posted
this probably sounds stupid but is a surveyor used to survey a property before you purchase.also if its a upper floor property thats being purchased whats to stop the ground floor owner if he would want to knock his property down.apologies for what may be a silly question,hopefully theres a simple answer.
Posts: 117 | From: manchester uk | Registered: Jun 2006
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Real properties are generally sold "as is". The surveyor's role only comes when you register the contact with the Real Estate Register (the equivalent of a notary public).
As for the upper floor/ground floor issue. By law, the owner of the ground floor may not exercise his right to demolish if it were exclusively to your detrminet. Please note, however, that he may always exercise his preemption right and acquire the property you bought for the same price.
Posts: 88 | From: Khonfesharia | Registered: Jun 2004
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posted
hi mirox,thank you for the info......very interesting,the preemption right sounds like it could be beneficial to the ground floor owner.what would be the criteria for someone to exercise this right.does this mean that if property prices soared then ground floor owners can buy back the upper floors of the property at the original price paid,ie.cheap price.
Posts: 117 | From: manchester uk | Registered: Jun 2006
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posted
The exercise of preemption right takes place by virtue of a lawsuit that needs to be filed within either: a) 15 days from the date on which the buyer formally notifies (i.e., through the court's bailiff) all parties entitled to exercise the preemption right or; b) 4 months from the date on which the sale and purchase contract is registerd with the Real Estate Register.
The plaintiff in the said lawsuit needs to deposit the full sale price with the court before filing the lawsuit. In the event that the plaintiff wins the lawsuit, the defendant shall be entitled to withdraw the money from court.
As a matter of practice, many people write down a value for the sale that's much lower than the true price paid so as to reduce the registration fees (3% of the sale price). I strongly advise against this because this is the price that the plaintiff has to pay in case he exercises his preemption right.
Posts: 88 | From: Khonfesharia | Registered: Jun 2004
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posted
thank you very much for this information.i am considering purchasing a proprty in sharm but was wondering why first floor property is more numerous than ground floor.i suppose there are advantages to purchase ground floor.thank you once again.
Posts: 117 | From: manchester uk | Registered: Jun 2006
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posted
you're most welcome Ian. A small legal tip FYI; foreigners are not allowed to "own" property in Sinai but rather to have a "usufruct" for up to 99 years. People overlook this since very few people actually register their ownership over there. Good luck
Posts: 88 | From: Khonfesharia | Registered: Jun 2004
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posted
more usefull info.perhaps if i choose to purchase somewhere you could represent me!
Posts: 117 | From: manchester uk | Registered: Jun 2006
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posted
I'm just glad to be of assistance. If you need further help after you fly in, please feel free to send me a private message through theses forums.
posted
I have a heap of questions about property as I am interested in buying an apartment in Cairo with a view to moving there in about 5 years time once I can get my pension (yippee day 46 months and 1 week and counting.... )
- eg. Is a foreigner allowed to buy property in Cairo? If I wanted to buy an apartment what kind of maximum lease might I be allowed? What kind of residency would I have to have? Are apartments leasehold or freehold, are there ground rents, service charges etc etc.
Does anyone know of a good website or other source of information with what the rules are?
Posts: 5593 | From: Egypt | Registered: Dec 2005
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As far as Cairo's concerned, foreign residents may own property freely. The general restriction is two properties in Egypt with a collective area of no more than 4,000 square meters.
You should expect to pay an annual property tax as well as any relevant fees that may relate to homeowners' associations and the likes.
Good luck with your retiremrent.
Posts: 88 | From: Khonfesharia | Registered: Jun 2004
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As far as Cairo's concerned, foreign residents may own property freely. The general restriction is two properties in Egypt with a collective area of no more than 4,000 square meters.
You should expect to pay an annual property tax as well as any relevant fees that may relate to homeowners' associations and the likes.
Good luck with your retiremrent.
Thanks - any idea what sort of sums of money these might be? Are we talking 100LE, 1000LE or 10000LE or more - I know it probably depends on property size so, eg a 2/3bed flat costing about 150000LE just for an example - maybe 6th October or somewhere like that?
Posts: 5593 | From: Egypt | Registered: Dec 2005
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posted
Hi Mac, the following is what I wrote "you're most welcome Ian. A small legal tip FYI; foreigners are not allowed to "own" property in Sinai but rather to have a "usufruct" for up to 99 years. People overlook this since very few people actually register their ownership over there. Good luck "
I didn't say whether it was a law or a decree. The law refers the Prime Minister to issue the proper regulations for foreigner's ownership in certain areas of Egypt, the 99 year limit comes in the form of an Executive Decree implementing the provisions of the law.
Furthermore, you're the one who's wrong when you say it's a 99 years "lease", as the decree specifies that it is a usufruct. One of the main differences between "lease" and "usufruct" is that under a lease the lessee may not sub-lease the property, while under usufruct, the benificiary may lease the property. Another difference is that usufruct can be inherited while leases cannot.
I hope this clarifies things a bit.
Posts: 88 | From: Khonfesharia | Registered: Jun 2004
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Without tiring you with legal jargon, ownership, under Egyptian law, is divided into two separate rights 1)Ownership of the benefit and 2) ownership of the "res". Generally, if a person owns a car or any other property the person's ownership relates to both of the forgoing elements. Sticking to the car example, a car's owner can use it himself, turn in into a taxi and gain monetary advantges, rent it to others. Moreover,he can chop it and sell it as spare parts or through it into a junkyard for all he cares.
