quote:

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But I understand that this might be an African thing, so carry on.

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quote:

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Originally posted by lamin:
Mike, looks like like you are not following your U.S. news. Muslim converts in the U.S. and Canada have been known to resort to murder by beheading once the Quranic spirit hits them.

You must know by now Mike that the guys who flew those planes into the WTC were inspired by their religion.

Mike, you almost have to disrobe and bare your scrota, etc. for intrusive cameras all because some crazy guys decide to take their religion seriously. Pay attention Mike.

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quote:

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Originally posted by lamin:
Most instructive books for the 20th century.

The Wretched of the Earth(Fanon), Black Skin, White Masks(Fanon), Civilisation or Barbarism(C.A. Diop), Africa Must Unite(Nkrumah), The World and Africa(W.E. Dubois), Philosophy and Opinions(M. Garvey).

Many Western universities offer a courses to students titled "Great Books" or "History of Ideas". But no university in Africa or the Americas, Britain or France offer such a course where all of the above authors are treated. Even U.S. Departments of Africana Studies ignore such books--except, perhaps, Temple University.

A mind is a delicate thing and can be easily input with then right ideas. I say this because of this example....

Amedy Coulibaly, the Muslim terrorist who terrorised that Kosher market in Paris recently, was talking with some of his hostages and declared himself first as a Muslim who happened to be of Malian background. Just check the order of his identities--which indeed was at first puzzling--but later understood.

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quote:

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In addition to what you suggested I would also recommend The West And The Rest of Us- Chienweizu. To understand the economics of the world we live in.

"West and the Rest of Us: White Predators, Black Slavers and the African Elite"

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quote:

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Originally posted by lamin:

quote:

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But I understand that this might be an African thing, so carry on.

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Mike, looks like like you are not following your U.S. news. Muslim converts in the U.S. and Canada have been known to resort to murder by beheading once the Quranic spirit hits them.

You must know by now Mike that the guys who flew those planes into the WTC were inspired by their religion.

Mike, you almost have to disrobe and bare your scrota, etc. for intrusive cameras all because some crazy guys decide to take their religion seriously. Pay attention Mike.

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quote:

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Originally posted by CelticWarrioress:
Mike & Kdolo (err Mike), ever heard the saying, the enemy of my enemy is not my friend LOL.

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quote:

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Originally posted by CelticWarrioress:
Funny Mike I've heard that saying somewhere before my Whitey hating enemy. It is true though especially when both enemies want nothing more than to exterminate you. Muslims want to see Islamic boots on non-Islamic necks (particularly White necks), you Blacks want to see Black boots on White necks. Even you yourself said that Whites should not have any kind of self determination & self rulership.

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quote:

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Blacks were the original Europeans and Dravidian Albinos, from which you derive, are Central Asians. The only ones making a fuss about that is you and the Africans. Hell, even the Albino supremacist at Stormfront accept that. So I ask YOU, what's wrong with you and the Africans?

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quote:

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Originally posted by lamin:
Mike your fantasies are just so charmingly amusing. Mike, African America's most prominent scholar is W.E.B. Dubois. Du Bois wrote on the social sciences, history included. Nowhere in his writings does he ever claim that AAs derived from Europe. The same with the AA doyen of history, John Hope Franklin. He has never ever wrote that U.S. blacks derive from any part or section of Europe's population.

The very respected AA historian, the late John Henrik Clarke has never written or found any historical evidence the U.S. blacks--even a minority have any direct connection in Europe. The same with with Chancellor Williams, David Leavering Lewis(biographer of Dubois), Nell Painter, Molefi Asante, and others have never written that U.S. blacks have any connection except by way of white European settler forbears whose genetic imprints may be found among some 10-13% of the U.S. black population.

Even sympathetic white historians such as Eric Foner, David Brion Davis and Eugene Genovese have never wrote that AAs derive from Europe. They have scoured the migration records of European settlement in the U.S. and have never noted anything pointing to blacks entering America from Europe proper.

Mike, all sound theories rest on empirical evidence and your theories--if they are to gain currency in the sense of convincing others--must provide adequate evidence. Otherwise, the consensus would be that your theories are the concoctions of a cranky crackpot. Chew on that Mike, and eat it too.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Mike111:

quote:

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Originally posted by lamin:
Mike your fantasies are just so charmingly amusing. Mike, African America's most prominent scholar is W.E.B. Dubois. Du Bois wrote on the social sciences, history included. Nowhere in his writings does he ever claim that AAs derived from Europe. The same with the AA doyen of history, John Hope Franklin. He has never ever wrote that U.S. blacks derive from any part or section of Europe's population.

The very respected AA historian, the late John Henrik Clarke has never written or found any historical evidence the U.S. blacks--even a minority have any direct connection in Europe. The same with with Chancellor Williams, David Leavering Lewis(biographer of Dubois), Nell Painter, Molefi Asante, and others have never written that U.S. blacks have any connection except by way of white European settler forbears whose genetic imprints may be found among some 10-13% of the U.S. black population.

Even sympathetic white historians such as Eric Foner, David Brion Davis and Eugene Genovese have never wrote that AAs derive from Europe. They have scoured the migration records of European settlement in the U.S. and have never noted anything pointing to blacks entering America from Europe proper.

Mike, all sound theories rest on empirical evidence and your theories--if they are to gain currency in the sense of convincing others--must provide adequate evidence. Otherwise, the consensus would be that your theories are the concoctions of a cranky crackpot. Chew on that Mike, and eat it too.

---

I often denigrate Africans for just this reason: You have sat through years of every imaginable proofs of the fact that Blacks are in fact the original Europeans, yet you say nonsense like that. Worst yet, your stupidity allows you to suggest that knowledge never moves forward, which also seems an African concept to me. And in all your bloviating, not one African steps forward to say, "this fool is not one of us he shames us."

Tell me you poor fool, how do you explain this?

http://www.realhistoryww.com/world_history/ancient/Misc/Crests/Crests_3.htm#black

http://realhistoryww.com./world_history/ancient/Whites/NG_admits.htm

.


The Albinos at Stormfront acknowledge that they are from Central Asia.

https://www.stormfront.org/forum/t951507-3/

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Mike is right about Black Europeans representing some of our ancestors. That's why I wrote my new book:



It is clear that there were Blacks in the British colonies before 1619. In addition, African slaves were not imported into North America until after 1649. Most of the "early" black slaves were the Black Native Americans. These Northeastern Black Native Americans fought many wars against the Europeans in the Carolina's.




It is long overdue that Afro-Americans write our own history without the guidance of Europeans.

.
 

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Posted by Mike111 (Member # 9361) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Clyde Winters:

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Clyde, what is the source of this drawing?
 

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Posted by CelticWarrioress (Member # 19701) on :
 
Ohhh look its Clyde "White people aren't human" Liar Winters, coming to do some shameless self promoting again LOL.


Mike can't you make one dang post without using racist epithets?? Dude I'm a member of Stormfront & I've heard them make all kinds of claims as a matter of fact they have made the same claims you have made about Blacks but changed it to Whites LOL, alot of them are the White version of well YOU LOL. Like you hate Whites, they hate Blacks, like you are a Black supremacist, they are White supremacists. Funny how you leave out that not only do they claim Whites are indigenous to Central Asia, but also N. Africa, the ME, the Americas, Japan, & India as well LOL.
 

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Posted by Mike111 (Member # 9361) on :
 
^You have to learn how to recognize the loons and weed them out Doxie.

And btw - I love White people.
 

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Posted by xyyman (Member # 13597) on :
 
??






This is were we are at for the last 40yrs what we have is a grave site dating 1250 A.D with two apparently non native Americans of African origins one wearing a Pre-Colombian clay vessel around his wrist dating 950-1250 A.D no colonial objects were found at the site. and as said earlier this is no stand alone although I know of no new studies done on the others,I hope the Virgin Island's government refocus on this.

Incidentally one of the figures appeared to been a sacrifice


This skeleton was buried in a non European fashion with a large pot fragment dating to the Elenoid period (950-1250 A.D).It's upper body was contorted while it's legs was rigidly aligned and aiming true east as if they had been tied together;three heavy rocks were placed above the feet.The skeleton was racially hybrid,part Indian part Negro.It also exhibits what Dr Stewart considers tooth mutilation characteristic of West African cultures.

news.google.com/newspapers?nid=757&dat=19741021&id=kw9OAAAAIBAJ&sjid=BK4DAAAAIBAJ&pg=6610

Read more: http://egyptsearchreloaded.proboards.com/thread/1682/study-precolumbian-african-skeletons-virgin?page=1#ixzz3QAqRNDtt
 

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Posted by xyyman (Member # 13597) on :
 
The Smithsonian Institute never DNA tested these negroid skeletons.

Nothing was heard of them since.
 

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Posted by Clyde Winters (Member # 10129) on :
 
We have moved beyond this 1974 article.


The first Americans Naia, and Luzia dating to 12,000 BC were Negroes



NAIA of Mexico




LUZIA of Brazil

Archaeologist have reconstructed the faces of ancient Americans from Brazil and Mexico. These faces are based on the skeletal remains dating back to 12,000BC.

Researchers working on these ancient people note that they resemble Negroes, instead of contemporary Native Americans.


In the Smithsonian Magazine Dr. Chatters who found Naia's skeleton, noted that:

“The small number of early American specimens discovered so far have smaller and shorter faces and longer and narrower skulls than later Native Americans, more closely resembling the modern people of Africa, Australia, and the South Pacific. "This has led to speculation that perhaps the first Americans and Native Americans came from different homelands," Chatters continues, "or migrated from Asia at different stages in their evolution."

Read more: http://www.smithsonianmag.com/science-nature/dna-12000-year-old-skeleton-helps-answer-question-who-were-first-americans-180951469/#hexUIhxcwDxMkCAz.99


Although Dr. Chatters believes these Negroes came from Asia this seems unlikely. It is unlikely because the Ice Age would have made it impossible to sail from Asia to Mexico and Brazil at this time. These Negroes were probably Blacks from Africa. This is the most likely origin of these Blacks; the Dafuna boat dating back to 18,000 BC, shows that Africans had boats at this early date.
Posted by Dr. Clyde Winters at 8:46 PM 1 comment:
The Khoisan Probably took haplogroups N and y-chromosome R to Eurasia during the Aurignacian period

.

I discuss the origin Europeans genes in my recent paper: " Were the First Europeans Pale or Dark Skinned? http://www.scirp.org/journal/aahttp://dx.doi.org/10.4236/aa.2014.43016



I quote"
The traditional view for the spread of L3(M, N) across Eurasia is that the M and N macrohaplogroups originated in western Eurasia and returned to Africa as a result of back-migration. The big problem for this theory is that the proposed dates for the origin of haplogroups N and M in western Europe, date to a period when these areas were inhabited by Neanderthal people—not AMH. This supports an African origin for L3(M, N).


The craniometric evidence supports a Khoisan presence in Europe during Aurignacian times. If the Khoisan represent the ancient dark skinned European population, this reality should be able to be confirmed by genetic research.


