quote:

---

Originally posted by Njii:

Archeogenticists

These are scholars that combine archeology and linguistics in genetics from an African centered prospective and seek to understand genetic data from the perspective of the original African blueprint of humanity. [/QB]

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Njii:
Upon following various blogs and videos I have noticed 3 streams of thought among black people when analyzing and interpreting genetic data. Although many black people all around the world are beginning to learn about how fraudulent and conjecture based most European and Eurocentric papers on genetics are. There are still a large group of black people that take everything that Europeans interpret at face value. For me this group is comprises the first stream of thought.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Mike111:
He,he,he: Of which generation are you - Millennial Generation or Generation Y, X, or Generation Z?

Interesting though, that you put time and effort into categorizing various thinking on genetics by the simple-minded, but show no effort to provide insight into the actual discipline, or it's nefarious uses.

As an example;
You were correct in deriding the nonsense Albino back-migration claims about Y-dna "R". But you made no effort to explain why it was Albino nonsense.

It seems to me that people would have better use for that knowledge, than they do for how many categories there is.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Njii:


The "We Aint African" Crowd

This stream consists of self hating black people who believe that genetics is a hoax because it connects African American people to African people. They hate Africa and African people because they believe that Africa has no redeeming qualities no civilizations, no writing, no culture of horse domestication, no culture of inventing the wheel, no burial rites, and no agricultural technology. This stream of thought is usually connected to religious and social ideological movements in the US such as the Moors and the Hebrew Isrealites or other groups with anti African motives, views, and opinions. Ultimately the hatred of all things African and ignorance of African history is what leads this stream of thought to take their position against modern mainstream genetics.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Njii:
Upon following various blogs and videos I have noticed 3 streams of thought among black people when analyzing and interpreting genetic data. Although many black people all around the world are beginning to learn about how fraudulent and conjecture based most European and Eurocentric papers on genetics are. There are still a large group of black people that take everything that Europeans interpret at face value. For me this group is comprises the first stream of thought.

These are scholars that combine archeology and linguistics in genetics from an African centered prospective and seek to understand genetic data from the perspective of the original African blueprint of humanity.

---

Well analyzed.


Archaeogenetics: The study of the past using the techniques of molecular genetics. The application of genetics to archeology. The term "archaeogenetics" was coined in the 1990s by the archeologist Colin Renfrew from the Greek archaios (ancient) + genetics = archaeogenetics, literally, ancient genetics.

In archaeogenetics, information on the DNA of different ethnic groups from around the world is used to analyze prehistoric events and corroborate accounts from historical sources. The DNA data are reconciled with the findings of archeologists, linguists, and paleoanthropologists to shed light on the past.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Njii:


Eurocentrists.....


This stream of thought mainly uses genetics for two main reasons:

1. To seem updated with the latest information coming out of Eurocentric universities.

2. To combat social ideological enemies that they consider are toxic to the legacy of African people; mainly Hebrew Isrealites and Moors. They use Genetic data to try to debunk the beliefs of these ideologues.

---

So the second reason that Eurocentrics use genetics is to combat social ideological enemies that they consider are toxic to the legacy of African people; mainly Hebrew Isrealites and Moors. They use Genetic data to try to debunk the beliefs of these ideologues.


^ So Eurocentrics want to remove the toxicity to the legacy of the African people

and they want to combat Hebrew Isrealites and Moors


Ish Gebor you are calling this a good analysis ????
 

---

Posted by zarahan- aka Enrique Cardova (Member # 15718) on :
 
3. Archeology and Linguistics have little to no bearing on analysis of genetic data

This seems rather dubious- another strawman set up to later
"refute" as to what the alleged "Afrocentrics believe"?

Precisely what Eurocentric academics think Archeology and Linguistics
have little to no bearing on analysis of genetic data?
To the contrary they often try to shoehorn archaeology and linguistic
data into their genetic constructs. Some of their attempt fail,
but not for lack of trying. Cavalli-Sforza's Genes,
People, Language is a classic example and he tried
to work in archaeo and linguistic data aplenty. So where are
these reputed "Eurocentrcs" who say it has "no bearing"?


So the second reason that Eurocentrics use genetics is to combat social ideological enemies
that they consider are toxic to the legacy of African people; mainly Hebrew Isrealites and Moors. They use Genetic data to try to debunk the beliefs of these ideologues.

Equally dubious. "Genetic data" is not needed to debunk notions
about black "Hee-brew Israelites" originating in ancient West Africa.
It doesn't even pass the smell test with basic historic and archaeo
data. Likewise exactly what "genetic data" supposedly "combats"
that some Moors were from North Africa and that among
them were persons with common DNA markers found in African populations?
XYZ's posted studies on the Iberian peninsula's profile on into the
historic era confirm the case. So exactly what does alleged
genetic data "combat" as to these two items?

Archeogenticists
These are scholars that combine archeology and linguistics in genetics from an African centered prospective and seek to understand genetic data from the perspective of the original African blueprint of humanity.

^^This is shaky too for many so-called "archaeogenticists" are
not operating from any African centered perspective, and
are manipulating data and models to maintain stereotypical racial
constructs. Cavalli-Sforza again is a classic example.
He is a legit scholar with some credible info but
also falls into certain stereotypical thinking traps.
Some in this alleged stream of archaeogenetic thought are very Eurocentric.
The article below debunks notions of "archaeogenticists"
necessarily providing any more balanced treatment of Africa and Africans.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10768880

Curr Anthropol. 2000 Jun;41(3):357-384.
Genes, Tribes, and African History.
MacEachern S.
Abstract

Over the past 40 years, traditional perspectives on the constitution of human groups have been subjected to stringent critique within anthropology. This began with the dismantling of accepted "race" divisions after World War II and continued with analyses of the meaning and reality of African "tribal" distinctions from the 1960s until the present. Archaeologists, ethnographers, linguists, and historians of Africa now work within a research milieu where social interactions, cultural exchange, and the dynamic nature of group identifications are accepted as a normal part of the human experience. At the same time, new techniques have been developed for the examination of human history, techniques based upon an expanding repertoire of tools for the analysis of genetic variability in human populations. Perhaps the most striking result of this research has been Cavalli-Sforza, Menozzi, and Piazza's The History and Geography of Human Genes. Rather less attention has been paid, however, to the conceptual relationships between the human groups defined through such analyses, in Africa and elsewhere, and those defined through other kinds of research. This paper is a preliminary examination of the fit between genetic, archaeological, and ethnographic data on the African past."




^^ANd there are plenty of archaeogenetic games being played
with Africa and Africans..
 

---

Posted by the lioness, (Member # 17353) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by zarahan- aka Enrique Cardova:


Equally dubious. "Genetic data" is not needed to debunk notions
about black "Hee-brew Israelites" originating in ancient West Africa.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Njii:
Upon following various blogs and videos I have noticed 3 streams of thought among black people when analyzing and interpreting genetic data. Although many black people all around the world are beginning to learn about how fraudulent and conjecture based most European and Eurocentric papers on genetics are. There are still a large group of black people that take everything that Europeans interpret at face value. For me this group is comprises the first stream of thought.

These are scholars that combine archeology and linguistics in genetics from an African centered prospective and seek to understand genetic data from the perspective of the original African blueprint of humanity.

---

Well analyzed.


Archaeogenetics: The study of the past using the techniques of molecular genetics. The application of genetics to archeology. The term "archaeogenetics" was coined in the 1990s by the archeologist Colin Renfrew from the Greek archaios (ancient) + genetics = archaeogenetics, literally, ancient genetics.

In archaeogenetics, information on the DNA of different ethnic groups from around the world is used to analyze prehistoric events and corroborate accounts from historical sources. The DNA data are reconciled with the findings of archeologists, linguists, and paleoanthropologists to shed light on the past.

---

why are you saying it's well analyzed when none of the people identifying themselves as archaeogeneticists including the originator of the term Colin Renfrew say that they have an "African centered prospective "

Stop being stupid and cheerleading without thinking

quote:

---

Originally posted by Njii:


Eurocentrists.....


This stream of thought mainly uses genetics for two main reasons:

1. To seem updated with the latest information coming out of Eurocentric universities.

2. To combat social ideological enemies that they consider are toxic to the legacy of African people; mainly Hebrew Isrealites and Moors. They use Genetic data to try to debunk the beliefs of these ideologues.

---

So the second reason that Eurocentrics use genetics is to combat social ideological enemies that they consider are toxic to the legacy of African people; mainly Hebrew Isrealites and Moors. They use Genetic data to try to debunk the beliefs of these ideologues.


^ So Eurocentrics want to remove the toxicity to the legacy of the African people

and they want to combat Hebrew Isrealites and Moors


Ish Gebor you are calling this a good analysis ????

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Njii:
Upon following various blogs and videos I have noticed 3 streams of thought among black people when analyzing and interpreting genetic data. Although many black people all around the world are beginning to learn about how fraudulent and conjecture based most European and Eurocentric papers on genetics are. There are still a large group of black people that take everything that Europeans interpret at face value. For me this group is comprises the first stream of thought.

These are scholars that combine archeology and linguistics in genetics from an African centered prospective and seek to understand genetic data from the perspective of the original African blueprint of humanity.

---

Well analyzed.


Archaeogenetics: The study of the past using the techniques of molecular genetics. The application of genetics to archeology. The term "archaeogenetics" was coined in the 1990s by the archeologist Colin Renfrew from the Greek archaios (ancient) + genetics = archaeogenetics, literally, ancient genetics.

In archaeogenetics, information on the DNA of different ethnic groups from around the world is used to analyze prehistoric events and corroborate accounts from historical sources. The DNA data are reconciled with the findings of archeologists, linguists, and paleoanthropologists to shed light on the past.

---

why are you saying it's well analyzed when none of the people identifying themselves as archaeogeneticists including the originator of the term Colin Renfrew say that they have an "African centered prospective "

Stop being stupid and cheerleading without thinking

quote:

---

Originally posted by Njii:


Eurocentrists.....


