Weekly - yes even daily - stories like that coming up here on ES. Lately I realized that especially Russian women are getting treated unfairly by Egyptian men (or at least these ones are complaining the most here on this forum).
Girls, get yourself together, if you go on vacation in Egypt just don't hang out w/ Egyptian men. After all you must realize that you will not find your habibi like that, at least not in the touristic areas. There is no need then to update the Kunstkamera w/ new bad Egyptian guys and other sad stories to tell they are all sound alike anyway. I wonder if the Egyptian guys have a own website for stupid, naive Western women who they promised to get the stars from the sky, to love them til the end of time, then these individuals cheated on these women, took their money and starting the same thing with another girl????
All in once most of the time you can tell just by looking at someone if he is a slimball or not, the way he acts, dresses, talks too much etc. If you want to have fun with them that's okay but - please - don't expect more.
Posts: 30135 | From: The owner of this website killed ES....... | Registered: Feb 2004
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quote:Originally posted by Tigerlily: Lately I realized that especially Russian women are getting treated unfairly by Egyptian men (or at least these ones are complaining the most here on this forum).
I don't agree with u. They treat all tourists like that. (I don't talk about lucky exeptions). Just russian women can't give so much to them then european women. Egyption guys don't want to move to Russia, but many of them try to move to Europe. They try to find a wealthy european women and marry her. I spent lots of time on other sites with such topics and what I found is that the majority of girly who have relationsheep with resort habibies found out that at the same time their guys have relationsheep with foregn women. They ask for presents and money from foregn women as well. Some women from Europe even present their boyfriends cars. Not many of russian women who go there have such opportunity. They use all women despite the nationality and age. Just for different purposes.
Posts: 287 | From: Moscow Russia | Registered: Feb 2004
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quote:Originally posted by Lukoshko: [QUOTE]Originally posted by Tigerlily: [b] Lately I realized that especially Russian women are getting treated unfairly by Egyptian men (or at least these ones are complaining the most here on this forum).
I don't agree with u. They treat all tourists like that. (I don't talk about lucky exeptions). Just russian women can't give so much to them as european. Egyption guys don't want to move to Russia, but many of them try to move to Europe. They try to find a wealthy european women and marry her. I spent lots of time on other sites with such topics and what I found is that the majority of girly who have relationsheep with resort habibies find out that at the same time their guys have relationsheep with foregn women. They ask for presents and money from foregn women as well. Some women from Europe even present their boyfriends cars. Not many of russian women who go there have such opportunity. They use all women despite the nationality and age. Just for different purposes.
[/B][/QUOTE]
Posts: 287 | From: Moscow Russia | Registered: Feb 2004
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I think this 'Ammar' character should be reported to the authorities, to the Embassies, to the newspapers, as well as each and every other sleeze - both genders by the way - for whatever it's worth.
Monica
[This message has been edited by Monica (edited 06 March 2004).]
posted
Hi! I STAYED IN SHARM IN DECEMBER AND I MET A MAN CALLED OMAR! I WOULD SEE YOUR PHOTO TO CONTROL IF HE IS THE SAME PERSON! CAN YOU GIVE ME YOUR E-MAIL ADDRESS PLEASE? THANKS A LOT
quote:Originally posted by blau_frau: Hi people!
Starting from my first visit in Egypt on April 2003, from May to August (and somehow September & October) 2003 I had a "stabile" relationship with such a disgusting Egyptian guy. His name was Ammar. Every Egyptian named him Ammar, but he was used to introduce himself to foreign girls as “Omar – like Omar Sharif”, he was used to say! His real name, anyway, was Hany El Said Fauzy Ataja Beltezer – or some like this (it was a long I was not thinking about his complicated name); anyway I have his real and complete name from a copy of ours contract in arabic!! (I have and he not!!! Want to go to the Embassy and make something to prevent such a dangerous man to come somewhen in Europe and to be sure he will not play anyway dangerous game with other women, who he would like to ruin).
I was living with him in Sharm el Sheikh. He was assuring, acting, convincing me the whole time he was in love with me and meanwhile, I discovered, he was going out and having sex and promising also love and marriage to dozens of other girls, not one per week, more..
I know this for sure because at the end I managed to contact some of this girls: one from Greek and living in UK (Helena?), one from Swiss who did not believe in me and 2 day after went on going out with my “husband” (yes, I was also married ORFI!), and another from Russia (Irina – I know also her name and she called me once!!!).
I realized I was putting myself in a big mistake and trouble when he introduced me his wild and mad father to ask me for a real marriage.. His father already planned everything and when he knew I was a joung well educated architect and above all with a good working position, he strongly wanted and supported this very fast marriage!!!
Now I am clean from this dirty relationship and dirty feeling and better than before, even if much more poor in money and in time.
Here, but, I would like to know girls he was with!! I am really soooo much curious to know what was he telling other women when he was coming back home by me.. And I really want to prevent he succeed with other women as he did with me and Irina… So please, if you are some of this girl contact me friendly! really!!
