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King_Tut
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There seems to be heavy discussion on what “Egyptian men” are like so why not a little on Egyptian woman? From my personal experiences from all cultures personality differs from female to female, obviously. However certain ideologies and beliefs or morals seem to be VERY similar. I take this example from Italy, the woman I met there (disregarding Rome), while all have different personalities, there traits are very much the same. They all have very strong pronouncement in morals, religious beliefs (Catholicism), family values, and so forth. So with that said, what are Egyptian woman like?
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Undead
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Never mind... I should let the women respond

[This message has been edited by Undead (edited 26 January 2004).]

[This message has been edited by Undead (edited 26 January 2004).]


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arx
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muslim women NEVER, EVER get involved with non-muslim men. since most egyptian women are muslims.........
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Undead
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That is untrue. You could say "not usually" but "NEVER, EVER" is wrong. I have friends that have Muslim mothers and Christian fathers. Yes, it is not what is advised under Islam but some women want a man for the man and not for his religion.
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AMR the great
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in islam there is no marriage between a non muslim man and a muslim woman. it is considered adultery......
about the one u know it is ubnormal and considered as i mentioned


quote:
Originally posted by Undead:
That is untrue. You could say "not usually" but "NEVER, EVER" is wrong. I have friends that have Muslim mothers and Christian fathers. Yes, it is not what is advised under Islam but some women want a man for the man and not for his religion.


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King_Tut
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wow, well I'm Roman Catholic, I didn't know muslim was that big there.
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Undead
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Yes, I am aware of it. I also said that it is not what is advised under Islam The mother was raised Muslima but I don't know if she still considers herself one. My friends are brought up under both religions, but now don't care for either. At one point hundreds of years ago these religions brought people together, now they are forcing them apart.

PS now that I am thinking about it I know several couples like this. I know a Christian Egyptian who married a Afghan woman. Of course she was Muslim in Afghanistan, but now she doesn't have faith in God/Allah what-so-ever. They own and operate a restaurant together and are quite happy. It is not the norm, but it is also more common than one would think. These people don't normally tell others about the situation because it is not the business of others, and also they don't like having people telling them that their marriage is wrong.

[This message has been edited by Undead (edited 27 January 2004).]


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Mooly El Din
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Whenever an issue regarding Egyptian women is raised in this site, I feel one of two: 1) bunch of foreigners, who deem that they have grasped the Egyptian culture and fully understood the physiology of the Egyptian women, or some Egyptians guys who are still immersed in their patriarchal presumptions flavoured by some religious spices. Wakes up, if Egyptian men can relate, date, and marry non-Egyptian women, so can the Egyptian women. Please ……do not flag the logistics of the religion, as we all know it is only a matter of technicalities and formalities!

In real life, non-Egyptian Muslim women are committed to non-Egyptian and non-Muslim men (It is not a matter of can or can not). I am one of them; I have been in a four-year relation with a non-Muslim guy. Two of my Egyptians female friends are married to non-Egyptian and non-Muslim guys. Another very good Egyptian friend is going to have her first baby from her non-Muslim and non-Egyptian partner.

In earlier threads, some of you mentioned that there is a dilemma when it comes to finding the right match, the mature, responsible and independent Egyptian women…… the other different Egyptian women !!!!!, and this was the offered explanation for the fact that some Egyptian men marries western women, they possesses these missing and wanted qualities,. However, if any discussions started to explore the possibility of Egyptian women practising some rituals which is not the norm and performing some ground-breaking actions, then every one will squeeze his/her nose to submerse these discussions, abort these attempts and sabotage any possible change. We are living in denial or as we say in anthropology the “culture of silence”, we do not like what we are practising and experiencing but so spineless to change it! Sorry for the long message, felt the urge to say something!

