Tukuler
multidisciplinary Black Scholar
Member # 19944
posted
thot i saw a puddy tat umm tweet where Razib Kahn finally figured out Levant Iraq and the Arabian Peninsula are parts of africa -- just like GK Osei taught me backinda dinosaur dayz of yore er mine
or was i inna dreamin daze and dint know it
At Discover Magazine, Khan once wondered why African bushmen are considered human, but bonobos are not.
Gd help the str8 haired 'eastern ethiopian' self admitted coconut if Bushmen were Ashkenazis and he were Nick Cannon.
posted
Is he quack and someone I should dismiss? Because I've seen some stuff he wrote but not enough to give full judgment.
Posts: 1123 | From: New York | Registered: Feb 2016
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quote:Originally posted by Thereal: Is he quack and someone I should dismiss? Because I've seen some stuff he wrote but not enough to give full judgment.
judge for yourself, here's the link, this is the part about bushmen and bonobos:
quote: The question ensues: are Sub-Saharan Africans several distinct races? Using evolutionary history as a measure I would say yes! This is definitely one area where social expectations have led us astray. It turns out that it may be that the Bushmen/non-Bushmen separation is only 1/3 as long ago in the past as the Neanderthal/modern human separation. In fact, the Bushmen may predate, and not be part of, the "Out of Africa" event. Along with the Pygmies and Hadza there seems to be a very ancient differentiation between the agriculturalist and hunter-gatherers in the African continent. For me these details of history are fascinating. But going back to normative concerns: is there a worry that Bushmen will be dehumanized if it is understood that they are not part of the modern human expansion event circa ~80,000 years before the present? Unfortunately, I don't think that science matters much in this case. The Bushmen have been dehumanized for hundreds of years. The Pygmy of Central Africa have also been dehumanized. All without science. An understanding of our evolutionary history is informative, but I doubt it is the prime motor for the great injustices of history. The 19th century race science which modern biologists and anthropologists revile (to a great extent, rightly) did not give rise to the race system of the West. Look at the history, and you see that its genesis predates Darwin by decades. Science may have been a supporting argument, but this was thesis looking for talking points. The Bushmen are human. The Bonobos are not. Why? I don't think it has been definitively proven that modern humans and Bonobos are not inter-fertile. Granted, the separation between the Bonobos and humans are about two orders of magnitude greater than Bushmen and other humans, but there is some evidence that Bushmen have admixture from archaic lineages diverged nearly 1 million years into the past, pushing elements below a magnitude! Where do you draw the line? Species are a typological concept, but usually as a pure categorical typology the class is useless. Rather, it's a tool, a framework. What you do with a tool, well, that's a different thing altogether....
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Is this guy serious...He considers Bonobos the be AMH?
Posts: 8804 | From: The fear of his majesty had entered their hearts, they were powerless | Registered: Nov 2007
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posted
It never really ends, like I said with Max Plank these people know exactly what they're doing when they dog whistle...
quote:Fragments from that part of Khan’s life started circulating online almost immediately after the news of his appointment at The Times was announced. Those fragments included a letter he had written in 2000 to VDare, a white-nationalist website, suggesting among other things that black people are innately less intelligent than white people.
BTW, maybe he should familiarize himself with racial science, last I checked his Bangladeshi ancestors were considered colored.
Posts: 8804 | From: The fear of his majesty had entered their hearts, they were powerless | Registered: Nov 2007
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posted
I've tangled with this Razib Khan before. Outside the "HBD" echo chamber, he is somewhat cowardly, and is quick to distort what people are saying then "ban" them when he is called out on the facts- a typical "HBD" pattern. --------------------------------------------------------
Enrique Cardova says:
Razib says: Most of the assertions of post-colonial theorists collapse under even the barest of inspection with an empirical mindset. The problem though is most people don’t have much comparative historical or anthropological data to sift through the theory.
This is not so at all. In fact some post-colonial theory is distinguished by the exact opposite. In contrast to skewed and biased constructs imposed on the data by colonial era scholars and such- like the now defunct “Hamitic Hypothesis,” some post colonial theory is actually more empirically based. In the Nile Valley for example, post-colonial scholars have long shown that the civilizations developed therein are indigenous, and do not need assorted “Hamite”, “Mediterranean” or “Oriental” settlers or colonists of various colonial and or post 1950s academic narratives to explain why. In the more political sphere, Fanon’s post colonial analyses on some measures are more objective and realistic than the claim of happy natives under a beneficent colonial regime pushed by the regime’s masters, or allegedly culturally deficient natives waiting for linear philosophies of Western progress. And so on.. Many more examples can be given. If anything the claims of non-post colonialists often collapse under empirical examination, like some of the claims of heriditarian favorite JP Rushton.