PS: He is a very nice looking dark brown men – I also have picture to send you to compare the person.. Aged 22, but he was continuously telling to everybody to be 27-28.. and somehow he can pretend to be such old. He was working for “La Dolce Vita – The Desert Party”, selling ticket and so on. Not only: he was used to sell tickets also for the Bus Stop and El Fanar… but not only. Basicly he was used to earn a percentage for every customer he was getting to a shop, a discos and so on. So he was used to stay often on the road looking trying to know new people under the falsh character of a friedly person. His apartment was to El Noor, in front of the Delta Sharm.
I am a person who already had been living in foreign countries without having any problems with men or friends.
I always was able to point this differences and to behave according to these, the way not to be hurt and not to hurt anyone.
in Sharm (and Hurgada and Marsa Alam etc. etc.) is that local people always hide these cultural differences. In every single little thing the whole life there is a kind of worse copy of our culture: houses, resorts, shops, discos, music, dress, food, fun and then the whole life and kinds of behaviours of the whole Egyptian populations; even the language used.
[This message has been edited by blau_frau (edited 16 March 2004).]
posted
I reported him to the local police, but he told them my visa was expired... Policemen starded to joke and speak confideunsiously with Ammar while I could show on my faces still the sign of his brutal violence.
Who want to face such kind of relationships must know everything. Already now I am going on with this pourpose of information!!! And I succeed.. there are lots of women knowing te true and that are saving time and force...
[This message has been edited by blau_frau (edited 16 March 2004).]
posted
I apologyze with all the other english speaking people...
Maya
vedo che sei italiana, di Torino... Ho scritto un reconto sommario ma significativo della mia storia sul sito http://libera_madani.blog.tiscali.it inoltre esiste un forum italiano dove molte donne che hanno avuto un esperienza analoga alla mia a Sharm si sono conosciute. Io a Sharm ci ho vissuto fino a gennaio.. ma fortunatamente con Ammar ho chiuso definitivamente ad inizio ottobre!!! Dopo non gli ho voluto manco più parlare. Se si tratta della stessa persona posso dirti di cuore di stargli alla larga e leggendo la mia storia capirai i tanti perchè. Inoltre faccio parte anche di un gruppo su internet in italiano che sta facendo scoprire a tante ragazze italiani la fasullità di queste storie...Se vuoi unisciti a noi, troverai anche una foto di Ammar nella sezione foto e di nuovo la mia storia nella sezione documenti.
Non ti mando i link ai siti qui, perchè molte preferiscono tutelarsi però se vuoi saperne di più scrivimi a blau_frau@hotmail.it o a dani.l@libero.it
quote:Originally posted by maya38000: Hi! I STAYED IN SHARM IN DECEMBER AND I MET A MAN CALLED OMAR! I WOULD SEE YOUR PHOTO TO CONTROL IF HE IS THE SAME PERSON! CAN YOU GIVE ME YOUR E-MAIL ADDRESS PLEASE? THANKS A LOT
posted
Ciao cara, sto leggendo il tuo website...mi piace molto questa idea. Mi ha fatto anche dispiacere di sapere quello che ti ha fatto quello...Senti, devi fare attenzione alla tua salute ...Ammar e un zero.
Questa parte e veramente bella:
''Ma io ho voluto pensare che nella sua vita di sfigato gli fosse capitata una cosa buona, io, che lo avrei potuto cambiare e migliorare.''
Tanti saluti...e alla prossima.
Monica
quote:Originally posted by blau_frau: H i Monica! For sure I will do! I already reported him to the local police, but the result was that he told them my visa was expired and at the end the policeman leader was very hard to me!!! They starded to joke and spek confideunsiously with Ammar while I could show on my faces still the sign of his brutal violence against me. You have an italian name, if you can read italian on the website http://libera_madani.blog.tiscali.it you will be able to read my whole history (ok, just a summary but very clear). anyway I will do better and much more than report him. I was living enough there to understand lots of things and experience loads of bad experiences. Who wantto face such kind of relationships must know everything. Already now I am going on with this pourpose of information!!! And I succeed.. there are lots of women knowing te true and that are saving time and force...
[This message has been edited by Monica (edited 06 March 2004).]
fa bene leggere certi apprezzamenti da una persona molto ragionevole e perspicace (ho letto diversi tuoi commenti su vari forum ;-)
a presto!! ora sai anche un'altro posto dove trovarmi ;-)
quote:Originally posted by Monica: Ciao cara, sto leggendo il tuo website...mi piace molto questa idea. Mi ha fatto anche dispiacere di sapere quello che ti ha fatto quello...Senti, devi fare attenzione alla tua salute ...Ammar e un zero.
Questa parte e veramente bella:
''Ma io ho voluto pensare che nella sua vita di sfigato gli fosse capitata una cosa buona, io, che lo avrei potuto cambiare e migliorare.''