The most archaic AMH remains come from Florished, South Africa; they date between 190 - 330 kya (Rito et al., 2013). Other ancient fossil evidence of AMH in South Africa come from Broken Hill (c. 110 kya) and the Klasis River caves (c. 65 - 105 kya). Researchers have been surprised to find Khoisan and European admixture. The idea that the Khoisan acquired Eurasian admixture via Ethiosemitic speakers is pure speculation (Pickrell et al., 2013). There is no archaeological
evidence of Ethiopians migrating into East and South Africa, but there is evidence of an ancient migration of Khoisan into Europe based on archaeological and skeletal data.


The Khoisan carry haplogroups L3(M, N). Before they reached Iberia, they probably stopped in West Africa. The basal L3(M) motiff in West Africa is characterized by the Ddel site np 10,394 and Alul site np 10,397 associated with AF-24. This supports my contention that Khoisan speakers early settled West Africa on their way to Iberia.


Granted L3 and L2 are not as old as LOd, but Gonder et al. (2006) provides very early dates for this mtDNA e.g., L3(M, N) 94.3; the South African Khoisan (SAK) carry L1c, L1, L2, L3 M, N dates to 142.3 kya; the Hadza are L2a, L2, L3, M, N, dates to 96.7 kya.


The dates for L1, L2, L3, M, N are old enough for the Khoisan to have taken N to West Africa, where we find L3, L2 and LOd and thence to Iberia as I suggested in my paper (Winters, 2011). It is interesting to note that LO haplogroups are primarily found among Khoisan and West Africans. This shows that at some point in prehistory the Khoisan had migrated into West Africa.


The first modern European reconstructed by Forensic artist Richard Neave based on skull fragments from 35,000 years ago resembled a Khoisan (Figure 1). The skull was discovered in the southwest region of Romania’s Carpathian Mountains. This supports the research of Boule and Vallois that South Africans migrated into Europe 35 kya. This genetic evidence now supports Boule and Vallois of a Khoisan migration into Europe.


The Khoisan may have introduced the L haplogroup to Iberia. The SAK populations carry haplogroups L2, and L3. de Domínguez (2005), noted that much of the ancient mtDNA found in Iberia has no relationship to the people presently living in Iberia today and correspond to African mtDNA haplogroups. de Domínguez (2005) found that the lineages recovered from ancient Iberian skeletons are the African lineages L1b, L2 and L3."



References:



Balter, M. (2005). Ancient DNA Yields Clues to the Puzzle of European Origins. Science, 310, 964-965. http://dx.doi.org/10.1126/science.310.5750.964



Barral, L., & Charles, R. P. (1963). Nouvelles donnees anthropometriques et precision sue les affinities systematiques des negroides de Grimaldi. Bulletin du Musee d’Anthropologie Prehistorique de Monaco, 10, 123-139.

Boule, M., & Vallois, H. V. (1957). Fossil Man. New York: Dryden Press.

Brace, C. L., Seguchi, N., Quintyn, C. B., Fox, S. C., Nelson, A. R., Manolis, S. K., & Pan, Q. F. (2006). The Questionable Contribution of the Neolithic and the Bronze Age to European Craniofacial Form. Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences of the United States of America, 103, 242-247. http://dx.doi.org/10.1073/pnas.0509801102



Brown, S. J. (2006). Neanderthals and Modern Humans in Western Asia. http://karmak.org/archive/2003/01/westasia.html



Canfield, V. A., Berg, A., Peckins, S. et al. (2014). Molecular Phylogeography of a Human Autosomal Skin Color Locus under Natural Selection. G3, 3, 2059-2067. http://dx.doi.org/10.1534/g3.113.007484



Caramelli, D., Lalueza-Fox, C., Vernesi, C., Lari, M., Casoli, A., Mallegni, B. C., Dupanloup, I., Bertranpetit, J., Barbujani, G., & Bertorelle, G. (2003). Evidence for a Genetic Discontinuity between Neandertals and 24,000 Year-Old Anatomically Modern Europeans. Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences of the United States of America, 100, 6593-6597. http://dx.doi.org/10.1073/pnas.1130343100



Caramelli, D., Milani, L., Vai, S., Modi, A., Pecchioli, E. et al. (2008). A 28,000 Years Old Cro-Magnon mtDNA Sequence Differs from All Potentially Contaminating Modern Sequences. PLoS ONE, 3, e2700. http://dx.doi.org/10.1371/journal.pone.0002700

Clark, J. D. (1977). The Origins of Domestication in Ethiopia. 5th Panafrican Congress of Prehistory and Quaternary Studies, Nairobi.

de Domínguez, E. F. (2005). Polimorfismos de DNA mitocondrial en poblaciones antiguas de la cuenca mediterránea. PhD Thesis, Barcelona: Universitat de Barcelona, Departament Biologia Animal.

Diop, A. (1974). The African Origin of Civilization. Brooklyn, NY: Lawrence Hill Books.

Diop, A. (1991). Civilization or Barbarism. Brooklyn, NY: Lawrence Hill Books.

DuBois, W. E. B. (1941). The World and Africa.

Ehret, C. (1979). On the Antiquity of Agriculture in Ethiopia. Journal of African History, 20, 161-177.
http://dx.doi.org/10.1017/S002185370001700X



Gilead, I. (2005). The Upper Paleolithic Period in the Levant. Journal of World Prehistory, 5, 105-154.

Gonder, M. K., Mortensen, H. M., Reed, F. A., de Sousa, A., & Tishkoff, S. A. (2006). Whole mtDNA Genome Sequence Analysis of Ancient African Lineages. Molecular Biology and Evolution, 24, 757-768. http://dx.doi.org/10.1093/molbev/msl209

González, A. M., Cabrera, V. M., Larruga, J. M., Tounkara, A., Noumsi, G., Thomas, B. N., & Moulds, J. M. (2006). Mitochondrial DNA Variation in Mauritania and Mali and Their Genetic Relationship to Other Western Africa Populations. Annals of Human Genetics, 70, 631-657. http://www.blackwell-synergy.com/doi/abs/10.1111/j.1469-1809.2006.00259.x?cookieSet=1&journalCode=ahg
Haak, W., Forster, P., Bramanti, B., Matsumura, S., Brandt, G., Tänzer, M., Villems, R., Renfrew, C., Gronenborn, D., Alt, K. W., & Burger, J. (2005). Ancient DNA from the First European Farmers 7500-Year-Old Neolithic Sites. Science, 310, 1016-1018.

Holliday, T. (2000). Evolution at the Crossroads: Modern Human Emergence in Western Asia. American Anthropologist, 102, 54-68.

Ki-Zerbo, J. (1981). Unesco General History of Africa Vol. 1: Methodology and African Prehistory. 572.

Klyosov, A. A. (2014). Reconsideration of the “Out of Africa” Concept as Not Having Enough Proof. Advances in Anthropology, 4, 18-37. http://www.scirp.org/journal/aahttp://dx.doi.org/10.4236/aa.2014.41004

Lazaridis, J., Patterson, N., Mittnik, A. et al. (2013). Ancient Human Genomes Suggest Three Ancestral Populations for Present-Day Europeans. http://biorxiv.org/content/biorxiv/early/2013/12/23/001552.full.pd

Olalde, I., Allentoft, M. E., Sanchez-Quinto, F., Santpere, G., Chiang, C. W. K., DeGiorgio, M. et al. (2014). Derived Immune and Ancestral Pigmentation Alleles in a 7,000-Year-Old Mesolithic European. Nature, 507, 225-228. http://dx.doi.org/10.1038/nature12960

Pickrell, J. K., Patterson, N., Loh, P. R., Lipson, M., Berger, B., Stoneking, M., Pakendorf, B., & Reich, D. (2013). Ancient West Eurasian Ancestry in Southern and Eastern Africa. http://arxiv.org/abs/1307.8014

Prufer, K., Racimo, F., Patterson, N., Jay, F., Sankararaman, S., Sawyer, S. et al. (2014). The Complete Genome Sequences of Neanderthal from the Altai, Mountains. Nature, 505, 43-49.

Quibtanana-Murci, L., Semino, O., Bandelt, H. J., Passaro, G., McElreadey, K., & Santachiara-Benerecetti, A. S. (1999). Genetic Evidence of an Early Exit of Homo Sapiens from Africa through Eastern Africa. Nature Genetics, 23, 437-441. http://dx.doi.org/10.1038/70550



Rito, T., Richard, M. B., Fernandes, V., Alshamal, F., Cerny, V., Pereira, L., & Soares, P. (2013). The First Modern Human Dispersals aross Africa. PLoS ONE, 8, e80031.

Scozzari, R., Massaia, A., Trombatta, B., Bellusci, G., Myres, N. M., Novelletto, A., & Cruciani, F. (2014). An Unbiased Resource of Novel SNP Markers Provides a New Chronology for Human Y-Chromosome and Reveals a Deep Phylogenetic Structure in Africa. Genome Research.

Skoglund, P., Malmström, H., Omrak, A., Raghavan, M., Valdiosera, C., Günther, T., Hall, P., Tambets, K., Parik, J.,Sjögren, K. G., Apel, J., Willerslev, E., Storå, J., Götherström, A., & Jakobsson, M. (2014). Genomic Diversity and Admixture Differs for Stone-Age Scandinavian Foragers and Farmers. Science, 344, 747-750. http://dx.doi.org/10.1126/science.1253448



Stevanovitch, A., Gilles, A., Bouzaid, E., Kefi, R., Paris, F., Gayraud, R. P., Spadoni, J. L., El-Chenawi, F., & Béraud-Colomb, E. (2003). Mitochondrial DNA Sequence Diversity in a Sedentary Population from Egypt. Annals of Human Genetics, 68, 23-29. http://dx.doi.org/10.1046/j.1529-8817.2003.00057.x

Steven, L. K., Stiner, M. C., Reese, D. S., & Gulec, E. (2001). Ornaments of the Earliest Upper Paleolithic: New Insights

from the Levant. Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences of the United States of America, 98, 7641-7646. http://dx.doi.org/10.1073/pnas.121590798
Wendorf, F. (1968). The History of Nubia. Dallas, TX.

Winters, C. (2008). Aurignacian Culture: Evidence of Western Exit for Anatomically Modern Humans. South Asian Anthropologist, 8, 79-81.

Winters, C. (2010). Origin and Spread of the Haplogroup N. Bioresearch Bulletin, 3, 116-122.

Winters, C. (2011). The Gibraltar out of Africa Exit for Anatomically Modern Humans.
WebmedCentral BIOLOGY, 2, ArticleID: WMC002311. http://www.webmedcentral.com/article_view/2311
 

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Posted by Clyde Winters (Member # 10129) on :
 
Research indicates now that Blacks were here in the Americas for 100,000 years.

Africans Discover Brazil 100,000 Years Ago
Fire unless the result of lightening is produced by man. The evidence that fire existed in Brazil 65kya is an indication that man was at the site 65,000 years ago, since researchers found charcoal, which is the result of fire making.

