Genomic Ancestry of North Africans Supports Back-to-Africa Migrations
Brenna M. Henn equal contributor, Laura R. Botigué equal contributor, Simon Gravel, Wei Wang, Abra Brisbin, Jake K. Byrnes, Karima Fadhlaoui-Zid,Pierre A. Zalloua,Andres Moreno-Estrada, Jaume Bertranpetit,Carlos D. Bustamante David Comas ¶ mail
Troll, are Brenna Henn and the other contributers to this article racists ? yes or no no games please
Nevertheless the Capsian ends 8000 years ago and there are no other people known in the Maghreb until the Sea People and Pheonicians
I can't speak for troll, but I myself will say that although I can't call Henn et al. racist I CAN say that they are biased as are many Western 'experts' when it comes to things prehistoric North African. There is still the inclination to de-Africanize or someway white-wash North Africa due to its [too] close proximity to and significant influence to Europe.
I didn't call Henn racist, nowhere did I write such.
I called lion'ass a racist.
Posts: 22249 | From: Omni | Registered: Nov 2010
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quote:Originally posted by Djehuti: But just to be fair to lyinass, the premise of her thread is not archaeology nor skeletal evidence but purely genetics.
Her argument is that there is genetic evidence of 'Eurasians' in North Africa due to the presence of alleged 'Eurasian' maternal clades like U6 and H1. Yet U and H aren't the only 'Eurasian' clades in Africa.
^ The ones circled in green are 'Eurasian' clades found in Africa.
Yet we have this caveat from Keita: The issue of how much Paleolithic migration from the Near East there may have been is intriguing, and the mitochondrial DNA variation may need to be reassessed as to what can be considered to be only of "Eurasian origin" because if hunters and gatherers roamed between the Saharan and supra-Saharan regions and Eurasia it might be difficult to determine exactly "where" a mutation arose. In Hot Pursuit of Language in Prehistory ed. John Benjamins. (2008)
^ The above maps from Pedro Soares et al. shows the hypothetical dispersal of major mtDNA macro-clades. Note the map of the Pleistocene shows the dispersal of MN the ancestor of Eurasian M and N clades, with MN originating in East Africa deriving from L3a. Note the time period of the dispersal of MN which is about 65 to at least 70 kya and of course 'Eurasia' means Arabia right next door. Thus any pre-Holocene 'black-migrations' from Arabia and the Levant would be by Africans right next door.
But then we have the recent Fu et al. study as discussed here. Human mutation rates are directly calculated using securely dated ancient human mtDNAs ► The study provides improved molecular estimates for human evolutionary events. The last major gene flow event between Africans and non-Africans was calculated to 95 kya
According to Fu above, the split between Africans and 'Eurasians' occurred IN Africa BEFORE the successful Out-of-African expansion. Yet if this is so, how could they be called non-Africans or Eurasians if they haven't left Africa yet. Also, exactly what is the nature of this divergence other than a change in nucleotide sequences??
Thus bringing me back to my point on what exactly lyinass let alone the authors of her sources mean by 'Euasian'?
Djehuti, you know as well that population "genetics" doesn't look at one aspect solely. Many things have to be taken into account, such as population movement. The best way to trace this is by archeology and anthropology.
Posts: 22249 | From: Omni | Registered: Nov 2010
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quote:Originally posted by Troll Patrol: I didn't call Henn racist, nowhere did I write such.
scared to?
Howso, I called you out for what you are. A racist!
You've never been able to prove what you've cited and claimed for the longest!
Your delicate racism is all over this forum, racist!
Last year, Henn had her Uni-page linked to Mathilda's block-site. I openly commented on that one, no big deal.
Posts: 22249 | From: Omni | Registered: Nov 2010
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quote:Originally posted by Troll Patrol: I didn't call Henn racist, nowhere did I write such.
scared to?
How so,
Are you scared to call Brenna Henn a racist?
Repost for this ignorant dumbass,
Howso, I called you out for what you are. A racist!
You've never been able to prove what you've cited and claimed for the longest, with actual fossil records! However, what was proven without a shadow of a doubt. Is that "sub- Saharan" Africans indeed did migrate up North into the Maghreb.
Your delicate racism is all over this forum, racist!
Last year, Henn had her Uni-page linked to Mathilda's block-site. I openly commented on that one, no big deal. Such a joke!LOL
Posts: 22249 | From: Omni | Registered: Nov 2010
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quote:Originally posted by Troll Patrol: I didn't call Henn racist, nowhere did I write such.
scared to?
How so,
Are you scared to call Brenna Henn a racist?
Repost for this ignorant dumbass,
Howso, I called you out for what you are. A racist!
You've never been able to prove what you've cited and claimed for the longest, with actual fossil records! However, what was proven without a shadow of a doubt. Is that "sub- Saharan" Africans indeed did migrate up North into the Maghreb.
Your delicate racism is all over this forum, racist!
Last year, Henn had her Uni-page linked to Mathilda's block-site. I openly commented on that one, no big deal. Such a joke!LOL
Are you saying Brenna Henn is not a racist? why isn't she a racist? Isn't the Mathilda link more proof of her racism?
you are right about the fossils, there are no fossils for a 4000 year period years linking green Sahara prehistoric Mahgrebians to modern Mahgrebians of the historic period.
However I agree that the Mahgreb has been predominantly African if you look at the whole 30,000 years up to now period. You're on team lioness now
Posts: 43083 | From: , | Registered: Jan 2010
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quote:Originally posted by Troll Patrol: I didn't call Henn racist, nowhere did I write such.
scared to?
How so,
Are you scared to call Brenna Henn a racist?
Repost for this ignorant dumbass,
Howso, I called you out for what you are. A racist!
You've never been able to prove what you've cited and claimed for the longest, with actual fossil records! However, what was proven without a shadow of a doubt. Is that "sub- Saharan" Africans indeed did migrate up North into the Maghreb.
Your delicate racism is all over this forum, racist!
Last year, Henn had her Uni-page linked to Mathilda's block-site. I openly commented on that one, no big deal. Such a joke!LOL
Are you saying Brenna Henn is not a racist? why isn't she a racist?
you are right about the fossils, there are no fossils for a 4000 year period years linking green Sahara prehistoric Mahgrebians to modern Mahgrebians of the historic period
In order to call someone out like that you need to know more about their motifs.
I know your motifs, after conversing with you for over two years.
And still no fossil records by you. Mere distorting this thread!
quote:Originally posted by the lioness,: ^^^^ but aren't you are racist who randomly posts photos of white people with skin cancer hoping they'll die?
here are the time periods-
12,000-8 ,000 years ago Capsian Culture
8,000-4,000 years ago, no fossil record of anybody in Maghreb (Show me the fossil record I've been asking you for 2 years)
4,000 years ago to present, - Sea people. Phoenicians,Garamantes, Greeks, Romans, Vandals, Arabs, Turks, Europeans
No, it's not racist if you have to make a point to someone who is a supporter of eugenics and is constantly distorting African history and is posting racist posts on African populations. It's called exposing bigotry. When you look up several forums on the net, you can read what kind of racist slander eurocentrics are posting.
