This is topic Genetics Research Supports White supremacy in forum Deshret at EgyptSearch Forums.


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Posted by Clyde Winters (Member # 10129) on :
 
Click on the video:

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Posted by KING (Member # 9422) on :
 
great job Clyde. genetics are so fake that they thought they could tell a story with blood yet the only one that can read blood is GOD.

genetics is scientist pretending they Some kind of God and sneakly following the history of people using all common history techniques then pretending that there dna nonsense adds to the story. dna is fake

i add this hear


Also there was DNA Tests of people who were clearly African...who had DNA stating they were From places as far as East Asia

Man as 'black’for 50 years finds out he's probably not


http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/en/doc/2003-12/29/content_294229.htm


This is the Next particular strange phenomenon of DNA when an African Male took the dna Lie oops plunge:



I Thought I Was Black - Until I Had An Ancestry DNA Test
http://www.arogundade.com/my-story-ancestry-dna-testing-for-ethnicity.html

DNA seems to get what the doctor or scientist desires. I would not hold to DNA testing to prove my point.

Scientist are liars
 

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Posted by Clyde Winters (Member # 10129) on :
 








 

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Posted by the lioness, (Member # 17353) on :
 


Contact is irrelevant.

Settlement and people mixing it what is relevant and could have impact on a population.
 

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Posted by the lioness, (Member # 17353) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Clyde Winters:
[Genetics Research Supports White supremacy

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quote:

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Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

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Originally posted by Clyde Winters:
[Genetics Research Supports White supremacy

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Yet Clyde Winters has numerous articles trying to use genetic research conducted by white researchers and white institutions to support his theories

Here's an example

https://www.academia.edu/1898548/Possible_African_Origin_of_Y-Chromosome_R1_-M173


I.J.S.N., VOL. 2(4) 2011: 743-745 ISSN 2229 – 6441
7 4 3
POSSIBLE AFRICAN ORIGIN OF Y-CHROMOSOME R1-M173
Clyde Winters, 2011
Uthman dan Fodio Institute, Chicago,Illinois 60643


^^ If you look at this article written by Dr. Clyde it's theme is based on genetic research on chromosomes, he uses genetic research to argue his position and at the end of the article has numerous genetic research references conducted by whites in white founded institutions, so this thread must be retracted

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You sound stupid as usual. I am saying that the Academe lies about the relationship between people of color to make it appear that there are genes common only to Eurasians and Africans, instead of admitting that Africans carried all of these genes first. As a result, there was no such thing as a back migration of Eurasian genes back into Africa.

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Posted by Clyde Winters (Member # 10129) on :
 
The biggest lie is that Blacks in Africa and the Pacific are two different populations.

Dr. Keita attempts to explain Polytopicity , by claiming that although the Melanesians and Africans look similar they are not related because they speak different languages and possess disimilar genes.

Use of melanesians and Africans to exemplify Polytopicity was a bad analogy, because Africans and Melanesians are not only Negroes, they also share genes, placenames and language.

There is constant changes in the terminology for haplogroups as researchers attempt to imply that Africans carry one set of genes, and other populations outside Africa carry a different and unique set of genes. Although this is the case in many cases the populations are carrying African genes--whoes name has been changed to erase any unity between Sub-Saharan Africa and everyone else.

For example, Africans and Melanesians share haplogroups.



In fact, they also share common placenames. Shared place names in Melanesia suggest that the Melanesians recently came to the Pacific from Africa, as claimed by the Fijians.




The Melanesians probably belonged to the Niger-Congo and Dravidian speaking communities that formerly lived in the Sahara-Sahel region until 5-6kya. The Melanesians formerly lived in Africa and/or South China/Southeast Asia before they sailed to the Pacific Islans, probably as part of the Lapita migrations.

In figure 3 we see cognate Mande and Melanesian terms for vase, pot, arrow, cattle/ox, and fish. They also shared agricultural terms as well

• Polynesian English Manding
  *talun fallow, land daa
  *tanem to plant daa
  *suluq torch, flame suu
  *kuDen cooking pot,bowl ku

As you can see the Melanesians and Africans are not only negroid they also share genes, placenames and culture terms. Obviously, use of Melanesians and Africans does not support Polytopicity.

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Posted by the lioness, (Member # 17353) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Clyde Winters:
instead of admitting that Africans carried all of these genes first.

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quote:

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Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

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Originally posted by Clyde Winters:
instead of admitting that Africans carried all of these genes first.

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That's a lie

People who left Africa have been outside Africa have been outside Africa at least 60,000 years or 100,000 or more.

That is a long period of time.
Long enough for multiple new unique haplogroups to form outside of Africa

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quote:

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Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

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Originally posted by Clyde Winters:
instead of admitting that Africans carried all of these genes first.

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That's a lie

People who left Africa have been outside Africa have been outside Africa at least 60,000 years or 100,000 or more.

That is a long period of time.
Long enough for multiple new unique haplogroups to form outside of Africa

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Are you paid to be this stupid? Is it worth the money?

How does what you say contradict what you qouted? If a person moves from somewhere and within his loins is the ability to create diverse variations of people, that means that the ability was already in the more ancient man, moving the person to a new location changes nothing about that.

What is the end goal by forcibly playing stupid?
 

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Posted by Clyde Winters (Member # 10129) on :
 



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Genetics is used to perpetuate white supremacy.

Researchers use genetics to maintain the idea of the "true Negro". Although, history makes it clear that Africans and Eurasians have been mixing for 1000's of years, but, Admixture and Structure programs are based on the assumption that the Eurasians and Africans only came in contact during the Atlantic Slave Trade. And as a result, they theorize that the genes carried by Eurasians today are unique to Eurasians populations.

But, what happened is that as they researched African genomes and found that Africans carried the same genes. For example, the highest frequency of haplogroup DE was found in Nigeria, I believe, but as more and more Eurasians were found to carry the haplogroup (hg) the Europeans declared it was European, and that the 9-bp deletion was characteristic of only Asians..

Europeans claimed that L3(M,N) were unique to Eurasians. Then it was discovered that hg M1, was of African origin--yet, they still maintained that it could only appear in Africa as the result of a back migration. Next, they found out that Eurasians carried the exact same M1 as Africans, so they began to call the Eurasian M Macrohaplogroup: hg D, and African M1 in Eurasia hg D4.

Next the geneticists discovered hg R1-M173 in Africa. They knew African R1-M173 was the pristine form of the genome, but they claimed it was the result of a back migration.

In 2010, R-V88 was originally named R1b1a and ; R-V8, was named R1b1a2. Today R-V88 is named R1b1a2, and R1b1a is renamed R-L754. Africans also , carried R1b1 so the status quo changed the name to R-L278.

After, geneticist were able to recover ancient DNA, they found that ancient Eurasians carried R1b1a, R-L754, R-V88, R-M269 and R-L278, the exact same genes as Africans, they began to claim these genomes were no longer found in Africa, and that Africans only carried R-V88. They did this to try and maintain that Eurasians are a unique population, instead of the reality they are carrying African genes and as a result, Africans truely are their Daddy and Mother.

The presence of genomes carried by Africans, in the prehistoric Europeans populations should not be a surprised, because the skeletons show the ancient Europeans were Africans, or Negroes. Moreover, the archaeology indicated that the Aurignacian Solutrean , Bell Beaker/Corded Ware cultures appeared first in Africa and was carried into Europe by Africans practicing these cultures. And as a result, genetics are only supporting the history and archaeology of numerous migrations of Africans into Eurasia.

The ancient Europeans and Africans share R-L278. The earliest carrier of R-L278 in Europe was Villabruna man in Italy. Villabruna man lived 12kya. This would place Africans carrying R-L278 in Europe long before the origination of the Bell Beaker and Yamnaya cultures.

Given the wide distribution of M269, V88 and R-L278 in Africa and ancient Europe, the carriers of these haplogroup were probably also Africans since the Bell Beaker people/culture originated in Morocco.Eurasian scholars know this, but they try not to admit it because they feel it denies their existence as a unique population.

Many people refuse to acknowledge God in the creation process.if humans would think they would know that God did not create just one colored bird, He made birds in numerous colors.

Eurasian ( i.e., Arabs, East Asians and Europeans) supremacists desire to make themselves appear superior to the African, who they maintain were always their slaves. They know Blacks appeared first on Earth in Africa. Thusly they had to admit there was an Out of Africa event that encouraged man to migrate out of Africa into Eurasia and the Americas.

Archaeology and craniometrics proved Africans /Blacks created the first civilizations. Geneticists was hoping that they could use this science to once and for all prove the superiority whites over the Blacks, no matter what history, craniometrics and archeology illustrated.

But as in the case of history, craniometrics and archaeology, overtime, genetics also showed the important role Africans/Negroes played in World History.

Given the need for most whites to support the idea of "white supremacy", the members of FBF and the numerous 'Eurogenetics' blogs, have to practice a form of selective amnesia in relation to genetic evidence, to maintain their self-esteem , and the myth of African/Negro inferiority.
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Don't ever believe that Europeans at Forumbiodiversity don't know you are RIGHT. They know what they are telling and supporting is a Big Lie, but they maintain it because they want too.

Mike and I are hated because he has found the iconographic evidence of the role of Blacks in World history. I am hated because I have began to show the real phylogeography of African people, that blow up the status quo phylogeography of African people.

You are wasting your time trying to teach the posters at Forumbiodiversity (FBF) the actual Phylogeography of world populations, they don't want to hear it, and they are tired of Afro-Amewricans coming to their site telling them what they already know.

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Posted by Clyde Winters (Member # 10129) on :
 
Kivisild (2017) claimed the V88 samples from Samara and Spain was in Haak et al 2015. Kivisild (2017) wrote:"Interestingly, the earliest offshoot of extant haplogroup R1b-M343 variation, the V88 subclade, which is currently most common in Fulani speaking populations in Africa (Cruciani et al. 2010) has distant relatives in Early Neolithic samples from across wide geographic area from Iberia, Germany to Samara (Fig. 7)."
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Kivisild (2017) made it clear that the Samara and Spanish samples were different from other aDNA samples. Kivisild (2017) wrote: "Late Neolithic, Early Bronze Age and Iron Age samples from Central and Western Europe have typically the R1b-L11, R1a1-Z283 and R1a-M417 (xZ645)
affiliation while the samples from the Yamnaya and Samara neighbourhood are different and belong to sub-clades R1b11-Z2105 and R1a2-Z93 (Allentoft et al. 2015; Cassidy et al. 2016; Haak et al. 2015; Mathieson et al. 2015; Schiffels et al. 2016)."

As you can see Haak et al (2015) is cited as a source. In Haak et al(2017) Table S4.2, these samples were identified as R1b1.

Up to 2010, R1b1 was recognized as an African genome. Africans carried R1b1, the name for this haplogroup was changed to R-L278. In 2010, R-V88 was originally named R1b1a and ; R-V8, was named R1b1a2. Today R-V88 is named R1b1a2, and R1b1a is renamed R-L754.

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Haak et al (2017) Table S4.2: Y-Haplogroup assignments for 34 ancient European males. See : http://biorxiv.org/content/biorxiv/early/2015/02/10/013433.full.pdf

• I0124 0.96 R1b1 Samara_HG
  I0410 3.29 R1b1 Spain_EN

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Haak et al (2015) had only two samples from Samara and Spain, i.e., named R1b1. The R1b1 samples can be the only representation of V88 from Samara and Spain, cited by Kivisild (2017).
 

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Posted by Clyde Winters (Member # 10129) on :
 
Toomas Kivisild1 (2017).The study of human Y chromosome variation through ancient DNA. web page

The article is interesting. It is most interesting because it places V88 in ancient Europe.

It is sad that researchers fail to publish this reality.

Also, they claim that many of the ancient Europeans carried Y chromosome Haplogroup C that is common today in populations of Siberia, Southeast Asia and Oceania.The C haplogroup was carried by Kostenki man.