The New York Times, reported that humans were Brazil 100,000 years ago .

A New York Times video noted that Dr.Nieda Guidon supports her dating of an African population in Brazil 100,000 years ago to ancient fire and tool making.

Look at the New York Times video: Human’s First Appearance in the Americas @:

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/03/28/world/americas/discoveries-challenge-beliefs-on-humans-arrival-in-the-americas.html?hp&_r=4

.
 

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Posted by Clyde Winters (Member # 10129) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Mike111:

quote:

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Originally posted by Clyde Winters:

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Clyde, what is the source of this drawing?

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I had the source but I lost it. It was done by a German painter.

.
 

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Posted by Clyde Winters (Member # 10129) on :
 


Above is the picture Europeans want you to see when you think about Black Americans.They don't want you to see pictures like the one below.



The problem is you have to copy the picture quick and record the site because they don't last long on the WWW. I also saw paintings of Blacks in their red brick forts fighting white Americans, but I failed to save it and now I can't find it.

In Florida and Mississippi the Black Native Americans usually built their forts with red bricks.
.

.
 

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Posted by Clyde Winters (Member # 10129) on :
 
We have been lied too about Black History. When I was growing up my mother made it clear that we were part Choctaw. So in 1967, I took a survey at my High School: DuSable, in Chicago and found that over 40% of my classmates had Indian heritage.


Choctaw

At the time many people laughed at us because they only saw Lakota ad Apache on T.V. Today because of the WWW, there are numerous pictures of Black Native Americans on the Web. Below French artist Alexandre de Batz's renderings of Native American life in colonial Louisiana, such as "Desseins de Sauvages de Plusieurs Nations" ("Drawings of Several Native Americans of Various Nations") from 1735



As you can see there was not one Native American ethnicity

Several types of blacks entered the Americas including the Khoisan, Anu or negrito type and the Proto-Saharan variety of blacks. Up until recently it was believed that the first humans crossed the Bering Strait 12,000 B.P., to enter the North American continent.(Begley 1991, p.15) This view was never accepted by physical anthropologists who have found skeletal remains far older than 12,000 B.P.

Today archaeologists have found sites from Canada to Chile that range between 20,000 and 40,000 years old. In Brazil evidence of Africans date back 100,000 years.

There are numerous sites in North and South America which are over 35,000 years old.1 These sites are the Old Crow Basin (c.38,000 B.C.) in Canada; Orogrande Cave (c.36,000 B.C.) in the United States; and Pedra Furada (c.45,000 B.C.)2 Given the fact that the earliest dates for habitation of the American continent occur below Canada in South America is highly suggestive of the fact that the earliest settlers on the American continents came from Africa before the Ice melted at the Bering Strait and moved northward as the ice melted.
The appearance of pebble tools at Monte verde in Chile (c.32,000 B.P), and rock paintings at Pedra Furada in Brazil (c.22,000 B.P.) and mastodont hunting in Venezuela and Colombia (c.13,000 B.P.), have led some researchers to believe that the Americas was first settled from South America.3 C. Vance Haynes noted that:"If people have been in South America for over 30,000 years, or even 20,000 years, why are there so few sites?....One possible answer is that they were so few in number; another is that South America was somehow initially populated from directions other than 4north until Clovis appeared".

P.S. Martin and R. G. Klein after discussing the evidence of mastodont hunting in Venezuela 13,000 years ago observed that : "The thought that the fossil record of South America is much richer in evidence of early archaeological associations than many believed is indeed provocative.... Have the earliest hunters been overlooked in North America? 5Or did the hunters somehow reach South America first"?
The early presence of ice-age sites in South America suggest that these people probably came from Africa. This would explain the affinities between 6African languages and the Amerind family of languages.

In very ancient times the American continent was inhabited by Asian and African blacks. The oldest skeletal remains found in the Americas are of blacks. Marquez (1956,p.179) observed that "it is [good] to report that long ago the youthful America was also a Negro continent." Dr. Dixon (1923) noted that as early as 70,000 B.C., Austroloid and later negritos crossed the Bering Strait to reach the New World. His dating for these early Blacks crossing the Beringa is far too earlym because ice made it impossible to cross from Asia to North America, until at least 12-15,000 years ago. This meant that Blacks had to come directly from Africa and Eurpe to settle the Americas.


And Lanning (1963) noted that "there was a possible movement of negritos from Ecuador into the Piura Valley, north of Chicama and Viru" in early times.

In the 1970’s in Brazil an interesting skull of a girl was found. This skull was reconstructed and dated back to 12,000 BC. Dr. Walter Neves professor of biological anthropology at the University of Sao Paolo, after reconstructing the “Luzia” skull found that this personage was either an African or Pacific island type Black7. And recently, archaeologist found the skull of another Blck girl dating to this period, they named Naia.

I am happy to be an Afro-Indian. My heritage is of Africa and America Being here today is just making America the way it was originally. A continent first explored and inhabited by Africans. who began sailing to America probably as early as 100,000 years ago. We definitely know Africans were here by 30kya.
.

Notes

1. Warwick Bray,"The Paleoindian debate". Nature 332, (10 March) 1988, p.107.

2 . Ibid, p.107; "Man's New World arrival Pushed back", Chicago Tribune, (9 May 1991) Sec.1A, p.40;and A.L. Bryan, "Points of Order". Natural History , (June 1987) pp.7-11.

3. Bryan, p.11.

4. C.V. Haynes,Jr.,"Geofacts and Fanny". Natural History ,(February 1988)pp.4-12:12.

5 . P.S. Martin and R.G.Klein (eds.),Quarternary Extinctions: A Prehistoric Revolution, (Tucson:University of Arizona Press,1989) p.111.

6 . M.Ruhlen,"Voices from the Past". Natural History, (March 1987) pp.6-10:10; J.H. Greenberg,Language in the Americas. Stanford:Stanford University Press,1987.

7 Neves W.A . and Pucciarelli H.M. 1991. "Morphological Affinities of the First Americans: an exploratory analysis based on early South American human remains". Journal of Human Evolution Journal of Human Evolution 273
Powell J.F. and Neves W.A . 1999. "Craniofacial morphology of the first Americans: pattern and process in thepeopling of the New World". Yearbook of Physical Anthropology 42:153-188
Neves W.A ., Powell J.F. and Ozolins E.G. 1999. "Extra-continental morphological affinities of Lapa Vermelha IV Hominid 1: A multivariate analysis with progressive numbers of variables. Homo 50:263-268; Neves W.A ., Powell J.F. and Ozolins E.G. 1999. "Extra-continental morphological affinities of Palli-Aike, Southern Chile". Interciencia24:258-263
 

---

Posted by CelticWarrioress (Member # 19701) on :
 
Mike bull crap, sorry but Whites are NOT Africans either. Tell another lie Mike, everyone knows that you, Clyde "Whites aren't human" Winters, Xyyboy, Kdolo, Habsburg,and the majority of this forum including the admins & mods hate Whites with a passion. Why else would you not want White children to have a future? Why else would you try to rob White children of their future & their past? Why else would you want White children to think they are inferior non humans? Why else would you want White children to think they have no history and thus no future? Why else would you want White children to think they have nothing to be proud of as White children?? Why else would you want White children to think they have no place on earth they belong?
 

---

Posted by Mike111 (Member # 9361) on :
 
^All together now: "WE LOVE WHITE PEOPLE."

And we'll love you even more if we can manage to civilize you.
 

---

Posted by xyyman (Member # 13597) on :
 
Dhoxie and her “ilk” like Lioness, don’t believe Euroepans are a sub-set of Africans. MelaninKing/Marmerthoth will call them Albino Africans.

Don’t believe me…here is the latest., fresh off the press. Cass the skull expert can jumo in anytime. He! He! He! Now the morphology corroborates the genetics

I got this!!!!

Quote:
-----------------------

Levantine cranium from Manot Cave (Israel) foreshadows the first European modern humans - Israel Hershkovitz1,2* Jan2015

The overall shape and discrete morphological features of the Manot 1 calvaria demonstrate that this partial skull is unequivocally modern. It is similar in shape to RECENT African skulls as well as to European skulls from the Upper Palaeolithic period, but DIFFERENT from most other early anatomically modern humans in the Levant. This suggests that the Manot people could be closely related to the first modern humans who later successfully colonized Europe. Thus, the anatomical features used to support the ‘assimilation model’ in Europe might NOT have been inherited from European Neanderthals, but rather from earlier Levantine populations.


The taxonomic significance of this combination of features is not immediately clear, but hominins with similar combinations persist in the fossil record ACROSS SUB-SAHARAN AFRICA AND THE LEVANT until, and EVEN AFTER, ,35 kyr ago12,14,15. Geometric morphometric methods16,17 were used to place the Manot 1 fossil in the broader context of the fossil record (Supplementary Information E and Extended Data Table 4). The first two principal components of shape space (Fig. 3a, b) explain,62%of the total shape variance. This analysis places Manot 1 within the cloud of recent and Upper Palaeolithic modern humans—namely Mladecˇ 1 (,35 kyr cal. (calibrated years) BP), Preˇdmostı´3 (,30–27 kyr cal. BP), Brno 2 (,29–28 kyr cal. BP), Pavlov (,29 kyr cal. BP), and Oberkassel (,14.7–13.7 kyr cal. BP)—and remote from other fossils from the Near East, such as Shanidar 1, Skhul 5 or Qafzeh 6. A nearest neighbour analysis (Fig. 3c), based on the full Procrustes distance, links the Manot specimen with recent African skulls and with central European Upper Palaeolithic specimens, such as Mladecˇ 1


Manot 1 is thus the first direct fossil evidence that modern humans inhabited the Levantine corridor,55 kyr ago. This period coincides with the timing predicted by GENETIC and archaeological models for a wave of modern human dispersal out of Africa19–22. The Manot 1 calvaria is similar in overall shape to early Upper Palaeolithic European skulls, and its discrete features FORESHADOW those of later Upper Palaeolithic humans in central Europe. This implies that the Manot people could have given rise to the first modern humans to colonize Europe SUCCESSFULLY.


----------------------
.


Oh! Look at fig 3a. Odd they did not include Mechta-Aflou(sp?) in the chart. Although they sated Manot 1 was a close match.

Any questions?? Ask the skull expert..Cass

quote:

---

Originally posted by CelticWarrioress:
Mike bull crap, sorry but Whites are NOT Africans either. ?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by xyyman:
[QB] Dhoxie and her “ilk” like Lioness, don’t believe Euroepans are a sub-set of Africans. MelaninKing/Marmerthoth will call them Albino Africans.

---

Doxies is not my ilk, fool

Wpproximately how many years ago were the ancestors of Europeans people living in Africa?

Also if OOA is correct (which Doxies doesn't believe)
then all people are a "sub set of Africans" and there for you are making a pointless point
 

---

Posted by Mike111 (Member # 9361) on :
 


.

EVER WONDER WHY THE "BLACKFOOT" were called the Blackfoot?