You have a hand in this racist stereotyping as well.
And it's not my fault they can't deal with extreme sun exposure. Such as is in the Sahara.
And again, you're distorting the previous post by me, on the Garamantes who definitely had contact with other Africans from the Sahara.
So, another false claim by you has just been destroyed! Go figure!
Now you even lie about me, changing it into, you asking me for fossil records. LOL at the delusional Eurocentric mind-tricks.
Thusfar you haven't shown any of the fossil records of the time periods you keep repeating, the only thing I have seen was nonsensical babble.
Not only are you a racist, but also a liar. This combination makes you like venom.
Libya and the Maghreb: If the archaeology of the Sahara’s southern margins remains rela- tively poorly understood, the Maghreb has long been the focus of sustained activity focused on the Pleistocene/Holocene transition (Lubell 2000, 2005). Here and at Haua Fteah in northeastern Libya, the Iberomaurusian industry introduced in Chapter 7 continued to be made into the terminal Pleistocene (McBurney 1967; Close and Wendorf 1990). Several unusual features are of interest, including evidence, rare at this time depth, for sculpture. This takes the form of anthropomorphic and zoomorphic ceramic figurines from Afalou, Algeria, baked from locally available clay to temperatures of 500◦–800◦C (Hachi 1996, Hachi et al. 2002). Dating 15–11 kya, they are complemented by an earlier fragmentary figurine from the nearby site of Tamar Hat (Saxon 1976). Distinctive, too, are the many burials known from these later Iberomaurusian contexts, including apparent cemeteries at Afalou (Hachi 1996) and Taforalt, Morocco (almost 200 individuals; Ferembach et al. 1962). Analysis of these remains (see inset) raises issues of territoriality, limited mobility, and group identity that economic data are still too few to explore further.
Knowing that people hunted Barbary sheep and other large mammals and that they collected molluscs, both terrestrial and marine, is very different from being able to develop this checklist of ingredients into a meaningful set of recipes or menus that could illuminate the details of Iberomaurusian subsistence-settlement strategies. WHAT BONES CAN TELL: BIOLOGICAL PERSPECTIVES ON THE HUNTER-GATHERERS OF THE MAGHREB: The extremely large skeletal samples that come from sites such as Taforalt (Fig. 8.13) and Afalou constitute an invaluable resource for understanding the makers of Iberomaurusian artifacts, and their number is unparalleled elsewhere in Africa for the early Holocene. Frequently termed Mechta-Afalou or Mechtoid, these were a skeletally robust people and definitely African in origin, though attempts, such as those of Ferembach (1985), to establish similarities with much older and rarer Aterian skeletal remains are tenuous given the immense temporal separation between the two (Close and Wendorf 1990). At the opposite end of the chronological spectrum, dental morphology does suggest connections with later Africans, including those responsible for the Capsian Industry (Irish 2000) and early mid-Holocene human remains from the western half of the Sahara (Dutour 1989), something that points to the Maghreb as one of the regions from which people recolonised the desert (MacDonald 1998).
Turning to what can be learned about cultural practices and disease, the individuals from Taforalt, the largest sample by far, display little evidence of trauma, though they do suggest a high incidence of infant mortality, with evidence for dental caries, arthritis, and rheumatism among other degenerative conditions. Interestingly, Taforalt also provides one of the oldest known instances of the practice of trepanation, the surgical removal of a portion of the cranium; the patient evidently survived for some time, as there are signs of bone regrowth in the affected area. Another form of body modification was much more widespread and, indeed, a distinctive feature of the Iberomaurusian skeletal sample as a whole. This was the practice of removing two or more of the upper incisors, usually around puberty and from both males and females, something that probably served as both a rite of passage and an ethnic marker (Close and Wendorf 1990), just as it does in parts of sub-Saharan Africa today (e.g., van Reenen 1987). Cranial and postcranial malformations are also apparent and may indicate pronounced endogamy at a much more localised level (Hadjouis 2002), perhaps supported by the degree of variability between different site samples noted by Irish (2000).
--Lawrence Barham The First Africans: African Archaeology from the Earliest Toolmakers to Most Recent Foragers (Cambridge World Archaeology) Posts: 22249 | From: Omni | Registered: Nov 2010
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quote:In the North live the Tuareg, typical of broad ranging of nomads, they generally look more diverse
Some Tuareg look like dark skinned Malians of the South and others look to varying mixtures of relatively lighter skinned Arab...
Typical lyinass rhetoric. If an African looks lighter than ebony he/she must be 'Eurasian mixed'.
Ethiopians
Egyptians
South Africans
^^ By lyinass logic all the darker Africans above are 'pure' while their lighter counterparts have 'Eurasian' admixture. Her lyinass logic is merely a repetition of the debunked Hamitic theory where pure Africans are 'true negro' types and any deviation whatsoever whether lighter skin, narrower noses, or hair straighter than kinky or tightly coiled are all signs of Eurasian (Caucasian) admixture.
Hence, a racist ideologic theory.
Which only a true racist would (still) support.
Display Settings:AbstractSend to: J Hum Evol. 2000 Oct;39(4):393-410.
The Iberomaurusian enigma: north African progenitor or dead end?
Irish JD et al.
quote:Data obtained during an ongoing dental investigation of African populations address two long-standing, hotly debated questions. First, was there genetic continuity between Late Pleistocene Iberomaurusians and later northwest Africans (e.g., Capsians, Berbers, Guanche)? Second, were skeletally-robust Iberomaurusians and northeast African Nubians variants of the same population? Iberomaurusians from Taforalt in Morocco and Afalou-Bou-Rhummel in Algeria, Nubians from Jebel Sahaba in Sudan, post-Pleistocene Capsians from Algeria and Tunisia, and a series of other samples were statistically compared using 29 discrete dental traits to help estimate diachronic local and regional affinities. Results revealed: (1) a relationship between the Iberomaurusians, particularly those from Taforalt, and later Maghreb and other North African samples, and (2) a divergence among contemporaneous Iberomaurusians and Nubian samples. Thus, some measure of long-term population continuity in the Maghreb and surrounding region is supported, whereas greater North African population heterogenity during the Late Pleistocene is implied.
quote:The Iberomaurusian is an epipalaeolithic culture that flourished in North Africa for over 10,000 years. A key question surrounds its appearance in the Maghreb, a semi-arid upland zone on the edge of the Sahara, soon after the Last Glacial Maximum (20,000 years ago) and despite evidence for a continuation into the Holocene very little is known either about the later part of this timespan or what processes led to its disappearance after 9000 years ago. An issue rarely commented upon is the apparently synchronous and sudden occurrence of large scale midden deposits in Iberomaurusian contexts in caves across the western Maghreb at around 13,000 years ago. This also seems to have coincided with the appearance of some of the earliest cemeteries.