In addition to y-Chromosome haplogroup C, many ancient Europeans also carried y-haplogroup H, which is characterized bt the Siddis of India, who are of Ethiopian origin.

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Ancient DNA evidence from Anatolia and Iran confirms that G, along with H, was the most common Y chromosome haplogroup of the early farmers in these areas (Fig. 5) as well as being characteristically frequent in European Early Neolithic populations who also show low autosomal genetic distances with Anatolian farmers (Broushaki et al. 2016; Hofmanova et al. 2016; Lazaridis et al. 2016; Mathieson et al. 2015)....

In contrast to haplogroup G, the geographic distribution of haplogroup H is presently almost entirely restricted to South Asia, while one of its sub-clades, H4-L285 (Fig. 5), can be detected as an extremely rare lineage in some European populations. H4-L285 has also been found in the aY sequences of the Anatolian and Levantine farmers as well as in Iberian Chalcolithic samples (Gunther et al. 2015;
Lazaridis et al. 2016). Overall, the comparisons of early and middle Holocene versus present-day distributions of haplogroup G and H suggest that as characteristic markers of the early farmer populations of Middle East they were introduced to Europe by the expanding Anatolian farming populations.

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Late Neolithic, Early Bronze Age and Iron Age samples from Central and Western Europe have typically the R1b-L11, R1a1-Z283 and R1a-M417 (xZ645)
affiliation while the samples from the Yamnaya and Samara neighbourhood are different and belong to sub-clades R1b11-Z2105 and R1a2-Z93 (Allentoft et al. 2015; Cassidy et al. 2016; Haak et al. 2015; Mathieson et al. 2015; Schiffels et al. 2016).





The R1b11-Z2015 lineage is today common in the Caucasus and Volga-Uralic region while being virtually absent in Central and Western Europe (Broushaki et al.2016). Interestingly, the earliest offshoot of extant haplogroup R1b-M343 variation, the V88 subclade, which is currently most common in Fulani speaking populations in Africa (Cruciani et al. 2010) has distant relatives in Early Neolithic samples from across wide geographic area from Iberia, Germany to Samara (Fig. 7).

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Posted by Clyde Winters (Member # 10129) on :
 


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quote:

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Originally posted by Doug M:


Hypocrisy and double standards.

It is odd that they find an ancient Ethiopian and get a full DNA set, but instead of showing how that Ethiopian has genes that are partly ancestral to all other modern humans, they propose the opposite. And doesn't it just seem a bit too convenient to say that out of all the populations in Africa, the one most ancestral to all other humans is the only one most affected by back migration? I mean why didn't these Eurasians back migrate into other parts of Africa and affect them? It just sounds too good to be true that the downstream children of the parent magically come back later and "magically" erase all the parents genes with their own. What on earth are the odds of that happening? But people still believe this garbage. And this is where understanding where certain DNA lineage splits arose come into play.

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Characterizing genetic diversity in Africa is a crucial step for most analyses reconstructing the evolutionary history of anatomically modern humans. However, historic migrations from Eurasia into Africa have affected many contemporary populations, confounding inferences. Here, we present a 12.5× coverage ancient genome of an Ethiopian male ("Mota") who lived approximately 4,500 years ago. We use this genome to demonstrate that the Eurasian backflow into Africa came from a population closely related to Early Neolithic farmers, who had colonized Europe 4,000 years earlier.

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https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2016/02/160218195657.htm

Like I keep saying, if folks REALLY want to understand the history of population evolution in Africa they need to do like Lazaridis did and filter out all non African DNA and focus on finding the "basal African" gene and all the "basal Splits" that occurred in Africa.

But they wont do that and by now we should know why. Out of all the places on earth, the population history of Africa is the least understood but whenever they claim to want to unravel it, they come up with "ancient Eurasians" as the explanation for everything..... Seriously?

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Originally posted by Narmerthoth:
Did I say that I hate genetics?
Rather, I hate the agenda of the group(s) who control and manipulate genetics.
The unstated end goal of the human gnome project is to understand human genetics to allow defective Eurobinos to repair that which is broken.

Dr. Winters is 1000% correct in that Eurobinos have no unique genetics from those of Africans, only missense/deletions that are the result of bad/improper living, such as incest or diet.
Eurobino geneticists take these defects, relabel and suppress their true origins to pass them off as normal genes evolved in Europe when they are in fact defects originating in Africa before the outward migration.
The only gene seeding due to back migration are these further defects caused the the original African defect.

Eurobinos are liars.
Just 5 years ago, Lionese attempted to paint OCA as a "RARE" defect. Now we understand that it isn't rare at all, but common to ALL Eurobinos and Asians.
Although Eurobinos attempt to paint OCA as a Normal gene, we now realize that it is not. It is a gene deletion defect that drastically changes the very fundamental nature of hue-manity.

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You are so right. AA women rarely engaged in relationships with European males. Look at all the TV shows and Movies, that are trying to get AA women to mate with white males to add color to their race.
 

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Posted by DD'eDeN (Member # 21966) on :
 
Every genetic 'defect' is a prehistoric advantage (I think). This includes things like poor vision, some time long ago (500ma?) this 'defect' was an improvement over very very poor vision, and so was selected for. It may be a defect relative to the current species norm (eg. African traits), but this depends on the advantage/disadvantage in the adaptation to local/temporal climate eg. glacial-snow H&G vs forest-green H&G.
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from GHorvat @ HM: A Mbuti pygmy numt would be classified as a basal mtDNA haplogroup L (close to the RSRS reference sequence), a Cambodian’s would be classified as N* and a Mozabite’s as U6a5. https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/HumanMigrations/conversations/messages/6090
 

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Posted by Narmerthoth (Member # 20259) on :
 
^ As usual, you're wrong.

As I stated, Human gnome is about correcting or repairing the devastating autosomal diseases that afflict Eurobino gentile and Jews who suffer from many many forms of genetic mutation resulting in everything from massive skin cancer susceptibility, to severe mental disorders, to an inability to sleep to extremely low reproduction rates where the ratio of deaths to births is affecting their very genetic survival.

In all cases, EUROBINOS attempt to downplay the occurrence of these OCA related defects as characterizing them as, rare.
However, in reality, they are as rare as the OCA mutation which is present in ALL EUROBINOS and Asians.

Here is an prime example of the goal of genetics to allow Eurobinos to survive their mutation death toll.
Note, that EUROBINOS will openly confess to the ATP7A defect, but will never ever confess to it's direct connection to OCA (their albinism).

Deadly genetic disease prevented before birth in zebrafish

By injecting a customized "genetic patch" into early stage fish embryos, researchers at Washington University School of Medicine in St. Louis were able to correct a genetic mutation so the embryos developed normally.

The research could lead to the prevention of up to one-fifth of birth defects in humans (EUROBINOS) caused by genetic mutations, according to the authors.
Erik C. Madsen, first author and an M.D./Ph.D. student in the Medical Scientist Training Program at Washington University School of Medicine, made the groundbreaking discovery using a zebrafish model of Menkes disease, a rare, inherited disorder of copper metabolism caused by a mutation in the human version of the ATP7A gene.
(THIS IS A OCA RELATED DEFECT WHICH PROVES OCA DOES NOT JUST NEGATIVELY AFFECT SKIN COLOR)

Children who have Menkes disease have seizures, extensive neurodegeneration in the gray matter of the brain, abnormal bone development and kinky, colorless hair. Most children with Menkes die before age 10, and treatment with copper is largely ineffective.


The development of organs in the fetus is nearly complete at a very early stage. By that time, the mutation causing Menkes disease has already affected brain and nerve development.

The work is an important step toward personalized medicine, which can tailor treatment to an individual's genetic makeup.

https://phys.org/news/2008-03-deadly-genetic-disease-birth-zebrafish.html#jCp

Cell-specific ATP7A transport sustains copper-dependent tyrosinase activity in melanosomes.

To catalyse melanin synthesis, tyrosinase is subsequently reloaded with copper within specialized organelles called melanosomes. Copper is supplied to melanosomes by ATP7A, a cohort of which localizes to melanosomes in a biogenesis of lysosome-related organelles complex-1 (BLOC-1)-dependent manner. These results indicate that cell-type-specific localization of a metal transporter is required to sustain metallation of an endomembrane cuproenzyme, providing a mechanism for exquisite spatial control of metalloenzyme activity. Moreover, because BLOC-1 subunits are mutated in subtypes of the genetic disease Hermansky-Pudlak syndrome, these results also show that defects in copper transporter localization contribute to hypopigmentation, and hence perhaps other systemic defects, in Hermansky-Pudlak syndrome.


Copper restores in vitro tyrosinase activity in melanosomes of BLOC-1-deficient melanocytes

DOPA cytochemistry of BLOC-1− melan-mu (a–f) or BLOC-1R melan-mu:MuHA (g, h) cells in the absence or presence (+ Copper) of 20 µM copper sulfate in the reaction buffer. (a–d) Bright field microscopy analysis of cells treated for 4 h as indicated. Insets, boxed regions magnified 10X. Bars, 10 µm. Note the increased melanin deposits in BLOC-1− cells in the presence (c) compared to the absence (a) of copper. (e–h) EM analysis of thin sections of cells treated for 2 h. Note melanin deposits in the trans-most Golgi cisternae, but not in striated melanosomes, of BLOC-1− melan-mu cells in the absence of excess copper (e; inset), and the additional deposition of melanin in striated melanosomes in the presence of copper (f, stars; inset). GA, Golgi apparatus; TGN, trans-Golgi network; PM, Plasma membrane; II, III, IV, melanosome stages II and IV. Bars, 500 nm and inset, 200 nm


 

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Posted by Clyde Winters (Member # 10129) on :
 
The Mota article has been found to be in error.

quote:

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Error found in study of first ancient African genome
Finding that much of Africa has Eurasian ancestry was mistaken.

Ewen Callaway
29 January 2016
Article toolsRights & Permissions

Kathryn and John Arthur
This rocky area in Mota cave held bones that yielded the first ancient African genome.
An error has forced researchers to go back on their claim that humans across the whole of Africa carry DNA inherited from Eurasian immigrants.

This week the authors issued a note explaining the mistake in their October 2015 Science paper on the genome of a 4,500-year-old man from Ethiopia1 — the first complete ancient human genome from Africa. The man was named after Mota Cave, where his remains were found.

Although the first humans left Africa some 100,000 years ago, a study published in 2013 found that some came back again around 3,000 years ago; this reverse migration has left its trace in African genomes.

In the Science paper, researchers confirmed this finding. The paper also suggested that populations across the continent still harbour significant ancestry from the Middle Eastern farmers who were behind the back-migration. Populations in East Africa, including Ethiopian highlanders who live near Mota Cave, carried the highest levels of Eurasian ancestry. But the team also found vestiges of the ‘backflow’ migration in West Africans and in a pygmy group in Central Africa, the Mbuti.

Andrea Manica, a population geneticist at the University of Cambridge, UK, who co-led the study, says the team made a mistake in its conclusion that the backflow reached western and central Africa. “The movement 3,000 years ago, or thereabouts, was limited to eastern Africa,” he says.

Incompatible software
Manica says that the error occurred when his team compared genetic variants in the ancient Ethiopian man with those in the reference human genome. Incompatibility between the two software packages used caused some variants that the Ethiopian man shared with Europeans (whose DNA forms a large chunk of the human reference sequence) to be removed from the analysis. This made Mota man seem less closely related to modern European populations than he actually was — and in turn made contemporary African populations appear more closely related to Europeans. The researchers did have a script that they could have run to harmonize the two software packages, says Manica, but someone forgot to run it.


Pontus Skoglund, a population geneticist at Harvard Medical School in Boston, Massachusetts, says that he was surprised by the claim that as much as 6–7% of the ancestry of West and Central African groups came from the Eurasian migrants. But after obtaining the Mota man’s genome from Manica’s team, he and his colleague David Reich carried out their own comparison and found no evidence for that conclusion. They informed Manica’s team, who then discovered the processing error.