Tanti saluti...e alla prossima.
Monica
[This message has been edited by Monica (edited 06 March 2004).]
posted
Mi piace veramente molto il tuo website ...e molto interessante. Scrivi benissimo...che meraviglia di leggere quelle parole passionate. A real natural writer!
quote:Originally posted by blau_frau: Grazie Monica,
fa bene leggere certi apprezzamenti da una persona molto ragionevole e perspicace (ho letto diversi tuoi commenti su vari forum ;-)
a presto!! ora sai anche un'altro posto dove trovarmi ;-)
posted
Grazie cara! anche se come avrai forse letto i miei campi sono altri, apprezzo molto il tuo complimento!!!
(PS: sai che dopo aver letto un pò sui vari forum di egyptserch temevo un pò la tua opinione? ho superato una buona prova :-P )
quote:Originally posted by Monica: Mi piace veramente molto il tuo website ...e molto interessante. Scrivi benissimo...che meraviglia di leggere quelle parole passionate. A real natural writer!
posted
Ti ho lasciato il mio email sul tuo site! Adesso me ne vado a dormire. nella mia casa e mezzanotte! Credo che da tu sono le sei di mattina...Buona giornata!
quote:Originally posted by blau_frau: Grazie cara! anche se come avrai forse letto i miei campi sono altri, apprezzo molto il tuo complimento!!!
(PS: sai che dopo aver letto un pò sui vari forum di egyptserch temevo un pò la tua opinione? ho superato una buona prova :-P )
those who speak about bad guys in the red sea, go to kunstkamera those who speak about gays there r thousands of sites about this. those who want to attack a religion can go to any debate site.. to all of those, please keep Egypt Search special.
posted
To Egy_prince Learn to respect freedom before asking such a thing! and above all, read before speaking!!!
quote:Originally posted by egy_prince: The attack of Kunstkamera, step by step...
Hope Egypt Search keep its unique nature
those who speak about bad guys in the red sea, go to kunstkamera those who speak about gays there r thousands of sites about this. those who want to attack a religion can go to any debate site.. to all of those, please keep Egypt Search special.
quote:Originally posted by egy_prince: The attack of Kunstkamera, step by step...
Hope Egypt Search keep its unique nature
those who speak about bad guys in the red sea, go to kunstkamera those who speak about gays there r thousands of sites about this. those who want to attack a religion can go to any debate site.. to all of those, please keep Egypt Search special.
Sorry, would u be so kind to tell me what can I speak here about. Could u mention plz allowed topics.
Thanks
Posts: 287 | From: Moscow Russia | Registered: Feb 2004
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posted
Again again again, everytime the same stories, but this is a public forum and it is from my personal opinion the best media to make such topics public and to discuss them. Whereelse should we do this. Yes, some maybe bored by this, but we have to make it public to reduce step by step that those stories happen. And thank you Monica, that you have always an open ear for everyone and that you always try to help. It is good to know for everyone, that there is the possiblity of going to the tourist police. Another possiblity, by the way, is to mention the story at the General Manager of the Hotel where he is working. Some hotels maybe make consequences out of it and the guy looses his job. But also you Egyptian men, who you are decent, smart, honest and true: you can do as much as we can: talk to/about people. Show them, that their behaviour is also not right in the eyes of other Egyptians. Show them, that honest, true relationships to European woman work and that they even "gain" more out of such a relationship, talking about love, harmony, respect AND money, lifestandard etc. It is also the duty of you Egyptians to show whats wrong and right. You are also responsible for the opinion which the world will have of Egypt. Right now is getting slowly step by step as bad as the opinion about Turkey is, mainly in Germany: a country of cheaters and liars, just nice to spend a very cheap holiday, but not worth to have contact with the people because they have a bad character. Posts: 53 | From: Frankfurt, Germany | Registered: Feb 2004
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quote:Originally posted by Jutta: Again again again, everytime the same stories, but this is a public forum and it is from my personal opinion the best media to make such topics public and to discuss them. Whereelse should we do this. Yes, some maybe bored by this, but we have to make it public to reduce step by step that those stories happen. And thank you Monica, that you have always an open ear for everyone and that you always try to help. It is good to know for everyone, that there is the possiblity of going to the tourist police. Another possiblity, by the way, is to mention the story at the General Manager of the Hotel where he is working. Some hotels maybe make consequences out of it and the guy looses his job. But also you Egyptian men, who you are decent, smart, honest and true: you can do as much as we can: talk to/about people. Show them, that their behaviour is also not right in the eyes of other Egyptians. Show them, that honest, true relationships to European woman work and that they even "gain" more out of such a relationship, talking about love, harmony, respect AND money, lifestandard etc. It is also the duty of you Egyptians to show whats wrong and right. You are also responsible for the opinion which the world will have of Egypt. Right now is getting slowly step by step as bad as the opinion about Turkey is, mainly in Germany: a country of cheaters and liars, just nice to spend a very cheap holiday, but not worth to have contact with the people because they have a bad character.