The climatic framework of this study is the late Pleistocene and early Holocene (c. 20,000 - 9000 BP) and is important because it was a phase of major climatic instability and allows us to assess any cultural responses made by Iberomaurusian human populations in the context of these changes. Details of the climatic record for this period come principally from the Greenland Ice cores but there were also marked fluctuations in sea surface temperatures recorded in basal sediments of the Atlantic and Mediterranean. These indicate evidence of distinct cooling phases associated with increased aridification on the adjacent landmasses of North Africa during the Younger Dryas (c.11,000-10,000 years ago), and at earlier times in the past including at around 15,000 and 25,000 years ago. The climatic dynamics provide a vital element in exploring the effects of environmental change on epipalaeolithic human behaviour.
quote:Originally posted by Troll Patrol: I didn't call Henn racist, nowhere did I write such.
scared to?
Howso, I called you out for what you are. A racist!
You've never been able to prove what you've cited and claimed for the longest!
Your delicate racism is all over this forum, racist!
Last year, Henn had her Uni-page linked to Mathilda's block-site. I openly commented on that one, no big deal.
Are you scared to call Brenna Henn a racist?
LMAOH
The question is are YOU scared to address the topic of this thread in a logical way instead of resorting to a desperate plea to authority in the form of Brenna Henn and using her as shield against any attacks against YOU!
Troll Patrol didn't call her racist, he called YOU one! Your excuse is Henn's material. Of course TP nor I can't call Henn a racist as there is nothing in her work to validate that. Biased perhaps, but not racist. YOU on the other hand have displayed negrophobic tendencies when it comes to the history of North Africa so your racism is more obvious.
quote:but aren't you (Troll Patrol) a racist who randomly posts photos of white people with skin cancer hoping they'll die?
More lyinass ad-hominem nonsense. Troll Patrol has posted posted photos of whites with skin cancer as examples of how the subtropical sun of North Africa would be detrimental to any ancient let alone prehistoric whites in the region. I have never once seen him "hope" any death on anyone, white, cancer-ridden, or otherwise. Quit making false accusations to get the spot light of shame off yourself! Posts: 26472 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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posted
Some Euronuts state that the Maghreb only means the coastal region. And that the Saharan part doesn't count, but there are two regions of the Maghreb.
quote:Originally posted by Djehuti: [QB] [QUOTE]Originally posted by the lyinass,: [qb] [QUOTE]Originally posted by Troll Patrol: [
You are a fucking ASSHOLE. The comment wasn't addresed to you and you changed my name in the quote and Troll Patrol didn't ask you to be his hero. I didn't read your comments. As soon as I see my name is wrong it's fvck you. As soon as I see insults, it's fvck you. As soon as I see cheerlleading, I don't read it, it's fvck you. You are a troll by definition. Somebody who insults and calls names in every post and thinks himself righteous
Posts: 43083 | From: , | Registered: Jan 2010
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quote:Originally posted by Son of Ra: Some Euronuts state that the Maghreb only means the coastal region. And that the Saharan part doesn't count, but there are two regions of the Maghreb.
^^^I don't really like using Wikipedia...But I had to for this situation.
I've always understood Maghreb to connote the Mediterranean area north of the Atlas mountains.
Posts: 7210 | From: Fallbrook, CA | Registered: Mar 2004
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quote:Originally posted by Son of Ra: Some Euronuts state that the Maghreb only means the coastal region. And that the Saharan part doesn't count, but there are two regions of the Maghreb.
quote:Originally posted by Son of Ra: Some Euronuts state that the Maghreb only means the coastal region.
contemporary definition Maghreb territory
In Arabic but not in English, Al Maghreb commonly refers to Morocco: the full Arabic name of Morocco (Al Mamlakah al Maghrib?yah) translates to "the Western Kingdom". Historically, Morocco was called Al Maghreb al Aq?á ("the Furthest West").
wikipedia:
The Maghreb ( Arabic: المغرب, al-Maghrib, French: (le) Maghreb) is usually defined as much or most of the region of Northwest Africa, west of Egypt. The traditional definition as being the region including the Atlas Mountains and the coastal plains of Morocco, Algeria, Tunisia, and Libya, was later superseded, especially since the 1989 formation of the Arab Maghreb Union, by the inclusion of a fifth nation, and of the disputed territory of Western Sahara (mostly controlled by Morocco). During the Al-Andalus era in Spain, the Maghreb's inhabitants, Maghrebis, were known as "Moors";[1] the Muslim areas of Spain in those times were usually included in contemporary definitions of the Maghreb—hence the use of 'Moor' or 'Moors' to describe the Muslim inhabitants of Spain by Christian and other Western sources.
Historical terms for the region or various portions of it include Numidia, Libya, and Africa in classical antiquity. The term maghrib is in origin an Arabic word for "west, occident", denoting the westernmost territories that fell to the Islamic conquests of the 7th century.[2] Today, it is used as a proper noun denoting the Maghreb, also known as المغرب العربي al-maghrib al-ʻarabīy "the Arab Maghreb" or المغرب الكبير al-maghrib al-kabīr "the great Maghreb" in Arabic.
Before the establishment of modern nation states in the region during the mid-20th century, Maghreb most-commonly referred to a smaller area between the Atlas Mountains in the south and the Mediterranean Sea, often also including eastern Libya, but not modern Mauritania. As recently as the late 19th century it was used to refer to the Western Mediterranean region of coastal North Africa in general, and to Algeria, Morocco and Tunisia in particular.
The region was somewhat unified as an independent political entity during the rule of the Berber kingdom of Numidia, which was followed by Roman Empire's rule or influence. That was followed by the brief invasion of the Germanic Vandals, the equally brief re-establishment of a weak Byzantine rule by the Byzantine Empire, the rule of the Islamic Caliphates under the Umayyads, the Abbasids, and the Fatimids. The most enduring rule was that of the local Berber Muslim empires of Almoravids, Almohads, Hammadids, Zirids, Marinids, Wattasids (to name some of those among the most prominent) during the 8th to 13th centuries. The Ottoman Turks ruled the region as well.
The five modern states of North Africa established the Maghreb Union in 1989 to promote cooperation and economic integration in a common market. It was envisioned initially by Muammar Gaddafi as an Arab superstate, ignoring the Berber identity of most North Africans.
, Population centers, Roman period
Roman provinces:
Mauretania ( old Mauretania, location 25- map)
Africa (old definition of Africa part of Tunisia, location 6-map)
Numidia
Cyrenaica
Aegyptus (Egypt)
.
Africa Population density, 1995
1771 Bonne Map Maghreb here is called Barbary note southern portions of nations now called Maghreb are shown here the blank area marked "Sahara desert", southern areas, more than half what are now nations called Algeria, Libya etc.
Posts: 43083 | From: , | Registered: Jan 2010
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But here the thing that gets me and I have said this before. The majority view is that U6 entered the Maghreb from the Near East. If so...How do those U6 carriers get passed the Atlas Mountains?
And in most studies suggesting that U6 entered Africa(from Near East) 30k years don't even elaborate on which part on North Africa, but just state North Africa.
@Troll Patrol
I'm confused with the Maghreb. Some say just coastal parts or the whole Northwest Africa. While some state their are two Maghreb's..Mediterranean Maghreb and Saharan Maghreb. I agree with latter.
@The Lioness.
Excellent post.
Posts: 1135 | From: Top secret | Registered: Jun 2012
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quote:Originally posted by Son of Ra: @Truthcentric
I see...
