! Just look at that as a dramatic gesture on his part!!

Him taking you to meet his parents could mean something or nothing... depends on the individual. Most of the time the parents don't speak English so the man will just introduce you as a tourist who wanted to meet an Egyptian family. He could also have introduced you - in Arabic - as his meal ticket to your country!! Again sad, but sometimes true!!

Sunbathing topless.... unless he is a real shite and cares nothing for his country or you, there is no way he should have encouraged you to sunbathe topless! It is just not a respectable thing to do in Egypt - not even in Hurghada. The staff may be used to seeing European's doing it but that just "confirms" their low view of western women. No Egyptian man that i know would allow his wife to sunbathe topless and may even protest at her wearing a bikini. I'm not married to an Egyptian, but i have Egyptian male friends and i know quite a few westerners married to Eyptians, their husbands even get upset if the woman wears a vest on the street. I'm sorry but this was the part of your post that makes me think that the guy you met is just a shite. Plain and simple.

Was it Old Vic beach that you were sunbathing on? If it was then yeah, the women do all sorts there, but it's also full of the nastiest Egyptian men in Hurghada. And alot of the Orfi married couples live in the flats there. It's just that type of place.

No matter what you do.... don't go into business with him (i know there has been no contact anyway), but don't, don't, don't!! Unless he has a really good excuse for why he hasn't contacted you, then i would say it has something to do with the fact that Hurghada is full of European women at the moment so he is busy!

I'm sorry to be so cynical, i think it has something to do with the fact that i have been in Hurghada for long enough now. Also don't let this experience put you off of Egypt. Alot of Egyptians are really good people and there are other cities/towns which are nothing like Hurghada! Just some of the men give the rest a bad name. I haven't got time now or i would have tried to be a little less cynical and given you more positives about Egypt, but i think you should file this as a learning experience. He's a shite!!

If he does contact you again and asks to see you etc just say Fil Mish Mish - When apricots bloom


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Lucia
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Schatze,
It seems like these guys disappear without a trace when they decide they are finished with a woman. I met an Egyptian guy in Europe and have been in contact for the last 5 months. All of a sudden, his phone is no longer on I have no way of contacting him to find out what is going on. It's so frustrating because I cannot even express my anger. This treatment after saying "I love you, you're such a nice person, you're not like other girls," blah, blah, blah. He's the one who began this thing, but he's not enough of a man to end it. I did not want to think so, but I have to agree that it sounds they are all the same. Sorry...

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schatze
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well, there is further news - i had a call from his friend in Hurghada to let me know that my orfi husband had an accident diving (came up too quickly)and ended up in decompression chamber! his phone was with those who were looking after him and it was later handed over to his friend who saw my msgs and contacted me to tell me what had happened - my OH is now at home recovering from bends, still not quite able to speak but i heard from him by text today - sigh of relief to know he is ok and i think i could consider whay happened a good reason for not being in touch for the last few days - i'm still puzzled about the issue of topless sunbathing and will want to hear his reasons for encouraging me to do it when he is in a fit state to engage - by the way Nefertiti, the beach was not the one you mentionned but one out of Hurghada - only european tourists there, the egyptians are staff and, as far as i could tell, we were the only mixed couple - nonetheless, i am saddened by what i have learned about the Hurghada scene from all your responses and the extent of deceit local men go to - i find it difficult to trust my situation being so far apart and in the face of all this feedback it is more difficult to work out how genuine this man is - thank you for putting me in the picture and opening my eyes - may bore you again in future with any developments as i find it helpful to get a local perspective with some hard nailed truths rather than just the views of my friends at home who have never been to egypt and have no idea of the local culture/modus operandi
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strangelookingnegro
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Nefertiti - Are you buying the story about the diving accident?

Sorry to say we are very cynical and even a story as dramatic as that one would be one I'd be wondering about. No way to prove it one way or the other I suppose... unfortunately, and of course his response would be to question how you could question his honesty. LOL


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Adoula
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Although am very patriot to Egypt, and I already posted so many posts saying that Egyptian men are not alone, and so many people around the world doing the same in tourist areas.

Egyptians are friendly, hospitable and modest. They also have a sense of balance and moderation.

But I will comment on your story.

First U must know some points:
1- In general, most men think that single women travel alone to have a good time - not to be serious.
2- Young Egyptian men nowadays, have no chance for dating and marriage beacuse of the current economic situation.

In a conservative country like Egypt, people raised beleiving in one thing, sex is a beautiful gift from God. These almost overpowering needs for love and companionship were put in you for a purpose. God meant you to experience them, at the proper time (which is marriage).

And as the marriage age became 35 to 40 for men and almost 30 to 35 for women, they invented this Orfi marriage for this.

I mean to have sex relation without hurting God.

Did U got me, so this man was lier from the start, and I think U will never hear from him again.

Good luck with another man.

------------------
Regards
adoula777@yahoo.com


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schatze
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quote:
Originally posted by Adoula:
Although am very patriot to Egypt, and I already posted so many posts saying that Egyptian men are not alone, and so many people around the world doing the same in tourist areas.

Egyptians are friendly, hospitable and modest. They also have a sense of balance and moderation.

But I will comment on your story.

First U must know some points:
1- In general, most men think that single women travel alone to have a good time - not to be serious.
2- Young Egyptian men nowadays, have no chance for dating and marriage beacuse of the current economic situation.

In a conservative country like Egypt, people raised beleiving in one thing, sex is a beautiful gift from God. These almost overpowering needs for love and companionship were put in you for a purpose. God meant you to experience them, at the proper time (which is marriage).

And as the marriage age became 35 to 40 for men and almost 30 to 35 for women, they invented this Orfi marriage for this.

I mean to have sex relation without hurting God.

Did U got me, so this man was lier from the start, and I think U will never hear from him again.

Good luck with another man.


ok, if this is the situation and he has lied to me from the start, what do egyptian women think of the way their men behave? are they ok with their husbands shagging other women and even marrying them? what do the mothers of these men think about having their houses full of these foreign women (on a rotation system hopefully, rather than all at once); are they accepting of what their sons do and if so why if it is so against their religion? - i don't know what is going to happen to my situation, my OH does not seem (yet!) to want anything from me other than for me to move to live in egypt - but one of the many things i find difficult to reconcile myself with in our cultural differences is precisely the fact that muslims are allowed to have up to 4 wifes so if i were to end up marrying him for real and moving to live with him in egypt i fear that he would be allowed by his own culture to marry other women and there would be nothing i could do to stop that - in my culture marriages are a monogamus set up and it is not acceptable to have extra-marital relationships (although it happens nonetheless i know)- i certainly could not cope with a situation like that but by then i would have given up my job, my home and my financial security to be with him.
i have heard from him by text every day since (allegedly) he has been back home - of all the excuses he could have come up with, he would have had to be pretty stupid to make up this one, just in case it may happen for real! or is tempting faith something muslims do not believe in?? - thanx for helping me get some clarity

[This message has been edited by schatze (edited 05 August 2003).]


