Best wishes
Ok well I met my boyfriend in egypt this year, march just gone. I have not seen him since but i plan to travel there again in January - the new year. My boyfriend is married, has 3 children but wants to marry me so where does that leave me and how would i fit into all of this? I doubt very much he is getting a divorce for what ever reason he has i know he loves me and he is genuine except i dont think i can legally have a marriage with him, can i? He is takeing me to Cairo and he didnt say why he wants to and i know there are alot of legal marriages performed there, he is from Sharm. I can only think right now he doesnt want his wife to take the kids from him and all that belongs to him - But aparantly they are like brother & sister and i can only think well why would she turn around and do that to you then but she obviously wants to stay married or he does or both. I dont mind him being married to her at all, because i know he doesnt love her and also I feel like i am abit left out if i cant be legally married to him yet she can and i can only marry orfi or something? I didnt want to become a full muslim but i didnt mind changeing some things to involve myself more in his culture etc like changeing my name, learning arabic and wearing the clothes the muslim women do when i visit his family.. I hope you understand what i am saying and the circumstance but i just dont see how i can now be legally married to him because he is legally married to his muslim wife already??? Could he maybe legally marry us both and we both would know this of course? I dont understand about the types or marriages and law and all the rules in Egypt but i do know we want to marry each other very much and we are both serious about that, i would like to live over there with him in Sharm soon and start our new lives there as we have been dreaming but i dont understand alot of all of this. Can you help please with any information you know or any websites i could take a look at about it? Thanks v.much
Best wishes
you can have a legal wedding that will be valid in egypt (and any country that formally recognizes polygamous marriages) but it will not be valid in most of the world due to polygamy. you would get married as any egyptian couple would, so just ask him what's required of an egyptian woman.
about the kids - he automatically gets custody of his children; they are allowed to be in their mother's custody only up to a certain age. hopefully he's not saying this is his main reason for staying married.
I am a second wife but I have a background of 25 years involvement in Egypt, 16 years of Arab relationships, I knew exactly what I was getting into and my husband is totally honest. Our relationship had started as friends some 2 years before we were romatically inclined.
Being a second wife is a serious undertaking which can bring great happiness to all three of you if handled correctly.
I suggest you do some serious reading on the subject. There are some great Islamic websites around that will help you understand the rules.
------------------
Jane Akshar UK Co-owner of www.flatsinluxor.co.uk Appartments and Tours in Luxor
Thankyou to all..azizah - i am a big believer in fate and love at first site, this is not my excuse entirely for my reasons of marriage with my boyfriend but i want to be committed to him and have people know that we are serious. My boyfriends name begins with M and it is not the man you are talking about, i know his dad already and my boyfriend knows my family already and he keeps in touch with them all so it is really a blessed relationship we have so in that area i am fine. I am concerned only about with him, marriage and what type we can have and his reasons for not divorceing her. I tell myself everyday this is KARAAAZZY but not ever doubt my love for him or our love for each other should i say so i know what your saying and it is true - be weary of this kind of thing i agree to!! But it is not like that with us and i do really know that, to be honest hes a lucky man to have me im alot younger than him and also a very nice looking ladyee (laugh) If i do say so myself *shrugs shoulders* Soooo thanks anyway.
melfenien - veerryy good message lol
you are absolutely right - i cant trust him, but i do. i have no idea in the world about if he has other wives only the fact from what hes said and what i have seen. i am going to at the end of all this say to him i will marry him legal and no other way else no marriage to me at all, we can still be together but just until i find someone else cus im 19 nearly 20 i want a real relationship to not pissing about i suppose. good advice and thanks for explaining about polygamy marriages ExptinCAI
Thanks again,
Kel
A muslim man can have upto 4 wives.They all have to be kept in the same manner and he has to have a good reason for taking a second third etc.
But please you do not know this man think very carefully before getting involved.
If you dont mind a hareem fine go ahead.
quote:
Originally posted by asiaq:
Asiaq you are so funny.
quote:
Originally posted by Samia:
Duuuhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! here we go again!!!!
Come on Kelly you are 19 years old...go and live a bit, don't throw your life away on this man. You have fallen in love with what you think is an exotic life style, you have no idea what you are getting into and it will end with a great deal of heartache. Are your parents really supporting you in this stupid venture??
quote:
Originally posted by Penny:
Come on Kelly you are 19 years old...go and live a bit, don't throw your life away on this man. You have fallen in love with what you think is an exotic life style, you have no idea what you are getting into and it will end with a great deal of heartache. Are your parents really supporting you in this stupid venture??