Molly


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Undead
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Thanks for the corroborating report! I am glad you spoke up. Some of these absolutists do not see what is outside their window.
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Mooly El Din
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I had the feeling that you will be on line!
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Undead
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Yes! Every day from 4:30 to 11 or 12 midnight. My business requires me being online at these hours because I have to work with markets in New York.
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arx
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muslim women do not marry non-muslim men. if they do, they are no longer considered muslim..... even if they say they are. the reason why muslim men are allowed to marry non-muslim women is to breed more muslims and to cut her off from breeding more non-muslims. thats why the koran demands the children from such a marriage be raised muslim instead of the mothers religion or to have a choice. the fear of the reverse is why muslim women must marry muslim men.

as for egyptian men and western women relationships. the character of both are greatly in question and the relationship itself is usually considered by the world as a form of degeneracy, especially when observed. (my opinion is not given here).


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Undead
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A lot of Muslims don't do everything as demanded by the Quran, but they are still Muslims. If someone believes Allahu Akbar La elaha illah Allah Mohammedan Rasulullah are they not a Muslim? Who are you to say that someone who takes shahada is not a Muslim just because of whom they marry.
What is your opinion on Muslims that drink liquors or just do not make Zakat? They are no longer Muslims? I have had this debate too many times and should be wiser than to draw it out again
Anyway in my opinion your religion is defined by you. If you know Islam and define yourself a Muslim then you are Muslim. If you don't follow all the points in the Quran, then you are a Muslim who doesn't follow all the points. You cease to be a Muslim when you no longer believe in the creed in shahada. Not because you married a Christian or whatever.

"as for egyptian men and western women relationships. the character of both are greatly in question and the relationship itself is usually considered by the world as a form of degeneracy"

Considered by the world? Are you sure that is not your opinion? The world doesn't consider anything universally. Absolutist statements such as the above seriously harm ones credibility.


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arx
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if a muslim woman marries a non-muslim man she is no longer a muslim. that has been made clear by too many muslim scholars and interpreters to dismiss. i don't know the answer about a muslim who drinks liquor or doesn't do zakat. you can take your hypotheticals to ludicrous levels. what about a muslim who doesn't believe in god? perhaps he is just interpreting the koran differently than everyone else, thus making him a muslim? what about a muslim who worships satan? perhaps he is interpreting the koran differently than everyone else? what about a muslim who believes in child sacrifice? just interpreting the koran differently?

"Considered by the world? Are you sure that is not your opinion? The world doesn't consider anything universally. Absolutist statements such as the above seriously harm ones credibility."

you seem to think everything is relative. that's very liberal pc of you. yes, the world does see some things in black and white terms. this is one such thing.


[This message has been edited by arx (edited 27 January 2004).]


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Undead
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I gave you CLEAR terms on when someone stops being a Muslim. You haven't responded to that.
To quote you:
"that has been made clear by too many muslim scholars and interpreters to dismiss."
is easily applied to the terms I described as being muslim. Muslim scholars have always said you are Muslim if you believe in the Shahada, the rest is how well you practice your religion. Not that you ARE NOT a member of the religion if you don't practice well. So please put a little more thought into answering.
"you can take your hypotheticals to ludicrous levels." How about just answering the question with what you think instead of saying what levels it could go to? I will answer your hypothetical scenarios.

"what about a muslim who doesn't believe in god? perhaps he is just interpreting the koran differently than everyone else, thus making him a muslim? what about a muslim who worships satan? perhaps he is interpreting the koran differently than everyone else? what about a muslim who believes in child sacrifice? just interpreting the koran differently? "
Again you show your reactionary nature and your lack of thought behind your response. This is really... I won't say it; instead I will show you the error in thinking. The crux of my arguement was that if someone BELIEVES IN THE SHAHADA they are Muslim. If they worship Satan they cannot be believing in the Shahada now can they? The Shahada says there is no deity worthy of worship other than Allah, so if you believe that...
It also says that you believe that Allahu Akbar. So how can you believe Shahada and not believe in God? Again, completely flawed thinking in your REACTION to what I wrote. Now, child sacrifice is not part of Islam BUT someone crazy or misguided could do it and still be a Muslim. Before you start with more reactionary banter consider that which is occuring with Taliban and Al Qaeda and the like. A lot of the things they are doing are not sanctioned by Islam. Still, they are Muslims. Merely crazy or misguided ones. They are not following God's instruction if you ask me (and probably you agree but one can't be sure) but no one can say they aren't Muslim.

