posted
Okay this thread in a way touches base on Djehuti's comment on some North Africans having Bushmen looks.
First off I hope I do not sound like a late noob, but I noticed something.
But I noticed people in this type of climate...The Arid climate.
Are usually lighter skinned and have an 'East Asian look' in appearances. Lol...Again I am not trying to come off as a complete noob. But here are some groups that do live in that climate.
Taureg(I know Taureg people are slightly mixed, but still):
Khoisan:
^^^Some people will say it is due to them being mixed...Maybe for the Tuareg people, but most certainly not the Khoisan people.
So is living in the Arid climate responsible for the light skin and 'East Asian look' or should I say 'Khoisan look'?
I am interested in discussing this.
Posts: 1135 | From: Top secret | Registered: Jun 2012
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posted
Sigh!! First off...noob??2ndly what makes you think the Tauregs are admixed.
-------------------- Without data you are just another person with an opinion - Deming Posts: 12143 | From: When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable | Registered: Jun 2007
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So is living in the Arid climate responsible for the light skin and 'East Asian look' or should I say 'Khoisan look'?
I am interested in discussing this. [/QB]
the theory is not relating arid climate to lighter skin. The theory is relating to a location's distance to the equator, the closer to the equator the darker due to higher UV sunlight.
You see a general pattern of this with some exceptions.
You see in old pictures Amican Indians of the North with quite dark skin. It is belived that they have not been in the Northern regions long enough for the skin lightening mutation to occur. Luzia Woman, of, Brazil is one of the oldest human remains found in the Americas, dated to only 11,500 year ago
Posts: 42939 | From: , | Registered: Jan 2010
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quote:Originally posted by xyyman: Sigh!! First off...noob??2ndly what makes you think the Tauregs are admixed.
I didn't say they were extremely admixed. But don't they have some Eurasian dna in them? Especially in their mtdna. I am willingly to be corrected.
quote:Originally posted by the lioness,:
quote:Originally posted by Son of Ra:
So is living in the Arid climate responsible for the light skin and 'East Asian look' or should I say 'Khoisan look'?
I am interested in discussing this.
the theory is not relating arid climate to lighter skin. The theory is relating to a location's distance to the equator, the closer to the equator the darker due to higher UV sunlight.
You see a general pattern of this with some exceptions.
You see in old pictures Amican Indians of the North with quite dark skin. It is belived that they have not been in the Northern regions long enough for the skin lightening mutation to occur. Luzia Woman, of, Brazil is one of the oldest human remains found in the Americas, dated to only 11,500 year ago [/QB]
I see.
Posts: 1135 | From: Top secret | Registered: Jun 2012
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posted
^ The ancestry of Saharan nomads was discussed too many times and depending on the kel (clan) and tribe, yes some Tuareg are mixed and as Dana pointed out even took part in the trade of white slaves from Europe.
quote:Originally posted by Son of Ra: Okay this thread in a way touches base on Djehuti's comment on some North Africans having Bushmen looks.
First off I hope I do not sound like a late noob, but I noticed something.
But I noticed people in this type of climate...The Arid climate.
Are usually lighter skinned and have an 'East Asian look' in appearances. Lol...Again I am not trying to come off as a complete noob. But here are some groups that do live in that climate.
Taureg(I know Taureg people are slightly mixed, but still):
Khoisan:
^^^Some people will say it is due to them being mixed...Maybe for the Tuareg people, but most certainly not the Khoisan people.
So is living in the Arid climate responsible for the light skin and 'East Asian look' or should I say 'Khoisan look'?
I am interested in discussing this.
Skin color has nothing to do with aridity but with the exposure to UV rays from the sun. The Khoisan are light-skinned because they are adapted to a subtropical area that receives less sunlight than the greater part of Africa that lies in the tropics. Unsurprisingly, Khoisan skin tends to wrinkle much easier than the skin of other (darker) Africans.