Blackfoot warrior, (Karl Bodmer, between 1840 and 1843)




A Moorish military musician in Berlin by Peter Schenk (c. 1690)

(He,he,he: anyone see anything "Moorish" about him?). Albinos just can't stop lying - just look at lioness!

P.S. the last of the Moors were driven out of Spain in 1492.




Peter Schenk Dutch Painting of the Yamassee War





A Dutch view of the Yamasee War. The full title, translated from the Dutch, reads "The gruesome attack of the Indians on the English, in Carolina, West Indies, on 19 April 1715

http://yamasseegov.org/main_site/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=70:dutch&catid=1:latest-news&Itemid=55


Von Reck's drawings

The supreme commander of the Yuchi Indian nation, whose name is Kipahalgwa



Indians going a-hunting



An Indian Camp



http://base.kb.dk/manus_pub/cv/manus/ManusPage.xsql?nnoc=manus_pub&p_ManusId=22&p_PageNo=Bind&p_Lang=alt&p_Mode=img


NKS 565 4º: Von Reck's drawings


"In 1736, Philip Georg Friedrich von Reck, then only twentyfive years old, sailed with other colonists from Germany to Georgia. One of his intentions, expressed in a letter before he left Europe, was to bring back from America "ocular proof" of what he called "this strange new world." Idealistic nad enthusiastic, welleducated and blessed with an amazing artistic gift, von Reck kept a travel diary, wrote separate descriptions of the plants, animals and Indians he discovered in Georgia and drew some fifty watercolor and pencil sketches of what he saw. [...]

These drawings, accompanied by von Reck's writings, are important as history, science and art. As history, they give us a new and absolutely unique glimpse of Georgia as it looked when the first Europeans settled there. [...] As science, von Reck's natural history drawings represent the earliest records of several plants and animals. [...] Von Reck's drawings and writings are especially important for the light they shed on Indian life. The drawings show in detail their costumes and equipment, houses and activities. [...] As art, von Reck's drawings are as fresh, intimate and alive on the paper as the day they were drawn."

(Extract from 'Introduction' to VON RECK'S VOYAGE. Drawings and Journal of Philip Georg Friedrich von Reck. Edited by Kristian Hvidt. With the Assistance of Joseph Ewan, George F. Jones and William C. Sturtevant. The Beehive Press, Savannah 1980.)


In this net edition all the aquarelles and drawings in von Reck's sketch book (36,5 x 28,8 cm) and all other drawings in the collection NKS 565 4º have been reproduced. For further information on and description of the drawings and their background the book mentioned above is recommended.


http://base.kb.dk/manus_pub/cv/manus/ManusIntro.xsql?nnoc=manus_pub&p_ManusId=22&p_Lang=alt
 

---

Posted by Mike111 (Member # 9361) on :
 



The Yamasee War

The Yamasee Indians were part of the Muskhogean language group. Their traditional homelands lay in present-day northern Florida and southern Georgia. The advent of the Spanish in the late 16th century forced the Yamasee to migrate north into what would become South Carolina. Relations between the tribe and English settlers in that region were generally positive during the latter half of the 17th century.

Not surprisingly, problems between the races developed. The continuing influx of white settlers put pressure on Indian agricultural and hunting lands. The relationship was further complicated in that the tribe had become dependent on English firearms and other manufactured items, and had incurred a large debt, typically payable in deerskins. White fur traders acted on their displeasure by enslaving a number of Yamasee women and children to cover portions of the outstanding debt.

In the spring of 1715, the Yamasee formed a confederation with other tribes and struck at the white settlements in South Carolina. Several hundred settlers were killed, homes burned and livestock slaughtered. The frontier regions were emptied; some fled to the relative safety of North Carolina and others pushed on to even more secure Virginia. Charleston also received large numbers of frightened settlers.

At the height of the fighting, it appeared that the tribal confederation's overwhelming numerical superiority would end in the white settlements' complete destruction in the region. This would have been a virtual certainty if the confederacy had successfully drawn the Cherokee into their cause. Instead, the Cherokee gave in to the lure of English weapons and other goods, and chose to aid the Carolinians. In a further stroke of good fortune, the besieged settlers also managed to gain support from Virginia ~ez_mdash~ an event not assured in this age of intense colonial rivalries.

The tide turned against the Yamasee, who were slowly pushed south through Georgia back into their ancestral lands in northern Florida. There, the tribe was virtually annihilated by protracted warfare with the Creeks, but some members were absorbed by the Seminole.

The Yamasee War took a heavy toll in South Carolina. Such terror had been instilled in the minds of the frontiersmen that it would take nearly 10 years for resettlement to occur in many areas. The warfare also brought a sharp change to the region's economy. Originally, farming had been the settlers' primary occupation, but the livestock supply had been so drastically depleted that many farms disappeared. In their absence, enterprising South Carolinians turned to the forests as a source of naval stores (tar, pitch and turpentine) and soon developed a lucrative trade with England. Later, the economy would develop rice and indigo as its primary products.


http://www.u-s-history.com/pages/h1169.html
 

---

Posted by xyyman (Member # 13597) on :
 
I know sometimes I get too hyped. But! I thought you would get the point. Since ALL humans originated from Africa and Manot1 is clearly African but different from Australian(the first OOA). Then obviously there were***** MANY***** waves. Neolithic EEF being the last replacement. Which is what I been saying all along …and my point. Do you know why I mentioned Mechta_Aflou? Geography.!!!!!!! Mechta – Was suspiciously NOT included in the chart (Fig3) although Mechta was in the write-up. Hmmmmm! It takes a brilliant mind like mines to pickup these errors. You know. The high IQ thing.

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

---

Originally posted by xyyman:
[QB] Dhoxie and her “ilk” like Lioness, don’t believe Euroepans are a sub-set of Africans. MelaninKing/Marmerthoth will call them Albino Africans.

---

Doxies is not my ilk, fool

Wpproximately how many years ago were the ancestors of Europeans people living in Africa?

Also if OOA is correct (which Doxies doesn't believe)
then all people are a "sub set of Africans" and there for you are making a pointless point

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by lamin:
Mike your fantasies are just so charmingly amusing. Mike, African America's most prominent scholar is W.E.B. Dubois. Du Bois wrote on the social sciences, history included. Nowhere in his writings does he ever claim that AAs derived from Europe. The same with the AA doyen of history, John Hope Franklin. He has never ever wrote that U.S. blacks derive from any part or section of Europe's population.

The very respected AA historian, the late John Henrik Clarke has never written or found any historical evidence the U.S. blacks--even a minority have any direct connection in Europe. The same with with Chancellor Williams, David Leavering Lewis(biographer of Dubois), Nell Painter, Molefi Asante, and others have never written that U.S. blacks have any connection except by way of white European settler forbears whose genetic imprints may be found among some 10-13% of the U.S. black population.

Even sympathetic white historians such as Eric Foner, David Brion Davis and Eugene Genovese have never wrote that AAs derive from Europe. They have scoured the migration records of European settlement in the U.S. and have never noted anything pointing to blacks entering America from Europe proper.

Mike, all sound theories rest on empirical evidence and your theories--if they are to gain currency in the sense of convincing others--must provide adequate evidence. Otherwise, the consensus would be that your theories are the concoctions of a cranky crackpot. Chew on that Mike, and eat it too.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Mike111:


.

EVER WONDER WHY THE "BLACKFOOT" were called the Blackfoot?

Blackfoot warrior, (Karl Bodmer, between 1840 and 1843)




A Moorish military musician in Berlin by Peter Schenk (c. 1690)

(He,he,he: anyone see anything "Moorish" about him?). Albinos just can't stop lying - just look at lioness!

P.S. the last of the Moors were driven out of Spain in 1492.




Peter Schenk Dutch Painting of the Yamassee War





A Dutch view of the Yamasee War. The full title, translated from the Dutch, reads "The gruesome attack of the Indians on the English, in Carolina, West Indies, on 19 April 1715

http://yamasseegov.org/main_site/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=70:dutch&catid=1:latest-news&Itemid=55


Von Reck's drawings

The supreme commander of the Yuchi Indian nation, whose name is Kipahalgwa



Indians going a-hunting



An Indian Camp



http://base.kb.dk/manus_pub/cv/manus/ManusPage.xsql?nnoc=manus_pub&p_ManusId=22&p_PageNo=Bind&p_Lang=alt&p_Mode=img


NKS 565 4º: Von Reck's drawings


"In 1736, Philip Georg Friedrich von Reck, then only twentyfive years old, sailed with other colonists from Germany to Georgia. One of his intentions, expressed in a letter before he left Europe, was to bring back from America "ocular proof" of what he called "this strange new world." Idealistic nad enthusiastic, welleducated and blessed with an amazing artistic gift, von Reck kept a travel diary, wrote separate descriptions of the plants, animals and Indians he discovered in Georgia and drew some fifty watercolor and pencil sketches of what he saw. [...]

These drawings, accompanied by von Reck's writings, are important as history, science and art. As history, they give us a new and absolutely unique glimpse of Georgia as it looked when the first Europeans settled there. [...] As science, von Reck's natural history drawings represent the earliest records of several plants and animals. [...] Von Reck's drawings and writings are especially important for the light they shed on Indian life. The drawings show in detail their costumes and equipment, houses and activities. [...] As art, von Reck's drawings are as fresh, intimate and alive on the paper as the day they were drawn."

(Extract from 'Introduction' to VON RECK'S VOYAGE. Drawings and Journal of Philip Georg Friedrich von Reck. Edited by Kristian Hvidt. With the Assistance of Joseph Ewan, George F. Jones and William C. Sturtevant. The Beehive Press, Savannah 1980.)


In this net edition all the aquarelles and drawings in von Reck's sketch book (36,5 x 28,8 cm) and all other drawings in the collection NKS 565 4º have been reproduced. For further information on and description of the drawings and their background the book mentioned above is recommended.


http://base.kb.dk/manus_pub/cv/manus/ManusIntro.xsql?nnoc=manus_pub&p_ManusId=22&p_Lang=alt

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Clyde Winters:
Thanks Mike, I added these pictures to my blog so we can have a resource on Black Native Americans, to combat the racism expressed against us by some Mongoloid Native Americans and Euronuts.

---

That's the idea, we share knowledge.

As I recall, you once theorized that Africa was left behind because they secreted knowledge in secret societies.

Check out this next post.
 

---

Posted by Mike111 (Member # 9361) on :
 


Link to full sized picture.

http://realhistoryww.com./world_history/ancient/Misc/Americas/Yamacraw_Indians.jpg


Examiner: British researchers probe mystery of lost Native American artifact.



It is the Rosetta Stone of North America. The English translation of this hand-painted vellum containing a lost Native American writing system, requires eight printed pages. With the encouragement of His Royal Highness, Charles, Prince of Wales, a search has begun on both sides of the Atlantic to find the original artifact, or at least a copy of the writing system. It has been misplaced for over 230 years.

