posted
I'll make this short. I just need some information on how to get a legal divorce from a guy I married at the Ministry of Justice. We have been waiting for one year now for his visa to be processed and in the meantime this war in Iraq has caused so much hatred and prejudice for Americans that his mom refuses for him to come here. He is 27 and I'm 43 and they don't even know we're married and he has no intentions on telling them. Believe me I discussed all of this before we got married and have learned my lesson the hard way. But I still love Egypt and want to come back and don't want any problems when I do visit. I heard if he keeps his original marriage license then he can still say we're married. He says he wants to keep it because he still loves me but he can't kill his parents and tell them. This has been hell. So please if anyone knows how to legally get a divorce done and if it matters if he keeps his original.
Thanks LifeIsTooShort
Posts: 7 | From: United States | Registered: Jun 2004
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posted
Get in touch with the Egyptian consulate/ Embassy where you live, and ask for an international divorce lawyer's name. If you don't go the legal way with an international lawyer, you will probably have a problem getting the divorce, he will probably give you the run around.
quote:Originally posted by LifeIsTooShort: I'll make this short. I just need some information on how to get a legal divorce from a guy I married at the Ministry of Justice. We have been waiting for one year now for his visa to be processed and in the meantime this war in Iraq has caused so much hatred and prejudice for Americans that his mom refuses for him to come here. He is 27 and I'm 43 and they don't even know we're married and he has no intentions on telling them. Believe me I discussed all of this before we got married and have learned my lesson the hard way. But I still love Egypt and want to come back and don't want any problems when I do visit. I heard if he keeps his original marriage license then he can still say we're married. He says he wants to keep it because he still loves me but he can't kill his parents and tell them. This has been hell. So please if anyone knows how to legally get a divorce done and if it matters if he keeps his original.
posted
LITS - Please keep us informed as to if this works. I'll be curious to hear how much trouble you have, or if it turns out to be not that much problem for a foreign woman to finish her marriage contract from afar.
posted
What he say's is true. While he has the marriage papers, in Egypt, you are still married to him. Which means that you cannot marry anyone else and that if anything happens to you (you get run over bu a bus, etc) he can claim his share of your property in Egypt. Nowhere else in the world accepts the marriage and you can just tear the papers up and forget them. However, it can curtail your actions in Egypt.
Getting a divorce from a reluctant man is not easy. He can divorce you simply but usually the men who are with European women will only sign divorce papers for an incentive. In other words you might have to pay him off. "Still loving you" is often a euphamism for "how much will you pay to get rid of me". If he signs the papers the divorce is simple because then he is divorcing you. How big an incentive he requies depend on what he knows about your finances and how wealthy he thinks you are. His livlihood has gone and he might want compensating for it.
Without his agreement there is virtually nothing you can do. It is possible to get a divorce from the court but it takes years. I bought mine !!
Mediation is better than confrontation in this situation as you need his co-operation.
If you have no intention of re-marrying in Egypt and have no property there, then just ignore it and get on with your life.
Good luck.
[This message has been edited by Luxorlover (edited 29 June 2004).]
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thanks debbie and luxorlove...but for some reason i really believe he loves me but can't because of his situation with his parents. He is not reluctant to divorcing me, but he wants to keep the original marriage papers for some reason that I don't know why. He said his dad is 62 years old and he doesn't want to hurt him before he dies so this means giving me up. I think this is like a romeo and juliet scenerio that can be stopped by a mom wishing the best for her son. I really think he doesn't mean to hurt me, but my god it's hurt me beyond belief. But I will go on with my life, as he will, because we have no choice. And ever since I've been to Egypt and have seen this culture and the Egyptian men, I feel like there is no comparison. So yes, I will marry again, but only to an Egyptian, because that is where I left my heart and soul.
Posts: 7 | From: United States | Registered: Jun 2004
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posted
I don't think you will have any problems divorcing him quickly on either side - if you claim he deceived you, and married you only to get a visa
Posts: 2182 | Registered: Oct 2002
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posted
Sorry, if she is talking about the Egyptian courts (especially Luxor) it will take at least three years before it get in front of the judge. There is no such thing as a quickie divorce for a woman in Egypt but it only takes a few minutes for a man to free himself from marital ties.
[This message has been edited by Luxorlover (edited 29 June 2004).]
If he will divorce you, then there is no problem about him keeping the original papers to show others. That will save his face and not affect you unduly. You do not have to surrender the old papers. He will have no legal claim on you if you hold the divorce papers (get them translated).
The original marriage papers in the court files will have the divorce papers attached to them so no copies of the marriage certificate will be allowed.
Just get the divorce and get on with your life. If he will really divorce you then accept his offer and let him keep the papers - if saving face is his compensation then so be it.
[This message has been edited by Luxorlover (edited 29 June 2004).]