Jutta, you are perfectly right that this is a public forum and everyone has a right to express their opinion. And since sad stories like these abound, as a consequence we have to read them.
On the other hand Egypt does not mean only this. I think that excessive discussion of the effect of Egyptian men on foreign women leads to less attention given to other aspects of life in Egypt. We can also lose the interest and precious contributions of educated Egyptians who post in this forum. I mean, if there was a forum about your country and all you saw were posts from foreigners telling about horrible experiences they had with some of your compatriots, and then somehow extending it to the rest of the population, would you be interested to post in this forum?
I don't know whether there are too many not-so-honorable Egyptians or too many Egyptian-obsessed foreign women or both, but the importance of this subject in the overall picture of life in Egypt is really exagerrated. This is my opinion. In view of this public forum, please allow me to express it.
posted
Blau-frau, yes indeed the relationship you had with the "Moon"-man was more than ...... but you need to get other that. Be thankful to realize so quickly what kind of person he is. Yes and make sure these other women are aware what they have gotten into also. Imagine you would have married him, you would have a child together, investing so much money into your both future which actually boils down to one big lie.
I lived long enough in the country to understand the people. Stay for a while in Cairo - it is certainly different. The guys are single and living with their parents up until they get married. So it is already a good sign if you don't sleep with a person straight away and he presents you to his parents. You got one foot in the door ..... if you really want to work this relationship and want to settle for marriage. You can get to know a person better while doing daily activities together - not only surrounded by the flair of holiday like in these resorts.
I could tell you so many more things and believe me I learned my lessons too.
Please stay away from these resort gigolos and players. I just want to say again: There are many, many good-looking, smart and honest Egyptian guys out there who would have treated you differently.
I don't see a problem if an Egyptian tells me he speaks a language and actually he doesn't or not so well. At least he's trying and he wants to impress. Men want to impress their women. Take your time if you ever fall for someone else again and check him out more carefully before rushing into something you might later regret. I still love Egyptians, if they are male or female, everyone is friendly. Yes sometimes they are annoying with questions and other stuff but its because I am looking different. And hey, at least this means they showing an interest in me. Egyptians in general have a great personality, most of them are down to earth, their like to talk and are humorous ..... Gosh, I don't know why I didn't stay in Egypt. Well I didn't marry an Egyptian. But I am always back on vacation. I need this time to find myself. In Germany people in general a more reserved, not very helpful etc. ......
Blau-frau, I didn't understand one thing in your earlier post: What do you mean about cultural revolution? You mean Egyptians should give up their traditions and values to act like Europeans? Please clarify here. Thanks you.
[This message has been edited by Tigerlily (edited 09 March 2004).]
Posts: 30135 | From: The owner of this website killed ES....... | Registered: Feb 2004
| IP: Logged |
I decided to remain in the same Sharm longer in order to understand more and I got in contact lots of times with egyptians of different class in Cairo, Aleiskandria and in the countrisides around. I had very good inpressions and feelings towards these people. I also experienced very nice happenings involving very gentle nice and kind egyptians.
i do agree and understand what all the people in egyptserch are going to tell that in this turistic place is everything too much different: I never supposed that going to Sharm meant "to experience egypt".. therefore I tried to experience Egypt in Cairo and so on... But I think that is not jet enough known the excessive freedom of sexual costumes in Sharm, ecc. ecc. And the problem lies in the fact that most of western people do know that muslims are quite strenght on this matter. We even do not realize that muslims could have had easy sex before being married... People help themselfs with the religion believings. One guy, egyptian and muslim, also pretended to convert to christinism by going into an italian church, let him blessed from the priest and promising to marry this woman in front of GOD!!!
[This message has been edited by blau_frau (edited 16 March 2004).]
posted
If you don't like the subject, ignore it and post your own may be you can attract "interest and precious contributions of educated Egyptians who post in this forum."(Whatever that means)[/B][/QUOTE]
You are totally missing the point here.
Of course I don't even intend to regulate anything on this forum. I am simply expressing my opinion. Go beck to what you wrote yourself - people post what's on their mind. There is nowhere written that we have all to agree with each other or else.
I have as much right to reply to this thread - to any thread - as you have a right to write in it.
Since I registered in ES and I kept readying a lot of posts similar to this one ! I never replied to any of them as I thought they are really a waste of time ( at least for me) . However I stared to ask all my friends who went for vacation to the Egyptian resorts about such incidence.
I have at least 10 girl friends who went to Sharm and no one faced such a situation. Two days ago my very close Italian friend "A" came from Sharm and I asked her if she has encountered any kind of these incidences that I keep reading about in EC Forum?” she answered “ not at all I had a great time” and added “of course men who works in the hotel and restaurants try to flirt with you , but it is up to you what to do and whether to take it further or not”
Her words enlightened me and I decided to reply to your message. I honestly can not imagine my friend A ( who is super intellectual and well accomplished ) to fall in love with a 22 Y old guy , with no education , and marry him after couple of weeks or even months.
