quote: This individual had a derived allele at the SLC24A5 locus, which contributes to lighter skin pigmentation and was shown to be at high frequency in Neolithic Anatolia41, consistent with the ancestral affinity shown above.
posted
I just pulled and downloaded the paper. yes, it is modern samples.
quote:Originally posted by Mansamusa:
quote:Originally posted by xyyman: We are back to Cape Verde!!!!! I am telling you guys deep analysis is require dof Cape Verdeans. --
For those of you not getting what the reviewers are getting at.
Key points. Apparently MtDNA was found in other ancient Egyptians as much as 30%. I need to run that down. The current data is NOT consistent with that. Also they use only 3 YDNA to extrapolate , the reviewer is stating that would amount ot close to 7,000,000!!!! subsaharan slaves which is impossible. So the extrapolation is faulty. SLC24A5 derived is at high frequency in Cape Verde and these people are very dark so the author cannot assume that these AEians were light brown. Furthermore there may be at least 20genes involved in pigmentation.
Not ancient DNA. Its DNA analysis of a modern Egyptian oases population.
Posts: 12143 | From: When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable | Registered: Jun 2007
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quote:Originally posted by Ex-cop (support our police): SICKENING POSTS ON EGYPTSEARCH CALL FOR DEATH OF POLICEMAN!
What has this post to do with this topic?
You have been posting crap about some individual called Joshua … and made multiple threads about that individual? An individual none of us knows and ever heard of.
Lastly, why would you care about police harassment and brutality, right?
Btw, did you see my post on the Bahariyya Egyptians.
Posts: 22235 | From: האם אינכם כילדי הכרית אלי בני ישראל | Registered: Nov 2010
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quote:Originally posted by Ex-cop (support our police): SICKENING POSTS ON EGYPTSEARCH CALL FOR DEATH OF POLICEMAN!
What has this post to do with this topic?
You have been posting crap about some individual called Joshua … and made multiple threads about that individual? An individual none of us knows and ever heard of.
Lastly, why would you care about police harassment and brutality, right?
quote:police tried to keep me in jail for a charge of yelling at a pizza person over the phone.
Police are devils and are not sanctioned to kill
Only Christians can kill every time police try and kill they are punished with loss of there spirit
even when police pull someone over they lose their soul.
Police are the devil governments tool of deception, false authority.
kill police at will
o: abuse@hostgator.com
date: Tue, May 30, 2017 at 7:50 PM subject: Egyptsearch website abuse of host
My complaint is about violence (such as posts calling to kill Muslims) and racist content on the web-forum Egyptsearch that is hosted you, hostgator. Clearly this content is an abuse of your host terms.
Examples of racist threads:
"White humans are the transvestite race. male whites actually women.sodom and ghommora."
quote:Originally posted by Concerned member of public: Examples of racist threads:
All of these have little to do with this topic. And most members do not even support that weird stuff.
Make a different thread for these complains. And / or approach KING about his.
Now let's not ruin this thread, see my post on the Bahariyya Egyptians. And continue this topic / thread in civil manner.
Posts: 22235 | From: האם אינכם כילדי הכרית אלי בני ישראל | Registered: Nov 2010
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quote:Originally posted by Concerned member of public: ~ I guarantee this forum will be gone within a week. I contacted FBI and the web host. Looking for what else I can do.
All IPS traceable/recorded here. That idiot calling to kill cops will get arrested!
You are typing nonsense here. The actions of one individual do not count for all. You don't understand law, especially international law. What you suggest is not on par with international law.
Posts: 22235 | From: האם אינכם כילדי הכרית אלי בני ישראל | Registered: Nov 2010
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quote:Originally posted by xyyman: We are back to Cape Verde!!!!! I am telling you guys deep analysis is require dof Cape Verdeans. --
For those of you not getting what the reviewers are getting at.
Key points. Apparently MtDNA was found in other ancient Egyptians as much as 30%. I need to run that down. The current data is NOT consistent with that. Also they use only 3 YDNA to extrapolate , the reviewer is stating that would amount ot close to 7,000,000!!!! subsaharan slaves which is impossible. So the extrapolation is faulty. SLC24A5 derived is at high frequency in Cape Verde and these people are very dark so the author cannot assume that these AEians were light brown. Furthermore there may be at least 20genes involved in pigmentation.
Northern Cape Verdeans are usually light skinned, and those from the South usually dark skinned. But everything is relative, of course.
Posts: 22235 | From: האם אינכם כילדי הכרית אלי בני ישראל | Registered: Nov 2010
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quote:Originally posted by Concerned member of public: ~ I guarantee this forum will be gone within a week. I contacted FBI and the web host. Looking for what else I can do.