. When discussing differences between American society, and his own, he often posits the construct of “Western culture.” My objection to this reflex is always to suggest that what he thinks of as distinctive about “Western culture” is actually a feature shared by many other societies…and Arab culture is distinctive in its own ways. There are ways that all cultures are peculiar, and ways in which it shares features with other cultures
Creating false constructs is a a common problem with Western people, presuming to make pronouncements on “Indian culture” or “African culture” or “Arab culture” when they are often ignorant of not only the details but key cultural landmarks and understandings. Ironically, it has taken post-colonialists to expose many of these false constructs. • Replies: @Razib Khan
One thing I like to add as well, is that the problem with post-colonial theory and other such other modes of historiography which focus on trends rather than historical fact and deep evidence.
How so? Actually some post-colonialists marshal much historical fact and deep evidence to expose a number of falsehoods and false constructs pushed by Westerners. If the topic is the Middle East or Africa, numerous received narratives collapse under empirical scrutiny. Did the peoples of Palestine really “spontaneously flee” in 1948 for example, conveniently vacating massive tracts of land? Were millions of square miles of land really “vacant”- just conveniently waiting for white Boer intruders to take them over? Were Africans, who mysteriously materialize “somehow” on the allegedly “vacant” land really happy with the apartheid system put in place by the white Boers and Anglo collaborators? Post-colonial writers have a lot to say (and expose) about “official” narratives in academia, politics, or culture using historical fact and evidence.
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all negative social phenomenon are derived from the colonial [white european] experience.
No serious post-colonial writer as such has ever made such a claim. Fanon for example, never claimed all was sweetness and light before Europeans came.
^^Echo chamber “gangsta”..
CALLED OUT ON THE SIMPLE FACTS, RAZIB KHAN TESTILY BLOCKS COMMENTARY - A NEAT WAY TO DIVERT ATTENTION FROM THE SHAKY STUFF HE WAS PUSHING.
His “ban” also neatly avoids the points at issue and apparently just pointing out the facts is “annoying” and “hectoring.” It also avoids further exposure of the rest of the dubious stuff he was posting.. Notice how he diverts the issue. The issue is not whether "anyone believes in the Hamitic Hypothesis" but his dubious claims about post-colonial writers..
Razib Khan says: at 10:07 pm GMT • 5.7 years ago ? @Enrique Cardova
no one believes in the “hamitic hypothesis” in a simple fashion anymore. in contrast, people do believe in the post-colonial fantasies (please note i’m not going to publish annoying/hectoring/misrepresenting follow up comments from you).
-------------------- Note: I am not an "Egyptologist" as claimed by some still bitter, defeated, trolls creating fake profiles and posts elsewhere. Hapless losers, you still fail. My output of hard data debunking racist nonsense has actually INCREASED since you began.. Posts: 5905 | From: The Hammer | Registered: Aug 2008
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quote:Originally posted by -Just Call Me Jari-: It never really ends, like I said with Max Plank these people know exactly what they're doing when they dog whistle...
quote:Fragments from that part of Khan’s life started circulating online almost immediately after the news of his appointment at The Times was announced. Those fragments included a letter he had written in 2000 to VDare, a white-nationalist website, suggesting among other things that black people are innately less intelligent than white people.
BTW, maybe he should familiarize himself with racial science, last I checked his Bangladeshi ancestors were considered colored.
He seems to know quite a bit about "racial" science, and I have no doubt he is on the payroll of some "herditarian" funding organization or individual. The link you posted shows his activity and dalliance with the "alt-right" - not at all surprising. He does pretty well in their echo chambers but when his claims are put to the test outside the fawning circle of acolytes, a different picture emerges.
He is reminiscence in some ways of another South Asian pundit and writer who has put himself in service of the right wing- Dinesh Dzouza, who among other things is himself a beneficiary of "affirmative action." His specialty is pitching himself as the "minority guy" who "understands" race, and racism, and who can sympathize with white people who are bothered by those noisy negroes. One of his books is laughably entitled: "The End of Racism."
