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Author Topic: Roman Meroe? ... please
alTakruri
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quote:
Originally posted by Dead:
... 300 BC - AD 300. The Romans had sacked Meroe and settled there.

Oh do please elucidate.
This is EGYPTOLOGY forum.
Primary documentation preferred
but secondary docmentaton will do.


Afaik, Augustus gave it up
after diplomatic talks
and Nero didn't even bother
considering it impoverished.

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Tukuler
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From Myra's old site (any underscores are mine)

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Amun-Ra The Ultimate
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Very interesting post Tukuler


quote:

and Nero didn't even bother
considering it impoverished.

Sources?
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Tukuler
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Myra Wysinger is former ES member from
a veteran class of some year or other.


See UNESCO's History of Africa vol 2. p.292
where Hintze's Studien zur Meroitischen

I've seen it in other places but w/o
any indication where they got it from.

You can always do a nero meroe keyword
search via your favorite search engine.

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the lioness,
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homestead is down
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the lioness,
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quote:
Originally posted by Tukuler:
From Myra's old site (any underscores are mine)
  • THE ROMAN CONQUEST OF EGYPT AND THE REVOLT OF A MEROITIC CANDAKE

    Nubia never became part of the Roman empire – although the Romans tried to make it part.



    Source:
    The Candaces of Meroe (332 BC- 12 AD)

    Nubian Queens in the Nile Valley and Afro-Asiatic Cultural History, Carolyn Fluehr-Lobban, Professor of Anthropology, Ninth International Conference for Nubian Studies, Museum of Fine Arts, Boston U.S.A, August 20-26, 1998

I can't read the whole document but it may be a section of


http://www.scribd.com/doc/69840972/Candace-of-Meroe#scribd

Candace of Meroe
by Sisay Seifu
Lecturer at AAU-EiABC
EthiopiaNonprofit Organization Management
Current
AAU-EiABC
Previous
NGO
Education: Doctor of Philosophy (PhD), Environmental Planning
2010 – 2015 Addis Ababa University, Ethiopia

________________________

The other item

Nubian Queens in the Nile Valley and Afro-Asiatic Cultural

https://www.yumpu.com/en/document/view/3732509/nubian-queens-in-the-nile-valley-and-afro-asiatic-cultural-history

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zarahan aka Enrique Cardova
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Good job Tukler. LEt's add some more. Rome did have
some success against the meroites, but also saw some setbacks.
In the end, as your info shows, they preferred to cut a deal
for peace directly with the Meriorites, even waiving
tribute, ceding territory and all with the personal
imprimatur of Roman emperor Augustus himself. And as one book
put in- the Mereoites did not merely show up as beaten
supplicants is suggested by the aggressive message
from thir ruler, Candace, conveyed by the envoys of
Meroe to Rome. A bundle of golden arrows was
presented with the envoys reputedly saying:

"The Candace sends you these arrows. If you
want peace, they are a token of her friendship
and warmth. If you want war, you are going to
need them."


FROM: Selina O'Grady, 2012, And Man Created God:
A History of the World at the time of Jesus, pp.
79-88. See also Strabo, Geographia, Book XVII,
Chaps 1 -3. Translated from Greek by W. Falconer
(1903)

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Askia_The_Great
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Good posts Tukuler. I NEVER heard any sources stating the Romans settled in Meroe or conquered it.
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Brada-Anansi
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 -
Not only that but one of the earlier Kandakes sacked Roman occupied Nowe aka Thebes,plundered it enslaved who they laid their hands on and marched or sailed them back to their territory along with the decapitated head of a statue of one Augustus Caesar, burying it at the entrance of their temple so he maybe trampled on for all times.

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Tukuler
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Tnx y'all!

Ok yeah I shoulda posted
that Roman POW slave so
to make up for it
  •  -  -

    Courtesy of British Museum Press

    Once forming part of a statue of Rome’s revered first true emperor, the head was violently separated from the body and carried away in triumph by ancient tribesmen shortly after its creation. For nearly two millennia it remained buried in front of a temple in their capital city of Meroe. The head, recovered in 1910 and remarkably well preserved, is one of the British Museum’s most treasured objects.

