While Egyptian depictions of Asiatics are often Yellow to Light and Pale Beige in color, sometimes no different than the present inhabitants of the Near East. What is barely discussed and touted by Eurocentric and Arabcentric historians is the depictions and images of Dark skinned or "Asiatics" who resemble Tropical people found in Africa.
These Dark Skinned people do not have to be African, but they are black and Dark Skinned or Tawny people. Many times their phenotype is different than those of other Africans such as the "Kushites" and Egyptians who depicted them. Other times they are very similar in phenotype.
A supply ship. On deck, the captain is haranguing a crew of Canaanites. Painted wood, 12th Dynasty (2000-1785 BCE), Middle Kingdom, Egypt.
What is interesting about this image of "Canaanites" is that they look no different than Egyptians. They are depicted with Dark Brown Skin and even wear Egyptian clothing and Hair Styles.
As odd as this might seem, another depiction of a Canaanite depicts nearly the same details.
This Image of a "Syrian"(Canaanite) Soldier married to an Egyptian Woman, is the same color as his dark skinned wife, even his servant. Its obvious that the skin tones are faded and would probably be a darker reddish brown color. To note his beard is something you would not find on most Egyptian Men, and his clothing is obviously different.
Other renditions on the Syrian soldier image..
Posted by The Explorer (Member # 14778) on :
It's likely because it reflects the diversity of "Near Easterners". It wouldn't be unreasonable for elements of these dark skinned groups to be closely related to Africans, since there had been continuous movements of Africans into the region.
"Near East" doesn't have the same situation going like that in south and southeast Asia, where we have dark people with the deepest lineages for non-Africans.
Posted by the lioness (Member # 17353) on :
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lioness productions
2011
Posted by Whatbox (Member # 10819) on :
There were darker skinned groups around back then, many of whom just outside Africa I believe were influenced from within, such as in the nearby Arabian peninsula & Levant. Some darker skinned groups more reminiscent of those today more nearby India (think, Tamils, or, Dravidians), like the Elamites (lioness go head, googl'em), I believe were not and just still held [an extremely] dark shade they'd had since before history, and that may have started becoming less common with major historical civilizations, such as the Persians (who were more pale than the Greeks, according to Greeks, although perhaps still not considered "white") who conquered them.
I think medium colored (for Saudis) Saudis should naturally be the mode of the skin color of Arabia as it's at the lattitude of Egypt (and in Kemet's case remember they were people of SSA ancestry and so likely darker than they should be), and the mode color of many darker skinned Portuguese, Sicilians, and Cyprussians, meaning dark ones but not the abnormally past beyond swarthy dark ones [a white person who tans well with a good tan], should be that of the Northern Middle East in my opinion.
So some ancient Middle Easterners were much darker than what the Mediterranean region's climate (-UV, not temperature ) might suggest, while some today are lighter.
Posted by xyyman (Member # 13597) on :
Lioness like pictures. . . .he is like a kiddygartener.
BTW. Is that a joint he is smoking? Posted by -Just Call Me Jari- (Member # 14451) on :
More Darkskinned Asiatics..
Face of a Canaanite man (fragment) from Beth Shan Painting on a jar (about 1300 BCE)
Head of two Bedouins from Syria(Canaan)
RAMESSES III/USERMAATRE-MERIAMUN
Notice that both have similar Hair styles, a Braided style pulled back but the first "Bedouin" is a Darker Brown while the latter is a Reddish Brown.
Lower part of a Kneeling Bedouin..
Notice the clothing..
Posted by -Just Call Me Jari- (Member # 14451) on :
Procession of Asiatics from tomb of khnumhotep @ Beni Hassan..
Frescoes from the Palace at Mari
The royal palace of Mari was the royal residence of the rulers of the ancient kingdom of Mari in eastern Syria. The royal palace was excavated with the rest of the city in the 1930s and is considered one of the most important finds made at Mari.
Notice the Similarity in how the Egyptians depicted Subjugated Syrians/Asiatics bearing Tribute in the Tomb of Sobekhotep
Posted by The Explorer (Member # 14778) on :
quote:Originally posted by -Just Call Me Jari-: [QB] Procession of Asiatics from tomb of khnumhotep @ Beni Hassan..
In that wall relief, the Kemetic figures appear even darker than "Aamu" figures depicted above. See:
The actual photograph of the relief:
Posted by Djehuti (Member # 6698) on :
quote:Originally posted by -Just Call Me Jari-: While Egyptian depictions of Asiatics are often Yellow to Light and Pale Beige in color, sometimes no different than the present inhabitants of the Near East. What is barely discussed and touted by Eurocentric and Arabcentric historians is the depictions and images of Dark skinned or "Asiatics" who resemble Tropical people found in Africa.
