posted
Well, now that they have had their "black" pharaohs of the 25th dynasty, NG has decided to go back to the "non black" 18th dynasty and Hatshepsut:
Not ironically, while they have a lot of images from Karnak and Dier el-Bahri, they sure avoid showing too many, especially the trip to Punt itself, like those below (as if people don't have access to a full array of images from this temple which obviously contradict the "artists" representation above). Obviously this makes it seem that while the ancient Egyptians saw themselves as quite dark (or at least portrayed themselves that way), modern "experts" from Europe or America, thousands of miles away and with NO physical relationship to ancient Egypt or Africa somehow know better and therefore the need for modern artists to "correct" the way the ancient Egyptians depicted themselves.
But the funniest bit is the following caption on an image of one of her statues:
quote: A luminous face in painted limestone, from Hatshepsut's mortuary temple at Deir el Bahri, reveals characteristics that the pharaoh shared with close relatives: an aquiline nose, a wide mouth, and a bulging upper lip. "The whole family had an overbite," explains archaeologist Betsy Bryan.
Big lips and buck teeth. LOL!
That and another quote which shows that the only time her depictions are even close to as pale as the image above is after the layers of soot were removed from certain images, which also removed a lot of the color. Lame attempts to excuse why European artists use a color palette totally UNLIKE the palette the Egyptians used for themselves. Also note how the modern reproductions make sure to keep the walls of the temples white washed and without imagery so as not to make the contradictions so obvious. LOL! Here we have all sorts of scenes of the pharaohs from the 18th dynasty literally covering every nook and cranny of their temples, yet the modern artists make the walls blank. Yep, that is really accurate work there for sure. But I guess it is easier to do that as opposed to trying to cover the walls with pink or tan colored pharaohs, which do NOT match the artwork that has survived.
quote:A thorough cleaning by Polish conservators has revealed the vibrant colors that adorned the sanctuary of Amun-Re when it was first built at Deir el Bahri. Two small patches on the wall at right—where a bearded Hatshepsut makes an offering—show how thickly the soot from candles and oil lamps built up over many centuries.
If anyone doubts National Geographic's Eurocentric bias look no further than this imagery.
Posts: 647 | From: Atlanta | Registered: Jan 2009
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posted
Not to mention they are now rerunning secrets of Egypt's lost Queen on Discovery.....
Now THAT is a funny program. You have all these black locals running around the site in Upper Egypt, yet all the reenactments are LILY WHITE (ULTRA WHITE) and none of the FULL COLOR images of Hatsepsuts coronation or depiction as king are shown. And interspersed with their PRO WHITE EUROPEAN reenactments (Thutmosis I looks like the French Archaeologist onsite... doh!) are reality TV like dramatic moments that are obviously fake. Not to mention the UNPROFESSIONAL handling of the remains that they are going through in the museum.
posted
Oh my ... the repro of Thut IV above. Somewhere somewhile ago wasn't just his head and shoulders from that very painting posted here and wasn't the profile intact without the nose destroyed?
How many are there of him and Hathor? The one I find on the Theban (theivin') Mapping Project site differs in color and detail from the Flikr one. Is TMP's a retouched photo or a photo of a retouched tomb painting? Or??? Thanks for any help.
IMPORTANT: the mdw ntjr at their shoulders should match between the flikr version and the TMP one, but I notice a 'loaf' missing in flikr.
NEVERMIND I found a perfect match up. I jumped the gun -- no modern foul play against the nose
Posts: 8014 | From: the Tekrur in the Western Sahel | Registered: Feb 2006
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posted
I think it's time for a collective boycott of Discovery and NatGeo. The problem is that there is no concerted effort to make these FOR-PROFIT people show some respect in a way they will understand.
At the same time, there is no push amongst blacks in the diaspora or Africa to create their own forms of media that deal with these subjects. Integration is at it's worst when we continue to expect these people to do what's right and not build our own.
Posts: 455 | From: Tharsis Montes | Registered: Jan 2009
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posted
I agree, but you have to keep in mind that these shows are PURELY PRODUCED for "western" audiences and are NOT designed for consumption by Egyptians or other Africans. That right there tells you the whole story. People from thousands of miles away from the Nile valley with NO genetic or ancestral relationship with it feel a need to identify with something that they had NOTHING to do with. Therefore they FUND, PRODUCE and DISTRIBUTE such nonsense purely for the consumption of people who have no connection to Egypt at all, ancient or modern. Europeans come from Europe. White Americans come from Europe. Europe is not the Nile Valley and Europeans are not Nile Valley Africans or the basis of the features there in ancient times.