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strangelookingnegro
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In response to your question about wives and mothers....Yes, sadly, they do put up with it, all in the name of making life better for the family.
They really don't think that much of it. I think Nefertiti mentioned in her post that it isn't that uncommon for a wife to be introduced to a foreign woman as a sister. This can happen with or without the wife's knowledge too, as you can imagine you don't understand a thing he is saying to them in Arabic, they also don't understand a thing being said to you in English...but just as often they will be in on the scam to fleece you of whatever they can get to improve their lives.
As an example, I know one poor man in Luxor that has been married to his wife for something like 8 years now. They have 3 children and one more on the way, and his wife jokingly, but also seriously (to some extent) makes comments to the effect that he (the husband) needs to find a second foreign wife to make their life better. If you saw how they live, you'd understand where she is coming from, I think. She wouldn't loose anything if he were to marry another, she would only gain, so why would she fight it? And she knows her children would benefit from it as well, which is ultimately important to her.

So, the short answer to your question is YES, they do put up with the parade of foreign women coming through their home and the shagging, and all, if it will benefit their life in the long run.


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strangelookingnegro
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Another thing to remember when it comes to wives and mothers putting up with the foreigner coming in as a 2nd wife is that many of these women were raised in homes with more than one woman married to their father so the concept isn't that odd to them. If nothing else they have been raised in a country where it is common knowledge that this is acceptable, so again, it isn't that odd to them....not like it is to the western woman, who generally considers the idea unthinkable.
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Nefertiti
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quote:
Originally posted by Debbie:
Nefertiti - Are you buying the story about the diving accident?

Sorry to say we are very cynical and even a story as dramatic as that one would be one I'd be wondering about. No way to prove it one way or the other I suppose... unfortunately, and of course his response would be to question how you could question his honesty. LOL


Hi Debbie

His story could be true and i like it!! I may have to use that one someday!! Anyway like you said there is no way to prove it. I personally wouldn't believe him.

I was sitting with some friends yesterday talking about foriegners with Egyptian men and we were comparing the lies that you get from the men that work in the tourist industry.... Lol, there were some real funny ones!! The husband of one of my friends basically told us..."don't listen to what any of the Egyptian men that work in tourism say! They will lie to impress you" He made it clear that most Egyptian men are not the same - ones away from places like Hurghada and Sharm etc are very honest and kind. He is Egyptian.

Basically Schatze, you will do what ever you think is best no matter what we say. You really just have to trust your instincts. From what i have heard about the men that are in the Diving scene.... i would tell him to take a running jump back into the Red sea!!


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Nefertiti
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quote:
Originally posted by schatze:
ok, if this is the situation and he has lied to me from the start, what do egyptian women think of the way their men behave? are they ok with their husbands shagging other women and even marrying them? what do the mothers of these men think about having their houses full of these foreign women (on a rotation system hopefully, rather than all at once); are they accepting of what their sons do and if so why if it is so against their religion? - i don't know what is going to happen to my situation, my OH does not seem (yet!) to want anything from me other than for me to move to live in egypt - but one of the many things i find difficult to reconcile myself with in our cultural differences is precisely the fact that muslims are allowed to have up to 4 wifes so if i were to end up marrying him for real and moving to live with him in egypt i fear that he would be allowed by his own culture to marry other women and there would be nothing i could do to stop that - in my culture marriages are a monogamus set up and it is not acceptable to have extra-marital relationships (although it happens nonetheless i know)- i certainly could not cope with a situation like that but by then i would have given up my job, my home and my financial security to be with him.
i have heard from him by text every day since (allegedly) he has been back home - of all the excuses he could have come up with, he would have had to be pretty stupid to make up this one, just in case it may happen for real! or is tempting faith something muslims do not believe in?? - thanx for helping me get some clarity

[This message has been edited by schatze (edited 05 August 2003).]



I wouldn't be able to give you an opinion on what Egyptian women think of their husbands doing this.... most of the men in the tourist areas are not married to Egyptian women. They may have up to 4 foreign orfi wives, which is quite easy to do because rarely are they all in Egypt at the same time. This means he can space them out over the year.... he may also have some girlfriends that visit in between. The wives will stay in his flat and the girlfriends will stay in hotels!! If for some reason he needs a space to marry another woman... he will choose one of his wives to "divorce" - possibly by making up a lie to her about why things are not working so. I could go on and on about the strategies they use etc but i won't and believe me i'm not saying this from speculation. I have a few playboy friends and they keep me informed of the way things work!! I would rather be a friend than a victim!! There is a saying that goes "keep your friends close and keep your enemies closer!!"

Regarding what their mothers think.... many of the romeos in Hurghada are originally from other parts of Egypt so they don't live with their families. Therefore Mother will probably think they are good little boys working hard to send money home!! Also they would have too much respect for their mothers to sleep with these women in the family home. They will usually just be introduced as a tourist who wants to see how Egyptians live..... nothing wrong with that in the families eyes! Egyptians are kind people. On the other hand as Debbie explained it will be in some of the families interest to just turn a blind eye to it.

Regarding him having upto 4 wives - yes he is allowed. If you stay married to him in the Orfi way then you will have NO control over this. He can do what he likes because it isn't recognised by the Government etc. If you married him properly then you could insist that it is put into the contract he can not marry anymore without your permission etc. There is much much more to it also, but would take to long to write. My advice to you would be... if you are gonna be involved with a man that has a different religion to you then research his religion. That's if you want it to be serious - if it's just a fling then don't worry. There is a chance that if you don't get facts on his religion he may play on your ignorance and tell you things that are untrue (or twist the facts) and call it religion. At the end of the day as far as he is concerned you will never know!!

Regarding saying things that are not true and tempting fate..... some people just live for today and don't care for the future! This is regardless of religion, culture, race etc. If he wants to lie he will lie!!


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italian soul
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quote:
Originally posted by schatze:
on the subject of intimate relations with egyptian men, i'd like to hear your views about what happened to me.
i went to hurghada for the first time in april this year (with a friend from home) -there a met a local man and had what i considered at the time a holiday fling with him - he told me soon after we started seeing each other that he was married to an austrian (orfi marriage)who only visited him for the holidays and there were problems between them because she had not told her family about him (apparently because her family did not like black people), lied to her family as to where she was going when she took trips to see him in egypt and she would not have him going to see her in austria and she would not move to live with him in egypt - i did not bother much with all this as i did not think our fling would last beyond the holiday, especially because it was already married! - however, when i returned to england he kept texting me, declaring his feelings for me, asking me to go back, telling me that it was over with his wife etc etc - in short we maintained this relationship - although i was not planning to return to egypt at least until the end of this year (really liked the place and wanted to go back to see more of it), i decided to verify how true he was being and agreed to return in july - we had two lovely weeks, went to the sinai peninsula, really got close to each other and he really seemed very genuine in his feelings for me - in order to be together away from hurghada, we got married (orfi marriage - he ripped up the papers of the one with his austrian wife in front of me)and a few days before my return to england we went back to hurghada and stayed at his home with his family - when in hurghada he asked me to marry him properly - i said no because i am just about to embark in a 4 years of studying before i can move to egypt and, hopefully, make a decent living from running my own business - as i want to be living with my husband (not be miles away and only see each other for the holidays) i explained that i did not think it was fair to marry now because 4 years is a long time and anything can happen during them - we talked about staying friends and being business partners for when i am ready to move to egypt permanently - in this way, we could still have something together but also be free to make other relationships if that was what needed to happen to us - if we still felt the same about each other in the end, we were obviously meant to be together for real - after all, no marriage papers can be truer than the test of time - he was not entirely happy about this but seemed to understand and agreed - when i came back home he texted me for the first few days, usual amorous stuff, love, waiting for me etc etc - i daresay my replies were much the same - but in the last week everything has stopped - he has not answered my phone calls or my sms - this is highly unusual for him but i also know it is the way he behaved with his austrian wife at the end (although as far as i know he told her what the problem was and it did not include me!)- as we spent time together i got to know him a little better and i believed that he was a very honest person and would have told me if he did not want to continue a relationship with me - now i am a little confused but i know that this is likely to be me being upset about the events because i know that we are over - reading the replies posted here, someone said that a way for a westener to be considered cheap by egyptians is to sunbathe topless - when we went back to hurghada, he encouraged me to do just that - as a westener i do not have a problem with it especially because the beach was exclusively for europeans and others were doing it so i was not out of place and did not feel was offending anyone (which i am always careful not to do when i travel in foreign countries)- but there were egyptian staff and they were his friends/acquaintances - if the local mentality is as it is said, would someone who claims to love you and wants to marry you want you to be considered a whore by his own people? - no smartass answers please!