This stream of thought mainly uses genetics for two main reasons:

1. To seem updated with the latest information coming out of Eurocentric universities.

2. To combat social ideological enemies that they consider are toxic to the legacy of African people; mainly Hebrew Isrealites and Moors. They use Genetic data to try to debunk the beliefs of these ideologues.

---

So the second reason that Eurocentrics use genetics is to combat social ideological enemies that they consider are toxic to the legacy of African people; mainly Hebrew Isrealites and Moors. They use Genetic data to try to debunk the beliefs of these ideologues.


^ So Eurocentrics want to remove the toxicity to the legacy of the African people

and they want to combat Hebrew Isrealites and Moors


Ish Gebor you are calling this a good analysis ????

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by zarahan- aka Enrique Cardova:
What's your theory?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Mike111:
He,he,he: Of which generation are you - Millennial Generation or Generation Y, X, or Generation Z?

Interesting though, that you put time and effort into categorizing various thinking on genetics by the simple-minded, but show no effort to provide insight into the actual discipline, or it's nefarious uses.

As an example;
You were correct in deriding the nonsense Albino back-migration claims about Y-dna "R". But you made no effort to explain why it was Albino nonsense.

It seems to me that people would have better use for that knowledge, than they do for how many categories there is.

---

Some people left Africa

for some reason some people think it was impossible for people to go back into Africa, go figure

quote:

---

Originally posted by Njii:


The "We Aint African" Crowd

This stream consists of self hating black people who believe that genetics is a hoax because it connects African American people to African people. They hate Africa and African people because they believe that Africa has no redeeming qualities no civilizations, no writing, no culture of horse domestication, no culture of inventing the wheel, no burial rites, and no agricultural technology. This stream of thought is usually connected to religious and social ideological movements in the US such as the Moors and the Hebrew Isrealites or other groups with anti African motives, views, and opinions. Ultimately the hatred of all things African and ignorance of African history is what leads this stream of thought to take their position against modern mainstream genetics.

---

Ok I do see people like that.

I wonder who he's talking about. Mike, any ideas?
I was thinking of one particular website, the name escapes me

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by zarahan- aka Enrique Cardova:
3. Archeology and Linguistics have little to no bearing on analysis of genetic data

This seems rather dubious- another strawman set up to later
"refute" as to what the alleged "Afrocentrics believe"?

Precisely what Eurocentric academics think Archeology and Linguistics
have little to no bearing on analysis of genetic data?
To the contrary they often try to shoehorn archaeology and linguistic
data into their genetic constructs. Some of their attempt fail,
but not for lack of trying. Cavalli-Sforza's Genes,
People, Language is a classic example and he tried
to work in archaeo and linguistic data aplenty. So where are
these reputed "Eurocentrcs" who say it has "no bearing"?


So the second reason that Eurocentrics use genetics is to combat social ideological enemies
that they consider are toxic to the legacy of African people; mainly Hebrew Isrealites and Moors. They use Genetic data to try to debunk the beliefs of these ideologues.

Equally dubious. "Genetic data" is not needed to debunk notions
about black "Hee-brew Israelites" originating in ancient West Africa.
It doesn't even pass the smell test with basic historic and archaeo
data. Likewise exactly what "genetic data" supposedly "combats"
that some Moors were from North Africa and that among
them were persons with common DNA markers found in African populations?
XYZ's posted studies on the Iberian peninsula's profile on into the
historic era confirm the case. So exactly what does alleged
genetic data "combat" as to these two items?

Archeogenticists
These are scholars that combine archeology and linguistics in genetics from an African centered prospective and seek to understand genetic data from the perspective of the original African blueprint of humanity.

^^This is shaky too for many so-called "archaeogenticists" are
not operating from any African centered perspective, and
are manipulating data and models to maintain stereotypical racial
constructs. Cavalli-Sforza again is a classic example.
He is a legit scholar with some credible info but
also falls into certain stereotypical thinking traps.
Some in this alleged stream of archaeogenetic thought are very Eurocentric.
The article below debunks notions of "archaeogenticists"
necessarily providing any more balanced treatment of Africa and Africans.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10768880

Curr Anthropol. 2000 Jun;41(3):357-384.
Genes, Tribes, and African History.
MacEachern S.
Abstract

Over the past 40 years, traditional perspectives on the constitution of human groups have been subjected to stringent critique within anthropology. This began with the dismantling of accepted "race" divisions after World War II and continued with analyses of the meaning and reality of African "tribal" distinctions from the 1960s until the present. Archaeologists, ethnographers, linguists, and historians of Africa now work within a research milieu where social interactions, cultural exchange, and the dynamic nature of group identifications are accepted as a normal part of the human experience. At the same time, new techniques have been developed for the examination of human history, techniques based upon an expanding repertoire of tools for the analysis of genetic variability in human populations. Perhaps the most striking result of this research has been Cavalli-Sforza, Menozzi, and Piazza's The History and Geography of Human Genes. Rather less attention has been paid, however, to the conceptual relationships between the human groups defined through such analyses, in Africa and elsewhere, and those defined through other kinds of research. This paper is a preliminary examination of the fit between genetic, archaeological, and ethnographic data on the African past."




^^ANd there are plenty of archaeogenetic games being played
with Africa and Africans..

---

quote:

---

Format: AbstractSend to
Curr Anthropol. 2000 Jun;41(3):357-384.
Genes, Tribes, and African History.
MacEachern S.
Abstract
Over the past 40 years, traditional perspectives on the constitution of human groups have been subjected to stringent critique within anthropology. This began with the dismantling of accepted "race" divisions after World War II and continued with analyses of the meaning and reality of African "tribal" distinctions from the 1960s until the present. Archaeologists, ethnographers, linguists, and historians of Africa now work within a research milieu where social interactions, cultural exchange, and the dynamic nature of group identifications are accepted as a normal part of the human experience. At the same time, new techniques have been developed for the examination of human history, techniques based upon an expanding repertoire of tools for the analysis of genetic variability in human populations. Perhaps the most striking result of this research has been Cavalli-Sforza, Menozzi, and Piazza's The History and Geography of Human Genes. Rather less attention has been paid, however, to the conceptual relationships between the human groups defined through such analyses, in Africa and elsewhere, and those defined through other kinds of research. This paper is a preliminary examination of the fit between genetic, archaeological, and ethnographic data on the African past.

---

quote:

---

Bayesian probability is one interpretation of the concept of probability. In contrast to interpreting probability as the "frequency" or "propensity" of some phenomenon, Bayesian probability is a quantity that we assign for the purpose of representing a state of knowledge, or a state of belief.

---

This means that researchers using Bayesian statistics are just confirming what they already believe. As a result, when Eurocentrist, and 'go-along' AA geneticist make claims about the phylogeography of Afro-Americans and Africans their results are going to be biased, an infer that Black people are isolated and retricted to Africa; and that if black haplogroups appear outside Africa they are the result of slavery.

Archaeogenetics is the only way you can support any hypothesis relating to population migrations and admixture studies.

Ray and Excoffier argue that to build a reliable model of population dispersal researchers must combine genetic data and archaeological (or historical and linguistic) data . Using the method of research advocated by Ray and Excoffier demands that we reconsider the origin of the Dravidian and Aryan populations of India.
The methods of Ray and Excoffier are in conformity with basic archaeogenetic research methods. The Archaeogenetic method suggest that coupling the archaeological data with genetic data is a powerful way to infer population migration .

In summary you don't know what you're talking about. Bayesian studies discriminate against Blacks, not archaeogenetics. Bayesian just confirm every evidence of Black genes outside Africa, date to the European spread of African people during slavery.It is due to archaeogenetics that we can prove/confirm that the Paleoamericans and first Europeans were Black.

.
 

---

Posted by Evil Troll (Member # 22491) on :
 




[ 29. July 2016, 01:30 PM: Message edited by: ausar ]
 

---

Posted by Njii (Member # 21985) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Mike111:
He,he,he: Of which generation are you - Millennial Generation or Generation Y, X, or Generation Z?

Interesting though, that you put time and effort into categorizing various thinking on genetics by the simple-minded, but show no effort to provide insight into the actual discipline, or it's nefarious uses.

As an example;
You were correct in deriding the nonsense Albino back-migration claims about Y-dna "R". But you made no effort to explain why it was Albino nonsense.

It seems to me that people would have better use for that knowledge, than they do for how many categories there is.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Njii:


Archeogeneticists:

Due to the diversity of the RV88 branch of R in Central Africa and the historical migration patterns of African people into Europe that is seen in the archeological record, it is safe to assume that R originated in Africa and was spread to Europe. [/QB]

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Njii:


Archeogeneticists:

Due to the diversity of the RV88 branch of R in Central Africa and the historical migration patterns of African people into Europe that is seen in the archeological record, it is safe to assume that R originated in Africa and was spread to Europe.

---

No peer reviewed scientific article says that R originated in Africa.
Archeogeneticists have analyzerd 24,000 year old human remains carrying R found in Siberia ( the Mal'ta boy)

RV88 ( R1b1c ) as well as R1b and R2 are subclades of R which came later. They are variant mutations, splits from of the R* parent ancestor

RV88 originates in the Cameroon and part of Chad region and is dated 9200–5600 years old.

So what you are saying is 100% wrong Archeogeneticists and Eurcentrists both believe haplogroup R originates in Eurasia

there is no term for a "black genetics paradigm"

---

quote:

---

‘‘Out of Africa’’ haplogroups.

All Y-clades that are not exclusively African belong to the macro-haplogroup CT, which is defined by mutations M168, M294 and P9.1 [14,31] and is subdivided into two major clades, DE and CF [1,14].

In a recent study [16], sequencing of two chromosomes belonging to haplogroups C and R, led to the identification of 25 new mutations, eleven of which were in the C-chromosome and seven in the R-chromosome.

Here, the seven mutations which were found to be shared by chromosomes of haplogroups C and R [16], were also found to be present in one DE sample (sample 33 in Table S1), and positioned at the root of macro-haplogroup CT (Figure 1 and Figure S1)

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3492319/figure/pone-0049170-g001/

Figure S1

Structure of the macro-haplogroup CT. For details on mutations see legend to Figure 1. Dashed lines indicate putative branchings (no positive control available). The position of V248 (haplogroup C2) and V87 (haplogroup C3) compared to mutations that define internal branches was not determined. Note that mutations V45, V69 and V88 have been previously mapped (Cruciani et al. 2010; Eur J Hum Genet 18∶800–807).