^ The above highlighted area is the tropical latitudinal zone with the very central latitude at 0 degrees being the equator (not shown). The northern border of the tropics is called the Tropic of Cancer while the southern border is the Tropic of Capricorn.
The Khoisan's light complexion is probably due to them living in subtropical area for over 60,000 years (at least). One may imagine that IF there are populations isolated in the subtropics of North Africa for as long period of time they too would have similar complexions. The problem is the indigenous people of North Africa don't have genetic lineages that reach as far back in time even though the fossil evidence in the area is just as prehistoric.
Posts: 26286 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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posted
A more probable theory is that the yellowish-brown hue of the Sanids is linked to the desert, so they could blend into the background for survival.
Posts: 873 | From: USA | Registered: Sep 2012
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posted
I told those pics of Cass..is not him. a young man going to college can not be that ignorant and dumb. The following statement is a classic case of someone who grew up in the 60's, 50's or earlier.
That is like saying Aframs are fast because they trained by running from lions. LOL!
quote:Originally posted by Faheemdunkers: A more probable theory is that the yellowish-brown hue of the Sanids is linked to the desert, so they could blend into the background for survival.
Posts: 12143 | From: When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable | Registered: Jun 2007
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quote:Originally posted by Djehuti: The problem is the indigenous people of North Africa don't have genetic lineages that reach as far back in time even though the fossil evidence in the area is just as prehistoric. [/QB]
They don't have to have lineages that go back as far as the Khoisans for thier skin to have lightened.
Anatomically modern humans are known to have been present in North Africa during the Upper Paleolithic at least 45,000 years ago as attested by the Aterian culture of the Atlas region.
Likewise the earliest humans in Europe about 45,000 years ago
However some Items of personal adornment (pierced and ochred Nassarius shell beads) are known from at least one Aterian site, with an age of 82,000 years pushing back the human lineage much further.
Posts: 42939 | From: , | Registered: Jan 2010
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posted
^ But genetic lineage is an important indication of long a population has been living in the area. For a population's skin color to adapt to an area in this case an African one becoming lighter in response to lower UV takes a very long period of time. Many estimate over 60,000 years at least. We know the Khoisan peoples today have both physical remains and SNP markers dating that far back. North Africa may have physical remains dating far but their SNP markers largely date to the mesolithic in paternal lines and maternally only about 30,000 years give or take even if fossil evidence for human habitation is much longer. Plus this is reflected in many indigenous (unmixed) North Africans who are still quite dark and not as typically light as Khoisan.
quote:Originally posted by Fartheadbonkers: A more probable theory is that the yellowish-brown hue of the Sanids is linked to the desert, so they could blend into the background for survival.
The problem with that theory is that not only do the San range far beyond the limits of the Kalahari and Namib deserts, but that these said deserts did not always exist. In fact prior to the Holocene much of southern Africa was fertile savanna and wetland. Desert regions are far older in and around the Sahara i.e. the Sahel yet the populations there are all very dark (black). So your whole desert camouflage is null.
Posts: 26286 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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quote:Originally posted by Djehuti: [QB] ^ But genetic lineage is an important indication of long a population has been living in the area. For a population's skin color to adapt to an area in this case an African one becoming lighter in response to lower UV takes a very long period of time. Many estimate over 60,000 years at least. We know the Khoisan peoples today have both physical remains and SNP markers dating that far back. North Africa may have physical remains dating far but their SNP markers largely date to the mesolithic in paternal lines and maternally only about 30,000 years give or take even if fossil evidence for human habitation is much longer. Plus this is reflected in many indigenous (unmixed) North Africans who are still quite dark and not as typically light as Khoisan.
The fact is North Africans are 45k-82k old
The other fact Euroepans are 45k old
^^^^ there's a time frame for light skin 45k or less,
probably a lot less
The American Association of Physical Anthropologists in 2007 reported research gene for skin color suggested that Europeans acquired pale skin quite recently, perhaps only 6000 to 12,000 years ago.This contradicts a long-standing hypothesis that modern humans in Europe grew paler about 40,000 years ago, as soon as they migrated into northern latitudes.