[This message has been edited by schatze (edited 03 August 2003).]



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italian soul
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HI SCHATZE,SORRY FOR MY ENGLISH
i have seen your message and it was like to be in front of a mirror....
i was in Hurghada for 2 times..last summer and this summer i came back a few days ago.
last summer i spent good days with a boy that was talking me about his unlikely life...i don't want boring you but i sware that he talked me about terrible family things...but i dindn't believe i just listened to him...we were just good friends and nothing happens between us because i had a boyfriend here in Italy.during the winter we send each other some sms in which he always write ... i miss you..please come back..i need a person like you...
This year i went there again...(not for him but because i really like red sea ..and also because i have some good friends there)i have seen him and i told me he was sad because he had so many problems...i was so disturbing by this victim way to do that a decided to stop to see him....after some days someone told me that he was married with a european girl(orfi marriage)and that he told me a lot of lyes just to impress me...now i am happy that nothing happened between us...but now i fall in love with another boy...he didnt' speak me about health problems..money problems..nothing!! he asked me nothing!! but he talks about properly marriage..about to go to visit his family...he dosen't want me to swim with bikini...he dosn't like me to talk jocking with his friends....he doesn't like me to dress shorts...and so ..and so...but also if i really like him so much...how can i trust him? He told me that he was a bad boy before...but now he wants to change for me...so ..i don't think to be so special ...i am not an angel...if i tell you that i trust him i tell you a lye ...but it's nice to think that someone can do it for you...
open eyes...also when you dream!!!!!

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schatze
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quote:
Originally posted by italian soul:
HI SCHATZE,SORRY FOR MY ENGLISH
i have seen your message and it was like to be in front of a mirror....
i was in Hurghada for 2 times..last summer and this summer i came back a few days ago.
last summer i spent good days with a boy that was talking me about his unlikely life...i don't want boring you but i sware that he talked me about terrible family things...but i dindn't believe i just listened to him...we were just good friends and nothing happens between us because i had a boyfriend here in Italy.during the winter we send each other some sms in which he always write ... i miss you..please come back..i need a person like you...
This year i went there again...(not for him but because i really like red sea ..and also because i have some good friends there)i have seen him and i told me he was sad because he had so many problems...i was so disturbing by this victim way to do that a decided to stop to see him....after some days someone told me that he was married with a european girl(orfi marriage)and that he told me a lot of lyes just to impress me...now i am happy that nothing happened between us...but now i fall in love with another boy...he didnt' speak me about health problems..money problems..nothing!! he asked me nothing!! but he talks about properly marriage..about to go to visit his family...he dosen't want me to swim with bikini...he dosn't like me to talk jocking with his friends....he doesn't like me to dress shorts...and so ..and so...but also if i really like him so much...how can i trust him? He told me that he was a bad boy before...but now he wants to change for me...so ..i don't think to be so special ...i am not an angel...if i tell you that i trust him i tell you a lye ...but it's nice to think that someone can do it for you...
open eyes...also when you dream!!!!!

sono italiana anche io - magari mi puoi scrivere in italiano e possiamo scambiarci notizie piu' dettagliate su questo ragazzo..in caso scopriamo che e' la stessa persona! se eri a hurghada, stavi per caso al villaggio di franco rosso? spero di sentirti presto - ciao


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Donna Maria
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quote:
Originally posted by Nefertiti:

I wouldn't be able to give you an opinion on what Egyptian women think of their husbands doing this.... most of the men in the tourist areas are not married to Egyptian women. They may have up to 4 foreign orfi wives, which is quite easy to do because rarely are they all in Egypt at the same time. This means he can space them out over the year.... he may also have some girlfriends that visit in between. The wives will stay in his flat and the girlfriends will stay in hotels!! If for some reason he needs a space to marry another woman... he will choose one of his wives to "divorce" - possibly by making up a lie to her about why things are not working so. I could go on and on about the strategies they use etc but i won't and believe me i'm not saying this from speculation. I have a few playboy friends and they keep me informed of the way things work!! I would rather be a friend than a victim!! There is a saying that goes "keep your friends close and keep your enemies closer!!"

Regarding what their mothers think.... many of the romeos in Hurghada are originally from other parts of Egypt so they don't live with their families. Therefore Mother will probably think they are good little boys working hard to send money home!! Also they would have too much respect for their mothers to sleep with these women in the family home. They will usually just be introduced as a tourist who wants to see how Egyptians live..... nothing wrong with that in the families eyes! Egyptians are kind people. On the other hand as Debbie explained it will be in some of the families interest to just turn a blind eye to it.

Regarding him having upto 4 wives - yes he is allowed. If you stay married to him in the Orfi way then you will have NO control over this. He can do what he likes because it isn't recognised by the Government etc. If you married him properly then you could insist that it is put into the contract he can not marry anymore without your permission etc. There is much much more to it also, but would take to long to write. My advice to you would be... if you are gonna be involved with a man that has a different religion to you then research his religion. That's if you want it to be serious - if it's just a fling then don't worry. There is a chance that if you don't get facts on his religion he may play on your ignorance and tell you things that are untrue (or twist the facts) and call it religion. At the end of the day as far as he is concerned you will never know!!

Regarding saying things that are not true and tempting fate..... some people just live for today and don't care for the future! This is regardless of religion, culture, race etc. If he wants to lie he will lie!!


Yes, Neferty you saw and see the right situation in hurghada.
Better life for the playboys and heartbreaking for the women.
Or fun for the boys and fun for the girls (playmates)without any feeling from heart.
And 1% or 2% from the men are true.