(TIF)

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3492319/bin/pone.0049170.s001.tif

---

quote:

---

This branching pattern, along with the geographical distribution of the major clades A, B, and CT, has been interpreted as supporting an African origin for anatomically modern humans,10 with Khoisan from south Africa and Ethiopians from east Africa sharing the deepest lineages of the phylogeny.15 and 16

[...]



The deepest branching separates A1b from a monophyletic clade whose members (A1a, A2, A3, B, C, and R) all share seven mutually reinforcing derived mutations (five transitions and two transversions, all at non-CpG sites).

[...]



How does the present MSY tree compare with the backbone of the recently published “reference” MSY phylogeny?13 The phylogenetic relationships we observed among chromosomes belonging to haplogroups B, C, and R are reminiscent of those reported in the tree by Karafet et al.13 These chromosomes belong to a clade (haplogroup BT) in which chromosomes C and R share a common ancestor (Figure 2).

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Njii:
Upon following various blogs and videos I have noticed 3 streams of thought among black people when analyzing and interpreting genetic data. Although many black people all around the world are beginning to learn about how fraudulent and conjecture based most European and Eurocentric papers on genetics are. There are still a large group of black people that take everything that Europeans interpret at face value. For me this group is comprises the first stream of thought.

These are scholars that combine archeology and linguistics in genetics from an African centered prospective and seek to understand genetic data from the perspective of the original African blueprint of humanity.

---

Well analyzed.


Archaeogenetics: The study of the past using the techniques of molecular genetics. The application of genetics to archeology. The term "archaeogenetics" was coined in the 1990s by the archeologist Colin Renfrew from the Greek archaios (ancient) + genetics = archaeogenetics, literally, ancient genetics.

In archaeogenetics, information on the DNA of different ethnic groups from around the world is used to analyze prehistoric events and corroborate accounts from historical sources. The DNA data are reconciled with the findings of archeologists, linguists, and paleoanthropologists to shed light on the past.

---

why are you saying it's well analyzed when none of the people identifying themselves as archaeogeneticists including the originator of the term Colin Renfrew say that they have an "African centered prospective "

Stop being stupid and cheerleading without thinking

quote:

---

Originally posted by Njii:


Eurocentrists.....


This stream of thought mainly uses genetics for two main reasons:

1. To seem updated with the latest information coming out of Eurocentric universities.

2. To combat social ideological enemies that they consider are toxic to the legacy of African people; mainly Hebrew Isrealites and Moors. They use Genetic data to try to debunk the beliefs of these ideologues.

---

So the second reason that Eurocentrics use genetics is to combat social ideological enemies that they consider are toxic to the legacy of African people; mainly Hebrew Isrealites and Moors. They use Genetic data to try to debunk the beliefs of these ideologues.


^ So Eurocentrics want to remove the toxicity to the legacy of the African people

and they want to combat Hebrew Isrealites and Moors


Ish Gebor you are calling this a good analysis ????

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Njii:


Archeogeneticists:

Due to the diversity of the RV88 branch of R in Central Africa and the historical migration patterns of African people into Europe that is seen in the archeological record, it is safe to assume that R originated in Africa and was spread to Europe.

---

No peer reviewed scientific article says that R originated in Africa.
Archeogeneticists have analyzerd 24,000 year old human remains carrying R found in Siberia ( the Mal'ta boy)

RV88 ( R1b1c ) as well as R1b and R2 are subclades of R which came later. They are variant mutations, splits from of the R* parent ancestor

RV88 originates in the Cameroon and part of Chad region and is dated 9200–5600 years old.

So what you are saying is 100% wrong Archeogeneticists and Eurcentrists both believe haplogroup R originates in Eurasia

there is no term for a "black genetics paradigm" [/QB]

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Njii:


Archeogeneticists:

Due to the diversity of the RV88 branch of R in Central Africa and the historical migration patterns of African people into Europe that is seen in the archeological record, it is safe to assume that R originated in Africa and was spread to Europe.

---

No peer reviewed scientific article says that R originated in Africa.
Archeogeneticists have analyzerd 24,000 year old human remains carrying R found in Siberia ( the Mal'ta boy)

RV88 ( R1b1c ) as well as R1b and R2 are subclades of R which came later. They are variant mutations, splits from of the R* parent ancestor

RV88 originates in the Cameroon and part of Chad region and is dated 9200–5600 years old.

So what you are saying is 100% wrong Archeogeneticists and Eurcentrists both believe haplogroup R originates in Eurasia

there is no term for a "black genetics paradigm" [/QB]

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Njii:


The 3 streams of thought within the Black Genetics paradigm » Post

(3)

Archeogenticists

These are scholars that combine archeology and linguistics in genetics from an African centered prospective and seek to understand genetic data from the perspective of the original African blueprint of humanity. [/QB]

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Njii:

Most geneticists use the greater diversity paradigm to establish the origin of modern haplogroups and genetic markers. The greatest diversity of R is found in Central Africa. According to this particular line of reasoning R originated in Africa and not Eurasia.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Njii:
Upon following various blogs and videos I have noticed 3 streams of thought among black people when analyzing and interpreting genetic data. Although many black people all around the world are beginning to learn about how fraudulent and conjecture based most European and Eurocentric papers on genetics are. There are still a large group of black people that take everything that Europeans interpret at face value. For me this group is comprises the first stream of thought.


Eurocentrists
The Eurocentric stream of Black scholastic knowledge and understanding regarding genetics take everything that white and eurocentric scholars say about genetics at face value. An example of the beliefs that this stream of thought hold include but are not limited to:

1. The Back Migration Fallacy; genetic markers that are shared by Eurasians and Africans entered Africa as a result of a back migration

2. The R Haplogroup originated outside of Africa

3. Archeology and Linguistics have little to no bearing on analysis of genetic data

4. When Black people migrated outside of Africa they became less African and any population that is found outside of Africa after the Out of Africa migration is completely disqualified from the classification of African and black.

This stream of thought mainly uses genetics for two main reasons:

1. To seem updated with the latest information coming out of Eurocentric universities.

2. To combat social ideological enemies that they consider are toxic to the legacy of African people; mainly Hebrew Isrealites and Moors. They use Genetic data to try to debunk the beliefs of these ideologues.

The "We Aint African" Crowd

This stream consists of self hating black people who believe that genetics is a hoax because it connects African American people to African people. They hate Africa and African people because they believe that Africa has no redeeming qualities no civilizations, no writing, no culture of horse domestication, no culture of inventing the wheel, no burial rites, and no agricultural technology. This stream of thought is usually connected to religious and social ideological movements in the US such as the Moors and the Hebrew Isrealites or other groups with anti African motives, views, and opinions. Ultimately the hatred of all things African and ignorance of African history is what leads this stream of thought to take their position against modern mainstream genetics.


Archeogenticists

These are scholars that combine archeology and linguistics in genetics from an African centered prospective and seek to understand genetic data from the perspective of the original African blueprint of humanity.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Njii:

b]The "We Aint African" Crowd[/b]

This stream consists of self hating black people who believe that genetics is a hoax

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Njii:


The 3 streams of thought within the Black Genetics paradigm » Post

(3)

Archeogenticists

These are scholars that combine archeology and linguistics in genetics from an African centered prospective and seek to understand genetic data from the perspective of the original African blueprint of humanity.

---

First of all spell the word correctly:

Archaeogenetics, "a" before "e"

Archaeogenetics, a term coined by British archaeologist and paleolinguist Colin Renfrew, is not research practiced by scholars
it is practiced by scientists in laboratories using scientific equipment.

Archaeogentics is a term is not specific to "Black genetics" or an "African centered perspective"
The term was invented by a white man and is most frequently used in referring to the Max Planck institute in Germany who has a department called the Department of Archaeogentics although is of course not specific to it.


Look at the term "genetics" and the term "archaeology"
Both are science. Neither are supposed to be biased toward Eurocentric or Afrocentric.

Therefore a Eurocentric or an Afrocentric can use archaeogenetics
in their arguments as a tool but archaeology and genetics or combining the two as " archaeogenetics"

quote:

---

Originally posted by Njii:

Most geneticists use the greater diversity paradigm to establish the origin of modern haplogroups and genetic markers. The greatest diversity of R is found in Central Africa. According to this particular line of reasoning R originated in Africa and not Eurasia.

---

Clyde Winters is not a geneticist and has no training in biology.

There is no professional geneticist or archaeogenticist that says Haplogroup R has greater diversity in Central Africa or any part of Africa.

As regards to Haplogroup R, it has LESS diversity in Central Africa than in Western Asia and anatolia.

Try to find one single peer reviewed non-Clyde Winters scientific article that says R has it's greatest diversity anywhere in Africa to substantiate your claim. Your statement is false

To Clyde and others:
please don't try to save him. He made the claim so he should be the one responsible for backing it with references. Let's give him a couple of days to come up with something

If not, I'm putting another scratch on my belt.

______________________________________ [/QB]

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Clyde Winters:

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Njii:


The 3 streams of thought within the Black Genetics paradigm » Post

(3)

Archeogenticists

These are scholars that combine archeology and linguistics in genetics from an African centered prospective and seek to understand genetic data from the perspective of the original African blueprint of humanity.

---

First of all spell the word correctly:

Archaeogenetics, "a" before "e"

Archaeogenetics, a term coined by British archaeologist and paleolinguist Colin Renfrew, is not research practiced by scholars
it is practiced by scientists in laboratories using scientific equipment.

Archaeogentics is a term is not specific to "Black genetics" or an "African centered perspective"
The term was invented by a white man and is most frequently used in referring to the Max Planck institute in Germany who has a department called the Department of Archaeogentics although is of course not specific to it.


Look at the term "genetics" and the term "archaeology"
Both are science. Neither are supposed to be biased toward Eurocentric or Afrocentric.

