This is topic USA Blacks And The Sport Of Boxing: The Greatest In The World! in forum Deshret at EgyptSearch Forums.


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Posted by Narmerthoth (Member # 20259) on :
 
Boxing is the number 1 sport for gauging physical superiority, man against man.
For blacks, especially those African Americans in the USA, boxing has been a tremendous sport of pride, for it is the only sport where a black man can beat the hell out of an albino legally, and get paid to do it.

When a reporter asked Miles Davis, an huge boxing fan, what he'd like to do if told he only had 10 minutes left to live, Miles coolly responded;
"If I had only 10 minutes left to live I'd like to spend it by choking the hell out of a white man".

All of the United States greatest boxing since the 1800s have been African Americans. Sure, Albinos attempt to shoe-in a couple token whites like Jack Dempsey, but anyone even half familiar with the sport understand that Dempsey doesn't belong on the list of All Time Greats.

Here is a list of The world's all time greatest boxers, starting from the 1900s to present.

1. Sugar Ray Robinson "Pound for Pound, #1"
2. Mohammed Ali "The Greatest & World's most recognized person"
3. Henry Armstrong "181 fights, 151 wins, and 101 knock outs"
4. Jack Johnson "First African American Heavyweight champion"
5. Sam Langford "256 fights, 180 wins, 128 KOs, 39 draws"
6. Joe Louis "US champion against the Nazis"
7. Roberto Duran "held world titles in 4 weight divisions"
8. Joe Frazier "Ali Vs Frazier- Fight Of The Century"
9. Lennox Lewis
10.Floyd Mayweather, Jr. "Largest purse ever in the sport"

As you can easily see, the list is largely comprised of African American and a Panamanian, Roberto Duran.

It is amazing in that, the US around 10% black population, yet the best boxers found in the world were African Americans.

Boxing is also the most racial polarizing of all sports.
Fan racism can be hidden in other team sports because a team's members may be multi-racial, so whites and blacks may root for the same team.
However, in boxing, with the exception of Joe Louis, where he represented the US against Nazi Germany, most often when a black is boxing against a white, the white majority will always root for the white, and there is little to no attempt to hide it.
Mohammed Ali was so well known and so great because for blacks, he was a man of principle and pride, but for whites, he was the black man to beat.
In a sport controlled by Jewish mobsters, the reason Mohammed Ali survived for so long can be attributed to his conversion to The Nation Of Islam, and the organizations rise in boxing political power. Only the NOI could stand up to and strike fear in the Jewish mob.

Floyd Mayweather deserves a position in the top ten mostly due to his going undefeated in his 19 year career, as well as earning more revenue than anyone else in the sport's history.

For four years in a row, Floyd Mayweather was named as the world's highest paid athlete on the Forbes list, and this was against albino shoe-in champions like Vladimir Klitscho, who was handed endorsements from Mercedes, BMW, and many other product manufacturers.
Floyd Mayweather generated close to 3/4 of $1B over the 19 year span of his career, without any product endorsements.
http://www.forbes.com/sites/kurtbadenhausen/2015/09/13/mayweather-routs-berto-finishes-career-with-700-million-in-earnings/#437b825241f1

So, the fact that all the all time great boxers are African Americans leaves a huge mystery of why Africa has no representation on the list?
After all, African Americans are just Africans stolen from their home countries, and boxing is a huge sport in Africa.
So, why are African boxers missing from the list?

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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sam_Langford

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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sugar_Ray_Robinson

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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henry_Armstrong

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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joe_Louis

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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roberto_Dur%C3%A1n

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Posted by Narmerthoth (Member # 20259) on :
 
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http://www.pbs.org/unforgivableblackness/rebel/

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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lennox_Lewis

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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Floyd_Mayweather_Jr.

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"Smokin" Joe Frazier
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joe_Frazier
 
Posted by Narmerthoth (Member # 20259) on :
 
The sport of boxing is huge in countries like the UK, Russia and Asia, but has waned in the United States since the feminisation of the American male.
In the UK, even B level fighters draw audiences of 80,000, while in the USA that same fight would barely attract 8,000.

Boxing appeals to people from the lowest economic status up to the very top.
Here we see one of the world's richest men, Warren Buffet, worth an estimated $65 Billion attending a boxing match in Omaha of Terence Crawford Vs John Molina. Terence Crawford is currently one of the best pound for pound boxers in the sport.

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It's pretty amazing that Buffet, flanked by his two bytches, purchased tickets for the fight, not in the premium seats, but in 15th row cheap seats.
 
Posted by lamin (Member # 5777) on :
 
Training seems to be the answer.

Cuba's black population is much less than that of Brazil, yet Cuba has produced more outstanding boxers. There have been some very good black heavyweight boxers from Britain: Frank Bruno, Lennox Lewis and now Anthony Joshua. A great fight would be a young Iron Mike Tyson vs. Anthony Joshua.

One thing they have in common, African genes.

So, it must boil down to training conditions and sponsorships.
 
Posted by Mike111 (Member # 9361) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by lamin:
Training seems to be the answer.

Cuba's black population is much less than that of Brazil, yet Cuba has produced more outstanding boxers. There have been some very good black heavyweight boxers from Britain: Frank Bruno, Lennox Lewis and now Anthony Joshua. A great fight would be a young Iron Mike Tyson vs. Anthony Joshua.

One thing they have in common, African genes.

So, it must boil down to training conditions and sponsorships.

Cuba's Black population is "Self-aware" and assertive.

Brazil's is clueless and hoping for pity as they are being exterminated.

All humans have African genes - including European Albinos, whose African genes are NEWER than many.
 
Posted by the lioness, (Member # 17353) on :
 
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Azumah Nelson , Ghana
Widely considered the greatest African boxer of all time
 
Posted by IronLion (Member # 16412) on :
 
Anthony Oluwafemi Olaseni Joshua. alias, AJ. born, 1989-10-15 / age 27

Born to Nigerian Immigrant Parents in U.K.

World Champion

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Posted by IronLion (Member # 16412) on :
 
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Dick Tiger

World Champion

Nigerian origin
 
Posted by IronLion (Member # 16412) on :
 
http://www.africapublic.com/the-story-of-a-fallen-star-ike-ibeabuchi/

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When debating the greatest heavyweights of all time, inside most boxing circles someone will inevitably start a comment with, “Well if Ike Ibeabuchi never went to prison…” For those unfamiliar with heavyweight boxing in the 90s, Ike Ibeabuchi was one of the top prospects in the sport’s most revered division, boasting a very solid 20-0 record with 15KOs by, and bested the then undefeated David Tua and eventual IBF Heavyweight champion Chris Byrd in devastating fashion. In fact, Ibeabuchi’s knockdown punch on Bryd is one of the most brutal punches I’ve ever seen landed in boxing. Many also prospected that he would have won against the likes of Mike Tyson and Lennox Lewis had his career not been cut short.....

http://fightland.vice.com/blog/former-heavyweight-sensation-ike-ibeabuchi-is-planning-a-comeback
 
Posted by IronLion (Member # 16412) on :
 
 -

Simpiye Vetyeka South African Boxer

Current WBC World Champion

Featherweight rank


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ame: Moruti Mthalane
Alias: Babyface
Born: 1982-10-06
Birthplace: Gauteng, South Africa
Hometown: KwaZulu-Natal, South Africa

Current IBF World Champion

Fly Weight Division
 
Posted by Narmerthoth (Member # 20259) on :
 
Africa currently have no boxers on the world All Time great list, which to me is very puzzling, since Africa has a magnitude more blacks than the United States.

So, percentage wise, Africa should have at least an equal number of All Time Great boxers, but statistically they should have many more.

One of the very best boxers out of Africa in recent times was Heavy-weight boxing contender, Ike Ibeabuchi out of Nigeria.
Ike Ibeabuchi was well on his way to becoming a world heavyweight champion after his defeat on New Zealand's David Tua.

I, a huge Ibeabuchi fan, believed that Ike would not only beat both Klitscho brothers and gain a HW championship, but had the ability and skills to eventually be placed in the World's top 20 All Time Great list of boxers.

Following his amazing defeat of Tua in an epic HW battle, Ibeabuchi was on the fast path of facing the Russian Klitscho brothers, who I definitely though he would defeat, but then something happened to not only derail Ibeabuchi's boxing career, but also to deny him his freedom with an 8 year prison sentence.

Ibeabuchi fell prey to the same Jewish Mobster set-up that entrapped Mike Tyson and many other African-American boxers.
The tried and true: Send a hooker to scream rape set-up that the Jewish Mob has successfully used to entrap US black boxers since the early 1900s.

With Ibeabuchi imprisoned and out of the way, and David Tua tied up in legal managerial stasis by his Jewish manager, the path was open and clear for the Russian Klitscho brothers (Products of Russian KGB genetic experiments) with no worthy opposition, to gain and retain all the world HW titles and to hold them for the next 10 years, generating 100s of millions of dollars of revenue.

By the time the albinos allowed Ibeabuchi to go free, his prime years were far behind, and he weighed in at an out of boxing weight of over 300 lbs.

Ibeabuchi's mother, a registered nurse is on record as stating that her son was fed all kinds of Antidepressant drugs were incarcerated, and that these drugs have completely impaired her son's mind.

The story of Ike Ibeabuchi: The dream that never was

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Mother's request for intervension

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Ike and mum

Patricia Ibeabuchi Interview

http://www.lindaikejisblog.com/2013/08/the-story-of-ike-ibeabuchi-dream-that.html

Note, in the interview Ms. Ibeabuchi mentions Top Rank Boxing Promotion, which is run by a Zionist Jew Mobster named Bob Arum. Arum is the same Jew who promotes Manny Pacquaio and has mismanaged Pacquaio into owing over $65M in back taxes, while Arum collects 30% off the top of all pacquaio earnings.
Just for reference, Pacqauio earned over $100M for his fight against Mayweather, meaning for that one fight alone, Bob Arum made over $30M off of Pac for that one fight.
 
Posted by IronLion (Member # 16412) on :
 
Hogan Kid Bassey wins world championship:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QsZD-upMHfo
 
Posted by Nehesy (Member # 17252) on :
 
Well Boxing has nothing to do with genes, I think.

Like all martial arts physical conditioning is compulsory (70 % of a fight's outcome depends on endurance and strenght).(English)Boxing and Muay Thai Boxing are highly energy draining, and consequently their conditioning is the best out here. Plus you have to respect your body with diets and effective rest.

Boxing is an art and a science: footsteps, combinations, bobbing and weaving, strategy etc

Afro Americans boxers were the best not because of their genes but of their effective training, and their willingness to train hard.

Just look at Mike Tyson, when he started chasing women and gave up his hard training sessions, he became a "common" boxer.

Sugar Ray Robinson was AMAZING, looking at some of his documentaries in YouTube: his style inspired the Great Muhammad Ali who acknowledged that Robinson was the best POP boxer ever.

Thomas Hearns who KO'd Roberto Duran in a NASTY way or Marvin Hagler were also fierce fighters. Frazier, Foreman, Holyfield...AAs produced GREAT fighters, and USA is the mecca of boxing.
 
Posted by Mike111 (Member # 9361) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Nehesy:

Well Boxing has nothing to do with genes, I think.
Boxing is an art and a science: footsteps, combinations, bobbing and weaving, strategy etc

Afro Americans boxers were the best not because of their genes but of their effective training, and their willingness to train hard.

.
Nehesy - was it really that much trouble to do a little research before opining on something that you really don't know anything about?

As the original humans, Blacks have all of the attributes developed by "HOMO's" over the time of our existence.

Part of this human development was the ability to feature development of "FAST TWITCH" (speed and power) or "SLOW TWITCH" (Endurance) muscles, depending on environment and need.

None of the Albino derived races have these attributes in the same measure.

Google "fast twitch muscles genetics"
For info and studies.
 
Posted by Nehesy (Member # 17252) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Mike111:
quote:
Originally posted by Nehesy:

Well Boxing has nothing to do with genes, I think.
Boxing is an art and a science: footsteps, combinations, bobbing and weaving, strategy etc

Afro Americans boxers were the best not because of their genes but of their effective training, and their willingness to train hard.

.
Nehesy - was it really that much trouble to do a little research before opining on something that you really don't know anything about?

As the original humans, Blacks have all of the attributes developed by "HOMO's" over the time of our existence.

Part of this human development was the ability to feature development of "FAST TWITCH" (speed and power) or "SLOW TWITCH" (Endurance) muscles, depending on environment and need.

None of the Albino derived races have these attributes in the same measure.

Google "fast twitch muscles genetics"
For info and studies.

Mike,

17 years of Martial Arts (started in 1999) and still practicing :

- 10 years of Indonesian Penchak Silat (Setia Hati Terate, Wali Songo, Cimande)...

- Muay Thai Boxing since 2008...I train in a camp called Derek Boxing (Paris Suburb) with many World Champions or Former World Champions...Joel Cesar, Danny Bill, Gregory Choplin etc,etc

So in conclusion, Mike in terms of Martial Arts and Boxing I could give some lessons for sure...Young, Fit, Strong and Trained...

PS1: I never speak about something I don't know, this is what we call humility...I'll have a look at your information though...

PS2: Kovalev beat the hell out of brother Ward, even with his "albino" derived genes...
 
Posted by Mike111 (Member # 9361) on :
 
^Albinos beat the hell out of dumb niggers the world over, who though they didn't have anything to worry about with those colorless Albinos. Dealing with a "prepared" Black man is another thing entirely for the Albino.

Btw - someone posted a youtube video of two teenagers - one Black, one Albino, play boxing in the middle of a suburban street.
The Black kid was into showing his speed and skill, so he never threw a punch, just bobbed and weaved his head when the Albino kid threw his punches.

I always wish that I had kept that video as an example of the Dumb Nigger.

Because of course, given enough chances, anyone can connect with a lucky punch.

That Albino boy knocked that young Negro OUT!
 
Posted by Narmerthoth (Member # 20259) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Nehesy:
Well Boxing has nothing to do with genes, I think.

Like all martial arts physical conditioning is compulsory (70 % of a fight's outcome depends on endurance and strenght).(English)Boxing and Muay Thai Boxing are highly energy draining, and consequently their conditioning is the best out here. Plus you have to respect your body with diets and effective rest.

Boxing is an art and a science: footsteps, combinations, bobbing and weaving, strategy etc

Afro Americans boxers were the best not because of their genes but of their effective training, and their willingness to train hard.

Just look at Mike Tyson, when he started chasing women and gave up his hard training sessions, he became a "common" boxer.

Sugar Ray Robinson was AMAZING, looking at some of his documentaries in YouTube: his style inspired the Great Muhammad Ali who acknowledged that Robinson was the best POP boxer ever.

Thomas Hearns who KO'd Roberto Duran in a NASTY way or Marvin Hagler were also fierce fighters. Frazier, Foreman, Holyfield...AAs produced GREAT fighters, and USA is the mecca of boxing.

You're wrong.
Boxing, as well as many other sports has much to do with genetics.
Strength, reflexes, endurance, are all predetermined by genetic composition.

As example, it is a biological fact that black women birth children with 30% higher bone density than white women.
Bigger bones can carry larger muscles.

Also, muscle twitch factor (reflexes) are dependent on the time the brain sends signalling to the muscle via neuromuscular melanin interconnects. This is accomplished by Eumelanin in spinal fluid which connects the brain to all other parts of the body.

Whites knew there is a genetic difference between blacks and whites early in the 1700s, and in the US, sports competition between whites and blacks was illegal until the early 1900s.
Even in the 1940s NBA/ABA Basketball teams were comprised of all whites (Jews), and it was a sad thing to watch. The sport didn't become popular until the 1950s when Blacks began being integrated into basketball teams. When blacks were allowed in there was no longer a place for Jews. They simply could not compete.

Same with Boxing.
This is why today you see all Russian boxers being caught using steroids and PEDs (Performance Enhancing Drugs) to counter their genetic short comings. Without artificial enhancement, Russians and whites in general just cannot compete with the naturally gifted black athletes.

The same is true for Martial Arts, but don't confuse Martial arts with the sport of boxing. They are not the same. Very few Martial Artists can successfully make the transition to boxing.
Buddha introduced Martial arts into Asia, not as a combat sport, but to help strengthen weak albino bodies and minds.

Being from Russia, there is a 90% probability that Kovalev, Golovkin and both Klitscho brothers are products of long term steroids and PED usage.
It has been proven that steroid and PED use has been mandated in Russia from Putin on down with severe penalties given to Russian athletes who don't comply.
This is why they were totally banned from competing in the RIO Olympics.

However, I have wondered why all the world's greatest boxers are African American and none African.
African Americans (and African-Cubans, Brazilian, Afro-Britains, etc.) beat up every other country in the world, but today's native Africans get beaten silly by Russians, Americans, and even Asians.

I have a couple theories of why this is and will post them shortly.
 
Posted by Mike111 (Member # 9361) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Narmerthoth:
today's native Africans get beaten silly by Russians, Americans, and even Asians.

I have a couple theories of why this is and will post them shortly.

.
I will recount something I saw on T.V. many years ago. It was some kind of martial arts championship. An African with a beautiful physique was pitted against an Asian - perhaps Japanese.

As the match started the African took up the supposedly classic stance of sideways with left leg extended and bent at the knees and right leg back with foot perpendicular for balance.

The Asian man merely used the top of his foot to slap at the calf muscle of the African.

The African recoiled at the slap, then returned to his original position.

The Asian man again used the top of his foot to slap at the calf muscle of the African.

The African again recoiled at the slap, then returned to his original position.

The Asian man again used the top of his foot to slap at the calf muscle of the African.

The African again recoiled at the slap, then TRIED to returned to his original position - but could not, his calf muscle was in spasm and locked-up.

In that one encounter we see the foundations of much of Africa's problems.

They take the word of others at face value, without though, nor intent to improve upon what they were taught. Thus they are always two steps back.
 
Posted by Narmerthoth (Member # 20259) on :
 
^ This is technique that works on many boxers, because boxers aren't trained and prepared for calf and shin strikes.

Ali did an exhibition bout with a Martial artist back in the 1960s or 70s and the Asian martial artist used the same technique of attacking the calf and shin. Although Ali was the greatest boxer, he was totally unprepared for this.
The basic sweep is another technique boxers are susceptible to. They don't see it coming and next thing you know, they are on their back.

When I grew up, I had a friend who was older than me and was a master in Chinese and Korean martial arts.
He held a belt in Taekwondo that was black, but had red strips.
There were many brothers who held black belts, but his ranked higher, thus the red strips.
I used to watch him do calf and shin strikes against a wooden pole, repetitively. This is conditioning his calves for these type of strikes, as well as his offence to apply those strikes.

Being from the hood, this brother was a natural boxer and coupled with his martial arts skills, he was a virtually unbeatable brother.
I used to think, this brother could probably beat Bruce Lee.
He practised Buddhism and used to always tell me that martial arts aren't any good without applying the spiritual aspects.

The technique used above and on Ali won't have worked on him.
 
Posted by IronLion (Member # 16412) on :
 
Mike and Narmer

This is 2017. AAs have this Trump and KKK problem to deal with. And you guys are still dumping it on the Africans?? Eh?