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Donna Maria
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quote:
Originally posted by schatze:
well, there is further news - i had a call from his friend in Hurghada to let me know that my orfi husband had an accident diving (came up too quickly)and ended up in decompression chamber! his phone was with those who were looking after him and it was later handed over to his friend who saw my msgs and contacted me to tell me what had happened - my OH is now at home recovering from bends, still not quite able to speak but i heard from him by text today - sigh of relief to know he is ok and i think i could consider whay happened a good reason for not being in touch for the last few days - i'm still puzzled about the issue of topless sunbathing and will want to hear his reasons for encouraging me to do it when he is in a fit state to engage - by the way Nefertiti, the beach was not the one you mentionned but one out of Hurghada - only european tourists there, the egyptians are staff and, as far as i could tell, we were the only mixed couple - nonetheless, i am saddened by what i have learned about the Hurghada scene from all your responses and the extent of deceit local men go to - i find it difficult to trust my situation being so far apart and in the face of all this feedback it is more difficult to work out how genuine this man is - thank you for putting me in the picture and opening my eyes - may bore you again in future with any developments as i find it helpful to get a local perspective with some hard nailed truths rather than just the views of my friends at home who have never been to egypt and have no idea of the local culture/modus operandi

Hi, next time your OH will not have an accident. No, next time his mother is in a hospital for operation, or somebody died.
They trust you by the life of mothers and children and family ans s.o.
If you can open your eyes, let think with your mind not with the heart.


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italian soul
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oh che bello...posso parlarti in italiano.
no,io non ero al Franco Rosso ma all'Arabella quest'anno e in un hotel in centro l'anno scorso.La situazione li' e' un vero casino...tu non hai idea di quanto sarei felice se il 50% di quello chewmi dice fosse vero...fa progetti di vita insieme...figli...lavoro..casa...e'dolcissimo e premuroso, ammette di essere stato un playboy sfegatato fino al giorno prima di conoscermi.....e' ora e' cambiato...come no!!! comunque lavora sulle barche che fanno le gite a Giftun...ti prego dimmi che il tuo e' un altro!!!!!

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schatze
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quote:
Originally posted by italian soul:
oh che bello...posso parlarti in italiano.
no,io non ero al Franco Rosso ma all'Arabella quest'anno e in un hotel in centro l'anno scorso.La situazione li' e' un vero casino...tu non hai idea di quanto sarei felice se il 50% di quello chewmi dice fosse vero...fa progetti di vita insieme...figli...lavoro..casa...e'dolcissimo e premuroso, ammette di essere stato un playboy sfegatato fino al giorno prima di conoscermi.....e' ora e' cambiato...come no!!! comunque lavora sulle barche che fanno le gite a Giftun...ti prego dimmi che il tuo e' un altro!!!!!

senti, andiamo al nocciolo della questione..il mio si chiama fade e ha la sua barca che affita al diving centre dove franco rosso ha il villaggio. mi ha incuriosito che sei tornata pochi giorni fa perche' e' la scorsa settimana che lui dovrebbe avere avuto questo incidente - comunque, se il tuo si chiama rami, questo e' un suo carissimo amico e lavora sulle barche che fanno i safari ed altre cose (non so cosa e' Giftun) - riguardo i progetti, la dolcezza e l'essere premuroso, il mio e'tutte questo cose ed anche di piu' e sotto questo aspetto io non dubito che i suoi sentimenti siano sinceri - fidarsi, comunque, e' un'altra cosa e lui senza dubbio vuole venire da me e per questo vuole sposarsi al piu' presto (leggi il mio messaggio in inglese per gli ultimi sviluppi) - per favore, mi dici come si chiama il tuo? - se poi vuoi scambiare e-mail e comunicare direttamente, indicamelo - ciao e non dimenticare..nonostante le similarita' delle culture mediterranee, la sua cultura e' molto diversa dalla nostra italiana, a prescindere da quale regione veniamo - sta attenta anche tu perche' i figli, se poi non va tra i genitori, gli uomini musulmani se li tengono loro!


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schatze
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well dear all, thank you very much for your kind contributions which have helped me to ask the right questions and for this great website that has given me insignt into the workings of egyptian tradition. i think it is only fair thay i update you on the latest developments. once my OH recovered from the accident (sounds genuine when i speak to him but the seed of doubt has been planted!)i asked him some straight questions (by text):
Q1 -why did he let me sunbathe topless?
A - essentially, he was afraid i would object to him expecting me to behave like an egyptian and wanted to respect my wish to be and feel free (true, they were my words before i went back in july - i told him that i needed to feel free to leave when i wanted and be myself and for him not to expect me to suddenly turn into an egyptian - i am very respectable in my culture 'though i did not know then how egyptians view european women in any event)- he pointed out that he did not say anything on the beach but would get quite cross when i did not firmly shut the door when hanging out in his room in his home as 'it was not nice for his family to get a chance to catch a glimpse of me in swimwear' - some would say that he likes me for being european (has never had an egyptian girfriend) and does not wish to change me (!?)
Q2 - why did he want to marry me?
A - because he loves me - does not want to wait for me for 4 years and then find i changed my mind after all - besides, getting properly married would mean that he can come to visit me and i go to visit him without problems about visas - denied that he was interested in a european passport but eventually i got out of him that he wants 'a good life' and got the distinct impression that him coming to visit me involved longer than two weeks stay
it is beyond me why he thinks that he would have a better life in england when the language and cultural barrier,poor job opportunities for someone whose english is not that great and does not have a profession and,last but not least, the weather would simply drive him over the edge! - however, although i have offered to sponsor his visa application for a holiday to visit me as a friend so he can see England, he is not happy with this and only would come if we marry - although he has all my support for wanting to improve his life (but not at my expense!), this is the bit that does not feel right and made me refuse his second marriage proposal
Q3 - why did he ask me to marry him but never spoke of maher and badhkar (not sure about the spelling but i understand they are the present and drawry an egyptian man gives to his future wife)
A - asked me how i knew these words and was he not more important that these things?

to summarise, we have had an interesting texting weekend during which he wanted to know an answer to his second marriage proposal without delay and after some thought i had to say no because it does not feel right! i do not doubt that he has feelings for me (i am not a young girl or a stupid woman)and that i have hurt him by rejecting him - a more mature man would (maybe?) have understood that even in ordinary circumstances it is not easy to agree to marry someone after knowing them for 3 months during which you only spent 3 weeks together - whether it is his immaturity that made him push me into a decision or whether it is his desire not to waste too much time after someone who will not in the end give him what he wants is difficult to be sure - but the only fact there is a doubt makes it not right for me - afterall, i would not marry anyone so quickly even when there are no issues about what they may be trying to get out of me and this is what my OH does not understand - we are still texting and some of it is heartbreaking because there are genuine feelings involved on both parts - the chance we may stay friends is there but may take a while or it may not happen at all.
anyone welcome to make comments if u want to!

[This message has been edited by schatze (edited 11 August 2003).]


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italian soul
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che sospiro di sollievo...non e' lui!!!!!
si chiama Ashraf...concordo che dovremmo andarci coi piedi di piombo per quaNTO RIGUARDA I GRANDI PROGETTI...anche perche' se il tuo Fade viene a stare un po da te ..supponi che la cosa non vada bene...lui puo' sempre ritornare a casa sua e tu non hai perso lavoro..studi....casa...Il mio "amico"invece sarebbe ben contento che andassi io li'...il che per me vorrebbe dire mollare un bel lavoro,una casa,un gatto...per poi non sapere come andra'...onestamente non vorrei trovarmi tra 6 mesi con il c... per terra e il cuore spezzato.
Pero' dall'altro canto me la voglio vivere fino in fondo perche' l'istinto mi dice che non e' poi cosi'cattivo come sembra....
avrei piacere di parlare un po' con te...hai visto mai che 2 teste ragionino meglio di 1 confusa come la mia....