Therefore a Eurocentric or an Afrocentric can use archaeogenetics
in their arguments as a tool but archaeology and genetics or combining the two as " archaeogenetics"

quote:

---

Originally posted by Njii:

Most geneticists use the greater diversity paradigm to establish the origin of modern haplogroups and genetic markers. The greatest diversity of R is found in Central Africa. According to this particular line of reasoning R originated in Africa and not Eurasia.

---

Clyde Winters is not a geneticist and has no training in biology.

There is no professional geneticist or archaeogenticist that says Haplogroup R has greater diversity in Central Africa or any part of Africa.

As regards to Haplogroup R, it has LESS diversity in Central Africa than in Western Asia and anatolia.

Try to find one single peer reviewed non-Clyde Winters scientific article that says R has it's greatest diversity anywhere in Africa to substantiate your claim. Your statement is false

To Clyde and others:
please don't try to save him. He made the claim so he should be the one responsible for backing it with references. Let's give him a couple of days to come up with something

If not, I'm putting another scratch on my belt.

______________________________________

---

You don't have to be a genericist to write and publish genetics articles. Iosif Lazaridis is a Computer Scientist--not a geneticist, and he has authored several articles you guys have accepted as genetics research on this forum: http://www.egyptsearch.com/forums/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=8;t=009467;p=9 . [/QB]

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Clyde Winters:

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Njii:


The 3 streams of thought within the Black Genetics paradigm » Post

(3)

Archeogenticists

These are scholars that combine archeology and linguistics in genetics from an African centered prospective and seek to understand genetic data from the perspective of the original African blueprint of humanity.

---

First of all spell the word correctly:

Archaeogenetics, "a" before "e"

Archaeogenetics, a term coined by British archaeologist and paleolinguist Colin Renfrew, is not research practiced by scholars
it is practiced by scientists in laboratories using scientific equipment.

Archaeogentics is a term is not specific to "Black genetics" or an "African centered perspective"
The term was invented by a white man and is most frequently used in referring to the Max Planck institute in Germany who has a department called the Department of Archaeogentics although is of course not specific to it.


Look at the term "genetics" and the term "archaeology"
Both are science. Neither are supposed to be biased toward Eurocentric or Afrocentric.

Therefore a Eurocentric or an Afrocentric can use archaeogenetics
in their arguments as a tool but archaeology and genetics or combining the two as " archaeogenetics"

quote:

---

Originally posted by Njii:

Most geneticists use the greater diversity paradigm to establish the origin of modern haplogroups and genetic markers. The greatest diversity of R is found in Central Africa. According to this particular line of reasoning R originated in Africa and not Eurasia.

---

Clyde Winters is not a geneticist and has no training in biology.

There is no professional geneticist or archaeogenticist that says Haplogroup R has greater diversity in Central Africa or any part of Africa.

As regards to Haplogroup R, it has LESS diversity in Central Africa than in Western Asia and anatolia.

Try to find one single peer reviewed non-Clyde Winters scientific article that says R has it's greatest diversity anywhere in Africa to substantiate your claim. Your statement is false

To Clyde and others:
please don't try to save him. He made the claim so he should be the one responsible for backing it with references. Let's give him a couple of days to come up with something

If not, I'm putting another scratch on my belt.

______________________________________

---

You don't have to be a genericist to write and publish genetics articles. Iosif Lazaridis is a Computer Scientist--not a geneticist, and he has authored several articles you guys have accepted as genetics research on this forum: http://www.egyptsearch.com/forums/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=8;t=009467;p=9 .

---

It's not just losif Lazaridis it's a research team that includes trained geneticists and who do the primary analysis

The genetic structure of the world's first farmers

Iosif Lazaridis, Dani Nadel, Gary Rollefson, Deborah C. Merrett, Nadin Rohland, Swapan Mallick, Daniel Fernandes, Mario Novak, Beatriz Gamarra, Kendra Sirak, Sarah Connell, Kristin Stewardson, Eadaoin Harney, Qiaomei Fu, Gloria Gonzalez-Fortes, Songül Alpaslan Roodenberg, Gyorgy Lengyel, Fanny Bocquentin, Boris Gasparian, Janet M. Monge, Michael Gregg, Vered Eshed, Ahuva-Sivan Mizrahi, Christopher Meiklejohn, Fokke Gerritsen, Luminita Bejenaru, Matthias Blueher, Archie Campbell, Gianpero Cavalleri, David Comas, Philippe Froguel, Edmund Gilbert, Shona M. Kerr, Peter Kovacs, Johannes Krause, Darren McGettigan, Michael Merrigan, D. Andrew Merriwether, Seamus O'Reilly, Martin B. Richards, Ornella Semino, Michel Shamoon-Pour, Gheorghe Stefanescu, Michael Stumvoll, Anke Tonjes, Antonio Torroni, James F. Wilson, Loic Yengo, Nelli A. Hovhannisyan, Nick Patterson, Ron Pinhasi, David Reich
doi: http://dx.doi.org/10.1101/059311 [/QB]

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:
The genetic structure of the world's first farmers

Iosif Lazaridis, Dani Nadel, Gary Rollefson, Deborah C. Merrett, Nadin Rohland, Swapan Mallick, Daniel Fernandes, Mario Novak, Beatriz Gamarra, Kendra Sirak, Sarah Connell, Kristin Stewardson, Eadaoin Harney, Qiaomei Fu, Gloria Gonzalez-Fortes, Songül Alpaslan Roodenberg, Gyorgy Lengyel, Fanny Bocquentin, Boris Gasparian, Janet M. Monge, Michael Gregg, Vered Eshed, Ahuva-Sivan Mizrahi, Christopher Meiklejohn, Fokke Gerritsen, Luminita Bejenaru, Matthias Blueher, Archie Campbell, Gianpero Cavalleri, David Comas, Philippe Froguel, Edmund Gilbert, Shona M. Kerr, Peter Kovacs, Johannes Krause, Darren McGettigan, Michael Merrigan, D. Andrew Merriwether, Seamus O'Reilly, Martin B. Richards, Ornella Semino, Michel Shamoon-Pour, Gheorghe Stefanescu, Michael Stumvoll, Anke Tonjes, Antonio Torroni, James F. Wilson, Loic Yengo, Nelli A. Hovhannisyan, Nick Patterson, Ron Pinhasi, David Reich
doi: http://dx.doi.org/10.1101/059311

^^^ the difference between this and a Clyde Winters article is despite who actually wrote the article it is based on the contributions of over 50 people including several well known geneticists. It has primary data in it including DNA testing and is published in a well regarded a peer revived journal.

In contrast Clyde Winters has done no DNA testing, has no team of geneticists assisting him has only done secondary research and has not published any articles in peer reviewed biology journals and has zero co-authors signing on the conclusions

That's the difference

---

Jealousy and envy will get you no where. Ain't I a bad Mother.....,I have proved you don't have to be a geneticists to write a genetics research paper.

.

.

LOL. You don't have to do any testing most of the material is already collected and all you have to do is decide on the research topic, choose the appropriate Computer Program and run the data.


Most people just sign on to a research paper as a co-contributor to increase their number of publications and have contributed nothing to the paper. You just hate the fact that Europeans no longer control access to peer reviewed publications.
 

---

Posted by Mike111 (Member # 9361) on :
 
^Please excuse the intrusion, but the absurdity of the situation demanded comment:

Lioness, your are a crotch-rotted, lying Albino troll, using a fake avatar of a Black woman.

The extent of your ability and knowledge, is cutting and pasting mostly Wiki material, to confuse the truth.

Yet YOU would judge what is proper research conduct??????

Lioness - your Albino delusions are clearly showing.
 

---

Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:
^^^ see all of this?

None of it proves R originated in Africa, so stop it

---

LOL


Here, the seven mutations which were found to be shared by chromosomes of haplogroups C and R [16], were also found to be present in one DE sample (sample 33 in Table S1), and positioned at the root of macro-haplogroup CT (Figure 1 and Figure S1)





These chromosomes belong to a clade (haplogroup BT) in which chromosomes C and R share a common ancestor (Figure 2).


LOL
 

---

Posted by the lioness, (Member # 17353) on :
 
^ LOL, Again, this phylogeny does not prove Haplogroup R originated in Africa
 

---

Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:
^ LOL, Again, this phylogeny does not prove Haplogroup R originated in Africa

---

quote:

---

All Y-clades that are not exclusively African belong to the macro-haplogroup CT, which is defined by mutations M168, M294 and P9.1 [14,31] and is subdivided into two major clades, DE and CF [1,14].


chromosomes of haplogroups C and R [16], were also found to be present in one DE sample (sample 33 in Table S1)

---

quote:

---

"haplogroup CF and DE molecular ancestors first evolved inside Africa and subsequently contributed as Y chromosome founders to pioneering migrations that successfully colonized Asia. While not proof, the DE and CF bifurcation (Figure 8d ) is consistent with independent colonization impulses possibly occurring in a short time interval."

---

quote:

---

The Y chromosome Alu polymorphism (YAP, also called M1) defines the deep-rooted haplogroup D/E of the global Y-chromosome phylogeny [1]. This D/E haplogroup is further branched into three sub-haplogroups DE*, D and E (Figure 1). The distribution of the D/E haplogroup is highly regional, and the three subgroups are geographically restricted to certain areas, therefore informative in tracing human prehistory (Table 1). The sub-haplogroup DE*, presumably the most ancient lineage of the D/E haplogroup was only found in Africans from Nigeria [2], supporting the "Out of Africa" hypothesis about modern human origin. The sub-haplogroup E (E-M40), defined by M40/SRY4064 and M96, was also suggested originated in Africa [3-6], and later dispersed to Middle East and Europe about 20,000 years ago [3,4]. Interestingly, the sub-haplogroup D defined by M174 (D-M174) is East Asian specific with abundant appearance in Tibetan and Japanese (30–40%), but rare in most of other East Asian populations and populations from regions bordering East Asia (Central Asia, North Asia and Middle East) (usually less than 5%) [5-7]. Under D-M174, Japanese belongs to a separate sub-lineage defined by several mutations (e.g. M55, M57 and M64 etc.), which is different from those in Tibetans implicating relatively deep divergence between them [1]. The fragmented distribution of D-M174 in East Asia seems not consistent with the pattern of other East Asian specific lineages, i.e. O3-M122, O1-M119 and O2-M95 under haplogroup O [8,9].