I agree Penny. 19 years old, you have the rest of your life before you dont be second best to anyone
I understand and ive heard all the stories about the foreign women falling into the trap and getting hurt but the way i see it is he is very lucky to have me and he knows me too well to know i wont stand for any crap off him. And i wont. I realise im too young for marriage but i really think that by being married to him i will be able to have a normal relationship with him and we will live together etc, He has not asked for me to do anything except marry him and once that is done and if he changed it would be over. Maybe the polygamy marriage thing is right for the time being??? He originally said he wanted to marry me in 2 years but things changed, I am willing to do this. I have no doubt at all i come first where his first wife is concerned as i know him and i have had long talks with his dad, i believe this. His dad is fine with our relationship HOWEVER he seems to think its up to him if a divorce should be or not which is absolutely ridiculous its not.. But anyway if my boyfriend wants to marry me still i will do it but under my rules just as well as his Thanx for all your advice and you have all helped but this is so right to me and i will have to just have my heart broken in the end if im wrong, Thanks to you all.
PEACE
get to know your rights as an egyptian wife.
if you're going in as a 2nd wife, little things like money will be crucial. he's suppose to be supporting you, his current wife and his 3 kids.
have you discussed such issues as household budget for your new home together? how much is he going to contribute to it? how much is his other wife get (not counting the kid's expenses)? do you care? will you start caring 3 years into the marriage when he tells you he can't afford xyz because his first wife wants to go on vacation for the eid?
where will you live? is he buying a new flat for you two? (most egyptians do, and the bride provides furniture). would he be willing to put it in your name to give you a sense of security? if no, why not?
after all- if you got divorced, in theory you'd be out on the street and he'd have the flat and your furniture (in theory).
do you know anything about writing a marriage contract?
did you know you can stipulate certain rights in a marriage contract, including conditions for your right to ask for a divorce without him being able to contest it?
oh, like a 3rd wife (from another european country).
did you know everything in his name stays in his name when you divorce -- even if you bought it? make sure if you financially contribute to anything, it's either solely in your name (as a gesture of how much he trusts you) or you are co-owner.
keep all property you own outside of egypt in your name. he will have no claim to it, as the marriage is not valid outside of the country.
good luck.
you're young and remember if it ends up being a mistake...you have lots of time to learn from it and move on. if it doesn't, then you're lucky to have found what you wanted so early in your life.
Ta'
the one thing that sticks out for me is that you say you know that he doesnt love his wife. How do you know?
He must have loved her to have 3 children with her.
Have you met his wife? and her English is good enough for you both to discuss this? you have heard her say that they do not love each other?
have you met the children? you will be like an aunt to them, it's important you get on with his wife and children.
Was it really his dad that you met and had long talks with?
or just an Egyptian that he knows who speaks good English to back up his story (background, who he is, the uncaring wife, his short term feelings for you etc ...)
This is a common thing to happen. That he introduces his "brother" or "uncle" or "dad" to the tourist, who then says that they have spoken to his family about you and they are all very happy for you.
"apparantly they are like brother and sister". Did his "dad" tell you that?
It sounds like a cheesy line from a guy in a bar in UK, that he doesnt love his wife, that she doesnt understand him, she means nothing to him. You've probably heard that kind of thing before.
The more people warn you about these type of characters and these types of situations, the more determined you are to hold onto your dream and to try to prove us all wrong.
If you went to Blackpool for the week and met a nice guy in your hotel and got to know him over the week, wouldnt you find it weird if he turned round and said to you that he loved you and wanted to marry you but he was already married but he doesnt really love her?
how desperate would that sound?
If your guy has such great chemistry with you after 1 week of knowing you, how many other tourists has he "connected with" after their 1 week holiday?
This sounds like it should be on the Trisha/Jerry Springer tv shows.
listen to the women giving you replies here kelly, they now what they are talking about - most of them...
but i know you will not, so i wish you all the best and i hope you will get out of this misery before you are to tired to start a new life...
take care - maybe you are clever enough to listen to others, but i doubt not :rooleyes:
Maybe in rare cases it works,but this is very rare.Is he a good muslim?
quote:
Originally posted by Ge Ge:
Kelly, a good egyptian man does not take a second wife.