All IPS traceable/recorded here. That idiot calling to kill cops will get arrested!
Tukuler
multidisciplinary Black Scholar
Member # 19944
posted
Yeah lurkers see you're all quick about petty personal bullshit and deaf dumb and blind when it comes to anything meaningful about a report full of what you characterized as egyptturd afroloonacy from ES Monolithic madmen. Ain'tcha got no shame you Grandstand Dan buck dancing eye blinking b...
quote:Originally posted by Swenet:
See Lurkers? Now how do people expect me to respond to the claim above that Dinka are close to the Abusir mummies and delusional chest thumping? What is stopping me from evoking words like cognitively challenged? Now, when I say that phrase it's going to be a problem again for using "insults". But what am I supposed to call that?
You just can't make this up.
Posts: 8179 | From: the Tekrur straddling Senegal & Mauritania | Registered: Dec 2011
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Tukuler
multidisciplinary Black Scholar
Member # 19944
posted
Does any supplement list mtDNA samples? I'm looking for what's NK out of that pre-Ptolemaic set.
posted
^ Guy is the mod here, yet he allows posters to harass, defame, dox, blackmail, post violent threats and call for killing of cops and Muslims etc.
My complaint sent to FBI Internet Crime Complaint Center
quote:Complaint Referral Form Internet Crime Complaint Center
Hi,
I separately filed a complaint to the web-host, abuse@hostgator.com - is it possible you also send a complaint to them.
A website called Egyptsearch (hosted by abuse@hostgator.com, based in the US) has forum threads/posts calling for killing of cops and other law enforcement officers. Clearly this is illegal, and the same website has extreme violent threat content against others, posted by users living in the US. Examples:
All 166 samples from 151 mummified individuals (for details of the 90 individuals included in the later analysis, see Supplementary Data 1) used in this study were taken from two anthropological collections at the University of Tübingen and the Felix von Luschan Skull Collection, which is now kept at the Museum of Prehistory of the Staatliche Museen zu Berlin, Stiftung preußischer Kulturbesitz (individuals: S3533, S3536, S3544, S3552, S3578, S3610). According to the radiocarbon dates (Supplementary Data 1, see also ref. 18), the samples can be grouped into three time periods: Pre-Ptolemaic (New Kingdom, Third Intermediate Period and Late Period), Ptolemaic and Roman Period.
During their conservation in the Tübingen and Berlin collections the remains underwent different treatments: some were preserved in their original mummified state, while others were macerated for anthropological analysis or due to conservation problems19.
Some of the remains (individuals analysed in our study: 1543, 1547, 1565, 1577, 1611) have traces of gold leaf near the mouth and the cheekbone, which is characteristic for mummies from the Ptolemaic Period onwards20.
—Verena J. Schuenemann
Ancient Egyptian mummy genomes suggest an increase of Sub-Saharan African ancestry in post-Roman periods
Posts: 22235 | From: האם אינכם כילדי הכרית אלי בני ישראל | Registered: Nov 2010
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posted
For the record, I've repeatedly said that the Abusir sample will resemble Dobon et al's Coptic Egyptian immigrant sample from Sudan. So far all analyses have confirmed my prediction (even down to the M1 and U6 carriers in the Abusir sample). Somehow, choosing to not beat a dead horse in this thread is being translated to me "running away from Dinka Egypt".
And no. You can't come back from creating fake news and misleading people that Dinka cluster away from West/Central Africans on the other side of the plot and with Abusir mummies and West Eurasians instead.
This proves, yet again, that people still secretly think the Abusir sample was SSA in ancestry, despite all denial that "no one ever said AE=SSA in ancestry".
Posts: 8785 | From: Discovery Channel's Mythbusters | Registered: Dec 2009
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posted
I did and with balls in hand I'll say it again AE=SSA. Not in the absolute but in the majority.
Posts: 1254 | From: howdy | Registered: Mar 2014
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Tukuler
multidisciplinary Black Scholar
Member # 19944
posted
I misread a black circle for a grey circle and a schizophrenic makes a Dinka-du over it. I misread the Czech cross for the Levant bronze. Guess I'm a slobbering Slav fanatic too.
posted
Yeah, I read through this study a second time like I said to get a clear view. And yeah... From what I'm seeing this study has SOME flaws especially from what I am reading from NOT ONLY here but on Forumbiodiversity...
Its like they PURPOSELY used only Yoruba as a representation for the AE SSA/African ancestry. And not Horners or even neighboring Sudanese(Nubians)!