But here the thing that gets me and I have said this before. The majority view is that U6 entered the Maghreb from the Near East. If so...How do those U6 carriers get passed the Atlas Mountains?
And in most studies suggesting that U6 entered Africa(from Near East) 30k years don't even elaborate on which part on North Africa, but just state North Africa.
@Troll Patrol
I'm confused with the Maghreb. Some say just coastal parts or the whole Northwest Africa. While some state their are two Maghreb's..Mediterranean Maghreb and Saharan Maghreb. I agree with latter.
@The Lioness.
Excellent post.
What is there to be confused about?
The entire NW Africa is considered the Maghreb.
Late Pleistocene-Early Holocene Maghreb - Haua Fteah, et al.
One should understand that colonial topology doesn't apply to historical African topology. In many ways it did more harm than good.
Eventually the North of the NW and the South of the NW carry the same people. With people towards the coast (Mediterranean) having more admixture.
Lakeside Cemeteries in the Sahara: 5000 Years of Holocene Population and Environmental Change
quote:The older occupants have craniofacial dimensions that demonstrate similarities with mid-Holocene occupants of the southern Sahara and Late Pleistocene to early Holocene inhabitants of the Maghreb.
quote:These early occupants abandon the area under arid conditions and, when humid conditions return ~4600 B.C.E., are replaced by a more gracile people with elaborated grave goods including animal bone and ivory ornaments.
quote: Principal components analysis of craniometric variables closely allies the early Holocene occupants at Gobero with a skeletally robust, trans-Saharan assemblage of Late Pleistocene to mid-Holocene human populations from the Maghreb and southern Sahara.
quote:Figure 6. Principal components analysis of craniofacial dimensions among Late Pleistocene to mid-Holocene populations from the Maghreb and southern Sahara.
Plot of first two principal components extracted from a mean matrix for 17 craniometric variables (Tables 4, 7) in 9 human populations (Table 3) from the Late Pleistocene through the mid-Holocene from the Maghreb and southern Sahara. Seven trans-Saharan populations cluster together, whereas Late Pleistocene Aterians (Ater) and the mid-Holocene population at Gobero (Gob-m) are striking outliers. Axes are scaled by the square root of the corresponding eigenvalue for the principal component. Abbreviations: Ater, Aterian; EMC, eastern Maghreb Capsian; EMI, eastern Maghreb Iberomaurusian; Gob-e, Gobero early Holocene; Gob-m, Gobero mid-Holocene; Mali, Hassi-el-Abiod, Mali; Maur, Mauritania; WMC, western Maghreb Capsian; WMI, western Maghreb Iberomaurusian.
--(doi:10.1371/journal.pone.0002995.g006)
quote:Craniometric data from seven human groups (Tables 3, 4) were subjected to principal components analysis, which allies the early Holocene population at Gobero (Gob-e) with mid-Holocene “Mechtoids” from Mali and Mauritania [18], [26], [27] and with Late Pleistocene Iberomaurusians and early Holocene Capsians from across the Maghreb (see cluster in Figure 6). The striking similarity between these seven human populations confirms previous suggestions regarding their affinity [18] and is particularly significant given their temporal range (Late Pleistocene to mid-Holocene) and trans-Saharan geographic distribution (across the Maghreb to the southern Sahara).
I'm confused with the Maghreb. Some say just coastal parts or the whole Northwest Africa. While some state their are two Maghreb's..Mediterranean Maghreb and Saharan Maghreb. I agree with latter.
The current definition is Morocco, Algeria, Tunisia, Libya. Mauritania
This modern nation oriented definition includes more Southerly areas of these nations and Mauritania is a later addition. As shown in the population map over 90% of the population lives in the North coastal region of these countries. By far most of the land of Algeria and Libya is not where most of the population lives
If you are looking at a study you have to consider the aim of the study. "Predominantly" means on average. If the aim of the study is to represent the diverse groups of the whole region that is different. The United States for instance is predominantly European. It also has 13% African Americans. Native people are under 1%. So one study may be about average current demographics of a modern country but another study may be about talking about all of the over 500 tribes of American indian tribes and their history.
The current definition of North Africa is more problematic While the modern definition of the Maghreb can usually be agreed on as Morocco, Algeria, Tunisia, Libya, Mauritania "North Africa" is less agreed on.
Many articles will use "North Africa" to mean only the Maghreb. Others will mean The Maghreb and Egypt. Others The Maghreb and Egypt plus Sudan Others The Magreb and Sahel (Mali, Niger, Chad) Others The Magreb, Sahel and Egypt
The terms Mahgreb and Sahel have less variance.
It doesn't affect the conclusion about data what you call something as long as you define what countries you are including in the broader term. If you wnated to define America as not including Texas your remarks about your redefined area you are calling America might still be true. Looking at Africa, territory and corresponding nation names were often divided according to colonial history. But such that it is safe to call Morocco, Algeria, Tunisia, Libya. Mauritania the Maghreb.
Posts: 43083 | From: , | Registered: Jan 2010
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It is just that I seen all this defintion and arguments of what the Maghreb really is. And thanks.
@The Lioness.
I see and interesting. I also notice the modern definition of the Maghreb includes Libya. But the link Troll Patrol posted states it basically includes almost all of Northwest Africa.
Posts: 1135 | From: Top secret | Registered: Jun 2012
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posted
I know this is off topic. But Troll Patrol...What do you mean side scenes of fossil records when you were posting to The Lioness?
I assume you were asking her for archaeological evidence, but I was always wondering what they means.
Posts: 1135 | From: Top secret | Registered: Jun 2012
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posted
^ The situation IS very much confusing because U6 has its highest frequency diversity in Africa alone with the highest being the Maghreb, though U6 is also found as far south as Kenya. The general theory is that a branch of U6 entered Africa from the Levant via Sinai, but since the predominant clade in Egypt is M1. But then I take it you are suggesting U6 entered the Maghreb from Europe via Iberia, yet the archaeology of such an entry is virtually non-existent. Euronuts tried at one time try to connect the Aterian Industry to the Mousterian of Europe but close examination of tools show that despite superficial similarities the two industries are very much different.