---

quote:

---

Further refinement awaits the finding of new markers especially within paragroup E3a*-M2. The microsatellite profile of the DE* individual is one mutational step away from the allelic state described for Nigerians (DYS390*21, DYS388 not tested; [37], therefore suggesting a common ancestry but not elucidating the phylogenetics.

---

quote:

---

There has been considerable debate on the geographic origin of the human Y chromosome Alu polymorphism (YAP). Here we report a new, very rare deep-rooting haplogroup within the YAP clade, together with data on other deep-rooting YAP clades. The new haplogroup, found so far in only five Nigerians, is the least-derived YAP haplogroup according to currently known binary markers. However, because the interior branching order of the Y chromosome genealogical tree remains unknown, it is impossible to impute the origin of the YAP clade with certainty. We discuss the problems presented by rare deep-rooting lineages for Y chromosome phylogeography.

---

quote:

---

‘‘Out of Africa’’ haplogroups.


All Y-clades that are not exclusively African belong to the macro-haplogroup CT, which is defined by mutations M168, M294 and P9.1 [14,31] and is subdivided into two major clades, DE and CF [1,14].

In a recent study [16], sequencing of two chromosomes belonging to haplogroups C and R, led to the identification of 25 new mutations, eleven of which were in the C-chromosome and seven in the R-chromosome.

Here, the seven mutations which were found to be shared by chromosomes of haplogroups C and R [16], were also found to be present in one DE sample (sample 33 in Table S1), and positioned at the root of macro-haplogroup CT (Figure 1 and Figure S1)

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:
LOL, Again, the phylogeny does not prove Haplogroup R originated in Africa

remember, quality of argument over quantity

---

The quality was highlighted in the quantity.

The >>>Molecular Dissection of the Basal Clades<<< have proven you wrong. lol




" seven mutations which were found to be shared by chromosomes of haplogroups C and R [16], were also found to be present in one DE sample "

chromosomes of haplogroups C and R [16], were also found to be present in one DE sample

I understand all this DE found in Africa is overwhelming for you. All you can do now is repeat your same delusional racist opt. But that argument doesn't boil now, it is completely meaningless here. It just shows that you are a retarded racist. This is a common denominator you have with other racists.




Remember you're a fake, a racist a black woman impostor.
 

---

Posted by the lioness, (Member # 17353) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:
[qb] LOL, Again, the phylogeny does not prove Haplogroup R originated in Africa

remember, quality of argument over quantity

---

The quality was highlighted in the quantity.

The >>>Molecular Dissection of the Basal Clades<<< have proven you wrong. lol




seven mutations which were found to be shared by chromosomes of haplogroups C and R [16], were also found to be present in one DE sample

chromosomes of haplogroups C and R [16], were also found to be present in one DE sample

I understand all this DE found in Africa is overwhelming for you.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:
[qb] LOL, Again, the phylogeny does not prove Haplogroup R originated in Africa

remember, quality of argument over quantity

---

The quality was highlighted in the quantity.

The >>>Molecular Dissection of the Basal Clades<<< have proven you wrong. lol




seven mutations which were found to be shared by chromosomes of haplogroups C and R [16], were also found to be present in one DE sample

chromosomes of haplogroups C and R [16], were also found to be present in one DE sample

I understand all this DE found in Africa is overwhelming for you.

---

I understand your attempts to quote scientific terms and charts

but none of the above means Haplogroup R originates in Africa

YOu really have no understanding of how the location of the origin of a haplogroups is determined

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

quote:

---

The Y chromosome Alu polymorphism (YAP, also called M1) defines the deep-rooted haplogroup D/E of the global Y-chromosome phylogeny [1]. This D/E haplogroup is further branched into three sub-haplogroups DE*, D and E (Figure 1). The distribution of the D/E haplogroup is highly regional, and the three subgroups are geographically restricted to certain areas, therefore informative in tracing human prehistory (Table 1). The sub-haplogroup DE*, presumably the most ancient lineage of the D/E haplogroup was only found in Africans from Nigeria [2], supporting the "Out of Africa" hypothesis about modern human origin. The sub-haplogroup E (E-M40), defined by M40/SRY4064 and M96, was also suggested originated in Africa [3-6], and later dispersed to Middle East and Europe about 20,000 years ago [3,4]. Interestingly, the sub-haplogroup D defined by M174 (D-M174) is East Asian specific with abundant appearance in Tibetan and Japanese (30–40%), but rare in most of other East Asian populations and populations from regions bordering East Asia (Central Asia, North Asia and Middle East) (usually less than 5%) [5-7]. Under D-M174, Japanese belongs to a separate sub-lineage defined by several mutations (e.g. M55, M57 and M64 etc.), which is different from those in Tibetans implicating relatively deep divergence between them [1]. The fragmented distribution of D-M174 in East Asia seems not consistent with the pattern of other East Asian specific lineages, i.e. O3-M122, O1-M119 and O2-M95 under haplogroup O [8,9].

---

--Hong Shi et al. 2008:

http://www.biomedcentral.com/1741-7007/6/45

quote:

---

Further refinement awaits the finding of new markers especially within paragroup E3a*-M2. The microsatellite profile of the DE* individual is one mutational step away from the allelic state described for Nigerians (DYS390*21, DYS388 not tested; [37], therefore suggesting a common ancestry but not elucidating the phylogenetics.

---

Haplogroup DE* in Guinea-Bissau:

Y-chromosomal diversity in the population of Guinea-Bissau: a multiethnic perspective

http://www.biomedcentral.com/1471-2148/7/124

quote:

---

There has been considerable debate on the geographic origin of the human Y chromosome Alu polymorphism (YAP). Here we report a new, very rare deep-rooting haplogroup within the YAP clade, together with data on other deep-rooting YAP clades. The new haplogroup, found so far in only five Nigerians, is the least-derived YAP haplogroup according to currently known binary markers. However, because the interior branching order of the Y chromosome genealogical tree remains unknown, it is impossible to impute the origin of the YAP clade with certainty. We discuss the problems presented by rare deep-rooting lineages for Y chromosome phylogeography.

---

Haplogroup DE* in Nigerians:

Rare Deep-Rooting Y Chromosome Lineages in Humans: Lessons for Phylogeography

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1462739/pdf/14504230.pdf

quote:

---

‘‘Out of Africa’’ haplogroups.


All Y-clades that are not exclusively African belong to the macro-haplogroup CT, which is defined by mutations M168, M294 and P9.1 [14,31] and is subdivided into two major clades, DE and CF [1,14].

In a recent study [16], sequencing of two chromosomes belonging to haplogroups C and R, led to the identification of 25 new mutations, eleven of which were in the C-chromosome and seven in the R-chromosome.

Here, the seven mutations which were found to be shared by chromosomes of haplogroups C and R [16], were also found to be present in one DE sample (sample 33 in Table S1), and positioned at the root of macro-haplogroup CT (Figure 1 and Figure S1)

---

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3492319/figure/pone-0049170-g001/

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:
LOL, Again, the phylogeny does not prove Haplogroup R originated in Africa

remember, quality of argument over quantity

---

The quality was highlighted in the quantity.

The >>>Molecular Dissection of the Basal Clades<<< have proven you wrong. lol




" seven mutations which were found to be shared by chromosomes of haplogroups C and R [16], were also found to be present in one DE sample "

chromosomes of haplogroups C and R [16], were also found to be present in one DE sample

I understand all this DE found in Africa is overwhelming for you. All you can do now is repeat your same delusional racist opt. But that argument doesn't boil now, it is completely meaningless here. It just shows that you are a retarded racist. This is a common denominator you have with other racists.




Remember you're a fake, a racist a black woman impostor.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:
Again, none of what you said represents the location of the origin Haplogroup R

You need to find some quotes which talk about how the location of origin of a haplogroup is dtermined

---

LOL This is getting funny. It represents that the basal of "R" has origin in Africa and was taken outside of Africa. LOL


>>>seven mutations which were found to be shared by chromosomes of haplogroups C and R [16], were also found to be present in one DE sample"<<<

quote:

---

How does the present MSY tree compare with the backbone of the recently published “reference” MSY phylogeny?13 The phylogenetic relationships we observed among chromosomes belonging to haplogroups B, C, and R are reminiscent of those reported in the tree by Karafet et al.13

---

--Fulvio Cruciani et al
A Revised Root for the Human Y Chromosomal Phylogenetic Tree: The Origin of Patrilineal Diversity in Africa (2011)



 

---

Posted by the lioness, (Member # 17353) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:
[qb] Again, none of what you said represents the location of the origin Haplogroup R

You need to find some quotes which talk about how the location of origin of a haplogroup is dtermined

---

LOL This is getting funny. It represents that the basal of "R" has origin in Africa and was taken outside of Africa. LOL

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:
[qb] Again, none of what you said represents the location of the origin Haplogroup R

You need to find some quotes which talk about how the location of origin of a haplogroup is dtermined

---

LOL This is getting funny. It represents that the basal of "R" has origin in Africa and was taken outside of Africa. LOL

---

Again, haplogroup R is a mutation that occured after people carried earlier haplogroups outside of Africa.

This is genetics 101 and you still don't get it

---

quote:

---

"haplogroup CF and DE molecular ancestors first evolved inside Africa and subsequently contributed as Y chromosome founders to pioneering migrations that successfully colonized Asia. While not proof, the DE and CF bifurcation (Figure 8d ) is consistent with independent colonization impulses possibly occurring in a short time interval."

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:
[qb] Again, none of what you said represents the location of the origin Haplogroup R

You need to find some quotes which talk about how the location of origin of a haplogroup is dtermined

---

LOL This is getting funny. It represents that the basal of "R" has origin in Africa and was taken outside of Africa. LOL

---

Again, haplogroup R is a mutation that occured after people carried earlier haplogroups outside of Africa.