If such a guy approached her ,or even me, and he was so cute and witty and she fancied him . Then she might go out and flirt and even more with him ( which is any body’s right ) a part from the norm and tradition of the country. And by doing ( having good time) you will not be insulting any one in Egypt. But to marry him and believe all the S about him being in love, excuse me! This is being senseless
If you fall for someone who is much younger than you, not educated, never travelled beyond the borders of these resorts. What kind of relation you except! You have nothing in common, very poor communication (due to language barriers) and above all culture differences. If you want to convince me that you really thought this is love and believe that you are building a marriage institution , then you must think I am the STUPID type.
When I read some of posted phrases like “The local man made that place a kind of sexual tourism place” Excuse me, if the local man did not found clients that how could he started in the first place!
These guys are professionals, It is male prostitutiom, even if they did not say it. They add flavour for their acts by saying the LOVE words and legitimate it by ORFI marriage.
If you want to believe that is more than SEX this is your problem, and for him inorder to provide sexual services he needs to be paid.
I also think that if you examine all the girls that falls for these kind of men you will find them sharing certain characteristic. I lived in Europe and I know how difficult it is to start a relation and hear the LOVE words and marriage, that became so rare.
So if any women want to fall for the very very obvious deception and emotional blackmail, then this is what she wants and nothing ( your warning and these discussion) will help preventing it.
I am not defending these horrible men in these resorts, but actually putting more the blame on the women who falls for it.
Sorry for being so Bold, but I think someone has to say it.
I wish you will experience so much lies, then you will understand! anyway I am not complaining or insult anyone. I just wanted to know other women who had the "luck" to meet that men. Anyway: Ammar did not look 22 at all! And more: he was telling me he was 28! I asked him thousends of times about and the answer was always the same. All the people I knew there were his friends all telling me the same lies. At the end I forced myself to learn arabic numbers, let him not know about and then asking him a document. Second he was telling me lies about everything and probably because my education I was not able to undrestand why. Third: I went often to a tipical sex free resort place in Italy, being always able to protect my self from this kind of situation. I was not complianing at all in my 2 posts about what I experienced (that at the end brought me to a better understanding of people), I complain, instead, your intelligence able to judge very quickly about people and situation. Just able to criticize the others thinking to be above them. Sorry. That's what I think. (People should be really able to read completely the post and understand!!!)
quote:Originally posted by Mooly El Din: Dear Every body
Since I registered in ES and I kept readying a lot of posts similar to this one ! I never replied to any of them as I thought they are really a waste of time ( at least for me) . However I stared to ask all my friends who went for vacation to the Egyptian resorts about such incidence.
I have at least 10 girl friends who went to Sharm and no one faced such a situation. Two days ago my very close Italian friend "A" came from Sharm and I asked her if she has encountered any kind of these incidences that I keep reading about in EC Forum?” she answered “ not at all I had a great time” and added “of course men who works in the hotel and restaurants try to flirt with you , but it is up to you what to do and whether to take it further or not”
Her words enlightened me and I decided to reply to your message. I honestly can not imagine my friend A ( who is super intellectual and well accomplished ) to fall in love with a 22 Y old guy , with no education , and marry him after couple of weeks or even months.
If such a guy approached her ,or even me, and he was so cute and witty and she fancied him . Then she might go out and flirt and even more with him ( which is any body’s right ) a part from the norm and tradition of the country. And by doing ( having good time) you will not be insulting any one in Egypt. But to marry him and believe all the S about him being in love, excuse me! This is being senseless
If you fall for someone who is much younger than you, not educated, never travelled beyond the borders of these resorts. What kind of relation you except! You have nothing in common, very poor communication (due to language barriers) and above all culture differences. If you want to convince me that you really thought this is love and believe that you are building a marriage institution , then you must think I am the STUPID type.
When I read some of posted phrases like “The local man made that place a kind of sexual tourism place” Excuse me, if the local man did not found clients that how could he started in the first place!
These guys are professionals, It is male prostitutiom, even if they did not say it. They add flavour for their acts by saying the LOVE words and legitimate it by ORFI marriage.
If you want to believe that is more than SEX this is your problem, and for him inorder to provide sexual services he needs to be paid.
I also think that if you examine all the girls that falls for these kind of men you will find them sharing certain characteristic. I lived in Europe and I know how difficult it is to start a relation and hear the LOVE words and marriage, that became so rare.
So if any women want to fall for the very very obvious deception and emotional blackmail, then this is what she wants and nothing ( your warning and these discussion) will help preventing it.
I am not defending these horrible men in these resorts, but actually putting more the blame on the women who falls for it.
Sorry for being so Bold, but I think someone has to say it.
posted
Let me first apologize if my post has offended you. I did not mean to judge you ( who Iam to judge anyone)
I rather commented on the whole deception plot I keep reading about in this forum.
