It's been awhile since I last posted a forum here and just wanted to update you that this will be the final one, since I now do not have an Egyptian connection to make me care about Egypt and it's issues and people.
As you remember, I was in a relationship with an egyptian guy in Alex. I had met him there was while I was studying Fusha back in Feb. I could'nt tolerate living in Egypt so I left in April to continue modeling and working as a fashion stylist in Dallas. The Egyptian guy was very nice, honest and interesting and he wanted to prove to me that Egypt was decent. So, he paid for my entire trip so I could visit him in Alex for the month of August. I enrolled in the school I had previously attended and learned more Arabic. The experience was'nt any better, since I was still not willing to convert to a typical Arabic women and as usual I could'nt handle and observe women being treated like dirt(myself included) and seeing actual animals being abused, plus the heat was unbearable.
After August I returned back to Dallas and the plan was for him to come live in Dallas with me. As we started the visa process last month, he backed out and told me that he wanted me to live and move to Egypt and marry him there in Feb. As you all know from my previous posts, living in Egypt would be a living nightmare. So I ended the relationship immediatley.
I could'nt imagine living in Egypt. I remember when I was there I met an American wife married to an Egyptian and all she did all day was take care of her children and watch American movies. How predictable and dull! She was'nt fluent in Arabic so she could'nt communicate with that many people. While she seemed to be content with her life, she also realized that she was in a position where she did not have much of a choice but to force herself to be falsely happy.
While I do believe that Western women can be happy in an de-progressive third world country like Egypt, I also fully believe that they have had to alter there personalities because the mindset is so ignorant. Why should you convert your personality? I never have understood the mindset of these women but obviously lack of a self-esteem and comfort of self in their own country leads for them to feel confortable to change their personalities for a man. To each his own, I suppose.
Also I can't understand why a Western woman would like to live in a society where women are so disrepected and aesthetically speaking, it's so dirty and ugly? I guess we all have our idea of taste, even if its means really horrible personal taste. I also worried that if I had a child, he would take it and I would'nt have any say in that! How comfortable of a feeling that is! Also a high percentage of girls are victims of FGM and I'd be damned if my daughter became part of that percentage!
On the upside of this adventure, I realised how lucky I am to be from a 1st world country and have the ability to be anything I want to be without the worry of my gender. It's a really nice feeling to know that I live in a progressive society that does not mix religion and state. So yes, my experience was an eye opener and I must thank Egypt for allowing me to see that what I used to consider depressing(e.g. my favourite lipstick or shoes being sold out) is nothing really, when you look at how some people live in 3rd world countries. It's a rejuvenating feeling.
So yes, it was time to end that relationship. I want to thank Tigerlily, Akshar a few others who knew just by reading my posts that I could never succumb to such a society and have a husband who was no matter how liberal he seemed, he was at the end of the day a Muslim man. I wish luck to all the other women who are in these relationships and I warn them that they have to go visit Egypt on their own without being escorted to really see, if they can conform to such a culture, mindset and behaving like the women there.
As for me, I'm looking forward to attending either a cosmetic schools in Paris or a shoe design school in Milan. Whichever I end up choosing, I can guarantee you that it will be much more mentally and emotionally stimulating then being a housewife in Egypt. Take care everyone!!
Posts: 87 | From: cleveland | Registered: May 2005
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Okay I promise you this is going to be a 5- page thread. So let me get the melodrama started.
I am so happy for you, that you've been wise enough to get out of this at the right time.
Have a great life.. And yes, having your favorite shoes sold out *is* a big issue.
Posts: 8756 | From: Tax-Free Zone | Registered: Jul 2005
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quote:Originally posted by frienda: As for me, I'm looking forward to attending either a cosmetic schools in Paris or a shoe design school in Milan. Whichever I end up choosing, I can guarantee you that it will be much more mentally and emotionally stimulating then being a housewife in Egypt. Take care everyone!!
Yeah shoes are so important.
Posts: 5744 | From: Minneapolis, Mn USA | Registered: Mar 2004
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There's more things to do than only be a housewife in Egypt. I'm glad things worked out for you, but that seems to be a really unidimensional view of an entire culture...
Posts: 8794 | From: 01-20-09 The End of an Error | Registered: Dec 2004
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Congrats and condolences about your relationship ending. There is a huge difference between living poor and living 'held down' in society that makes choices for you that don't fit. So some less-fortunate areas of the world can still be interesting to live in. I have some friends living in South America in the poorer areas and they love it too much. They are also off exploring and doing what they want without cultural expectations that would unnecessarily limit them. Good for you for sticking to your guns when it mattered. And good for him for disproving the oft-repeated stereotype that the Egy boiz will do anything for a "permanent resident" status in a country with a higher GNP.