Whats up brothers?

IronLion
 
Posted by Mike111 (Member # 9361) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by IronLion:
Mike and Narmer

This is 2017. AAs have this Trump and KKK problem to deal with. And you guys are still dumping it on the Africans?? Eh?

Whats up brothers?

IronLion

.
Sooner or later, Africans will do better just to shut us up.

Then we will have an ally instead of a burden.
 
Posted by Narmerthoth (Member # 20259) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by IronLion:
Mike and Narmer

This is 2017. AAs have this Trump and KKK problem to deal with. And you guys are still dumping it on the Africans?? Eh?

Whats up brothers?

IronLion

If you can refute the historic international boxing data, then refute it. Else, stop being defensive in the face of facts and offer so context to why African boxers fall so short.

I ALWAYS root for the African against the Russian or European, but they always let me down, and I'm tired of it. I'm tired of rooting for the African only to see some Albino beat them down.
Don't believe me. Just watch British Boxing where there are a greater number of African boxers than in the US, boxing against British and Russian albinos.

It can't be genetics.
They have the same genetics as their African American ATG counterparts.
It can't be management and training. Like you said, it's 2017, so they have the choice to get the same managers and trainers.
Is it the mindset?
Possibly.
Is it diet?
Possible.

Then you can look at tiny Cuba who have the best Afro-Cuban boxers in the world. Russian boxers fear Cuba's black boxers. So the genetics of Cubans and African Americans in boxing seem on par.

All I know is Africans have been competing in international boxing as long as African Americans and logically, they should be equally, if not greater represented in the International Boxing ATG list, but they aren't. In fact, there are none there, which is extremely puzzling.


Why do YOU think they aren't?
 
Posted by Mike111 (Member # 9361) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Narmerthoth:

Then you can look at tiny Cuba who have the best Afro-Cuban boxers in the world. Russian boxers fear Cuba's black boxers. So the genetics of Cubans and African Americans in boxing seem on par.

.
Blacks in the Americas represent survivors of mass murder in Europe and the Americas, and then, often the enslavement of survivors. They also survived the most brutal treatment; including transportation from Africa. Not to mention the use of disease as a weapon of war. Thus the American Black is genetically the best of the best.

Point being - the American hemisphere Black is quite different from all others.
 
Posted by Narmerthoth (Member # 20259) on :
 
Mike, I'm thinking as I have posted before, that no matter how inhumane African slavery was, in the end it was still a huge business.
With any business you differentiate your products by quality. I.E., Premium, medium, low quality.
The grade of the product dictates the price.
Therefore, as we know, Slaves with in-demand skills would offer a premium price over those who were just basic grunts.
So, slaves with skills in Engineering, architecture, Agriculture and other disciplines would offer the highest price over those who were just general labourers.
It's highly improbable that slavers would target the weakest and least skilled for sale to a country in it's infancy, with a deficiency of skilled labor.
For one, the weakest had less chance of surviving the voyage, and if they did, they would go for a low price.

We know that Jews are all about profit.
We know that Jews were the albinos who were best at selecting the natives and also owned the ships that transported them.
We know that Jews owned many of the auction houses selling slaves and that Jews were the ones selling and setting the selling price of slaves.

Think about it.

Is it possible that skilled slaves were most in-demand for a country being built and needing skilled labor to build it?
Is it possible that this demand actually depleted Africa of it's most skilled talents, shipping them to America, Europe and the Islands?

These people were probably also the leaders of African nations, so by kidnapping and shipping them off, the Europeans were really killing two birds with one stone.
first, by getting Africans as products with skills that command the highest price, and secondly, to ship off those who were most capable of organizing resistance to rebel against the invaders.

I don't doubt that for some Africans, they were pleased to see them go, because now they could rise to positions they would otherwise had no chance of filling.
 
Posted by Mike111 (Member # 9361) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Narmerthoth:

It's highly improbable that slavers would target the weakest and least skilled for sale to a country in it's infancy, with a deficiency of skilled labor.
For one, the weakest had less chance of surviving the voyage, and if they did, they would go for a low price.

.
I find it interesting that after all these years of discussion and copious evidence, you and many others, still can't intellectually accept that what the Albinos taught you over much of your lifetime WAS A LIE!

Except in Brazil and a few of the Caribbean Islands, most Black Americans are Natives Americans or Europeans.

But you are quite correct about the skills of slaves:

That is why I so denigrate the Southern Albino for his abject stupidity.

The Plantation owner was intent on having his plantation "Self-sufficient" needing neither outside goods nor outside skill.

Thus the only job one of those dumb bastards could ever hope to get was as an "Overseer". How many of those do you think were needed?

But those ass-holes took their pink asses to be slaughtered in war, and those that didn't go willingly were forced or killed.

After the slaughter was over, those dumb bastards then convinced themselves that they had done something NOBLE - ha,ha,ha.

Imagine that, killed by the hundreds of thousands so you wouldn't be able to get a job: then your dumb-assed descendants celebrate your stupidity by clinging to the flag you were duped with.
 
Posted by Mike111 (Member # 9361) on :
 
Southern Society
(The Antebellum South)

In eighteenth-century America, planters expected to have a large number of skilled slaves as well as common laborers. “I have my Flocks and my Herds, my Bond-men and Bond-women, and every sort of Trade amongst my own Servants,” wrote William Byrd II in 1727, who expressed an ideal of being able to “live in a kind of Independence”. James Grant described a similar attitude as existing in the lower South, including South Carolina and Georgia: “the Planter has Tradesmen of all kinds in his Gang of Slaves, and ‘tis a Rule with them, never to pay Money for what can be made upon their Estates, not a Lock, a Hinge or a Nail if they can avoid it.” In other words, planters expected enslaved people to perform a wide range of jobs that included carpenter, cooper, boatman, cook, seamstress, and blacksmith, to mention only a few of the skilled functions required around plantations.

Talented slaves also ensured the planters’ personal comfort, as in the case of expert and sensitive body servants. Both George Washington and Thomas Jefferson had accomplished cooks, and Jefferson’s was French-trained.

(How do you suppose an African taken from the Bush, got training as a French Chef)?

One could not readily dispense with such people. Whether they were making boats or barrels, building barns or houses, making furniture (either fine or just functional), being able to make or repair harnesses or do other leatherwork, or various kinds of ironwork, people with artisanal capability were in short supply in the eighteenth century and not everywhere in the nineteenth: further, Whites ones were expensive where found. Of course, the possession of these skills gave slaves leverage because planters desired to keep them at home, and at work, rather than run away. Thus a slave's skill level and value to the master often determined how he/she was treated.

Skilled Blacks, both free and hired-out slave, were instrumental in building the U.S. Capital and White House, as well as perhaps the majority of buildings and Bridges in the antebellum South, including:

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Posted by Mike111 (Member # 9361) on :
 
So in truth, skilled Blacks, both free and slave, were an integral part of Southern life. The Colonial Williamsburg Foundation collected this list of advertisements for Black workers and Tradesmen found in the Virginia Gazette by year in which it appeared.

Baker Negro baker for trade. 2/26/1780
Baker Negro baker for trade. 2/19/1780
Baker Negro baker for trade. 2/12/1780
Blacksmith Negro blacksmith for hire. 8/14/1779
Blacksmith Negro blacksmith for hire. 8/7/1779
Blacksmith Negro blacksmith for hire. 7/24/1779
Blacksmith Negro blacksmith for hire. 4/16/1779
Ironworker Negro workers wanted. 12/19/1777
Ironworker Negro workers wanted. 12/5/1777
Ironworker Negro workers wanted. 12/5/1777
Ironworker Negro workers wanted. 11/28/1777
Weaver Manufactory seeking negro child apprentices. 11/28/1777
Ironworker Negro workers, all trades, wanted. 11/14/1777
Ironworker Negro workers, all trades, wanted. 11/7/1777
Ironworker Negro workers, all trades, wanted. 10/31/1777
Carpenter Carpenters (white and negro) wanted. 8/1/1777
Carpenter Carpenters (white and negro) wanted. 7/25/1777
Carpenter House carpenters, Negro carpenters wanted. 4/11/1777
Carpenter Carpenters (white and negro) wanted. 4/11/1777
Carpenter Carpenters (white and negro) wanted. 4/4/1777
Carpenter House carpenters, Negro carpenters wanted. 3/28/1777
Carpenter Carpenters (white and negro) wanted. 3/28/1777
Carpenter Carpenters (white and negro) wanted. 3/21/1777
Carpenter House carpenters, Negro carpenters wanted. 3/21/1777
Saltmaker Negro workers wanted. 3/14/1777
Ironworker Negro workers wanted. 3/7/1777
Ironworker Negro workers wanted. 2/28/1777
Ironworker Negro workers wanted. 2/21/1777
Saltmaker Repayment of debts to come; Negros wanted. 2/21/1777
Ironworker Seeks Negro workers. 2/21/1777
Ironworker Seeks Negro workers. 2/14/1777
Joiner Shop joiners, negro carpenters wanted. 1/31/1777
Blacksmith Negro blacksmith for hire. 1/31/1777
Blacksmith Negro blacksmith for hire. 1/24/1777
Blacksmith Negro blacksmith for hire. 1/17/1777
Joiner Very faint; shop joiners, negro carpenters wanted. 1/17/1777
Joiner Shop joiners, negro carpenters wanted. 1/10/1777
Carpenter Negro carpenters wanted. 4/5/1776
Carpenter Negro carpenters wanted. 3/29/1776
Carpenter Negro carpenters wanted. 3/22/1776
Blacksmith Negro blacksmith for hire. 2/9/1776
Blacksmith Negro blacksmith for hire. 2/2/1776
Blacksmith "Valuable Negro Blacksmith" to be hired. 1/27/1776
Blacksmith Negro blacksmith for hire. 1/26/1776
Carpenter Negro carpenter for hire. 1/5/1776
Blacksmith Negro blacksmith wanted. 11/21/1771
Blacksmith Negro blacksmith wanted. 11/14/1771
Blacksmith Negro blacksmith wanted. 11/7/1771
Musician Negro musician wanted for hire or purchase. 10/5/1769
Musician Negro musician wanted for hire or purchase. 9/21/1769
Musician Negro musician wanted for hire or purchase. 9/14/1769
Carpenter "Four Negro Carpenters" from deceased man's estate 4/6/1769
Carpenter "Four Negro Carpenters" from deceased man's estate 3/9/1769
Carpenter "Four Negro Carpenters" from deceased man's estate 2/23/1769

.
African Slaves would not have had these types of skills.
 
Posted by IronLion (Member # 16412) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Narmerthoth:


All I know is Africans have been competing in international boxing as long as African Americans ..... which is extremely puzzling.


Why do YOU think they aren't?

Can you be specific regarding the information above. When did AAs start competing in international boxing? When did Africans start? With sources if possible...

Waiting...
 
Posted by the lioness, (Member # 17353) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Mike111:


most Black Americans are Natives Americans or Europeans.


So most "African Americans" are not African

Most were tricked into thinking they were African

Most are actually Natives Americans or Black Europeans but just by coincidence they both look African
 
Posted by IronLion (Member # 16412) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Mike111:
quote:
Originally posted by Narmerthoth:

Then you can look at tiny Cuba who have the best Afro-Cuban boxers in the world. Russian boxers fear Cuba's black boxers. So the genetics of Cubans and African Americans in boxing seem on par.

.
Blacks in the Americas represent survivors of mass murder in Europe and the Americas, and then, often the enslavement of survivors. They also survived the most brutal treatment; including transportation from Africa. Not to mention the use of disease as a weapon of war. Thus the American Black is genetically the best of the best.

Point being - the American hemisphere Black is quite different from all others.

No. going by the same logic you use for Africans AAs are fucking losers because they lost three continents to obviously "weaker albinos". Europe and the 2 Americas.

AAs must be worse off in the mind set than Africans who lost just one continent, and Indians who lost half a continent.

AAs were genocided, then enslaved, then the jim crowed, then the kkk-ed, then lynched; which persists today and manifests as those public lynchings and killings by police.

Again and again the weak albino wallops our collective AA asses.

Is that a sign of strength and superiority? Is there a link there to your dislike of Africans?
 
Posted by IronLion (Member # 16412) on :
 
The black race is the most hated race on planet earth and black people being the most hated race on planet earth should stick together instead of trying to pick tribes and races that they do not among themselves.

We do not have the luxury of refusing to cooperate because we believe we are black Europeans rather than Africans, or black Asians against black South America.

Nomatter how black European your black ass maybe, you are still a black man to any pink ass European. He dont give a **** which tribe you think you belong, and would shoot you just like he would shoot a black Australian, given the chance.

This divisive philosophy is disgraceful and should cease!
 
Posted by Narmerthoth (Member # 20259) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Mike111:
So in truth, skilled Blacks, both free and slave, were an integral part of Southern life. The Colonial Williamsburg Foundation collected this list of advertisements for Black workers and Tradesmen found in the Virginia Gazette by year in which it appeared.

Baker Negro baker for trade. 2/26/1780
Baker Negro baker for trade. 2/19/1780
Baker Negro baker for trade. 2/12/1780
Blacksmith Negro blacksmith for hire. 8/14/1779
Blacksmith Negro blacksmith for hire. 8/7/1779
Blacksmith Negro blacksmith for hire. 7/24/1779
Blacksmith Negro blacksmith for hire. 4/16/1779
Ironworker Negro workers wanted. 12/19/1777
Ironworker Negro workers wanted. 12/5/1777
Ironworker Negro workers wanted. 12/5/1777
Ironworker Negro workers wanted. 11/28/1777
Weaver Manufactory seeking negro child apprentices. 11/28/1777
Ironworker Negro workers, all trades, wanted. 11/14/1777
Ironworker Negro workers, all trades, wanted. 11/7/1777
Ironworker Negro workers, all trades, wanted. 10/31/1777
Carpenter Carpenters (white and negro) wanted. 8/1/1777
Carpenter Carpenters (white and negro) wanted. 7/25/1777
Carpenter House carpenters, Negro carpenters wanted. 4/11/1777
Carpenter Carpenters (white and negro) wanted. 4/11/1777
Carpenter Carpenters (white and negro) wanted. 4/4/1777
Carpenter House carpenters, Negro carpenters wanted. 3/28/1777
Carpenter Carpenters (white and negro) wanted. 3/28/1777
Carpenter Carpenters (white and negro) wanted. 3/21/1777
Carpenter House carpenters, Negro carpenters wanted. 3/21/1777
Saltmaker Negro workers wanted. 3/14/1777
Ironworker Negro workers wanted. 3/7/1777
Ironworker Negro workers wanted. 2/28/1777
Ironworker Negro workers wanted. 2/21/1777
Saltmaker Repayment of debts to come; Negros wanted. 2/21/1777
Ironworker Seeks Negro workers. 2/21/1777
Ironworker Seeks Negro workers. 2/14/1777
Joiner Shop joiners, negro carpenters wanted. 1/31/1777
Blacksmith Negro blacksmith for hire. 1/31/1777
Blacksmith Negro blacksmith for hire. 1/24/1777
Blacksmith Negro blacksmith for hire. 1/17/1777
Joiner Very faint; shop joiners, negro carpenters wanted. 1/17/1777
Joiner Shop joiners, negro carpenters wanted. 1/10/1777
Carpenter Negro carpenters wanted. 4/5/1776
Carpenter Negro carpenters wanted. 3/29/1776
Carpenter Negro carpenters wanted. 3/22/1776
Blacksmith Negro blacksmith for hire. 2/9/1776
Blacksmith Negro blacksmith for hire. 2/2/1776
Blacksmith "Valuable Negro Blacksmith" to be hired. 1/27/1776
Blacksmith Negro blacksmith for hire. 1/26/1776
Carpenter Negro carpenter for hire. 1/5/1776
Blacksmith Negro blacksmith wanted. 11/21/1771
Blacksmith Negro blacksmith wanted. 11/14/1771
Blacksmith Negro blacksmith wanted. 11/7/1771
Musician Negro musician wanted for hire or purchase. 10/5/1769
Musician Negro musician wanted for hire or purchase. 9/21/1769
Musician Negro musician wanted for hire or purchase. 9/14/1769
Carpenter "Four Negro Carpenters" from deceased man's estate 4/6/1769
Carpenter "Four Negro Carpenters" from deceased man's estate 3/9/1769
Carpenter "Four Negro Carpenters" from deceased man's estate 2/23/1769

.
African Slaves would not have had these types of skills.

Sure, I think that Africans would have possessed these skills, and more.
 
Posted by Narmerthoth (Member # 20259) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by IronLion:
quote:
Originally posted by Narmerthoth:


All I know is Africans have been competing in international boxing as long as African Americans ..... which is extremely puzzling.


Why do YOU think they aren't?

Can you be specific regarding the information above. When did AAs start competing in international boxing? When did Africans start? With sources if possible...

Waiting...

Boxing is and always has been very popular in England since the 1500s.

Africans were colonized by the English and everywhere the English went (Africa, Asia, India) they took their boxing rules and set up boxing between the natives.
Today's boxing is based on England's Queensberry Boxing rules as defined in 1867.

Boxing existed in Africa well before England's existence, but today, boxing is in accordance with the English rules.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marquess_of_Queensberry_Rules

Still, that is irrelevant to the question I asked.

For reference, Here is a list of all time great boxers.
http://www.ranker.com/crowdranked-list/the-best-boxers-of-all-time

As I said, IMHO, for the most part African and African Americans are genetically identical.
So, why aren't Africans whipping Albino ass like their African American cousins?
It's a valid question.
 
Posted by Narmerthoth (Member # 20259) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by IronLion:
quote:
Originally posted by Mike111:
quote:
Originally posted by Narmerthoth:

Then you can look at tiny Cuba who have the best Afro-Cuban boxers in the world. Russian boxers fear Cuba's black boxers. So the genetics of Cubans and African Americans in boxing seem on par.

.
Blacks in the Americas represent survivors of mass murder in Europe and the Americas, and then, often the enslavement of survivors. They also survived the most brutal treatment; including transportation from Africa. Not to mention the use of disease as a weapon of war. Thus the American Black is genetically the best of the best.

Point being - the American hemisphere Black is quite different from all others.

No. going by the same logic you use for Africans AAs are fucking losers because they lost three continents to obviously "weaker albinos". Europe and the 2 Americas.

AAs must be worse off in the mind set than Africans who lost just one continent, and Indians who lost half a continent.

AAs were genocided, then enslaved, then the jim crowed, then the kkk-ed, then lynched; which persists today and manifests as those public lynchings and killings by police.

Again and again the weak albino wallops our collective AA asses.

Is that a sign of strength and superiority? Is there a link there to your dislike of Africans?

If what Mike is saying proves true, then they aren't technically AAs and I can't immediately think of an appropriate label. Perhaps Mike already has.

However, if they are AAs or not isn't my question.
 
Posted by Narmerthoth (Member # 20259) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by IronLion:
The black race is the most hated race on planet earth and black people being the most hated race on planet earth should stick together instead of trying to pick tribes and races that they do not among themselves.

We do not have the luxury of refusing to cooperate because we believe we are black Europeans rather than Africans, or black Asians against black South America.