It must be remembered that these people DO NOT OWN history and the world's history and Africa's history is not THEIRS to control. They use their media as nothing more than a tool of propaganda, which is not so much to push truth, but reinforce popular propaganda. This entire house of cards falls apart easily when exposed to the TRUTH. But because they OWN the media and they FUND the excavations, they use that to their advantage, knowing full well that they are telling lies. They simply want to reinforce a nonsense historical narrative that does not exist and create a fantasy out of thin air. They could care less about the millions of BLACK Egyptians that are still in Egypt and they could care less about Africans. They only want to make the people of Europe and America feel "close" to the Egyptians and not the people NATIVE to the Nile Valley who ARE closest to it.
Therefore, I agree, but the point isn't to convince Europeans of anything. They aren't Nile Valley Africans. The point should be to EDUCATE the Africans of the Nile Valley and the rest of Africa of their OWN history and the fact that THEY DON'T need whites to tell them their history.
Posts: 8897 | Registered: May 2005
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White Nord
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posted
Lmfao yeah you guys are really spreading the "truth" to the masses! No one believes the BS on this forum for the last time...Sorry!
Posts: 219 | Registered: Aug 2007
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quote:No one believes the BS on this forum for the last time
Hopefully the last time we have to see you.. You white nord Euro spammers kill me with your "everyone" = white people and "no one" = everybody else. Buzz off my delusional son.
Posts: 4021 | From: Bay Area, CA | Registered: Mar 2007
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posted
Hey Doug M,I really think they are trying to do better:remember there was a time they would unabashedly paint them pink or milk white,now they just started painting them beige,with enough time they will get around to paint them chocolate brown, just like the Kemeties painted themselves. Posts: 6546 | From: japan | Registered: Feb 2009
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posted
LOL. They won't. It is a power trip and the whole idea is that they have the power to portray these people like them, whether the facts agree with it or not. It is no different than if Africans had conquered Europe and were now portraying the Romans as being black.
These institutions are not about truth they are about white supremacy pure and simple.
Bottom line: The ancient Egyptians hardly EVER portrayed themselves as pink to pale white. And this is most certainly true for Hapshepsut, who is almost ALWAYS portrayed in dark brown colors, along with MOST of the soldiers, priests and high officials around her. NONE of them were painted pink or pale white. Therefore there is NOTHING in any artwork that suggests the Egyptians saw themselves as that complexion. Those colors were reserved EXPLICITLY for foreigners, like Asiatics. Therefore, the reenactments are portraying the ancient Egyptians as Asiatics not as Egyptians. And it is a joke to pretend that this isn't obviously purely deception. They know it and that is why the SO MANY tombs from the 18th dynasty that are in FULL COLOR are still not shown in any major form even though they have been excavated for many years. These tombs have thousands of images of Egyptians with blacks from top to bottom and front to back. And when they do show them, they show them in bits and pieces, in order to maintain their deception.
Not only that, but the only whites on these archaeological sites are often the foreign archaeologists, with most of the people being black native Egyptians. Therefore, to pretend that the reenactments with pharaohs looking more like European archaeologists as opposed to the NATIVE Egyptians is BLATANT distortion.
And again, these reenactments are not historical evidence they are nothing more than entertainment with no historical value. If you want art and reproductions that are of historical value, you have to look at the actual art of the ancients.
More than once on the TV program they mentioned how the Thutmosids had wide noses, big upper lips, overbites and receding chins, all of which are characteristically black African. So how does that support depicting these people as bright white people? It doesn't. They know it and it is simply a lie. None of these actors had that trait.
Egyptology has never been intended to do anything but lie and distort Egyptian history. It has never been intended to tell the truth.
Here are some pages showing Egyptian tombs from the 18th dynasty and the native Egyptians looking exactly the same, while the only whites are foreigners. Yet and still from the piece above, the only people in the reenactments look like foreigners.
Again, nowhere do you see any pale white people, except in the pale foreign archaeologists and their reenactments.
Posts: 8897 | Registered: May 2005
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posted
Well Doug M,of course they will do it (paint them pink or milk white),if no one challanges them, and so for nearly a hundred years they did as they damn well pleased,while most of the black or African intellectuals,were busy fighting just to stop their people from getting killed and brutally exploited:mind you that fight is nowhere complete,but they do have a little time just recently to adderess such issues.And again they are enough lay persons who know enough to raise questions that will cause them embaressment,people on this very board and else where.After all they do want ligitimecy,and they pretend to have pride,so i beleive they will continue to give a little,untill finally they come clean.they know they are being watched,with a beige coloring they can say "hey" what are you protesting now, beige is well in the range of African colors,why can't you be satified with that!! Posts: 6546 | From: japan | Registered: Feb 2009
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quote:Originally posted by Doug M: Not to mention they are now rerunning secrets of Egypt's lost Queen on Discovery.....
