Afar man having a traditional hairstyle with a stick to make curly hair, Afar region, Afambo, Ethiopia
Posts: 42938 | From: , | Registered: Jan 2010
| IP: Logged |
-------------------- It's not my burden to disabuse the ignorant of their wrong opinions Posts: 2707 | From: New York | Registered: Jun 2015
| IP: Logged |
posted
Yes I had used this picture because it is the same hair do as the numidian calvary
-------------------- It's not my burden to disabuse the ignorant of their wrong opinions Posts: 2707 | From: New York | Registered: Jun 2015
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by Yatunde Lisa: Yes I had used this picture because it is the same hair do as the numidian calvary
It's not the same hair as the numidian cavalry but the same technique.
Numidians didn't have kinky hair like Afar :
Roman bronze cavalry mask showing the portrait of a Numidian Prince. Late 1st-Early 2nd century AD
Bust of Massinissa, king of Numidia, preserved in the Hall of the Philosophers at the Capitoline Museum, Rome - Date of Photo 1890 ca. - Date of Artwork II sec. a.C. - Location Rome -
Hellenistic art, bronze head of a noble north african from the temple of Apollo in Cyrene, Libya , 300 B.C., British Museum :
This bust apparently might have been the numidian prince Mastanabal according to this paper :
quote:Its North African features indicate that it is a portrait of an indigenous ruler, and thus attribution must be based on the likelihood of such a person being honoured in Kyrene. It is herein suggested that it is a portrait of the Numidian prince Mastanabal, son of Massinissa, and that it dates to the time that Massinissa was a close associate of the king of Kyrene, the future Ptolemaios VIII of Egypt, or 163–148 BC. Mastanabal was a noted athlete and thus the piece may be a commemoration of one of his victories. Its commissioning would fit into his father's vigorous hellenization policy. Although the style remains difficult of analysis, certain features, especially the beard under the chin, support a second-century BC date."
posted
can you add URL for Roman bronze cavalry mask showing the portrait of a Numidian Prince in your post thanks
Posts: 42938 | From: , | Registered: Jan 2010
| IP: Logged |
I wonder if there is an ancestral relation between this Libyan and the Numidians
Also Assuming the hair on the Numidians was created by this stick technique and the Afar all the way over in Ethiopia are also using it did one group teach it to the other ? or they might also have some common ancestry as we see the ancestor of the common E-M81 so called "berber marker" haplogroup of the Maghreb is thought to be descendant of E-M215 which is believed to originate in the horn
Posts: 42938 | From: , | Registered: Jan 2010
| IP: Logged |
This could be that stick method but it also looks less orderly and a little similar to dred locked hair or could be some version of that stick made curl
Posts: 42938 | From: , | Registered: Jan 2010
| IP: Logged |
I wonder if there is an ancestral relation between this Libyan and the Numidians
Eastern libyans in general didn't have the same hairstyle
quote:Originally posted by the lioness,: Also Assuming the hair on the Numidians was created by this stick technique and the Afar all the way over in Ethiopia are also using it did one group teach it to the other ? or they might also have some common ancestry as we see the ancestor of the common E-M81 so called "berber marker" haplogroup of the Maghreb is thought to be descendant of E-M215 which is believed to originate in the horn [/QB]
Why should it be teached ? That's a simple technique that could have been used by different people at different times moreover not all moors/numidians had that hairstyle.
Posts: 1779 | From: Somewhere In the Rif Mountains | Registered: Nov 2021
| IP: Logged |
that goes back to at least the early neolithic not the time of the numidians
Posts: 1779 | From: Somewhere In the Rif Mountains | Registered: Nov 2021
| IP: Logged |
posted
A couple of more ancient Libyans with interesting hairstyles
Tile with Libyan prisoner from the time of Ramses III. Excavated at Lower Egypt: Nile Delta: Tell el-Yahudiya. Housed in British Museum.
quote: Polychrome glazed composition tile: this expressive tile is of a captive Libyan chief. Portrayed with uplifted face and one arm bound by a rope, he wears ornamented chest-straps and a loin-cloth, the simple costume of an overlord of the ancient Libyan, or Tjehenu, tribe. His tattoos and pierced ear reflect current Libyan fashion.