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italian soul
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Hi Nefertiti,

if a have understood well...you are English and you live in Hurghada...is it right?
I would like so much to ask you about my "boyfriend" maybe you know him...but i'm afraid about your answer....so i don't ask you about him....I am just happy that his photo was not in the Russian Site concerning Hurghada and Sharm Playboys.... but i will check everyday if this picture will appear...
AH AH AH !!
I'm jocking .... but i envy you because you have found the bravery to leave your country and to go to stay there...


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bazok
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Ciao Italian soul e Shatze.....ecco qui un'altra italiana.......dunque all'arabella ci sono stata pure io.....e li' e' pienooooooooo di dolci cari ragazzi sfigati con il babbo che sta tanto male e la mamma povera povera che si da un gran da fare per risolvere i problemi di casa......e sono tutti molto romantici, ti fanno i regalini......piccole cose naturalmente...non hanno grandi posssibilita,ma tutto quello che hanno se lo giocano nella prospettiva di una vita migliore....che forse potete dare voi....
Di ragazzi li' ne conosco pure io.....ma sono molto molto scettica......forse sara' la mia eta'....
Certamente anche l'italia e' piena di dolci ragazzi che cercano avventure....ma perlomeno questi non ti fanno promesse a lungo termine.....anzi si guardano bene dal farlo........
Personalmente posso dirvi che nel mio piccolo paese italiano conosco due ragazze che hanno sposato uno di loro.....e a quanto pare sono pure felici.....ma i problemi ci sono e sono anche molto grandi....ve lo immaginate cosa puo' significare per una occidentale l'integrazione con un'uomo con un background culturale completamente diverso dal nostro......sicuramente voi ben sapete qual'e' la posizione della donna islamica all'interno del focolare domestico.....siamo sicure di essere pronte a rinunciare alla liberta' che abbiamo acquistato in tutti questi anni..per condividere la nostra vita e il nostro futuro con un'uomo che ci considerera' sua proprieta' esclusiva???
Potremo ancora essere libere di andare in palestra ,di uscire con le nostre amiche il venerdi' sera per andare a ballare??
E il nostro lavoro sara' considerato necessario o ci verra' chiesto di rimanere a casa ad accudire ai nostri figli.....e questi ultimi come verranno cresciuti??...cultura e religione islamica in italia??SE qualcosa dovesse andare male nella nostra unione vi immaginate cosa potra' fare il padre per avere con se i suoi figli??se non sbaglio l'educazione dei figli e la loro custodia e' affidata alle madri fino agli 11 anni....poi ne e' responsabile il padre......duro da accettare .....ma bisogna fare i conti col futuro......Di tutti questi problemi dovreste parlare a lungo con il vostro ragazzo.....io ne ho conosciuto uno che aborriva l'dea che io potessi avere amici maschi e che nel mio lavoro potessi avere clienti e collaboratori di sesso maschile......per non parlare poi del suo atteggiamonto di possesso nei miei confronti.......guai parlare con chiunque all'interno del villaggio.....guai indossare gonne che lasciassero intravedere un centimetro di caviglia......usare sempre gli occhiali da sole per nascondere i miei occhi verdi dallo sguardo indiscreto di altri ...........;grandi gentiluomini sono di sicuro....se ti portano a bere un te' da qualche parte si preoccupano di sistemarti per benino la seggiola sulla quele ti devi sedere ( e' questo a me all'inizio mi impressionava e mi imbarazzava allo stesso tempo).......e ti parlano del loro grande amore per la religione ( che io ammiro immensamente), del loro rispetto per le regole comportamentali......niente sesso per carita'......e' proibito.....pero' poi alla fine sono ben felici se voi siete compiacenti ma a cose fatte ( se non sono riusciti a sposarvi Orfi per non macchiare la loro coscienza), si sentono cosi' in colpa per il loro peccato ( 60 frustate per un rapporto prematrimoniale sono previste dalla legge).....e magari perdono anche parte della considerazione che hanno per voi.......occidentali e libertine.....o libere???
Io uno di questi ragazzi l'ho conosciuto, bello bravo e buono..e sfigato...ma e' meglio che resti a casa sua....e che sposi una vergine egiziana, cosi' da sentirsi rispettato da tutti.....
Ora ho un buon amico laggiu'...... .....se qualcosa dovra' esserci in futuro tra noi prima ci dovranno essere fiumi di parole e di discussioni per sapere e conoscere meglio chi ho di fianco.....e spero che anche per voi sara' cosi.....siate obbiettive, scavate ben in fondo al cuore del vostro fidanzato, fatelo per voi.....e anche per lui....fatevi rispettare e rispettatelo per come e' cresciuto e per quello che fin da piccolo gli e' stato inculcato nella mente........credo che in fondo anche loro siano prigionieri di una cultura troppo restrittiva e impositiva....se meritano il vostro amore dateglielo incondizionatamente.....ma guardate prima ben in fondo ai loro occhi scuri.....
Da ultimo....avete idea di queli difficolta' ci sono per fare arrivare in italia uno di loro con i tempi che corrono??
A meno che voi non vi sposiate subito al ministero di giustizia del Cairo .....fargli ottenere un visto per venire in italia costera' a voi un gran lavoro e grandi sacrifici e ci vorra' anche un'anno o forse piu'.....
Baci
italiana come voi....

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Nefertiti
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quote:
Originally posted by italian soul:
Hi Nefertiti,

if a have understood well...you are English and you live in Hurghada...is it right?
I would like so much to ask you about my "boyfriend" maybe you know him...but i'm afraid about your answer....so i don't ask you about him....I am just happy that his photo was not in the Russian Site concerning Hurghada and Sharm Playboys.... but i will check everyday if this picture will appear...
AH AH AH !!
I'm jocking .... but i envy you because you have found the bravery to leave your country and to go to stay there...


Hi Italian Soul

You are correct, i'm English and live in Hurghada, but Insha'allah i will be leaving soon. I have had enough of Hurghada!

I don't think i would know your boyfriend personally, but maybe i would know someone that knows him or knows of him. I don't go to the disco's here so i don't really know who is who in that scene. The playboys i know don't have Italian Girlfriends so i doubt if your boyfriend is one of them!

To all others... stay safe in Hurghada, because some of these guys look like they have some serious sexual health problems! Or to be more specific, they look like they have HIV. Just be careful.


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italian soul
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Nefertity,
please don't make me sad thinking about illness!!! i hope i was lucky with him....
So you really want go away from hurghada? you don't work there? don't tell me that you prefer the British rainy weather?
When you think to go away?
I will come back in Hurghada in October.