The year is 1733. Growing increasingly fearful of a combined Spanish, French and Indian attack on its vulnerable white population, the Province of South Carolina agreed to renounce claims on territory southwest of the Savannah River so that a new colony of yeoman farmers could be established on its frontier. Roughly sixty percent of South Carolina’s population was either African or Native American slaves. These suppressed peoples would be highly inclined to assist the French and Spanish.

In 1715, without the direct assistance of European powers, the Yamasee Indians had almost succeeded in wiping the southern part Carolina off the face of the earth. Back then there was no North or South Carolina. A new alliance of tribes in the Carolina Mountains switched sides and attacked the Yamasee just at the moment when Charleston faced annihilation. This alliance was now called the Cherokees.

The new colony, called Georgia in honor of King George I, would have no slaves. Its first town, Savannah, had been designed in advance as a military bastion. Its unique plan maximized the defensive effectiveness of artillery. All males in the colony agreed to be members of the militia in return for being given free land. The colony’s Board of Trustees planned to recruit the thousands of Englishmen in debtor’s prisons, plus German Protestants, being persecuted in Catholic regions, to settle the countryside. Unlike Maryland, Virginia, South and North Carolina, there would be no plantation aristocracy. At least, that was the plan.

The key to this colony’s success would be good relations with the Muskogean peoples of the interior. Prior to the Yamasee War, they had been divided up into provinces of various sizes. The strongest province was itself an alliance known to the British as the Ochese Creek Indians. At about the same time in 1718 that the Mountain Alliance was given the name Cherokees, the Muskogeans formed their own regional confederacy from provinces speaking several languages and dialects.

The Muskogean Confederacy was not a tribe at this time, but would eventually evolve into the Creek Indians. Nevertheless, in 1733, this alliance contained the largest and most culturally advanced indigenous population in North America. It claimed all the former lands of its members, between the Smoky Mountains in North Carolina southward to St. Augustine, FL. Expansion of the Cherokee Alliance into western North Carolina had forced many Muskogean provinces to relocate to Alabama and Georgia. Its members would not be called “the Creek Indians” until the 1740s.

The founding of the Province of Georgia

Savannah was settled in February of 1733 on land given to British Crown by a small Muskogean tribe, known as the Yamacraw. Its leader, Tamachichi (Tomochichi in English) had been banished from Muskogean Confederacy for some unknown incedent. About 1728 Tomochichi created the Yamacraws from an assortment of Muskogean and Yamasee Indians after the two alliances disagreed over future relations with Great Britain and Spain. This Yamacraw village would remain adjacent to Savannah until the American Revolution. Immediately, Tamachichi and Governor James Edward Oglethorpe became close friends.

In November of 1733, Tamachichi invited the highest leaders of the Muskogean Confederacy to Savannah to meet his friend, James Oglethorpe. Tamachichi’s prestigious new status as a close ally of Great Britain brought him reinstatement into the confederacy. British officials were shocked to learn that the Indians in the interior were not one ethnic group, but many peoples with separate histories reaching back over 2,000 years. They were the vestiges of the mound-building era. The leaders agreed to be steadfast allies of Great Britain. The Okonee Province (Ocute in the de Soto Chronicles) agreed to give Oglethorpe all their land that he needed along the Atlantic Coast to establish a healthy colony.

Governor Oglethorpe immediately sent a long letter back to British government that described their new allies, who seemed very different from any Indians that the British had dealt with before. He was astonished that they were skilled in writing, math, astronomy and land surveying without being taught these skills by Europeans. He told the prime minister that he was convinced that these new allies were the descendants an ancient civilization.

The Migration Legend of the Kashita People

Early in 1734 a delegation of Muskogean Confederacy leaders returned to Savannah to confirm their alliance with Oglethorpe. This delegation was lead by Chikili, the war chief of the Palache (Apalache) who formerly lived in the gold fields of the Georgia Mountains, but now lived in the region northwest of Savannah. The highlight of a friendship ceremony was the presentation of a vellum made from a bison calf skin. On this vellum was painted in the Muskogean writing system, the history of the Kas’hita People. They were late arrivals to the Southeast. As Chikili read the vellum, Indian trader, John Musgrove and his beautiful Indian wife, Kusaponakeesa, translated the legend into English, while a notary wrote down the information. The Creek Indian writing system was capable of transmitting all verb tenses and complete thoughts.

The Kashita People called themselves, the Kauche-te, in their Itsate Creek language. They were originally vassals of Kusa, the great town visited by Hernando de Soto in the summer of 1540. At some time in the past, they moved northward to live among the Talasee Creeks in the Smoky Mountains of Tennessee, then moved to an abandoned town site on the Hiwassee River near present-day Murphy, NC. Juan Pardo visited them in the fall of 1567. He called them the Cauche. In their migration legend, the Kashita claim to have sacked a great capital on the side of Georgia’s highest mountain, Brasstown Bald. The Kashita’s description of this town seems to match the Track Rock terrace complex site.

Governor Oglethorpe immediately realized the scientific importance of the Kashita vellum. He dispatched it to England for safe-keeping. It created quite a stir in England. The American Gazetteer newspaper published a full translation and described as written with peculiar red and black characters, not pictures as normally seen on American Indian skin paintings. It reportedly was mounted in a frame on the wall of the Georgia Office in Westminster Palace as long as Georgia was a colony then misplaced. See the following URL for more complete discussions of the Creek Indians’ migration legends: http://www.accessgenealogy.com/native/the-migration-legend-of-the-kashita-people.htm

The on-going research into the cultural connections between the Southeast and Mesoamerica has sparked a renewed interest in the long forgotten bison calf vellum. Tamachichi’s name was Itza Maya. It means “Merchant Dog.” Of particular interest is the statement in contemporary London papers that the Creek Indian’s writing system consisted of “peculiar red and black characters.” During the Terminal Classic and Post-Classic Periods, the Itza Mayas used a simplified Maya writing system consisting of red and black characters. A mineral mined in Georgia was found on the buildings at Palenque, the Classic Period capital of the Itza Mayas in Chiapas.

Clarence House picks up the rugby ball

The premier of American Unearthed on December 21, 2012, about the Creek Indian-Maya connection, had the highest viewership of any program ever watched on History Channel H2. It is now being viewed by people around the world. Intrigued by the research, His Royal Highness, Charles, Prince of Wales, directed one of his personal secretaries at Clarence House to assist in the search for the lost buffalo calf vellum. Clarence House is the official residence of the Prince of Wales and the Duchess of Cornwall.

The staff at Clarence House reported on January 28, 2013 has already turned up some previously unknown details about the lost vellum. Tamachichi and several family members were guests of the Archbishop of Canterbury when they visited England in 1734. His barge was at their disposal. In a ceremony on August 18, 1734 Tamachichi and Governor Oglethorpe formally presented the vellum to Archbishop William Wake at Lambeth Palace. The vellum has been the official property of the Church of England since then. It may be in the church archives rather than in the British Museum.

In a recent conversation with the Friends of Oglethorpe Society, Clarence House official, Grahame Davies, has learned that a Lutheran minister, the Rev. Martin Boltzius, copied portions of the Creek writing system then included them in personal correspondence to Lord Edgemont in England. Boltizius was the leader of the Saltzburger Colony at New Ebenezer, GA. The next step in the research process will require the laborious study of archives held by the Church of England, British Museum, British Government and the James Oglethorpe Room at the Godalming Museum in Surrey, UK. See http://www.exploringsurreyspast.org.uk/themes/places/surrey/waverley/godalming/godalming_westbrook_manor/.

The results of this research could again turn the world of archaeology upside down. American anthropologists have traditionally refused to label the Southeastern Indians as “civilized” because "they did not have a writing system until the early 1800s, when Sequoyah created the Cherokee Syllabary.” There will not be a whole lot that the anthropologists can say, when an official at Clarence House presents the Creek writing system to the world.
 

---

Posted by CelticWarrioress (Member # 19701) on :
 
Sorry Xyyboy, I don't need a GED, I have my diploma thanks. No Whites are NOT a subset of Africans and we are NOT Albinos either (Lioness is right I don't believe the OOA THEORY). White people hating Black racist, Black supremacists such as yourself only use that term to demean, degrade, denigrate, & dehumanize Whites due to your intolerable hatred for us. Especially Whitey haters like you who even state that there is no place on earth that White people belong. You, Clyde, Mike, Narmer, Troll Patrol,Tukuler, etc, are all of the same White people hating, Whites have no right to exist, no place on earth they belong, are inferior,aren't human Black racist, Black supremacist ilk.
 

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Posted by Clyde Winters (Member # 10129) on :
 
The Black Native Americans were not illiterate. Many of these Blacks continued to use the Vai script to write. The Vai script taken to America by the the Malian explorers led by Abubakari in 1310. They left inscriptions across the United States.





There is constant talk about the Cherokee script.



Although a great deal is made of the invention of the script, in reality it is just a modification of the Vai writing that had been used as a written language in America at least since 1310. You can tell the influence of the Malians on Sequoyah or George Guess. You can look at the African influence on Sequoyah by his head dress which is a Turban.

.
 

---

Posted by lamin (Member # 5777) on :
 
Mike, your reply is a blatant non-sequitur. I referenced America's most important and prominent historians of the "black experience" in the U.S. and some of the well-regarded white historians of the same black experience and none of both groups would find any validity in your claims.

Unless you want to call the whole black and white set stupid. Do you think that all those prominent black historians were "stupid". After all, I was just expressing their views vis a vis your very outlandish theories.
 

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Posted by Clyde Winters (Member # 10129) on :
 
DuBois knew there were Black Europeans and Blacks in America before Europeans.

]

.


.
Another great Afro-American historian was Lerone Bennett. In Before the Mayflower, lerone bennett jr describes these first Blacks in America as being kidnapped off the Streets of London and other European cities if I remember correctly.


[/URL]


Portugal and Spain had numerous Blacks rich and poor.



.
 

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Posted by CelticWarrioress (Member # 19701) on :
 
LOL Clyde Mr. White people aren't human, you expect anyone except well your own Whitey hating, Black racist, Black supremacist ilk (Xyyboy, Mike, Narmer, Kdolo, Habsburg,Mena7, Marc, Troll Patrol, etc) to believe what other White people hating, Black racist, Black Supremacists like Dubois, Bennett, Rogers, etc have to say LOL. Only White people hating Black supremacists believe a word you or they say.
 

---

Posted by Habsburg (Member # 21824) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Mike111:

quote:

---

Originally posted by lamin:
Mike your fantasies are just so charmingly amusing. Mike, African America's most prominent scholar is W.E.B. Dubois. Du Bois wrote on the social sciences, history included. Nowhere in his writings does he ever claim that AAs derived from Europe. The same with the AA doyen of history, John Hope Franklin. He has never ever wrote that U.S. blacks derive from any part or section of Europe's population.