Posts: 1161 | From: wo xiang xiao bian ji si le | Registered: Oct 2005
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Good for you for being strong enough to know what is right for you and not getting caught up in a situation that would lead to divorce. I feel that some people just aren't cut out for living in another culture and you are obviously one of them (no insult intended by the way). I too felt that I needed to appreciate my life in America more and that was part of many reasons for my recent visit to Egypt. I did come back feeling lucky that I was a woman born in America. I also no longer felt the need to "keep up with my friends" when it comes to material posessions, not that I ever had too big of a problem with it in the first place, but now I have no issues, I feel lucky to have the things I have after seeing Egypt. I do advise anyone, especially a woman thinking of moving to Egypt to go alone and see what happens. I had a very rough first few days there, but it was a life experience and I learned how to deal with the mentality of some bad Egyptians. Overall I had a great time and I am still considering living there.
Posts: 333 | From: USA | Registered: Apr 2005
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Hello Frienda, I'm glad it all worked out for you. Although I think if this guy was what you really wanted and loved the location would be irrelevant. Also I don't think being a housewife is such an awful concept. Who's to say she isn't happy? Plus, I disagree with your views of Egypt. It seems you looked at it through pesimistic and critical eyes. There's so much beauty there, but you have to open yourself to it. That goes for any country. I preceive you as materialistic and high maintenance and well, there's just so much more to life. Hey, that's for you though. I'm glad you found out now what you wanted....for him too. Good luck to you!
Posts: 1063 | From: Oregon | Registered: Jun 2005
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I agree with you KIR, but I'm glad Frienda was true to herself to know where she belongs.....there is good and bad to every place, and we've got to know what we can cope with, what we love, what we don't mind, and what we can't live without. (But you know that, I'm just saying I admire her ability to stay true to her own needs/wants).
Because I hate the pollution in Cairo too. But other than that, I thought it was incredible. Somebody once said here that every city has its own energy.....
and I'm definitely in tune with Cairo. Posts: 8794 | From: 01-20-09 The End of an Error | Registered: Dec 2004
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I think what u said about Egypt was very disrespectful, and if u think u "can't" live in Egypt, then I am sure Egypt can live without u too!!!
Posts: 36 | From: Toronto, Canada | Registered: Jan 2006
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if this guy said to u "hey,sweety i wanna go to dallas that would be f**kin' amazing" i think u would have told us this guy make use of me and wanna go to live in the heaven of u.s!!!!!!!!!!!,and when he told u to live in egypt,u broke up with him coz u don't want to live in the hell of egypt!!!!!!!!!!.com'on for God's sake.!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Posts: 20 | Registered: Jan 2006
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Frienda, best of luck for the future. And it looks like you will be soon over here in Europe. Be careful Italianos are really masters in flirting and sweeping a woman of their feet. I've been to Bergamo, close to Milano, for a couple of weeks to visit a friend of mine. What a wonderful summer it was. Enjoy yourself!
Oh just as a note on the side: My husband could get us to Naples this summer for his new assignment but I really want to wait it out to see if we can secure the job for next summer in Cairo. That's where I want to be again, only for two max. three years. I could not imagine to live in Egypt all my life. At one point I need to back in the Western society and I also miss my own homecountry and it's culture too much.
Posts: 30135 | From: The owner of this website killed ES....... | Registered: Feb 2004
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Also I can't understand why a Western woman would like to live in a society where women are so disrepected and aesthetically speaking, it's so dirty and ugly? I guess we all have our idea of taste, even if its means really horrible personal taste. I also worried that if I had a child, he would take it and I would'nt have any say in that! How comfortable of a feeling that is! Also a high percentage of girls are victims of FGM and I'd be damned if my daughter became part of that percentage!
On the upside of this adventure, I realised how lucky I am to be from a 1st world country and have the ability to be anything I want to be without the worry of my gender. It's a really nice feeling to know that I live in a progressive society that does not mix religion and state. So yes, my experience was an eye opener and I must thank Egypt for allowing me to see that what I used to consider depressing(e.g. my favourite lipstick or shoes being sold out) is nothing really, when you look at how some people live in 3rd world countries. It's a rejuvenating feeling.