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schatze
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quote:
Originally posted by bazok:
Ciao Italian soul e Shatze.....ecco qui un'altra italiana.......dunque all'arabella ci sono stata pure io.....e li' e' pienooooooooo di dolci cari ragazzi sfigati con il babbo che sta tanto male e la mamma povera povera che si da un gran da fare per risolvere i problemi di casa......e sono tutti molto romantici, ti fanno i regalini......piccole cose naturalmente...non hanno grandi posssibilita,ma tutto quello che hanno se lo giocano nella prospettiva di una vita migliore....che forse potete dare voi....
Di ragazzi li' ne conosco pure io.....ma sono molto molto scettica......forse sara' la mia eta'....
Certamente anche l'italia e' piena di dolci ragazzi che cercano avventure....ma perlomeno questi non ti fanno promesse a lungo termine.....anzi si guardano bene dal farlo........
Personalmente posso dirvi che nel mio piccolo paese italiano conosco due ragazze che hanno sposato uno di loro.....e a quanto pare sono pure felici.....ma i problemi ci sono e sono anche molto grandi....ve lo immaginate cosa puo' significare per una occidentale l'integrazione con un'uomo con un background culturale completamente diverso dal nostro......sicuramente voi ben sapete qual'e' la posizione della donna islamica all'interno del focolare domestico.....siamo sicure di essere pronte a rinunciare alla liberta' che abbiamo acquistato in tutti questi anni..per condividere la nostra vita e il nostro futuro con un'uomo che ci considerera' sua proprieta' esclusiva???
Potremo ancora essere libere di andare in palestra ,di uscire con le nostre amiche il venerdi' sera per andare a ballare??
E il nostro lavoro sara' considerato necessario o ci verra' chiesto di rimanere a casa ad accudire ai nostri figli.....e questi ultimi come verranno cresciuti??...cultura e religione islamica in italia??SE qualcosa dovesse andare male nella nostra unione vi immaginate cosa potra' fare il padre per avere con se i suoi figli??se non sbaglio l'educazione dei figli e la loro custodia e' affidata alle madri fino agli 11 anni....poi ne e' responsabile il padre......duro da accettare .....ma bisogna fare i conti col futuro......Di tutti questi problemi dovreste parlare a lungo con il vostro ragazzo.....io ne ho conosciuto uno che aborriva l'dea che io potessi avere amici maschi e che nel mio lavoro potessi avere clienti e collaboratori di sesso maschile......per non parlare poi del suo atteggiamonto di possesso nei miei confronti.......guai parlare con chiunque all'interno del villaggio.....guai indossare gonne che lasciassero intravedere un centimetro di caviglia......usare sempre gli occhiali da sole per nascondere i miei occhi verdi dallo sguardo indiscreto di altri ...........;grandi gentiluomini sono di sicuro....se ti portano a bere un te' da qualche parte si preoccupano di sistemarti per benino la seggiola sulla quele ti devi sedere ( e' questo a me all'inizio mi impressionava e mi imbarazzava allo stesso tempo).......e ti parlano del loro grande amore per la religione ( che io ammiro immensamente), del loro rispetto per le regole comportamentali......niente sesso per carita'......e' proibito.....pero' poi alla fine sono ben felici se voi siete compiacenti ma a cose fatte ( se non sono riusciti a sposarvi Orfi per non macchiare la loro coscienza), si sentono cosi' in colpa per il loro peccato ( 60 frustate per un rapporto prematrimoniale sono previste dalla legge).....e magari perdono anche parte della considerazione che hanno per voi.......occidentali e libertine.....o libere???
Io uno di questi ragazzi l'ho conosciuto, bello bravo e buono..e sfigato...ma e' meglio che resti a casa sua....e che sposi una vergine egiziana, cosi' da sentirsi rispettato da tutti.....
Ora ho un buon amico laggiu'...... .....se qualcosa dovra' esserci in futuro tra noi prima ci dovranno essere fiumi di parole e di discussioni per sapere e conoscere meglio chi ho di fianco.....e spero che anche per voi sara' cosi.....siate obbiettive, scavate ben in fondo al cuore del vostro fidanzato, fatelo per voi.....e anche per lui....fatevi rispettare e rispettatelo per come e' cresciuto e per quello che fin da piccolo gli e' stato inculcato nella mente........credo che in fondo anche loro siano prigionieri di una cultura troppo restrittiva e impositiva....se meritano il vostro amore dateglielo incondizionatamente.....ma guardate prima ben in fondo ai loro occhi scuri.....
Da ultimo....avete idea di queli difficolta' ci sono per fare arrivare in italia uno di loro con i tempi che corrono??
A meno che voi non vi sposiate subito al ministero di giustizia del Cairo .....fargli ottenere un visto per venire in italia costera' a voi un gran lavoro e grandi sacrifici e ci vorra' anche un'anno o forse piu'.....
Baci
italiana come voi....

Ma perche' non creiamo un club? o meglio, perche' non ci presentiamo tutte insieme ad hurghada? Italian soul, in altre circostanze avrei proposto ci incontriamo a Hurghada in ottobre ma io vado in Italia a settembre (io vivo in inghilterra) per cui ferie ad ottobre non ne ho - tra l'altro io non credo che la mia storia continui, ormai siamo agli sgoccioli, lui sta facendo vari ricatti morali e emotivi e le carte se le sta giocando tutte ma la mia risposta rimane no - riguardo ai figli, bazok, questo e' un punto che io ho gia' affrontato - i figli prendono sempre la religione del padre e, per quanto io non sia religiosa, sono cresciuta cattolica e voglio che i miei figli crescano cristiani e senza tutte queste strane idee sulle donne etc inculcate in loro - cosa che non credo sarebbe possible in un posto come Hurghada!
Bazok, tu stai in egitto? o ti interessa tornare?
italian soul, non voglio farti entrare in paranoia ma..il nome del tuo mi suona familiare; ha per caso i baffi, e' scuro di carnagione e lavora a un diving centre? io ho conosciuto un'amico del mio OH che e' cosi', il suo nome e' simile ma non sono sicura esattamente, e' attraente, di famiglia benestante (hanno un gran ristorante a hurghada) ma...decisamente sposato con un' egiziana e hanno due bambine gemelle! sono d'accordo con bazok, anche perche'a me ha aiutato fare cosi: fai molta ricerca sulla cultura egiziana, the formalita' di matrimonio con straniere, la religione con tutte le sue limitazioni (che sono tante) ma sopratutto fagli domande chiare tenendo presente che per gli egiziani sono molto tradizionali e l'uomo e' quello che provvede per la famiglia - se non offre di mantenerti (anche se poi tu decidi di lavorare) non credo sia serio nella sua offerta - se col tempo gli interessa venire da te piu' di avere te in egitto, addrizza le orecchie! magari finisce che sei tu a mantenerlo..ciao


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schatze
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hey nefertiti, the wisest woman of all! wot's this website of hearthrobs from hurghada italian soul talks to you about? are they pictured naked? how do i get on it? don't want to wind u up but..we r having 37 to 40 degrees c. in england, just like egypt but u can still breath (ok maybe not in london)- sorry about the italian interlude, it must be boring for those of u who do not understand wot we r saying - still talking about men i'm afraid - hope u r enjoying the move!
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bazok
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Well,dear girls.....
first of all sorry if I write my post in italian language.....really it's better for all of us to write in english so everybody can read what we write...I think it's more correct.....
I consider my self lucky because I dont live in Hurghada...it's a nice place if u stay there for a couple of weeks....not more...a part from the hot weather ( and this summer we have really an egyptian clima even in our country...) but I consider that city impossible to live for more then a vacation period....hmmmm...sorry but I think it's a caotic place...sometimes a dirty place ( what about the toilet outside the vacation village.....oh my god....).....so I'll never like to live there.....
Yes, we can find more relaxed way of live there.....if we compare with the italian running style.....people is nice and gentle......everybody is smiling at u there.....but but but.....better to live here.....
I can remember women with theyr head fully covered walking in the road with theyr boss (husband)dressed like a western one.....I never could accept it....
I'll be back there next october for a week or may be for two if I free from my business duties......
Here in Italy I have my own business and this can be very interesting for an egyptian boy.....what do u think about ??
I'm so sorry for u shatze hearing that your love story is at his end, but I think that u are an intelligent woman and u must take care to your life.....and dont take wrong steps.....
And what about italian soul??
If u plan to go to egypt next october may be we can meet there, if u give me your email I'll write u and may be we can became friends and while we are in Hurghada we can spend some time togheter....witout egyptian men...lol.....
To Nefertiti....thanks to your nice and experienced words.....and I hope u can came back to your country as soon as possible..........
A kiss to everybody
bazok