This is genetics 101 and you still don't get it

---

101 says: >>>seven mutations which were found to be shared by chromosomes of haplogroups C and R [16], were also found to be present in one DE sample"<<< LOL SMH

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:
[qb] Again, none of what you said represents the location of the origin Haplogroup R

You need to find some quotes which talk about how the location of origin of a haplogroup is dtermined

---

LOL This is getting funny. It represents that the basal of "R" has origin in Africa and was taken outside of Africa. LOL

---

Again, haplogroup R is a mutation that occured after people carried earlier haplogroups outside of Africa.

This is genetics 101 and you still don't get it

---

101 says: >>>seven mutations which were found to be shared by chromosomes of haplogroups C and R [16], were also found to be present in one DE sample"<<< LOL SMH

---

Again, shared mutations between C or DE and R do not mean Haplogroup R orientated in Africa, stop being stupid

---

quote:

---

"haplogroup CF and DE molecular ancestors first evolved inside Africa and subsequently contributed as Y chromosome founders to pioneering migrations that successfully colonized Asia. While not proof, the DE and CF bifurcation (Figure 8d ) is consistent with independent colonization impulses possibly occurring in a short time interval."

---

quote:

---

The regional distribution of an ancient Y-chromosome haplogroup C-M130 (Hg C) in Asia provides an ideal tool of dissecting prehistoric migration events. We identified 465 Hg C individuals out of 4284 males from 140 East and Southeast Asian populations. We genotyped these Hg C individuals using 12 Y-chromosome biallelic markers and 8 commonly used Y-short tandem repeats (Y-STRs), and performed phylogeographic analysis in combination with the published data. The results show that most of the Hg C subhaplogroups have distinct geographical distribution and have undergone long-time isolation, although Hg C individuals are distributed widely across Eurasia. Furthermore, a general south-to-north and east-to-west cline of Y-STR diversity is observed with the highest diversity in Southeast Asia. The phylogeographic distribution pattern of Hg C supports a single coastal 'Out-of-Africa' route by way of the Indian subcontinent, which eventually led to the early settlement of modern humans in mainland Southeast Asia. The northward expansion of Hg C in East Asia started approximately 40 thousand of years ago (KYA) along the coastline of mainland China and reached Siberia approximately 15 KYA and finally made its way to the Americas.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

quote:

---

The regional distribution of an ancient Y-chromosome haplogroup C-M130 (Hg C) in Asia provides an ideal tool of dissecting prehistoric migration events. We identified 465 Hg C individuals out of 4284 males from 140 East and Southeast Asian populations. We genotyped these Hg C individuals using 12 Y-chromosome biallelic markers and 8 commonly used Y-short tandem repeats (Y-STRs), and performed phylogeographic analysis in combination with the published data. The results show that most of the Hg C subhaplogroups have distinct geographical distribution and have undergone long-time isolation, although Hg C individuals are distributed widely across Eurasia. Furthermore, a general south-to-north and east-to-west cline of Y-STR diversity is observed with the highest diversity in Southeast Asia. The phylogeographic distribution pattern of Hg C supports a single coastal 'Out-of-Africa' route by way of the Indian subcontinent, which eventually led to the early settlement of modern humans in mainland Southeast Asia. The northward expansion of Hg C in East Asia started approximately 40 thousand of years ago (KYA) along the coastline of mainland China and reached Siberia approximately 15 KYA and finally made its way to the Americas.

---

--Zhong H1, Shi H, Qi XB, Xiao CJ, Jin L, Ma RZ, Su B.

Global distribution of Y-chromosome haplogroup C reveals the prehistoric migration routes of African exodus and early settlement in East Asia.

J Hum Genet. 2010 Jul;55(7):428-35. doi: 10.1038/jhg.2010.40. Epub 2010 May 7.

http://www.nature.com/jhg/journal/v55/n7/full/jhg201040a.html

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:
Sill you don't understand what you are reading.

you can type it over and over again like a maniac, shared mutations are not all mutations involved, Haplogroup R did not originate in Africa, try to find ANY article stating that it did, stop bullshitting

---

I don't know what I am reading? lol

There is NO need to find an article.

THE BASAL ORIGINATED IN AFRICA!!!

Here, the seven mutations which were found to be shared by chromosomes of haplogroups C and R [16], were also found to be present in one DE sample (sample 33 in Table S1), and positioned at the root of macro-haplogroup CT



 

---

Posted by the lioness, (Member # 17353) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:
[qb] Sill you don't understand what you are reading.

you can type it over and over again like a maniac, shared mutations are not all mutations involved, Haplogroup R did not originate in Africa, try to find ANY article stating that it did, stop bullshitting

---

I don't know what I am reading? lol

There is NO need to find an article.

THE BASAL ORIGINATED IN AFRICA!!!

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

quote:

---

The regional distribution of an ancient Y-chromosome haplogroup C-M130 (Hg C) in Asia provides an ideal tool of dissecting prehistoric migration events. We identified 465 Hg C individuals out of 4284 males from 140 East and Southeast Asian populations. We genotyped these Hg C individuals using 12 Y-chromosome biallelic markers and 8 commonly used Y-short tandem repeats (Y-STRs), and performed phylogeographic analysis in combination with the published data. The results show that most of the Hg C subhaplogroups have distinct geographical distribution and have undergone long-time isolation, although Hg C individuals are distributed widely across Eurasia. Furthermore, a general south-to-north and east-to-west cline of Y-STR diversity is observed with the highest diversity in Southeast Asia. The phylogeographic distribution pattern of Hg C supports a single coastal 'Out-of-Africa' route by way of the Indian subcontinent, which eventually led to the early settlement of modern humans in mainland Southeast Asia. The northward expansion of Hg C in East Asia started approximately 40 thousand of years ago (KYA) along the coastline of mainland China and reached Siberia approximately 15 KYA and finally made its way to the Americas.

---

--Zhong H1, Shi H, Qi XB, Xiao CJ, Jin L, Ma RZ, Su B.

Global distribution of Y-chromosome haplogroup C reveals the prehistoric migration routes of African exodus and early settlement in East Asia.

J Hum Genet. 2010 Jul;55(7):428-35. doi: 10.1038/jhg.2010.40. Epub 2010 May 7.

http://www.nature.com/jhg/journal/v55/n7/full/jhg201040a.html

---

Again , shared mutations between Asian Haplogroup C and Haplogroup R doesn't mean Haplogroup R originated in Africa. Stop the ongoing lies and deceit

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:
[qb] Sill you don't understand what you are reading.

you can type it over and over again like a maniac, shared mutations are not all mutations involved, Haplogroup R did not originate in Africa, try to find ANY article stating that it did, stop bullshitting

---

I don't know what I am reading? lol


There is NO need to find an article.

THE BASAL ORIGINATED IN AFRICA!!!

---

Again haplogroups basal to Haplogroup R are not the same as Haplogroup R.
Haplogroup R was caused by mutation that occurred outside of Africa, despite your ongoing giant sized stupidity and lies.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

quote:

---

The regional distribution of an ancient Y-chromosome haplogroup C-M130 (Hg C) in Asia provides an ideal tool of dissecting prehistoric migration events. We identified 465 Hg C individuals out of 4284 males from 140 East and Southeast Asian populations. We genotyped these Hg C individuals using 12 Y-chromosome biallelic markers and 8 commonly used Y-short tandem repeats (Y-STRs), and performed phylogeographic analysis in combination with the published data. The results show that most of the Hg C subhaplogroups have distinct geographical distribution and have undergone long-time isolation, although Hg C individuals are distributed widely across Eurasia. Furthermore, a general south-to-north and east-to-west cline of Y-STR diversity is observed with the highest diversity in Southeast Asia. The phylogeographic distribution pattern of Hg C supports a single coastal 'Out-of-Africa' route by way of the Indian subcontinent, which eventually led to the early settlement of modern humans in mainland Southeast Asia. The northward expansion of Hg C in East Asia started approximately 40 thousand of years ago (KYA) along the coastline of mainland China and reached Siberia approximately 15 KYA and finally made its way to the Americas.

---

--Zhong H1, Shi H, Qi XB, Xiao CJ, Jin L, Ma RZ, Su B.

Global distribution of Y-chromosome haplogroup C reveals the prehistoric migration routes of African exodus and early settlement in East Asia.

J Hum Genet. 2010 Jul;55(7):428-35. doi: 10.1038/jhg.2010.40. Epub 2010 May 7.

http://www.nature.com/jhg/journal/v55/n7/full/jhg201040a.html

---

Again , shared mutations between Asian Haplogroup C and Haplogroup R doesn't mean Haplogroup R originated in Africa. Stop the ongoing lies and deceit

---

LOL


In a recent study [16], sequencing of two chromosomes belonging to haplogroups C and R, led to the identification of 25 new mutations, eleven of which were in the C-chromosome and seven in the R-chromosome.


PLoS One. 2012; 7(11): e49170.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3492319/figure/pone-0049170-g001/

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

quote:

---

The regional distribution of an ancient Y-chromosome haplogroup C-M130 (Hg C) in Asia provides an ideal tool of dissecting prehistoric migration events. We identified 465 Hg C individuals out of 4284 males from 140 East and Southeast Asian populations. We genotyped these Hg C individuals using 12 Y-chromosome biallelic markers and 8 commonly used Y-short tandem repeats (Y-STRs), and performed phylogeographic analysis in combination with the published data. The results show that most of the Hg C subhaplogroups have distinct geographical distribution and have undergone long-time isolation, although Hg C individuals are distributed widely across Eurasia. Furthermore, a general south-to-north and east-to-west cline of Y-STR diversity is observed with the highest diversity in Southeast Asia. The phylogeographic distribution pattern of Hg C supports a single coastal 'Out-of-Africa' route by way of the Indian subcontinent, which eventually led to the early settlement of modern humans in mainland Southeast Asia. The northward expansion of Hg C in East Asia started approximately 40 thousand of years ago (KYA) along the coastline of mainland China and reached Siberia approximately 15 KYA and finally made its way to the Americas.