Anyway, I was actually honestly curious about what you, arx himself, thought about a Muslim who didn't obey God's law on Zakat. Or Muslims who drink liquors even though it is against God's law. Indeed there was a point in asking; I wanted to know because I wanted to understand your reasoning better. If you had said "they are not muslim if they don't Zakat" I would have understood that you think that someone that doesn't follow everything is not a Muslim. I wanted to know how you draw the line. Instead you tell me how others draw the line (and not all scholars agree on that, as I pointed out.)

And I will reiterate that the world DOES NOT see anything universally. It is not an attempt at being PC or liberal because if you knew me personally you would never think I am PC because I am definitely not out to please those that I disagree with. Liberal is relative so you might call me one, but it isn't relevant. I don't know how much you have travelled but in my own travels and studies I have found that there is no "world view" on anything. We could debate this if you really want to, but consider that there have been cultures that did indeed sacrifice children and felt it was right. Cultures that "head hunt." Cultures that execute people for not growing beards. Cultures that celebrate the birth of a daughter because they can sell her into prostitution. I could go on and on. All these cultures felt what they were doing was right. And the world is a collection of cultures, not 'one universal value set.' For you to say the world sees relationships between Egyptians and foreign people as degeneracy is patently ludcirous. It is not a black and white issue and for you to further state it as such puts your reason in a dubious light. If you have constructive rebuttals, we can continue discussing but if it comes back to reactionary drivel you are welcome to the last word.


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HisCrazyLover
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Un Dead...BRAVO!!!!! I was reading this thread thinking wow I cant believe no one has said yet what you did here!!

As for me, my relationship with my God is something different then my "religion"... I am very spriitual & religious but I define it in a different mannor then most.

Arx Im sorry that you are so rigid with your thought process.

God Bless & regards....

HCL


quote:
Originally posted by Undead:
A lot of Muslims don't do everything as demanded by the Quran, but they are still Muslims. If someone believes Allahu Akbar La elaha illah Allah Mohammedan Rasulullah are they not a Muslim? Who are you to say that someone who takes shahada is not a Muslim just because of whom they marry.
What is your opinion on Muslims that drink liquors or just do not make Zakat? They are no longer Muslims? I have had this debate too many times and should be wiser than to draw it out again
Anyway in my opinion your religion is defined by you. If you know Islam and define yourself a Muslim then you are Muslim. If you don't follow all the points in the Quran, then you are a Muslim who doesn't follow all the points. You cease to be a Muslim when you no longer believe in the creed in shahada. Not because you married a Christian or whatever.

"as for egyptian men and western women relationships. the character of both are greatly in question and the relationship itself is usually considered by the world as a form of degeneracy"

Considered by the world? Are you sure that is not your opinion? The world doesn't consider anything universally. Absolutist statements such as the above seriously harm ones credibility.


[This message has been edited by HisCrazyLover (edited 27 January 2004).]


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Lori
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quote:
Originally posted by King_Tut:
There seems to be heavy discussion on what “Egyptian men” are like so why not a little on Egyptian woman? From my personal experiences from all cultures personality differs from female to female, obviously. However certain ideologies and beliefs or morals seem to be VERY similar. I take this example from Italy, the woman I met there (disregarding Rome), while all have different personalities, there traits are very much the same. They all have very strong pronouncement in morals, religious beliefs (Catholicism), family values, and so forth. So with that said, what are Egyptian woman like?