But then you have the skeletal evidence from the Maghreb. In the sum, the results obtained further strengthen the results from previous analyses. The affinities between Nazlet Khater, MSA, and Khoisan and Khoisan related groups re-emerges. In addition it is possible to detect a separation between North African and sub-saharan populations, with the Neolithic Saharan population from Hasi el Abiod and the Egyptian Badarian group being closely affiliated with modern Negroid groups. Similarly, the Epipaleolithic populations from Site 117 and Wadi Halfa are also affiliated with sub-Saharan LSA, Iron Age and modern Negroid groups rather than with contemporaneous North African populations such as Taforalt and the Ibero-maurusian. ---Pierre M. Vermeersch 'Palaeolithic quarrying sites in Upper and Middle Egypt'
This gives many the impression that there truly is a division between early North(west) i.e. Maghrebi Africans and 'Sub-Saharans', but then Pinhasi explains such findings below: De Villiers & Fatti (1982) analyzed the antiquity of the Bantu-speaking populationsin sub-Saharan Africa using both modern and prehistoric specimens. The authors performed discriminant function analysis using a total of 53 cranial and mandibular measurements. Results indicate that LSA East African specimens are not far removed from the recent Negro sample they used. In contrast, the North African specimens from Afalou-bou-Rhummel and Taforalt in Morocco and the Singa skull from Sudan display indeterminate affinities as they are neither closely associated with modern Negro specimens, nor with Khoisan specimens. **However, the statistical analysis combined means of sample measurements of prehistoric populations with individual data. Such statistical procedure could be biased, as means of samples used for computation are not true representatives of the range of variability observed among individuals within each sample.** The focal point of the research carried out by Rightmire’s (1975), and De Villiers & Fatti’s (1982) analyses was the question of the antiquity of the Bantu-speaking and Khoisan populations in sub-Saharan Africa rather than the detection of morphometric affinities and the examination of bio-diversity among Holocene and post-Holocene African fossils. Keita (1990)examined the population variability among prehistoric, protohistoric and modern crania from Egypt, the Maghreb, Nubia, East Africa (Teita) and West Central Africa (Gabon), and Europe (Romano-British). Canonical variates, used as discrimination functions, were applied to the selected dataset of 13 cranial measurements. Subsequently, analyses were performed on smaller subsets of ten and seven measurements respectively. The analyses demonstrated the metric heterogeneity of the prehistoric and protohistoric Maghrebian crania. Variability was also found to be significant among and between the Egyptian crania, with Predynastic specimens (Badari, Naqada) displaying close affinities with Nubian specimens whilenorthern Egyptians (Sedment and E-Series) displayed close affinities with both Maghrebian samples and with the European sample (Egyptian "E"). Keita’s results show the heterogeneity within and between mid-Holocene and protohistoric North African populations and the affinities among some of the prehistoric Nile Valley populations. However, it is unclear as to whether a similar pattern of variability and affinities existed among earlier (Late Pleistocene and early Holocene) African populations. This issue is addressed here through the examination of the morphometric affinities of the Nazlet Khater specimen.
quote:Originally posted by Son of Ra: I know this is off topic. But Troll Patrol...What do you mean side scenes of fossil records when you were posting to The Lioness?
I assume you were asking her for archaeological evidence, but I was always wondering what they means.
Yes, historically by archaeological and anthropological evidence, this is how the Maghrebian population was build in NW Africa. I.e. the latter industry.
Posts: 22249 | From: Omni | Registered: Nov 2010
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quote:Originally posted by Son of Ra: But here the thing that gets me and I have said this before. The majority view is that U6 entered the Maghreb from the Near East. If so...How do those U6 carriers get passed the Atlas Mountains?
For my part, I reckon that Europe, specifically the Iberian peninsula, is where Northwest Africa's haplogroup U came from. Note that haplogroup U used to be more prevalent among Europeans than it is now and that Iberia is a lot closer to the Maghreb than the Near East.
Posts: 7210 | From: Fallbrook, CA | Registered: Mar 2004
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When you post how all skeletons 30k years show African characteristic.
So what Pierre M. Vermeersch is basically stating is that skeleton remains in the Maghreb during 30k years showed African characteristics? Interesting.
Posts: 1135 | From: Top secret | Registered: Jun 2012
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quote:Originally posted by Troll Patrol: ^ I assume you meant to say "NW" Africa.
You are correct.
I'm not saying that this is how it should be but in conversation it causes less confusion to say
The Maghreb ( Morocco, Algeria, Tunisia, Libya. Mauritania)
or
The Sahel ( Sahel covers parts of Senegal, southern Mauritania, central Mali, southern Algeria and Niger, central Chad, southern Sudan, northern South Sudan and Eritrea)
or
The Maghreb and the Sahel
_____________________________
But using the term "North Africa" leads to a lot more confusion because people have much more varied definitions of it.
Posts: 43083 | From: , | Registered: Jan 2010
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quote:Originally posted by Djehuti: [QB But then I take it you are suggesting U6 entered the Maghreb from Europe via Iberia, yet the archaeology of such an entry is virtually non-existent. Euronuts tried at one time try to connect the Aterian Industry to the Mousterian of Europe but close examination of tools show that despite superficial similarities the two industries are very much different.[/QB]
Uh, Mousterian is associated with Neanderthals, not Upper Paleolithic Europeans.
Posts: 7210 | From: Fallbrook, CA | Registered: Mar 2004
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quote:Originally posted by the lioness,: 1771 Bonne Map Maghreb here is called Barbary note southern portions of nations now called Maghreb are shown here the blank area marked "Sahara desert", southern areas, more than half what are now nations called Algeria, Libya etc.
Correct. The old Western term for Maghreb was 'Barbary' as in the Muslim Barbary pirates that assaulted non-Muslim European and early U.S. trade ships spurring the latter to found the U.S. Navy back in 1775.
barbary pirates
Posts: 26472 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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quote:Originally posted by Truthcentric: Uh, Mousterian is associated with Neanderthals, not Upper Paleolithic Europeans.
You're right, but that didn't stop the Euronuts from naming any Upper Paleolithic industry similar to that of the original Mousterians as 'Mousterian' or Mousterian derived. I take it you haven't heard of the old theory that Neanderthals once inhabited the Maghreb. Recall that Jebel Irhoud, the oldest AMH found in the Maghreb was initially thought to be a Neanderthal-Sapiens 'hybrid'! LOLPosts: 26472 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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quote:Originally posted by Truthcentric: Uh, Mousterian is associated with Neanderthals, not Upper Paleolithic Europeans.
You're right, but that didn't stop the Euronuts from naming any Upper Paleolithic industry similar to that of the original Mousterians as 'Mousterian' or Mousterian derived. I take it you haven't heard of the old theory that Neanderthals once inhabited Maghreb.
No, I haven't, but thanks for clearing that up.
As for the whole argument over how long North Africa in general has been genetically affiliated with Eurasia, I get the impression that Euronuts usually attribute it not to back migrations circa 30 kya but rather to the demic diffusion of Neolithic farmers from the Near East after 10 kya. Considering how recently the "Caucasian" phenotype evolved, the Neolithic is the earliest immigration date for the hypothetical Wandering Caucasoids that I can think of.
Posts: 7210 | From: Fallbrook, CA | Registered: Mar 2004
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quote:Originally posted by Troll Patrol: I didn't call Henn racist, nowhere did I write such.
scared to?
Howso, I called you out for what you are. A racist!
You've never been able to prove what you've cited and claimed for the longest!
Your delicate racism is all over this forum, racist!
Last year, Henn had her Uni-page linked to Mathilda's block-site. I openly commented on that one, no big deal.
Are you scared to call Brenna Henn a racist?
LMAOH
The question is are YOU scared to address the topic of this thread in a logical way instead of resorting to a desperate plea to authority in the form of Brenna Henn and using her as shield against any attacks against YOU!