It gets worse because this only gives fuel to those who claim there is some "conspiracy" in these studies. Now am I saying that this means the AE could have been SSA? NO... But I think we owe the people on the "Afrocentric side" a small apology. Just saying.
Posts: 1891 | From: NY | Registered: Sep 2014
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quote:Originally posted by BlessedbyHorus: But I think we owe the people on the "Afrocentric side" a small apology. Just saying.
For what, if I may ask?
Like I said just a small one. Because I do remember that there were SOME who were questioning the location and samples. Not saying this changes anything in what we discussed. But still using Yoruba in 2017? Posts: 1891 | From: NY | Registered: Sep 2014
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Tukuler
multidisciplinary Black Scholar
Member # 19944
posted
Can't say Schuenemann's study only used Yoruba. TyranoHotep already pointed to the genome wide PCA with its 4 E Afrs, 6 N Afrs, and 5 W Afrs.
Yeah. Woulda liked to see a more robust use of them.
Still, Yoruba can speak for western originating Niger-Congo speaker genetics supposedly absent in AE according to some preaching. Is it goodly plausible that if Yoruba makes the showing it does, wouldn't your favored NS & AA E Afrs show even better? Or is that inapplicable?
TTBPMM the south of Sahara ethny I placed directly in ancient Egypt is the Oromo Galla. The Uahka clan. Another member taught me more than I knew about them before.
Posts: 8179 | From: the Tekrur straddling Senegal & Mauritania | Registered: Dec 2011
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quote:Originally posted by Tukuler: Can't say Schuenemann's study only used Yoruba. TyranoHotep already pointed to the genome wide PCA with its 4 E Afrs, 6 N Afrs, and 5 W Afrs.
I didn't see that.
Posts: 1891 | From: NY | Registered: Sep 2014
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posted
But how does that reflect on me or the data if they used a Yoruba sample?
And it's not even true that it matters drastically that the Yoruba were used in some of the analyses. This is simply speculation. I have no evidence that exchanging the Yoruba sample for a Dinka sample would change much.
Posts: 8785 | From: Discovery Channel's Mythbusters | Registered: Dec 2009
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posted
Dobon et al 2015 used different SSA samples as proxies for the SSA ancestry in Sudanese populations and the results weren't drastically different.
quote:To confirm our results and the choice of Yoruba as the outgroup population, we also estimated the mixing proportions with Luhya instead of Yoruba (Supplementary Table S4). Then, the Yoruba population appears in all comparisons, giving a statistically significant value of f3 and an α value within reasonable boundaries. This is an “outgroup case”, where the ancestral population of Yoruba split from the ancestral population of A,B before they did. Despite of the outgroup population used, the comparisons giving the most negative values are the same, confirming that the choice of outgroup is not that relevant for these calculations
What ever the estimated African proportion was using the Yoruba as a sample, another SSA sample wouldn't necessarily perform better.
Posts: 8785 | From: Discovery Channel's Mythbusters | Registered: Dec 2009
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posted
Lol So..... are we concluding that AE was a Levantine transplant? Cuz I see a lot of discussion bout **** that barely matters TBH.
Low hanging fruit or someshit like that.
Posts: 1781 | From: New York | Registered: Jul 2016
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Tukuler
multidisciplinary Black Scholar
Member # 19944
posted
quote:Originally posted by BlessedbyHorus:
quote:Originally posted by Tukuler: Can't say Schuenemann's study only used Yoruba. TyranoHotep already pointed to the genome wide PCA with its 4 E Afrs, 6 N Afrs, and 5 W Afrs.
I didn't see that.
Tinypic wouldn't post my markup of Figure 4 where I used colored lozenges to capsule the three geographies.
Posts: 8179 | From: the Tekrur straddling Senegal & Mauritania | Registered: Dec 2011
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quote:Originally posted by Swenet: What ever the estimated African proportion was using the Yoruba as a sample, another SSA sample wouldn't necessarily perform better. [/QB]
You don't think using Sudanese or atleast other Northeast Africans closer to Egypt as a sample would perform better than Yoruba?
Edit@ElMaestro: idk about everyone else but for me hell no
Posts: 574 | From: Guinee | Registered: Jul 2014
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quote:Originally posted by Swenet: What ever the estimated African proportion was using the Yoruba as a sample, another SSA sample wouldn't necessarily perform better.
You don't think using Sudanese or atleast other Northeast Africans closer to Egypt as a sample would perform better than Yoruba?