    This concise and attractively illustrated book tells the story of this striking work of art and its intriguing historical context, revealing the significance of the head in the light of Augustus’ rise to power and the role of portraits in the Roman world.

  • British Museum Curator's comments

    This head once formed part of a statue of the Roman Emperor Augustus (ruled 27 BC-AD 14).
    In 31 BC Augustus defeated Mark Antony and Cleopatra at the battle of Actium and took possession of Egypt, which became a Roman province. The writer Strabo tells us that statues of Augustus were erected in Egyptian towns near the first cataract of the Nile at Aswan and that an invading Kushite army looted many of them when they raided Roman forts and settlements in Upper Egypt in 25 BC. Most were later returned as a result of negotiations between the Meroitic Queen Candace and the Roman general Petronius.

    However, this head remained buried beneath the steps of a native temple dedicated to Victory at the Kushite capital Meroë. It seems likely that it was torn from a statue and placed there deliberately so as to be permanently below the feet of its Meroitic captors. Remains of frescoes from within the temple, which appear to show Roman prisonors of war before a Meroitic ruler, support this interpretation.

    The head of Augustus appears larger than life, with perfect proportions based upon Classical Greek notions of ideal human form. His calm distant gaze, emphasised with inset eyes of glass and stone, give him an air of quiet, assured strength.

    Coins and statues were the main media for propagating the image of the Roman emperor. This portrait head, like many others throughout the Empire, was made as a continuous reminder of the all-embracing power of Rome and its emperor. Yet its fate is a graphic illustration of resistance to the imposition of Roman rule in Egypt from strongly independent tribes beyond the southern frontier.

Courtesy of British Museum

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Clyde Winters
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You can find out more about the Roman-Meroite War in my book:


The Kushite Prince Akinidad: And the Roman-Kushite War

 -


In this book we review the life and history of Prince Akinidad. It uses Meroitic textual material to explain the position of Akinidad in Meroitic politics and interaction between the Meroitic State and the Roman rulers of Egypt. The textual material makes it clear that Akinidad never became King because he was killed by the Romans in battle.


CreateSpace eStore: https://www.createspace.com/4237036

--------------------
C. A. Winters

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Tukuler
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Originally posted October 08, 2010 by Clyde Winters:

  • Saturday, January 14, 2006

    Candace Amanirenas

     -


    Candace Amanirenas

    From the Notes of Clyde A. Winters, Ph.D. (web site)

    Meroitic-Kush never became part of the Roman empire – although the Romans tried to make it part. In 24 B.C., the Romans were planning a campaign against both Meroitic-Kush (Meroë) and Arabia.


    Augustus (31 BC-14 AD), when he defeated Mark Antony and Cleopatra, got control of Egypt. He made it a Roman province, governed by an equestrian prefect under his own control. Kush – just to Egypt’s south – was outside the empire.


    In 24 B.C. Roman forces were sent to fight in Arabia. According to Pliny and Strabo the Meroite-Kushites sacked Aswan and destroyed the Roman statues at Philae (Török, 1998; Welsby, 1996).


    In response to the Kushite expedition, Gaius Petronius with a force of 10,000 infantry and 800 horses pushed the Kushites back to Pselchis. Strabo (17.1.53) mentions the fact that the Meroites were led by a Candace and her son Akinidad.


    The Romans and Kushites, according to Strabo began peace negotiations at Dakka in 24 B.C.. The negotiations failed, and the Romans pushed their forces deeper into Meroitic-Kushite territory as far as Sara. They also established forts at Qasr Ibrim (Török, 1998; Welsby, 1996).


    Akinidad was probably killed in 24 B.C. Strabo (17.1.54) mentions that the Candace's son was killed during this campaign. This son of the Candance was probably Akinidad.


    We know that Akinidad was in Dakka on two occasions, once with Teriteqas, and later only with Amanirenas. In Dakka 2, we discover that Akinidad died at Dakka. This is most interesting because, the Romans pushed the Meroites back to Dakka in 24 B.C.