Could you all please stick to the topic? I am greatly interested in how Egyptian women are simply because I have not met any on the streets, in cafes or in the shops. It would be nice to understand what is the culture, how do they dress, how do they spend their time, what jobs they can have, how much freedom they can enjoy...

This is a general discussion and there are always exceptions to everything, but can we please stick to the RULE for this topic?

Thanks in advance to all who will provide an answer on the subject.

Lori

------------------
In Love With Egypt


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Mooly El Din
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Undead, I loved you answer I could not say better myself. The fact that it is coming from a young Egyptian men. makes it even more powerful and effective. If I have said the same , I would have been accused of being gender biased.


Lori, I am surprised of what you have said “ I have not met any on the streets, in cafes or in the shops” you mean that during all your visits to Egypt you have not seen Egyptian women! Hard to believe!

Cheers


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arx
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why is the shahada absolute and not inter-religious marriage between muslim women and non-muslim men? again, perhaps it is also open to interpretation? how can you give me "clear" terms on who is a muslim and who is not when you yourself said everthing is relative. perhaps another interpretation of the koran would say that the shahada is completely unnecessary or a flaw put there by aliens from mars or something? if everything is relative and open to interpretation, then this can be as well, correct?


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Mooly El Din
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Where are you Undead ? It is an exhaustive exercise with these absolutists

Molly


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Undead
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He is welcome to the last word, and it is indeed mindless drivel as I had predicted at the end of my last statement. Anyone with an expected level of comprehension would find his rebuttal ridiculous, so naturally I don't feel inclined to spend time explaining what is obvious.
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Monica
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.

[This message has been edited by Monica (edited 30 January 2004).]


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arx
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well, its not like you answered any of my questions. you just call my arguements drivel, why? is everything relative or are their absolutes? is everything open to interpretation or not? are hypotheticals wrong to use in an arguement?
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Undead
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On the contrary, you have not responded to all the questions I put forth to you... now you are accusing me? Nothing was hypothetical, I was actually asking you your opinion, for the second time. This is perhaps why I think you have poor levels of comprehension. I ask you a simple question on your OPINION and you think it is hypothetical. I hate to burst your bubble but it is not hypothetical that Muslims drink liquors, or that they do not Zakat. Those are real world situations that I was asking your opinion on, having nothing to do with Mars aliens. Anyway it is all CLEARLY stated in the earlier posts. Indeed I did answer all of your questions, some before you even asked them. Just read my first two posts addressed to you, and you will find all the answers. Perhaps I called your reaction "drivel" because it is inane? READ MY POST, I answered your questions and asked some of my own, which you have answered NONE OF. Not even attempted to. I think you don't feel I have answered you because you cannot comprehend what has been said, which is also why I will not further discuss things with you. Believe what you will... but please, stop embarassing your self.

[This message has been edited by Undead (edited 29 January 2004).]


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arx
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alright
you want to hear my opinion?
the answer is yes, in my opinion, a muslim can drink liquor or not do zakat and still be considered a muslim. i do not believe a muslim woman can marry a non-muslim man and still be considered a muslim.

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Monica
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.

[This message has been edited by Monica (edited 30 January 2004).]


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arx
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considered muslim by majority muslim scholars. i believe i stated that earlier.
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HisCrazyLover
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Please forgive me for being a little bit flustered but this seems crazy!

I wonder if you think of all things in your life as absolutes, black & white with no grey!

I wonder if you feel that because I was born into a roman catholic family but then chose Islam on my own, do you feel I am not a muslim?

Seems to me that regardless of whom you marry your faith is your faith. I could be wrong but this is my opinion.