The very respected AA historian, the late John Henrik Clarke has never written or found any historical evidence the U.S. blacks--even a minority have any direct connection in Europe. The same with with Chancellor Williams, David Leavering Lewis(biographer of Dubois), Nell Painter, Molefi Asante, and others have never written that U.S. blacks have any connection except by way of white European settler forbears whose genetic imprints may be found among some 10-13% of the U.S. black population.

Even sympathetic white historians such as Eric Foner, David Brion Davis and Eugene Genovese have never wrote that AAs derive from Europe. They have scoured the migration records of European settlement in the U.S. and have never noted anything pointing to blacks entering America from Europe proper.

Mike, all sound theories rest on empirical evidence and your theories--if they are to gain currency in the sense of convincing others--must provide adequate evidence. Otherwise, the consensus would be that your theories are the concoctions of a cranky crackpot. Chew on that Mike, and eat it too.

---

lamin - is the full magnitude of your stupidity dawning on you yet?

---

lamin, I'd like you to look at a map of the Hawaii and note where it is in the middle of the Pacific Ocean.

Then I would like you to ask yourself this question? If Black people could make to that remote location, then whatever stopped them entering Europe, considering that compared with Hawaii, Europe is basically a walk across the park? Note that the Suez Canal which seemingly separates Africa from Europe is an artificial creation and that it is located entirely in Egyptian territory. Elsewhere crossing over by sea is not such a big deal.

Can you think of a reason why the bold and brave ancestors of this attractive young lady managed to migrate to Hawaii, yet never managed to set foot in Europe?


Queen Liliuokalani

The issue is not whether Black people have ever been settled in Europe, but when the population diminished to the point where the notion of Black people ever having been in Europe is met with disbelief. Perhaps it is time to start doing some serious research.

PS. On a side note the people in charge of the trust she left behind don't resemble her, or have names like her. Not unexpected, just noting it.
 

---

Posted by Mike111 (Member # 9361) on :
 
^Now you see my dilemma in determining whether lamin is an Albino fronting Black, in order to disperse false information, or just a really, really stupid African. I use the umbrella term African, because there are a few young Africans like Ra (they say they're Africans) whose thinking is just as laughably stupid. Plus I envision that millions of lamins is why Africa, in general, is so backward.
 

---

Posted by lamin (Member # 5777) on :
 
Habsburg,
Looks like you have fallen for the Mike syndrome disease of the mind.

Let me give you a simple lesson on how the world was peopled over the millenia.

I accept the OOA hypothesis which means that humankind began somewhere in East-Southern Africa some 180-200,000 years ago. The climate was tropical/sub-tropical which produced humans who were adaptive to that African ecology and climate. First, there was migration to all parts of Africa then after 120,000 years or so in Africa some of the groups migrated--of course, they did not know where they were going--out of what is now called Africa.

Some groups traveled due East into Asia then some split off and migrated Northwards into the temperate zones. Other groups migrated northwards in places like Spain, Southern France and Italy. Archeological findings in the Grimaldi area in Italy created much discussion because the "Grimaldi negroids" had phenotypical traits that were characterised as "Negroid"--traits that were seen as distinct from the Neanderthals and the Cro-Magnons.

At that time there was no naming of continents and the very extensive land mass stretching from extreme East Asia to the peninsula now called Europe was the land to which larger groups from Asia settled some 40,000-50,000 years ago. For whatever reasons the Grimaldi types became marginalised and the groups that settled East Asia, Central Asia and Europe multiplied and grew in numbers. More groups migrated into Europe from the Levant and other proximate areas.

These settlements began some 40,000 years ago and lasted till some 15-20,000 years ago. DNA analysis traces these population movements in time.

A crucial point to note is that the flora and fauna of nature are never static. There are always adaptive pressures at work--all within a mix of genetic drift, bottle-necking, selective mating, and the adapting of certain traits to the environment.

It is for this reason that East Asians from North East Asia are genotypically and phenotypically distinct from those populations that adapted to the colder and more variable climates of Europe stretching from 0 degrees GMT to some 90 degrees East.

This is how nature operates: adaptations and mutations all subject to the demands of the environment. It is for this reason that the sabre-tooth tiger eventually gave way to the modern tiger of Asia.

Darwin observed the same natural processes in the Galapagos Islands. The finches there all descended originally from a single type but then over time they differentiated into distinct types. Some species had thin beaks while others had heavier and more robust beaks--all for feeding on different kinds of vegetation. And humans have done the same thing with dogs--all descended from the domesticated wolf.

My point is that over 40,000 years environmental pressures transformed the original African migrants into Eurasia and Europe into populations that are phenotypically and genotypically distinct from those who remained in the tropical and subtropical environments of Africa. It is on this basis that the short-statured Twa from the tall Dinka and Masai. Same for the yellow-coloured Khosian and the very dark Dinka.

In Asia one finds the process at work: A South Asian(Indian) is usually easily distinguishable from a South-East Asian(Thailand, Burma, Laos, etc.)

The Paleo-Asians that crossed the Bering Straits to settle all of North America some 10-15,000 years ago are phenotypically distinct from those that might have migrated in boats from South East Asia.

Have Africans traveled great distances while retaining their original traits notwithstanding evident mutational experiences at the haplogroup level? Yes. Examples are the peoples of the Pacific such as Fijians, Solomon Islanders, New Guineans, and some Polynesians. There are also some marginalised groups in Asia such as the Andaman Islanders and the so-called "Negrito" populations of the Philippines and further South such as Java and parts of Indonesia.

Hope the above brief statement answers your questions.
 

---

Posted by lamin (Member # 5777) on :
 
Mike in his usual myopic and simple-minded fashion fails to see that if we take a time-slice of the last 5,000 years Africa civilisations were the most technically advanced 60% of that time. The Egypto-Nubian complex was at the vanguard of world civilisation from 3,000 BC to the dawn of the AD time span.

And if one take the whole span of human existence which is some 180,000 years, all human civilisation was in Africa until some 50,000 years ago. That's about 70% of the time.

Of course, Africa is now experiencing some serious problems but they will be solved sooner or later with right-thinking minds condemning and seeking to change the ongoing degradation.

It happens too with sports teams, to take a prosaic example. Some teams that are now lowly had their moments of greatness in the past. The successful ones were not always so. That's how time and the material world operates.
 

---

Posted by Habsburg (Member # 21824) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by lamin:
Habsburg,
Looks like you have fallen for the Mike syndrome disease of the mind.

Let me give you a simple lesson on how the world was peopled over the millenia.

I accept the OOA hypothesis which means that humankind began somewhere in East-Southern Africa some 180-200,000 years ago. The climate was tropical/sub-tropical which produced humans who were adaptive to that African ecology and climate. First, there was migration to all parts of Africa then after 120,000 years or so in Africa some of the groups migrated--of course, they did not know where they were going--out of what is now called Africa.
.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by lamin:
Habsburg,
Looks like you have fallen for the Mike syndrome disease of the mind.

Let me give you a simple lesson on how the world was peopled over the millenia.

I accept the OOA hypothesis which means that humankind began somewhere in East-Southern Africa some 180-200,000 years ago. The climate was tropical/sub-tropical which produced humans who were adaptive to that African ecology and climate. First, there was migration to all parts of Africa then after 120,000 years or so in Africa some of the groups migrated--of course, they did not know where they were going--out of what is now called Africa.

Some groups traveled due East into Asia then some split off and migrated Northwards into the temperate zones. Other groups migrated northwards in places like Spain, Southern France and Italy. Archeological findings in the Grimaldi area in Italy created much discussion because the "Grimaldi negroids" had phenotypical traits that were characterised as "Negroid"--traits that were seen as distinct from the Neanderthals and the Cro-Magnons.

At that time there was no naming of continents and the very extensive land mass stretching from extreme East Asia to the peninsula now called Europe was the land to which larger groups from Asia settled some 40,000-50,000 years ago. For whatever reasons the Grimaldi types became marginalised and the groups that settled East Asia, Central Asia and Europe multiplied and grew in numbers. More groups migrated into Europe from the Levant and other proximate areas.

These settlements began some 40,000 years ago and lasted till some 15-20,000 years ago. DNA analysis traces these population movements in time.

A crucial point to note is that the flora and fauna of nature are never static. There are always adaptive pressures at work--all within a mix of genetic drift, bottle-necking, selective mating, and the adapting of certain traits to the environment.

It is for this reason that East Asians from North East Asia are genotypically and phenotypically distinct from those populations that adapted to the colder and more variable climates of Europe stretching from 0 degrees GMT to some 90 degrees East.

This is how nature operates: adaptations and mutations all subject to the demands of the environment. It is for this reason that the sabre-tooth tiger eventually gave way to the modern tiger of Asia.

Darwin observed the same natural processes in the Galapagos Islands. The finches there all descended originally from a single type but then over time they differentiated into distinct types. Some species had thin beaks while others had heavier and more robust beaks--all for feeding on different kinds of vegetation. And humans have done the same thing with dogs--all descended from the domesticated wolf.

My point is that over 40,000 years environmental pressures transformed the original African migrants into Eurasia and Europe into populations that are phenotypically and genotypically distinct from those who remained in the tropical and subtropical environments of Africa. It is on this basis that the short-statured Twa from the tall Dinka and Masai. Same for the yellow-coloured Khosian and the very dark Dinka.

In Asia one finds the process at work: A South Asian(Indian) is usually easily distinguishable from a South-East Asian(Thailand, Burma, Laos, etc.)

The Paleo-Asians that crossed the Bering Straits to settle all of North America some 10-15,000 years ago are phenotypically distinct from those that might have migrated in boats from South East Asia.

Have Africans traveled great distances while retaining their original traits notwithstanding evident mutational experiences at the haplogroup level? Yes. Examples are the peoples of the Pacific such as Fijians, Solomon Islanders, New Guineans, and some Polynesians. There are also some marginalised groups in Asia such as the Andaman Islanders and the so-called "Negrito" populations of the Philippines and further South such as Java and parts of Indonesia.

Hope the above brief statement answers your questions.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Mike111:

It's always painful to watch an idiot attempt to bamboozle with Bullsh1t. Really? Blacks - the strongest, most resilient Humans, just kind of "Faded Away". Now you see my dilemma in determining whether lamin is an Albino fronting Black, in order to disperse false information, or just a really, really stupid African. Who of you can say they know with certainty?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Habsburg:
an article I read makes it clear that most of the present day European population are descended from Africans who left Africa 6000 years ago.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Mike111:


EVER WONDER WHY THE "BLACKFOOT" were called the Blackfoot?

Blackfoot warrior, (Karl Bodmer, between 1840 and 1843)

---

.

^^^ Clyde what is your best guess as to the ancestry of this straight haired person?


.
 

---

Posted by the lioness, (Member # 17353) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Mike111:


P.S. the last of the Moors were driven out of Spain in 1492.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Mike111:


P.S. the last of the Moors were driven out of Spain in 1492.

---

^Mike this statement is wrong, please correct it

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Mike111:


EVER WONDER WHY THE "BLACKFOOT" were called the Blackfoot?

Blackfoot warrior, (Karl Bodmer, between 1840 and 1843)

---

.