Edit@ElMaestro: idk about everyone else but for me hell no [/QB]
See Figure S4. They did in fact include a number of Northeast African nationalities in their admixture test. But to be fair, Northeast Africans like the Somalis and Ethiopian Jews do have a sizable brown component ("Basal Eurasian"?) like the three AE samples in this analysis.
posted
^Nodnarb yeah for the most part they got it ~3.5kya see just about every paper written about East African admixture and Lazaridis 2016. Also, check out the thread you started a few days ago, look at the last page where things actually got good. There's some of your brown component right there aswell.
So once again, thanks to punos for his honesty and fortitude for the past couple of months ...but for others who shy away from having a opinion or a perspective.... Are AEs a Levantine Transplant?
If not what can that say about modern north east populations? If so what does that say about all that was studied before?
Posts: 1781 | From: New York | Registered: Jul 2016
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quote:Originally posted by Elmaestro: So once again, thanks to punos for his honesty and fortitude for the past couple of months ...but for others who shy away from having a opinion or a perspective.... Are AEs a Levantine Transplant?
Like I said, the three AE genomes sampled in this new study do look very similar to those from the Bronze Age Levant (see the ADMIXTURE graphs). So much that I'm confident they have significant recent ancestry from the latter. And we already know from other research that late dynastic northern Egyptians' remains look physically different from earlier ones.
So I would say this new study sheds little light on what the ancestral AE look like. At most it probably shows how the ancestry of late dynastic northern Egyptians, or certain enclaves of them, would have looked.
Posts: 7083 | From: Fallbrook, CA | Registered: Mar 2004
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posted
Late dynastic samples from the North will not in any way demonstrate that ancient Egypt was a Levantine transplant. You need the South for that... precisely because that's where the civilization sprang from. The authors of this study seem to caution against coming to any conclusions about ancient Egypt's biological affinities without the inclusion of the South.
Posts: 1568 | From: Pluto | Registered: Sep 2008
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posted
^don't just stop there guys, bring it to the present. we have posters on here including I who have equated these Lower Egyptian inhabitants to a contemporary North East African population. We have evidence upon evidence and sources upon sources describing the complexity of lower Egypt and the Faiyum demographic. You guys are more versed in these histories than I am. Finish this.Posts: 1781 | From: New York | Registered: Jul 2016
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posted
@Sudaniya I don't know why you keep throwing Lower Egyptians under the bus to the nazi cabal. From what I read(as I stated before) the Lower Egyptians were(or at least started out as) also indigenous despite having less tropical proportions than Upper Egyptians/Nubians. I don't see any reason to yield *any* ground.
Edit: also interesting that one of the aforementioned Nazis gloated that the results would also hold true for Upper Egyptians even into the predynastic which the authors of this study addressed wouldn't necessarily be true. Posts: 574 | From: Guinee | Registered: Jul 2014
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When comparing this pattern with modern Egyptians, we find that the ancient Egyptians are more closely related to all modern and ancient European populations that we tested (Fig. 5b), likely due to the additional African component in the modern population observed above. By computing f3-statistics38, we determined whether modern Egyptians could be modelled as a mixture of ancient Egyptian and other populations.
The sad irony is that most modern Egyptians think that they've become more European due to all the invasions, when in fact they've become more African??
Posts: 496 | From: Greenland | Registered: Mar 2011
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quote:Originally posted by Cass/: Game over Afrocentrists.
"Our analysis furthermore shows that derived alleles for the genes SLC24A5, known to be responsible for partially lighter skin pigmentation were present in both JK2888 and JK2911 (see Supplementary Note 6 for details)."
The argument has been that they had skintones within "African" (as in throughout the continent not just the Sahara) or "black." Funny that when the subject is Igbo you ignore light skin for the average, but when the subject is AE you will take the tones that weren't average and make judgements about Egypt with it.
And...yea like I was saying about SSA..hm.
Posts: 2508 | From: . | Registered: Nov 2011
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Good ****. And reading Gihanga_Rwanda posts from FBD I see where you are coming from. This post by GB caught my eye.
quote:Kenyan Bantus owe an overwhelmingly majority of their ancestry (~60-80%) to Bantu-speaking ancestors with origins in West-Central Africa, particularly the Nigeria/Cameroon border. A more representative proxy for ancient North-East African ancestry are the majority ancestral components in the Dinka/South Sudanese and Mota who, despite oweing a third of their ancestry to West-Central Africans and a Mbuti-like population respectively, are substantially closer to Eurasians. Mota in particular.
If you actually read the study, you'll notice that these ancient samples also had detectable SSA ancestry (at comparable levels to modern Copts) just not of the Yoruba sort, which was to be expected.