Nomatter how black European your black ass maybe, you are still a black man to any pink ass European. He dont give a **** which tribe you think you belong, and would shoot you just like he would shoot a black Australian, given the chance.

This divisive philosophy is disgraceful and should cease!

Actually, the hate is in your own mind.
In my experience, blacks are the most envied of all so-called races.
Although we are envied, we are disrespected because we allow ourselves to be abused when we clearly are physically superior, but mentally dysfunctional.
Our sad condition is no one's fault but our own.
 
Posted by IronLion (Member # 16412) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Narmerthoth:
quote:
Originally posted by IronLion:
quote:
Originally posted by Narmerthoth:


All I know is Africans have been competing in international boxing as long as African Americans ..... which is extremely puzzling.


Why do YOU think they aren't?

Can you be specific regarding the information above. When did AAs start competing in international boxing? When did Africans start? With sources if possible...

Waiting...

Boxing is and always has been very popular in England since the 1500s.

Africans were colonized by the English and everywhere the English went (Africa, Asia, India) they took their boxing rules and set up boxing between the natives.
Today's boxing is based on England's Queensberry Boxing rules as defined in 1867.

Boxing existed in Africa well before England's existence, but today, boxing is in accordance with the English rules.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marquess_of_Queensberry_Rules

Still, that is irrelevant to the question I asked.

For reference, Here is a list of all time great boxers.
http://www.ranker.com/crowdranked-list/the-best-boxers-of-all-time

As I said, IMHO, for the most part African and African Americans are genetically identical.
So, why aren't Africans whipping Albino ass like their African American cousins?
It's a valid question.

You side stepped my question because you had no answer.

I will help you.

AAs began participating in Western style international boxing in the late 19 century.

Africans got into the game in the 1950s.

AAs should thus be more experienced. AA boxers have had the benefits of world class gyms, world class coaches and world class promoters which are not generally accessible to African boxers.

Western style Boxing, just like western soccer, just like western basket ball games, is a western game not an African game. Africans in the field are learning the rules of something very alien to their culture.

Genetic disposition is honed by good training facilities which lack in African petty states. Promotion is the life blood of most boxers and there is none in Africa.

In any case, no Kenyan has called you mentally lame because you cannot compete with them in long distance races.

Seen?
 
Posted by IronLion (Member # 16412) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Narmerthoth:
quote:
Originally posted by IronLion:
The black race is the most hated race on planet earth and black people being the most hated race on planet earth should stick together instead of trying to pick tribes and races that they do not among themselves.

We do not have the luxury of refusing to cooperate because we believe we are black Europeans rather than Africans, or black Asians against black South America.

Nomatter how black European your black ass maybe, you are still a black man to any pink ass European. He dont give a **** which tribe you think you belong, and would shoot you just like he would shoot a black Australian, given the chance.

This divisive philosophy is disgraceful and should cease!

Actually, the hate is in your own mind.
In my experience, blacks are the most envied of all so-called races.
Although we are envied, we are disrespected because we allow ourselves to be abused when we clearly are physically superior, but mentally dysfunctional.
Our sad condition is no one's fault but our own.

Collective responsibility is alright. The type of divisiveness that Mike has practiced on this forum for a while now is disgusting.

Together we make it or sink.

And by the way, "envy" is not too far off from "hate". Both indicate a feeling of resentment...

quote:
Envy: a feeling of discontented or resentful longing aroused by someone else's possessions, qualities, or luck....
https://www.google.ca/search?q=envy&oq=envy&aqs=chrome..69i57j0l5.7147j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8
 
Posted by Narmerthoth (Member # 20259) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by IronLion:
quote:
Originally posted by Narmerthoth:
quote:
Originally posted by IronLion:
quote:
Originally posted by Narmerthoth:


All I know is Africans have been competing in international boxing as long as African Americans ..... which is extremely puzzling.


Why do YOU think they aren't?

Can you be specific regarding the information above. When did AAs start competing in international boxing? When did Africans start? With sources if possible...

Waiting...

Boxing is and always has been very popular in England since the 1500s.

Africans were colonized by the English and everywhere the English went (Africa, Asia, India) they took their boxing rules and set up boxing between the natives.
Today's boxing is based on England's Queensberry Boxing rules as defined in 1867.

Boxing existed in Africa well before England's existence, but today, boxing is in accordance with the English rules.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marquess_of_Queensberry_Rules

Still, that is irrelevant to the question I asked.

For reference, Here is a list of all time great boxers.
http://www.ranker.com/crowdranked-list/the-best-boxers-of-all-time

As I said, IMHO, for the most part African and African Americans are genetically identical.
So, why aren't Africans whipping Albino ass like their African American cousins?
It's a valid question.

You side stepped my question because you had no answer.

I will help you.

AAs began participating in Western style international boxing in the late 19 century.

Africans got into the game in the 1950s.

AAs should thus be more experienced. AA boxers have had the benefits of world class gyms, world class coaches and world class promoters which are not generally accessible to African boxers.

Western style Boxing, just like western soccer, just like western basket ball games, is a western game not an African game. Africans in the field are learning the rules of something very alien to their culture.

Genetic disposition is honed by good training facilities which lack in African petty states. Promotion is the life blood of most boxers and there is none in Africa.

In any case, no Kenyan has called you mentally lame because you cannot compete with them in long distance races.

Seen?

I didn't side step anything. You are just in defensive mode and refuse to acknowledge the data.
It doesn't matter when AAs or Africans entered into international competition.
They both have been boxing long before then. American boxing didn't start with Jack Johnson in the early 1900s.
African slaves in America have been boxing since they arrived in America and even before.

As a cultural aspect of slavery, sports were an extremely important element of life for the American slave. The competition and athleticism provided through sports granted slaves healthy outlets for aggression and enjoyment with and away from their masters. Although slaves primarily participated in sports on their own time and own terms, occasionally the masters of the plantations would pit their strongest and most valiant slave against a slave from a neighboring plantation in boxing or wrestling matches.[51] These events were prominent among southern plantations and served as forms of entertainment for slave masters and their families as well as the slaves living in the area. Owners predominantly purchased male slaves for their strength and physical prowess. Their white counterparts throughout the country were often times astounded by the brute force and strength presented by the slaves both shipped from Africa and those bred domestically.[52] These slaves were not only efficient field hands but they also made for entertaining competitors within the confines of the ring. The excitement among the plantations would brew as the boxing matches were intense, bare-knuckled brawls filled with violence and blood.[53] Ultimately, the plantation owner whose slave was crowned victor of the match would take the losing slave home. The loser, in other words, was the bet in these competitions.
Sports in Shackles: The Athletic and Recreational Habits of Slaves on Southern Plantations
Jon Griffith

Africans have been boxing well before Whites discovered the African continent.
We didn't just begin boxing when whites allowed us to compete with them, but thousands of years before.

 -
 -
 -
 -

Using those late dates for AAs and Africans in boxing is an excuse because you are afraid to acknowledge and address the issue I presented.

 -
Nigerian Middleweight Champion Dick Tiger, 1964
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dick_Tiger

See.
Africans USED to beat white people up. What happened?

 -
 
Posted by lamin (Member # 5777) on :
 
quote:
Sure, I think that Africans would have possessed these skills, and more.
Yes, Africa had long entered the Iron Age. The Benin Bronzes, Nok Terracotta, and Ife Art in wood and metal all testify to that. The skilled carvings from all over West Africa, the existence of towns with protective gates long exited before the Atlantic trade. Example: the Walled City of Kano.
 
Posted by Nehesy (Member # 17252) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Narmerthoth:
quote:
Originally posted by Nehesy:
Well Boxing has nothing to do with genes, I think.

Like all martial arts physical conditioning is compulsory (70 % of a fight's outcome depends on endurance and strenght).(English)Boxing and Muay Thai Boxing are highly energy draining, and consequently their conditioning is the best out here. Plus you have to respect your body with diets and effective rest.

Boxing is an art and a science: footsteps, combinations, bobbing and weaving, strategy etc

Afro Americans boxers were the best not because of their genes but of their effective training, and their willingness to train hard.

Just look at Mike Tyson, when he started chasing women and gave up his hard training sessions, he became a "common" boxer.

Sugar Ray Robinson was AMAZING, looking at some of his documentaries in YouTube: his style inspired the Great Muhammad Ali who acknowledged that Robinson was the best POP boxer ever.

Thomas Hearns who KO'd Roberto Duran in a NASTY way or Marvin Hagler were also fierce fighters. Frazier, Foreman, Holyfield...AAs produced GREAT fighters, and USA is the mecca of boxing.

You're wrong.
Boxing, as well as many other sports has much to do with genetics.
Strength, reflexes, endurance, are all predetermined by genetic composition.

As example, it is a biological fact that black women birth children with 30% higher bone density than white women.
Bigger bones can carry larger muscles.

Also, muscle twitch factor (reflexes) are dependent on the time the brain sends signalling to the muscle via neuromuscular melanin interconnects. This is accomplished by Eumelanin in spinal fluid which connects the brain to all other parts of the body.

Whites knew there is a genetic difference between blacks and whites early in the 1700s, and in the US, sports competition between whites and blacks was illegal until the early 1900s.
Even in the 1940s NBA/ABA Basketball teams were comprised of all whites (Jews), and it was a sad thing to watch. The sport didn't become popular until the 1950s when Blacks began being integrated into basketball teams. When blacks were allowed in there was no longer a place for Jews. They simply could not compete.

Same with Boxing.
This is why today you see all Russian boxers being caught using steroids and PEDs (Performance Enhancing Drugs) to counter their genetic short comings. Without artificial enhancement, Russians and whites in general just cannot compete with the naturally gifted black athletes.

The same is true for Martial Arts, but don't confuse Martial arts with the sport of boxing. They are not the same. Very few Martial Artists can successfully make the transition to boxing.
Buddha introduced Martial arts into Asia, not as a combat sport, but to help strengthen weak albino bodies and minds.

Being from Russia, there is a 90% probability that Kovalev, Golovkin and both Klitscho brothers are products of long term steroids and PED usage.
It has been proven that steroid and PED use has been mandated in Russia from Putin on down with severe penalties given to Russian athletes who don't comply.
This is why they were totally banned from competing in the RIO Olympics.

However, I have wondered why all the world's greatest boxers are African American and none African.
African Americans (and African-Cubans, Brazilian, Afro-Britains, etc.) beat up every other country in the world, but today's native Africans get beaten silly by Russians, Americans, and even Asians.

I have a couple theories of why this is and will post them shortly.

Well...After Reading all your post, you NEVER trained boxing for sure...There is an Afro American School of Boxing (Boxers and Trainers), it is well known...Eddie Futch rings a bell ??? And your last sentence about Africans (what's up with this BS ?)is just high class ignorance...John Mugabi? Hassan N'Dam ? Souleymane M'Baye ?

Klitschko brothers are punks who only fought 2nd or 3rd class boxers. Lennox Lewis whooped the eldest when he was almost 40 yrs old.

Golovkin never fought a tough guy...

I repeat...Boxing has nothing to do with genes...The way you have been trained is the most important thing.

It's like saying Karate or Judo is linked to Japanese genes. Since they opened their doors and their training methods(to Europeans) they do have an upper hand anymore.

And it is people with African descent: mainly from Africa (Congo,Senegal,Mali, Ivory Coast etc) and few from the West Indies ( French West indies) , trained martial artists (Boxers, Taekwondo, Kick Boxing, Muay Thai, Kung Fu etc) who cleaned up Paris, with the Skinheads trash...Men to men fights in the streets...Research (Paris) BLACK DRAGONS...

Pure Ignorance...
 
Posted by Nehesy (Member # 17252) on :
 
Another aparté, Danny Bill an African raised in Paris. The biggest Muay Thai(boxing and legs) artist of the 90s, and a legend in Thailand.

When he went to Thailand to train and learn their arts, his Asian Muay Thai masters told him that this art came from Africans and showed him documents about this fact and reality...Yes guys...You can find the video on Youtube...

Danny went several times to Runoko Rashidi, conferences here in Paris to tell this story...

I repeat pure ignorance...When having a look at the rebellions during the slave plantations period in the New World...Only Haitians (pure Africans at that time) at this period destroyed their masters and slavery and paved the way for emancipation in many countries in the West Indies and South America...Learn your facts straight guys...
 
Posted by Narmerthoth (Member # 20259) on :
 
Pure Ignorance.

Yes, you are.

John Mugabi, Hassan N'Dam, Souleymane M'Baye were good boxers, but far from being all time greats.
None of them are on the boxing all time great lists I posted above.

You prove my point by bringing up Lennox Lewis's 6 round TKO of Vitali Klitscho.
Lennox Lewis is of Jamaican decent, migrated to Britain. Not African.

Samuel Peters however, who fought and got beat by BOTH Klitscho brothers was an African, or rather I should say, he was a Nigerian.
The way those Russian boys beat up the Nigerian was embarrassing.

Lennox Lewis, a Jamaican, IS on the boxing all time great (ATG) list. He beat up Vitali Klitscho as a black man should.

Samuel Peters, a Nigerian, is not on the ATG list, and for good reason.

Boxing has as little to nothing too do with Martial arts and is as far from martial arts as it is from UFC. Don't get them twisted, foolish one.

Eddie Futch is a great African American boxing trainer. He is an AA, not African.
Africa has produced no boxing trainers who are listed on the boxing all time great list.
In fact, I had a good laugh when I saw LHW South African boxer Chilemba being trained by a white woman.
Needless to say, the Russian, Kovalev knocked Chilimba out.
 
Posted by Narmerthoth (Member # 20259) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Nehesy:
Another aparté, Danny Bill an African raised in Paris. The biggest Muay Thai(boxing and legs) artist of the 90s, and a legend in Thailand.

When he went to Thailand to train and learn their arts, his Asian Muay Thai masters told him that this art came from Africans and showed him documents about this fact and reality...Yes guys...You can find the video on Youtube...

Danny went several times to Runoko Rashidi, conferences here in Paris to tell this story...

I repeat pure ignorance...When having a look at the rebellions during the slave plantations period in the New World...Only Haitians (pure Africans at that time) at this period destroyed their masters and slavery and paved the way for emancipation in many countries in the West Indies and South America...Learn your facts straight guys...

Please stop polluting the thread with martial arts.
This is a boxing thread and MA or UFC have nothing to do with boxing.
Don't believe me, ask Rhonda Rousey.

France also has no boxers on the All Time Great list.
France produces no top level boxers. They hardly produce even good contender level boxers.
However, if there was an international competition for weeping, the French would be all time greats. [Big Grin]
 
Posted by Mike111 (Member # 9361) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by IronLion:

AAs must be worse off in the mind set than Africans who lost just one continent, and Indians who lost half a continent.

AAs were genocided, then enslaved, then the jim crowed, then the kkk-ed, then lynched; which persists today and manifests as those public lynchings and killings by police.

Again and again the weak albino wallops our collective AA asses.

Is that a sign of strength and superiority? Is there a link there to your dislike of Africans?

.
The facts you state about what happened in Europe and the Americas is quite true.

But Africans also did not see the huge threat the dirty, stink, colorless, Albino posed.

The only thing saving Africa from total destruction was the sheer number of Africans and the diseases of Africa.

As in all such "Near Death" escapes - the survivors come out stronger.
 
Posted by Mike111 (Member # 9361) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by IronLion:
The black race is the most hated race on planet earth and black people being the most hated race on planet earth should stick together instead of trying to pick tribes and races that they do not among themselves.

We do not have the luxury of refusing to cooperate because we believe we are black Europeans rather than Africans, or black Asians against black South America.

Nomatter how black European your black ass maybe, you are still a black man to any pink ass European. He dont give a **** which tribe you think you belong, and would shoot you just like he would shoot a black Australian, given the chance.

This divisive philosophy is disgraceful and should cease!

.
I have heard that so often:

First it was in relation to Ghetto people:

But guess what, the average Black family has more to fear from a ghetto criminal than ANY Albino.

Now were are asked to overlook the fuch-ups of Africans - in thinking and deed - because we are all one.

Well - Yes we should cooperate - as equals.
That means Africans need to re-evaluate.
 
Posted by Mike111 (Member # 9361) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by lamin:
quote:
Sure, I think that Africans would have possessed these skills, and more.
Yes, Africa had long entered the Iron Age. The Benin Bronzes, Nok Terracotta, and Ife Art in wood and metal all testify to that. The skilled carvings from all over West Africa, the existence of towns with protective gates long exited before the Atlantic trade. Example: the Walled City of Kano.
All over the world, the structures of these skilled tradesmen still stand as testaments to their work.
Can you cite any such examples in sub-Sahara Africa?
 
Posted by Mike111 (Member # 9361) on :
 
This part requires some critical thinking.

The Albinos answer to why Blacks in the Americas had those skills was because they were trained by Albinos! (Remembering that they have to provide explanations in keeping with their false history).

THE ONLY PROBLEM IS THAT THEIR STORY DOESN'T JIBE WITH THE REALITY OF THE TIMES!

REMEMBER - THE LIST OF SLAVE TRADESMEN I POSTED, COVERED THE YEARS 1769 - 1780.


United States Department of Labor:

Chapter 1: The Emergence of American Labor By Richard B. Morris

On August 5, 1774, just a month before the First Continental Congress convened in Philadelphia, the ship Needham landed in New York from Newry, England, Captain William Cunningham, master. The ship's cargo was white indentured servants. On arrival they protested to the authorities that they had been kidnapped in Ireland and had suffered "bad usage" on the voyage across the Atlantic. Whereupon the city fathers ordered them discharged. The servants had gained their freedom, but Cunningham nursed a grudge, and later, as the notorious provost marshal of the British army in America, he confined captured Patriots to atrocious prison ships and jails. The incident of the Needham's cargo dramatizes how the early American labor market was supplied. It also reveals that certain aspects of the old labor system were repugnant to that free society the American inhabitants sought to create for themselves.

The colonists quickly discovered that the Indians, the native Americans who had settled the continent centuries before the Europeans, would not make compliant workers confined to settled abodes. The alternatives for labor power were to be found in the British Isles, the European continent, and along the west coast of Africa. (This is never creditably explained - merely a throwaway to cover skilled Blacks). Convinced that England was overpopulated, the government encouraged the emigration to America of the unemployed poor and vagrant class and permitted skilled workers to go to the colonies. Gradually, with England's rise to commercial and industrial primacy by the end of the seventeenth century, the official attitude changed, culminating in the enactment by Parliament in 1765 of a law forbidding the emigration of skilled workers. This was followed in turn by statutes of 1774, 1781, and 1782 forbidding the exportation of textile machinery, plans, or models. Toward the poor, the untrained, the vagrants, and the criminal class the government felt no such inhibitions; they were encouraged to immigrate to the colonies if someone, somewhere, would foot the bill for the passage. Official obstructions notwithstanding, the importation of skilled artisans continued virtually unabated throughout the colonial years.

The rest of this is basically typical Albino lie history as relates to race.

https://www.dol.gov/general/aboutdol/history/chapter1
 
Posted by Nehesy (Member # 17252) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Narmerthoth:
quote:
Originally posted by Nehesy:
Another aparté, Danny Bill an African raised in Paris. The biggest Muay Thai(boxing and legs) artist of the 90s, and a legend in Thailand.