I was just wondering why yesterday on the Discovery Channel they were showing all these programs.. And by the way, the first time I saw the program when it first aired and I saw the Hatshepsut 're-enactments', I actually thought the actress who portrayed her was one and the same as the white Egyptologist! LOL No lie, they looked so much a like and neither liked Hatshepsut.
Posts: 26286 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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quote:Originally posted by White Nerd: Lmfao yeah you guys are really spreading the "truth" to the masses! No one believes the BS on this forum for the last time...Sorry!
So you call all the authentic ancient artwork the Egyptians made of themselves "BS" and not truth??
Yes keep telling yourself that if it makes you feel better. At least Natgeo is smart enough to know the truth but hide it instead of denying the truth like the crazed loser that you are!
Speaking of which, Doug what you pointed out as humorous as it is, it's also sad that a 'respected' 'academic' journalistic company would go so far as continue their ridiculous tradition of white fantasy art over authentic historical reality! Indeed, I'm sure even laypeople who are ancient Egypt enthusiasts and therefore familiar with authentic portraits of the 18th dynasty would be disturbed by Nat-Geo.
A luminous face in painted limestone, from Hatshepsut's mortuary temple at Deir el Bahri, reveals characteristics that the pharaoh shared with close relatives: an aquiline nose, a wide mouth, and a bulging upper lip. "The whole family had an overbite," explains archaeologist Betsy Bryan.
Of course we know the so-called "overbite" be alveolar prognathism. Yeah, wide-mouth, bulging lips, and prognathous teeth are very 'caucasian' features aren't they?? LMAOPosts: 26286 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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quote:Originally posted by White Nerd: Lmfao yeah you guys are really spreading the "truth" to the masses! No one believes the BS on this forum for the last time...Sorry!
So you call all the authentic ancient artwork the Egyptians made of themselves "BS" and not truth??
Yes keep telling yourself that if it makes you feel better. At least Natgeo is smart enough to know the truth but hide it instead of denying the truth like the crazed loser that you are!
Speaking of which, Doug what you pointed out as humorous as it is, it's also sad that a 'respected' 'academic' journalistic company would go so far as continue their ridiculous tradition of white fantasy art over authentic historical reality! Indeed, I'm sure even laypeople who are ancient Egypt enthusiasts and therefore familiar with authentic portraits of the 18th dynasty would be disturbed by Nat-Geo.
A luminous face in painted limestone, from Hatshepsut's mortuary temple at Deir el Bahri, reveals characteristics that the pharaoh shared with close relatives: an aquiline nose, a wide mouth, and a bulging upper lip. "The whole family had an overbite," explains archaeologist Betsy Bryan.
Of course we know the so-called "overbite" be alveolar prognathism. Yeah, wide-mouth, bulging lips, and prognathous teeth are very 'caucasian' features aren't they?? LMAO
National Geographic, along with discovery and the History channel on cable are only interested in appealing to their majority audience, which means white European people. Their magazines and television shows are not for Africans, which means they are not designed to appeal to ACTUAL Egyptians, they are designed to appeal to Europeans. Therefore, they are not interested in TRUTH they are interested in maintaining the white European fantasy world view of all history revolving around white folks. Therefore it is not "respected" in the sense of telling the truth and is as much part of the institution of white supremacy as any other outlet.
If you asked the artist what he/she based their paintings on they ultimately would have NO answer, because there AREN'T any images of Hatshepsut and the trip to punt featuring ANY tan skinned Egyptians. Therefore, there is no "evidence" that the Egyptians looked this way.
Posts: 8897 | Registered: May 2005
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posted
For the record, I skimmed through this Hathshepsut issue of NatGeo just yesterday in my school library. They actually had a couple of pages showing scenes of an Egyptian soldier carrying myrhh trees from Punt as well as a tiny pic of Hatshepsut's painted bust. Other than that, they mostly showed her other unpainted statuary.
I believe they even showed a picture of Thutmose.
I really don't know what the people of Natgeo were thinking.
Posts: 26286 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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You white nord Euro spammers kill me with your "everyone" = white people and "no one" = everybody else. Buzz off my delusional son.
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