He got a job as a researcher at Stanford's prestigious Hoover institution without a single peer reviewed paper or publication. He became president of Kings College without having an ounce of experience in college or educational administration. And his top degree is a BA in English. This guy is the epitome of the "undeserving minority" propaganda construct produced by "affirmative action" that he and fellow right wingers rail about.
During his divorce case, his wife testified that he used his karate skills to kick her around. Obviously this dude is one baaaaaddddd muthafa....
Oh and by the way, he wants to repeal the Civil Rights Act of 1964. Git to the back of the bus- so solly black people..
-------------------- Note: I am not an "Egyptologist" as claimed by some still bitter, defeated, trolls creating fake profiles and posts elsewhere. Hapless losers, you still fail. My output of hard data debunking racist nonsense has actually INCREASED since you began.. Posts: 5905 | From: The Hammer | Registered: Aug 2008
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posted
Razib must really have taken the traditional classification of Indians as "Caucasoid" to heart. We can only hope he'll change his tune once the alt-righters no longer find him useful...
posted
Sometimes I read his articles because he has some scientific knowledge and sources, even if I might not agree with his interpretations or opinions but I haven't read one in a long time
A new preprint, Projecting ancient ancestry in modern-day Arabians and Iranians: a key role of the past exposed Arabo-Persian Gulf on human migrations, finds that Basal Eurasian (BEu) ancestry seems to peak in eastern Arabia, and among Iberomaurusian people of late Pleistocene North Africa. I think reading the preprint is important. But, to be frank, much is left unclear.
In 2014 when BEu was created as a construct to explain the greater affinities of Mesolithic European hunter-gatherers with East Eurasians than modern Europeans*, I probably would have been a little surprised that a mostly BEu individual had still not been discovered in the ancient DNA. After all, we had seen Ma’lta boy answer the question of who the mysterious “Siberians” were that left an imprint all over West Eurasia. Ma’lta was part of an ancient Paleo-Siberian group, the Ancient North Eurasians (ANE), who no longer exist in “pure” form, but contributed ancestry (or more precisely were related to groups that did so) to hunter-gatherers in Eastern Europe and the ancestors of New World populations.
No such luck with BEu. In fact, BEu as a construct is so vaguely understood that research groups can estimate that populations are 10% BEu, or 40% BEu, contingent upon various specifications in their model. In the middle 2010’s one of the scientists involved in the groups working in this space and using BEu as a construct even told me that this population may never have existed in pure form anyhow (not Iosif Lazaridis to be clear).
Basically, there is still not a lot of clarity. BEu seems to have diverged before Neanderthal admixture into the non-African lineage ~55,000 years ago. It also seems to have been subject to the long bottleneck of all non-Africans. A very plausible model that BEu occupied the southern Middle East, while non-basal Eurasians occupied the northern Middle East, seem to be the highest probability to me. The authors of this preprint argue that the Basal Eurasian ur-heimat might be in and around the Persian Gulf. I laughed when I read that because it reminds me of the early 20th century “Lost Civilization Underwater” motif. But it could be true.
I would hazard to guess dates, but I think the separation and later (early) admixture of BEu and non-BEu people in the Near East is probably strongly conditional on the paleoclimate data, which I am not fluent in.
* BEu ancestry came into Europe with Neolithic farmers, so affinities between Mesolithic hunter-gatherers and East Asians is higher than between modern Europeans and East Asians.
posted
Khan has mastered a great deal of technical genetic detail. Its when he tries to apply some of that to the real world of human diversity, evolution and history that he runs into trouble and the weaknesses of his arguments and knowledge are often revealed- such as his "hereditarian" or "alt-right" claims. As Jari's link reveals he has been on the payroll of libertarian and/or "alt-right" entities for years like Unz.org and they loved him because he provided technical detail that they could distort to fit their agendas. He also provided/provides a sort of "cullud inoculation" to those paymasters or followers, who can always say: "Hey, how can we be racist when we have this Indian brown guy agreeing with us and furnishing data?'
His bonobo article is saying a lot about nothing, mostly about his opinion on this and that, and specifics are left vague, no doubt to preserve "plausible denial." Its like the authors in "The Bell Curve" saying they ares "agnostic" about whether racial differences in IQ are due to genetics, when in fact their data and arguments are selected and framed in such as way as to lead to just that conclusion, including justification of current racial hierarchies. A great slice of writing in the field is just a propaganda game, complete with strawmen.