“Almost all of us agree there was some back-to-Africa gene flow, and it was a pretty big migration into East Africa,” says Skoglund. “But it did not reach West and Central Africa, at least not in a detectable way.” The error also undermines the paper’s original conclusion that many Africans carry Neanderthal DNA (inherited from Eurasians whose ancestors had interbred with the group).

Skoglund praised the paper — “the genome itself is just fantastic,” he says — and the researchers’ willingness to share their data and issue a speedy note about the error: they posted it online on 25 January. When asked to confirm whether and when it would publish the researchers' update, a representative for Science said the journal couldn't yet comment.

Manica is not yet sure if Science will change the title of the paper, ‘Ancient Ethiopian genome reveals extensive Eurasian admixture throughout the African continent’. But if the team had caught the error earlier, he says, “I’m sure we would have phrased things differently”.

See: http://www.nature.com/news/error-found-in-study-of-first-ancient-african-genome-1.19258

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If you read the paper above we learn two things that made it necessary to dispute this paper.

Firstly, this paper made it clear that Mota man's evidence of Eurasian genes was deliberately blocked. As a result, it indicated that Ethiopians were carry Eurasian genes long before their is evidence of of Eurasians migrating into Africa.

Any researcher worth his salt, could flip the script and show that the so-called Eurasian genes found in Mota man prove the African origin of many so-called Middle Eastern caucasian haplogroups.

Secondly, the researchers of MOta man reported that he carried Neanderthal DNA. This finding could not be allowed to stand. Because it confirmed the finding of Prufer 2013 of a relationship between Altaic Neanderthals and Africans. The idea that Mota man was related to the Neanderthals had to be reversed, because this finding disputed the myth that only Eurasians carried Neanderthal genes, and that Eurasians were a unique AMH because Africans did not carry Neanderthal genes.

An exception to this norm are the Khoisan who share a phylogenic relationship with Altai Neanderthals (Prufer, et al, 2013). Many researchers claim that Africans have no relationship to the Neanderthals.But Prufer et al (2013) share more alleles with Altaic Neanderthal than Denisova.

In the Supplemental section of Prufer et al (2013) there is considerable discussion of the relationship between Neanderthal and Khoisan. In relation to the Altaic Neanderthal the non-Africans have a lower divergence rate than Africans between 10-20%. Prufer et al (2013) note little statistical difference between non-African and African divergence.

Researchers have observered a relationship between the Neanderthals, the Khoisan and Yoruba. Prufer et al (2013) detected a relationship between the Neanderthal and Mandekan. It is interesting to note that Yoruba traditions place them in Mande-speaking areas (Prufer et al,2013).

There is interesting information in Figure S7.1. In Figure S7.1 the maximum likelihood tree of bonobo, Denisova and Neanderthal, the closest present-day hmans are Africans, not Europeans. Reading the Tree Chart Graph, the neighbor joining tree of archaic and present day human individuals has the Khoisan following the Denisova.

As you can see from the case of Mota man, analysis of aDNA from Africans can upset the status quo. It will destroy the protocols of Structure and Admixture programs that maintain Africans and Eurasians only came in contact after 1492 due to the Atlantic slave trade.

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Posted by Clyde Winters (Member # 10129) on :
 


Everyday researchers publish new papers profiling European pre-history using shattered pieces of bones and teeth found in terrible condition. Yet no matter the condition, geneticists are able to recover genomic evidence that usually corresponds to Europeans that presently live in the area today and Native Americans.

Yet archaeologists have discovered thousands of bones and teeth in Africa in pristine condition dating to every period. Yet geneticists claim they can not recover any genomic evidence except for some 4kya bones that suggest Eurasian admixture.

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Other researchers are attempting to suggest that there was widespread mixture between Africans and Europeans during colonial times. This is pure hog-wash. Except for South Africa there was very little admixture in Africa between Europeans and Africans.

The Big Lie is that researchers expect everyone to believe they can recover genomic material from fragmentary corrupted bones and teeth--but can't recover genomic evidence from pristine bones and teeth from Africa.

Modern Europeans do not appear in Europe until after 1400 BC., with spread of the Sea People. Before this they were in Central Asia and Mesopotamia.

Yet, people on this site debate the identity of the :

Ancient North Eurasian (ANE)
West European Hunter-Gatherer (WHG)
Caucasus hunter-gatherers (CHG)
Early Farmers (EF)

The Craniometrics make it clear that all these people were Negroes or Africans.The archaeological evidence indicates that the flora and fauna, especially from the Levant was Sub-Saharan African in origin, while the tools and pottery used by the ANE, WHG,CHG and EF people point back to Africa as well.

.



.

Although this is the case people have debates here on ES numbering 5-20 pages on how these people were not Africans, because the geneticists claim they are carrying Eurasian genes.

Confidently, the Coconut on this site argue for the non-Africa character of the
Ancient North Eurasian (ANE)
West European Hunter-Gatherer (WHG)
Caucasus hunter-gatherers (CHG)
Early Farmers (EF)

as they parrot the writings of any European geneticist claiming the ancient Black Europeans were Indo-Europeans carrying non-African genes.

The ancient Eurasians are carrying the same genes Africans carry today, so there were no new mutations after the OOA.For example, in 2010, R-V88 was originally named R1b1a and it was renamed R1b1a2 . The samples from Samara identified as V88, are labled Rlbla--not R1b1a2. This shows that although researchers change the names of African haplogroups to cause confusion the truth is out there.


Don't you get it. If the people are craniometrically Negroes/Africans, the flora and fauna is SSA and tools and pottery African in origin the people were also African--not Indo-European.

It is time people stop spreading the Eurocentric LIE that the genes of the Paleolithic Europeans originated in Eurasia, instead of Africa. Just because posters here parrot what they have read, does not mean the research findings are wrong--it is the interpretation of the data which creates the Big Lie.

.
 

---

Posted by the lioness, (Member # 17353) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Clyde Winters:

there were no new mutations after the OOA.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Clyde Winters:


Everyday researchers publish new papers profiling European pre-history using shattered pieces of bones and teeth found in terrible condition. Yet no matter the condition, geneticists are able to recover genomic evidence that usually corresponds to Europeans that presently live in the area today and Native Americans.

Yet archaeologists have discovered thousands of bones and teeth in Africa in pristine condition dating to every period. Yet geneticists claim they can not recover any genomic evidence except for some 4kya bones that suggest Eurasian admixture.

.


.
Other researchers are attempting to suggest that there was widespread mixture between Africans and Europeans during colonial times. This is pure hog-wash. Except for South Africa there was very little admixture in Africa between Europeans and Africans.

The Big Lie is that researchers expect everyone to believe they can recover genomic material from fragmentary corrupted bones and teeth--but can't recover genomic evidence from pristine bones and teeth from Africa.

Modern Europeans do not appear in Europe until after 1400 BC., with spread of the Sea People. Before this they were in Central Asia and Mesopotamia.

Yet, people on this site debate the identity of the :

Ancient North Eurasian (ANE)
West European Hunter-Gatherer (WHG)
Caucasus hunter-gatherers (CHG)
Early Farmers (EF)

The Craniometrics make it clear that all these people were Negroes or Africans.The archaeological evidence indicates that the flora and fauna, especially from the Levant was Sub-Saharan African in origin, while the tools and pottery used by the ANE, WHG,CHG and EF people point back to Africa as well.

.



.

Although this is the case people have debates here on ES numbering 5-20 pages on how these people were not Africans, because the geneticists claim they are carrying Eurasian genes.

Confidently, the Coconut on this site argue for the non-Africa character of the
Ancient North Eurasian (ANE)
West European Hunter-Gatherer (WHG)
Caucasus hunter-gatherers (CHG)
Early Farmers (EF)

as they parrot the writings of any European geneticist claiming the ancient Black Europeans were Indo-Europeans carrying non-African genes.

The ancient Eurasians are carrying the same genes Africans carry today, so there were no new mutations after the OOA.For example, in 2010, R-V88 was originally named R1b1a and it was renamed R1b1a2 . The samples from Samara identified as V88, are labled Rlbla--not R1b1a2. This shows that although researchers change the names of African haplogroups to cause confusion the truth is out there.


Don't you get it. If the people are craniometrically Negroes/Africans, the flora and fauna is SSA and tools and pottery African in origin the people were also African--not Indo-European.

It is time people stop spreading the Eurocentric LIE that the genes of the Paleolithic Europeans originated in Eurasia, instead of Africa. Just because posters here parrot what they have read, does not mean the research findings are wrong--it is the interpretation of the data which creates the Big Lie.

.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Narmerthoth:
EXACTLY!
This is the major dysfunction with Negroes who prefer not to think for themselves, but instead feel more safe and comfortable to just accept and regurgitate the many millions of EUROBINO lies.
Millions because they have to keep layering and layering lie after lie to protect the original big lies.

The research released here on ES over the years has had an major impact on EUROBINO researchers.

Believe it or not, many of them have also accepted the LIE and don't know any better. Once they review the research on this site that exposes the LIE, they begin to question it and the answers being truth will have an dramatic effect on their future research.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Thereal:
Unless I'm misinterpreting that last part of the picture of the word I disagree with its message as mike and you have already established that whites are a mutation that doesn't conflict with the ooa theory if adaptation solely made whites different.the images is of a Ethiopian albino,image 1 is her by herself and the second image is her with colleagues some are white.


And while she reminds me that her appearance was more stark then—“I was six or seven years old, so I wasn’t wearing makeup. My hair was white, my eyebrows and eyelashes were white, my skin extremely pale”—she says that people didn’t really pay much attention to the albinism. “What seemed to make a difference to them was my being an immigrant,” she says.

At first, she says, people assumed she was Scandinavian, but when she explained that she was Ethiopian, opinions of her grew harsher.

“I was bullied,” she says, “though I guess I didn’t know what that was then. I just thought people were being mean.” She remembers one classmate in particular, who, upon hearing she was from Ethiopia, began to sing about Mussolini invading her country. “He told me his grandmother loved Mussolini,” she says, a sense of wonder still present in her voice all these years later.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Thereal:

At first, she says, people assumed she was Scandinavian, but when she explained that she was Ethiopian, opinions of her grew harsher.

“I was bullied,” she says, “though I guess I didn’t know what that was then. I just thought people were being mean.” She remembers one classmate in particular, who, upon hearing she was from Ethiopia, began to sing about Mussolini invading her country. “He told me his grandmother loved Mussolini,” she says, a sense of wonder still present in her voice all these years later.

---

.

I don't really understand your question either Thereal, but I can explain to this young woman WHY their attitude towards her changed, when they found out that she was ETHIOPIAN!

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
.
THESE ARE ETHIOPIANS!

Though Ethiopians are Black people, many of them (Horn Africans in general), are of the Caucasian phenotype.






---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

THIS IS A DRAVIDIAN.

Like Horn Africans, they are of the Caucasian phenotype.


.
.

THIS IS A DRAVIDIAN ALBINO!

.



.

As you can see, the Ethiopian Albino and the Dravidian Albino, are IDENTICAL to everyday EUROPEANS!

And that is why they started to HATE her when they found out that SHE WAS BLACK!

For it showed them that they too must be BLACK.....AND ALBINO!
 

---

Posted by Thereal (Member # 22452) on :
 
I'm assuming the image of the wolfs and ladies are for illustrating purpose only excluding the words on it,my issue with the bottom images is that the African woman is not wholly representative of African phenotype so the picture has a weird implication depending on what you know,level of understanding and how or where you acquire your info,not saying MR. Clyde is being deceptive but from what I've read here and there the image gives a weird interpretation.
 

---

Posted by Mike111 (Member # 9361) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Thereal:
I'm assuming the image of the wolfs and ladies are for illustrating purpose only excluding the words on it,my issue with the bottom images is that the African woman is not wholely representative of African phenotype so the picture has a weird implication depending on what you know,level of understanding and how or where you acquire your info,not saying MR. Clyde is being deceptive but from from read here and there the image gives a weird interpretation.