---

--Zhong H1, Shi H, Qi XB, Xiao CJ, Jin L, Ma RZ, Su B.

Global distribution of Y-chromosome haplogroup C reveals the prehistoric migration routes of African exodus and early settlement in East Asia.

J Hum Genet. 2010 Jul;55(7):428-35. doi: 10.1038/jhg.2010.40. Epub 2010 May 7.

http://www.nature.com/jhg/journal/v55/n7/full/jhg201040a.html

---

Again , shared mutations between Asian Haplogroup C and Haplogroup R doesn't mean Haplogroup R originated in Africa. Stop the ongoing lies and deceit

---

LOL


In a recent study [16], sequencing of two chromosomes belonging to haplogroups C and R, led to the identification of 25 new mutations, eleven of which were in the C-chromosome and seven in the R-chromosome.


PLoS One. 2012; 7(11): e49170.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3492319/figure/pone-0049170-g001/

---

--Zhong H1, Shi H, Qi XB, Xiao CJ, Jin L, Ma RZ, Su B.

Global distribution of Y-chromosome haplogroup C reveals the prehistoric migration routes of African exodus and early settlement in East Asia.

J Hum Genet. 2010 Jul;55(7):428-35. doi: 10.1038/jhg.2010.40. Epub 2010 May 7.

damn lol


Hg C-M130 has a wide distribution across Asia and Oceania, less frequent in Europe and the Americas, and absent in Africa. As a non-African lineage, Hg C is highly informative in tracing the migration route of the African exodus in prehistory

PLoS One. 2012; 7(11): e49170.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3492319/figure/pone-0049170-g001/

______________________

do you read what you post ??? damn

---

Of course I can read what what says, very well. This however was after Hg C supports a single coastal 'Out-of-Africa' route. After this of course the mutation continued. Duh. lol So logically those mutation will only be detected in the population(-s) outside of Africa. lol


Here, the seven mutations which were found to be shared by chromosomes of haplogroups C and R [16], were also found to be present in one DE sample (sample 33 in Table S1), and positioned at the root of macro-haplogroup CT




The basal of these mutations was already there in Africa. lol Why does this bother you so much? lol
 

---

Posted by the lioness, (Member # 17353) on :
 
Again this article you posted contradicts your claims

_________________________________


PLoS One. 2012; 7(11): e49170.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3492319/figure/pone-0049170-g001/ [/qb][/QUOTE]--Zhong H1, Shi H, Qi XB, Xiao CJ, Jin L, Ma RZ, Su B.

Global distribution of Y-chromosome haplogroup C reveals the prehistoric migration routes of African exodus and early settlement in East Asia.

J Hum Genet. 2010 Jul;55(7):428-35. doi: 10.1038/jhg.2010.40. Epub 2010 May 7.


Hg C-M130 has a wide distribution across Asia and Oceania,
less frequent in Europe and the Americas,
and absent in Africa. As a non-African lineage, Hg C is highly informative in tracing the migration route of the African exodus in prehistory

PLoS One. 2012; 7(11): e49170.

http://www.nature.com/jhg/journal/v55/n7/full/jhg201040a.html
______________________

Again R also has unique mutations that C doesn't have

and neither originated in Africa

/close thread
 

---

Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:
Again this article you posted contradicts your claims



PLoS One. 2012; 7(11): e49170.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3492319/figure/pone-0049170-g001/

---

quote:

---

Again R also has unique mutations that C doesn't have

and neither originated in Africa

/close thread

---

quote:

---

Jin and his team focused on three SNPs on the Y-chromosome – M89, M130 and YAP. They are mutations of another mutated DNA molecule M168, which originated in Africa between 31,000 and 79,000 years ago.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

Jin and his team focused on three SNPs on the Y-chromosome – M89, M130 and YAP. They are mutations of another mutated DNA molecule M168, which originated in Africa between 31,000 and 79,000 years ago.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

Jin and his team focused on three SNPs on the Y-chromosome – M89, M130 and YAP. They are mutations of another mutated DNA molecule M168, which originated in Africa between 31,000 and 79,000 years ago.

---

Again, Haplogroups C and R also have unique mutations which occurred outside of Africa

---

LOL Of course it does, however the basal of the mutations is found within Africa. Within DE. Which is found in Africa, before they left Africa. lol


A mutation takes thousands or hundreds of years to develop. lol

It not from one day to the other. LOL
 

---

Posted by the lioness, (Member # 17353) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

Jin and his team focused on three SNPs on the Y-chromosome – M89, M130 and YAP. They are mutations of another mutated DNA molecule M168, which originated in Africa between 31,000 and 79,000 years ago.

---

Again, Haplogroups C and R also have unique mutations which occurred outside of Africa

---

LOL Of course it does, however the basal of the mutations is found with in Africa. lol

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

Jin and his team focused on three SNPs on the Y-chromosome – M89, M130 and YAP. They are mutations of another mutated DNA molecule M168, which originated in Africa between 31,000 and 79,000 years ago.

---

Again, Haplogroups C and R also have unique mutations which occurred outside of Africa

---

LOL Of course it does, however the basal of the mutations is found with in Africa. lol

---

Again some mutations basal to R occurred in Africa but others didn't

Therefore you can't say haplogroup R originated in Africa

-unless if you're stupid. Then you could say it

---

What is "others"? LOL

Since the basal originated in Africa, it means that Africa has its own mutations in R, logically.lol


This is why is it positioned at the root of macro-haplogroup CT LOL


Repost:

"Here, the seven mutations which were found to be shared by chromosomes of haplogroups C and R [16], were also found to be present in one DE sample (sample 33 in Table S1), and positioned at the root of macro-haplogroup CT"





There will be a time, you'll get it. But for now...? lol
 

---

Posted by the lioness, (Member # 17353) on :
 
Again some mutations in Haplogroup C and R occurred outside Africa.
Therefore you can't say haplogroup C or R originated in Africa, again stop being stupid, again LOL
 

---

Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:
Again some mutations in Haplogroup C and R occurred outside Africa.
Therefore you can't say haplogroup C or R originated in Africa, again stop being stupid, again LOL

---

quote:

---

According to the current data East Africa is home to nearly 2/3 of the world genetic diversity independent of sampling effect. Similar figure have been suggested for sub-Saharan Africa populations [1]. The antiquity of the east African gene pool could be viewed not only from the perspective of the amount of genetic diversity endowed within it but also by signals of uni-modal distribution in their mitochondrial DNA (Hassan et al., unpublished) usually taken as an indication of populations that have passed through ‘‘recent’’ demographic expansion [33], although in this case, may in fact be considered a sign of extended shared history of in situ evolution where alleles are exchanged between neighboring demes [34].

• Figure S1 Neighbor joining (NJ). NJ tree of the world populations based on MT-CO2 sequences. The evolutionary relationship of 171 sequences and evolutionary history was inferred using the Neighbor-Joining method. The optimal tree with the sum of branch length = 0.20401570 is shown. The evolutionary distances were computed using the Maximum Composite Likelihood method and are in the units of the number of base substitutions per site. Codon positions included were 1st+2nd+3rd+Noncoding. All positions containing gaps and missing data were eliminated from the dataset. There were a total of 543 positions in the final dataset. Phylogenetic analyses were conducted in MEGA4. Red dots: east Africa, Blue: Africa, Green: Asia, Yellow: Australia, Pink: Europe and gray: America. (TIF)

• Figure S2 Multidimensional Scaling Plot (MDS). The 2nd and 3rd coordinates of an MDS plot of 848 nuclear microsatellite loci from 469 individuals of 24 world populations. MDS uses pairwise IBS data based on the 848 loci generated by PLINK software and plotted using R version 2.15.0. The figure, besides a separate clustering of east Africans, indicates the substantial contribution of Africans and east Africans to the founding of populations of Europe and Asia.
  (TIF)

[list]
[*]Figure S3 Multidimensional Scaling Plot (MDS). The 3rd and 4th coordinates of an MDS plot of 848 Microsatellite loci, across the human genome in 469 individuals from 24 populations from Africa, Asia and Europe. MDS uses pairwise IBS data based on the 848 loci generated by PLINK software and plotted using R version 2.15.0. The central position of east Africans and some other Africans emphasizes the founding role of east African gene pool and the disparate alignment on coordinates along which the world populations were founded including populations of Aftica aligning along the 4th dimension.
(TIF)

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:
[qb] Again some mutations in Haplogroup C and R occurred outside Africa.
Therefore you can't say haplogroup C or R originated in Africa, again stop being stupid, again LOL

---

LOL The BASAL occurred within Africa. Go cry a river.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:
[qb] Again some mutations in Haplogroup C and R occurred outside Africa.
Therefore you can't say haplogroup C or R originated in Africa, again stop being stupid, again LOL

---

LOL The BASAL occurred within Africa. Go cry a river.

---

Lol, Again
Because the basal of a haplogroup is in Africa it doesn't mean the haplogroup is African, LOL

stop trying to steal haplogroups and you don't even live there, lol

---

LOL so much for this logic. LOL SMH

CT has origin in Africa. lol If these basal mutations were already there in DE. How can it magically be that it wasn't there when it suites you, in "R"? lol Mind you DE is only found in Africa. In the region where "R is most prevalent. Ironically. lol




bas·al (bā′səl, -zəl)
adj.
1.
a. Of, relating to, located at, or forming a base.
b. Botany Located at or near the base of a plant stem, or at the base of any other plant part: basal placentation.
2. Of primary importance; basic.


basal (ˈbeɪsəl)
adj
1. at, of, or constituting a base
2. of or constituting a foundation or basis; fundamental; essential
ˈbasally adv


http://www.thefreedictionary.com/basal
 

---

Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:
[qb] Again some mutations in Haplogroup C and R occurred outside Africa.
Therefore you can't say haplogroup C or R originated in Africa, again stop being stupid, again LOL

---

LOL The BASAL occurred within Africa. Go cry a river.

http://images.slideplayer.com/16/4883196/slides/slide_3.jpg

---

Lol, Again
Because the basal of a haplogroup is in Africa it doesn't mean the haplogroup is African, LOL

stop trying to steal haplogroups and you don't even live there, lol

---

quote:

---

According to the current data East Africa is home to nearly 2/3 of the world genetic diversity independent of sampling effect. Similar figure have been suggested for sub-Saharan Africa populations [1].