These Dark Skinned people do not have to be African, but they are black and Dark Skinned or Tawny people. Many times their phenotype is different than those of other Africans such as the "Kushites" and Egyptians who depicted them. Other times they are very similar in phenotype.
A supply ship. On deck, the captain is haranguing a crew of Canaanites. Painted wood, 12th Dynasty (2000-1785 BCE), Middle Kingdom, Egypt.
What is interesting about this image of "Canaanites" is that they look no different than Egyptians. They are depicted with Dark Brown Skin and even wear Egyptian clothing and Hair Styles.
As odd as this might seem, another depiction of a Canaanite depicts nearly the same details.
This Image of a "Syrian"(Canaanite) Soldier married to an Egyptian Woman, is the same color as his dark skinned wife, even his servant. Its obvious that the skin tones are faded and would probably be a darker reddish brown color. To note his beard is something you would not find on most Egyptian Men, and his clothing is obviously different.
Other renditions on the Syrian soldier image..
Wow!! Is this for real?! I've seen that very ship miniature and crew countless times and never thought they were anything else but Egyptians! So the crew are actually Canaanites! You don't know how delighted this news is to me as well as this whole thread.
In fact just months ago I had a private message correspondence with Dana about depictions of black Canaanites where I included a picture of the Syrian soldier that was posted in this board before. I have more...
A duplicated rendition from a painting of Tut receiving a Canaanite delegation.
^ Notice the pale ones with long hair along with the ones of the same dark coloring as Egyptians.
Posted by Djehuti (Member # 6698) on :
quote:Originally posted by -Just Call Me Jari-: More Darkskinned Asiatics..
Face of a Canaanite man (fragment) from Beth Shan Painting on a jar (about 1300 BCE)
Head of two Bedouins from Syria(Canaan)
RAMESSES III/USERMAATRE-MERIAMUN
Notice that both have similar Hair styles, a Braided style pulled back but the first "Bedouin" is a Darker Brown while the latter is a Reddish Brown.
Lower part of a Kneeling Bedouin..
Notice the clothing..
^ Yes and notice the black skinned feet of the kneeling Bedouin.
As far as the Canaanite youth painting from the Beth Shan jar fragment, I have another of an older bearded man here:
I can't help but notice they have the same features as the Asiatic sheik from Khnumhotep's tomb.
Oh, and as far as the faience heads of the two Syrian men, I can't help but notice the one on the right has traces of darker paint on the ears and on the top lining of his forehead.
Here are a couple of more pics of Asiatic bearing tribute:
You can really notice the dark remnants of paint.
Posted by The Explorer (Member # 14778) on :
I'd put brakes on that excitement a bit for the moment.
Those figurines on the boat ARE the Egyptians, unless I'm missing something. Is there an inscription on the figurine or some description about the sculpture wherein it is said that the figurines are anything but Kemetic?
Posted by Truthcentric (Member # 3735) on :
Doesn't the bio-anthropological data report that Middle Easterners had cold-adapted limb proportions relative to Egyptians and other Africans as far back as the Natufian period? That would throw a wrench into the argument that there were significant black populations in the Fertile Crescent as recently as the Bronze Age. I think you guys are interpreting the ancient artwork too literally.
Posted by The Explorer (Member # 14778) on :
^And wrongly in some cases, as I had pointed out with actual photographs (as in the Beni Hassan-based relief) that seemed to be ignored for some reason, but I don't doubt that there were dark skinned "Near Easterners" and that the AE must have been observant of that as well.
Posted by The Explorer (Member # 14778) on :
BTW, Truthcentric, the so-called "cold-adapted" limb proportions don't correlate well with melanin concentration as heat-adapted limb proportions do.
Posted by -Just Call Me Jari- (Member # 14451) on :
I found the image from a Book where it is described as having "Canaanites" which is what the site where I got the online Image says also..
Im sure there was some inscriptions to lead these people to label it as such, but yeah they do look like normal Egyptians IMO.
quote:Originally posted by The Explorer: I'd put brakes on that excitement a bit for the moment.
Those figurines on the boat ARE the Egyptians, unless I'm missing something. Is there an inscription on the figurine or some description about the sculpture wherein it is said that the figurines are anything but Kemetic?
Posted by The Explorer (Member # 14778) on :
Jari,
I'd caution the claim that the figures on the boat are anything but Egyptian figures, unless I see material evidence specifically saying so.
I've never seen any "Near Eastern" personality depicted just like the Egyptians, wearing Egyptian attire.
Posted by -Just Call Me Jari- (Member # 14451) on :
I did'nt mean to Ignore your posts, I just got caught up in the Moor Tread, and I was trying to Drown out a little faggot hairy roach trying to pollute My thread.