Regards,
HCL


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Undead
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Please disregard arx He is wrong to think that his view is held by the majority of respectable scholars. He is entitled to believe that the woman is not a muslim, but this is not what the law of Islam dictates. Legally, which has nothing to do with personal opinion but rather standards set by the lawyers and scholars of the society concerned (not 'world view') the woman is indeed continued to be considered a Muslim. She has not committed shirk and has not rejected the oaths of shahada. The MARRIAGE, however is not considered sanctioned. Just like I had mentioned about the Taliban actions when they were in power. They are Muslims that violated Islamic laws but violating the law did not revoke their faith. Let us also keep in mind that their are several schools of Islamic law. In Egypt most are under the Maliki school which in terms of numbers is actually the majority. This majority does not agree with the statment made by arx... so I do not know which "majority" he is referring to. The Maliki standard is as follows: Shari`ah does not expressly prohibit or allow marriage between a Muslim woman and a Christian or a Jewish man. The Qur'an states not to give your daughter into marriage with an un-believer, but the Arabic word used is "mushrik" which means polythiest, so using it to blanket all non Muslims is not accurate. Jews are monotheists and Christians believe they only worship one god, although Muslims and Jews do not agree with the Christians in that respect. Obviously, those who consider the silence of the Qur'an regarding Jews and Christians spefically implies disapproval also would be of the opinion that God does not approve of this union; while those who do not consider the silence of the Qur'an to imply a disapproval would not consider marriage to be disapproved by God. It is not stated one way or the other so despite what arx thinks there is no absolute definition in this case.

It is clear that marriage between a Muslim man or a woman with a person ascribing to polytheism (shirk and rejection of shahada) is expressly prohibited by Islam. HOWEVER, despite it being prohibited it does not challenge the status of the woman being Muslim.

In Egypt in the last decade their have been a couple of high profile cases (Nasr Abu Zeid, Nawal Sawadi, etc.) in which hisba was called for. That is to say Islamic lawyers called the women to divorce their non-Muslim husbands. The fact they were called to divorce demonstrates that the LAW still regarded them as married. The LAW also still regarded the women as Muslim, which is why the women were called to divorce their husbands for not being so. If these women were no longer a Muslim then they would no longer be subject to the directives Islam, just as Christians or secular people are not subject to Islam. It is plain logic, and the "majority" has acknowledged it and demonstrated it in their behaviour.
arx may believe what he will, I don't seek further discussion with him on this subject. I am just providing background for the other readers who had questions regarding this.
The short of it is: Is a woman that is Muslim still a Muslim if she marries a non-Muslim man? Yes.
Is that marriage sanctioned by Islam? It is still debated when regarding Christian and Jewish men, and it is *prohibited* if the man does not believe in one of the three mentioned religions.
Since it is prohibited in the latter case, hisba may be demanded. The womans status as a Muslim is not challenged. The marriage is.

[This message has been edited by Undead (edited 30 January 2004).]

[This message has been edited by Undead (edited 30 January 2004).]


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arx
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ok i have talked to several muslims so far, they all say that she would no longer be considered a muslim. however, they also said that the woman should be stoned to death. i did a little research and it seems inconclusive. i have checked scholarly work and they would consider her an adulterer. i have read many times that she wouldn't be considered a muslim either, but now i can't say that is the majority scholarly view. her being an adulterer certainly, but not necessarialy a non-muslim. hmmm..... at this point in time i would have to concede to you undead. she would be an adulterer, not a non-muslim.

hcl: for calling yourself a muslim, that is one slutty screen name. have you no shame? you wouldn't happen to be one of those wetsern women we were talking about earlier, would you?

[This message has been edited by arx (edited 30 January 2004).]


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Undead
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Thus we come back to the fact that there are no "world views." Some believe she should be stoned, some don't. The Qur'an doesn't say, and even if it did a great many people would say to spare her; as we have seen recently in the cases in West Africa where the women involved were in adulterous extra-marital affairs. There are other examples I can use from the last post of yours but I am sure you get the idea... simply saying it is not absolute, and the fact that you have found so many interpretations supports that.

