Does anyone know about the ethnic divisions in northern Africa (Maghreb, Egypt, Mauritania, Chad, Sudan)?
I've heard that northern Sudanese are descendants of Africans (probably Nubians) who identify with Arabs in language and culture, not ethnicity. But I also heard that there are a lot of Arabs from Arabia in Sudan. Is there a caste or hierarchy? What's the Darfur situation about? They all look African to me.
I heard that in Sudan Arabs are usually at the top, only marry Arabs, and can trace their lineage directly back to Arabia. Everyone else is Arabized Africans or mulattoes, and they are subordinate to the Arabs. How true is this?
Is the same situation occurring throughout northern Africa. I read that Berber languages and cultures were suppressed and Berbers were subordinate to Arabs.
Does anyone know of books or articles that talk about these issues?
Posted by argyle104 (Member # 14634) on :
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Posted by AbuAnu (Member # 16410) on :
Why do u bring up all of those assumptions About Sudanese look at the word Sud black in arabic language but sudan is not only Khartoum and Omdurman and Up the nile its also the South,West,and East with so many different people all speaking different languages its not all about Arabic either Sudan is Tribal based all over its sooo diverse.
Posted by TheAmericanPatriot (Member # 15824) on :
Abu, On this board we are all black.
Posted by Freehand (Member # 10819) on :
^You're not black you lie.
Posted by xyyman (Member # 13597) on :
Hey!! nothing wrong with being white . . .or black. We have to thank honest white people for publishing their studies no matter how heart wrenching are the results.
Posted by dknytx (Member # 16355) on :
quote:Originally posted by AbuAnu: Why do u bring up all of those assumptions About Sudanese look at the word Sud black in arabic language but sudan is not only Khartoum and Omdurman and Up the nile its also the South,West,and East with so many different people all speaking different languages its not all about Arabic either Sudan is Tribal based all over its sooo diverse.
I'm trying to understand northern African identity (not just Sudan). They seem to want to associate more with the Arab world than the African world (or at least that's my perception). I want to know how Arabs and Arabic culture has influenced northern Africans and their identity.
(I guess I can equate it to Afro-Latinos not wanting to identify as being black when they come to the U.S. They prefer to ignore their African heritage and see themselves at Latinos (which is their choice).)
I have not been able to find anything on this topic, so I figured I'd throw it out there to see if anyone on this board was either from the region or read something on it.
Posted by Yonis2 (Member # 11348) on :
quote:dknytx wrote: I'm trying to understand northern African identity (not just Sudan). They seem to want to associate more with the Arab world than the African world (or at least that's my perception). I want to know how Arabs and Arabic culture has influenced northern Africans and their identity.
There is no such thing as "arabic culture", you are giving to much credit to bedouins, however there is islamic culture which is an amalgam of cultures adopted throughou the regions of the islamic khalifates and Empirs, drawn from early christian, zoroastrian, jewish, pagan practices and societies in the levant, India, Mesopotamia, Persia etc. This Islamic culture is deep rooted in north africa including sudan for centuries, it's not something you just throw away like that, it's deeply ingrained in all aspects of peoples social lifes and mentality. Racial or continental identity has no meaning (neither did national untill recently) therefore being "african" is not even thought of let alone discussed, religious, sectarian and tribal identity is what dominates.
Posted by AbuAnu (Member # 16410) on :
True The Sudanese have been dressing like that and riding camels before Arabs came 2 arabia as well as the Afar tribes. There is no ARab Culture that Way of Life was going on in Northern AFrica as well as the Sahel Beja,Tigre, the saho,Afar,Nara all of these tribes have been living a so called bedouin way of life.
Most people think that when the Arabs came to North Africa and East africa that they never wore jalabiya and rode camels as well as never had more than one wives that the Arabs just brought this Arab Bedouin Culture 2 them WRONG it was already there and it wasnt Arab it was just the way in the desert as well as the Yemeni who live in fertile land who grew food not 2 arab are they as well as Socotra
Posted by dknytx (Member # 16355) on :
Here's an example of what I'm getting at: centuries ago, Chinese culture was dominant in eastern Asia. The elites of various countries, while being ethnically Japanese, Korean, or Vietnamese, spoke Chinese, read Chinese literature, wrote in Chinese script, etc.
Is this the situation in northern Africa? Are the elites Arabic-speaking Africans (tribes or ethnic groups)? Or do they trace descent from Asia? I know there are Arabs in these countries. Where do they fit into the social system?
In the Maghreb, there was a policy of Arabization, and the Berbers were trying to hold on to their language and culture. Does that mean the elites are Arabs? Or do they just prefer Arab culture? I found an article that gives a glimse into the Arab presence in Sudan: Arabs and conflict in Darfur
On a side note, why are Somalia, Sudan, and Mauritania part of the League of Arab States while Guinea, Senegal, Niger, and Chad are not.
Posted by The Explorer (Member # 14778) on :
quote:Originally posted by dknytx:
They seem to want to associate more with the Arab world than the African world (or at least that's my perception).
That's because you probably haven't met Imazighen nationalists yet. As I have said before: Visiting areas of interest in Africa for oneself, assuming one is not from there [if one is from said areas, then there is no excuse for unnecessary ignorance], is the way to go. Merely learning through the internet or via "Western" mass media outlets can give one very misleading ideas about Africa. There's nothing like "learning on the ground" itself.
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