Anyway, Yeah I agree. I try to refrain from calling all these people "Black" (Unless its obvious) but I use Dark Skinned. Its obvious these Amu Men are Tanned or Dark Skinned compared to the majority of the Ammu people, so they would be a minority. However it still goes to show many Asaitcs were quite dark. The Amu people are mainly Yellow and Lighter than the Egyptians, no doubt, but come one how many places/Books/Websites actually show these Two Dark Skinned Ammu Men??
BTW, I can't find a better quality Image of the Full Scene...I tried flickr to no avail.
quote:Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:Originally posted by -Just Call Me Jari-: [QB] Procession of Asiatics from tomb of khnumhotep @ Beni Hassan..
In that wall relief, the Kemetic figures appear even darker than "Aamu" figures depicted above. See:
The actual photograph of the relief:
Posted by -Just Call Me Jari- (Member # 14451) on :
Yeah but why would the book and the Museum label them as Canaanites??
It is odd that they would look so similar to Egyptians, maybe its because the scale of the Models??
quote:Originally posted by The Explorer: Jari,
I'd caution the claim that the figures on the boat are anything but Egyptian figures, unless I see material evidence specifically saying so.
I've never seen any "Near Eastern" personality depicted just like the Egyptians, wearing Egyptian attire.
Posted by -Just Call Me Jari- (Member # 14451) on :
Well Explorer makes a good and important point in that as you observe these folks all look like Egyptians..
Also Im glad you like the tread, please continue to contribute..
quote:Originally posted by Djehuti:
quote:Originally posted by -Just Call Me Jari-: While Egyptian depictions of Asiatics are often Yellow to Light and Pale Beige in color, sometimes no different than the present inhabitants of the Near East. What is barely discussed and touted by Eurocentric and Arabcentric historians is the depictions and images of Dark skinned or "Asiatics" who resemble Tropical people found in Africa.
These Dark Skinned people do not have to be African, but they are black and Dark Skinned or Tawny people. Many times their phenotype is different than those of other Africans such as the "Kushites" and Egyptians who depicted them. Other times they are very similar in phenotype.
A supply ship. On deck, the captain is haranguing a crew of Canaanites. Painted wood, 12th Dynasty (2000-1785 BCE), Middle Kingdom, Egypt.
What is interesting about this image of "Canaanites" is that they look no different than Egyptians. They are depicted with Dark Brown Skin and even wear Egyptian clothing and Hair Styles.
As odd as this might seem, another depiction of a Canaanite depicts nearly the same details.
This Image of a "Syrian"(Canaanite) Soldier married to an Egyptian Woman, is the same color as his dark skinned wife, even his servant. Its obvious that the skin tones are faded and would probably be a darker reddish brown color. To note his beard is something you would not find on most Egyptian Men, and his clothing is obviously different.
Other renditions on the Syrian soldier image..
Wow!! Is this for real?! I've seen that very ship miniature and crew countless times and never thought they were anything else but Egyptians! So the crew are actually Canaanites! You don't know how delighted this news is to me as well as this whole thread.
In fact just months ago I had a private message correspondence with Dana about depictions of black Canaanites where I included a picture of the Syrian soldier that was posted in this board before. I have more...
A duplicated rendition from a painting of Tut receiving a Canaanite delegation.
^ Notice the pale ones with long hair along with the ones of the same dark coloring as Egyptians.
Posted by The Explorer (Member # 14778) on :
Why does any book get information wrong? As for the Museum deal, I think that's in reference to the holders of the piece(?)
The burden is on the source(s) to identify what makes them label the figurines as such, as it is not obvious that the figurines are anything but Egyptian personalities.
Truthcentric,
The average brachial index reported for the Natufian in one study is 77%, while the Hayonim Natufian bunch reported a range from 75-78%, but no word on the crural, unfortunately.
Posted by The Explorer (Member # 14778) on :
quote:Originally posted by -Just Call Me Jari-:
I did'nt mean to Ignore your posts, I just got caught up in the Moor Tread, and I was trying to Drown out a little faggot hairy roach trying to pollute My thread.
Actually, the reason I said my post seemed to have been ignored, was because I followed up your post on the khnumhotep wall relief, which looks to be a repro or else a reworked artwork, with the actual photo of the relief, to show the differentiation between the two, but that information did not seem to have been accounted for in Djehuti's reply to your post.
Posted by the lioness (Member # 17353) on :
Book of Gates, fourth division (P)/fifth hour (H), lower register, scene 30: Syrian and Nubian, two of the "four races of mankind."
Posted by -Just Call Me Jari- (Member # 14451) on :
(This one is dedicated to you Lyin-arse)
Syrian Tribute bearers found by Siptah..
[/QUOTE]
Syrians
tribute with vases from the Tomb of scribe Haremhab TT78, Cross Hall 8 at Thebes.
![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
) might suggest, while some today are lighter.
[/QUOTE]