---

.

Thereal Quote: my issue with the bottom images is that the African woman is not wholely representative of African phenotype

Damn Thereal, I didn't realize that you were such a fuching idiot or Albino!

How did you hide it for so long?

Here is a link to pictures of Africans in about 16 different countries - feel free to point out which ones look the same.

http://realhistoryww.com./world_history/ancient/Misc/True_Negros/Assorted/Paintings_Menu.htm

When it dawns on you that they all look different;
HERE IS WHY.
.


 

---

Posted by Thereal (Member # 22452) on :
 
Simply I'm suggesting that the image raises more question than it answers sense you can explain away the differences,I know that was not the intention of the picture but as an average Joe trying to sharpen my thinking abilities I know that the human species can!produce healthy offspring where as different species produce defective or no offspring at all and yes I know of some of the things you posted.
 

---

Posted by Narmerthoth (Member # 20259) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Mike111:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Thereal:

At first, she says, people assumed she was Scandinavian, but when she explained that she was Ethiopian, opinions of her grew harsher.

“I was bullied,” she says, “though I guess I didn’t know what that was then. I just thought people were being mean.” She remembers one classmate in particular, who, upon hearing she was from Ethiopia, began to sing about Mussolini invading her country. “He told me his grandmother loved Mussolini,” she says, a sense of wonder still present in her voice all these years later.

---

.

I don't really understand your question either Thereal, but I can explain to this young woman WHY their attitude towards her changed, when they found out that she was ETHIOPIAN!

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
.
THESE ARE ETHIOPIANS!

Though Ethiopians are Black people, many of them (Horn Africans in general), are of the Caucasian phenotype.






---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

THIS IS A DRAVIDIAN.

Like Horn Africans, they are of the Caucasian phenotype.


.
.

THIS IS A DRAVIDIAN ALBINO!

.



.

As you can see, the Ethiopian Albino and the Dravidian Albino, are IDENTICAL to everyday EUROPEANS!

And that is why they started to HATE her when they found out that SHE WAS BLACK!

For it showed them that they too must be BLACK.....AND ALBINO!

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Clyde Winters:

there were no new mutations after the OOA.

---

what is the date of the OOA and why would no new mutations have occurred since then?

---

quote:

---

However, we found that the African and Eurasian R1b lineages diverged 17,900–23,000 ya, suggesting that genetic structure was already established between the groups who expanded to Europe and Africa. R1b-V88 was previously found in Central and West Africa and was associated with a mid-Holocene migration of Afro-asiatic speakers through the central Sahara into the Lake Chad Basin.8 In the populations we examined, we found R1b in the Toubou and Sara, who speak Nilo-Saharan languages, and also in the Laal people, who speak an unclassified language. This suggests that R1b penetrated Africa independently of the Afro-asiatic language spread or passed to other groups through admixture.

---

quote:

---

EF share greater genetic affinity to populations from southern Europe than to those from northern Europe with an inverted pattern for WHG1,2,3,4,5. Surprisingly, we find that CHG influence is stronger in northern than Southern Europe (Fig. 4a and Supplementary Fig. 3A) despite the closer relationship between CHG and EF compared with WHG, suggesting an increase of CHG ancestry in Western Europeans subsequent to the early Neolithic period. We investigated this further using D-statistics of the form D(Yoruba, Kotias; EF, modern Western European population), which confirmed a significant introgression from CHG into modern northern European genomes after the early Neolithic period (Supplementary Fig. 4).

---

quote:

---

We investigated the temporal stratigraphy of CHG influence by comparing these data to previously published ancient genomes. We find that CHG, or a population close to them, contributed to the genetic makeup of individuals from the Yamnaya culture, which have been implicated as vectors for the profound influx of Pontic steppe ancestry that spread westwards into Europe and east into central Asia with metallurgy, horseriding and probably Indo-European languages in the third millenium BC5,7. CHG ancestry in these groups is supported by ADMIXTURE analysis (Fig. 1b) and admixture f3-statistics14,25 (Fig. 5), which best describe the Yamnaya as a mix of CHG and Eastern European hunter-gatherers. The Yamnaya were semi-nomadic pastoralists, mainly dependent on stock-keeping but with some evidence for agriculture, including incorporation of a plow into one burial26

---

• English Hattic Egyptian Malinke (Mande
  language)
  
  powerful ur wr'great,big' fara
  
  protect $uh swh solo-
  
  head tup tp tu 'strike the head'
  
  up,upper tufa tp dya, tu 'raising ground'
  
  to stretch put pd pe, bamba
  
  to prosper falfat -- find'ya
  
  pour duq --- du 'to
  dispense'
  
  child pin,pinu den
  
  Mother na-a -- na
  
  lord sa -- sa
  
  place -ka -ka

• Hurrian Sanscrit
  Mi-it-ra Mitra
  Aru-na Varuna
  In-da-ra Indra

quote:

---

Given their geographic origin, it seems likely that CHG and EF are the descendants of early colonists from Africa who stopped south of the Caucasus, in an area stretching south to the Levant and possibly east towards Central and South Asia. WHG, on the other hand, are likely the descendants of a wave that expanded further into Europe. The separation of these populations is one that stretches back before the Holocene, as indicated by local continuity through the Late Palaeolithic/Mesolithic boundary and deep coalescence estimates, which date to around the LGM and earlier. Several analyses show that CHG are distinct from another inferred minor ancestral population, ANE, making them a divergent fourth strand of European ancestry that expands the model of the human colonization of that continent.


The separation between CHG and both EF and WHG ended during the Early Bronze Age when a major ancestral component linked to CHG was carried west by migrating herders from the Eurasian Steppe. The foundation group for this seismic change was the Yamnaya, who we estimate to owe half of their ancestry to CHG-linked sources. These sources may be linked to the Maikop culture, which predated the Yamnaya and was located further south, closer to the Southern Caucasus. Through the Yamanya, the CHG ancestral strand contributed to most modern European populations, especially in the northern part of the continent.

---

Jones et al, make it clear that ”Given their geographic origin, it seems likely that CHG and EF are the descendants of early colonists from Africa who stopped south of the Caucasus, in an area stretching south to the Levant and possibly east towards Central and South Asia”. the African origin of these Levantines is supported by Holliday. Trenton W. Holliday, tested the hypothesis that if modern Africans had dispersed into the Levant from Africa, "tropically adapted hominids" would be represented in the archaeological history of the Levant, especially in relation to the Qafzeh-Skhul hominids. This researcher found that the Qafzeh-Skhul hominids (20,000-10,000),were assigned to the Sub-Saharan population, along with the Natufians samples (4000 BP). Holliday also found African fauna in the area. (See: Holiday, T. (2000). Evolution at the Crossroads: Modern Human Emergence in Western Asia, American Anthropologist,102(1)) .

As I have noted previously, the The Niger-Congo and Dravidian speakers were Kushites and belonged to the C-Group culture. The Kushites made corded ware and Red-and-black pottery.
.



.

By 3500 BC the Dravidian and Mande tribes began to migrate out of Africa. Dr. Menges was the first archaeologist to argue that some Dravidians landed in Iran and migrated into India and the Indus Valley.
These Kushites were the ancestors of the Yamnaya or CHG culture bearers. They were the people who practiced horseback riding and etc.

The movement of the Kushite group is supported by the spread of BRW from Nubia to the Indus Valley and the South Indian megalithic.; and the Dravidian substratum in the prakrit, puranas and other languages in Eurasia.
.




The Yamnaya and or CHG introduced the Agro-Pastoral traditions of the CHG. It was also the Kushites who introduced the R haplogroup carried by the CHG and the presence of V88 in early Europe.
The African origin of the CHG is supported by the following evidence:

1. The Kushites began to replace the Anu after the Great Flood, i.e., after 4000BC.

2. There is archaeological evidence of Kushites migrating into Eurasia from Middle Africa 6kya.The Kushites were the rounded headed cattle herders depicted in Saharan Rock art. They belonged to the C-Group . The C-Group was primarially composed of Niger-congo and Dravidian speakers.

'


'

3. there is no archaeological evidence for a back migration of Eurasians back into Africa.

4. Cattle domestication may have appeared first in the Neat East--but evidence for the first cattle herders appears in Middle African Rock art --not the Near East. These Africans took their Agro-Pastoral traditions into Eurasia.

5. Africans domesticated the horse before the I-E people as evident in the Saharan rock art.

6. Kushites introduced chariot riding and horseback riding to the world.

7. The Corded Ware pottery traditions began in Africa among the Kushites

8. The culture terms used by the I-E speakers are of Dravidian and Niger-Congo origin.

9. The I-E people were a bunch of nomads lacking any culture as supported by the so-called Proto- I.E., terms that are not of kushite origin. The I-E speakers remained isolated in Central Asia, until they attacked Kusite centers in Western Europe and Pakistan-India after 1400BC

10. R1b1a is nothing more than V88. This haplogroup is found throughout Africa. Given its frequency in Africa it can not be the result of a back migration.
 

---

Posted by the lioness, (Member # 17353) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Clyde Winters:

AAs carry 24% R1. This is not due to European admixture

---

R1 in Africa is under 1% including R-V88 and all other clades

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Clyde Winters:

AAs carry 24% R1. This is not due to European admixture

---

R1 in Africa is under 1% including R-V88 and all other clades

---

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Clyde Winters:

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Clyde Winters:

AAs carry 24% R1. This is not due to European admixture

---

R1 in Africa is under 1% including R-V88 and all other clades

---

---

LOL. Stupid. The frequency was higher in areas where North American slaves came from and among Black Native Americans.


.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:
M269 and V88 are two different haplogroups.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Thereal:
@ MR. Winters did you understand my post trying to clarify my first comment?

---

No!


.

The meaning of the picture is simple.

The picture makes it clear that while the jackal look identical in phenotype, the black and white girls do not. As a result, what people call science is not correct.
 

---

Posted by Clyde Winters (Member # 10129) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Clyde Winters:

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Clyde Winters:

AAs carry 24% R1. This is not due to European admixture

---

R1 in Africa is under 1% including R-V88 and all other clades

---

---

LOL. Stupid. The frequency was higher in areas where North American slaves came from and among Black Native Americans.


.

---

Jackass African Americans came from all over West and Central Africa and you also say East.
You can take any of those regions and the average R1 frequency is under 1%.


M269 and V88 are two different haplogroups.
There are no groups in Africa that have high frequencies of M269 only very low frequencies and the corresponds to European colonies.

The higher frequencies of R-V88 around the Chad basin do not change the fact that that in either West Africa or Central Africa the amount of V88 carriers is under 1% .

If you were to compare West or Central Africans to African Americans the have more non-African admixture. That is because African Americans were and are part of European society. The amount of Africans that were part of Native American society are much much less. And not all Africans who allied with Native Americans mixed with them. The Black African Seminoles for instance were allied with native Americans but mainly lived separately from them.


All Indigenous Amerindian mtDNA can be traced back to five haplogroups, A, B, C, D and X. More specifically, indigenous Amerindian mtDNA belongs to sub-haplogroups A2, B2, C1, D1, and X2a (with minor groups C4c, D2, D3, and D4h3).
Those are not typical African American mtDNA haplogroups

As for Y-DNA in Native Americans Haplogroup Q is distinctive. That is rare. In African Americans.

Some African Americans had mixed with Native Americans, who like Europeans carry R1 as well. However having had much more contact with Europeans as a whole the R1 that some AAs have comes primarily from Europeans. It's denial not to acknowledge this fact.

---

Stupid Euronut. You know that hg Q is common to Central and South America, R1 is the dominant clade among Indians in the North and Southeast where the Black Native Americans lived.