When I read your posting I first thaught that it was a joke, but then, I realised and understood why some some Egyptian really don't like some people from the West
Posts: 1182 | Registered: Sep 2005
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It's a really nice feeling to know that I live in a progressive society that does not mix religion and state. Quoted from Frienda
America is not state and religion mixed? I was under the impression it WAS due to born again christian majority in government? Not trying to hassle you Americans-I really thought the politics was a lot to do with religion? It is here -just not as declared....
Posts: 872 | From: Sydney | Registered: Nov 2005
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Generally it's separated, Melati, but the majority in there right now seem to be evangelical Christians and they are not even trying to keep the two separate.
It bothers me a lot...
Posts: 8794 | From: 01-20-09 The End of an Error | Registered: Dec 2004
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Wow, I guess I always overlooked the insight that shoes & make-up are mentally stimulating. I now wonder about all those wonderful things I have missed out on in my life! Must get some new shoes & make-up...
Your views on Egyptian society are very shallow & uni-dimensional. Please do stay where you are, you don't even grasp what's going on in your own country, don't venture outside.
Posts: 42 | From: Maadi, Cairo | Registered: Dec 2005
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Acutally Frienda, and I never ever thought I would hear myself saying these words, but I think your Egyptian man has had a lucky escape. For you only ever to have travelled to Egypt at his expense, is pretty cheap on your part anyway. I usually find myself warning Western women about relationships/marriage with Egyptian men because the majority of the women I have met are the ones not only funding their own trips but financially supporting their Egyptian male and extended families, conned into property purchases etc. Having witnessed the poverty and huge culture differences whilst you were in Egypt, have you ever contributed any money to any Orphanage or Animal Centre, or given a few LE to obviously those you may have encountered who are obviously worse off than you? Many of the Western women who do marry Egyptian men aren't just stay at home, mothers and/or housewives but do actually contribute something to their adopted society. Maybe the worst thing in the world for you is not being able to purchase your favourite lipstick or to be spoilt for choice when purchasing your new footwear, you should be ashamed of yourself. Take off your blinkers!! MM
Posts: 33 | From: UK | Registered: Nov 2005
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1st world? I think it is called a developed country - if you loved this man you would live with him anywhere.
Posts: 9 | Registered: Dec 2005
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Frienda....enjoy your superficial and shallow life outside Egypt... I'm sure Egypt can survive the great loss of not having you there!!!!! Posts: 4238 | From: USA | Registered: Jul 2004
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quote:Originally posted by frienda: While I do believe that Western women can be happy in an de-progressive third world country like Egypt, I also fully believe that they have had to alter there personalities because the mindset is so ignorant.
I *am* happy you have realized your own desires in life and that they don't fit with your view of Egypt, but I personally know several Western women who are *loving* their lives in Egypt and they haven't changed their personalities at all.
One person on this board -- whom I don't know but who strikes me as very Western and true to her beliefs -- is Dalia. She seems to have a wonderful mix of maintaining her own personal (Western) values while still deeply respecting and appreciating Egyptian culture.
quote:Originally posted by frienda: As for me, I'm looking forward to attending either a cosmetic schools in Paris or a shoe design school in Milan. Whichever I end up choosing, I can guarantee you that it will be much more mentally and emotionally stimulating then being a housewife in Egypt. Take care everyone!!
Mentally stimulating cosmetic school!
Posts: 8794 | From: 01-20-09 The End of an Error | Registered: Dec 2004
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I´ll let you hear my opinions. I am also living in one of the wellfare countries,Finland, we have famous Nokia etc... I see things totally differently than Frienda.
I know we have social security, but we pay huge amount of taxes. We have female president and quite equal society, but women face still lot of racism, abusive husbands, too much pressure because we are highly educated and expected do do career, take care of children, husbands, decorate and clean houses...
We have also high unemployment rate, no matter how experienced or educated you are, it maybe won´t help you to get a job.
Yes, we have quite frens air and space to walk in the forest alone. But thanks to ******our seas are very polluted, the most typical weather here is grey and slippery, or like last week -40 degrees. It can also rain whole summer:(
Women have their independence, we can live wherever we want, there is no cutting...But between surveys we don´t feel good. Why? Maybe women are not actually ment to act like men. Take too much responsibility and men acting like womens like they do here. I don´t say Egyptian way is better, but in each country there is some ****...
Because we don´t have social culture many people feel lonely. We are only expected do act well at work, no need to do anything else. Families maybe don´t have close relations, some live totally isolated. So wellfare countries have another face also despite Nokia and all!
You can buy just anything here, but for example one cucumber costs 2 euros this time of a year:)
I feel empty as a single woman in my cosy new house. This is not reasonable. I love outdoors and be with people. But all of my frends are married or live together with a man. Everybody stays inside and escapes winter, so there is nothing social.