When he went to Thailand to train and learn their arts, his Asian Muay Thai masters told him that this art came from Africans and showed him documents about this fact and reality...Yes guys...You can find the video on Youtube...

Danny went several times to Runoko Rashidi, conferences here in Paris to tell this story...

I repeat pure ignorance...When having a look at the rebellions during the slave plantations period in the New World...Only Haitians (pure Africans at that time) at this period destroyed their masters and slavery and paved the way for emancipation in many countries in the West Indies and South America...Learn your facts straight guys...

Please stop polluting the thread with martial arts.
This is a boxing thread and MA or UFC have nothing to do with boxing.
Don't believe me, ask Rhonda Rousey.

France also has no boxers on the All Time Great list.
France produces no top level boxers. They hardly produce even good contender level boxers.
However, if there was an international competition for weeping, the French would be all time greats. [Big Grin]

When I say You're ignorant : Boxing is a martial art which uses body weapons who are your arms and fists, footsteps and body (clinch). However Legs and knees are forbidden.

In Muay Thai Boxing you use Boxing, Clinch, Arms + Elbows and Fists + Legs and knees

In all martial arts you use Jabs, Hooks, Uppercuts and clinch...You need to go practicing and stop uttering BS on the net...
 
Posted by Mike111 (Member # 9361) on :
 
^Thinking logically:

If you are an Albino, and you know that you have a skill of great value and in Great demand.

Would YOU train a Slave who would work for free and put you and your descendants, AND all your tradesmen friends, OUT OF BUSINESS???

No

Not in a million years!

Therefore Blacks reached the U.S. WITH those skills:
(Like the Slave who was a trained French Chef).

See - when you break down Albino history, and consider it logically:

Only then do you realize what a total, disgusting, lie it is.
 
Posted by Thereal (Member # 22452) on :
 
I could understand the native population as they were free but the African part makes no sense as the whole point of slavery was for blacks to work going by what whites say.
Ghettos were created by whites to funnel blacks or made by whites leaving black encroachment so the peoples behavior were generated out of stuff they weren't cognizant to or they the power relations didn't permit the blacks maintain those places.
 
Posted by Narmerthoth (Member # 20259) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Nehesy:
quote:
Originally posted by Narmerthoth:
quote:
Originally posted by Nehesy:
Another aparté, Danny Bill an African raised in Paris. The biggest Muay Thai(boxing and legs) artist of the 90s, and a legend in Thailand.

When he went to Thailand to train and learn their arts, his Asian Muay Thai masters told him that this art came from Africans and showed him documents about this fact and reality...Yes guys...You can find the video on Youtube...

Danny went several times to Runoko Rashidi, conferences here in Paris to tell this story...

I repeat pure ignorance...When having a look at the rebellions during the slave plantations period in the New World...Only Haitians (pure Africans at that time) at this period destroyed their masters and slavery and paved the way for emancipation in many countries in the West Indies and South America...Learn your facts straight guys...

Please stop polluting the thread with martial arts.
This is a boxing thread and MA or UFC have nothing to do with boxing.
Don't believe me, ask Rhonda Rousey.

France also has no boxers on the All Time Great list.
France produces no top level boxers. They hardly produce even good contender level boxers.
However, if there was an international competition for weeping, the French would be all time greats. [Big Grin]

When I say You're ignorant : Boxing is a martial art which uses body weapons who are your arms and fists, footsteps and body (clinch). However Legs and knees are forbidden.

In Muay Thai Boxing you use Boxing, Clinch, Arms + Elbows and Fists + Legs and knees

In all martial arts you use Jabs, Hooks, Uppercuts and clinch...You need to go practicing and stop uttering BS on the net...

The thread title is;

USA Blacks and the sport of Boxing; The Greatest In the world!

Not

USA Blacks and Martial Arts
I have another thread here on ES regarding Blacks and Martial arts, and this ain't it.
Please refrain yourself.
 
Posted by Narmerthoth (Member # 20259) on :
 
^ Anyone can watch Boxing on US, UK, Japan, Australian and Canadian television to keep abreast of the boxing talents of those nations.

Does anyone know which African nation TV shows feature boxing?
 
Posted by Mike111 (Member # 9361) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Mike111:
All over the world, the structures of these skilled tradesmen still stand as testaments to their work.
Can you cite any such examples in sub-Sahara Africa?

.
Typical Africans, always waiting for others to do the brain-work for them.

Encyclopćdia Britannica

African architecture


https://www.britannica.com/art/African-architecture


I was amazed by what the Albinos had destroyed, but not surprised that modern Africans didn't know about it. West Africans are worst than even I thought.
 
Posted by IronLion (Member # 16412) on :
 
^^Wow, I am amazed!

The only things you appear to know about Africa come from Albino sources... wow, just wow!
 
Posted by the lioness, (Member # 17353) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by IronLion:
^^Wow, I am amazed!

The only things you appear to know about Africa come from Albino sources... wow, just wow!

check this out:

http://www.egyptsearch.com/forums/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=15;t=011931
 
Posted by Narmerthoth (Member # 20259) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by IronLion:
^^Wow, I am amazed!

The only things you appear to know about Africa come from Albino sources... wow, just wow!

LOL, that's not fair.

I have many questions about ancient Africa that I find extremely difficult in uncovering, but as you know, much written information has been lost, hidden or destroyed.
Then there is the problem that Africa has never unified, therefore the multitude of nations never developed a common language to record continental African history. So, information is gathered fragment by painful fragment.

Albino sources are more abundant, but then you have the usual problem of separating fiction from lies to gain the small percentage of truth. It's truly time consuming.
Plus, Africans aren't too helpful either.

Over the years I've asked many questions regarding Africa on the site and the Africans here hardly ever respond.
Still, we crave the knowledge and continue to seek it.

Thank God for Dr. Winters who has over the years provided many pieces of lost critic African information that Africans themselves seem not to know.
 
Posted by Mike111 (Member # 9361) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by IronLion:
^^Wow, I am amazed!

The only things you appear to know about Africa come from Albino sources... wow, just wow!

.
Come-on lion, that's a silly thing to say - THERE ARE "NO" NATIVE AFRICAN SOURCES.

Most Africans don't know this sh1t, and those that do must be keeping it a secret!
 
Posted by IronLion (Member # 16412) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Narmerthoth:
quote:
Originally posted by IronLion:
^^Wow, I am amazed!

The only things you appear to know about Africa come from Albino sources... wow, just wow!

LOL, that's not fair.

I have many questions about ancient Africa that I find extremely difficult in uncovering, but as you know, much written information has been lost, hidden or destroyed.
Then there is the problem that Africa has never unified, therefore the multitude of nations never developed a common language to record continental African history. So, information is gathered fragment by painful fragment.

Albino sources are more abundant, but then you have the usual problem of separating fiction from lies to gain the small percentage of truth. It's truly time consuming.
Plus, Africans aren't too helpful either.

Over the years I've asked many questions regarding Africa on the site and the Africans here hardly ever respond.
Still, we crave the knowledge and continue to seek it.

Thank God for Dr. Winters who has over the years provided many pieces of lost critic African information that Africans themselves seem not to know.

When you seek with arrogance and prejudgment, you will not find!

More humility, more patience, and you will hit a trove like Dr Clyde Winters did....
 
Posted by Narmerthoth (Member # 20259) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Mike111:
quote:
Originally posted by IronLion:
^^Wow, I am amazed!

The only things you appear to know about Africa come from Albino sources... wow, just wow!

.
Come-on lion, that's a silly thing to say - THERE ARE "NO" NATIVE AFRICAN SOURCES.

Most Africans don't know this sh1t, and those that do must be keeping it a secret!

True.
Typically when you ask an African they immediately kick into defence mode while deflecting the question.
This thread is a prime example.
So far, not one African has offered objective insights on why, there are no Africans on the international Boxing All Time Great lists.
 
Posted by lamin (Member # 5777) on :
 
quote:
All over the world, the structures of these skilled tradesmen still stand as testaments to their work.
Can you cite any such examples in sub-Sahara Africa?

LOL. Only an ignorant of African history person would pose such a question. Instances of metal and wood work in Africa are all over the net.

And you persist in the racist talk of "sub-Saharan Africa". Almost forgot, you define yourself oxymoronically as a "black European". Obviously you would be just as racist as many white Europeans. Mike, you must be very old because you never seem to learn.
 
Posted by Mike111 (Member # 9361) on :
 
^To the point on architecture: Encyclopćdia Britannica says this.....


In the 19th century the earth-and-stone palace of the Asantehene (king) of the Asante empire at the capital city of Kumasi covered some five acres (two hectares). It had many courtyards with verandas and open screens and more than 60 rooms with steep thatched roofs. The exterior walls of the palace were covered with rich embellishments in raised clay, patterns that may be related to Islamic calligraphy. Shrine houses were also constructed. Little of the palace survived the Asante wars and a punitive expedition by the British in 1874.

More extensive was the great palace of the oba of Benin City, Nigeria. In the 16th and 17th centuries it was as large as a European town, with many courts surrounded by galleried buildings, their pillars encased in bronze plaques. Roofs were shingled, and there were numerous high towers topped with bronze birds. Benin City was burned by the British in 1897.

The Yoruba of western Nigeria are also an urban people. Their towns traditionally have as their centre the afin (palace) of the oba, from which radiate broad roads dividing the town into quarters, each with its compound of a subordinate chief. Some afins in the precolonial era were of great size, encompassing much of the surrounding bush; the afin of Oyo, the capital of the Oyo empire (17th and 18th centuries), was reported to cover 640 acres (260 hectares). The palace buildings were substantially built, and the open verandas were supported by carved caryatid pillars. Yoruba towns still have palaces; though the architecture is often Westernized, traditional courtyards, recreation grounds, and high surrounding walls persist.
.

Being curious as to what those palaces looked like, and being certain that Africans would have created many recreations in drawings and models of their only high achievements, I googled the palace name "palace of the oba of Benin City" and got THIS:
I believe this drawing was done by a Brit.


 -

Well that's my research into African architecture. It appears I have more interest than most Africans.

My real interest was in seeing if any of the skilled tradesmen enslaved in the U.S. could have been African.

Unfortunately there are no examples to judge from, but it appears that the kings had access to skilled tradesmen who built and maintained their palaces. These men could have been local or imported. Because the larger society did not use dwellings needing great skill to make, it is obvious that skilled tradesmen were few, and of great value. Certainly no king would sell them off into slavery, and no European would dare steal them.

Thus the skilled tradesmen Slaves in the U.S. could NOT have been Africans.

 
Posted by Mike111 (Member # 9361) on :
 
The drawing above appears to be modeled after this painting:

.
University of Virginia

King of Benin (Oba) in procession, late 17th cent.

 -

Source
Giulio Ferrario, IL Costume Antico & Moderno . . . . (Milano, 1815-1827), vol. 2, pt. 1, plate 38

Comments
Mounted on a horse, the king is depicted being surrounded by retainers playing various musical instruments. This image appears to be derived from one edition or another of Dapper (e.g., 1668, 1686); see image reference BO17 on this website.
 
Posted by Mike111 (Member # 9361) on :
 
^Only problem is that the painting above is totally BOGUS!

This is the Oba's real costume.


 -


 -
 
Posted by Narmerthoth (Member # 20259) on :
 
^ Mike

This caption seems unreasonable to me.
Why would the King's retainers be playing instruments when they would clearly be the kingdom's managers and elites.
The small guy on the left of the king appears more as you would expect from a retainer and leader reporting to the king.
Also, to the right of the king, just in front of the horse you can see two others who appear to be the King's retainers.
Those playing instruments are probably just that, the court musicians.

As I posted, Africa has a very long history where great civilizations existed, died, and were either replaced by other great civilizations or reverted back to low forms of small tribes.

Although there is no trace of it today, following the patterns of other civilizations, I don't doubt in Africa's long history there have been great rulers who did have a dream of conquering the thousands of small tribes and unifying a good part, if not all of Africa.

We know that the Meroitic culture possessed an efficient government system, many skilled workers, and architectures that mirrored those of AE.
Meroe had a writing system and very likely used it to record it's daily activity as well as it's history. Unfortunately, not much of it survives.

 -
 -

 -

 -

 -

The city of Meroe occupied over one square mile of fertile ground and, at its height, was a great center of iron smelting, agriculture, and trade. Van De Mieroop writes, "The Ptolemies [of Egypt] and Romans wanted African goods such as hardwoods, ivory, other exotica, and animals including elephants. Those animals had become important in warfare" (340).
One of the earliest documented cases of political cooperation between the Kingdom of Meroe and the Ptolemaic Dynasty of Egypt, in fact, concerns Meroe supplying Egypt with elephants for war.
The iron industry of Meroe made the city as famous as its wealth and, of course, contributed greatly to that wealth as the iron workers of Meroe were considered the best, and iron tools and weapons were much sought after.

 
Posted by Narmerthoth (Member # 20259) on :
 
Who are the blacks in the background dressed in European garb (suits), and in the far background to the right dressed in modernized African clothing?
The photo appears to be recent, taken in the mid-1900s.
I don't think you can trust this photo as representative of the typical garb worn throughout the Oba tribe.

 -
 
Posted by Mike111 (Member # 9361) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Narmerthoth:

We know that the Meroitic culture possessed an efficient government system, many skilled workers, and architectures that mirrored those of AE.
Meroe had a writing system and very likely used it to record it's daily activity as well as it's history. Unfortunately, not much of it survives.

Africa north of the Sahara was one of the cradles of civilization, and is not an issue.

On the issue of tradesmen; Interestingly, North Africa had Sawmills before Europe north of the Mediterranean civilizations.
 
Posted by Mike111 (Member # 9361) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by lamin:
quote:
All over the world, the structures of these skilled tradesmen still stand as testaments to their work.
Can you cite any such examples in sub-Sahara Africa?

LOL. Only an ignorant of African history person would pose such a question. Instances of metal and wood work in Africa are all over the net.

And you persist in the racist talk of "sub-Saharan Africa". Almost forgot, you define yourself oxymoronically as a "black European". Obviously you would be just as racist as many white Europeans. Mike, you must be very old because you never seem to learn.

.
This is why I can never figure out if lamin is an Albino Mole or just a very DUMB Negro!

lamin - REALLY???

You try to turn the onus of my challenge back on ME???
Even the most degenerate Albino would never try that on me.
Only a true dimwit would even think of such a thing.
 
Posted by lamin (Member # 5777) on :
 
Namerthoth,

If you are not an African--then what are you. Curious to know. Treat the question as you would treat similar questions about the definition of "Arab", "Jew", "Asian Indian", "Sino-Asian", etc.

African Sources:

History of Ghana, Mali, Songhay: http://africaworldpressbooks.com/the-timbuktu-chronicles-1493-1599-al-hajj-mahmud-katis-tarikh-al-fattish-edited-by-christopher-wise-translated-by-christopher-wise-hala-abu-taleb/


http://siiasi.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/Tarikh-Introduction.pdfhttp://siiasi.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/Tarikh-Introduction.pdf

Malian jurist and scholar: AHMED BABA

http://siiasi.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/Tarikh-Introduction.pdf


Abyssinian Philosopher: Zara Yakub http://www.meskot.com/Ethio_Philosophers2.pdfhttp://www.meskot.com/Ethio_Philosophers2.pdf


In Contemporary times the writings of Cheikh Anta Diop and Theophile Obenga offer information on the languages of Africa. Diop's

Precolonial Black Africa offer much information of the dozens of scholars at the University of Sankore.

On a general History Of Africa--including its archeological history there are the UNESCO History of Africa--9 Volumes. First Volume on African Archaelogical history edited by historian Joseph Ki-Zerbo.

Cambridge History of Africa--8 Volumes. Articles by African scholars included.
 
Posted by lamin (Member # 5777) on :
 
quote:
I don't think you can trust this photo as representative of the typical garb worn throughout the Oba tribe.
"Oba" means "ruler" or "king" in the Yoruba language. The Yorubas live mainly in Nigeria and Benin Republic. They are some 45 million in numbers. Note that the word "tribe" is a racist colonial term applied by the Europeans to people such as Africans, Native Americans and some Asian Indians.

In Europe, no one speaks of the Basque tribe or Gypsy tribe or Welsh tribe.
 
Posted by Narmerthoth (Member # 20259) on :
 
^ IMHO, Tribe means a small fraction of a country/continent, like China before unification was formed of many klans. Even after China unified, these klans still existed within the larger frame-work.
Africans divided into Nigerians, Ugandans, South Africans, are still stuck in this ancient Asian fractured frame-work, which is why studying ancient Africa is more difficult than studying Religion (Islam, Christianity, Judaism) or Asian history.

Africa cannot be viewed in the same context as Europe or The United States.
Although Europe is divided in nations, as the United States, they are both united whereas Africa is not.

I've studied all the source and more as you've listed, but these are recently established countries in Africa.
 
Posted by Mindovermatter (Member # 22317) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Narmerthoth:
^ IMHO, Tribe means a small fraction of a country/continent, like China before unification was formed of many klans. Even after China unified, these klans still existed within the larger frame-work.
Africans divided into Nigerians, Ugandans, South Africans, are still stuck in this ancient Asian fractured frame-work, which is why studying ancient Africa is more difficult than studying Religion (Islam, Christianity, Judaism) or Asian history.

Africa cannot be viewed in the same context as Europe or The United States.
Although Europe is divided in nations, as the United States, they are both united whereas Africa is not.

I've studied all the source and more as you've listed, but these are recently established countries in Africa.

Europe is not united and never was wholly united lol, I don't know what you are talking about. Please ask Lithuanians for example, if they are Poles or if their country belongs to Poland. Or ask Danes if they have anything in common with Germans, or if the Welsh have anything to do with the rest of Europe, or the Northern Ireland with the rest of the British Isles, or Ukraine with Russia. Hell just look at what happened with the recent Crimean fiasco.


Not to mention Brexit, the various Basque separatist movements and various Central European countries splitting into several states, and the break up of yugoslavia and the 1991 Bosnian war showed that European albino's have not actually been that united at all......
 
Posted by IronLion (Member # 16412) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Mike111:
quote:
Originally posted by Narmerthoth:

We know that the Meroitic culture possessed an efficient government system, many skilled workers, and architectures that mirrored those of AE.
Meroe had a writing system and very likely used it to record it's daily activity as well as it's history. Unfortunately, not much of it survives.

Africa north of the Sahara was one of the cradles of civilization, and is not an issue.

On the issue of tradesmen; Interestingly, North Africa had Sawmills before Europe north of the Mediterranean civilizations.

Comeon shut it down with that fake fact.

Sudan is in the Sahara and extends southward.

For your information there are many Nigeria nationalities who are ethnic Sudanese.

So called Chad and Niger as well. Note too that Chad and Niger used to be parts of Sudan.

It is pathetic when you attempt to show expertise in a field where you are a neophyte...

Research MuuR!

 -
 
Posted by IronLion (Member # 16412) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Mindovermatter:
quote:
Originally posted by Narmerthoth:
^ IMHO, Tribe means a small fraction of a country/continent, like China before unification was formed of many klans. Even after China unified, these klans still existed within the larger frame-work.
Africans divided into Nigerians, Ugandans, South Africans, are still stuck in this ancient Asian fractured frame-work, which is why studying ancient Africa is more difficult than studying Religion (Islam, Christianity, Judaism) or Asian history.