The major American Indian male lineages include R1, C,D and Q3.There is evidence of African admixture in the American y-chromosome haplogroups. The Q y-haplogroup has the highest frequency among indigenous Mexicans. The frequency hg Q varies from a high of 54% for Q-M243, and a low of 46% for QM (34).
African y-chromosome are associated with YAP+ and 9bp. The YAP-à associated with A-àG transition at DYS271 is found among Native Americans. The YAP+ individuals include Mixe speakers (32-33). YAP+ is often present in haplogroups (hg) C and D.

The DYS271 transition is of African origin (32).The DSY271 Alu insertion is found only in chromosomes bearing Alu insertion (YAP+) at locus DYS287 (33). The DYS271 transition was found among the Wayuu, Zenu and Inzano. The Mexican Native American y-chromosome bearing the African markers is resident in haplogroups C and D (34).

R-M173 is also found in Mexico. Haplogroups R and Q are part of the CT microgroup which dates back 56kya. Haplogroup R branches from hg Q, with the SNP M242.

The CT haplogroup has SNP mutation M168, along with P and M294. Haplogroup P (M45) has two branches Q (M242) and R-M207 which share the common marker M45.

The M45 chromosome is subdivided by the biallelic variant M173 (35). In Africa we find P (M173), R1b (M343) and V88; and R1b1a2 (M269).

Native Americans carry a high frequency of R-M173 (48). The predominate y-chromosome in North America is R-M173. R-M173 is found only in the Northeastern United States along with mtDNA haplogroup X (25%). Both haplogroups are found in Africa, but is absent in Siberia.

The R haplogroup is carried by Mexicans. The frequency of hg R varies from Tarahumara (5.6%), Otomi (14.3%), Yucateca Maya (10.5%). There is also a high frequency of haplogroup R among the Ch'ol and Chontal which stood around 15% (38).

The most predominate y-chromosome of Native Americans in North America is R-M173. R-M173 is
found in the Northeastern and Southwestern parts of the United States along with mtDNA haplogroup X (25%). Both haplogroups are found in Africa, but are absent in Siberia. There are varying frequencies of y-chromosome M-173 in Africa and Eurasia. Whereas only between 8% and 10% of M-173 is carried by Eurasians, 82% of the carriers of this y-chromosome are found in Africa (Winters, 2010, 2011b).




R1 clades among NA populations vary. The NA populations that possess the RM173 haplotypes are predominately found in the Northeastern and South eastern parts of the USA . It is important to remember that many Southwest NA population groupings originally lived in
the Northeast.


This is very interesting given the presence of R-M173 is found among many American Indian groups. RM173 among the North American Algonquian group range from Ojibwe (79%), Chipewyan (62%), Seminole (50%), Cherokee (47%), Dogrib (40%) and Papago (38%) (Malhi et al., 2008).


Amerindians carry the X haplogroup (hg). Amerindians and Europeans hg X are different (Person, 2004). Haplogroup X has also been found throughout Africa (Shimada et al., 2006). Shimada et al., (2006) believes that X(hX) is of African origin. Amerindian X is different from European hg X, skeletons from Brazil dating between 400-7000 BP have the transition np 16223 (Martinez-Cruzado, 2001; Ribeiro-DosSantos et al., 1996). Transition np 16223 is characteristic of African haplogroups. This suggest that Africans may have taken the X hg to the Americas in ancient times.


The African origin of this haplogroup is evident among the Seminoles who continue to show the African phenotype.



The pristine form of R1*M173 is found only in Africa (Cruciani et al., 2002, 2010). The frequency of Y chromosome R1*-M173 in Africa range between 7-95% and averages 39.5% (Coia et al., 2005). The R*-M173 (haplotype 117) chromosome is found frequently in Africa, but rare to extremely low frequencies in Eurasia. The Eurasian R haplogroup is characterized by R1b3-M269. The M269 derived allele has a M207 /M173 background.

This literature provides us with the data to critically examine the distribution of R1*-M173 in North America. It presents a genetic pattern of this haplogroup from Africa to Eurasia, and the dispersal of a significant African male contribution to Eurasia.


Y-chromosome V88 (R1b1a) has its highest frequency among Chadic speakers, while the carriers of V88 among Niger-Congo speakers (predominately Bantu people) range between 2-66% (Cruciani et al., 2010; Bernielle-Lee et al., 2009). Haplogroup V88 includes the mutations M18, V35 and V7. Cruciani et al.(2010) revealed that R-V88 is also carried by Eurasians including the distinctive mutations M18, V35 and V7.


R1b1-P25 is found in Western Eurasia. Haplogroup R1b1* is found in Africa at various frequencies. The frequencies of R-M269 in Sub-Saharan Africa. Berniell-Lee et al., (2009) found in their study that 5.2% of SSA carried Rb1*. The frequency of R1b1* among the Bantu ranged from 2-20. The bearers of R1b1* among the Pygmy populations ranged from (Berniell-Lee et al., 2009). The frequency of R1b1 among Guinea-Bissau populations was 12% (Carvalho et al., 2010). Y-Chromosome R1-M173 was probably spread in Western Europe first by African Roman soldiers, and later by African Muslims when they conquered Western Europe as Moors. This would explain why 60-70% French and Spanish males carry this y-haplogroup. Around 0.1 of Sub-Saharan Africans carry R1b1b2. Wood et al., (2005) found that Khoisan (2.2%) and Niger-Congo (0.4%) speakers carried the R-M269 y-chromosome. The Niger-Congo speakers formed a significant population in the nomes of Upper Egypt, where the founders of the 18th dynasty originated. Henn et al., (2011) presents conclusive evidence that African hunter-gatherer (HG) populations share a number of ancestral lineages including B264*; although they are geographically distinct populations situated among agropastoral groups (Henn et al., 2011)). An interesting finding of Henn et al., (2011) was the discovery of the Eurasian clade R1b1b1a1a among the Khomani San of South Africa (Henn et al., 2011).

.
 

---

Posted by Clyde Winters (Member # 10129) on :
 



.

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:

Some African Americans had mixed with Native Americans, who like Europeans carry R1 as well. However having had much more contact with Europeans as a whole the R1 that some AAs have comes primarily from Europeans. It's denial not to acknowledge this fact.

---

Wrong. Europeans had little contact with Native Americans except as genocidal warriors.



The major contact of Native Americans and whites took place in Oklahoma after the discovery of oil. Whites were made the caretakers of the Indians. Many of these whites married Native Americans and killed their wives and became owners of the major oil wells in Oklahoma. This is why so many "whites" are Indians in Oklahoma.

quote:

---

David Grann’s New Book Explores a Time When Killing Native Americans Wasn’t Murder
In an interview, the author of ‘The Lost City of Z’ looks at his new book examining the casual and systematic murder of Osage Indians in Oklahoma by whites who wanted oil leases.


David Grann was already interested in writing a book about the serial murders of members of the Oklahoma-based Osage Indian tribe when he visited the Osage Nation Museum.
On one wall was a panoramic photo of members of the tribe taken in 1924, but there was a panel missing. When Grann asked the museum director what happened to that part of the photo, she responded “It’s too painful to show. The devil was standing there.”

That “devil” was a white man named William Hale, ostensibly a friend of the tribe but, as it turned out, a vicious murderer who killed Indians for their money, which was considerable, since the Osage lived on oil-rich land, and at one point were considered the wealthiest people per capita on earth.

Hale wasn’t the only white man who killed Osage for profit, a story told in Grann’s new book, Killers of the Flower Moon. Author of the 2009 bestseller The Lost City of Z, about the search for a vanished civilization in the Amazon (the film version debuted April 14),

Grann tells an entirely different story in his latest work, one that has elements of the Wild West, classic gangster movies, the birth of the FBI, greed, and racism. “Why were the Osage killed?” asks Grann. “They were killed for their money. However, it was racism that made these killings nonchalant, and allowed them to go on for years. What is amazing is how some of the killers did not equate killing a Native American with murder. The prejudices of the time are an essential element to this story.”

Also essential to understanding the reason behind the killings—which extended from 1918 to 1931 and may have involved hundreds of deaths (no one really knows)—are the mind-boggling corruption and incompetence of Oklahoma law enforcement agencies and a thoroughly racist federal system of financial guardianship, which mandated that any Indian be given a (white) guardian if the Department of the Interior deemed that person “incompetent” to handle their own affairs. This gave the unscrupulous the incentive to bump off Indians and take over their oil leases.

“One of the things that intrigued me was just how lawless this part of the country was,” says Grann. “You kind of think that period of American history is over, this last remnant of the Wild West. And I was also intrigued by how corrupt law enforcement was.”

Grann says he first heard about this forgotten episode when a historian mentioned the killings. After his visit to the Osage Nation Museum, Grann realized he “wanted to figure out the pain the Osage felt, and understand and document this story that most people had forgotten.” He spent a year filling out Freedom of Information Act requests for documents relating to the case, then returned to Oklahoma, where he found “that many Osage were very welcoming. So many of them have stories that have not been told, so many of them are chasing ghosts. Justice was never brought to their cases.”
What Grann discovered, in fact, was that despite FBI intervention, which eventually put Hale and another killer behind bars, many of the murders remain unsolved. Yet that did not stop the young J. Edgar Hoover from touting the convictions as a public relations coup for the Bureau. “Hoover actually wanted to get out of the case, because he couldn’t solve it,” says Grann, “but there was a brewing scandal [a criminal the Bureau released from jail to work as an informant committed a robbery-murder instead], and Hoover was partially motivated by that, to avoid scandal. Then he exploited the case for his own purposes.”
Grann is a New Yorker staff writer who hit it big with The Lost City of Z, which became a number one New York Times paperback bestseller and was translated into 20 languages. He’s a self-described “insecure person” who says that before his books come out, “you live in such dread, that they might disappear. I spend a lot of time on these projects—I’m not a fast writer—and the success [of The Lost City of Z] has allowed me time to work within that framework.”
Describing himself as “a generalist,” Grann says he likes to report on subjects “I know very little about. You want the story to be about something, have some deeper meaning, but there is also an emotional, almost instinctual, element, which is, does this story seize some part of you and compel you to get to the bottom of it?”

Grann’s two books have this in common: on one level, they deal with the relationship between whites and people of color. In the case of The Lost City of Z, it’s the indigenous people of the Amazon, described by members of the British scientific establishment as “savages.”
In Killers of the Flower Moon, that connection between whites and the Osage is best described by a member of the tribe who, during Hale’s trial is quoted as saying, “It is a question in my mind whether this jury is considering a murder case or not. The question for them to decide is whether a white man killing an Osage is murder—or merely cruelty to animals.”

.
See:

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2017/04/16/when-killing-indians-wasn-t-murder

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quote:

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Originally posted by Clyde Winters:

quote:

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Originally posted by Thereal:
@ MR. Winters did you understand my post trying to clarify my first comment?

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No!


.

The meaning of the picture is simple.

The picture makes it clear that while the jackal look identical in phenotype, the black and white girls do not. As a result, what people call science is not correct.

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quote:

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• (i) Motivation
  There were a number of populations for which we did not have access to unadmixed samples. To learn about the history of such populations, we needed to adjust for the presence of non-Native ancestry. We used three complementary approaches to do this. The concordance of results from all these approaches increases our confidence in the key findings of this study.
  
  (1) Restricting to unadmixed samples: We restricted some analyses to 163 Native American samples (34 populations) without any evidence of recent European or African admixture (Note S2). A limitation of these studies, however, is that we could not analyze 16 populations in which all individuals were inferred to have some degree of recent admixture.
  
  (2) Local ancestry masking: We identified segments of the genome in each individual that had an appreciable probability of harboring non-Native American or Siberian ancestry. We then created a “masked” dataset that treated genetic data in these sections as missing (Note S4).
  
  (3) Ancestry Subtraction: We explicitly corrected for the effect of the estimated proportion of European and African in each sample by adjusting the value of f4-statistics by the amount that is expected from this admixture. This is discussed in what follows.
  