Anyway, this is why we are called Sunni, right? As per Sunnah we are to read the Qur'an ourselves, seek out knowledge and then weigh the arguements and decide which we think is more persuasive. Under Sunnah we must do what we *think* the Qur'an says, which is by definition 'interpretation.' This is why I say "Believe what you will" as the Sunnah instructs Muslims to permit others their beliefs unless they are breaking the law. Believe this: one hundred Muslims will have one hundred views.
Unfortunately many simply follow what they hear from the common people, and do not search for themselves from the higher resources. I applaud that you did your own research


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Undead
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Please let us return to the topic of "what is the typical Egyptian woman like" For me, I would say there are 5 types you will normally see: The secular type, the moderate Christian, the moderate Muslim, the fanatic Christian, and the fanatic Muslim.
In my circles the bulk are moderate Muslims, covering their hair at times and not at others. Has a Muslim value set, but doesn't know the Qur'an well and is put off by the amount of restrictions. Very concerned with getting married! !!! Very judgemental and jealous. Some very much want to work and have a career while others want to be home-makers or nab a rich husband so she can spend all her days making herself more beautiful. I know so many different types of Egyptians... and it is very difficult to summarize a people... anyone else want to help from this start?

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HisCrazyLover
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quote:

hcl: for calling yourself a muslim, that is one slutty screen name. have you no shame? you wouldn't happen to be one of those wetsern women we were talking about earlier, would you?[B]

Is this the way your mother taught you to speak to a woman? You decided insted of answering my question to try & put me down & make me seem less. You are just plain & simply Rude.

I have news for you, People who have such a close minded views on things & chose to speak in absolutes are doomed to a very unhappy life. Unless of course you enjoy conflict all the time.

By the way, it is YOUR dirty mind that makes my nick name "Slutty". The word lover is what I think you may be referring to & in this case I suggest you look it up. Lover, is neither a slutty word, or one to bring me shame.

You see? I had enough mannors to answer your question directly, I did not call you names. And you know what? It was quiet simple. Perhaps in the future you should take a minute before hitting the "submit reply" button.

HCL


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Sasy Cat
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Thank you Undead for your clear and concise explanation of Islamic views on mixed marriages. It is very helpful for the non-muslim population. The problem seems not to be with the message, but rather with some of the messengers. By the way, what is
"hisba"?

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Undead
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Hisba... it is a bit difficult to explain in English which is why I used Arabic. I don't think there is an equivalent word in English. I will try to explain it since there is no one word translation that I know of.
Hisba in the way I was using it is when a Muslim society calls for justice on a given situation in their midst. To demand Hisba action is to demand the upholding of virtue and discourage vice and debauchery. Maybe the best analogy is the "class action suit" in America and England where a segment of society may take legal action against a group that is offending a communitys sense of decency. As a community in America can sue to have a bar or nude club removed from their neighborhood, people in Muslim societies can uphold hisba and bring a suit against those that are aggressively offending their standards of decency. It must be very plain and even aggressive offense though. For example if one person enjoys criticising the Qur'an in his own home, no case can be brought against him. BUT if he goes to a masgid and does so, people will demand hisba be upheld. In the cases that a mentioned earlier, the reason hisba was invoked is because in each instance the spouse of a Muslim was making public statements in books, newspaper, and radio offending Muslim society. In some cases the people were being deliberatly obnoxious and hisba law was indeed enacted, in the case of Nawal Saadawi the courts found in her favor and she was not required to change her behaviour or divorce her husband.
Each community has different standards so it is rare for hisba cases to be called. Egypt is quite tolerant so the only times these cases are brought forth are when very highly respected Imams are offended and for that to happen the situation has to be very public. In other societies it can be more common. In some societies teachers are not allowed to teach that the Earth orbits the Sun.
I hope I could be of help!

[This message has been edited by Undead (edited 31 January 2004).]