Troll Patrol didn't call her racist, he called YOU one! Your excuse is Henn's material. Of course TP nor I can't call Henn a racist as there is nothing in her work to validate that. Biased perhaps, but not racist. YOU on the other hand have displayed negrophobic tendencies when it comes to the history of North Africa so your racism is more obvious.
quote:but aren't you (Troll Patrol) a racist who randomly posts photos of white people with skin cancer hoping they'll die?
More lyinass ad-hominem nonsense. Troll Patrol has posted posted photos of whites with skin cancer as examples of how the subtropical sun of North Africa would be detrimental to any ancient let alone prehistoric whites in the region. I have never once seen him "hope" any death on anyone, white, cancer-ridden, or otherwise. Quit making false accusations to get the spot light of shame off yourself!
Yes, you are correct on this. I have never hoped for people to die on skin cancer and such. I posted those images as examples. To how detriment the sun can be to certain populations. This was after "Faheem" posted his usual nonsense essay and citations from "The Children Of Ra", claiming North Europeans as the founders of the Egyptian civilization. Types like Faheem need a different approach to show them their delusions.
Posts: 22249 | From: Omni | Registered: Nov 2010
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It looks like the Sahara is considered part of the barbary corresponding to the Mahgreb with Southern portions (but above the Sahel mainly)
In arabic usage Al Maghreb refered to only Morocco. I don't know if I am following the history in the right sequence but it seems that for some reason the term Barbary as per the whole region was dropped (maybe it was too derogatory). Then they took the arabic Al Maghreb and used it to mean not only Morocco but the whole area they used to call the barbary. And before the barbary this same Magheb region has been called Libya or Africa by various authors
Etymology
Barbary c.1300, "foreign lands" (especially non-Christian lands), from Latin barbaria (see barbarian). Meaning "Saracens living in coastal North Africa" is attested from 1590s, via French (Old French barbarie), from Arabic Barbar, Berber, ancient Arabic name for the inhabitants of North Africa beyond Egypt. Perhaps a native name, perhaps an Arabic word, from barbara "to babble confusedly," but this might be ultimately from Greek barbaria. "The actual relations (if any) of the Arabic and Gr[eek] words cannot be settled; but in European langs. barbaria, Barbarie, Barbary, have from the first been treated as identical with L. barbaria, Byzantine Gr[eek] barbaria land of barbarians"
Posts: 43083 | From: , | Registered: Jan 2010
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It looks like the Sahara is considered part of the barbary corresponding to the Mahgreb with Southern portions (but above the Sahel mainly)
In arabic usage Al Maghreb refered to only Morocco. I don't know if I am following the history in the right sequence but it seems that for some reason the term Barbary as per the whole region was dropped (maybe it was too derogatory). Then they took the arabic Al Maghreb and used it to mean not only Morocco but the whole area they used to call the barbary. And before the barbary this same Magheb region has been called Libya or Africa by various authors
Etymology
Barbary c.1300, "foreign lands" (especially non-Christian lands), from Latin barbaria (see barbarian). Meaning "Saracens living in coastal North Africa" is attested from 1590s, via French (Old French barbarie), from Arabic Barbar, Berber, ancient Arabic name for the inhabitants of North Africa beyond Egypt. Perhaps a native name, perhaps an Arabic word, from barbara "to babble confusedly," but this might be ultimately from Greek barbaria. "The actual relations (if any) of the Arabic and Gr[eek] words cannot be settled; but in European langs. barbaria, Barbarie, Barbary, have from the first been treated as identical with L. barbaria, Byzantine Gr[eek] barbaria land of barbarians"
The Northern part of the Sahara is part of the Maghreb. And historically in African topology West Africa was considered West Sudan.
The Maghreb The Maghreb meaning "western" in Arabic, is the region of Africa north of the Sahara Desert and west of the Nile — specifically, coinciding with the Atlas Mountains. Geopolitically, the area is reckoned to include Morocco, Western Sahara, Algeria, Tunisia, Libya, and sometimes Mauritania (which is often placed in West Africa instead) - put more simply, the member states of the Arab Maghreb Union plus the Western Sahara. An inhabitant or thing of the Maghreb is called a Maghrebian or Maghrebi.
Etymology The word maghreb is an Arabic term literally meaning "place of setting (of the sun)", and hence "West." It derives from the root ghuroob, meaning "to set" or "to be hidden" (however, it is not used to refer to the setting of the moon). It is also used in a manner similar to the metaphorical use "to be eclipsed", which is used in English.
In Arabic but not in English, Al Maghreb commonly refers to Morocco: the full Arabic name of Morocco (Al Mamlakah al Maghrib?yah) translates to "the Western Kingdom". Historically, Morocco was called Al Maghreb al Aq?á ("the Furthest West").
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Did DNAtribes in its SNPAdmixture Results by Population list North Africans as mainly African? ^^^And not Eurasians(i.e European, Arabian,etc).
Can those results by DNAtribes be trusted and how they use regions?
But not only that Wikipedia even states Northwest Africans are mainly African though use Maghreb, but they do separate European and Near East from North Africa, which is interesting. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maghreb_people#Autosomal_DNA
So does North African(DNAtribes) and Maghreb(Wikipedia)= indigenous African for those two?
Posts: 1135 | From: Top secret | Registered: Jun 2012
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As for the whole argument over how long North Africa in general has been genetically affiliated with Eurasia, I get the impression that Euronuts usually attribute it not to back migrations circa 30 kya but rather to the demic diffusion of Neolithic farmers from the Near East after 10 kya. Considering how recently the "Caucasian" phenotype evolved, the Neolithic is the earliest immigration date for the hypothetical Wandering Caucasoids that I can think of. [/QB]
Brenna Henn said 12 kya which is closer to 10 kya than 30.
Where does this 30 kya thing come from? It may come from Carlton Coon. Some of Carlton Coon's research is still considered valid. Other parts are considered heavily tainted by racism. Below I will post the chapter in his Races of Europe (1939) book on North Africa. I don't endorse the theory but this is probably the source matreial of people who would argue that the Magheb was predominantly Caucasian for 30 kya:
During the Late Pleistocene, at the time of the Würm glaciations in Europe, northern Africa, including the present Morocco, Algeria, and Tunisia, enjoyed a cool climate and an abundant plant life; making an admirable home for human beings. Fortunately, many Late Pleistocene skeletons from these countries have been studied, and we are able to supplement our information from Europe very greatly by comparison.
During the Upper Palaeolithic, there were three cultures in North Africa whic h existed contemporaneously as geographical units; the Capsian, covering a restricted range in Tunisia and eastern Algeria; the Oranian, a related culture extending over the provinces of Alger and Constantine, and into Morocco; and the Aterian, along the Moroccan seaboard.
The Capsian and Oranian were cultures basically related to the Aurignacian of Europe, but which contained throughout their history a microlithic blade element which was destined to move northward, after the end of the glacial period, and to invade Europe as the Tardenoisian. The Capsian had probably moved westward along the southern Mediterranean shore from the East; the Oranian was nothing but a western extension of the Capsian; while the Aterian was a protracted survivor of the Mousterian which developed its own peculiarities as time went on, and was gradually crowded to the Atlantic seaboard by the Oranian.