As for experiencing such a lie! I might have experienced and will experience some kind of deceptions, but it will be very difficult even impossible to fall for this very obvious lie. Sorry!
posted
Let me first apologize if my post has offended you. I did not judge you , rather commented on the whole deception plot I keep reading about in this forum.
As for experiencing such a lie! I might have experienced and will experience some kind of deceptions, but it will be very difficult even impossible to fall for this very obvious lie. Sorry!
posted
Do you think I was really so blind? Do you think that at the first thought I think : oh, dear guy, he loves me!
We flirted togeter. Than I went back home and he started to call me more than one time a day. I am a person who likes to travel and to live abroad, I thought to go back there to experience better Egypt and see if this relationship had good possibilities.
To let you understand: <b>my big disappointment in Egypt was my best friend, egyptian</B> .. who told me unbelievable thousends of lies and why? he wanted to open my eyes but hide me lots of things..
[This message has been edited by blau_frau (edited 16 March 2004).]
posted
Mooly, let me share u ur astonishment about such huge number of pretend-to-be-naive-western-girl versus those who seem-to-be-irresistible-Egyptians as u siad, it is well known here that westerners r very controllable, strong-feeling, tough 2 b convinced by something cold "love" as most of them r practical and materialistic (again no generalization) but this is what is siad here comparing emotional easterners, anyway such a comparison isn't the target, but with all such things, we read tens of stories about well-educated, most-beautiful, good-characteristic, and wealthy girl, after meeting some barely-educated, penniless, fair-looking guy, 4 many times won't exceed their visit-days, the poor victim fall in the mighty hunter, how come? and only after 2-4 months chatting (if even this step happened), it is the next visit..to do what? to have sex or orfi marriage, why? coze this their "lifelove", if it is so easy, please let me join such a poo-victim-mighty-hunter club, maybe i'll change my mind, i think the reason is hidden in girls' subconscience, they look 4 that, being adventurous by nature, lacking love, easily deceived (by really tricky-clever opportunist).. so the solution is.. take it easy girls, and think twice and trice before going in such adventure.. before crying over split "life"..
Posts: 66 | From: Cairo | Registered: Feb 2004
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posted
I still believe that a huge part of this whole 'deception' concept, stems from a great lack of knowledge, vis à vis the Egyptian culture of today's 70 million.
Bluntly informing foreigners about how the Egyptian class dominated societies perceive women, that either have pre-marital sex, and /or get into a quick Orfi marriage, after a very short period of time, is a MUST.
quote:Originally posted by wacobaco: Mooly, let me share u ur astonishment about such huge number of pretend-to-be-naive-western-girl versus those who seem-to-be-irresistible-Egyptians as u siad, it is well known here that westerners r very controllable, strong-feeling, tough 2 b convinced by something cold "love" as most of them r practical and materialistic (again no generalization) but this is what is siad here comparing emotional easterners, anyway such a comparison isn't the target, but with all such things, we read tens of stories about well-educated, most-beautiful, good-characteristic, and wealthy girl, after meeting some barely-educated, penniless, fair-looking guy, 4 many times won't exceed their visit-days, the poor victim fall in the mighty hunter, how come? and only after 2-4 months chatting (if even this step happened), it is the next visit..to do what? to have sex or orfi marriage, why? coze this their "lifelove", if it is so easy, please let me join such a poo-victim-mighty-hunter club, maybe i'll change my mind, i think the reason is hidden in girls' subconscience, they look 4 that, being adventurous by nature, lacking love, easily deceived (by really tricky-clever opportunist).. so the solution is.. take it easy girls, and think twice and trice before going in such adventure.. before crying over split "life"..
[This message has been edited by Monica (edited 11 March 2004).]
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In other words let tourists know what to expect, if they have sex in Egypt! wether it involves a love story or not!
quote:Originally posted by Monica: I still believe that a huge part of this whole 'deception' concept, stems from a great lack of knowledge, vis à vis the Egyptian culture of today's 70 million.
Bluntly informing foreigners about how the Egyptian class dominated societies perceive women, that either have pre-marital sex, and /or get into a quick Orfi marriage, after a very short period of time, is a MUST.
[This message has been edited by Monica (edited 11 March 2004).]
posted
It's obvious here that blau_frau was really mistreated in Egypt -it is so so so unfortunate and so painful to hear this - as it was for MotherEgypt who was mistreated in Russia by the way.
It is so horrible to even imagine that she, and/or others have been beaten by a fellow Egyptian, and then made fun of by other fellow Egyptians. I am really, truly sorry for that. And that was so so unfair.
Nevertheless, it tells us in all evidence that there is still abuse and corruption, and it should be reported in every way in order to protect and preserve Egypt from those cunning individuals - and protect foreigners from those horrible creatures that do NOT represent the entire population.