Africa cannot be viewed in the same context as Europe or The United States.
Although Europe is divided in nations, as the United States, they are both united whereas Africa is not.

I've studied all the source and more as you've listed, but these are recently established countries in Africa.

Europe is not united and never was wholly united lol, I don't know what you are talking about. Please ask Lithuanians for example, if they are Poles or if their country belongs to Poland. Or ask Danes if they have anything in common with Germans, or if the Welsh have anything to do with the rest of Europe, or the Northern Ireland with the rest of the British Isles, or Ukraine with Russia. Hell just look at what happened with the recent Crimean fiasco.


Not to mention Brexit, the various Basque separatist movements and various Central European countries splitting into several states, and the break up of yugoslavia and the 1991 Bosnian war showed that European albino's have not actually been that united at all......

teach them...
 
Posted by Narmerthoth (Member # 20259) on :
 
^ He's not teaching squat!

When it came time to carve Africa into chunks they were unified enough to meet and plan it's distribution.
They are unified enough to not only extract and take all of Africa's resources, but to keep Africa fragmented for they will never be capable of breaking free of their rule as small disorganized tribes.

Relative to Africa, every country in the world is unified.
The united states are broken into independent states, but they are still unified. Most of Europe is the same.
 
Posted by lamin (Member # 5777) on :
 
quote:
Africans divided into Nigerians, Ugandans, South Africans, are still stuck in this ancient Asian fractured frame-work, which is why studying ancient Africa is more difficult than studying Religion (Islam, Christianity, Judaism) or Asian history.
UNESCO History of Africa is on line as PDF.

The Cambridge History of Africa VOL 1 is also on line PDF.

Right. Too many countries in Africa. Should be no more than 20. Single currencies and regional groupings make for more efficiency. But the AU is quiet on such matters.
 
Posted by Mindovermatter (Member # 22317) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Narmerthoth:
^ He's not teaching squat!

When it came time to carve Africa into chunks they were unified enough to meet and plan it's distribution.
They are unified enough to not only extract and take all of Africa's resources, but to keep Africa fragmented for they will never be capable of breaking free of their rule as small disorganized tribes.

Relative to Africa, every country in the world is unified.
The united states are broken into independent states, but they are still unified. Most of Europe is the same.

Uh no, most of Europe is not the same and never was, if you don't believe me then go visit European forums. Only particular Western European countries did most of the colonizing. but even they were not united at the core when they were doing it.

For example Norway and the Baltic countries and Finland did not colonize African countries, and neither did the Austro-Hungarian empire, (which split up into several states BECAUSE IT BALKANIZED DUE TO DIFFERENT ALBINO EUROPEANS BEING FORCED TOGETHER!), and neither did the Polish-Lithuanian common-wealth or Russia.

And when the albino Europeans were colonizing Africa, they fought with each other for control of the colonies all the time and for land and competed with each other. A great example of this, is the Anglo-Boer wars:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Boer_War


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_Boer_War

Did you know that the Nazi concentration camp model was based off the Albino British concentration camps that the Brits had used on fellow Albino Dutch Afrikaan Boer prisoners of war and populations, and which they used to torture and kill them? Obviously not!


So no they never really "united" at all, this coalesced in World War I and World War II and why they needed to have even have a conference of Berlin in the first place!

Another example, the Brits fought several wars and skirmishes for control of Central Asia with RUSSIA:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Great_Game

Another example is when the European powers got hold on China, they fought with each other for control there and created separate territories for each particular Euro country, the Prussians had Qing Dao, the French/Brits had Shanghai, the Portugese had Macau, the Spanish had Taiwan etc etc etc. They did the same in the new world and Africa! They were never united at all!


The Brits also had to FORCE the Scots and Irish to ASSIMILATE AND CONQUER THEM INTO THEIR EMPIRE! The Brits even had Irish slave plantations and were responsible for the potato famine that led to the Irish being enslaved by the English in America for centuries after it happened.


BTW, Europe had a large INDIGENOUS NATIVE BLACK EUROPEAN POPULATION ALL THE WAY UP TO THE CLASSICAL PERIOD IN EUROPE! Mike has shown that there were Black European soldiers and explorers and traders deployed in the new world colonies of these European powers, so what happened cannot be solely the blame of non-whites but also the Black Europeans that acted as co-conspirators and co-opters in this grand imperial game, many leading European imperial families actually retained their "black" looks well into the 19th century.


So the picture is a lot more complex then simple black and White.
 
Posted by Mike111 (Member # 9361) on :
 
MOM don't be such a ditz - When Albinos argue and fight, and kill millions of each other, it's called fallout among thieves. They are just naturally a violent murderous people.

But see how quickly they will put aside their differences to deal with Blacks or Mongols. Better yet - why don't you just read a good history book.

Look under the "Mongol invasion of Europe" and "the Partitioning of Africa."

I mean REALLY???
You didn't know THAT much?

Btw - ALL the important European powers carved up Africa: Belgian, Italian, British, Portuguese, French, Spanish, Germany.

Ethiopia and Liberia were the only ones spared - initially.

Greece and the Eastern European Countries were part of the Turkish Ottoman Empire: which already controlled North Africa, Arabia, and the Middle East.
 
Posted by IronLion (Member # 16412) on :
 
^^ Don't be such a show-off Mike.

Europeans did colonize and enslave one another even before they took that trip to Africa.

Search Rome.

England colonized Ireland and Scotland.

France colonized England in 1066 after the Norman invasion.

Italy colonized Sicily before it went to Africa to show off like you do sometimes.

Germany sought to colonize Poland, all the Slav republics including Russia, and this resulted in the 2nd World War.

Russia colonized Georgia, Abkhazia, Chechnya (now you know the reason for the Chechnya war, as well as Azerbiajan, Tajikistand, Turkemenistan etc.

Russia later colonized the entire East Europe and thrived off them till the fall of communism Search for the Hungarian and the Czech revolt.

There is so much you overlook, or don't know so humble up your self...
 
Posted by IronLion (Member # 16412) on :
 
England colonized Greece. - 1814

England colonized Malta. 1814
 
Posted by Mindovermatter (Member # 22317) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Mike111:
MOM don't be such a ditz - When Albinos argue and fight, and kill millions of each other, it's called fallout among thieves. They are just naturally a violent murderous people.

But see how quickly they will put aside their differences to deal with Blacks or Mongols. Better yet - why don't you just read a good history book.

Look under the "Mongol invasion of Europe" and "the Partitioning of Africa."

I mean REALLY???
You didn't know THAT much?

Btw - ALL the important European powers carved up Africa: Belgian, Italian, British, Portuguese, French, Spanish, Germany.

Ethiopia and Liberia were the only ones spared - initially.

Greece and the Eastern European Countries were part of the Turkish Ottoman Empire: which already controlled North Africa, Arabia, and the Middle East.

Uh I thought when the Mongols invaded Europe, there still were several Black European kingdoms and a BLACK EUROPEAN presence there, I mean it was before Benjamin Franklin's time period so.

Also the entirety of Eastern Europe wasn't colonized by the Ottoman empire, only the Balkans and the Ukraine region, and again the original Turks were a whitish looking people.

There was the Austro-Hungarian empire, the Russian empire and the Polish Lithuanian commonwealth, they all fought for control of Eastern to Central Europe and they fought with the Swedish, Prussian and Danish empires for control of the European peninsula.This was waaaay before Europeans started the scramble for Africa and engage in any colonialist ventures in the rest of the world.


Also several Euro kingdoms, even in places like France wanted to actually help and cooperate with the Mongols during their invasion. Search up the Franco-Mongol alliance, and even when the Mongols invaded, and even the Turks, Euro-kingdoms were still squabbling among each other for petty differences in Western Europe.


BTW, as I have said already, many of the Mongol soldiers WERE ACTUALLY WHITE! Yes the Mongols employed and used and were in alliance w/ various WHITE Turkic tribes.

The Mongols even had a albino Indo-European body guard contingent called the Alannic guard, they guarded and protected the Khans of the Mongol Empire, European Christian missionaries tried to convert them to Christanity during the middle ages. Many of the Mongol legion armies consisted entirely of white Turkic peoples like the Tartars and Uighurs etc etc

In various ancient reports of the armies of the Mongols, there were purported to be Blonde White looking soldiers within their various hordes. The Mongols employed and collaborated with many different peoples during their campaigns and empire building days....


Again the picture is more complex then what's told to us....
 
Posted by Narmerthoth (Member # 20259) on :
 
^ If you believe that Europe, the US and Israel are not unified, then just go and start a African unification revolution in and see how fast they come together to put their collective feet on African necks.
The only people in the world who aren't unified are Africans and African Americans, which is why Africans lose the continent and have never been able to recover it.
It's also the reason why Africa has NEVER asked for the return of the millions of Africans kidnapped from the continent.
 
Posted by the lioness, (Member # 17353) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Narmerthoth:
^ If you believe that Europe, the US and Israel are not unified, then just go and start a African unification revolution in and see how fast they come together to put their collective feet on African necks.
The only people in the world who aren't unified are Africans and African Americans, which is why Africans lose the continent and have never been able to recover it.
It's also the reason why Africa has NEVER asked for the return of the millions of Africans kidnapped from the continent.

Blacks in the U.S. are undoubtedly mostly of European extraction. The data to support that conclusion is already plentiful and available. The reason this is not generally known and accepted: is because the entire civil rights movement in the U.S. was based on all U.S. Blacks being one people, with one background (Africa), and one experience (Slavery). The racial cohesion and unity needed for a mass movement, was thus satisfied with those imbedded, and untrue beliefs. Note that the term "African American" is a new and modern term. The most obvious fallacy is that all U.S. Blacks were Slaves. Actually about 16-20% were always free, and in that group there were Slave owners. As we can see from the 1850 U.S. census, Whites were also Slaves.

The U.S. Black leadership has no interest in propagating these truths, because they fear that it might/probably will, dilute their power, as Africans and Black Europeans pursue their own separate histories.
 
Posted by Mike111 (Member # 9361) on :
 
^Ah yes - lioness the Afrocentric Black fronting Albino Mole.
 
Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 
"As we can see from the 1850 U.S. census, Whites were also Slaves."


Finding an Irish Ancestor Using United States Records

https://familysearch.org/wiki/en/Finding_an_Irish_Ancestor_Using_United_States_Records


For African Americans?:

http://www.slavevoyages.org
quote:



How the Myth of the "Irish slaves" Became a Favorite Meme of Racists Online

Such is the case with the myth of "Irish slaves," an ahistorical reimagining of real events weaponized by racists and conspiracy theorists before the Web and now reaching vast new audiences online.

In short, the "Irish slaves" myth argues that the first slaves brought to the Americas were Irish, that they were white, and that this fact, covered up by liberal historians, undermines the legacy of the African slave trade and proves that modern theories of racial inferiority are true.

Predictably, this revisionism has attracted Neo-Nazis, White Nationalists, Neo-Confederates, and even Holocaust deniers, while racist trolls have deployed the myth to attack the Black Lives Matter movement. More worrisome, though, is its widespread adoption by principally American Internet users as if it were a point of "Irish pride."

Irish scholar Liam Hogan has been tracking and debunking this reincarnated meme since he first saw it in 2013. Last year, Hogan published an impressive five-part series exposing the myth and provided a detailed historical analysis of the origins and evolution of the meme.

https://www.splcenter.org/hatewatch/2016/04/19/how-myth-irish-slaves-became-favorite-meme-racists-online


quote:


The unfree Irish in the Caribbean were indentured servants, not slaves

t’s a myth there were ‘Irish slaves’ in Barbados. As difficult as white servants’ experiences were, enslaved Africans were the people treated as livestock.

This is an op-ed by Liam Hogan, Laura McAtackney, and Matthew Connor Reilly. They write in response to what they call the myth of “Irish slaves” in the New World, which has recently entered the mainstream via social media.

This myth, conflating indentured servitude with racialised chattel slavery, has helped poison much of the public discourse about the legacy of the transatlantic slave trade, they said.

Today, they examine what is arguably the closest point between white servitude and black slavery, mid-17th century Barbados, and conclude that even there, these two forms of unfree labour cannot be equated.

A SPURIOUS GlobalResearch.ca article, first published in 2008, claims that an “Irish slave trade” was initiated in 1612 and abolished in 1839. It states that “Irish slaves” were treated worse than African slaves.

This article, which has been shared online at least one million times, is underpinned by a conspiracy theory which claims that “biased” historians are refusing to call indentured servants “slaves” for political reasons.

The fallout has been predictable. The myth is now a favoured derailment tactic for people who wish to shut down conversations about race and slavery. Many African Americans attest to encountering this myth, in person and online.

‘White slavery’

As the conversation about reparatory justice continues in the US and the Caribbean, those who proclaim the history of “white slavery” now claim a shared heritage of victimisation. They thus aim to vindicate themselves and their ancestors from any involvement in the processes of racial inequality or oppression in the past and the present.

This, in turn, fuels racial condemnation and racist sentiment toward those who bemoan racial inequality and oppression in the twenty-first century.



http://www.thejournal.ie/readme/irish-slaves-myth-2369653-Oct2015/


quote:

"Slavery was deeply woven into the fabric of the United States and challenged the meaning of democracy. Enslaved people’s work formed an economic engine producing half of all U.S. exports and providing much of the financial capital and raw materials to spark industrialization. Bought and sold as property, enslaved people were valued at an estimated $2.7 billion in 1860.

Despite daily denials of their humanity, enslaved African Americans sustained a vision of freedom. They seasoned life with small pleasures and found ways to make food, family, dance, prayer, dress, and even work their own. These everyday acts helped build identity and a foundation for freedom. "

http://americanhistory.si.edu/changing-america-emancipation-proclamation-1863-and-march-washington-1963/1863/slavery-america
 
Posted by lamin (Member # 5777) on :
 
quote:
If you believe that Europe, the US and Israel are not unified, then just go and start a African unification revolution in and see how fast they come together to put their collective feet on African necks.
The only people in the world who aren't unified are Africans and African Americans, which is why Africans lose the continent and have never been able to recover it.
It's also the reason why Africa has NEVER asked for the return of the millions of Africans kidnapped from the continent.

The West is never comfortable with Pan Africanists. Nkrumah was hounded down and was driven from power by U.S./CIA machinations hatched in the U.S. embassy in Ghana.

Amilcar Cabral was murdered by the Portuguese and French security forces. Same for Thomas Sankara who threatened change. He was murdered by the French by way if fried Blaise Campaoare. These 2 had Pan African programs to a certain extent.

Then the latest was North African Gadaffi. He supported the idea of Pan Africanism with cash thereby provoking opposition from the North African settler Arabs and the West. Obama,Hillary, Cameron and Sarkozy all conspired to destroy him and LIbya.

It was a collective Western/NATO effort.


Africa and Africans of the Americas

Liberia(4 million people)-- approx. same size as South Korea(50 million) was founded as the homeland for blacks in the Americas. But relatively few blacks settled there. Today, it's President is Americo-Liberian Helen Johnson-Sirleaf.

But some blacks from Brazil settled in Lagos, Nigeria and were called "Brazilian Yoruba". They are mostly absorbed into the Lagos population now. But the Afro-Brazilian architecture remains in the older parts of Lagos.

Other blacks from Brazil also settled in Benin Republic.

The fact is that most blacks in the Americas know very little about Africa and vice-versa. The erasure of collective memory by the Europeans has been quite effective. Even though in Brazil and pre-Castro Cuba West African cultural practices were an unconscious part of the black identity.

This is compounded by the fact that the majority of blacks in the Americas don't have the resources to travel to Africa and invest in business--as the Lebanese have done in West Africa. The British and French deliberately encouraged their migration to West Africa in the 1860s.
 
Posted by lamin (Member # 5777) on :
 
One interesting issue in all of this is the color permutations that blacks in general have lived through ever since the first captive ship left the West African coast. From negro to colored to
black and back and forth. The interesting thing is no other group has experienced this "identity angst".

The African was transformed from an ethnic persona to pure biology as "negro" and "black"--post the 16th century. As a result there is a constant angst concerning this issue.

Yet other identities are not as fragile. An "Arab" is an Arab regardless of whether in Asia or Africa. Same for "Jew" whether Ashkenazi or Sephardic. But the race thing enters the picture again because Falasha Jews are not seen as truly kosher in Israel. Same for Arabs. An Arabic speaking Sudanese is seen first and last as black when they travel to North Africa or the so-called Middle East.

It's that 1/32--one drop rule at play. African genes were seen as so dysgenic that any trace of such would get the hypodescent punishment. That's why "passers" in the U.S. and Brazil had to avoid their darker relatives.

So how to distinguish between "black" and "African". That's the ongoing issue for some.

Take the President Obama's daughters who are some 25% non-African in rank genotype. Yet they would get lost in a crowd in any major African city--Dakar, Nairobi, Kano, Khartoum, etc.--but not in any major European or Asian city. Taxonomically, they are of generic African phenotype but some might not want to refer to them as "African girls".

But using "black" instead of "African" reduces them to pure biology bereft of human accoutrements. The children of African migrants to the U.S., for example,are they black and African or just one of the 2 alternatives?
 
Posted by IronLion (Member # 16412) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by the lioness,:
quote:
Originally posted by Narmerthoth:
^ If you believe that Europe, the US and Israel are not unified, then just go and start a African unification revolution in and see how fast they come together to put their collective feet on African necks.
The only people in the world who aren't unified are Africans and African Americans, which is why Africans lose the continent and have never been able to recover it.
It's also the reason why Africa has NEVER asked for the return of the millions of Africans kidnapped from the continent.

Blacks in the U.S. are undoubtedly mostly of European extraction. The data to support that conclusion is already plentiful and available. The reason this is not generally known and accepted: is because the entire civil rights movement in the U.S. was based on all U.S. Blacks being one people, with one background (Africa), and one experience (Slavery). The racial cohesion and unity needed for a mass movement, was thus satisfied with those imbedded, and untrue beliefs. Note that the term "African American" is a new and modern term. The most obvious fallacy is that all U.S. Blacks were Slaves. Actually about 16-20% were always free, and in that group there were Slave owners. As we can see from the 1850 U.S. census, Whites were also Slaves.

The U.S. Black leadership has no interest in propagating these truths, because they fear that it might/probably will, dilute their power, as Africans and Black Europeans pursue their own separate histories.

LOL, you kill me! [Big Grin] [Big Grin] [Big Grin]

That is the Mikean theory....
 
Posted by Mike111 (Member # 9361) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Ish Gebor:
"As we can see from the 1850 U.S. census, Whites were also Slaves."

.
You posted this quote, and then proceeded to post typically bogus Albino articles attempting to refute it.

A generous person would attribute your actions to simple ignorance, but I don't see how.

The statement clearly says that the 1850 census tells the story. So wouldn't a sensible person simply look-up the 1850 census to see what it says?

Since that seems too much effort for you, I took the liberty:


 -


As you can see in schedule 1 - free inhabitants

It asks for a description - and gives the choices for COLOR:
White - Black - or Mulatto.