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:


CT has origin in Africa. lol If these basal mutations were already there in DE. How can it magically be that it wasn't there when it suites you, in "R"? lol

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:


CT has origin in Africa. lol If these basal mutations were already there in DE. How can it magically be that it wasn't there when it suites you, in "R"? lol

---

LMAO, LOL, Smh,
Again, mutations basal to C and R does not mean C and R originate in Africa.
These mutations are not called DE because they are different from DE even though the descend from that paragroup


You don't understand mutations and that some have occurred outside of Africa, LOL, Smh, Lmao

---

This is just sad, you don't understand that the BASIS of the gene is within Africa. Of course mutations continued to occur outside of Africa. lol




In the case above CF, CT, DE etc for example are the common ancestor.

You are such a pathetic individual.

quote:

---

According to the current data East Africa is home to nearly 2/3 of the world genetic diversity independent of sampling effect. Similar figure have been suggested for sub-Saharan Africa populations [1].

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:
mutations continued to occur outside of Africa. lol

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:
mutations continued to occur outside of Africa. lol

---

and at that point after such new mutations occurred Haplogroup R came about

---

quote:

---

According to the current data East Africa is home to nearly 2/3 of the world genetic diversity independent of sampling effect. Similar figure have been suggested for sub-Saharan Africa populations [1].

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:
the basal for R is positioned in Africa.

It says it right here macro-haplogroup LOL:


"Here, the seven mutations which were found to be shared by chromosomes of haplogroups C and R [16], were also found to be present in one DE sample (sample 33 in Table S1), and positioned at the root of macro-haplogroup CT

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:
the basal for R is positioned in Africa.

It says it right here macro-haplogroup LOL:


"Here, the seven mutations which were found to be shared by chromosomes of haplogroups C and R [16], were also found to be present in one DE sample (sample 33 in Table S1), and positioned at the root of macro-haplogroup CT

---

Again the paragroup basal to a haplogroup does not mean the haplogroup is soley defined by what is basal to it

That is why when you look at scientific articles they don't say haplogroup R originates in Africa

If mutations occur outside of Africa then the haplogroup is no longer considered African although it has African ancestors.

You know this are you playing deceitful games.

---

LOL This is where you failed again, because the Hg R does occur in Africa and so does the basal has seven mutations, which ironically was found in the same region. You lose again. LOL


A macro-haplogroup encompasses all that come out of it, therefore it is positioned at the root of macro-haplogroup CT, which already had the seven mutations. The encompassing was/ is solely in Africa as we know. LOL It is what it is! lol

Before you get to R and the seven mutations you need to pass CT. But since, R and DE have the same basal and seven mutations, prior to CT it means that R and the seven mutations was in Africa, and have continued to evolve into its own branch. It's that simple.


"Here, the seven mutations which were found to be shared by chromosomes of haplogroups C and R [16], were also found to be present in one DE sample (sample 33 in Table S1), and positioned at the root of macro-haplogroup CT.

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:
Again the paragroup basal to a haplogroup does not mean the haplogroup is soley defined by what is basal to it

---

quote:

---

According to the current data East Africa is home to nearly 2/3 of the world genetic diversity independent of sampling effect. Similar figure have been suggested for sub-Saharan Africa populations [1].

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

LOL This is where you failed again, because the Hg R does occur in Africa and so does the basal has seven mutations, which ironically was [b]found in the same region.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

LOL This is where you failed again, because the Hg R does occur in Africa and so does the basal has seven mutations, which ironically was found in the same region.

---

Again because R does occur in Africa and so does the basal does not mean haplogroup R originates there.

---

Do you have any idea how ridiculous that sounds. lol

the seven mutations and basal of R is and positioned at the root of macro-haplogroup CT. CT Was in Africa, thus R was in Africa. lol


"Here, the seven mutations which were found to be shared by chromosomes of haplogroups C and R [16], were also found to be present in one DE sample (sample 33 in Table S1), and positioned at the root of macro-haplogroup CT. LOL





bas·al (bā′səl, -zəl)
adj.
1.
a. Of, relating to, located at, or forming a base.
b. Botany Located at or near the base of a plant stem, or at the base of any other plant part: basal placentation.
2. Of primary importance; basic.


basal (ˈbeɪsəl)
adj
1. at, of, or constituting a base
2. of or constituting a foundation or basis; fundamental; essential
ˈbasally adv


http://www.thefreedictionary.com/basal
 

---

Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

The highest diversity of Haplogroup R is in Western Asia/Anatolia

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

You keep confusing paragroups basal to haplogroup phylogeny with haplogroup origin

---

quote:

---

‘‘Out of Africa’’ haplogroups.

All Y-clades that are not exclusively African belong to the macro-haplogroup CT, which is defined by mutations M168, M294 and P9.1 [14,31] and is subdivided into two major clades, DE and CF [1,14].

In a recent study [16], sequencing of two chromosomes belonging to haplogroups C and R, led to the identification of 25 new mutations, eleven of which were in the C-chromosome and seven in the R-chromosome.

Here, the seven mutations which were found to be shared by chromosomes of haplogroups C and R [16], were also found to be present in one DE sample (sample 33 in Table S1), and positioned at the root of macro-haplogroup CT (Figure 1 and Figure S1)

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:


Of course mutations continued to occur outside of Africa. lol

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:


Of course mutations continued to occur outside of Africa. lol

---

that is the end of the discussion right there.
These mutations are not African, so what is basal to them when this split occurs is irrelevant

---

The basal mutations occurred INSIDE AFRICA!!! LOL INSIDE AFRICA!!!! lol

CT is branched in AFRICA! lol If DE manifested an outmigration, while it has the same basal mutations as R and C. Then this means that R was in Africa. The mutation outside of Africa became a genetic drift. lol

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:
These mutations are not African, so what is basal to them when this split occurs is irrelevant

---

quote:

---

"haplogroup CF and DE molecular ancestors first evolved inside Africa and subsequently contributed as Y chromosome founders to pioneering migrations that successfully colonized Asia. While not proof, the DE and CF bifurcation (Figure 8d ) is consistent with independent colonization impulses possibly occurring in a short time interval."

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:
Again, CF mutated into different forms outside of Africa, LOL, smh

---

quote:

---

 Fig.2

Schematic of a serial found effect. We illustrate the effect of serial founder events on genetic diversity in the context of the OOA expansion. Colored dots indicate genetic diversity. Each new group outside of Africa represents a sampling of the genetic diversity present in its founder population. The ancestral population in Africa was sufficiently large to build up and retain substantial genetic diversity.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:
^ how ridiculous quoting Brenn Henn, the queen of back migration

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:
^ how ridiculous quoting Brenn Henn, the queen of back migration

---

quote:

---

According to David Comas, coordinator of the study and researcher at the Institute for Evolutionary Biology (CSIC-UPF), "some of the questions we wanted to answer were whether today's inhabitants are direct descendants of the populations with the oldest archaeological remains in the region, dating back fifty thousand years, or whether they are descendants of the Neolithic populations in the Middle East which introduced agriculture to the region around eight thousand years ago. We also wondered if there had been any genetic exchange between the North African populations and the neighbouring regions and if so, when these took place.


A native genetic component defines North Africans


To answer these questions, the researchers analyzed around 800,000 genetic markers, distributed throughout the entire genome in 125 North African individuals belonging to seven representative populations in the whole region, and the information obtained was compared with the information from the neighbouring populations.

The results of this study show that there is a native genetic component which defines North Africans. In-depth study of these markers, shows that the people inhabiting North Africa today are not descendants of either the earliest occupants of this region fifty thousand years ago, or descendants of the most recent Neolithic populations.


The ancestors of modern North Africans returned to Africa


The data shows that the ancestors of today's North Africans were a group of populations which already lived in the region around thirteen thousand years ago. Furthermore, this local North African genetic component is very different from the one found in the populations in the south of the Sahara, which shows that the ancestors of today's North Africans were members of a subgroup of humanity who left Africa to conquer the rest of the world and who subsequently returned to the north of the continent to settle in the region.

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Originally posted by the lioness,:
Smh, You must have forgotten the famous article Brenna Henn wrote, LOL

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"however, the time and the extent of genetic divergence between populations north and south of the Sahara remain poorly understood"

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Originally posted by the lioness,:
So you're saying she changed her position , that Genomic Ancestry of North Africans DOES NOT Support Back-to-Africa Migrations???

that's her new position?

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Originally posted by Ish Gebor:


I am not saying anything.

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Originally posted by the lioness,:

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Originally posted by Ish Gebor:


I am not saying anything.

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I know

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According to this recent study modern Egyptians are 80% non-African and 20% African. And the non-African admixtures are dated to around 750 years ago. Well, after the foundation of Ancient Egypt or the precursor cultures (Badarians, Tasians, Nabta Playa, etc).

"Using ADMIXTURE and principal-component analysis (PCA) (Figure 1A), we estimated the average proportion of non-African ancestry in the Egyptians to be 80% and dated the midpoint of the admixture event by using ALDER20 to around 750 years ago (Table S2), consistent with the Islamic expansion and dates reported previously."

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--Luca Pagan et al.

Tracing the Route of Modern Humans out of Africa by Using 225 Human Genome Sequences from Ethiopians and Egyptians

You lose again, bye bye.
 

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Posted by Njii (Member # 21985) on :
 


The Khoisan people have been found to have R-M269. The Khoisan are some of the oldest people on earth and have lived isolated from most populations. They could not have gotten these genes from a back migration population because most of these people live in Southwest Africa. This is solid proof that the R Haplogroup had to originate in Africa.

Whenever white geneticists want to hide the origin of genes they separate the races and give the same marker in different races different names. This is a trick that we should all be smart enough to catch. Not all genes shared by African and Non African people came into Africa as a result of a Back Migration. To believe this is to believe in white supremacy.
 

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