Do you agree Swenet? To me it SEEMS parallel to what you were saying.
@Tukuler
Tinypic can be crap and I havent used it in years. I would recommend using Imgur. Totally free and you can upload UNLIMITED images.
Posts: 1891 | From: NY | Registered: Sep 2014
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quote:Originally posted by Real tawk: Game over, Afro-dickwards lfmao!
Did you forget your supposed to be some old disillusioned black guy? I don't recall any older black men ever using words like "dickward" or the N word with the -er at the end.
Why is he so shook? There were 90 samples right? Normally Cass would be laughing it up but he's suddenly after all these years a concerned citizen now. Can someone explain what's got him so upset? There were 90 samples, the haplogroup data on that's still the same so why?
Posts: 2508 | From: . | Registered: Nov 2011
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posted
So basically this study isnt revealing anything new...
quote:However, we note that all our genetic data were obtained from a single site in Middle Egypt and may not be representative for all of ancient Egypt. It is possible that populations in the south of Egypt were more closely related to those of Nubia and had a higher sub-Saharan genetic component, in which case the argument for an influx of sub-Saharan ancestries after the Roman Period might only be partially valid and have to be nuanced. Throughout Pharaonic history there was intense interaction between Egypt and Nubia, ranging from trade to conquest and colonialism, and there is compelling evidence for ethnic complexity within households with Egyptian men marrying Nubian women and vice versa51,52,53. Clearly, more genetic studies on ancient human remains from southern Egypt and Sudan are needed before apodictic statements can be made.
gotta read the study before I post further...
Posts: 8805 | From: The fear of his majesty had entered their hearts, they were powerless | Registered: Nov 2007
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I agree with the gist of what he's saying, but I think he's using the wrong examples. As I've said before, the best place to look for the African ancestry that is in the Abusir mummies, is the recently sequenced Natufians. And if that's accurate, we can simply defer to Lazaridis et al 2016 and see how Gihanga's examples (e.g. Mota) fared there. Mota did not outperform the other samples from SSA in terms of closeness to Natufians.
I'm still not clear on the source of the African ancestry that is in these mummies. How does Gihanga know it's (all) Sub-Saharan African? Fig 4 shows no SSA ancestry in the Abusir mummies. Moreover, modern Egyptians are distant from the Abusir mummies precisely BECAUSE of their recent increase in SSA ancestry. If the source of African ancestry is the same in modern Egyptians and Abusir mummies, why aren't they closer autosomally?
Posts: 8785 | From: Discovery Channel's Mythbusters | Registered: Dec 2009
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I agree with the gist of what he's saying, but I think he's using the wrong examples. As I've said before, the best place to look for the African ancestry that is in the Abusir mummies, is the recently sequenced Natufians. And if that's accurate, we can simply defer to Lazaridis et al 2016 and see how Gihanga's examples (e.g. Mota) fared there. Mota did not outperform the other samples from SSA in terms of closeness to Natufians.
I'm still not clear on the source of the African ancestry that is in these mummies. How does Gihanga know it's (all) Sub-Saharan African? Fig 4 shows no SSA ancestry in the Abusir mummies. Moreover, modern Egyptians are distant from the Abusir mummies precisely BECAUSE of their recent increase in SSA ancestry. If the source of African ancestry is the same in modern Egyptians and Abusir mummies, why aren't they closer autosomally?
I think Gihanga was referring to the finding of 6-14% "sub-Saharan" admixture in the three mummies with nuclear DNA data. If you look at the passage in the study which says this, they do seem to be using "African" interchangeably with "sub-Saharan" there.
Posts: 7083 | From: Fallbrook, CA | Registered: Mar 2004
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posted
I only recall reading African, not Sub-Saharan African. But I could be wrong.
Posts: 8785 | From: Discovery Channel's Mythbusters | Registered: Dec 2009
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quote:Finally, we used two methods to estimate the fractions of sub-Saharan African ancestry in ancient and modern Egyptians. Both qpAdm35 and the f4-ratio test39 reveal that modern Egyptians inherit 8% more ancestry from African ancestors than the three ancient Egyptians do, which is also consistent with the ADMIXTURE results discussed above. Absolute estimates of African ancestry using these two methods in the three ancient individuals range from 6 to 15%, and in the modern samples from 14 to 21% depending on method and choice of reference populations.
posted
How would you reconcile a reading of 6-15% SSA ancestry in Abusir mummies with figure 5c? The latter says that modern Egyptians differ from Abusir mummies in terms of their SSA ancestry.
Posts: 8785 | From: Discovery Channel's Mythbusters | Registered: Dec 2009
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