He criticizes progressives making much ado about trivially obvious things then proceeds to do just that himself- i.e. yes, people of various ethnic groups differ. Really? Who credible goes about "denying" such a truism? Other startling nuggets include "Most people like associate with "their own kind, however that is defined." Again, who denies this trivial truism? Everybody has the right and preference to voluntary association, but various libertarians subtly shift from this to insinuate that such things as the Civil Rights Act of 1964 was "wrong", violating "freedom of association." Oh those evil liberals hindering "liberty." Why, "genetics" has shown greater negro propensity for criminality and violence, which explains why Jim Crow and apartheid was necessary to keep those races apart, and so on.. Why "genetics" too justifies housing segregation and employment discrimination, If only "the liberals" would admit "the truth."
And gosh durn it, they are oppressing and hindering "liberty." I mean the negroes these days are allowed to eat in the same restaurateurs as white people, and ride transport carriers up front like white people. Durn it, the negroes now are allowed to buy houses where they want. This obviously violates "scientific findings" on how most people "like to associate with their own.."
-------------------- Note: I am not an "Egyptologist" as claimed by some still bitter, defeated, trolls creating fake profiles and posts elsewhere. Hapless losers, you still fail. My output of hard data debunking racist nonsense has actually INCREASED since you began.. Posts: 5905 | From: The Hammer | Registered: Aug 2008
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Tukuler
multidisciplinary Black Scholar
Member # 19944
posted
Razib is a self-identifying coconut, the equivalent of an oreo.
Being a science of anthropology defined Caucasian, though mocked curry tigger by Euro whites who on the ground don't even pretend the lighest skinned of the Hindu are either caucasian or white, homeland of the Aryans notwithstanding.
Khan has a two part article on Aryan for those who can stomach reading the work of a man adored by mainstream science because being brown he can resuscitate overt 19th-21st century racism in academically accepted mainstream sciences related to anthropology -- itself invented by white people to rank themselves the highest living beings on planet earth at a time they had colonized and made coolies out of India and Indians -- without accruing the ire a white person would.
But has anybody seen the tweet or whatever I asked about in the opening post. I need to know if it exists. He had a mask on and he looked middle-aged so if not dreamt up is pretty recent.
for cracking the coconut in his own tree even if banned for it. He never would've made all his money w/o serving yte interests. He's so obviously full of self-serving horse manure. Khan scientifically posited blacks are intellectually inferior. Jungle fresh monkey West African Gulf of Guinea birth land of of the so-called true negroes are the most educated people in England not his spider monkey armed jungle book race. Imagine if black intelligence is inferior his browns and all the rest of non- 'true negro' related humanity must be as sub-human as bonobos.
I hafta wonder if the ascendency of Khan is the source of distasteful current Indians. In the 90's Indians were specifically headhunting blacks in the USA for IT positions. I miss the Indians I knew from the 60s-90s. Can't stand these generations act like Brits never colonized them, made them servants, and called them nigger too.
This American BIPOC thing, ugh. Hey I'm not no amorphous non-white and they ain't me. E&S South Africans but especially native Caribbes aren't fooled but American Blacks just don't know
I heard the kid curry tigger slur from a Croatian American girl who vehemently denied Indians any connection to white European peoples anthropology or no. Just look at the Roma/Gypsies who've been in Europe for centuries she pointed out.
=-=
Just imagine WIPOP White Interracial People of Pallour whenever you see BIPOC a cowardly way to say non-white although I doubt any majority black nation would invent a politics-use-only so socially meaningless 'safety net'.
quote:thot i saw a puddy tat umm tweet where Razib Kahn finally figured out Levant Iraq and the Arabian Peninsula are parts of africa -- just like GK Osei taught me backinda dinosaur dayz of yore er mine
or was i inna dreamin daze and dint know it
Lord but how he twisted the English language to say it... Posts: 2699 | From: New York | Registered: Jun 2015
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Tukuler
multidisciplinary Black Scholar
Member # 19944
posted
That's the main reason I can't read his works. I don't understand his English most of the time. Reads like gobbledeegook when he interprets science. But he of course is writing for his adoring audience.
I know some think the same of my styles but no kick$$$$$back comin my way, no $0.05 per post
BTW ES ol' buddy ol' pal Spencer Wells employs Razib Khan.
posted
I generally understand what you're saying,it's only when you abbreviate in way that I'm not use to that things become confusing.