I know there is many problems in arabic countries, but somehow I fashinated by Egypt when I was there. I have travelled a lot, but it was something else. I felt home there, weird...
I pray I could maybe try to live there in the future. If you born somewhere it doesn´t mean that country makes you the happiest:)I feel it is wise to try alternative ways to live. Then you are able to appriciate each thing what is good in each culture.
-True devotion
Posts: 118 | From: Finland | Registered: Jan 2006
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One person on this board -- whom I don't know but who strikes me as very Western and true to her beliefs -- is Dalia. She seems to have a wonderful mix of maintaining her own personal (Western) values while still deeply respecting and appreciating Egyptian culture.
Snooz, you forget one big thing here: Dalia is not married to an Egyptian (yet)...... She lives in Egypt out of free will, she can leave anytime if she wants to, no family attached.
Posts: 30135 | From: The owner of this website killed ES....... | Registered: Feb 2004
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I understand....but I'd still like to think that where a couple lives is a decision made by *both* spouses. Egyptian or not.
My husband wants to move back to Cairo if he gets a certain business deal he's working on.....but he said we can live anywhere *I* want to live. So I've definitely got the veto vote. Posts: 8794 | From: 01-20-09 The End of an Error | Registered: Dec 2004
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If you move to Cairo you and your husband will have the finances to live a comfortable lifestyle.
Most of the Westerners who are coming to Egypt to work coming with great even extraordinary contracts. Considering the prices - you can get much more for the Dollar or English Pound in Egypt than back home - these people live good.
But I do want to mention that there are also foreign women living in Egypt - even those who came for Western countries - and you can call their lifestyle compared to their homes very basic and even poor. In specific I was aquainted with a girl from the UK who got married to an Egyptian (you know typical story falling in love while on vacation in Sharm) and they had a little boy together. She worked as a English teacher in one of the kindergardens in Cairo, money was always tight, husband made even less than her, she had to ask often for some money to buy her son some milk or eggs. Husband didn't want to move to Europe, "it's gonna get better...." I really couldn't understand.
Posts: 30135 | From: The owner of this website killed ES....... | Registered: Feb 2004
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I am shallow enough to admit I would want to have enough money to live well in Cairo. I would find it a *huge* culture shock to live very modestly in a developing nation.
Women who do that? More power to them. Whatever lifestyle people choose, I really do hope they are happy and fulfilled. Posts: 8794 | From: 01-20-09 The End of an Error | Registered: Dec 2004
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Usually many women don't have the forsight, they are in love, getting married and after some time they fall down from cloud 9 and have a crash with reality. And they are struggling. Things don't turn out the way they thought. The sparkle of living in Egypt becomes a pain. And in most cases it's the money issue. Not many job offers and as you know local salaries are so low, some husbands don't even want that their wives go back to work out of pride and also because a woman has to stay at home in their mind. But life gets more and more expensive, at least after baby no. one arrives..........
Posts: 30135 | From: The owner of this website killed ES....... | Registered: Feb 2004
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I am surprised. I think Frienda's honesty about her problems with the idea of living in Egypt is refreshing. It isn't "right or wrong," and she didn't post that as a response to someone else's question or experience. She simply posted her feelings. But then, I rarely see a reason to flame people online. The thing is, there ARE some real issues invloved in settling down with someone in a foreign country. As a parent, I can see how important, how vitally vitally important, it is to understand the law, customs, and expectations of the culture you will adopt. Concern about fgm, even WITHOUT PARENTAL approval, is real, valid, and very serious. People do fall in love and make lives in areas that are less than "bustling metropoli," where things can happen that we later read about in the New York Times. Concern about the legal rights of Egy-married women, especially in regard to their children, is valid and incredibly important. So, maybe there is some venting going on, but I think that's good. Again, it's good to know who you are, what you like, what you can't stand - all subject to change on a whim!
Posts: 1161 | From: wo xiang xiao bian ji si le | Registered: Oct 2005
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There is nothing wrong in Frienda's finding Egypt is not the place for her but she does not need to make false assumptions about other peoples lives to justfiy her decision. She was in the country for a very short time to have any authority to come up with such judgements or to have any understanding about the lives of Egyptian women or foreign women that choose to live in Egypt.
Maybe one day she will come to understand the opression of women in 1st world countries but you have to live it to gain that understanding.
Posts: 3809 | From: Paradise | Registered: Mar 2003
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One might say "don't throw the baby out with the bathwater." Breakups sometimes make us want to return to what is comfortable and most familiar. Pity if it be at the expense of our openness to another culture.