  (ii) Details of Ancestry Subtraction
  Assume that we have an accurate estimate of African and European ancestry for each sample (whether it is an individual or a pool of individuals). In practice, we used the ADMIXTURE k=4 estimates, because as described below, they appear to be accurate for Native American populations (with the possible exception of Aleuts as we discuss below). We can then define:
  
  a = % African ancestry in a test sample
  e = % European ancestry in a test sample
  1-a-e = % Native ancestry
  
  For many of our analyses, we are computing f4 statistics, whose values are affected in a known way by European and African admixture. Thus, we can algebraically correct for the effect of recent European or African admixture on the test statistics, obtaining an “Ancestry Subtracted” statistic that is what is expected for the sample if it had no recent European or African ancestry.
  
  The main context in which we compute f4 statistics is in our implementation of the 4 Population Test, to evaluate whether the allele frequency correlation patterns in the data are consistent with the proposed tree ((Unadmixed, Test),(Outgroup1, Outgroup2)), where the Unadmixed population is a set of Native American samples assumed to derive all of their ancestry from the initial population that peopled America, the Test population is another Native American population, and the two outgroups are Asian populations. An f4 statistic consistent with zero suggests that the Unadmixed and Test populations form a clade with no evidence of ancestry from more recent streams of gene flow from Asia. If the Test population harbors recent European or African ancestry, however, a significant deviation of this statistic from zero would be expected, making it difficult to interpret the results. We thus compute a linear combination of f4 statistics that is expected to equal what we would obtain if we had access to the Native American ancestors of the Test population without recent European or African admixture:
  
  S_1=(f_4 (Unadmixed,Test;Out1,Out2)-(a) f_4 (Unadmixed,Yoruba;Out1,Out2)-(e) f_4 (Unadmixed,French;Out1,Out2))/(1-a-e) (S3.1)
  
  Intuitively, this statistic is subtracting the contribution to the f4 statistic that is expected from their proportion a of West African-like ancestry (Yoruba), and their proportion e of West Eurasian-like ancestry (French). We then renormalize by 1/(1-a-e) to obtain the statistic that would be expected if the sample was unadmixed.
  
  A potential concern is that the African and European ancestry in any real Native American test sample is not likely to be from Yoruba and French exactly; instead, it will be from related populations. However, S1 is still expected to have the value we wish to compute if we choose the outgroups to be East Asians or Siberians. The reason is that genetic differences between Yoruba and the true African ancestors, and French and the true European ancestors, are not expected to be correlated to the frequency differences between two East Asian or Siberian outgroups. Specifically, the allele frequency differences are due to history within Africa or Europe, which is not expected to be correlated to allele frequency differences within East Asia and within Siberia.
  
  (iii) Ancestry Subtraction gives results concordant with those on unadmixed samples
  To compare the performance of our three approaches to address the confounder of recent European and African admixture, we computed 48 = 8×6 statistics of the form f4(Unadmixed, Test; Han, San). We choose “Unadmixed” to be one of 8 Native American groups from Meso-America southward that have sample sizes of at least two and for which all samples are inferred to be unadmixed by ADMIXTURE k=4 (Chane, Embera, Guahibo, Guaymi, Karitiana, Kogi, Surui and Waunana). We choose “Test” to be one of 8 Native American populations from Meso-America southward with at least two samples that are entirely unadmixed, and that also have at least two samples that have >5% non-Native admixture according to the ADMIXTURE k=4 analysis (Aymara, Cabecar, Pima, Tepehuano, Wayuu and Zapotec1). This allows us to compare results on admixed and unadmixed samples from the same population.
  
  If the Test population harbors European or West African admixture that we have not corrected, we expect to see a significant deviation of the statistic from zero. For example, f4(Karitiana, French; Han, San), corresponding to the statistic expected for an entirely European-admixed Native American population, is significant at Z = 45 standard errors from zero, and f4(Karitiana, Yoruba; Han, San), which gives the f4-value we would expect for an entirely West African-admixed Native American population, is significant at Z = 101.
  
  Figure S3.1 shows the scatterplots of Z-scores we obtain without Ancestry Subtraction, with Ancestry Subtraction, and with local ancestry masking (Note S4). The x-axis shows data for the unadmixed samples from each Test population, while the y-axis shows the results for the >5% admixed samples from the same populations. We find that:
  • Without Ancestry Subtraction there are significant deviations from zero (|Z|>3) (Fig. S3.1A)
  • With Ancestry Subtraction, there are no residual |Z|-scores >3 (Figure S3.1B)
  • With local ancestry masking (Note S4), there are again no residual |Z|-scores >3 (Figure S3.1C), showing that this method also appears to be appropriately correcting for the admixture.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Thereal:
I get that you were trying to say that, my issue is from the perspective of some one who is starting to learn information like this and the photo is misleading if not put in proper context sense you and mike theorizes whites as a mutation and the photo of the Ethiopia albino was suggesting that you could explain away apparent differences without suggesting similar must be the same,not saying that's what you're implying but taken photo as is without reading the other stuff you wrote gives a weird implication.

---

My belief is that Europeans evolved into whites during the Ice Age.

Dr. Clyde Winters- Origin of the White Race;

The Caves of Europe, were seen as temples by the ancient Blacks of Europe. here they congregated and used them like temples.


In the caves these Blacks recorded their history and worshiped their gods.

The last Ice Age in Europe came suddenly. The Aurignacians probably sought santuary in their caves/temples.

.
Since the last Ice Age came suddenly the Blacks were trapped in the caves. In darkness.




The first Europeans were definitely Black when they entered the Caucasus Caves.




In the caves due to the absence of sunlight the Aurignacians lost the melanin in their skin. The melanin left the skin and congregated in the hair. This is evident when we look at the depigmented creatures who live in the caves.


.







As you can see living in caves can cause the lost of melanin in the skin.
The Caves of Europe, were seen as temples by the ancient Blacks of Europe.

The last Ice Age in Europe came suddenly. The Aurignacians probably sought santuary in their caves/temples.

.
Since the last Ice Age came suddenly the Blacks were trapped in the caves. In darkness.


The first Europeans were definitely Black when they entered the Caucasus Caves.
In the caves due to the absence of sunlight the Aurignacians lost the melanin in their skin. The melanin left the skin and congregated in the hair.


This is evident when we look at the depigmented creatures who lived in the caves.The drawings from the Grotte de Marche shows tha various facial changes that took place among the Proto-Europeans who remained trapped in the caves until after 1400-1200 BC.

The Grotte de Marche engravings show the evolution of Blacks into europeans.

Below is a Magdalenian carving from the Grotte de La Marche from 17 000-15 000BC:

See: http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_96D2zI7_w6c/Sc4YV3c6juI/AAAAAAAAIes/kxopVZ44cdA/s1600/la+marche+faces280.jpg



This 17ky cave painting appears to record the changes in the Proto-European into more 'human' like forms today. The pictures make it clear that the long chins and noses were a major feature of the Proto-Europeans.Check out information on Grotte de Marche at : http://pascal.lefalher.perso.neuf.fr/la_grotte_de_la_marche.htm

Europeans are not native to Europe except underground. Since they remained in the caves the Proto-Europeans at Grotte de Marche probably did not interact with the Blacks of Europe that did not enter the caves and become depigmented.

Granted the Aurignacian culture spread across Eurasia. The Europeans exited the caves in Central Asia--not western Eurasia. In Central Asia they probably hid in the mountains grew in numbers until they felt they were strong enough to attack the Blacks ruling the great cities of Eurasia and the Egyptian Delta, that were weakened after the tectonic chanes surrounding the Santorini volcanic eruption and other catatrophic events between 1700-1200 BC.

quote:

---

Santorini's volcanic activity during the past 2-500,000 years has been dominated by very large explosive eruptions at intervals of few tens of thousands of years. The most recent of this type occurred at around 1613 BC and is known as the so-called Minoan eruption. The late Bronze Age eruption, one of the biggest known volcanic explosions in younger time,- and one of the most studied, but still most mysterious eruptions of all time-, devastated not only Santorini, but had a deep impact on the whole of the Eastern Mediterranean. Perhaps it even had serious world-wide effects and changed history.
Still today, one can see its deposits, the characteristic, tens of meters thick layer of white pumice and ash that blankets most of the surface of the island group. The eruption changed the shape of the island itself dramatically: it is now believed that before the eruption, it had the shape of an almost complete ring that enclosed an earlier, shallower caldera. Then, large sections of island collapsed into the emptied magma chamber after the eruption, literally disappearing under the sea. The ring-island was breached to the W and NW, and the caldera was significantly widened and deepened.

The Minoan eruption devastated the rich, highly developed economic center, that Santorini was at that time. Since 1969, intense archaeological excavations have brought to light an important Cycladic/Minoan town which had been buried beneath the volcanic ash for almost 4000 years. Although it appears that people had time to evacuate their island in time before the eruption, carrying most of their goods with them, the findings from Akrotiri are impressive: especially, they include well-preserved and magnificent wall paintings, ceramics and other objects. Thanks to the work of numerous archaeologists, a new light was thrown on an important prehistoric period and culture. The spectacular discovery even induced continuing speculations that relate the volcanic destruction of Santorini to the legend of the sunken Atlantis.

See:

http://www.volcanodiscovery.com/santorini.html

---

Since the Proto-Europeans in western Eurasia, like those living at Grotte de Marche remaind in their self imposed imprisonment underground, they did not interact with the Black Europeans. As a result, they cannot be considered Europeans because they were either unable, or afraid to exit the caves of western Eurasia.


Europeans do not expand out of Central Asia until after 1700 BC. By 1200 BC, Proto-Europeans were expanding into Egypt Delta, Eastern Eurpe and India by 1000BC.

.

As you can see living in caves can cause the lost of melanin in the skin.[b]After the tectonic events of 2000 BC the entrances of the caves opened in the Caucasus.

The original Black Europeans had turned into the people we call Europeans today.



The first Caucasians had lived in the caves for thousands of years.


During this time they probably treated each other badly.


Given the lack of life in the caves these first caucasians probably ate each other and suffered many bad things.

These first Caucasians probably left the caves bitter because they had lost their pigmentation--while many of the people they saw when they left the caves were pigmented=Blacks.
The original home of the Caucasians was the Caucasus Mountains.

.


.
They came from the caves after 2000BC. They were probably not associated with the Yamnaya pastoralists.
 

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Posted by Clyde Winters (Member # 10129) on :
 
The Caves of Europe, were seen as temples by the ancient Blacks of Europe.

.



.
The last Ice Age in Europe came suddenly. The Aurignacians carrying haplogroup R, probably sought santuary in their caves/temples.

.
Since the last Ice Age came suddenly the Blacks were trapped in the caves. In darkness.


The first Europeans were definitely Black when they entered the Caucasus Caves.The Mal'ta skeleton makes it clear these Europeans carried the R haplogroup.

In the caves due to the absence of sunlight the Aurignacians lost the melanin in their skin. The melanin left the skin and congregated in the hair.


This is evident when we look at the depigmented creatures who lived in the caves.The drawings from the Grotte de Marche shows tha various facial changes that took place among the Proto-Europeans who remained trapped in the caves until after 1400-1200 BC.

The Grotte de Marche engravings show the evolution of Blacks into europeans.

Below is a Magdalenian carving from the Grotte de La Marche from 17 000-15 000BC:

See: http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_96D2zI7_w6c/Sc4YV3c6juI/AAAAAAAAIes/kxopVZ44cdA/s1600/la+marche+faces280.jpg



This 17ky cave painting appears to record the changes in the Proto-European into more 'human' like forms today. The pictures make it clear that the long chins and noses were a major feature of the Proto-Europeans.Check out information on Grotte de Marche at : http://pascal.lefalher.perso.neuf.fr/la_grotte_de_la_marche.htm

Europeans are not native to Europe except underground. Since they remained in the caves the Proto-Europeans at Grotte de Marche probably did not interact with the Blacks of Europe that did not enter the caves and become depigmented.
There was an extensive network of caves that allowed the Proto-Europeans to communicate across Eurasia.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Narmerthoth:


Stone Age Tunnels are man created a massive network of underground tunnels crisecrossing Europe from Scotland to Turkey , a new book on the Ancient superhighways has claimed. German archaeologist, said evidence of the tunnels has been found hundreds of Neolithic settlements all over the continent. Seemingly never ending series of underground tunnels are confirmed to be man-made , and the architecture boggles even the most sophisticated designers.