    If Akinidad had been wounded outside Dakka, Amanirenas may have stopped in the town to obtain medical treatment for her son. After Akinidad died in the town, Amanirenas may have withdrawn from peace talks and continued the War.


    If these events occurned , Amanirenas probably had the Qasr Ibrim 1420 stela erected in Qasr Ibrim, to honor Akinidad who had served as the Chief of the city during the Meroitic-Roman War. The Qasr Ibrim 1420 stela was probably defaced and broken during the Roman occupation of Qasr Ibrim to show their contempt for the Meroites.


    The Meroites resisted Roman occupation. By 22 B.C., the Meroites retook Qasr Ibrim from the Romans. In 21 B.C., a peace treaty was concluded between Augustus, and Meroite envoys on the Island of Samos.


    The textual evidence makes it clear that Akinidad remained a paqar (prince) until his death at Dakka in 24 B.C.


    The evidence of the Dakka 2 inscription and Hamadab 2 indicate that Akinidad probably died during Amanirenas rule of Merotic-Kush. After Teriteqas was killed during the Meroitic-Roman War, Akinidad may have become recognized as King, but without official

    succession, and his untimely death at Dakka, he remained until his death officially Crown Prince. This would explain our inability to find any evidence of Akinidad being recognized as anything more than a paqar, rather than a qore (king).


    Two large stela bearing the name Akinidad from the Hamdab temple, is the funerary stela of Kharapkhael, the older brother of Akinidad. In this stela Akinidad described as a paqar (prince). This suggest that Kharapkhael was the original crown prince, not Akinidad of King Teriteqas and Queen Amanirenas.


    It has usually been considered that Amanirenas was Greek geographer Strabo's "Candace".


    During battle, the Candace lost an eye; but this only made her more courageous. "One Eyed Candace," as then Roman governor Gaius Petronius referred to her.


    The Meroitic-Kush kingdom would last as long as the western Roman empire did – until the fifth century, when a new kingdom

    http://mynubian.blogspot.com/2006/01/candace-amanirenas.html

    .

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Tukuler
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quote:
Originally posted by Amun-Ra The Ultimate:
Very interesting post Tukuler


quote:

and Nero didn't even bother
considering it impoverished.

Sources?
.

First, the not worth conquest due
to poverty bit seems no more than
the Eurocentricism of the author I
was using. The actual report only
says there were few buildings or
they were showing signs of warfare.

Now

After going through old standbys
Snowden's Blacks in Antiquity has
the best coverage.

 -

 -

 -


 -

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Ledama Kenya
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Question is who were the blemmyes,and who were the people of meroe?descendants of ancient egyptians?..
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kdolo
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1. Too impoverished ????

Whatever typical euro nonsense

2. If the frescoe that is "lost" shows Romans captured and enslaved, perhaps what really happened is that the Romans were defeated. The embassy was sent to negotiate the peace treaty.

3. The head of Augustus: is it real ?

===== Ardo edit ======
this forum is reserved for critiquing normal mainstream academia and new paradigms mustering standard sources for independent conclusions
======================

any other verified images of Augustus ??

good thread.

[ 25. March 2015, 04:08 PM: Message edited by: ausar ]

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the lioness,
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kdolo

===== Ardo edit =====
sorry but this was a reply you knew better than to post here on E
=====================

why are you worried about the economy of the Blemmyes?
All Blacks cant have been rich.
The Blemmyes wern't "impoverished", they lived a humble lifestyle while the Black Romans were flamboyant and over-blinged

quote:

Originally posted by kdolo:


3. The head of Augustus: is it real ?

Of course it is, look at the skin tone

[ 25. March 2015, 04:10 PM: Message edited by: ausar ]

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Firewall
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Anybody seen this?
They leave out the part when kush had victories against roman armies too.
They make it seem kush lost the war the first time they clash and they did not.
Maybe some one should add the info.

Nubia
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nubia

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