Still under 45K, very under
NAs 45Kya + beads found 82K
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posted
And Scandinavans are perfectly blended for the snow fields of Europe. The mountain Lions could not see them to eat them....But... since they are slow...the Lions probably caught up with them.....sic. My bad maybe the dark head Scandanavians were slower and they were eaten out leaving only the blondes.
quote:Originally posted by xyyman: I told those pics of Cass..is not him. a young man going to college can not be that ignorant and dumb. The following statement is a classic case of someone who grew up in the 60's, 50's or earlier.
That is like saying Aframs are fast because they trained by running from lions. LOL!
quote:Originally posted by Faheemdunkers: A more probable theory is that the yellowish-brown hue of the Sanids is linked to the desert, so they could blend into the background for survival.
Posts: 12143 | From: When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable | Registered: Jun 2007
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posted
^ LOL Indeed that is the ignorant thinking of Anglo-idiot.
quote:Originally posted by xyyman: I hate to stand idle and listen or read ignorance run its course without stepping in. ... So.
Americans in the new world..what?....<10kyo.
Is the map above based on actual indigenous people or the presumed color expected for people to adapt to UV concentrations?
quote:Originally posted by the lyinass,: The fact is North Africans are 45k-82k old
And are you basing this on archaeological evidence or the genetics of living populations??
As I explained they are two different things. One is indicative of dead populations the other living.
quote:The other fact Euroepans are 45k old
^^^^ there's a time frame for light skin 45k or less,
probably a lot less
The American Association of Physical Anthropologists in 2007 reported research gene for skin color suggested that Europeans acquired **pale** skin quite recently, perhaps only 6000 to 12,000 years ago.This contradicts a long-standing hypothesis that modern humans in Europe grew paler about 40,000 years ago, as soon as they migrated into northern latitudes.
Still under 45K, very under
NAs 45Kya + beads found 82K
LOL Pale skin is not the same thing as light-skin or at least Khoisan light. Europeans did not go from black to pale all of a sudden. The process was a gradual one. The very study talks about Europeans acquiring pale skin. Experts like Jablonksi agree that European ancestors had to have been relatively light already before they became pale.
Posts: 26286 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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posted
To those who may miss it. Asians have the lighest skin. Europeans don't even have a monopoly on white skin. Lol! Right Cass.
-------------------- Without data you are just another person with an opinion - Deming Posts: 12143 | From: When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable | Registered: Jun 2007
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posted
And DJ stop spitting out that Jablonski nonsense. Read Norton and Kittles. They have a handle on skin pigmentation.
Science is a bitch. It always prove bigots wrong.
Posts: 12143 | From: When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable | Registered: Jun 2007
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quote:Originally posted by -Just Call Me Jari-: [QB] Many of the Arab Tauregs are Arab invaders not the original Taureg. Every scrap of historical reference has the Tauregs as black people.
put up two scraps
also location prior to camel
Posts: 42939 | From: , | Registered: Jan 2010
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posted
I am not sure what those pics suppose to represent.
But!! The cited chart was created by someone who traveled and conducted research. Not a picture spammers...ahem!....
That said. For those who cannot travel ...or leave the confines of suburbia or the inner city...or Trailer Trashtown. The chart clearly shows the indigenous people of Africa, Arabia, India and Koreas of similar complexion.
On the flip side...North Asians are lighter than Europeans...isn't that a bitch.
Posts: 12143 | From: When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable | Registered: Jun 2007
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quote:Originally posted by zarahan- aka Enrique Cardova: [QUOTE]Originally posted by Son of Ra: [qb] Okay this thread in a way touches base on Djehuti's comment on some North Africans having Bushmen looks.
First off I hope I do not sound like a late noob, but I noticed something.