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italian soul
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SCHATZE, non e' lui,non ha i baffi,e' chiaro come me ,benestante proprio no...e poi e' giovane e i suoi vivono in paesino vicino al Cairo.Ho visto il passaporto , non e' sposato non ha figli.ieri abbiamo litigato perche' io ho messo in dubbio tutto e lui e' rimasto malissimo e non capiva perche' da un giorno all'altro fossi diventata cosi' sospettosa e inquisitoria...vai a spiegargli che parlo di lui su un sito Egiziano...comnque poi abbiamo fatto pace e io mi sono sentita una cacchina!!ho deciso che vivro' la storia serenamente ma facendo ben attenzione a tutto !!
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italian soul
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BAZOK
you are right,me too, i will talk in english ...
About living in Hurghada...even if it's like Napoli 40 years ago... i think that i could do it...because i like the parfume of shisha coming out from the bars...the hot wind from the sea...the dolphins...Giftun paradise ...
About the clothes I respect Muslin way to dress...even if t's not MY way...
I would like very much to meet you in Hurghada, i am asking to my boss in office for a 1 week free...in October..ti lascio il mio indirizzo e-mail bebabeba1975@libero.it
kisses

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bazok
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To Italian soul.....oh my god....I had before u this experience....If u tell to your boyfriend (or friend) that u have some doubts about what he tells u......immediately he will say that u dont deserve his love.....he will be really offended because u dont believe in what he is.....and u'll feel guilty for your behaviour......dont be like that......u have all the rights to doubt....
He will tell u that he doesnt like his friends' intercourses with foreign women and theyr bad attitude....at the end he is a better man.....
I'll write u directly to your email...
have a good day...
bazok

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Sylvia
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Ciao Italian soul...too many Italians on this site! I m also italian 25 years old and I will also be in Hurghada in November with two other friends! I have only been one time to Egypt before... six years ago and i look forward to visiting egypt again! We will stay in cairo 10 days and another 10 days in Hurghada! It would be cool if we met... This time I am more prepared of what to expect in egypt! Last time I visited egypt, i did not know much about the country and i was totally shocked of what i saw! Every little thing was different. Things that you would thought are universal were different! it was a big cultural shock for me, it was as if i took a trip into the past 150 years ago! you said that hurghada was like napoli was 40 years ago! but i dont agree, italy never was like that..the poverty, dirt, customs..
It will be nice to visit egypt again because i dont rememeber much from my last visit! everything is a blur...i felt that i didnt see the things i wanted to see because i was busy taking care of my cultural shock. When it was about time to departure egypt and i though back of the time i spend in egypt, it seemed everything like a dream that i just imagined!

Egyptians are wonderful people and they deserve all the best in the word! this country will forever be in my heart! I only wonder about one thing despite that, why are they so dirty?? that's their biggest disadvantage, they don't learn about hygiene when they grow up! i know poverty is not an excuse...in italy 50 years ago in the poorest of villages people may not had to eat but their house was always clean! i believe the life of many egyptians would improve dramatically if they hold to the basic hygiene! its the biggest negative thing about egypt, the positive is their kindness,(i was really moved!) simpliness, and lust for life!!! I will always love them and wish them the best!


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Nefertiti
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quote:
Originally posted by italian soul:
Nefertity,
please don't make me sad thinking about illness!!! i hope i was lucky with him....
So you really want go away from hurghada? you don't work there? don't tell me that you prefer the British rainy weather?
When you think to go away?
I will come back in Hurghada in October.

Insha'allah i will leave Hurghada 2morrow, but i won't be returning to England... not yet anyway. No way do i like the weather in England!!

Have a good time when you return to Egypt in October Insha'allah


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Nefertiti
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quote:
Originally posted by schatze:
hey nefertiti, the wisest woman of all! wot's this website of hearthrobs from hurghada italian soul talks to you about? are they pictured naked? how do i get on it? don't want to wind u up but..we r having 37 to 40 degrees c. in england, just like egypt but u can still breath (ok maybe not in london)- sorry about the italian interlude, it must be boring for those of u who do not understand wot we r saying - still talking about men i'm afraid - hope u r enjoying the move!

Thanks for the weather info from England... i still prefer to be in Egypt!! I hope it's not to hot for everyone there

Take a look at the website that Italian soul talks about but i personally think it is wrong!! (not sure of the address, but there is a thread on this board somewhere called playboys in Sharm and Hurghada)The guy's on it are not Heart throbs.... they must be the worst selection of men that Hurghada has to offer!! Sorry they are not naked either!! They look bad enough with clothes on!!

I think it was put together by some Russians to expose the "bad guys" in Hurghada, but the stories that i can read - the ones that are in English - don't make me think these guy's are that bad at all. It really just sounds like a bunch of girls who have had holiday romances gone bad! For example i showed one of my friends the website yesterday and one of the pictures loaded and she said "oh my god that's ******. He isn't bad, he doesn't use women. Why did they put him on there!" We both know his family and from what my friend says (and her husband) he wouldn't be clever enough to use a woman! For sure he may have more than one woman, but Hurghada is a holiday resort and that's what the men (and women!) will do!

Lol, someone else on here posted something like most of the men on the site are junkies!! Lol, he could be right!!


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Nefertiti
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http://www.egyptsearch.com/forums/Forum1/HTML/000551.html

This is the thread for the playboys thing. The link for the site is on the first post... enjoy!! (and laugh!!)


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schatze
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hi nefertiti, thanx for the top tip and the laughs....definitily NOT the best looking men i've ever seen - i'm glad to say my OH looks nothing like that!
Bazok, i'm sorry to have given you a false impression but the stpry with my OH is not over in the least! i've just wised up to the situation and i've challenged him on several things he said and did - the end result is that i'm much clearer about not wanting to marry him for real and he is much clearer that he loves me for real! hope you have a good time if you go back to egypt in october - i have no plans to go back so far but stay in touch, i would still consider meeting up in future.

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bazok
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Hi Shatze,
I'm happy that your love with that boy is not at its end and I hope that his feelings are true and that both of u will have a good chance to share a life together.
If u want u can give me your email so we can keep in touch via email.....
Have a good day.
a kiss
bazok

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schatze
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hi bazok, sono contattabile su
ipittalis@tinyworld.co.uk
get in touch!