Posts: 1161 | From: wo xiang xiao bian ji si le | Registered: Oct 2005
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Okay, so everyone is thinking of me as this evil woman for not obeying him and forcing myself to live with him in Egypt because I deep down did'nt love him.
The money issue was a huge concern for as well as losing my personal freedom. He only made 2,500 LE per month at his job which is roughly $450. I make that amount in less than a week! I remember my apartment cost $150 and I spent $200 on food, taxis and other personal items, shopping for clothing not included. So the point is, if we lived in Egypt we would be living at the complete minimum, which is not something that I at 25 yrs old would despise to put myself through in the name of love!
We would barely afford to eat, we would have to rely on public transportation, traveling and shopping to exotic locales twice a year would be out of the question, hell even going back to the USA would be out of the questions as well, i could'nt afford to even take a class at a local college, no more going to ethnic clubs to take dancing courses, long would be the days when I could wear a sleeveless dress and high heels to the city centre and sunbathing out on the beach while drinking margaritas would so be forbidden. I could'nt even smile, cross my legs or laugh in public because it's against ebb.
So basically my life would include such dazzling benefits such as being holed up in an apartment, fulfilling the duties of a wife as specified in the Quran,having 4 children, forced to wear the hijab and having to tolerate the daily harrassment that is considered norm in this culture. How sad of an existence. I'm sorry but having hunger pains,cabin fever,loneliness and post-partum depression is not something that I would tolerate just to be in love with someone.Maybe I'm a rare bird, but I believe a relationship should be 50/50 and not me give 90 and he give 10. While this type of lifestyle is normal for an Egyptian woman, it's not acceptable in my opinion from an outsider looking in.
Many of you Western women think that living this way is appropriate, but I don't know of any girls here in America that could handle such a situation unless their dealing with identity issues. In terms of offering, I had much more to offer him and he had only his looks to offer me which I'm sure would soon get old. I have my own apartment, vehicle, job and am financially able to travel abroad twice a year for a few months at a time.
Plus, I never forced him to come to Dallas. When I met him and throughout the entire relationship, all he did was whine about how much he hated his life there. So I gave him an option to come to Dallas. I just assumed that if you hate a situation that you are in, you'll try to make a change for the better. He also knew of my personal opinion of Egypt and I had told him many many times that I was not going to live there with him. However, he would joke around and say that I would eventually enjoy my life there (looking back, he was serious!). I made it very clear from the beginning of the relationship that we could only have a relationship only if he was serious about coming to America. Otherwise I would have left it as a spring fling back in April and sure as hell not let it have continued up until December. But no, he said he was serious and then December came and gave me an ultimatum. Either we marry and live in Egypt or we end the relationship. Needless to say, within 15 seconds, I came up with my decision. He kept on promising that it was not his parents influencing him. When I met his parents, they dislked me at first but they grew to like me and then they invited me to one of their sons wedding. They did ask me if I wanted to live in Egypt with them and I told them that no I could not. I guess these people thought they could brainwash me or something. Or perhaps I thought that I was joking because I would always reply with a laugh and a smile.
However, he was so weak and confused, and I never understood why. He was truly afraid of traveling outside Egypt. I've never met a man so scared in my life. His friends would email me telling me that they were sick of hearing him think off all these things that could go wrong for him in the USA but at the same time he really wanted to go. I would always comfort him, but it got old very quickly(me playing the role of mother is'nt a nice site). I could'nt be with someone who did'nt have a backbone and was a constant dreamer. I tried to be nice and patient but many times I would question him why he was so weak and did'nt have any balls to make a decision. He wanted to get into the jewelry and fashion industry here in America and I specifically mentioned that he had to develop a tough skin, determination and a very strong personality that can withstand the rejections, turbulations and crassness of the people in this industry. He never could develop this personality. I can't understand why someone would be so afraid of traveling to an unknown locale. I've traveled all over the world on my own and I'm still surviving. Obviously adventurous was'nt one of his qualities.
Now with this information, it should be clear why I chose not to live with him. However, I'm sure there will be a few of you who still think that love supersedes everything and it's perfectly normal to be in a 90/10 relationship. Please continue living in this fantasy world because when that bubble bursts, it will be very painful when you see the reality in all it's rawness in being in this kind of relationship.
quote:Originally posted by helprequired: 1st world? I think it is called a developed country - if you loved this man you would live with him anywhere.
quote:Originally posted by frienda: Okay, so everyone is thinking of me as this evil woman for not obeying him and forcing myself to live with him in Egypt because I deep down did'nt love him.