Usufruct is strictly the first element of ownership without the second, it can be re-sold, inherited, endowed, etc.
As for the Sinai issue, Egyptian law was quite restrictive with respect to foreigner's ownership of real property, the restrictions eased bit by bit until the law finally allowed foreigner's ownership of real property and delegated the prime minister to set the rules and restrictions for foreginer's ownership in specific parts more specifically border regions. The prime minister's decree restricted foreigners' right to own property in Sinai and limited it to usufruct for up to 99 years.
Many countries that restrict foreigners' ownership of real property allow the usufruct example such as the United Arab Emirates.
Hope this is of assistance Posts: 88 | From: Khonfesharia | Registered: Jun 2004
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posted
ONCE AGAIN ITS A DECREE WHICH EVER WAY YOU WANT TO LOOK AT IT AND NOT LAW.ASLO I THINK THIS WHAT YOU TALK ABOUT IS SMALL TALK COMPEARED TO THE FACT THE LAW IN EGYPT WILL NOT ALLOW NEXT OF KIN STATUS TO FORIEGN OWNERS HOW MANY PEOPLE KNOW THAT WHO HAVE SIGNED CONTRACTS
Posts: 1344 | From: uk/ | Registered: Mar 2006
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posted
AND FOR PEOLPE WHO ARE BUYING DO YOUR HOME WORK ALL THAT SHINES IS NOT GOLD, IF IT SOUNDS GOOD IT IS,NT. TOO MANY PEOPLE ALL TO READY TO CONFUSE THINGS AND TRY TO MAKE OF OTHERS.
MIROX I LIVE IN THE U.A.E FOR MANY YEARS AND HAD SEVERAL PROPERTIES AND ITS NOT LIKE SOUTH SINA AT ALL
Posts: 1344 | From: uk/ | Registered: Mar 2006
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For the benefit of foreign property owners in the Sinai can you explain exactly what happens to the property when the 99 year term is up. Are there any provisions within the regulations to prevent me selling my property to a family member and then restarting the 99 year clock.
You also say that the usufruct can be inherited, there seems to be some confusion as to who can inherit this under Egyptian law. Can a foreign next of kin inherit and do you need to register a Will in Egypt stating who should inherit your Egyptian assets, or would the bequests in a foreign Will be recognised under Egyptian law.
Posts: 3809 | From: Paradise | Registered: Mar 2003
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To simplify this, let's start with an example. An Egyptian owner decides to "sell" a Sinai property to a foreigner, he can only sell the "use" of the property as earlier mentioned. Under Egyptian law usufruct cannot be perpetual and shall have to be timed either by the lifetime of the benificiary or for an agreed upon term. Thus, the foreigner buys the "use" of the property for a period not exceeding 99 years and even if the sale of use was for the lifetime of the benificiary it shall be limited to 99 years (in case the benificiary lives for 120 years after recieving the usufruct).
Now the root usufruct deed is timed, let's say for 30 years, the benificiary uses it for 10 years and then decides to dispose of it, such disposal will only be valid for the remaining 20 years any disposal for a period exceeding the remaining period shall be void and unenforceable vis-a-vis the original seller. In other words, the clock cannot be rest. Apart from that, nothing prevents the benificiary from disposing of the usufruct as long as there is no agreement or law that provides otherwise.
I'm afraid I am not the best person to advise on the Egyptian law's restrictions on foreigners' inheritence as it contains so many provisions that requires a specialist in family and personal status law. However, from what I have seen the Egyptian courts enforce the inheritance judgments or wills made outside Egypt but under the conditions of reciprocity and that such wills and judgments do not contradict public morals and order.
Posts: 88 | From: Khonfesharia | Registered: Jun 2004
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posted
Thank you mirox for your explanation. You know I don't think any of the contracts being signed make any of this clear. At least my property will survive for the full 99 years as it is owned by a UK registered company so when I die it is a UK matter who I leave the shares to. I guess I just then need to find an Egyptian to sell onto or if I am feeling very chartitable an Egyptian to bequeath it too! Posts: 3809 | From: Paradise | Registered: Mar 2003
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posted
penny i think we went round this one before. ur company must be in south sina/egypt as they will not recognised your company in law . and at the time of buying in the courts and the return of the blue paper who does it says who owns it you or the company.the simple thing is to have the company in egypt and own what you want and buy what you want.but like anything else its all in the contract and how strong it is. a lot of developers like the word lease as it is these who will use this to build on top of people in the future if they ever get it passed in law to go for the 3nd and forth floor.
like i said remove the word lease and enforce some of your own words in the contract. then once in the court and stamped and the blue paper returned and enforced.you have something to wave if ever the builder comes back
Posts: 1344 | From: uk/ | Registered: Mar 2006
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posted
penny i think we went round this one before. ur company must be in south sina/egypt as they will not recognised your company in law . and at the time of buying in the courts and the return of the blue paper who does it says who owns it you or the company.the simple thing is to have the company in egypt and own what you want and buy what you want.but like anything else its all in the contract and how strong it is. a lot of developers like the word lease as it is these who will use this to build on top of people in the future if they ever get it passed in law to go for the 3nd and forth floor.
like i said remove the word lease and enforce some of your own words in the contract. then once in the court and stamped and the blue paper returned and enforced.you have something to wave if ever the builder comes back
Posts: 1344 | From: uk/ | Registered: Mar 2006
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posted
i am glad my original question isnt as stupid as what i perceived it to be,seems like theres much that can be debated regarding property laws and that one question can have many answers.
Posts: 117 | From: manchester uk | Registered: Jun 2006
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