Posts: 1123 | From: New York | Registered: Feb 2016
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Tukuler
multidisciplinary Black Scholar
Member # 19944
posted
When I do that it's intentional unless due to that 7 herb schnapps
Got the idea from a story where the author spelled as he heard Canadians speak. Took forever to catch on but once I did ...
xlation: thot i taw a puddy tat - reference to Tweety Pie cartoon bird umm tweet - reference spoiling double entendre - links Tweety Bird to Twitter
dayz of yore er mine - just plain sappiness coating a tired cliche - meant to play off of inna dreamin daze
Me and my next younger brother usta do this allatime. Cholly all-A's joined in but Hammon, well he hated it, Shamsadin would just sit there, made Olive, Taifa and them laugh at us goofs.
posted
Hell if we got 5-cent or 5 mao per post for our years on ES we would have a nice bit of cash to pocket. I think the Times checked into some of his libertarian or "alt-right" claims and rightly backed away, though some people questioned why, when Nicholas Wade, who advances a bunch of shaky "hereditarian science" was able to hang on so long as a staff writer in the Science Times section of The New York Times from 1982 to 2012. One reason could be that Wade did not show his true colors until very recently. Both Khan and Wade claim "political correctness" caused them hurt, but much more than "correctness" did them in- rather it was/is fundamentally bad science. This was confirmed when over a hundred geneticists and biologists categorically dismissed Wade's view of race in a joint letter published in The New York Times on 8 August 2014:
"Wade juxtaposes an incomplete and inaccurate account of our research on human genetic differences with speculation that recent natural selection has led to worldwide differences in Intelligence quotient (IQ) test results, political institutions and economic development. We reject Wade's implication that our findings substantiate his guesswork."
Their main point of criticism was how Wade was DISTORTING standard genetic information, including some of THEIR work to make it look as if most of the data or science supported his skewed "hereditarian" view and speculations.
Charles Murray after the Bell Curve ran the same propaganda game plan- posing as the noble teller of truths, "persecuted" by the vile forces of "political correctness." Many fell into his trap with heated rhetorical attacks but his work has some serious flaws on the TECHNICAL merits, so that even libertarian fellow travelers like Thomas Sowell criticized his naive use of statistical correlations. "Political correctness" is often a convenient smokescreen Khan and others hide behind when their work receives any kind of serious critical scrutiny, and specific flaws are exposed. The "PC Card" is much easier to invoke rather than answer such scrutiny, and plays well with the base.
-------------------- Note: I am not an "Egyptologist" as claimed by some still bitter, defeated, trolls creating fake profiles and posts elsewhere. Hapless losers, you still fail. My output of hard data debunking racist nonsense has actually INCREASED since you began.. Posts: 5905 | From: The Hammer | Registered: Aug 2008
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posted
So these people have no history and therefore need to manufacture a historiography based on falsehoods. If Europeans were so smart based on genetics, then why aren't the first civilizations found in Western Europe? Why did most of Europe remain a backwater until the Romans invaded and forced them to become civilized? And why did that civilization fall after the Romans left? And even then, why was Europe was still behind Asia, Africa and the Islamic world and even the Americas in civilization? And if Europe was such a great place then why did so many Europeans leave between the 15th and 19th century to find a "better life" in colonies outside Europe based on theft of land, labor and resources from other people. And then why did the enlightenment in Europe happen only in the 17th century as a result of the wealth accumulated from all the resources stolen from various places around the world?
IQ has nothing to do with any of this. It is a measure of the infrastructure and educational institutions within a society and the quality and accessibility to that education. Comparing someone from an impoverished background with little access to quality education to someone from a wealthy background with full access to quality education is NOT a measure of biological intelligence. It is a measure of inequality in terms of wealth and educational resources. And that is the whole point of IQ, which is to flip the history of the last 500 years into an IQ issue versus a theft of resources and wealth creating vast inequalities in access and opportunities among various groups.
Posts: 8890 | Registered: May 2005
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Tukuler
multidisciplinary Black Scholar
Member # 19944
posted
Thot I taw a puddy tat? I did! I did!
Seeing Spencer Wells in cahoots with Khan by hiring him now I know I really saw that Tweet or whatever of the latter recognizing Levant Iraq Arabian peninsula as Africa in the exact terms that he did. He was just echoing his boss who btw is in love with the Bushmen.
But anyway the Kahn tweet may cause scientists to eventually reconsider African origins of major uniparental haplogroups and the last two most recent OoA episodes with their earliest concomitant so-called back migrations to and from Arabian tectonic plate lands mere intra-African regional movements.
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