quote:Originally posted by markellion: Does anyone have pictures of symbols of any writing that would be inspiration for Egyptian hieroglyphics? Could Kerma/Kush have writing predating Egypt?
"An inspired invention - hieroglyphic writing in Africa"
quote:Originally posted by markellion: I first got curious because of the old article "Nubian Monarchy Called Oldest"
it says
"Dr. Williams said the dating is based on correlations of artistic styles in the Nubian pottery with similar styles in predynastic Egyptian pottery, which is relatively well dated.
He said some of the Nubian artifacts bore disconnected symbols resembling those of Egyptian hieroglyphics that were not readable.
"They were on their way to literacy," Dr. Williams said, "probably quite close to Egypt in this respect."
And if Egyptian writing was inspired by Kerma it would follow what Diodorus said completely
"4. We must now speak about the Ethiopian writing which is called hieroglyphic among the Egyptians, in order that we may omit nothing in our discussion of their antiquities. Now it is found that the forms of their letters take the shape of animals of every kind, and of the members of the human body, and of implements and especially carpenters' tools; for their writing does not express the intended concept by means of syllables joined one to another, but by means of the significance of the objects which have been copied and by its figurative meaning which has been impressed upon the memory by practice. For instance, they draw the picture of a hawk, a crocodile, a snake, and of the members of the human body—an eye, a hand, a face, and the like. Now the hawk signifies to them everything which happens swiftly, since this animal is practically the swiftest of winged creatures. And the concept portrayed is then transferred, by the appropriate metaphorical transfer, to all swift things and to everything to which swiftness is appropriate, very much as if they had been named. And the crocodile is a symbol of all that is evil, and the eye is the warder of justice and the guardian of the entire body. And as for the members of the body, the right hand with fingers extended signifies a procuring of livelihood, and the left with the fingers closed, a keeping and guarding of property. The same way of reasoning applies also to the remaining characters, which represent parts of the body and implements and all other things; for by paying close attention to the significance which is inherent in each object and by training their minds through drill and exercise of the memory over a long period, they read from habit everything which has been written."
And according to Diodorus the "Ethiopians" claimed their civilization was more ancient than the Egyptians, he was writing what Nubian historians said about their own history
"Many other things are also told by them concerning their own antiquity and the colony which they sent out that became the Egyptians, but about this there is no special need of our writing anything."
quote:Originally posted by Alive-(What Box): Awesome thread
quote:Originally posted by markellion: Ya, that dam damn made me sick to my stomach when I first heard about it a while back. I can't say anything other than it's horribly depressing
Anyway, this article has more information on the far antiquity of Kerma
"The Missing Links: Relations between Early Cultures of the Sudan and the Western Frontiers of the Nile before the End of the 4th Millennium BC."
posted
It's a theory worth exploring since some researchers hold that the Egyptians developed writing before Mesopotamia, as proved by inscriptions found circa 3400BC at Abydos, even before the First Dyansty. The development may be linnked with the Kerma people, and indeed Keita shows the erly Abydos crania fairly to those tropical Africans further south.
Linguistic writing systems and population movements. The southern area of the Nile Valley not only produced advanced material culture and political organization but also pioneered in the advancement of learning and communication via writing, contradicting claims of an outside Mediterranean or Mesopotamian influx responsible for such developments. In 1998 a German archaeological team under scholar Günter Dreyer, head of the German Archaeological Institute, excavated tombs associated with the Naqada culture and retrieved hundreds of clay artifacts inscribed with proto-hieroglyphs, dating to the 33rd century BC.[151] Of Dreyer's finds, Archaeology Magazine states that they "...challenge the commonly held belief that early logographs, pictographic symbols representing a specific place, object, or quantity, first evolved into more complex phonetic symbols in Mesopotamia."[152]
The early examples appear to have been building blocks for later development into the full complex of hieroglyphs for inscribing the ancient Egyptian language,[153] showing a measure of continuity into the period of the pharaohs. According to Dreyer, these continuities provide evidence that the writing used later by Egyptian kingships developed gradually in the native environment. "Most of them are documents, records of linen and oil delivered to the King Scorpion, taxes, short notes, numbers, lists of kings' names, and names of institutions.. The writing is in the form of line drawings of animals, plants and mountains and is the earliest evidence that hieroglyphics used by later-day Pharaonic dynasties did not rise as phoenix from the ashes but developed gradually.. Although the Egyptian writing is in the form of symbols it can be called true writing because each symbol stands for a consonant and makes up syllables. In principle Ancient Egyptians were able to express themselves clearly.."[154] According to Egyptologist Kent Weeks, professor of Egyptology at the American University in Cairo, Dreyer's data suggests "one of the greatest discoveries in history of writing and ancient Egyptian culture."[155]
Dreyer has moved beyond his early findings to pose a separate, speculative hypothesis- that the Egyptians were the first in the world to develop systematic writing as opposed to the commonly held view that the Mesopotamians did.[156] Some Egyptian archaeology authorities appear to support Dreyer's hypothesis of Egyptian primacy. According to a 1999 statement by one Gaballa Ali Gaballa, secretary-general of the Egyptian Supreme Council of Antiquities: "The earliest known Sumerian writings date back to 3000BC while the German team's find shows that Abydos inscriptions date to 3400BC. The first Pharaonic dynasty began in 2920BC with King Menes. The earliest known writing in Dynasty Zero is much earlier than the oldest writing discovered in Mesopotamia." [157]
refs 152 ^ Gunter Dreyer, Umm El-Quaab I-Das pradynastische Konigsgrab U-j and seine fruhen Schriftzeugnisse (1998)- translation: Umm El-Quaab I-The Predynastic Royal Tomb U-j and Its Early Writing-Evidence]; see also Allen, James Paul. 2000. Middle Egyptian: An Introduction to the Language and Culture of Hieroglyphs. Cambridge: Cambridge University Press, pp. 1-20 153 ^ Larkin Mitchell, "Earliest Egyptian Glyphs," Archaeology, Volume 52 Number 2, March/April 1999 154 ^ Dreyer, Allen, op. cit 155 ^ Nevine El-Aref, "Did writing originate in Egypt?" Al-Ahram Weekly: 1 - 7 April 1999, Issue No. 423 156 ^ "Egyptian writing dating to 3300 B.C. discovered," The Japan Times, December 17, 1998 157^ Nevine El-Aref, "Did writing originate in Egypt?" op. cit
Posts: 5905 | From: The Hammer | Registered: Aug 2008
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posted
The earliest hieroglyphics known in the Nile Valley that many Egyptologists call 'proto-hieroglyphics' are found in Lower Nubia in the areas of Sayalah and Qustul (Ta-Seti). Other than that I don't know of any others, but I wouldn't be surprised if there was. Many scholars think that the proto-hieroglyphs themselves may very well be based on Saharan rock paintings.
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