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how long a divorce takes depends on what conditions she's stipulated in her marriage contract regarding her right to ask for a divorce, and whether she's willing to walk away without receiving any financial settlement. most foreigners don't have a large mahr in their contracts so it's not an issue.
lifeistooshort...I assume this is a marriage valid outside of egypt, since he's applying for a visa, right? you should get an international lawyer and try to get an annulment from where you are; that decision will be valid within egypt as well.
quote:Originally posted by Luxorlover: Getting a divorce from a reluctant man is not easy. He can divorce you simply but usually the men who are with European women will only sign divorce papers for an incentive. In other words you might have to pay him off. "Still loving you" is often a euphamism for "how much will you pay to get rid of me".
LOL!! Oh LuxorLover, you KILL me!!
Posts: 310 | From: Maryland, USA | Registered: May 2004
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If it was as easy as EPC seems to think it is then more would do it. Are you a woman and have you actually tried it ??
Yes, it depends on the circumstances. He could beat you half to death and they would still not give you a divorce if he did not want one. Divorce is a civil rather than a criminal matter but it still has to go before a judge - and that can takes years. (Been there, read the book, bought the T shirt, - didn't like it much).
You would not believe the lengths I had to go through to get a divorce. Half of them were totally immoral - but it was the only way to gain my freedom. My lawyer said I had to be really nice to him just in case he changed his mind and stopped the divorce. Eventually it went through the court without him knowing when it was going to be heard. I was sweetness personified until I got those papers in my hand.
If you have an American or European marriage then you have to sort it out in your own country as well.
Glad you liked the humour Carleen - honestly if I did not laugh about it all I would throw myself off Luxor bridge.
[This message has been edited by Luxorlover (edited 29 June 2004).]
[This message has been edited by Luxorlover (edited 29 June 2004).]
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When I contacted the British Embassy to enquire about Egyptian husbands being able to put travel restrictions on foreign wives I was told that this could only be done through a court order, but even if a husband did that his wife could now go to court and ask for khul’ (an Islamic divorce initiated by a wife with usually a repayment of the mahr). I was told that this would only take about four months. I know this law was only bought in recently, but was it before or after you tried to get your divorce Luxorlover? I was just wondering if due to this law whether the situation might not be easier now.
Posts: 4576 | From: Cairo | Registered: Jun 2002
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My divorce became 'absolute' (or however you would term it one year ago.) I did take about four months to go through the court - but that was solely because he agreed to it. Had he not agreed to it then it would have taken years. What is supposed to happen and what actually happens are two different things. A woman is supposed to be able to divorce her husband but in practice it is really hard.
If he agrees to let his wife go if she takes nothing from him, then there is no problem. If he does not agree, (or wants paying off) then there is little that can be done about it without a very lengthy fight.
My partner agreed to a divorce for a very high price. Then, he changed his mind (having accepted the 'bribe'). The only way that I got the divorce was by 'persuading' his lawyer not to tell him the date that it was being heard and to use his proxy to get it through. Without that i would still be married to him.
An Egyptian man cannot stop his European wife from leaving the country. A court order would not be granted unless there were children involved and then it would only cover the children.
[This message has been edited by Luxorlover (edited 29 June 2004).]
posted
God I didnt realise it would be this difficult. He has agreed to the divorce without any problems but he just hasnt done it yet. I will check on the international lawyer as well. And I'm not asking for anything and either is he so I hope this doesnt take long. I've already been through enough with him changing his mind after 2 years of being together. I just want to find someone else and move on with my life without crying over what he's done.
Thanks for your help guys
Posts: 7 | From: United States | Registered: Jun 2004
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quote:Originally posted by Luxorlover: The only way that I got the divorce was by 'persuading' his lawyer not to tell him the date that it was being heard and to use his proxy to get it through.
NOMB, but I'm curious....what did it cost to "persuade" the lawyer to do this?
What you said seems to back up this article, which although it is over a year old, seems to indicate that the new khul’ law is not being carried out as smoothly as it should be, as the whole point of the law was that a woman should be able to obtain a divorce without her husband’s agreement, provided that she sacrifices all that she would be due otherwise in a talaq divorce, and returns the advance portion of the dower (muqaddim). http://weekly.ahram.org.eg/2002/617/eg11.htm
Just one additional query, as far as you understood, was there any difference between the process you went through to one that someone who had a registered marriage with the Ministry of Justice would have had to go through?
posted
I don't really know about that. Mine was registered with the court and I had huge great green papers. It should have been a simple matter to get out of - it was far from simple.
The lawyer - well. This is Egypt so I did it the usual way. I gave him a white envelope with some large '50 piastra' notes in it. !! He did not even open it. He just stuffed it in his pocket and told me everything would be all right - it was.
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