The money issue was a huge concern for as well as losing my personal freedom. He only made 2,500 LE per month at his job which is roughly $450. I make that amount in less than a week! I remember my apartment cost $150 and I spent $200 on food, taxis and other personal items, shopping for clothing not included. So the point is, if we lived in Egypt we would be living at the complete minimum, which is not something that I at 25 yrs old would despise to put myself through in the name of love!
We would barely afford to eat, we would have to rely on public transportation, traveling and shopping to exotic locales twice a year would be out of the question, hell even going back to the USA would be out of the questions as well, i could'nt afford to even take a class at a local college, no more going to ethnic clubs to take dancing courses, long would be the days when I could wear a sleeveless dress and high heels to the city centre and sunbathing out on the beach while drinking margaritas would so be forbidden. I could'nt even smile, cross my legs or laugh in public because it's against ebb.
So basically my life would include such dazzling benefits such as being holed up in an apartment, fulfilling the duties of a wife as specified in the Quran,having 4 children, forced to wear the hijab and having to tolerate the daily harrassment that is considered norm in this culture. How sad of an existence. I'm sorry but having hunger pains,cabin fever,loneliness and post-partum depression is not something that I would tolerate just to be in love with someone.Maybe I'm a rare bird, but I believe a relationship should be 50/50 and not me give 90 and he give 10. While this type of lifestyle is normal for an Egyptian woman, it's not acceptable in my opinion from an outsider looking in.
Many of you Western women think that living this way is appropriate, but I don't know of any girls here in America that could handle such a situation unless their dealing with identity issues. In terms of offering, I had much more to offer him and he had only his looks to offer me which I'm sure would soon get old. I have my own apartment, vehicle, job and am financially able to travel abroad twice a year for a few months at a time.
Plus, I never forced him to come to Dallas. When I met him and throughout the entire relationship, all he did was whine about how much he hated his life there. So I gave him an option to come to Dallas. I just assumed that if you hate a situation that you are in, you'll try to make a change for the better. He also knew of my personal opinion of Egypt and I had told him many many times that I was not going to live there with him. However, he would joke around and say that I would eventually enjoy my life there (looking back, he was serious!). I made it very clear from the beginning of the relationship that we could only have a relationship only if he was serious about coming to America. Otherwise I would have left it as a spring fling back in April and sure as hell not let it have continued up until December. But no, he said he was serious and then December came and gave me an ultimatum. Either we marry and live in Egypt or we end the relationship. Needless to say, within 15 seconds, I came up with my decision. He kept on promising that it was not his parents influencing him. When I met his parents, they dislked me at first but they grew to like me and then they invited me to one of their sons wedding. They did ask me if I wanted to live in Egypt with them and I told them that no I could not. I guess these people thought they could brainwash me or something. Or perhaps I thought that I was joking because I would always reply with a laugh and a smile.
However, he was so weak and confused, and I never understood why. He was truly afraid of traveling outside Egypt. I've never met a man so scared in my life. His friends would email me telling me that they were sick of hearing him think off all these things that could go wrong for him in the USA but at the same time he really wanted to go. I would always comfort him, but it got old very quickly(me playing the role of mother is'nt a nice site). I could'nt be with someone who did'nt have a backbone and was a constant dreamer. I tried to be nice and patient but many times I would question him why he was so weak and did'nt have any balls to make a decision. He wanted to get into the jewelry and fashion industry here in America and I specifically mentioned that he had to develop a tough skin, determination and a very strong personality that can withstand the rejections, turbulations and crassness of the people in this industry. He never could develop this personality. I can't understand why someone would be so afraid of traveling to an unknown locale. I've traveled all over the world on my own and I'm still surviving. Obviously adventurous was'nt one of his qualities.
Now with this information, it should be clear why I chose not to live with him. However, I'm sure there will be a few of you who still think that love supersedes everything and it's perfectly normal to be in a 90/10 relationship. Please continue living in this fantasy world because when that bubble bursts, it will be very painful when you see the reality in all it's rawness in being in this kind of relationship.
quote:Originally posted by helprequired: 1st world? I think it is called a developed country - if you loved this man you would live with him anywhere.
Earth to Frienda.
you are superficial and thats it.
We could give a rats ass what you think.
Besides you are originally dutch right?
Posts: 5744 | From: Minneapolis, Mn USA | Registered: Mar 2004
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Ok so the problem was the man end of story.
What you describe as the life of Foreign women is very far from reality if you are with the right man.