On the other hand, foreigners like blau_frau should be made aware that the REAL EGYPTIAN CULTURE is exactly the opposite of what happened to her.
It is also essential that foreigners UNDERSTAND the implications of getting involved with people they don't know anything about.
I can't blame blau_frau for feeling resentful towards Egyptians at the moment, because of her very recent painful experience that included violence and humiliation, even if it breaks my heart ...Can anyone?
quote:Originally posted by blau_frau: <b>I think that some people showing their way of thinking in this forum only show me how little is their knowledge of freedom of thought. I must suppose you are egyptian and because I think tis discussion is becoming vey low in tone and useless, I will never appear here again. I just invite again to read and understand before writing their own opinion.
I am not at all crying because now I can much more aprecciate all what I have in terms of wealthiness and freedom in despite of what some bad guys in Sharm and you writing show me what you have.
A last thing: when I was beaten by Ammar (of course as western women I returned him, even if of course I was much more weak), I went uselessly to the police showing my black eye and other kinds of wounds. the result was right the same of you guy: lots of men laughing and confortably speaking with Ammar dealed right as an old friend. then Ammar told about my expired Visa and the police leader not only made to me a bad gesture like "your head is cut!" but he explain he would trow me out of Egypt like rubbish! And at the end suggested me to go to renew my Visa in a 100km far away town (into the desert) accompanied from my own executioner (but, oh, sorry, forgetting) my ridiculous falsh husband Ammar. Is this orfi a riciculous contract only under convenience? and what about your police service? think.. your way for understandings and freedom is far away from our times! and thanks to you my believings of Egypt is now much more worse have no more words to spend about!
(Just only for Monica: it would be nice to stay in contact with you, but I do not want anymore to have to do with this non-culture!) </b>
[This message has been edited by Monica (edited 11 March 2004).]
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Blau_Frau, please don't leave this forum. You have to be aware that this is an open forum and EVERYONE has a right to post his/her opinion.
Yes, indeed what you have been through is very hurtful. I can feel with you. Also I must admit that I was beaten couple of times by my Egyptian ex-fiancee. It could have been also a European man but in this case he was my first love and it hurted pretty much for a long time. I am not on this board here to complain - probably because what happened to me is years ago and times heals (almost all) wounds - but women/men need to understand what they are getting possibly into if they fall for someone from a totally different cultural background. I know out there a many proofs that relationsships like these work but you hear and see many more bad things.
Blau-Frau, my story is gone long time ago and your story is over now too. You need to accept that other countries have other cultures, traditions, a different mentality. Sometimes it is hard to accept certain things, to fit in even if you are trying so much. You can't wish for a "cultural revolution", it doesn't make a sense. People are different.
Blau_Frau, you really need to look forward, a country like Egypt has many beautiful sides. Hopefully you will return one day and have many more nicer experiences.
And you are a great woman and someone else will show you that you are worth so much more.
[This message has been edited by Tigerlily (edited 11 March 2004).]
[This message has been edited by Tigerlily (edited 11 March 2004).]
Posts: 30135 | From: The owner of this website killed ES....... | Registered: Feb 2004
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blau_frau, what can i say.. i think u misunderstood my post totally, is there a word in it shows that i'm defending such Egyptian monester? on the contrary..i resent and hate him more than u can imagine, i don't want to say more than u..coze of course u would think i'm exaggerating + sure u r the recent victim, whom no one can imagine her sufferings and hurt feelings, but believe me, i hate ur guy before seeing him for his deeds that destroy any nice image about Egyptians, and hate him one more time after hearing ur sad story..please forgive my harsh words (which were not addressed to u directly) maybe the tone of my post was not clear..the matter is..i really believe in western girls, their independence, their experiences in life, their characters, their way of living, their high eduction..and i'm so amazed how girls with such good qualities fall easily in such ignorant hunters' net.. see my point? i'm with u body and soul..still amazed of that easiness some western girls r falling in naive ambushes, which its results didn't affect u only..no..it affects me indirectly..just imagine once u r sitting on ur desk on the beach..and u ask the girl beside u for match .. and u recieve only a look like a dagger aimed at ur heart..as if u r a raper..just because u r egyptian..and she heard alot about Egyptian playboys..imagine after talking with two Dutch girls 4 two hours..they praising u (while u r just ur own self) ur character..ur behaviour..ur way of thinking..saying they couldn't believe they met one Egyptian with such a good character..even i was pleased with their praise..still feel very sad coze this is their general idea about Egyptians till simple and normal one comes and change it..got me? and why i hate ur guy..and i'm trying to convince victims like u ..not to give them the opportiunity to achieve their tricks? ...beating a woman? my God..this is the last thing i can imagine a gentelman whoever he is.. to do so.., blau_frau please accept my appology (if it could help) on behave all Egyptians..u have to know ( and u'll know if u give urself another chance) that such kind of man u r talking about..doesn't deserve to be called a MAN..befoer calling him Egyptian..please stay at this forum..help others to follow my aforesaid advice..to think twice and trice..before going in such adventure..and if do..do it with fully-opend-eyes..accept my appology again about my post if it hurts u.. Posts: 66 | From: Cairo | Registered: Feb 2004
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show me how little is their knowledge of freedom of thought. I must suppose you are Egyptian”
So in other words you assume that we are Egyptians, because we have little knowledge of freedom of thoughts”.!!!!!! ( I guess you mean freedom of expression)
You posted here to share with members of ES your story, and this is your right. Myself and others have expressed our views and this is our right also. This is called freedom of expression. If you did not like our replies this is your problem not ours.