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loriglenn
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Hi Undead:

I am a new poster here but have been following ES for awhile (am travelling to Egypt for the first time in March and am trying to learn all I can about the culture).
You described 5 different types of women, in your opinion, in Egypt. I am in the USA and would say we have the same types here plus more (as I'm sure you do in Egypt). And every country I have lived in I have found the same thing. Maybe deep down, people are just people? We certainly are shaped by our cultural influences, but we find the basic personality characteristics everywhere. This is a great thread and I look forward to reading more comments.


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Undead
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Hi Lori. While I would like to say that people are people, the way that those people behave, and what they believe in general does great vary from country to country. For example I did not find any significant segment of Thailands female population to be similar to the main groups in Egypt. There are fanatic Muslims in the States, but there numbers are insignificant where as in Egypt it is becoming all too common. I didn't find the women in Germany to be anywhere near as concerned about marriage as I find the women in Egypt to be. Etc, etc. I understand your point, but I do not agree that these people exist in equal ratios in every country. Each nation has its predominant patterns.
Nabbing a rich husband seems to be popular the world over :P

[This message has been edited by Undead (edited 01 February 2004).]


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Sasy Cat
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Undead: excellent explanation of "hisba" - very easy to understand, and Egypt appears to evoke it in an extremely fair manner. I appreciate your taking the time to insitefully explain some of Islam's finer points.
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loriglenn
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Hi Undead:

I totally agree with you that these characteristics are not manifested in equal proportions around the world. I guess what I really wanted to say is that for the most part, we all want the same thing; e.g. we want to find someone we love and who loves us and maybe have children and be treated with respect and have opportunities to "prosper" (by that I mean fulfill our dreams - whatever they may be)and be surrounded by family and friends that we love. I realize I am painting a rosy picture here and that life often doesn't work out that way. You are absolutely right, I would bet, that German women are not as preoccupied with getting married as Egyptian women are. That could be a result of culture/economics as German women, like many Western European/North American women have tremendous economic opportunities compared to many women in the world and do not have to rely on a man to support them. And despite that, I have known plenty of girls here whose main obsession is getting married. And in too many cases, the divorce comes 5, 10, 15 years later.
Re: women seeking rich husbands...LOL...I have an ongoing debate with a Mexican male colleague of mine about that. He totally agrees with you. I would never admit this to him, but I do think it is a global phenomena...believe me it happens here in my corner of the world.
Thanks for your thoughtful insights,
Lori


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Undead
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I have a funny story that happened in Egypt regarding this, but I don't presently have time to tell it.
Essentially women wanting wealthy men is no better or worse than men wanting beautiful women. Both typically wish to be loved for other reasons though, which is where it becomes an issue
On a side note;
I have one friend whose wife prefers to be told "You are beautiful" over "I love you." She is rather peculiar, but beautiful she is as well. Her reasoning is "everyone, even an ugly woman can find her darling that loves her. Beauty is more rare."

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Cindy
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I heard a lot of different opinions about Egiptian women. Of course, not from Egiptian but from foreigners who are living in Egypt. May I ask you a few plain questions? Not about their religion?

1) What Egiptiona women do after 18 y. o? I mean do they go to the Universities?
2) What kind of work Egyptian women do?
3) I heard that there are must be 1/3 of women at your Legislative Assembly(maybe government, I am not sure). Is it true?

I do realized that a lot of things depend on the social level of the family and so on...

Also I saw only a few Egyptian women when I was in Sharm El Sheik:
- one lady was with her 4 children and probaly with her husband at night club...I don't want to make any conclusions but I think it was not really good idea to be there for her 3 y. o. child. There were very loudly, crowded with foreign tourists and etc.
- two pretty young ladies, they were dressed in jeans and quite fashionably but with covered heads.
- a lady who works at guest relations desk at the hotel where I was staying about 12 days. She was very friendly, helpful and welcoming.
- a lady from souvenirs'shop was more then 20 years older me, so she could be my mother...She was dressed very formally. She didn't speak English but her smile was charming:-)

Your feedback is appreciated!


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