It is at present believed that North Africa, during the Late Pleistocene, was a marginal area of refuge, and not a highway of cultures. Gibraltar served less as a bridge than as a barrier. Nothing can better attest the passive cultural rôle of North Africa during this period than the fact that the Aterian, a Mid-Pleistocene culture, was allowed to elaborate its own special technique long after the Mousterian, from which it sprang, had passed out of existence elsewhere.
That the earlier phases of the Capsian and Oranian, coming directly after the Mousterian, were comparable in time to the Upper Palaeolithic cultures of Europe, such experts as Menghin, Obermaier, and Leakey are unanimous,42 while Miss Garrod, on the basis of Vaufrey’s work, would make them later.43
We can only, at this point, agree with Menghin that while the exact time correlation of North African and western European Late Pleistocene industries is still floating, they may be considered roughly parallel. At present, the general agreement is that the essential elements of both European and North African Upper Palaeolithic cultures came from the east, and had, at least in part, a common origin.
So far, all of the human remains of the Late Pleistocene from North Africa come from the Province of Constantine, where most of the archaeological work has been done. The total of these skeletons probably reaches one hundred, but, unfortunately, less than half of them have been fully preserved or competently studied.44 They come for the most part from two great sites, Afalou bou Rummel, and Mechta el ‘Arbi. The former is Oranian, the latter Capsian.
Afalou bou Rummel is an Early Oranian site. Within this early horizon, Arambourg distinguishes two levels, a lower and an upper. The lower may be correlated with the Early Aurignacian of Europe, by one system, or with Middle and Late Aurignacian, according to another.
The lower level is represented by the skeleton of a single adult male, to whom we shall refer by his catalogue number, #28. Number 28 was a short man, about 161.5 cm. tail, equivalent in stature to Galley Hill, Combe Capelle, and the male negroid from Grimaldi. His skull differs greatly from the others taken from the upper level of the same site. It is ovoid in shape, hyperdolichocephalic, and low vaulted; it possesses a sloping forehead, a large U-shaped palate, and high orbits. It is only moderately massive, and is about equal in this respect to Combe Capelle. This skull is that of a generalized white type, and can be placed without much difficulty into the general class of Galley Hill and Combe Capelle. Like the latter, its nasal aperture is wide, its index chamaerrhine.
Forty-nine other crania have been taken from the upper lenses of the Early Oranian culture level at Afalou bou Rummel. These correspond closely in physical type to Middle and Late Aurignacian man in western Europe, but the two groups are not identical. Like Crô-Magnon, all of the Afalou skeletons studied were tall, with an estimated male mean falling between 171 and 175 cm., according to different methods. Their limb proportions with long distal segments, are like those of many of the group; while their hands and feet, similarly, are both longer and broader than those of most Europeans. The combined height of the vertebrae show that their bodies, as well as their legs, were long, and the total bulk of a typical male, in good condition, must have been great.
A high ratio between the length of the collarbone and that of the upper arm (clavico umeral index) reveals that they had broader shoulders than those of most modern white men, a feature which has been also noticed on the Chancelade and Obercassel skeletons, and perhaps is equally true of the European group as a whole. The pelves are high and have narrow openings; the feet are highly arched, with well-developed heels; and the size and muscular markings of the long bones differentiate the males from the females clearly. All of the bodily traits of these men are shared by Crô-Magnon, and all are, in a general sense, European.
The Afalou crania have been exhaustively described and thoroughly illustrated. In general, they are very large, low-orbitted skulls, thick-boned, and marked in high relief for muscular attachment. The browridges form a heavy jut, even greater in most instances than those of the Crô-Magnons. Behind a salient glabella the forehead slopes in all instances. Vertical foreheads, frequent among modern whites, especially females, and present in some Crô-Magnon individuals, do not occur here. The union of the parietal and occipital bones is always marked by a lambdoidal depression, or flattening,45 while below this depression the occiput is usually bun- shaped and projecting. The mastoids are strongly developed, and the thickness of the vault is greater than that of modern man, but no greater than with Crô-Magnon.
Metrically, the male skulls (see Appendix I, col. 3) are practically identical with those of the total European series, except that they are slightly shorter and higher in vault dimensions, while the upper face is a little shorter. In these divergences from the total European group, they resemble the western branch, or Crô-Magnons. The cranial indices of 23 males range from 70 to 80, with a mean of 74.8; while the female figures are: range 70 to 84; and mean 75.7. Both in range and in means of head form, the Afalou series equals that of Crô-Magnon.
The nose of the Afalou type is perfectly European in bony conformation. The paired nasal bones unite at a sharp angle, without trace of flattening, while the bridges are high and mostly convex. The nasal spine is strong and projects far forward. The nasal index, which lies just over the border of chamaerrhiny,46 furnishes a real metrical difference between Afalou and Crô-Magnon. The elevation of the index is due to a shorter height as well as to a greater width. Not one of the Afalou skulls is actually leptorrhine. This feature, combined with the sloping forehead and heavy browridges, serves to differentiate the types in the two continents. The Afalou mandible, furthermore, is extremely broad, deep, and heavy. In the possession of a pronounced chin greater than those commonly found among the living, it is clearly opposed to any known Neanderthal form. However, it resembles the Neanderthaloids in one feature; the bigonial breadth is frequently greater than the mandibular length, a condition rare in Homo sapiens, and not even found in Skhul.
In the Crô-Magnon series, the combination of a short, broad upper face with a long cranial vault has often been called “disharmonic,” and it has been asserted that this condition is the result of mixture between a longer, narrower-faced dolichocephal and a shorter, wider-faced brachvcephal.47 In the European series, although both long and round skull forms occur, there are not enough crania which still possess facial bones to make a statistical analysis of this point valid. But in the Afalou series, where the same set of conditions is duplicated, such an analysis is possible.48 Out of nine dolichocranial skulls, four have upper facial indices in the broad category, while fourteen out of eighteen of the rounder-headed examples are broad faced. The tendency toward a broad upper face form, then, is borne predominantly by the meso- and brachycranial element in the group If this is true for the Afalou series, it is probably equally valid in the Crô- Magnon group.
Two of the Afalou skulls, however, present the “disharmonic” combination of a hypereuryene face with a long skull form. In explaining this anomaly we must remember that an extreme width of the face is sex- linked in both the Crô-Magnon and Afalou series; it is a manifestation of the extreme ruggedness and luxuriance of muscularity which the males of both series manifest, and is lacking, as a rule, among the females.
One other peculiarity which is common to both the European and the North African Upper Palaeolithic peoples is a very low orbital index. This again lends itself in the second series to statistical analysis. Only three out of eleven dolichocranial skulls are chamaeconch, while fourteen out of eighteen of those with higher cranial indices fall into this low-orbitted category.49
Hence we may deduce that the two parallel series, Crô-Magnon and Afalou, consist in each case of a Galley Hill-Neanderthal mixture as a base, with which is associated a variant tendency to round-headedness. To this is linked an extremely short, broad upper facial form, with a heavy lower jaw, and wide, low orbits. At the same time, certain differences, such as the nose form, definitely prevent the assumption that the two are identical, and make it extremely unlikely that the two met, after their initial separation. during the entire span of the Late Pleistocene.