Tile with another Libyan prisoner from the time of Ramses III, also from Lower Egypt: Nile Delta: Tell el-Yahudiya. Housed in British Museum
quote: Part of a polychrome glazed composition tile bearing a relief representation of the head and upper body of a Libyan prisoner with a pointed beard, side-lock and bound hands (one lost).
posted
please stick to the hair type we are talking about, long hanging curls, or hanging curls in rows
Posts: 42938 | From: , | Registered: Jan 2010
| IP: Logged |
posted
I think the Tjehenu you posted were not too unlike one of the tiles I posted, just that the hair, or locks were more sparse, and combed or oriented in a different manner. Sometimes it is hard to know exactly how thick or thin locks were since ancient pictures can be a bit stylized.
At least they seem to belong to the same people.
But maybe the hairstyles of ancient Libyans merit a separate thread.
Four Libyans from the tomb of Seti I. Interesting hairstyles.
Old copy by Minutoli (1820) from Hornung, The Tomb of Pharaoh Seti I
-------------------- Once an archaeologist, always an archaeologist Posts: 2689 | From: Sweden | Registered: Mar 2020
| IP: Logged |
Tukuler
multidisciplinary Black Scholar
Member # 19944
posted
quote:Originally posted by the lioness,:
I wonder if there is an ancestral relation between this Libyan and the Numidians
Also Assuming the hair on the Numidians was created by this stick technique and the Afar all the way over in Ethiopia are also using it did one group teach it to the other ? or they might also have some common ancestry as we see the ancestor of the common E-M81 so called "berber marker" haplogroup of the Maghreb is thought to be descendant of E-M215 which is believed to originate in the horn
.
Labels by yours truly, YYT al~Takruri. Cred where due. Couldja reformat my label the same way you reformatted all four Nehhesu labels years ago?
=-=-=-=-=
Lisa correctly mentioned the hair-do (not hair texture) similarity.
If the various Tjemehu of AE notice spoke taMazight and the particular Numidians under review spoke taMazight there's a good possibility they have bio-linear continuity.
As previously noted on ES Bates' Eastern Libyans is the prime goto. Yet and still, as you know, it's hard to show continuity as in identity for todays', earliest Islamic centuries', Greco-Latin literature's, and ancient Egypt's northernmost Africans.
That part of Africa's 25,000 years of indigenee continuity is maternal only. It seems their males were of different haplogroups over time. The recent male indigenee mates of the old old U6 females is where taMazight language, identity, and associated nrY originate. My studies conclude the language originated somewhere between Lower Nubia and Darfur, iirc.
Tjemehu is generic for 'Libyan'. The illo has an ethic specific Libyan type Tjehenu who are possibly the first Eastern Libyans AE documented in art. They lived in the north. Before Tjemehu became generic they were also a specific Libyan ethnic grouping living west of Nehesu Lower Nubian lands.
This is true to that map that shows Gafsian Neolithic Tradition peoples covering west of Nile territory clear south to 22°N.
quote:Originally posted by Yatunde Lisa: Yes I had used this picture because it is the same hair do as the numidian calvary
It's not the same hair as the numidian cavalry but the same technique.
Numidians didn't have kinky hair like Afar :
Roman bronze cavalry mask showing the portrait of a Numidian Prince. Late 1st-Early 2nd century AD
Interesting, Cushitic/Ethio Semitic speakers dervive most of their ancestry from Egypt/Sudan where the Afar type hairstyle was done, animal fat was also used by Egyptians and Nubians just as the Afar and some other Horners do, this is likely where the practise ultimately derives from, I wonder if Proto Berber migrations from the Nile Valley spread this style among North West Africans.
Posts: 161 | From: England | Registered: May 2020
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by SlimJim: Interesting, Cushitic/Ethio Semitic speakers dervive most of their ancestry from Egypt/Sudan where the Afar type hairstyle was done, animal fat was also used by Egyptians and Nubians just as the Afar and some other Horners do, this is likely where the practise ultimately derives from, I wonder if Proto Berber migrations from the Nile Valley spread this style among North West Africans. [/QB]
That's a possibility who knows
Posts: 1779 | From: Somewhere In the Rif Mountains | Registered: Nov 2021
| IP: Logged |
UBBFriend: Email this page to someone!
Printer-friendly view of this topic