posted
Does anybody know if Maat-a-ka-Re[Hathshepsut] was the first female to reign as a female? All other female rulers I have read ruled as consorts of their sons[such as Tiye or etc] so I am curious what other female pharaohs has there been?
Posts: 8675 | From: Tukuler al~Takruri as Ardo since OCT2014 | Registered: Feb 2003
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quote:Originally posted by ausar: Does anybody know if Maat-a-ka-Re[Hathshepsut] was the first female to reign as a female? All other female rulers I have read ruled as consorts of their sons[such as Tiye or etc] so I am curious what other female pharaohs has there been?
I recall thinking that she was first [dynastic female Pharaoh not as a consort] in a discussion here some time back, but was told there were others before her.
posted
Some searching shows that Queen Sobekneferu (aka Nefrusobek) of the 12th dynasty certainly preceded Hatshepsut (but without taking the title "Pharaoh" and that there may (but probably wasn't) have been a queen Nitocris in the 6th dynasty.
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posted
^^Yes, I have heard the exact same things Yom just brought up.-- that Sobeknefru may have been the first female pharoah and perhaps Nitocris before her.
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Some searching shows that Queen Sobekneferu (aka Nefrusobek) of the 12th dynasty certainly preceded Hatshepsut (but without taking the title "Pharaoh" and that there may (but probably wasn't) have been a queen Nitocris in the 6th dynasty.
Which is the point being addressed, the first female ruler to rule under the title of a Pharaoh. Lol.
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This queen is one of the most disputed persons of the archaic period. Not all the scholars agree with the eventuality that she could actually have reigned. It is sure that she was Horus DEN 's mother as shown on a seal impression recently discovered in the Tomb T of Umm el Qa'ab: she is 'mwt nswt' beside the name of Den thus it is also probable that she was the Horus Djet 's wife (Lauer, 1966, speculated a further parentage as Horus Djer' s daughter, but tha's not provable). Her Abydos tomb (Y) is close to that of the husband Djet (Z);the stela here drawn,now in the Louvre, was found outside the tomb by Petrie in 1900. The excavator first thought it belonged to a male ruler. At Abydos there's also Merneith's funerary enclosure; it's the easternmost of the group built N.E. of Peribsen's Western Mastaba and S.E. of the enclosure of Djet. The Saqqara mastaba 3503 is the only one that can be attributed to her; it's just north of S 3504 (Sekhemkasedj) of the reign of Djet. The seal impressions are named to Den. The reign of a female ruler, already before the middle of the first dyn., must not seem too strange: her husband Djet could have died after a brief reign of about 10 years (probabily he began to reign-and married- when he was already old because his predecessor Djer had a very long reign) and her son Den could have been too young for the throne. Anyhow there is no title or serekh which could clarify the position she held. The mentioned seal impression of Den did name Merneith but the similar piece dated to Qa'a omits this queen. Therefore only the two tombs and the two stelas induce to think she was a person of a status fairly comparable to that of a King. Indeed it is probable that in the mentality of the ancient egyptian her condition of rulership was never accepted or recognized, surely not like it was for Nitokerty,Nefrwsobek,Hatshepswt and Cleopatra. Merneith's name is almost wholly attested in Abydos except from the following few pieces: it appears on a stone vessels(unknown origin) and on some vessels fragments (from Saqqara),on an ivory vessel (Saqqara), and on a beautiful unprovenanced Pavian statuette (Kaplony K.B.I.A.F. p. 91 ff., plates XX-XXIII) of the Michailidis collection.
Some searching shows that Queen Sobekneferu (aka Nefrusobek) of the 12th dynasty certainly preceded Hatshepsut (but without taking the title "Pharaoh" and that there may (but probably wasn't) have been a queen Nitocris in the 6th dynasty.
Which is the point being addressed, the first female ruler to rule under the title of a Pharaoh. Lol.
Which is why I addressed it. Ausar asked for the first female pharoah, not the first with the title "pharaoh," so I wasn't sure if he meant with the title or genuinely female ruler of Egypt recognized as the leader (she wasn't a consort).
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Which is why I addressed it. Ausar asked for the first female pharoah, not the first with the title "Pharaoh," so I wasn't sure if he meant with the title or genuinely female ruler of Egypt recognized as the leader (she wasn't a consort).
If the female ruler wasn't considered a "Pharaoh", meaning ruling under the title of a Pharaoh, how then can you consider her the first female "Pharaoh". That is the point I was trying to get across. Besides, take a look at the thread's title, and this from its author:
quote:Originally posted by ausar:
Does anybody know if Maat-a-ka-Re[Hathshepsut] was the first female to reign as a female? All other female rulers I have read ruled as consorts of their sons[such as Tiye or etc] so I am curious what other female pharaohs has there been?
Now of course, that latter question is rather general, considering that Cleopatra too, was a female Pharaoh.
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posted
Uhhh! Guys. The term "Pharaoh" was not even used until the 18th dynasty. New Kingdom. Evolved from the term "Per aa" = "Great House" One of the titles given to the ruler, or "King" if you prefer.
So...Ausar, what do you think? Are you searching for the first female ruler? or the first female Pharaoh?
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posted
What was the term used for a ruler in ancient Egypt before per-aa? Yes, I am searching for the first female ruler of ancient Egypt.
Posts: 8675 | From: Tukuler al~Takruri as Ardo since OCT2014 | Registered: Feb 2003
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posted
One problem is that 'pharaoh' or ruler had many epithets and was basically called by many titles and names.
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posted
Semantics aside, yes we are referring to the first female ruler of "unified" ancient Egypt [i.e. presuming that is what Ausar was referring to], under the formal Kemetian crown. Many of us by now have an idea of what that crown looks like, I hope.
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