As you can see in schedule 2 - SLAVES

IT ALSO ASKS FOR THE "COLOR" OF THE SLAVE, WITH NO RESTRICTION IMPLIED FROM THE ORIGINAL MEANING.


For those needing further proof, there are these Photographs of Albino Slaves.


 -
 
Posted by Mike111 (Member # 9361) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Ish Gebor:
The unfree Irish in the Caribbean were indentured servants, not slaves

t’s a myth there were ‘Irish slaves’ in Barbados. As difficult as white servants’ experiences were, enslaved Africans were the people treated as livestock.

.


http://realhistoryww.com./world_history/ancient/Misc/Barbados/Barbados.htm


http://realhistoryww.com./world_history/ancient/Misc/Jamaica/Jamaica.htm
 
Posted by IronLion (Member # 16412) on :
 
^^Ish speaks from both sides of the mouth sometimes making it hard to understand him...
 
Posted by the lioness, (Member # 17353) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by IronLion:
quote:
Originally posted by the lioness,:
quote:
Originally posted by Narmerthoth:
^ If you believe that Europe, the US and Israel are not unified, then just go and start a African unification revolution in and see how fast they come together to put their collective feet on African necks.
The only people in the world who aren't unified are Africans and African Americans, which is why Africans lose the continent and have never been able to recover it.
It's also the reason why Africa has NEVER asked for the return of the millions of Africans kidnapped from the continent.

Blacks in the U.S. are undoubtedly mostly of European extraction. The data to support that conclusion is already plentiful and available. The reason this is not generally known and accepted: is because the entire civil rights movement in the U.S. was based on all U.S. Blacks being one people, with one background (Africa), and one experience (Slavery). The racial cohesion and unity needed for a mass movement, was thus satisfied with those imbedded, and untrue beliefs. Note that the term "African American" is a new and modern term. The most obvious fallacy is that all U.S. Blacks were Slaves. Actually about 16-20% were always free, and in that group there were Slave owners. As we can see from the 1850 U.S. census, Whites were also Slaves.

The U.S. Black leadership has no interest in propagating these truths, because they fear that it might/probably will, dilute their power, as Africans and Black Europeans pursue their own separate histories.

LOL, you kill me! [Big Grin] [Big Grin] [Big Grin]

That is the Mikean theory....

Back in the day Black European slave masters had Irish people picking cotton,
look it up. That's what these albinos dont want to tell you
 
Posted by Mike111 (Member # 9361) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

How the Myth of the "Irish slaves" Became a Favorite Meme of Racists Online

Such is the case with the myth of "Irish slaves," an a historical reimagining of real events weaponized by racists and conspiracy theorists before the Web and now reaching vast new audiences online.

In short, the "Irish slaves" myth argues that the first slaves brought to the Americas were Irish, that they were white, and that this fact, covered up by liberal historians, undermines the legacy of the African slave trade and proves that modern theories of racial inferiority are true.

Predictably, this revisionism has attracted Neo-Nazis, White Nationalists, Neo-Confederates, and even Holocaust deniers, while racist trolls have deployed the myth to attack the Black Lives Matter movement. More worrisome, though, is its widespread adoption by principally American Internet users as if it were a point of "Irish pride."

Irish scholar Liam Hogan has been tracking and debunking this reincarnated meme since he first saw it in 2013. Last year, Hogan published an impressive five-part series exposing the myth and provided a detailed historical analysis of the origins and evolution of the meme.

.
Knowing that many Blacks are poor readers, Albinos often try to sneak stuff past us in text.

Note the quote above: "undermines the legacy of the African slave trade and proves that modern theories of racial inferiority are true."

HOW?

If there were White Slaves and Black Slaves, then wouldn't THAT prove that Slavery was just a matter of circumstance NOT Race?

But of course what those Crackers are really trying to do is remove the STIGMA of Slavery from themselves.

For you see - regardless of the Bullsh1t, Slavery IS equated with being "LESS THAN": and RIGHTLY SO!

Whether I derive from Native American or European, one of by ancestors FUCHED-UP. He got beaten and enslaved - no way to get around that.

The Crackers know that, that's why they are loath to admit that there were Albino Slaves.

Because don't forget, the whole of the Albino Rabbles self-image and self-worth is in their cherished belief that as wretched as they are, they are still better than Niggers.

Since the truth tends to show their belief to be unfounded, they tend to develop alternative histories which support their fantasy.
 
Posted by the lioness, (Member # 17353) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Mike111:

Knowing that many Blacks are poor readers, Albinos often try to sneak stuff past us in text.


Isn't that a myth, you just said blacks are better educated in the other thread
 
Posted by the lioness, (Member # 17353) on :
 
 -
 -

Birth: 1858
Rectortown
Fauquier County
Virginia, USA
Death: unknown
New York, USA

Slave child - She was one of the most photographed of the "slave children" who were used as propaganda tools by abolitionists during the Civil War. These children had very light complexion but because they were of a mixed black/white relationship, they were automatically considered black regardless of their skin color, features or amount of "black blood" they possessed. Many of these children were able to pass as white after the Civil War. Fannie was considered an "octoroon", or someone with 1/8th black African ancestry.

Little is known about Fannie Virginia Casseopia Lawrence seen in the CDV pictures that accompany this memorial. Her birth name was "Fannie" Fletcher. Her mother was a freed slave named Mary Fletcher and her father, reportedly, was Charles Rufus Ayres, the owner of the plantation where she was born. The name Fannie Virginia Casseopia Lawrence was the name given to her when she was baptized in New York. It is thought that her middle name of Virginia was given to her as that was were she was born. And the Lawrence is obviously due to the woman who redeemed her from slavery, Miss Catherine S. Lawrence. It seems obvious that she had a white father and probably other white ancestors as she could have passed for white. The caption on the Carte de' Vista (CDV)photographs states, "Fannie Virginia Casseopia Lawrence: A redeemed Slave Child, 5 years of age. Redeemed in Virginia by Catherine S. Lawrence, baptized at Plymouth Church, by Henry Ward Beecher, May 1863." Beecher of course was one of the leading abolitionist spokesmen and noted preachers in the United States and brother to Harriett Beecher Stowe, the author of "Uncle Tom's Cabin". Stowe was the first pastor of this church and remained as such until his death in 1887. Due to his ardent abolitionist beliefs, he was a major player in slave's rights and his church figured prominently in the "Underground Railroad".

The CDV portraits attached to this memorial were copyrighted and distributed commercially in the 1860's to raise funds, presumably for more slave redemption's. Fannie was probably obtained in an area of Virginia occupied by Union military forces. It is believed she was a "freed" slave child after her purported father, was killed by a neighbor who shot him.

The Flicker website had a study of one of her pictures with a quote from Pastor Beecher's sermon as follows:
"The accounts of Fanny Lawrence's presentation and baptism at Plymouth Church in 1863 suggest that Beecher pressed this argument still further. Every account of Fanny's appearance reads much like the following, penned in the dramatic tones of sentimental fiction:
'When the audience supposed that the ceremony was ended, Mr. Beecher carried up into the pulpit a little girl about five years of age, of sweet face, large eyes, light hair, and fair as a lily. Pausing a moment to conquer his emotion, he sent a shiver of horror through the congregation by saying "This child was born a slave, and is just redeemed from slavery!" It is impossible to describe the effect of this announcement. The fact seemed so incredible and so atrocious that at first, the spectators held their breath in their amazement, and were then melted to tears.'"

"Beecher then addressed his audience, explaining that the child, baptized Fanny Virginia Casseopia Lawrence, had been discovered 'sore and tattered and unclean' by a nurse tending Union soldiers in Fairfax, Virginia, who adopted Fanny as her own(Catharine S. Lawrence). 'Look upon this child,' said Beecher, 'tell me if you ever saw a fairer, sweeter face?' Beecher then made explicit the fate that awaited little girls like Fanny. "This is a sample of slavery which clutches for itself everything fair and attractive," he explained. 'The loveliness of this face, the beauty of this figure, would only make her so much more valuable for lust.' Fanny was presented as a white-looking female rescued from the grips of a lecherous slaveholder. Beecher's rhetoric ... also placed Fanny alongside the children of his own congregation, bemoaning slavery's trespasses not upon black children but on 'fair and attractive' white ones. While their children were sheltered from the ravages of slavery, he intoned, Fanny (until 'redeemed') had been left exposed".

Miss Lawrence raised Fannie as her own child. Fannie married while in her teens against Miss Lawrence's wishes, bore two children and died young, before 1895. The location of her remains are unknown but it is assumed she is buried in New York.


 -
Fannie Virginia Casseopia Lawrence, a redeemed slave child, five years of age as she appeared when found in slavery. Redeemed in Virginia by Catharine [i.e., Catherine] S. Lawrence; baptized in Brooklyn, at Plymouth Church by Henry Ward Beecher, May 1863
Digital ID: (digital file from original item, front) ppmsca 11480 http://


 -


https://appetite4history.com/2016/11/22/the-redeemed-slave-child/

A few weeks ago, while researching something entirely different, I stumbled across the story of Fannie Virginia Casseopia Lawrence. Widely known in the 1860s as a “redeemed slave child,” Fannie was a poster child for the abolitionist movement.

At this point, you might be thinking, “Slave child? Isn’t that little girl white?” No, despite her fair complexion and light brown hair, she’s not. In the mid-1800s, when Fannie was born to a mulatto slave mother and a white slave owner, she would have been described as an “octoroon,” or someone who is one-eighth black.

At the time, terms like quadroon, octoroon and quintroon were used to describe people who were one-fourth, one-eighth and one-sixteenth black. Regardless of how white Fannie appeared or how little African ancestry she actually had, she was considered black.


Fannie, posed in prayer. R.S. De Lamater, photographer, Hartford, CT. (Library of Congress)
You can find many carte-de-visite photographs of Fannie online, including on the Library of Congress website. In the photos, the cherubic child is photographed in various poses, among them kneeling to pray while clad in an angelic, white nightgown.

Because these photos were used as anti-slavery propaganda, this was all about strategy — not only the sweet, innocent pose, but also because Fannie appears to be white. The thinking was that one might be more apt to support the cause, emotionally and monetarily, if one could imagine that praying child as one of their own.

But who was Fannie?

There’s an entry on FindAGrave.com about Fannie, written by a Rick Lawrence, who may or may not be a relative (he didn’t respond to my message). According to Lawrence, Fannie was born in 1858 in Rectortown, Fauquier County, Va.

Fannie’s mom was said to be a slave named Mary Fletcher and her dad was reportedly Fletcher’s owner, Charles Ayres. Ayres, who went by the middle name “Rufus,” was a white lawyer and farmer.

As described by William Page Johnson II, who wrote an article about Fannie and her family for the Historic Fairfax City newsletter in 2015, “Like many slaveholders, Rufus, who was unmarried, took full advantage of the relationship and had at least three children by his slaves Mary Fletcher, Jane Payne, and Ann Gleaves.

“However, unlike most slaveholders, he acknowledged them and provided for them in his last will and testament.”

In November 1859, that will came into play when Ayres was killed by a neighbor. An article headlined “Fatal Affair” in Richmond’s Daily Dispatch states that Ayres was “shot and instantly killed” by James Phillips, and that “the difficulty between them originated about the location of a road.

“Ayres struck Phillips with a cowhide, when the latter drew a pistol and shot Ayres, killing him on the spot.”

A subsequent article in the Alexandria Gazette and Virginia Advertiser describes a more drawn-out incident, involving multiple locations and an additional suspect or two, but the end result is the same: Ayres is dead.

(Both of these articles can be found in the Library of Congress newspaper archive, Chronicling America. Just search for Virginia, the year 1859 and Ayres.)

After Ayres death, the aforementioned slave women and the children Ayres fathered with them were freed. Unfortunately, because of laws at the time, that also meant they had to leave the state of Virginia. Because Mary Fletcher was married to another slave and had other children who were not freed upon Ayres’s death, she chose to remain enslaved.

But during the Civil War, in 1862, Mary Fletcher, Fannie and several other slaves, including others named in Ayres’s will that remained in slavery, escaped. There’s a long, detailed description of the escape in Johnson’s story, but in short, the group flees to Union territory.

What happens to Fannie’s mom after this is uncertain — Johnson includes some theories in his article — but Fannie ends up being adopted by a Civil War nurse named Catharine Lawrence. Lawrence was acquainted with the Rev. Henry Ward Beecher, abolitionist brother of Harriett Beecher Stowe, who wrote “Uncle Tom’s Cabin.”

Lawrence takes Fannie, who’s about 5 years old at the time, to New York. There, she’s baptized by Beecher as “Fannie Virginia Casseopia Lawrence.” It was at this point that Fannie’s “career” as a “redeemed slave child” began.

According to Johnson, before baptizing Fannie, Beecher held her up to his congregation, declaring dramatically, “This child was born a slave, and is redeemed from slavery!” upon which there was an “audible gasp from the astonished, and equally horrified parishioners, who assumed the child to be white.”

Johnson goes on to write that Beecher told his congregation of the terrible fate awaiting Fannie, had she not been adopted by Lawrence. Because of Fannie’s “near-white complexion,” Johnson writes, “Fann[ie], and others like her, were in danger of being abused by their white masters, or worse, being sold as Fancy Girls, a 19th century euphemism for light skinned slave prostitutes, which were then common in New Orleans.”

Or as Beecher put it:

… Look upon this child. Tell me have you ever seen a fairer, sweeter face? This is a sample of the slavery which absorbs into itself everything fair and attractive. The loveliness of this child would only make her so much more valuable as chattel; For while your children are brought up to fear and serve the Lord, this one, just as beautiful, would be made through slavery a child of damnation.

It was an effective ploy, albeit for the good cause of ending slavery.

 -


Sometime shortly after that, photos of Fannie were taken and widely distributed. As Johnson tells it, the pictures were “wildly popular in the North, making Fannie the most photographed slave child in history.”

While Johnson doesn’t say Fannie was abused or neglected in any way, he describes the tactics Beecher and Lawrence used as “exploitive.”

According to the Find A Grave entry, Lawrence raised Fannie “as her own child.” This is supported by the 1865 New York census, which shows a 6-year-old Fannie living in the town of Schoharie with Lawrence and her older brother, Henry Lawrence, a farmer.

Find A Grave also states Fannie married while in her teens and had two children. Johnson’s research led him to this quote by Lawrence, which supports this and also suggests the marriage was not a good one:

The little one that I adopted and educated, married one whom I opposed, knowing his reckless life rendered him wholly unfit for one like her. When sick and among strangers, he deserted her and an infant daughter and eloped with a woman, who left her husband and two small children.

Fannie is believed to have died sometime before 1895. Her burial site is unknown, although it’s believed to be somewhere in New York.

You can read Johnson’s article, in its well-researched entirety, [URL= here ]here[/URL] . It includes a lot more information about Fannie and her family, including the story of her older sisters, who also were brought north and adopted, but to even less happy endings.

And here , you can read an NPR story about other children who were photographed for anti-slavery campaigns.
 
Posted by IronLion (Member # 16412) on :
 
Octroon? But y'all are Octroons, no real albinos left no more. They died out years ago....
 
Posted by Mike111 (Member # 9361) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by IronLion:
Octroon? But y'all are Octroons, no real albinos left no more. They died out years ago....

.
He,he,he,he:

You would think so, but lately I have been seeing Albino children who are "Throwbacks". When I was a kid, White kids weren't THAT White.

And I'm noticing on the Television, where Albinos used to use "darkening" make-up, they are now using lighter make-up.

I assume that is because in the old days Blacks showed up way darker than real life in media, because they had to de-focus and darken to make Albinos look good. And now Blacks started to complain, forcing different camera settings.

So it seems some Albinos are just saying "fuch-it" I'll go with my natural color.

Which is probably the best way - after all, look how ridiculous Trump and a certain News anchor look around the eyes.
 
Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Mike111:
quote:
Originally posted by Ish Gebor:
The unfree Irish in the Caribbean were indentured servants, not slaves

t’s a myth there were ‘Irish slaves’ in Barbados. As difficult as white servants’ experiences were, enslaved Africans were the people treated as livestock.

.


http://realhistoryww.com./world_history/ancient/Misc/Barbados/Barbados.htm


http://realhistoryww.com./world_history/ancient/Misc/Jamaica/Jamaica.htm

Show me the voyages, ...

Next, explain why Irish kept their heritage, name and culture.

These folks are abviously speak of white folks. Or as you call them albinos. That is logic.


quote:
Originally posted by IronLion:
^^Ish speaks from both sides of the mouth sometimes making it hard to understand him...

Nothing is too complex, here. It is all logic.


http://www.egyptsearch.com/forums/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=8;t=009436;p=1#000006
 
Posted by IronLion (Member # 16412) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Ish Gebor:
....


quote:
Originally posted by IronLion:
^^Ish speaks from both sides of the mouth sometimes making it hard to understand him...

Nothing is too complex, here. It is all logic.

http://www.egyptsearch.com/forums/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=15;t=006899;p=1#000000

Seen, seen. [Smile] [Wink]
 
Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 
^That was the wrong link, there is an undated link in my previous post.
 
Posted by IronLion (Member # 16412) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Ish Gebor:
^That was the wrong link, there is an undated link in my previous post.

said!
 
Posted by Mike111 (Member # 9361) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Ish Gebor:
Show me the voyages, ...

Next, explain why Irish kept their heritage, name and culture.

These folks are abviously speak of white folks. Or as you call them albinos. That is logic.

.
Careful, your true color is starting to show.

Here is a link to: "Immigrant Ships Transcribers Guild - Volume 1"

It has ships manifests from the 1600s.

Please peruse it at your leisure, then please tell me how you will differentiate an Albino from a Black man.

http://immigrantships.net/index2.html
 
Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by IronLion:
quote:
Originally posted by Ish Gebor:
^That was the wrong link, there is an undated link in my previous post.

said!
^ Typo, undated = updated. (I am busy with several thing at one time, sorry)
 
Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Mike111:
quote:
Originally posted by Ish Gebor:
Show me the voyages, ...

Next, explain why Irish kept their heritage, name and culture.

These folks are abviously speak of white folks. Or as you call them albinos. That is logic.

.
Careful, your true color is starting to show.

Here is a link to: "Immigrant Ships Transcribers Guild - Volume 1"

It has ships manifests from the 1600s.

Please peruse it at your leisure, then please tell me how you will differentiate an Albino from a Black man.

http://immigrantships.net/index2.html

I knew something like that existed. I had it years ago. That database had names of these endurance as well. I will look into your link, when time fits. I am busy right now.


But it is still a funny amateur site.
 
Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Mike111:
quote:
Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

How the Myth of the "Irish slaves" Became a Favorite Meme of Racists Online

Such is the case with the myth of "Irish slaves," an a historical reimagining of real events weaponized by racists and conspiracy theorists before the Web and now reaching vast new audiences online.

In short, the "Irish slaves" myth argues that the first slaves brought to the Americas were Irish, that they were white, and that this fact, covered up by liberal historians, undermines the legacy of the African slave trade and proves that modern theories of racial inferiority are true.