First you blame what happened to the fact that Sharm is a sexual tourist resort, then you decide not to write in the forum and blame that to the fact that Egyptian has no knowledge or respect of freedom of expression. If you like to act as a victim then suit yourself, but please stop blaming the Egyptians.
Last year I met a German women in a French Ski resort. We skiing together and afterward, she told me that she is here for few days to recover after a terrible experience in Italy. She said that she met an Italian guy in the park and this guy invited her to dinner and was very nice to her and asked out again ,,,etc . One night she went with him to a bar and ended in his place and they had sex. The rest of the story is very obvious, the guy stop answering her calls, and told her that he not interested anymore. The women blamed herself for falling into this obvious trap and went to a retreat to contemplate, she did not blamed the Italian population!
Dear Monica “ protect foreigners from those horrible creatures that do NOT represent the entire population”
These stories is well known and there are couple of sites and every one Sharm and other resorts knows about these stories, but still it happens. In our opinion do you think that it is because of the ignorance, As I said before I have many friends who went to Sharm and non of them came back with a boyfriend, did any of your friends in Canada, who visited Sharm have encountered similar situation?
Unfortunately, This is a filthy profession that some Egyptian are specialist in! What can we do, I agree that the system must be more co-operative, but I guess they this every day ! and as you are married there is little they can do, except if you filled an official complain with witnesses which I guess you did not do!
Monica again you said “ It's obvious here that blau_frau was really mistreated in Egypt” . Allow to say “Blau_frau was mistreated by an individual that she chose with her free well as a husband” So whether this happened in Egypt or the Eskimo, this will make no difference!
In the past, I made bad choices but, I never blamed the race of my partner or the country I was living in! I blamed myself for a bad choice.
I will speak no more on the matter, became pretty exhausting one !
blau_frau described a mistreatment by more than one Egyptian. She described being mistreated in Egypt by the police people, as well as by another Egyptian male, she thought was her friend.
I do believe that it is in the woman's hand to get into a risky relationship or not, and I stated that, in different terms and even in different languages, on many many many posts related to this topic all over ES...no question about it.
blau_frau has an Italian website where she told her story in full details, it is extremely touching as she is a very highly educated Italian woman, and she admits that she was driven by passion.
What I feel is not 'sorry' for the outcome of such a risky venture, but rather sorry that other fellow Egyptians/police mistreated her, in alliance with the man/boyfriend in question. I know exactly what types these people are but I know the culture and you do too...but 'others' don't and it's so hard to understand, when you are NOT Egyptian, that Egypt is a 'class ' dominated country.
I repeatedly recommend to all foreigners NOT to have sex in Egypt/resorts with the 'help' turned 'gigolos', and some have criticised that term, but I still continue to say so - if there are exceptions to this rule that's what they are: exceptions - And I repeatedly explain that 'decent' Egyptians do not act in this 'low' and inhuman manner.
Hoping that some will get the idea one day!
quote:Originally posted by Mooly El Din:
Dear Monica “ protect foreigners from those horrible creatures that do NOT represent the entire population”
These stories is well known and there are couple of sites and every one Sharm and other resorts knows about these stories, but still it happens. In our opinion do you think that it is because of the ignorance, As I said before I have many friends who went to Sharm and non of them came back with a boyfriend, did any of your friends in Canada, who visited Sharm have encountered similar situation?
Monica again you said “ It's obvious here that blau_frau was really mistreated in Egypt” . Allow to say “Blau_frau was mistreated by an individual that she chose with her free well as a husband” So whether this happened in Egypt or the Eskimo, this will make no difference!
In the past, I made bad choices but, I never blamed the race of my partner or the country I was living in! I blamed myself for a bad choice.
I will speak no more on the matter, became pretty exhausting one !
Cheers
[This message has been edited by Monica (edited 12 March 2004).]
Monica, Next time I am in Canada I will come and visit you. I am really looking forward to meet you in person. Give me your contact send them to my email.
I will send you a note in a few minutes...wonderful!
Cheers!
quote:Originally posted by Mooly El Din: Amen!
Monica, Next time I am in Canada I will come and visit you. I am really looking forward to meet you in person. Give me your contact send them to my email.
UBBFriend: Email this page to someone!
Credo che da tu sono le sei di mattina...Buona giornata!
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