But I noticed people in this type of climate...The Arid climate.
Are usually lighter skinned and have an 'East Asian look' in appearances.
Your claim is off. The arid zone on your map runs thru part of southern Egypt and incorporates huge parts of the Sahara, Sudan and the Horn of Africa and these places have very dark people without an "East Asian" looks, or necessarily any "race mix." Tropical Africans are the most diverse peoples phenotypically. RECAP:
quote:Originally posted by xyyman: Black Italians
^^XYZ- where are these maps from? Citation?
Posts: 5905 | From: The Hammer | Registered: Aug 2008
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quote:Originally posted by xyyman: I am not sure what those pics suppose to represent.
But!! The cited chart was created by someone who traveled and conducted research. Not a picture spammers...ahem!....
That said. For those who cannot travel ...or leave the confines of suburbia or the inner city...or Trailer Trashtown. The chart clearly shows the indigenous people of Africa, Arabia, India and Koreas of similar complexion.
On the flip side...North Asians are lighter than Europeans...isn't that a bitch.
The distribution of skin colour variations of indigenous populations before colonization by Europeans. The map, compiled by the author of this article, Audrey Smedley, is a reconstruction of populations based on a number of sources. In some cases, areal characteristics have been estimated from descriptions (or drawings) of first contact by the earliest Europeans. In other cases, where there was little European contact or where there is scant information about native populations (as there is, for example, about the populations of inner Asia), skin colour was estimated from surrounding populations and geographic and climatological information. On a map of this scale, it is difficult to give more than a representation of current understanding. It must also be noted that many populations, even before the modern era, were quite heterogeneous for skin colour, and this heterogeneity is difficult to depict accurately on any scale. In areas of the world where the indigenous population was sparse and widely scattered (such as Australia), the map’s colour density can be misleading. Another such problem is represented by the Tasmanians, who are virtually extinct, and the Maori, who have been widely mixed with Europeans, so only a few examples of “unmixed” individuals have been found in the historical records.
Credit: Encyclopædia Britannica, Inc.
Posts: 42939 | From: , | Registered: Jan 2010
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posted
^ LOL Yet despite what your source says, you have this awful penchant for posting pictures of light-skinned, mixed, people as representative of indigenous Africans especially North Africans.
quote:Originally posted by xyyman: Black Italians
The above map talks about eye color. I don't know what that has to do with 'black Italians'.
Posts: 26286 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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quote:Originally posted by Djehuti: [QB] ^ LOL Yet despite what your source says, you have this awful penchant for posting pictures of light-skinned, mixed, people as representative of indigenous Africans especially North Africans.
^^^^ Old school "True Black proponent" he insists these people are not black they are "mixed" roll eyes
But xyyman's point was North East Asians are the whitest "white people" follwed by Europeans perhaps
Posts: 42939 | From: , | Registered: Jan 2010
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As I said...you do surpise me sometimes. Pity you are not a whee more brainy...we could have had some intellectually stimulating discussion.
Now all we need is some pics with really really really white Asians. Mike posted some before.
-------------------- Without data you are just another person with an opinion - Deming Posts: 12143 | From: When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable | Registered: Jun 2007
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quote:Originally posted by the lyinass,: ^^^^ Old school "True Black proponent" he insists these people are not black they are "mixed" roll eyes
Who said anything about "true blacks". You cited a source that talks about how the skin color of modern populations even indigenous ones may have been affected by admixture from non-indigenous peoples. And you prove that very point by posting pics of light-skinned Africans like the fair-skinned Nigerian actress. We know that you're all about white-washing Africans. Posts: 26286 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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Maybe your brain has been affected by the number of times Ive beaten you down on this subject causing you long term damage in your memory..but Im not going to do your dirty work..Hope this will help jog your affected memory...
also location prior to camel [/QUOTE]
Posts: 8805 | From: The fear of his majesty had entered their hearts, they were powerless | Registered: Nov 2007
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