Posts: 3809 | From: Paradise | Registered: Mar 2003
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Frienda, to come and live even get married in Egypt is a totally different story than just to come as a tourist. We all know that. You both showed efforts to maintain the relationship and I am sure that the ending was friendly and mutual. I don't understand why people beat you hear up literally when you just speaking what you had on your mind. And if people want to see it or not Egypt is "behind" in many ways but also offers things what we all more or less forgot about here in the so-called "Western society". And maybe thats what some folks - me included - actually like.
Again good luck for your future! Posts: 30135 | From: The owner of this website killed ES....... | Registered: Feb 2004
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quote:Originally posted by MyKingdomForATaba2Koshari:
quote:Originally posted by Kabreeta: Fi siteen dahya , fein el 2ola?
Eeh dah? Are you my alter ego?
Aslaha 7aga tin2it ya Koshary.. I mean what a shame that these scumbags of egyptian men allow themselves to fall for trailer trash like that... al designer al.. balash habala ba2a el wa7id mish 2adir yimsik a3sabu.
Posts: 126 | From: New York | Registered: Jan 2006
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quote:Originally posted by Kabreeta: Aslaha 7aga tin2it ya Koshary.. I mean what a shame that these scumbags of egyptian men allow themselves to fall for trailer trash like that... al designer al.. balash habala ba2a el wa7id mish 2adir yimsik a3sabu.
I'm not a fan of Egyptian men so I do not totally agree with you
BUT
I like you
Wanna be sa7bety? Posts: 8756 | From: Tax-Free Zone | Registered: Jul 2005
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I'll go back again and say... CONGRATS FOR THE MAN!
The guy is kiddy so she puts the blame on the whole nation!! who the hell do u think you are?? for some odd reason, I think ur forgetting what forum ur on...or dont you!!!
Well, thank Goodness that Egypt is free of ppl like urself missy!
Posts: 36 | From: Toronto, Canada | Registered: Jan 2006
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quote:Originally posted by Tigerlily: Frienda, to come and live even get married in Egypt is a totally different story than just to come as a tourist. We all know that. You both showed efforts to maintain the relationship and I am sure that the ending was friendly and mutual. I don't understand why people beat you hear up literally when you just speaking what you had on your mind. And if people want to see it or not Egypt is "behind" in many ways but also offers things what we all more or less forgot about here in the so-called "Western society". And maybe thats what some folks - me included - actually like.
Again good luck for your future!
Hi Tigerlily I don't think people had a problem that life in Egypt did not suit frienda. It was just the way she assumed eveyone's life was as she had witnessed from a small number of people in a very short space of time and used that to justify her decision, rather than just admiting this was not the right man for her.
Life in Egypt is very different to the West and of course that is what attracts so many of us but I do wish people would see just how fast things are changing these days. Women go to college, univesity, work and do not necessarily have to stay at home after they marry. Many choose to of course but it is their choice and as you will know the best one when the children are small. Many women also work out of economic necessity just like in the West. Maybe if our posted had considered this she could have found a way to make her relationship work.
I sometimes wonder if visitors to Egypt go around with blinkers on. Think how many women you see working in shops, banks, supermarkets, offices, schools, hospitals, etc then ask yourself if they are all sat in the home or not?
Posts: 3809 | From: Paradise | Registered: Mar 2003
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quote:Originally posted by MyKingdomForATaba2Koshari: BUT
I like you
Wanna be sa7bety?
Eih dah? Mafeesh cat fight???
Sorry Sub. I'm trying my best to keep my "enemyship" with everyone but I can't keep up.
You don't know how difficult it is to do one's best to make enemies every day. Please bear in mind that I'm a wife and working mother.
So those who wish to start a catfight with me kindly wait for your turn. I will be right back with you as soon as I bite the head off of the one before you.
For further information, please refer to the other section for our current catfight with zeft etteen 30-year old male virgin of ES.
Plus, I never forced him to come to Dallas. When I met him and throughout the entire relationship, all he did was whine about how much he hated his life there. So I gave him an option to come to Dallas. I just assumed that if you hate a situation that you are in, you'll try to make a change for the better. He also knew of my personal opinion of Egypt and I had told him many many times that I was not going to live there with him. However, he would joke around and say that I would eventually enjoy my life there (looking back, he was serious!). I made it very clear from the beginning of the relationship that we could only have a relationship only if he was serious about coming to America. Otherwise I would have left it as a spring fling back in April and sure as hell not let it have continued up until December. But no, he said he was serious and then December came and gave me an ultimatum. Either we marry and live in Egypt or we end the relationship. Needless to say, within 15 seconds, I came up with my decision. He kept on promising that it was not his parents influencing him. When I met his parents, they dislked me at first but they grew to like me and then they invited me to one of their sons wedding. They did ask me if I wanted to live in Egypt with them and I told them that no I could not. I guess these people thought they could brainwash me or something. Or perhaps I thought that I was joking because I would always reply with a laugh and a smile.