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francy
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MA DAI UNA CHE è STATA A HURGHADA E CHE PARLA ITALIANO.. SENTI VORREI POTERTI PARLARE è POSSIBILE.. VADO LI DA DUE ANNI E "CONOSCO UNA PERSONA" .. mail prsonaleè francesca978@virgilio.it

sono di milano..
spero tanto in una tua risposta..
baci
fra


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LiveItUp
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Italian senoras....why turn to Egyptian males when you all have the best looking Italian men?! Lol! One thing no one ever says is:Please... of course when you are on vacation in a lovely tropical resort area and some decent foreign sexy guy knocks you off your feet with those words or eyes, you are in that mode of vacation, fun, romance...but why not realize that and STOP IT all before it is too much hazzle? It won't be like that back in your hometown. I feel for you all but it just doesn't make sense to rationally think that these males are being sincere for what ever their reasons. Maybe 1 out of 20?
Also why do the owners/management of these resorts let these males pounce on the women tourists? There should really be some no fraternazation rule or out you go...Jeez we can't even say certain joking words in US to our co workers. The mngmnt need to get involved in this it seems to be a recurring problem for years according to this forum, eh? Good point eh?
Well good luck all and just have fun, sun, tan, dance, drink but don't fall privy to these males on vacation.

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bergamo
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deary lucia
good day
i interested of your replyed as it below because it happenned also with me
it gives me a grat pleasured to be my new friend
my e-mail: miasolimane@yahoo.com
wait u e-mail urgent
best wishes
mohamed

quote:
Originally posted by Lucia:
Schatze,
It seems like these guys disappear without a trace when they decide they are finished with a woman. I met an Egyptian guy in Europe and have been in contact for the last 5 months. All of a sudden, his phone is no longer on I have no way of contacting him to find out what is going on. It's so frustrating because I cannot even express my anger. This treatment after saying "I love you, you're such a nice person, you're not like other girls," blah, blah, blah. He's the one who began this thing, but he's not enough of a man to end it. I did not want to think so, but I have to agree that it sounds they are all the same. Sorry...


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bergamo
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deary lucia
good day
re your replyed as it below
i faced the same problem liked you it gives me a great pleasured to be my new friend
my e-mail:miasolimane@yahoo.com
wait u e-mail urgent
best wishes
mohamed

quote:
Originally posted by Lucia:
Schatze,
It seems like these guys disappear without a trace when they decide they are finished with a woman. I met an Egyptian guy in Europe and have been in contact for the last 5 months. All of a sudden, his phone is no longer on I have no way of contacting him to find out what is going on. It's so frustrating because I cannot even express my anger. This treatment after saying "I love you, you're such a nice person, you're not like other girls," blah, blah, blah. He's the one who began this thing, but he's not enough of a man to end it. I did not want to think so, but I have to agree that it sounds they are all the same. Sorry...


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kokokoas
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Hallo Sylvia...
First of all don't mention that Egypt is just a dirty place..and don't talk about people like that..if you are interestet to meet your own people you don't have to arrange meeting in dirty place as you say..you can meet them in your country if you want
Egypt may be is not like Rome 150 years ago but 4000 years ago Egypt was so spicial that your people was not even borne...
you are so wilcome to Egypt anytime ,,,,but try to respect this country and dont only look to bad things and forget good things..like if you forget your money or camira some where..people who you say so poor will not steal it but they will returne it back to you..this happiend already to me,,,people are the country..people are so friendly..so try..ihope yo can...try to be little friendly to this people

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Egyptians
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All girls have the right to sunbathe topless any place. like the boys. Let the girls show their beautiful big boobs. All the difference between boys and girls boobs is the size only. That's not reason to make the girl cover her boobs.
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Shadya
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quote:
Originally posted by Egyptians:
All girls have the right to sunbathe topless any place. like the boys. Let the girls show their beautiful big boobs. All the difference between boys and girls boobs is the size only. That's not reason to make the girl cover her boobs.

My boobs are no one else's business (period). I have nothing to prove by showing off what I got. Your reasoning is valid except you forget the element of human nature and their motives.


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bob the dog
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quote:
Originally posted by Egyptians:
All girls have the right to sunbathe topless any place. like the boys. Let the girls show their beautiful big boobs. All the difference between boys and girls boobs is the size only. That's not reason to make the girl cover her boobs.

With attitude like this, you are not welcome in a muslim country!!
Yes, you have the right..we have the right to do a lot of disrespectful things.. BUT... your rights are not at issue, respect for the country you are in is a much stronger issue!!!!!!
Behave like a sharmouta and you will get treated like one!!
Attitudes like yours make me sick!


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Egyptians
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Shadya

I want to tell you something, you are agree with me that all the difference between girls boobs and boys boobs is the size only.
Do you like to sunbathe topless and show your boobs in Hurghada and Sharm el Shiekh they accept topless sunbathe. If you want to make of my words that all the girls have the right to show their beautiful big boobs open the site http://www.tera.ca/
Topfree Equal Rights Association. That Association support and help girls to have their rights by the law to show their beautiful big boobs. I will tell you a story happend to me I was on beach and I saw girl sunbathe topless and she told me Do like my big boobs. I told her yes. She told me Do you want to touch it. I said yes.
And I saw her big boobs and I touch it I feel it. It's very big and beautiful. I enjoyed her beautiful big boobs.
What is your opinion on that?


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Serendipity
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quote:
Originally posted by Egyptians:
Shadya

I want to tell you something, you are agree with me that all the difference between girls boobs and boys boobs is the size only.
Do you like to sunbathe topless and show your boobs in Hurghada and Sharm el Shiekh they accept topless sunbathe. If you want to make of my words that all the girls have the right to show their beautiful big boobs open the site http://www.tera.ca/
Topfree Equal Rights Association. That Association support and help girls to have their rights by the law to show their beautiful big boobs. I will tell you a story happend to me I was on beach and I saw girl sunbathe topless and she told me Do like my big boobs. I told her yes. She told me Do you want to touch it. I said yes.
And I saw her big boobs and I touch it I feel it. It's very big and beautiful. I enjoyed her beautiful big boobs.
What is your opinion on that?


have you considered going to a proffesional shrink?..well at least think about it


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bob the dog
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quote:
Originally posted by Egyptians:
Shadya

I want to tell you something, you are agree with me that all the difference between girls boobs and boys boobs is the size only.
Do you like to sunbathe topless and show your boobs in Hurghada and Sharm el Shiekh they accept topless sunbathe. If you want to make of my words that all the girls have the right to show their beautiful big boobs open the site http://www.tera.ca/
Topfree Equal Rights Association. That Association support and help girls to have their rights by the law to show their beautiful big boobs. I will tell you a story happend to me I was on beach and I saw girl sunbathe topless and she told me Do like my big boobs. I told her yes. She told me Do you want to touch it. I said yes.
And I saw her big boobs and I touch it I feel it. It's very big and beautiful. I enjoyed her beautiful big boobs.
What is your opinion on that?


Ok.. so how much did you have to pay her at the end of the session???
Or.. have you been watching too many porno movies???
GET A LIFE!!!


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Serendipity
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quote:
Originally posted by Samia:
Ok.. so how much did you have to pay her at the end of the session???
Or.. have you been watching too many porno movies???
GET A LIFE!!!


girl, i bet she slapped him on the face! this is porn talk...sorry egyptians...you came to the wrong place..."proffesional help for sex adiictives" is next door


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