German archaeologist Dr Heinrich Kusch said evidence of the tunnels has been found under hundreds of Neolithic settlements all over the continent. In his book - Secrets Of The Underground Door To An Ancient World (German title: Tore zur Unterwelt) - he says that the fact so many have survived after 12,000 years shows that the original tunnel network must have been enormous.





In his book, he notes that chapels were often built by the entrances perhaps because the Church were afraid of the heathen legacy the tunnels might have represented, and wanted to negate their influence.


Not for the claustrophobic: Most of the tunnels are just 70cm wide - just wide enough for a person to slowly wriggle through

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quote:

---

Santorini's volcanic activity during the past 2-500,000 years has been dominated by very large explosive eruptions at intervals of few tens of thousands of years. The most recent of this type occurred at around 1613 BC and is known as the so-called Minoan eruption. The late Bronze Age eruption, one of the biggest known volcanic explosions in younger time,- and one of the most studied, but still most mysterious eruptions of all time-, devastated not only Santorini, but had a deep impact on the whole of the Eastern Mediterranean. Perhaps it even had serious world-wide effects and changed history.
Still today, one can see its deposits, the characteristic, tens of meters thick layer of white pumice and ash that blankets most of the surface of the island group. The eruption changed the shape of the island itself dramatically: it is now believed that before the eruption, it had the shape of an almost complete ring that enclosed an earlier, shallower caldera. Then, large sections of island collapsed into the emptied magma chamber after the eruption, literally disappearing under the sea. The ring-island was breached to the W and NW, and the caldera was significantly widened and deepened.

The Minoan eruption devastated the rich, highly developed economic center, that Santorini was at that time. Since 1969, intense archaeological excavations have brought to light an important Cycladic/Minoan town which had been buried beneath the volcanic ash for almost 4000 years. Although it appears that people had time to evacuate their island in time before the eruption, carrying most of their goods with them, the findings from Akrotiri are impressive: especially, they include well-preserved and magnificent wall paintings, ceramics and other objects. Thanks to the work of numerous archaeologists, a new light was thrown on an important prehistoric period and culture. The spectacular discovery even induced continuing speculations that relate the volcanic destruction of Santorini to the legend of the sunken Atlantis.

See:

http://www.volcanodiscovery.com/santorini.html

---

Since the Proto-Europeans in western Eurasia, like those living at Grotte de Marche remaind in their self imposed imprisonment underground, they did not interact with the Black Europeans. As a result, they cannot be considered Europeans because they were either unable, or afraid to exit the caves of western Eurasia.


Europeans do not expand out of Central Asia until after 1700 BC. By 1200 BC, Proto-Europeans were expanding into Egypt Delta, Eastern Eurpe and India by 1000BC.
[b]Many of these Proto-European whites probably carried their ancestral R haplogroup. The expansion of whites across Europe carrying their ancestral R gene after exiting the caves may explain the widespread frequency of this haplogroup in Europe today, if the whites did not acquire this haplogroup through mating with the Kushites.
 

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Posted by the lioness, (Member # 17353) on :
 
^This is quite child-like and bizarre. I thought it was joke when he posted it a couple of years ago but he actually believes this. Clyde is not normal.
 

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Posted by Narmerthoth (Member # 20259) on :
 
Additional images of this massive cave networks.











Dr. Osmanagic and the Bosnian Foundation for the archaeological study of the Bosnian Valley of the Pyramids have been cleaning and reinforcing with wooden support the prehistoric tunnels that are believed to lead towards the Pyramid of the Sun in Visoko.

The foundation has established that there are two different civilizations that participated in the construction of the Ravne Tunnels and their construct methods are clearly distinguished.
The original builders of the labyrinth created these incredible underground chambers, more than 20,000 years ago, these were the builders of the pyramids located in Visoko. A later civilization tried hard to hide the tunnels and make sure that no one entered them. This ancient civilization filled the tunnels with different types of material around 5000 years ago.
 

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Posted by Narmerthoth (Member # 20259) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:
^This is quite child-like and bizarre. I thought it was joke when he posted it a couple of years ago but he actually believes this. Clyde is not normal.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Narmerthoth:

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:
^This is quite child-like and bizarre. I thought it was joke when he posted it a couple of years ago but he actually believes this. Clyde is not normal.

---

You mean, child-like and bizarre like, Europeans lost their pigment in Europe to allow them to absorb more sunlight for Vitamin D, or BLUE EYES are a natural selection evolution?

I don't believe Dr. Winter's theory is quite as bizarre as those, why you swallowed.

Remember Rasol and MoM who 1st showed the paper with this bizarre theory? What happened to them and why haven't you followed them?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Narmerthoth:

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:
^This is quite child-like and bizarre. I thought it was joke when he posted it a couple of years ago but he actually believes this. Clyde is not normal.

---

You mean, child-like and bizarre like, Europeans lost their pigment in Europe to allow them to absorb more sunlight for Vitamin D, or BLUE EYES are a natural selection evolution?

I don't believe Dr. Winter's theory is quite as bizarre as those, why you swallowed.

Remember Rasol and MoM who 1st showed the paper with this bizarre theory? What happened to them and why haven't you followed them?

---

Then there's the Super Nova theory you subscribe to even Mike thinks that's crack pot.

Rasol and MoM left because they realized the illness was incurable.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Narmerthoth:
do you attribute blond hair and blue eyes to natural selection

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quote:

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Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

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Originally posted by Narmerthoth:
So, do you attribute blond hair and blue eyes to natural selection, as per Hitler's Zionist Scientists and their, MASTER RACE?

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The fact that there are millions of people of any kind existing presently is a result of selection of some sort, natural or sexual ( which is also part of nature)

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quote:

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Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

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Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

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Originally posted by Clyde Winters:

AAs carry 24% R1. This is not due to European admixture

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R1 in Africa is under 1% including R-V88 and all other clades

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quote:

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Originally posted by the lioness,:
to clarify on average haplogroup R in Africa is under 1%.
However some groups do have high frequencies, the Chad basin has some groups over 90% frequency of R-V88

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Narmerthoth:

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:
^This is quite child-like and bizarre. I thought it was joke when he posted it a couple of years ago but he actually believes this. Clyde is not normal.

---

You mean, child-like and bizarre like, Europeans lost their pigment in Europe to allow them to absorb more sunlight for Vitamin D, or BLUE EYES are a natural selection evolution?

I don't believe Dr. Winter's theory is quite as bizarre as those, why you swallowed.

Remember Rasol and MoM who 1st showed the paper with this bizarre theory? What happened to them and why haven't you followed them?

---

Then there's the Super Nova theory you subscribe to even Mike thinks that's crack pot.

Rasol and MoM left because they realized the illness was incurable.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:
to clarify on average haplogroup R in Africa is under 1%.
However some groups do have high frequencies, the Chad basin has some groups over 90% frequency of R-V88

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So?


To clarify:

"Africa as you've never seen it before: Clever comparison shows it's really as big as China, India, the United States AND most of Europe put together

Graphic shows Africa is as big as 13 nations and Eastern Europe
The continent is more than 30m sq km, but this is not reflected in standard Mercator maps

Biggest nation in terms of landmass is Russia, at more than 17m sq ft

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2445615/True-size-Africa-continent-big-China-India-US-Europe-together.html#ixzz4jmjaFlD2


You try so hard, it's getting funny at this point.

---

 

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Posted by Clyde Winters (Member # 10129) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness,:
to clarify on average haplogroup R in Africa is under 1%.
However some groups do have high frequencies, the Chad basin has some groups over 90% frequency of R-V88

---

The phylogeography of R1 in Africa makes it clear that this y-chromosome is spread globally across Africa and includes the genetic structure of diverse African populations including Berber, Chadic, Cushitic, Khoisan,Pygmy, Niger-Congo, Nilo-Saharan and Semitic speaking African populations (Berniell-Lee et al, 2009; Cruciani et al, 2010; Wood et al, 2009). The fact that Dravidians carry the R haplogroup illustrate the recent introduction of R y-chromosome to Eurasia, because the Dravidians originally belonged to the C-Group of Nubia. Africans also carry haplogroup R1a.
Research on y-haplogroups in Africa suggest that R1-M269 is also widespread in Africa.



Above is a figure from Gonzalez et al., of R1 in Guinea-Bissau. The Gonzalez et al article found that 10 out of 19 subjects in the study carried R1b1-P25 or M269. This is highly significant because it indicates that 53% of the R1 carriers in this study were M269, this finding is further proof of the widespread nature of this so-called Eurasian genes in Africa among populations that have not mated with Europeans . Moreover, Guinea-Bissau was a major area of origin of many slaves during the Atlantic Slave Trade, and, as a result the South American slaves probably already came to the New World carrying R-M269.

The R1 haplogroup probably originated in Africa.

The phylogeography of R1 in Africa makes it clear that this y-chromosome is spread globally across Africa and includes the genetic structure of diverse African populations including Berber, Chadic, Cushitic, Khoisan,Pygmy, Niger-Congo, Nilo-Saharan and Semitic speaking African populations (Berniell-Lee et al, 2009; Cruciani et al, 2010; Wood et al, 2009). The fact that Dravidians carry the R haplogroup illustrate the recent introduction of R y-chromosome to Eurasia.

Abu-Amero et al (20009) reveal the fact that Dravidians carry the R haplogroups illustrate the recent introduction of Ry-chromosomes to Eurasia. The frequency of haplotype M173 in Eurasia is as follows: Anatolia 0.19%, Iran 2.67%, Iraq 0.49% Oman 1.0%, Pakistan 0.57% and Oman 1.0% . This contrast sharply with the widespread distribution of R1 in Africa that ranges between 7- 95% in various parts of Africa, especially Cameroon (Coia et al, 2005). Coia et al (2005) has revealed that no maternal Eurasian lineages have been found among Sub-Saharan Africans with a R1- M173 profile.
Haplogroup V88 has the greatest frequency in Africa. It is predominately carried by Chadic speakers, ranges between 2-60% among Central African Niger-Congo speakers (Cruciani et al, 2010). Researchers have found that the TMRCA of V88 was 9200-5600 kya (Cruciani et al, 2010).



The phylogenetically deep haplogroup R1b is mainly found in West Africa and the Sahel, where the frequency ranges between 85-100% among Niger Congo speakers (Cruciani et al, 2010). The paternal record of M173 on the African continent illustrates a greater distribution of this y-chromosome among varied African populations than, in Asia.

The greatest diversity of R1b in Africa is highly suggestive of an Africa origin for this male lineage. Archaeological (Lal, 1963), genetic (Winters, 2008;2010a), placenames (Balakrishnan, 2005) and linguistic data group (Aravanan,1979,1980; Upadhyaya, 1976,1979; Winters 1985a,1985b, 1989) linking Africans and Dravidian support the recent demic diffusion of SubSaharan Africans and gene flow from Africa to Eurasia. An early colonization of Eurasia 4kya by Sub-Saharan Africans and Dravidian carriers of R1-M173 is the best scenario to explain the high frequency and widespread geographical distribution of this y-chromosome on the African continent (Winters, 2010c). Given the greatest diversity of R1- M173, this is the most parsimonious model explaining the frequency of R-M173 in Africa.
In conclusion, the R haplogroup probably originated in Africa. In my paper POSSIBLE AFRICAN ORIGIN OF Y-CHROMOSOME R1-M173 , I argue that the P clade originated in Africa because 1) the age of R-V88 and 2) the widespread nature of R1 in Africa. Researchers have found that the TMRCA of V88 was 9200-5600 kya (Cruciani et al, 2010). Eurasians carry the M269 (R1b1b2) mutation. The subclades of R1b1b2 include Rh1b1b2g (U106) (TMRCA 8.3kya) and R1b1b2h (U152) (TMRCA 7.4kya). The most recent common ancestor for R1b1b2 is probably 8kya (Balaresque et al, 2010).