Predictably, this revisionism has attracted Neo-Nazis, White Nationalists, Neo-Confederates, and even Holocaust deniers, while racist trolls have deployed the myth to attack the Black Lives Matter movement. More worrisome, though, is its widespread adoption by principally American Internet users as if it were a point of "Irish pride."

Irish scholar Liam Hogan has been tracking and debunking this reincarnated meme since he first saw it in 2013. Last year, Hogan published an impressive five-part series exposing the myth and provided a detailed historical analysis of the origins and evolution of the meme.

.
Knowing that many Blacks are poor readers, Albinos often try to sneak stuff past us in text.

Note the quote above: "undermines the legacy of the African slave trade and proves that modern theories of racial inferiority are true."

HOW?

If there were White Slaves and Black Slaves, then wouldn't THAT prove that Slavery was just a matter of circumstance NOT Race?

But of course what those Crackers are really trying to do is remove the STIGMA of Slavery from themselves.

For you see - regardless of the Bullsh1t, Slavery IS equated with being "LESS THAN": and RIGHTLY SO!

Whether I derive from Native American or European, one of by ancestors FUCHED-UP. He got beaten and enslaved - no way to get around that.

The Crackers know that, that's why they are loath to admit that there were Albino Slaves.

Because don't forget, the whole of the Albino Rabbles self-image and self-worth is in their cherished belief that as wretched as they are, they are still better than Niggers.

Since the truth tends to show their belief to be unfounded, they tend to develop alternative histories which support their fantasy.

"Knowing that many Blacks are poor readers, Albinos often try to sneak stuff past us in text."

Yep, you are vivid. lol


Tell me who wrote this BULLSHIT! LOL

"As we can see from the 1850 U.S. census, Whites were also Slaves."


Next you'll going to claim Brown vs the Board and the Jim Crow Law were actually implemented for whites, or albinos as you call them? lol I know you'll get tat ridiculous.
 
Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 
LOL at this baseless and dumb pseudo bullshit!

quote:
Note the quote above: "undermines the legacy of the African slave trade and proves that modern theories of racial inferiority are true."
Stop making up your own crazy stories.


I truly wonder, what are your credentials?


And as a matter of fact that link you had was already in my opening post on that nonsense.


For the sake of the argument, I will post it again.


Finding an Irish Ancestor Using United States Records
https://familysearch.org/wiki/en/Finding_an_Irish_Ancestor_Using_United_States_Records
 
Posted by Mike111 (Member # 9361) on :
 
^He,he,he,he:

I see the pressure has caused you to "OUT" your lying, subverting (at least trying to), Cracker Ass.

I presented EVIDENCE to prove my point:

What do YOU have to offer?
 
Posted by Mike111 (Member # 9361) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Mike111:

If there were White Slaves and Black Slaves, then wouldn't THAT prove that Slavery was just a matter of circumstance NOT Race?

But of course what those Crackers are really trying to do is remove the STIGMA of Slavery from themselves.

For you see - regardless of the Bullsh1t, Slavery IS equated with being "LESS THAN":

.
By way of proof, note Ish Gebor's almost "Hysterical" denouncement of me for suggesting that Albinos were also Slaves.

As I said in the previous page, the Rabble Albinos only sense of worth is in his false belief that only Blacks were Slaves.

And the fact that the very word "Slave" is derived from an Albino people who were so totally enslaved (the Slav's), that their name is synonymous with the evil institution of Slavery, is beyond the limits of their melaninless minds.

Point being, by now all must know that these Albinos aren't very bright, so our only hope is that they will limit their number of posts.
 
Posted by Narmerthoth (Member # 20259) on :
 
^ One thing is certain. ES has no real fans of the sport of boxing.
I get the impression a soccer or X-Box game thread would get much more traction.
 
Posted by Mike111 (Member # 9361) on :
 
^Sorry MK, you know how these threads take on a life of their own.

Besides - there are no compelling boxers left, Mayweather is not really that interesting.

Today's superman is Lebron.
 
Posted by Mike111 (Member # 9361) on :
 
^Lebron - Brawn and Brains!

Already busy building his empire.

Got mad (correctly) when Jackson alluded to thughood - no dumb Nigger here.

Having his hair replaced and complexion repaired, like I said, no dumb Nigger here.

Later on, the tats may be a problem.
 
Posted by Narmerthoth (Member # 20259) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Mike111:
^Sorry MK, you know how these threads take on a life of their own.

Besides - there are no compelling boxers left, Mayweather is not really that interesting.

Today's superman is Lebron.

Boxing is used as a reality check for Albinos to test the results of their genetic and chemical experimental enhancements on the albino body against black reference points.

In parallel with albino artificial physical enhance are other numerous social and economic programs deployed against blacks to render them physically, psychologically and spiritually weak to the point where albinos can physically beat them in the ring.

As I stated in the OP, African Americans have historically dominated boxing's all time great list for the last 60 years, and albinos are acutely aware of this reality.
They don't care about lacking in bouncing a ball and tossing it through a hoop as much as man to man physical combat.
Their enhancement programs will prove to be effective when albinos flip the script and begin showing up on and finally dominating boxing, the number 1 sport of manliness.

Russia has been leading the way in Albino artificial enhancement (steroids, PEDS).
Remember when Joe Louis was chosen to represent America (Whites/Jews) and capitalism against FASCIST Nazi Germany?
Today, Russians are being used as representatives of albino physical supremacy over blacks.
 
Posted by lamin (Member # 5777) on :
 
Sports are OK for entertainment, etc. But what really counts for humans is brainpower.

Dominance is the reward for those societies that dominate in economic and technology power. China and Japan never produced world champions in any popular sport but are greatly respected for their technological and economic power.

There is no human that can run faster than a cheetah, fight of an attacking lion, or swim faster than a dolphin.

In the case of the United States people should have more respect for theoretical physicist, Sylvester James Gates than 100 Muhammad Alis or 50 Michael Jacksons.
 
Posted by Mike111 (Member # 9361) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by lamin:
Sports are OK for entertainment, etc. But what really counts for humans is brainpower.

Dominance is the reward for those societies that dominate in economic and technology power.

.
Damn lamin, can't you be right about ANYTHING?

The United States was unimportant until WWII.

It helped win that war because it's auto, washing machine, aircraft factories, etc. could be converted into Ship building, Tank building, Aircraft building, etc. factories that could not be attacked by the enemy.

As a result the U.S. could turn out War materials in huge numbers. But none were the most advanced, the U.S. could simply OUTPRODUCE everyone.

After the war was over, the U.S. was the only one left standing - all others were in a state of ruin.

As a result the U.S. became the supplier of everything to everyone.
Which made the U.S. the most powerful in military and economy.

Along the way, the U.S. bought or stole the worlds brainiest.
 
Posted by the lioness, (Member # 17353) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Mike111:


Along the way, the U.S. bought or stole the worlds brainiest.

what are some of their names?
 
Posted by Narmerthoth (Member # 20259) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by lamin:
Sports are OK for entertainment, etc. But what really counts for humans is brainpower.

Dominance is the reward for those societies that dominate in economic and technology power. China and Japan never produced world champions in any popular sport but are greatly respected for their technological and economic power.

There is no human that can run faster than a cheetah, fight of an attacking lion, or swim faster than a dolphin.

In the case of the United States people should have more respect for theoretical physicist, Sylvester James Gates than 100 Muhammad Alis or 50 Michael Jacksons.

You want to discuss brain power, than you must understand that an occupational position isn't in itself worthy of admiration.
Rather, it is the psychology of brain that is most important.

Sylvester James Gates isn't worth 1/1000000th of one Mohammed Ali.
He is a theoretical physicist!
Meaning he is an isolated thinker but has little impact on the world other than the very small physics community.
Mohammed Ali was a humanistic thinker who shared his great thoughts with the whole world, not just the US Department of Defence.
Mohammed Ali was a black revolutionary, who transformed the collective thinking of blacks worldwide.

The whole world knew Mohammed Ali. Not because of his boxing, but because of his humanity, sacrifice and positive impact on tens of millions of human lives.

While Ali was an independent black man, Gates can only be a tool for Albinos.
 
Posted by lamin (Member # 5777) on :
 
LOL. Ali was not an "independent" black man. How was Ali a revolutionary thinker who transformed the collective thinking of blacks worldwide? Please explain.

A guys goes into a boxing ring and knocks out opponents and starts to shout "I am the greatest. I am prettiest". And the insults about the looks of Sonny Liston and Joe Frazier. He called them ugly. He called Africans ugly and said they need some white in them. It's all there in some books. OK, amusing and entertaining--that's all.

Ali refused the draft and went to jail--but that did not stop thousands of blacks from accepting to be drafted and fighting in Vietnam. Some died, some survived. Same for the whites.

He became as Muslim and in total ignorance did not know that Islam has also been very harsh blacks and has mentally enslaved and degraded them.

Is there a Muhammad Ali Foundation? Are there Muhammad Ali hospitals, clinics and schools?


Sylvester Gates, Charles Drew, Ben Carson--offer much more inspiration at having beaten the odds than some guy who goes into a boxing ring, knocks down an opponent and starts screaming "I am the greatest". Amusing and entertaining--but that's all.

Plus boxing has a long tradition with U.S. blacks. Ali was just part of a tradition. Not Gates, Charles Drew of Ben Carson

http://www.slate.com/blogs/browbeat/2012/12/24/django_unchained_mandingo_fighting_were_any_slaves_really_forced_to_fight.html

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tom_Molineaux#Career_in_Europe
 
Posted by Narmerthoth (Member # 20259) on :
 
^ ALL those Negroes you listed above work for albinos.
If you aspire to work for whites, then yes, they can be used as models, to be good slaves.

Ali never worked for whites.
He worked for himself and made 100x more money than Gates, Drew and Carson combined.
This is but a fraction of the money Ali earned and he was just 25 in this photo, so at the start of his long career.
 -

Of course there is a Mohammed Ali foundation, and there are city streets across America named after Ali,

New York names street near Madison Square Garden 'Muhammad Ali Way'
and there are many thousands of parents worldwide who named their children after Ali. Even whites.
There are about two dozen movies made about Ali and approx. 40-50 books on his life.

There is a DC issue of Superman comic book with Ali whipping Superman's ass and it is a valuable collector item.
 -
there are songs about Ali, like George Benson's, The Greatest Love Of All.

Muhammad Ali: Champion of Freedom

Ali received the nation's highest civilian honor, the Presidential Medal of Freedom, in 2005.
He also has established the Muhammad Ali Parkinson Research Center in Phoenix and a namesake educational and cultural institute in his hometown, Louisville, Ky.

The National Constitution Center, which opened in 2003, is dedicated to increasing public understanding of the Constitution and the ideas and values it represents.
It awards the Liberty Medal annually to a person who displays courage and conviction while striving to secure freedom for people around the world.

http://constitutioncenter.org/liberty-medal/recipients/muhammad-ali-champion-of-freedom

Ali's name alone is worth about $500M, and growing. By 2040, the Ali name will be worth over $1B dollars.

What will be the worth of the three people you've named and their names?

My Great grand parents were business owners. My grand parents were business owners. My parents were business owners. I am a business owner, and my sons are too.
Who wants to be a slave to albinos? LOL!

African Americans don't need more symbolism. They need to free their minds so their weak asses will follow.

Look at Ben Carson's stupid and twisted mentality. He is no role model except how to cater to albinos. I used to work for Johns Hopkins, so I'm very familiar with this lackey Negro Carson.
Gates dreams of things for whites which are used in their military complex, and the practical applications have nothing to do with assisting blacks. This is not what I'd want for my children, to emulate a weak minded Negro like Gates.
 
Posted by the lioness, (Member # 17353) on :
 
it's spelled with a U
 
Posted by Narmerthoth (Member # 20259) on :
 
F U!
 
Posted by lamin (Member # 5777) on :
 
quote:
Ali never worked for whites.
ral

Muhammad Ali worked for WHITE MAN Angelo Dundee. He made Dundee rich just doing the easy job of arranging fights for him.

Taking all those blows to the head just to get Parkinson's Disease and just to make a WHITE MAN rich.

Ali graduated 376 out of 391 students from Central High School in Louisville, Kentucky. Not the kind of credentials that would make you know how to manage your books and pay taxes--and how to spend your money wisely.

Not knocking the guy. He used his talents the best way he knew how--but Ali did WORK for WHITES. WHITES also set up that Parkinson's Center for him.
 
Posted by lamin (Member # 5777) on :
 
quote:
I could understand the native population as they were free but the African part makes no sense as the whole point of slavery was for blacks to work going by what whites say.
The Native American populations were not free as you claim. They were enslaved by the Spaniards for 100 years and more.

Then Spanish Priest Bartolomo de las Casas decided that the Native Americans should be saved for Christianity. He then appealed to the Pope and the Catholic monarch of Spain that blacks(negros in Spanish) would be preferable to do the slavery work.

That was how the African Slave Trade began.
 
Posted by lamin (Member # 5777) on :
 
quote:
Look at Ben Carson's stupid and twisted mentality. He is no role model except how to cater to albinos. I used to work for Johns Hopkins, so I'm very familiar with this lackey Negro Carson.
Gates dreams of things for whites which are used in their military complex, and the practical applications have nothing to do with assisting blacks. This is not what I'd want for my children, to emulate a weak minded Negro like Gates.

Most blacks in the U.S. work for whites, except for those selling illegal stuff and the very,very few that run their own businesses. Even Obama works for whites. After all, whites pay more than 90% of all taxes--and those taxes pay his wages.

Looks like your solution is to get your own state, the way are you are talking. Hey, why not petition for 5 Southern states for the blacks and 2 West Coast states for the Native Americans. They already have the Navajo Nation--3 times the size of Israel. Plus some other self-contained Reservations of thousands of square kilometers.

Your problem though is the vast majority of blacks will not go along with your program. They would prefer pushing the M.K. King dream of fighting for loving equality with whites.

Without your own state, what else could people like Carson and Gates do? They gotta work for whites. Right?

The black man's dream in the U.S. post-1865 has always been to be accepted and to be integrated with the white man. That's what the revered M.L. King preached. Right?
 
Posted by IronLion (Member # 16412) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by lamin:
LOL. Ali was not an "independent" black man. How was Ali a revolutionary thinker who transformed the collective thinking of blacks worldwide? Please explain.

A guys goes into a boxing ring and knocks out opponents and starts to shout "I am the greatest. I am prettiest". And the insults about the looks of Sonny Liston and Joe Frazier. He called them ugly. He called Africans ugly and said they need some white in them. It's all there in some books. OK, amusing and entertaining--that's all.

Ali refused the draft and went to jail--but that did not stop thousands of blacks from accepting to be drafted and fighting in Vietnam. Some died, some survived. Same for the whites.

He became as Muslim and in total ignorance did not know that Islam has also been very harsh blacks and has mentally enslaved and degraded them.

Is there a Muhammad Ali Foundation? Are there Muhammad Ali hospitals, clinics and schools?


Sylvester Gates, Charles Drew, Ben Carson--offer much more inspiration at having beaten the odds than some guy who goes into a boxing ring, knocks down an opponent and starts screaming "I am the greatest". Amusing and entertaining--but that's all.

Plus boxing has a long tradition with U.S. blacks. Ali was just part of a tradition. Not Gates, Charles Drew of Ben Carson

http://www.slate.com/blogs/browbeat/2012/12/24/django_unchained_mandingo_fighting_were_any_slaves_really_forced_to_fight.html

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tom_Molineaux#Career_in_Europe

Imagine this fuching disrespectful Juu!

Shut your mouth, since you have your head in your asshole...

Ali was a world icon.

How dare you mention Ali and Carson in the same breath...

Juu, you is a clown [Big Grin]


African King
 -
 
Posted by IronLion (Member # 16412) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by lamin:
quote:
Look at Ben Carson's stupid and twisted mentality. He is no role model except how to cater to albinos. I used to work for Johns Hopkins, so I'm very familiar with this lackey Negro Carson.
Gates dreams of things for whites which are used in their military complex, and the practical applications have nothing to do with assisting blacks. This is not what I'd want for my children, to emulate a weak minded Negro like Gates.

Most blacks in the U.S. work for whites, except for those selling illegal stuff and the very,very few that run their own businesses. Even Obama works for whites. After all, whites pay more than 90% of all taxes--and those taxes pay his wages.

Looks like your solution is to get your own state, the way are you are talking. Hey, why not petition for 5 Southern states for the blacks and 2 West Coast states for the Native Americans. They already have the Navajo Nation--3 times the size of Israel. Plus some other self-contained Reservations of thousands of square kilometers.

Your problem though is the vast majority of blacks will not go along with your program. They would prefer pushing the M.K. King dream of fighting for loving equality with whites.

Without your own state, what else could people like Carson and Gates do? They gotta work for whites. Right?

The black man's dream in the U.S. post-1865 has always been to be accepted and to be integrated with the white man. That's what the revered M.L. King preached. Right?

You should come over to US and see the reality..

You sound like all you know about the US is read from Albino books and magazines.

Come over here if you can and see that reality trumps your fantasy...
 
Posted by Real tawk (Member # 20324) on :
 
You are a damn bold face lie. I live in the US and can attest to the FACT a vast majority of Blacks will NOT go along with segregating from White America. They want to be included and seen as equals. That is what all this saber rattling noise is about that Blacks make. Deep down inside Blacks know they will fvcking fail as a state of their own. Look at any Black country and see for yourself. Without white backing a nigga is a nigga.


quote:
Originally posted by IronLion:
quote:
Originally posted by lamin:
quote:
Look at Ben Carson's stupid and twisted mentality. He is no role model except how to cater to albinos. I used to work for Johns Hopkins, so I'm very familiar with this lackey Negro Carson.
Gates dreams of things for whites which are used in their military complex, and the practical applications have nothing to do with assisting blacks. This is not what I'd want for my children, to emulate a weak minded Negro like Gates.

Most blacks in the U.S. work for whites, except for those selling illegal stuff and the very,very few that run their own businesses. Even Obama works for whites. After all, whites pay more than 90% of all taxes--and those taxes pay his wages.

Looks like your solution is to get your own state, the way are you are talking. Hey, why not petition for 5 Southern states for the blacks and 2 West Coast states for the Native Americans. They already have the Navajo Nation--3 times the size of Israel. Plus some other self-contained Reservations of thousands of square kilometers.

Your problem though is the vast majority of blacks will not go along with your program. They would prefer pushing the M.K. King dream of fighting for loving equality with whites.

Without your own state, what else could people like Carson and Gates do? They gotta work for whites. Right?

The black man's dream in the U.S. post-1865 has always been to be accepted and to be integrated with the white man. That's what the revered M.L. King preached. Right?

You should come over to US and see the reality..

You sound like all you know about the US is read from Albino books and magazines.

Come over here if you can and see that reality trumps your fantasy...


 
Posted by IronLion (Member # 16412) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Real tawk:
You are a damn bold face lie. I live in the US and can attest to the FACT a vast majority of Blacks will NOT go along with segregating from White America. They want to be included and seen as equals. That is what all this saber rattling noise is about that Blacks make. Deep down inside Blacks know they will fvcking fail as a state of their own. Look at any Black country and see for yourself. Without white backing a nigga is a nigga.


Blacks like your confused half-white half-haitian ass..