Clyde what is your best guess as to the ancestry of this straight haired person?


.

---

Sigh: Surely all of you know that this degenerate Albino bitch knows that Blacks have every kind of hair including straight hair. She is just trolling trying to get a rise. I answer only because some of you may not have seen these pictures.

(Is it just me, or does the look on the eldest daughters face, say that she knows bad things are on the way for them.)





 

---

Posted by Habsburg (Member # 21824) on :
 
Lioness perhaps you could advise this deluded Sudanese girl who considers herself black that she is not.



 

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Posted by CelticWarrioress (Member # 19701) on :
 
Habsblackracist, That **** is fake, you can see the nap underneath it & it looks like dang straw LOL.


Mike stop the crap Whitey hater boy, those people are NOT Black. Dark skinned as most Amerindians are but NOT Black.
 

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Posted by the lioness, (Member # 17353) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Habsburg:
Lioness perhaps you could advise this deluded Sudanese girl who considers herself black that she is not.

---

Are you suggesting this is an African migrant to the Americas like the Olmecs or a Native American?
 

---

Posted by the lioness, (Member # 17353) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Mike111:

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Mike111:


P.S. the last of the Moors were driven out of Spain in 1492.

---

^Mike this statement is wrong, please correct it

---

On 2 January, 1492, Granada was surrendered.


Sigh - dealing with the ignorant is Sooo taxing!

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Clyde Winters:

A Moorish military musician in Berlin by Peter Schenk (c. 1690)

---

Around the time of Moorish occupation if Spain Europeans referred to any Muslim living in Africa as a Moor

After the Moors were driven from Spain Europeans often called any African a "Moor" regardless of the fact that they might not have been North African

The "Moors" never called themselves Moors
It was a European imposed term that came to be used loosely and change meaning in different times and places, other varients terms "Blackamoor" and "Tawny Moor" were also used

The fair skinned Germans had a fetish for "exotic" black Africans i.e. "Moors" and used generic "Moors: as mascot emblems in their heraldry and later blackamoor baubles



http://www.exberliner.com/features/lifestyle/colonial-berlin-in-10-stops/

1. Gröbenufer A slave trader’s street
Start out on the Kreuzberg side of the Oberbaum Bridge. Opposite from Watergate, you’ll find a small street that runs along the Spree. This street was once named after Otto Friedrich von der Gröben. While other Prussians were focused on the army, this 25-year-old aristocrat braved the oceans to reach the Gold Coast (in current-day Ghana) and establish the fort Groß-Friedrichsburg. On January 1, 1683, the screaming red eagle of Brandenburg was raised over African soil.
The Prussians used the fort primarily for slave trading, kidnapping over 20,000 Africans and sending them across the Atlantic. After 35 years, however, Prussia’s soldier king lost interest in colonies and sold the fort to the Dutch West India Company. Gröben might have remained a footnote in German history had his name not been dredged up during the fevered colonial excitement of 1895 when the government honoured him as the founder of Germany’s colonial empire.
2. Mohrenstraße “’Moor’ isn’t an offensive word!”
Long before Hollywood actresses started adopting African babies, 18th-century European royals were enthralled with “court moors”: Africans forced to work as servants. When the Dutch bought Groß-Friedrichsburg, their payment included 12 Gold Coast natives, whom old King Fritz put to work as army musicians. Their barracks in the centre of Berlin inspired the name “Moor Street”.
Many years later, German-African activists are still campaigning to change the outdated racial slur to something less offensive (“Nelson Mandela Street” was one suggestion). Longtime Berliner Yonas Endrias, originally from Eritrea, has spent the past seven years campaigning with the group Berlin Postkolonial, listening as local (white) politicians explain that “moor” is not really a deprecatory word. In February 2009, an unknown individual in a pink bunny suit added two dots to the street signs, thus transforming Racial Epithet Street (Mohrenstraße) into Carrot Street (Möhrenstraße). Clever, right?
 

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Posted by the lioness, (Member # 17353) on :
 

 

---

Posted by Child Of The KING (Member # 9422) on :
 
Mike111 is it alright if I post the picture on my photobucket?
 

---

Posted by Mike111 (Member # 9361) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Child Of The KING:
Mike111 is it alright if I post the picture on my photobucket?

---

Absolutely.
 

---

Posted by Clyde Winters (Member # 10129) on :
 
lamin you are wrong. For thousands of years African/Black sailors were the dominant people on the planet earth.

Researchers have found evidence that Solutrean artifacts have been found on North American sites where Paleo-Native Americans have been found. This has led some researchers to create the so-called Solutrean hypothesis that proposes that ancient America was settled by ancient Europeans.

The proposed Solutrean migration route seems highly unlikely because these early men would have had to brave glaziers and Ice Age tempertures which would have made it impossible to reach North America.




Although a migration from Europe seems highly unlikely 20-30kya because of the Ice Age. Ancient man could have made their way to the Americas directly from Africa which is a shorter distance to the Americas than Europe, and also ancient sailors could have made their way to the Americas on Currents, especially the Gulf Stream, that regularly flow from Africa, to the Americas.




The first Americans Naia, and Luzia dating to 12,000 BC were Negroes



NAIA of Mexico




LUZIA of Brazil

Archaeologist have reconstructed the faces of ancient Americans from Brazil and Mexico. These faces are based on the skeletal remains dating back to 12,000BC.


Researchers agree that the first Americans, Naia of Mexico, Luzia of Brazil and Kennewick Man, found near the Columbia River in Washington, were all Negroes. This finding is not so significant because the first Europeans were also Blacks.



It appears that the first Europeans entered Western Europe across the Straits of Gibraltar. These people were Khoisan. The Khoisan took their art and culture to Europe 40kya. Here they contructed the Aurignacian, Grimaldi and Solutrean cultures. Since the first Europeans had come from North Africa, we also find a Solutrean culture in Africa.

Africa is closer to the Americas than Europe. As you can notice from the map above the Currents could have easily carried the Khoisan from Africa to the Americas. This view is supported by the face that most ancient archaeological sites of paleo-Indian habitation are nearer to the Atlantic Ocean, than the Pacific.



In addition in Africa we find the Dafuna boat. The Dafuna boat has been dated to 8000 B.C., the culture associated with the people who built the Dafuna boat date back to 12,000 BC. This would indicate that around the time Kennewick man, Naia and Luzia inhabited the Americas, Khoisan in Africa had the naval technology to have sailed to the Americas.

In summary , the Solutrean artifacts in the Americas probably relate to Khoisan from Africa sailing to America. The fact that these ancient people in Europe, Africa and the Americas indicate that for a considerable period of time the world was dominated by Black or Negro people.

.
 

---

Posted by lamin (Member # 5777) on :
 

quote:

---

I am not knowledgeable about genetic related theories, and as such I don't keep notes relating to genetic studies, but an article I read makes it clear that most of the present day European population are descended from Africans who left Africa 6000 years ago.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by lamin:

quote:

---

I am not knowledgeable about genetic related theories, and as such I don't keep notes relating to genetic studies, but an article I read makes it clear that most of the present day European population are descended from Africans who left Africa 6000 years ago.

---

1) What is the reference of this article?

2) 6000 years ago would be 4000BC. At that time the Egypto-Nubian complex would have started already and Eurasia would have already been settled.

3) Archaeological and DNA evidence show that the latest pre-written history migration into Europe was some 15-20,000 years ago. That migration came from the region of Asia Minor and the Levant. See "The Daughters of Eve"(Bryan Sykes).

4) The settlement of Eurasia dates from 50,000 BC to 40,000 BC. The Neanderthals were being reduced in numbers around 28,000 BC for whatever reasons but during their time with interactions with Homo Sapiens some of their DNA got passed on to modern Europeans. This is assumed to explain the 4% Neanderthal DNA that some Europeans are assumed to carry.

---

What an Ass, been here since 2004 and is still quoting "The Daughters of Eve" (Bryan Sykes). The Seven Daughters of Eve is a 2001 book by Bryan Sykes that presents the theory of human mitochondrial genetics.

The seven "clan mothers" mentioned by Sykes each correspond to one (or more) human mitochondrial haplogroups.

Ursula: corresponds to Haplogroup U (specifically U5, and excluding its subgroup K)
Xenia: corresponds to Haplogroup X
Helena: corresponds to Haplogroup H
Velda: corresponds to Haplogroup V
Tara: corresponds to Haplogroup T
Katrine: corresponds to Haplogroup K
Jasmine: corresponds to Haplogroup J


Not to mention to the fool that Blacks also carry Neanderthal DNA from wherever Neanderthals existed.
He is such a total idiot that he forgets that the statement is that "All non-Africans" have Neanderthal DNA. The Ass forgets Levant Blacks, Asian Blacks, European Blacks, Pacifican Blacks, and American Blacks.


----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Now some of you might say: well only an Albino would push nonsense like that - which SHOULD be true. But damn if there aren't Africans stupid enough to believe it, and push it also.

For intelligent people, there is this:


http://realhistoryww.com./world_history/ancient/Whites/NG_admits.htm
 

---

Posted by Mike111 (Member # 9361) on :
 
^I am often taken to task for my denigration of Africans. And every time that I start thinking that they may be right - that I am too hard on Africans - they do something else that is totally STUPID!

From my former Hero:

Mugabe Dismisses Male-Female Equality





Anita Powell

January 30, 2015 5:49 AM
JOHANNESBURG—

"It’s not possible that women can be at par with men," said the incoming chairman of the African Union, Zimbabwean President Robert Mugabe. He made the controversial comment in Addis Ababa on the eve the African Union summit, which begins Friday. Many are debating what the 90-year-old leader meant to convey by this statement.

Mugabe's remarks on women not being on par with men, fittingly, come as African Union leaders tackle this year’s summit topic: women’s empowerment.


http://www.voanews.com/content/mugabe-not-possible-that-women-can-be-at-par-with-men/2620347.html


Yes of course, women have built-in impediments to parity. But that is not to say that they are incapable of competence or excellence.

Don't judge women by Lioness or Doxie.
 

---

Posted by Clyde Winters (Member # 10129) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by lamin:

quote:

---

I am not knowledgeable about genetic related theories, and as such I don't keep notes relating to genetic studies, but an article I read makes it clear that most of the present day European population are descended from Africans who left Africa 6000 years ago.

---

1) What is the reference of this article?

2) 6000 years ago would be 4000BC. At that time the Egypto-Nubian complex would have started already and Eurasia would have already been settled.

3) Archaeological and DNA evidence show that the latest pre-written history migration into Europe was some 15-20,000 years ago. That migration came from the region of Asia Minor and the Levant. See "The Daughters of Eve"(Bryan Sykes).

4) The settlement of Eurasia dates from 50,000 BC to 40,000 BC. The Neanderthals were being reduced in numbers around 28,000 BC for whatever reasons but during their time with interactions with Homo Sapiens some of their DNA got passed on to modern Europeans. This is assumed to explain the 4% Neanderthal DNA that some Europeans are assumed to carry.