Other facts strengthen this conclusion.50 The Afalou people knocked out one to four incisor teeth from the jaws of each person of either sex, between the ages of fourteen and sixteen, apparently as a puberty rite. Tooth knocking is unknown in Europe before the Mesolithic,51 although finger-chopping, during the Upper Palacolithic, is indicated by the outlines of mutilated hands on the walls of the caves. Therefore, if the Crô-Magnon people observed bloody puberty ceremonies, as is quite possible, they must have removed some less tell-tale part of the anatomy than the teeth. While this bit of cultural evidence renders the theory of physical contact between the two groups unlikely, it does not necessarily affect the problem of relative age. We still do not know whether the Afalou men, whose sequence of types parallels that in western Europe, were contemporaneous with their kinsmen to the north, or later than them to arrive.
From a study of these presumably Pleistocene Algerians, we are able to confirm the conclusions reached in the preceding section, and to amplify them. A fully sapiens individual, comparable to Combe Capelle in every important respect, preceded, in time, a group of overgrown, large-headed and wide-faced Neanderthal-sapiens hybrids. This latter type, like Crô-Magnon and unlike the people in central and eastern Europe, bore a tendency to brachycephaly. That Crô-Magnon and Afalou men were the parallel termini of similar movements, and not way stations on a single line of migration, is probable. In view of the earlier evidence of a similar mixture in Palestine, and of the general center of Aurignacian activity in that neighborhood, it may be considered likely that the second pair of parallel movements proceeded westward from that general quarter. The earlier waves which brought Combe Capelle and Afalou #28 must have come from a different center. Whether the Crô-Magnon and Afalou people derived their brachycephalic tendencies from parallel mixtures at the terminal points of invasion or brought them with them in the first place, cannot be determined without further evidence.
Notes:
42 Menghin, O., Weltgeschichte der Steinzeit, pp. 34—35. Obermaier, H., AAnz, vol. 7, 1931, PP. 259—265. Leakey, L. S. B., Stone Age Africa, pp. 105—111.
43 Garrod, Miss D. A. E., RBAA, Pres. Ad., Sect. H. Vaufrey, R., Anth, vol. 43, 1933, pp. 457—483.
44 But two satisfactory accounts have been published: Part II of Les Grottes Palaeolithiques de Beni Séghoual, by Boule, Vallois, and Verneau. Cole, Fay-Cooper, LMB #1, 1928, Section on skeletal material.
45 This feature is extremely common among living North African tribesmen, and among crania from the Canary Islands. See Coon, C. S., Tribes of the Rif, p. 312.
Hooton, E. A., The Ancient Inhabitants of the Canary Islands, p. 134.
46 Mean for 21 males—53.1; Nose Ht.=52.7 mm.; Nose Br.=28.4 mm.
47 Hooton, E. A., Canary Islands, pp. 204—207.
48 The coefficient of mean square contingency between the cranial index and the up per facial index, calculated with nine boxes, equals .53.
49 C = .47. In this contingency table, of 6 boxes, the progression is constant, and of undoubted significance.
50 It was at one time thought that the presence of caries in a small percentage in the Afalou teeth made them later in age than the Europeans. However, the two Solutrean or Magdalenian skulls from Le Roc, Charente, were also carious. Boule, M., and Vallois, H., BIPH, # 18, 1937.
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Lakeside Cemeteries in the Sahara: 5000 Years of Holocene Population and Environmental Change
quote:The older occupants have craniofacial dimensions that demonstrate similarities with mid-Holocene occupants of the southern Sahara and Late Pleistocene to early Holocene inhabitants of the Maghreb.
quote:These early occupants abandon the area under arid conditions and, when humid conditions return ~4600 B.C.E., are replaced by a more gracile people with elaborated grave goods including animal bone and ivory ornaments.
quote: Principal components analysis of craniometric variables closely allies the early Holocene occupants at Gobero with a skeletally robust, trans-Saharan assemblage of Late Pleistocene to mid-Holocene human populations from the Maghreb and southern Sahara.
quote:Figure 6. Principal components analysis of craniofacial dimensions among Late Pleistocene to mid-Holocene populations from the Maghreb and southern Sahara.
Plot of first two principal components extracted from a mean matrix for 17 craniometric variables (Tables 4, 7) in 9 human populations (Table 3) from the Late Pleistocene through the mid-Holocene from the Maghreb and southern Sahara. Seven trans-Saharan populations cluster together, whereas Late Pleistocene Aterians (Ater) and the mid-Holocene population at Gobero (Gob-m) are striking outliers. Axes are scaled by the square root of the corresponding eigenvalue for the principal component. Abbreviations: Ater, Aterian; EMC, eastern Maghreb Capsian; EMI, eastern Maghreb Iberomaurusian; Gob-e, Gobero early Holocene; Gob-m, Gobero mid-Holocene; Mali, Hassi-el-Abiod, Mali; Maur, Mauritania; WMC, western Maghreb Capsian; WMI, western Maghreb Iberomaurusian.
--(doi:10.1371/journal.pone.0002995.g006)
quote:Craniometric data from seven human groups (Tables 3, 4) were subjected to principal components analysis, which allies the early Holocene population at Gobero (Gob-e) with mid-Holocene “Mechtoids” from Mali and Mauritania [18], [26], [27] and with Late Pleistocene Iberomaurusians and early Holocene Capsians from across the Maghreb (see cluster in Figure 6). The striking similarity between these seven human populations confirms previous suggestions regarding their affinity [18] and is particularly significant given their temporal range (Late Pleistocene to mid-Holocene) and trans-Saharan geographic distribution (across the Maghreb to the southern Sahara).
quote: Trans-Saharan craniometry. Principal components analysis of craniometric variables closely allies the early Holocene occupants at Gobero, who were buried with Kiffian material culture, with Late Pleistocene to mid-Holocene humans from the Maghreb and southern Sahara referred to as Iberomaurusians, Capsians and “Mechtoids.” Outliers to this cluster of populations include an older Aterian sample and the mid-Holocene occupants at Gobero associated with Tenerean material culture.
The Kiffian & Tenerean Occupation Of Gobero, Niger: Perhaps The Largest Collection Of Early-Mid Holocene People In Africa
quote:This site has been called Gobero, after the local Tuareg name for the area. About 10,000 years ago (7700–6200 B.C.E.), Gobero was a much less arid environment than it is now. In fact, it was actually a rather humid lake side hometown of sorts for a group of hunter-fisher-gatherers who not only lived their but also buried their dead there. How do we know they were fishing? Well, remains of large nile perch and harpoons were found dating to this time period.
quote:Originally posted by Son of Ra: Did DNAtribes in its SNPAdmixture Results by Population list North Africans as mainly African? ^^^And not Eurasians(i.e European, Arabian,etc).
Can those results by DNAtribes be trusted and how they use regions?
But not only that Wikipedia even states Northwest Africans are mainly African though use Maghreb, but they do separate European and Near East from North Africa, which is interesting. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maghreb_people#Autosomal_DNA
So does North African(DNAtribes) and Maghreb(Wikipedia)= indigenous African for those two?
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