Full blooded Muurs know where they come from and where they are heading to [Smile]
 
Posted by Mike111 (Member # 9361) on :
 
MK - I just realized you never mentioned the greatest Modern Heavyweight next to Ali:

(He beat a washed-up Ali in 1980).

Larry Holmes - guess that's what he gets for always fighting down to the competition.

But his bout with Cooney was epic.

Never seen a man survive a pummeling of his testicles like that, and win a fight.

Never seen a fighter purposefully and obviously, punch an opponents crotch and not be disqualified.

 -
 
Posted by Mike111 (Member # 9361) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Real tawk:
You are a damn bold face lie. I live in the US and can attest to the FACT a vast majority of Blacks will NOT go along with segregating from White America. They want to be included and seen as equals. That is what all this saber rattling noise is about that Blacks make. Deep down inside Blacks know they will fvcking fail as a state of their own. Look at any Black country and see for yourself. Without white backing a nigga is a nigga.

You are quite right, most Blacks do NOT want a separated and segregated country.

And it has nothing to do with equality:

You Albinos have to prove that YOU are equal, not the other way around. You mistake power for worth.

A child with a gun is powerful, but of little worth.

The reason we do not want separation, is because it would take about two months for our divided country to be overcome.

Rabble Albinos don't think like that.

They are simple-minded people who think every problem has a simple solution.

Hence their love and support for Donald Trump, another simple-minded person.

I was going to say: "Perhaps if you knew more about the World... but then Trump has been all over the world. So all I can say is.......

Damn you Rabble Albinos are STUPID!
 
Posted by lamin (Member # 5777) on :
 
quote:
Imagine this fuching disrespectful Juu!

Shut your mouth, since you have your head in your asshole...

Ali was a world icon.

How dare you mention Ali and Carson in the same breath...

Juu, you is a clown [Big Grin]



Listen to this 2 brain cells jackass. So stupid in his thinking. An opposing opinion is always met with the brainless jackass epithet of "ju" or "albino".

Face the facts, Ali was a great boxer but he made some white people rich. My preference in blacks whom I respect is "blacks with brains". That's been the black man's problem since 1492. Too few blacks have real brains.

Running,boxing, jumping, singing, dancing, rapping, etc.--I guess they are OK, but don't see how they have benefited blacks because behind the curtain, there is always some white man managing the money made. He doles out some for the black performer and keeps the rest for himself.
 
Posted by IronLion (Member # 16412) on :
 
Ali made the entire earth richer. He was a blessing.

Blacks with brains are all good. Is brain found only in books and schools?

Intelligence (which is what you are trying to define) is a quality that includes creativity, focus, attention, patience, love and inspiration.

Ali was all these and MUUR!

By his teachings Ali gave nuff man backbone to stand up.

How many men has either you or Carson inspired to further greatness.

Ali was our king who showed us how to beat up juus in and out of the ring.

You and your kind will soon fall, Babylonian bwoy!!
 
Posted by Narmerthoth (Member # 20259) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by lamin:
quote:
Ali never worked for whites.
ral

Muhammad Ali worked for WHITE MAN Angelo Dundee. He made Dundee rich just doing the easy job of arranging fights for him.

Taking all those blows to the head just to get Parkinson's Disease and just to make a WHITE MAN rich.

Ali graduated 376 out of 391 students from Central High School in Louisville, Kentucky. Not the kind of credentials that would make you know how to manage your books and pay taxes--and how to spend your money wisely.

Not knocking the guy. He used his talents the best way he knew how--but Ali did WORK for WHITES. WHITES also set up that Parkinson's Center for him.

You got it twisted.
Ali didn't work for Dundee. Dundee worked for Ali.
There is a difference.
Does the DoD work for Gates?
Does John Hopkins work for Carson?
Let your emotions settle down and think logically.
 
Posted by Narmerthoth (Member # 20259) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by lamin:
quote:
Look at Ben Carson's stupid and twisted mentality. He is no role model except how to cater to albinos. I used to work for Johns Hopkins, so I'm very familiar with this lackey Negro Carson.
Gates dreams of things for whites which are used in their military complex, and the practical applications have nothing to do with assisting blacks. This is not what I'd want for my children, to emulate a weak minded Negro like Gates.

Most blacks in the U.S. work for whites, except for those selling illegal stuff and the very,very few that run their own businesses. Even Obama works for whites. After all, whites pay more than 90% of all taxes--and those taxes pay his wages.

Looks like your solution is to get your own state, the way are you are talking. Hey, why not petition for 5 Southern states for the blacks and 2 West Coast states for the Native Americans. They already have the Navajo Nation--3 times the size of Israel. Plus some other self-contained Reservations of thousands of square kilometers.

Your problem though is the vast majority of blacks will not go along with your program. They would prefer pushing the M.K. King dream of fighting for loving equality with whites.

Without your own state, what else could people like Carson and Gates do? They gotta work for whites. Right?

The black man's dream in the U.S. post-1865 has always been to be accepted and to be integrated with the white man. That's what the revered M.L. King preached. Right?

And the biblical scriptures tell you that, 90% of the people will go to hell.

FYI, Carson rarely treated a black person. He catered to wealthy whites and had no time to treat poor blacks.
Look at him today. A soulless Black republican.
No surprised that you whites admire that.
 
Posted by Narmerthoth (Member # 20259) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Real tawk:
[QB] You are a damn bold face lie. I live in the US and can attest to the FACT a vast majority of Blacks will NOT go along with segregating from White America. They want to be included and seen as equals. That is what all this saber rattling noise is about that Blacks make. Deep down inside Blacks know they will fvcking fail as a state of their own. Look at any Black country and see for yourself. Without white backing a nigga is a nigga.

See, you heard it straight from the thin satanic lips of the very albino citizens that Carson and Gates work tirelessly to support and champion.
 
Posted by Narmerthoth (Member # 20259) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by lamin:
quote:
Imagine this fuching disrespectful Juu!

Shut your mouth, since you have your head in your asshole...

Ali was a world icon.

How dare you mention Ali and Carson in the same breath...

Juu, you is a clown [Big Grin]



Listen to this 2 brain cells jackass. So stupid in his thinking. An opposing opinion is always met with the brainless jackass epithet of "ju" or "albino".

Face the facts, Ali was a great boxer but he made some white people rich. My preference in blacks whom I respect is "blacks with brains". That's been the black man's problem since 1492. Too few blacks have real brains.

Running,boxing, jumping, singing, dancing, rapping, etc.--I guess they are OK, but don't see how they have benefited blacks because behind the curtain, there is always some white man managing the money made. He doles out some for the black performer and keeps the rest for himself.

Listen.
I'm assuming that you are very young.
So young that you fail to comprehend the powerful impact Ali had on not only blacks, but people all around the world.
Prior to Ali, we had these "Yes sir boss" Negroes like Joe Louis, Sonny Liston, and others.
The mindset of these Negroes was to fight when the white man said to fight, to lay down and roll over when the white man told them to. At press conferences, they usually held their heads down and mumbled a Yes/No answer before letting their white handlers finish the interview.

Then came Muhammed Ali. Head held high, voice loud and filled with a black man's confidence.
Negroes around the world saw this, were struck with lighting, and instantly transformed from Negroes to strong black men.
Ali took control of the Jew controlled media, hi-jacked it, and made it his own.
No other Black man has had this impact on blacks since Marcus Garvey!
 
Posted by Narmerthoth (Member # 20259) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Mike111:
MK - I just realized you never mentioned the greatest Modern Heavyweight next to Ali:

(He beat a washed-up Ali in 1980).

Larry Holmes - guess that's what he gets for always fighting down to the competition.

But his bout with Cooney was epic.

Never seen a man survive a pummeling of his testicles like that, and win a fight.

Never seen a fighter purposefully and obviously, punch an opponents crotch and not be disqualified.

 -

Holmes was one of Ali's sparring partners.
He didn't want to fight Ali, but Ali wanted the money and almost begged him to do the fight.
Holmes did and afterwards went to his dressing room and cried.
Holmes was never as good as Ali and fated to live in Ali's shadow.
However, after Ali retired, Holmes was the next best thing to Ali, and that's what the people wanted because Ali had spoiled them so badly.

Holmes is very smart and owns most all of Easton, PA.
When two factories in Easton announced they were shutting down and laying off thousands of workers, Holmes purchased both factories, kept the workers employed, and a year later had them both making record profits.
The people in Easton, PA love Larry Holmes and would kill anyone coming there disrespecting him.

Larry Holmes has an 8th grade education.
 
Posted by lamin (Member # 5777) on :
 
quote:
you got it twisted.
Ali didn't work for Dundee. Dundee worked for Ali.
There is a difference.
Does the DoD work for Gates?
Does John Hopkins work for Carson?
Let your emotions settle down and think logically.

You guys just a need some training in logic. Ali produced the OUTPUT of his sweat and boxing skills. Dundee as the MANAGER, just like a horse owner, collected the cash and took his cut. Then he would tell Ali "go rest up and massage your battered body. In the mean time I will look for some other fights for you". Without Dundee, Ali would be at loss to do anything in terms of collecting the prize money, pay taxes, invest the winnings, and arrange for other fights. That's why Dundee was the "manager" and Ali the "fighter".

Dundee in relation to Ali was like Johns Hopkins to employee Carson. Get it?
 
Posted by IronLion (Member # 16412) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by lamin:
quote:
you got it twisted.
Ali didn't work for Dundee. Dundee worked for Ali.
There is a difference.
Does the DoD work for Gates?
Does John Hopkins work for Carson?
Let your emotions settle down and think logically.

You guys just a need some training in logic. Ali produced the OUTPUT of his sweat and boxing skills. Dundee as the MANAGER, just like a horse owner, collected the cash and took his cut. Then he would tell Ali "go rest up and massage your battered body. In the mean time I will look for some other fights for you". Without Dundee, Ali would be at loss to do anything in terms of collecting the prize money, pay taxes, invest the winnings, and arrange for other fights. That's why Dundee was the "manager" and Ali the "fighter".

Dundee in relation to Ali was like Johns Hopkins to employee Carson. Get it?

Stupiiid bwoy!

Boxers sack their managers never the other way round...

The two links below will help you understand:

http://www.secondsout.com/world-boxing-news/world-boxing-news/pacquiaos-manager-sacks-nazario-praises-dibella

http://news.ugo.co.ug/boxer-basajjamivule-sacks-manager/
 
Posted by Narmerthoth (Member # 20259) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by lamin:
quote:
you got it twisted.
Ali didn't work for Dundee. Dundee worked for Ali.
There is a difference.
Does the DoD work for Gates?
Does John Hopkins work for Carson?
Let your emotions settle down and think logically.

You guys just a need some training in logic. Ali produced the OUTPUT of his sweat and boxing skills. Dundee as the MANAGER, just like a horse owner, collected the cash and took his cut. Then he would tell Ali "go rest up and massage your battered body. In the mean time I will look for some other fights for you". Without Dundee, Ali would be at loss to do anything in terms of collecting the prize money, pay taxes, invest the winnings, and arrange for other fights. That's why Dundee was the "manager" and Ali the "fighter".

Dundee in relation to Ali was like Johns Hopkins to employee Carson. Get it?

Read more and talk less.
Angelo Dundee was a TRAINER, not a manager. There is a huge difference and the two are not interchangeable.
Dundee had absolutely no part in finding or negotiating fights for Ali.
That was the job of Ali's manager, Herbert Muhammed, the 3rd son of Elijah Muhammed.

 -
Herbert Muhammed, to Ali's left. To the right of Ali is Bob Arum

Herbert Muhammed and Ali built Masjid Al-Fatir. Masjid Al-Fatir was one of the first mosques built from the ground up by Muslim Americans.

Angelo Dundee was/is a great boxing trainer, and after Ali, he went on to train, Sugar Ray Leonard and George Foreman, both also All Time Great US African American boxers.

You seem to know very little about the history of the sport of boxing. You must be very young, and lived a very isolated life. Private school, right?

 -
Ali's political mentor

 -
Ali In China

 -
Ali works out at his camp
 
Posted by Narmerthoth (Member # 20259) on :
 
For your future reference, the way payroll is performed in the sport of boxing;

Boxer: Lump sum Purse

IRS: 20-30% off the top
Promoter: 10-30% of purse
Manager: 10% of purse
Trainer: 3-5% of purse

So, if the boxer's purse is $1,000,000...

I.R.S.: $200,000 to $300,000
Promoter: $100,000 to $300,000 (This is what Herbert Muhammed received)
Manager: $100,000 (Herbert also acted as manager)
Trainer: $30,000 to $50,000 (This is what Angelo Dundee received)

So, as you see, Dundee was at the bottom of the food chain.

Other expenses;
-Travel expenses
-Sparring partner fees (Larry Holmes was paid from here)
-Training facility fees (Ali Owned his own training camp shown above)
-Conditioning coach (Handles diet, supplements, exercise program)
-Medical fees (Pre & Post fight medical, and sometimes, treatment)
-Accounting fees

Sometimes some of the above expenses come out of the promoter's cut.

So, from a $1M purse, the boxer after all shares and fees are distributed may bring home anywhere from $300,000 to $500,000.
Boxers generally fight 3-4 time per year.
 
Posted by the lioness, (Member # 17353) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Narmerthoth:
[QB] For your future reference, the way payroll is performed in the sport of boxing;

Boxer: Lump sum Purse

IRS: 20-30% off the top
Promoter: 10-30% of purse
Manager: 10% of purse
Trainer: 3-5% of purse

So, if the boxer's purse is $1,000,000...

I.R.S.: $200,000 to $300,000
Promoter: $100,000 to $300,000 (This is what Herbert Muhammed received)
Manager: $100,000 (Herbert also acted as manager)
Trainer: $30,000 to $50,000 (This is what Angelo Dundee received)


Herbert Muhammad was Ali's manager 1966-1981
his percentage was 33 1/3 %
Bob Arum was Ali's promoter 1966-1978
but Herbert Muhammad was also silent partner in Ali's promotions as you mention
Gene KIlroy, Ali's business manager


Don King, promoter "Rumble in te Jungle"
The Rumble in the Jungle was a historic boxing event in Kinshasa, Zaire (now Democratic Republic of the Congo) on October 30, 1974 (at 4:00 am). Held at the 20th of May Stadium (now the Stade Tata Raphaël), it pitted the undefeated world heavyweight champion George Foreman against challenger Muhammad Ali, a former heavyweight champion. The attendance was 60,000. Ali won by knockout, putting Foreman down just before the end of the eighth round. It has been called "arguably the greatest sporting event of the 20th century". The event was one of Don King's first ventures as a professional boxing promoter.

Don King has been involved in many litigation cases with boxers that were focused on fraud. In 1982 he was sued by Muhammad Ali for underpaying him $1.1 million for a fight with Larry Holmes. King called in an old friend of Ali, Jeremiah Shabazz, and handed him a suitcase containing $50,000 in cash and a letter ending Ali's lawsuit against King. He asked Shabazz to visit Ali (who was in hospital due to his failing health) and get him to sign the letter and then give Ali the $50,000. Ali signed. The letter even gave King the right to promote any future Ali fights. According to Shabazz, "Ali was ailing by then and mumbling a lot. I guess he needed the money." Shabazz later regretted helping King. Ali's lawyer cried when he learned that Ali had ended the lawsuit without telling him.

____________________________________________


AUDIO: Bob Arum, Ali promoter
Interview
"90 Percent of Americans Opposed Ali"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4jObnGUiedg
 
Posted by lamin (Member # 5777) on :
 
Ali's promoter and manager were really cleaning up from Ali's fights. Kinda looks like exploitation to me. He shouda(sic) knocked them all out.
 
Posted by Narmerthoth (Member # 20259) on :
 
About life, no one in this world is perfect, and sometimes in life you must reap the retributions of karma.
One aspect and decision Ali made that I recognize as a down point and shameful is when Ali turned his back on his spiritual and political mentor, Malcolm X.
When asked did he have any regrets in life, Ali always responded that he wished really regretted this.
With Malcolm gone, Ali lost one of his key advisers and friends. Had Malcolm lived, Ali would have left the NOI sooner and followed Malcolm.

Ali was a man, and a black man in American who was hated by Albinos for his out-spoken persona, his political stance, his involvement with the Nation Of Islam, and the fact that although he could have any Albino woman, he always married black.
Boxing has always been controlled behind the scenes by the Russian (Jewish) Mob. Don King and Bob Arum have strong connections to these Jewish gangsters, which is why both became large and successful boxing promoters.
Even today Jews control the sport through media and contractual control. However, the NOI put several of these Jews in the hospital and put fear in them, so the NOI became a major force in boxing and shielded Ali from the Jewish mob. But, the NOI couldn't shield Ali from his own.

In his will, Ali left each of his nine children $8 million dollars each, and his wife Lonnie around $25-30M.

After his death, Ali's long time doctor came out and announced that Ali's Parkinson wasn't actually Parkinsons, but Parkinson's symptoms.
He also stated that these symptoms DID NOT come from his boxing.
This is something I've suspected for quite a while. Many boxers took many times more abuse than Ali in the ring, but Parkinsons symptoms in boxers is very rare, yet the most vocal and most influential boxers in the world suddenly gets Parkinson symptoms.
This sounds like the work of Jews or the CIA who have the tools to give targeted people cancer and other diseases.
 
Posted by the lioness, (Member # 17353) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Narmerthoth:

Had Malcolm lived, Ali would have left the NOI sooner and followed Malcolm.


So who was it better for him to follow if Malcom had lived,
Malcom or Elijah Muhammad?
 
Posted by Narmerthoth (Member # 20259) on :
 
Life is a series of personal and collective evolutions.
Malcolm had evolved to be more open and accepting and Ali evolved also in the same manner.

The current NOI under Farrakhan has evolved to merge Christianity with Islam with the goal of pulling more mainstream Negroes into it's folds.

The NAACP has devolved from a propaganda tool for Jews into a useless and empty Negro financial contribution extraction tool run by Jew and Negro lawyers.
The new Jew controlled Negro false Hope org is the Black Lives Matter, toothless lionese of a movement.
 
Posted by Narmerthoth (Member # 20259) on :
 
Mohammed Ali schooling whites and Sly Stone on Mike Douglas show.
Sly looks and acts like he high on Coke.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cRUeV4bD27Q
 
Posted by the lioness, (Member # 17353) on :
 
The look on Ali's face when Sly asked him where do you live
 
Posted by the lioness, (Member # 17353) on :
 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mE0IYSr7xEA

Here's Ali saying African women who were partially naked in tribes were savages and then promoting Islamic concepts on covering up women

I don't agree with a lot of what Alis says but I respect that he was not afraid to speak his mind
 
Posted by Narmerthoth (Member # 20259) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by the lioness,:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mE0IYSr7xEA

Here's Ali saying African women who were partially naked in tribes were savages and then promoting Islamic concepts on covering up women

I don't agree with a lot of what Alis says but I respect that he was not afraid to speak his mind

He's right, but as with anything in life, there are positive and negatives associated with their being primitives.
The positive: Their husbands save a ton of money and don't have to worry about their wives putting them in debt at Macy's or Walmart buying carts full of clothing and cosmetics.
 


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