---

quote:

---

[T]he ‘Classic Aurignacian’ culture probably began in Africa, crossed the Straits of Gibraltar into Iberia, and expanded eastward across Europe. The archaeological record informs us that CroMagnon people carried hg N and replaced the Neanderthal population of the Levant, at Ksar Akil around 32, 000 years ago, not the Natufians who entered the Levant almost 20,000 years later. Moreover, by 7000 BC the dominant haplogroup of Western Eurasians remained hg N1.

The appearance of phylogenetically related sequences of hg L3 present in many ancient Iberian skeletons suggest that this haplogroup may have a long history in Iberia. The fact that hg N came to Iberia with the Cro-Magnon people in Aurignacian times suggest that carries of L3 may have also been part of this population movement.

The mtDNA, skeletal and archaeological record generally, support a third migration event out of Africa before the expansion of the Natufians into the Levant 10,000-20,000 ybp. This third out of Africa event took place between 40-35kya, when modern man crossed from Africa into Iberia carrying haplogroups N and L3, and began to replace Neanderthal as the dominant population in western Eurasia

http://www.webmedcentral.com/article_view/2319

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by lamin:
Clyde,
When you do research in the natural and social sciences one is free to develop whatever theories one thinks fit. But the ultimate test is the robustness and evidence of the theories. Hypotheses remain just hypotheses unless they can be show to be empirically valid.

You see to go on the assumption that nature is static and that floral and faunal biological nature--of which humans are a part--are not subject to the principles of biological evolution. Genotypical and phenotypical mutations are what explain the rich variety found in any number of species.

I have seen Asian Indians, Chinese, Europeans, West Asian Arabs in Africa and have carefully noted their phenotypes. They look that way because the original African type had to adapt to new environments plus factors such as genetic drift, assorted mating, expressing their influence. Asian Indians no matter how dark--I have seen some in Africa--are never mistaken for Africans--even in North Africa. The same for East Asians and Lebanese--who may be migrants to North Africa over the last centuries but are distinct in phenotype from indigenous North Africans.

I have also seen Native Americans up close in visits to the U.S. and they do seem to have affinity with East Asians especially by the hair and other features. Except in cases of admixtures they are easily distinguishable from the generic black and white person. This is empirical observation, Clyde.

It is a fact that skulls and crania distinct from the the larger populations have been found in the Americas--Luzia and Kennewick man, for example--the general and larger indigenous populations are claimed to be phnotypically distinct, hence the very noted interest in the origins of these 2 crania.

It is claimed that mutations take place every 10,000 years but they are manifest only at the DNA level. The importance of DNA analysis is that it shows up things like "most recent common ancestor" and the separation time between peoples. But it is the environment and climate that determine the phenotype of populations. Thus while Fijians, New Guineans(hence the name imposed on them by Europeans when they first saw them), Andaman Islanders, etc. strongly resemble Africans, their separation time from Africa may be longer than for peoples who who do not share the African phenotype--North East Asians, Europeans, etc.

Clyde, the point is that humans began as Africans but have changed over the millenia due to the genetic and environmental reasons given above. The time it too to effect such changes are some 40 tom 50,000 years ago--especially when climatic change is factored in.

Humans have proven that point when they artificially bred to wolf to produce totally un-wolf like looking dogs like the Chow and the Poodle.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by lamin:

quote:

---

I am not knowledgeable about genetic related theories, and as such I don't keep notes relating to genetic studies, but an article I read makes it clear that most of the present day European population are descended from Africans who left Africa 6000 years ago.

---

1) What is the reference of this article?

2) 6000 years ago would be 4000BC. At that time the Egypto-Nubian complex would have started already and Eurasia would have already been settled.

3) Archaeological and DNA evidence show that the latest pre-written history migration into Europe was some 15-20,000 years ago. That migration came from the region of Asia Minor and the Levant. See "The Daughters of Eve"(Bryan Sykes).

4) The settlement of Eurasia dates from 50,000 BC to 40,000 BC. The Neanderthals were being reduced in numbers around 28,000 BC for whatever reasons but during their time with interactions with Homo Sapiens some of their DNA got passed on to modern Europeans. This is assumed to explain the 4% Neanderthal DNA that some Europeans are assumed to carry.

---

quote:

---

What an Ass, been here since 2004 and is still quoting "The Daughters of Eve" (Bryan Sykes). The Seven Daughters of Eve is a 2001 book by Bryan Sykes that presents the theory of human mitochondrial genetics.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by lamin:
Mike, if you believe that Sykes's work is problematic then show some contrary evidence.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Mike111:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Child Of The KING:
Mike111 is it alright if I post the picture on my photobucket?

---

Absolutely.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Mike111:

quote:

---

Originally posted by lamin:
Mike, if you believe that Sykes's work is problematic then show some contrary evidence.

---

You dumb bastard, what do you think the attached link is?

http://realhistoryww.com./world_history/ancient/Whites/NG_admits.htm

Sorry folks, if you give idiot trolls respect, they see it as a reason to do more of same.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Mike111:

quote:

---

Originally posted by lamin:
Mike, if you believe that Sykes's work is problematic then show some contrary evidence.

---

You dumb bastard, what do you think the attached link is?

http://realhistoryww.com./world_history/ancient/Whites/NG_admits.htm

Sorry folks, if you give idiot trolls respect, they see it as a reason to do more of same.

---

quote:

---

DNA recovered from ancient skeletons reveals that the genetic makeup of modern Europe was established around 4,500 B.C. in the mid-Neolithic—or 6,500 years ago—and not by the first farmers who arrived in the area around 7,500 years ago or by earlier hunter-gatherer groups...


Archeologists call these first Central European farmers the linear pottery culture (LBK)

The details of this "genetic turnover" event are murky. Scientists don't know what prompted it, or even where the new colonizers came from. "The extent or nature of this genetic turnover are not clear, and we don't know how widespread it is," Cooper said. If this turnover were widespread, it could have been prompted by climate change or disease, he said. "All we know is that the descendants of the LBK farmers disappeared from Central Europe about 4,500 [B.C.], clearing the way for the rise of populations from elsewhere, with their own unique H signatures."

Peter Bogucki, an archeologist at Princeton University who has studied early farming societies in Europe, called the finding "really interesting" and noted the timing of the genetic turnover is curious. "At the end of the fifth millennium—[about] 4,000 B.C.—there are a lot of changes in the archeological record,"

---

quote:

---

About 7,500 years ago during the early Neolithic period, another wave of humans expanded into Europe, this time from the Middle East. They carried in their genes a variant of the H haplogroup, and in their minds knowledge of how to grow and raise crops.

---

quote:

---

The first modern humans to reach Europe arrived from Africa 35,000 to 40,000 years ago. By about 30,000 years ago, they were widespread throughout the area while their close cousins, the Neanderthals, disappeared. Hardly any of these early hunter-gatherers carried the H haplogroup in their DNA.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:
[Q] [QUOTE]---6,500 years ago, to the present (aka 4,500 B.C. - present)
the Middle East farmers were replaced by people whowere also of Haplogroup H DNA but different sub-clades of of it.
These people adopted farming from the farmers but also went on to develop cities, cathedrals, the Renaissance, the Industrial Revolution and the present electronic age of today [/QB]

---

quote:

---

"Moor" may have derived from Mbo.

---

quote:

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Originally posted by xyyman:
Are you a white male? "Lioness" the modern European MALE line were NOT, NOT, NOT farmers! Can you stop it. They are Medieval Age immigrants. Not even Richard 111 (15century CE), a Royal, was R1b-M269. But yes, they are in position of power now in the electronic age.

Please stop the BS.

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Originally posted by the lioness,:
[Q] [QUOTE]---6,500 years ago, to the present (aka 4,500 B.C. - present)
the Middle East farmers were replaced by people whowere also of Haplogroup H DNA but different sub-clades of of it.
These people adopted farming from the farmers but also went on to develop cities, cathedrals, the Renaissance, the Industrial Revolution and the present electronic age of today

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[/QB]

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Originally posted by CelticWarrioress:
Mike yep I keep reposting the same questions & I will continue to post them until I get an answer. I want to know why.

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Originally posted by lamin:

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In addition to what you suggested I would also recommend The West And The Rest of Us- Chienweizu. To understand the economics of the world we live in.

"West and the Rest of Us: White Predators, Black Slavers and the African Elite"

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All these books are interesting but the issue is how to put their ideas into practice.

Chinweizu is from Nigeria, but if you ask any random sample of, say, 1,000 Nigerian university students no more than 1%-if that much--would have ever heard of him or read him. That's where the problem is. The ideas of the named "Great Books" authors are very, very minimally disseminated. And Nigeria's population is now 180 million.

The majority of that big population are more enthralled by the Bible and the Qur'an instead of ideas that speak much better to their condition. The Bible is about the traditional folklore of the Hebrew/Jewsish people in the Old Testament and the life of a Jewish carpenter/rabbi in the New Testament. The Qur'an is essentially a compiled plagiarism of the Jewish/Christian Bible with an overlay of Arab cultural fascisms. One must be genuinely puzzled as to why Africans/blacks find the content of these 2 books so appealing.


It could be that for most people the selling of ideas has to come with a set of rituals and a place where such rituals are to be performed. For Christians regular prayer in a Church, the Christian ritual house, plus ritual events such as baptisms, marriages, and burials keep the minds of the devotees concentrated. For Muslims minds are kept regularly on target with constant prayer and washing(5 times daily), with regular attendance at the masjid(mosque)plus the other requirements shared with the Christians. And all kinds of rules must be followed--from eating to the toilet.

Maybe authors like Fanon and Diop need ritual houses--but said with "tongue in cheek".

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Originally posted by the lioness,:

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Originally posted by xyyman:
Are you a white male? "Lioness" the modern European MALE line were NOT, NOT, NOT farmers! Can you stop it. They are Medieval Age immigrants. Not even Richard 111 (15century CE), a Royal, was R1b-M269. But yes, they are in position of power now in the electronic age.

Please stop the BS.

quote:

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Originally posted by the lioness,:
[Q] [QUOTE]---6,500 years ago, to the present (aka 4,500 B.C. - present)
the Middle East farmers were replaced by people whowere also of Haplogroup H DNA but different sub-clades of of it.
These people adopted farming from the farmers but also went on to develop cities, cathedrals, the Renaissance, the Industrial Revolution and the present electronic age of today

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Again for the thick, according to the article on Mike's webiste

http://realhistoryww.com./world_history/ancient/Whites/NG_admits.htm


the chronology of the article

A) 45,000 years ago - 7,500 years ago
FIRST EUROPEAN HUNTER GATHERERS

--replaced by >>>

B) 7,500 years ago - 6,500 years ago,
FARMERS FROM THE MIDDLE EAST
DNA Haplogroup H

---replaced by >>>

C) 6,500 years ago, to the present
(aka 4,500 B.C. - present)
MODERN EUROPEANS
also Haplogroup H but different sub-clades from the farmers


got it ???

I said the same thing before [/QB]

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