However, he was so weak and confused, and I never understood why. He was truly afraid of traveling outside Egypt. I've never met a man so scared in my life. His friends would email me telling me that they were sick of hearing him think off all these things that could go wrong for him in the USA but at the same time he really wanted to go. I would always comfort him, but it got old very quickly(me playing the role of mother is'nt a nice site). I could'nt be with someone who did'nt have a backbone and was a constant dreamer. I tried to be nice and patient but many times I would question him why he was so weak and did'nt have any balls to make a decision. He wanted to get into the jewelry and fashion industry here in America and I specifically mentioned that he had to develop a tough skin, determination and a very strong personality that can withstand the rejections, turbulations and crassness of the people in this industry. He never could develop this personality. I can't understand why someone would be so afraid of traveling to an unknown locale. I've traveled all over the world on my own and I'm still surviving. Obviously adventurous was'nt one of his qualities.
Now with this information, it should be clear why I chose not to live with him. However, I'm sure there will be a few of you who still think that love supersedes everything and it's perfectly normal to be in a 90/10 relationship. Please continue living in this fantasy world because when that bubble bursts, it will be very painful when you see the reality in all it's rawness in being in this kind of relationship. [QUOTE]
one day you will realize in your life what truly matters. it is not anything you described, and love takes many forms (namely respect and admiration) which you might learn as well. these 'things' you seem so caught up in are truly not lasting and I think you are the saddest girl to ever sit behind a Pc.
Posts: 1074 | From: Menufia, Egypt | Registered: Oct 2005
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one day you will realize in your life what truly matters. it is not anything you described, and love takes many forms (namely respect and admiration) which you might learn as well. these 'things' you seem so caught up in are truly not lasting and I think you are the saddest girl to ever sit behind a Pc.
Not as sad as the girl who sits behind a PC with a fake persona.
Posts: 5744 | From: Minneapolis, Mn USA | Registered: Mar 2004
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frienda i agree with other ppl in here that the way you talk about egypt and its culture is not verry respectfull. even it is difficult for a western woman to understand this culture,does not mean it is a wrong and bad culture,its only that we are raized with different opportunitys and different vieuws on how it should be.Now its good that you took this deccision because you did not saved only yourself,but also him and even future children from having a misserable life.He seems a man who is proud of his country and he deserves a wife who can be as well. Its obvious that you were only attracted to this man but not in love with him,and that saved you both from a hudge mistake.Imagine you were in love with him that would not have changed your feelings about egypt but it could have made you blind for a couple of years and after when your eyes got open again severall lives would have been ruined.So are you a selfish,spoiled,materialistic woman?as ppl in here feels about you? maybe!but you did him a favor as well and i would say it is your right to decide what you want with the rest of your life selfish or not and at least you are honest on it ,if you made another choice we could have now talked to a bitter,dissapointed,broken woman.
Posts: 16 | From: Belgium | Registered: Dec 2005
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quote:I could never succumb to such a society and have a husband who was no matter how liberal he seemed, he was at the end of the day a Muslim man.
All I can say is - if you hate the guy don't hate the whole country. I mean, any country
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I met one young woman from Poland. She married an American man who brought her into US and told her, he wants to marry her because he thinks that all American women are bad. Also, the last girlfriend cheated on him so he specifically was looking for a foreign bride. They apparently met in Poland, and he brought her in US. She hardly speaks English, I mean how did they get to know each other without language, don't ask, I have no clue.
I could not believe she believed in all that he told her. She worked part time job to help him pay the bills. She cooked and cleaned their house, and he was going out into night clubs alone. Yet, she believes he loves only her, and nobody else. He is loyal and faithful and he loves her ( but he hates all American women, and you know how many American women are in the United States???? Who is indeed an "American woman"? )
Who is the "Egyptian woman"? Who is the "Muslim man"?
I think you will repeat the same experience with someone else until you resolve your issues. Good Luck! Posts: 989 | Registered: Aug 2004
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Yeah Tiger. And guess what, they are about the same age. She is 26. So there were no age difference. Plus she was soooo happy that he hates all American women and loves only her! LOL.
Posts: 989 | Registered: Aug 2004
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