In Africa we find R-M269 and V88. Clearly, R-V88 is older than R-M269 there is no evidence of archaeological evidence of a back migration or haplogroup R into Africa, but there is evidence of the migration of the Kushites and Proto-Sahara into Eurasia from Middle Africa. This supports the proposition the R haplogroups originated in Africa, not Eurasia.
The fact remains that R-M269, is found among Sub-Saharan Africans from West, to East and Southern Africa. This supports my contention that this haplogroup is widespread in Africa.

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In India the Dravidian people carry the R1a haplogroup The Dravidian people of India originally lived in Middle Africa and belonged to the Proto-Saharan Civilization.
The Proto-Saharan civilization was situated in the Proto-Sahara, which includes Cameroon.
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In Cameroon we find carriers of R1a.
In addition to carriers of R1a in Cameroon; the Dravidian languages are still spoken today in Cameroon see: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vWyAYGlFZjkhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vWyAYGlFZjk


In conclusion, the R macrohaplogroup probably originated in Africa. In my paper POSSIBLE AFRICAN ORIGIN OF Y-CHROMOSOME R1-M173 , I argue that the P clade originated in Africa because 1) the age of R-V88 and 2) the widespread nature of R1 in Africa.
 

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Posted by AlisonUK (Member # 22777) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Narmerthoth:
I think moving forward, there needs to distinct labeling associated with how we describe albinos because they aren't all the same.
Asian albinos aren't exactly physically and psychologically identical to European albinos, and of course, African albinos aren't the same either.

European albinos, because they have embraced their condition, forgotten their origins and strive to propagate their defect. They seem to be the extreme/worst case end of albinism, whereas African albinos fully comprehend their condition and pro-actively seek to breed it out in their next generation(s).

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quote:

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Originally posted by CelticWarrioress:
AlisonUK,

Give it up, you aren't White. You are a Black supremacist pretending to be White. You're probably Mike, or Narmer, or MOM pretending to be White. Whites are not nor have we ever been albinos. Consider your post

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quote:

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Originally posted by Mindovermatter:
AllisonUK

I have explained the modus operandi of Whites through the ages, and their survival mechanism for propagating the albinism defect through the generations. I would be thankful, if you could explain to me the phenomenon of denial in the so called White community and population, and please describe their ignorance as to their origins and how it plays out in real life.


Please look at this thread, where I have proven and theorized, that Whites/Euro-albinos have evolved an evolutionary survival mechanism of preserving their whiteness and albinism defect through multiple generations and through entire centuries on a per population basis:

http://www.egyptsearch.com/forums/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=15;t=011471

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The majority of "whites" simply aren't aware. There's probably only a few thousand whites in the entire world who understand the true origin and nature of "whiteness", unfortunately these people happen to be ones in positions of power, which is how they've been able to normalise whiteness for so long.

Hard to pinpoint the exact moment when it began, but at some point, most likely to due to extreme climatic changes, there were small groups of geographically-isolated "whites", and this led to excessive inbreeding, otherwise whiteness wouldn't have survived more than a generation. This allowed defective and recessives genes to flourish in a way that normally wouldn't happen in nature.

Even before modern genetic science proved that whiteness is a defect, the recessive nature of whiteness was instinctively understood, and there was a subconscious fear of genetic annihilation which I've never been able to relate to that much. This fear is most profound when living in close proximity to humans with normal amounts of melanin and can cause intense feelings of genetic inadequacy, which in turn leads to defense mechanisms such as white supremacy. White supremacy is nature flipped on its head, and it's the result of overcompensating for subconscious - or often conscious - feelings of inferiority.
 

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Posted by Clyde Winters (Member # 10129) on :
 
To disguise the African ancestry of the ancient Europeans Geno-Hamiticists change the name/number of African haplogroups to differentiate them from Europeans carrying the same haplogroup. R1b1 and Rlb1a were clades belonging to V88.

R1b1 and R1b1a do not change just because you give it a different number. Below is Cruciani et al (2010).


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Researchers give ancient DNA what ever number they wish. For example Haak et al (2015) claims I0124 (Samara_HG) is R1b1, while Iain Mathieson et al 2017, claims I0124 is R1b1a1a. How can the same individual be assigned two different R1 clades. The same thing is obvious in labeling I0124 (Samara_HG) R1b1 ( L278) and I0410 (Spain_EN) R1b1 (M415).

This is nothing but Trickology, an attempt to make it appear the individuals were not Sub-Saharan African.

See: Iain Mathieson et al 2017, The Genomic History of Southeastern Europe,
http://biorxiv.org/content/biorxiv/early/2017/05/09/135616.full.pdf [/QB][/QUOTE]
 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 
Genetics Research Supports White supremacy? Yep!
 

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Posted by Clyde Winters (Member # 10129) on :
 
Now Geneticists are pretending V88 (R1b1a2) is M269 in relation to the migration of the CHG and EF populations from Africa into Eurasia, These Africans, the Kushites who introduced archery, farming and cattle rearing to Eurasia.

Martiniano R, Cassidy LM, Ó'Maoldúin R, McLaughlin R, Silva NM, Manco L, et al. (2017) The population genomics of archaeological transition in west Iberia: Investigation of ancient substructure using imputation and haplotype-based methods. PLoS Genet 13(7): e1006852. https://doi.org/10.1371/journal.pgen.1006852

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Abstract


Recent ancient DNA work has demonstrated the significant genetic impact of mass migrations from the Steppe into Central and Northern Europe during the transition from the Neolithic to the Bronze Age. In Iberia, archaeological change at the level of material culture and funerary rituals has been reported during this period, however, the genetic impact associated with this cultural transformation has not yet been estimated. In order to investigate this, we sequence Neolithic and Bronze Age samples from Portugal, which we compare to other ancient and present-day individuals. Genome-wide imputation of a large dataset of ancient samples enabled sensitive methods for detecting population structure and selection in ancient samples. We revealed subtle genetic differentiation between the Portuguese Neolithic and Bronze Age samples suggesting a markedly reduced influx in Iberia compared to other European regions. Furthermore, we predict individual height in ancients, suggesting that stature was reduced in the Neolithic and affected by subsequent admixtures. Lastly, we examine signatures of strong selection in important traits and the timing of their origins.
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The authors argue that the three Bronze Age individuals carrying R1b1a2, represent R-M269, but this is false they represent V88 and M18. Moreover, they fail to show discontinuity because, we find R1b1a (R-L754) carried by Villabruna, who lived 15kya in north-west Italy, and was a member of the Epigravettian culture. R-L754 has a high frequentcy among Africans.

V88 and the Western Atlantic Modal Haplotype

Euronuts have no limit to their blatant and stealthily rewriting of history to "whiteout" Black and African people. The aDNA of the CHG and EF of Europe is R1b1a2. Although ISOGG 216 makes it clear this haplogroup is V88, in the research literature they are referring to this clade (R1b1a2) as R1b-P312/M269 , eventhough M269 is R1b1a1a2.

The presence of R1b1a2 in Europe is explained by the migration of the Kushites into Europe via Gibraltar and Anatolia


V88 and the Western Atlantic Modal Haplotype
Euronuts have no limit to their blatant and stealthily rewriting of history to "whiteout" Black and African people. The aDNA of the CHG and EF of Europe is R1b1a2. Although ISOGG 216 makes it clear this haplogroup is V88, in the research literature they are referring to this clade (R1b1a2) as R1b-P312/M269 , eventhough M269 is R1b1a1a2.

The presence of R1b1a2 in Europe is explained by the migration of the Kushites into Europe via Gibraltar and Anatolia
 

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Posted by Clyde Winters (Member # 10129) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by the lioness,:


Here we have R1

the part of the chart does not include R-M207 the basal R that is the ancestor of R1 and R2 which would be above this section

It also doesn't show the R2 phylogeny which would be at left of this section

Anyway we can see as M343 descends it splits into P297 (something Clyde never mentions) and R-V88

If we look at the descendants of P297 we see M269 at left and at right various clades in red lines M478 , Y13200 and other clades represented by the red lines but unnumbered
These clades are not descendants of M269, They are siblings part of a split from P297.

Downstream of M269 is R1b1'9 and R1b11 and various subclades

Now going to the far right of the chart the black line is V88. It has some subclades but none are shown.

The red lines at the right are siblings of V88 but are not descendants of V88.
Those are early hunter gatherers (H) and farmers (F) in Europe

So anything on a horizontal line are siblings the parent is the straight line above the horizontal line. In this case M343

The ancestor to all of this is in Eurasia somewhere R*
One place possible is Siberia because they found very old remains there carrying R*

Anyway what happened is people from that population went their separate ways into Central Asia, Europe and Africa

and in those places mutated into various different subclades

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quote:

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Originally posted by Clyde Winters:
R1b1 was recognized as an African genome. Africans carry R1b1, the name for this haplogroup was changed to R-L278.

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quote:

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R1b1* L278

R1b1* or R-L278* is rare among modern males. However, it has been found in two skeletons from prehistoric Europe: a male from the Mesolithic Samara culture (a pre-Yamna people who lived immediately north of the Caspian Sea) buried in about 5650–5555 BCE, and a male from the early Neolithic Cardial culture, buried in about 5178–5066 BCE at the Els Trocs site in the Pyrenees (modern Aragon, Spain).[34]

Some examples described in older articles, for example two found in Turkey,[23] are now thought to be mostly in the more recently discovered sub-clade R1b1a2 (R-V88). Most examples of R1b therefore fall into subclades R1b1a2 (R-V88) or R1b1a (R-P297). Cruciani et al. in the large 2010 study found 3 cases amongst 1173 Italians, 1 out of 328 West Asians and 1 out of 156 East Asians.[33] Varzari found 3 cases in the Ukraine, in a study of 322 people from the Dniester-Carpathian Mountains region, who were P25 positive, but M269 negative.[35] Cases from older studies are mainly from Africa, the Middle East or Mediterranean, and are discussed below as probable cases of R1b1a2 (R-V88).

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quote:

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Originally posted by the lioness,:

quote:

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Originally posted by Clyde Winters:
R1b1 was recognized as an African genome. Africans carry R1b1, the name for this haplogroup was changed to R-L278.

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Because Africans carry a gene does not prove it originated there (10o0th time)

quote:

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R1b1* L278

R1b1* or R-L278* is rare among modern males. However, it has been found in two skeletons from prehistoric Europe: a male from the Mesolithic Samara culture (a pre-Yamna people who lived immediately north of the Caspian Sea) buried in about 5650–5555 BCE, and a male from the early Neolithic Cardial culture, buried in about 5178–5066 BCE at the Els Trocs site in the Pyrenees (modern Aragon, Spain).[34]

Some examples described in older articles, for example two found in Turkey,[23] are now thought to be mostly in the more recently discovered sub-clade R1b1a2 (R-V88). Most examples of R1b therefore fall into subclades R1b1a2 (R-V88) or R1b1a (R-P297). Cruciani et al. in the large 2010 study found 3 cases amongst 1173 Italians, 1 out of 328 West Asians and 1 out of 156 East Asians.[33] Varzari found 3 cases in the Ukraine, in a study of 322 people from the Dniester-Carpathian Mountains region, who were P25 positive, but M269 negative.[35] Cases from older studies are mainly from Africa, the Middle East or Mediterranean, and are discussed below as probable cases of R1b1a2 (R-V88).

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So what you are not understanding is they are just changing names new haplgrouos are defined by new alleles.

THAT MEANS that when new genes are discovered samples that were part of an ancestor group have to be reviewed to see if they have the alleles of newly sub clade or not.

Of course I don't expect to to get this or acknowledge it.

You take new information and try to define it be old nomenclature. That's trickery

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