It’s the good ones who follow their religion properly who should be taking a second, and maybe even a third or a fourth wife, but the truth is sadly it is often the bad ones who do it, manage it badly, and give it a bad reputation. In the same way that their wives often do not follow their religion well and support their husbands when they are in a position to be able to support another wife as allowed by Allah. All the parties have to be good people and work together as a team to make it work, as in any marriage, its just that this team is a bit bigger.
quote:
Originally posted by newcomer:
It’s the good ones who follow their religion properly who should be taking a second, and maybe even a third or a fourth wife, but the truth is sadly it is often the bad ones who do it, manage it badly, and give it a bad reputation. In the same way that their wives often do not follow their religion well and support their husbands when they are in a position to be able to support another wife as allowed by Allah. All the parties have to be good people and work together as a team to make it work, as in any marriage, its just that this team is a bit bigger.
This is so true and a very good reason why this solution is unsuitable for Kellymichelle. This team doesn't even know each other and haven't discussed the roles or how they are going to play them. There is also has no idea of how Islam views the relationship of expects it to be conducted.
What about the other lady involved or the children.
[This message has been edited by akshar (edited 10 October 2004).]
quote:
Originally posted by Jacqueline:
If he is legally married to any woman he cannot legally marry a non-egyptian woman as well because the mazoon at the ministry of justice in cairo at lazoughly square (which is the only place in egypt where an egyptian can legally marry a non-egyptian)will not marry you without a document from your embassy giving you permission to marry. Your embassy will not give you permission to marry a married man.
This is not quite right but I am going to leave akshar to answer it becasue she will do it better than me
Therefore you can have a legal marriage in Egypt between an Egyptian and foreigner that is not recognised outside of Egpyt. Your emabasy would not be involved because they only recognised monogamous marriages.
There are many of us with legal marriages which are accepeted within Egypt but are not recognised by our country of origin. By accepeted I mean the government recognises them and allows us entry without visa, discount on hotels, airlines and historic sites and travel outside of the convoy system.
So my marital status in Egypt is married but in the Uk I am still considered a widow.
If you are a Muslim foreign woman then not only can your marriage be recognised legally in Egyp but also Islamically.
However I am really concerned about the originator of this thread who has little idea of the impact of her boyfriends proposal
------------------
Jane Akshar UK Co-owner of www.flatsinluxor.co.uk Appartments and Tours in Luxor
So nice to see you posting again after all this time.
------------------
Jane Akshar UK Co-owner of www.flatsinluxor.co.uk Appartments and Tours in Luxor
Is this man working in tourism in Sharm?
Where does he live in Sharm?
What does he do for a job ?
Is his wife and family living in Cairo?
How much older than you is he?
Why was his Dad in Sharm..does he live and work there too.
What about his Mum..she is the most important person in his life, have you met or spoken to her yet?
Have you thought about what work you will be able to do in Sharm if you live there?
Kelly I would really like to open your eyes to a few things and if you answer these questions I will try and help. I am not biased in anyway but I have lived in Sharm for 3 years with an Egyptian husband...no I am not an old woman.... sadly I have seen many bad things happen to women both young and old.
Penny
Good luck.
From reading responses, I think many people feel sorry for you because they think you will have some difficult times ahead of you. I haven't commented on your personal love life because you write like someone who is deeply in love and has that special filter on her ears which allows her to hear only what she wants to hear.
So - do what makes you happy, but realize that you still have to put yourself 1st in your life. Your boyfriend isn't going to. He's going to put his existing children 1st in his life, as any good father would.
And -if you really find what strangers say to you annonymously on the internet this hurtful - I suggest that you don't post on forums about your personal life. It invites both critique and support. But please, don't write that anyone is jealous of you. That's just plain childish.
His dad was not in Sharm but we travelled to visit his apartment i am not certain of the name all i know is that it took about 3 hours in the car to get there and its still in Sinai, His mother i am not sure about but i will be speaking with her for a second time when i return to Sharm as we are travelling around Egypt. If i work in Sharm i will be working with my boyfriend for his business, His friend has an english wife already who is ALOT older than him they have like 25 years apart who is currently working for there business but they are both moveing to england and Mohamed will have his own business in Sharm alone.
Penny thats great i would love to talk with you Can i ask please what happened with you and your egyptian husband and your experiences with Egypt?
Thanx 2 all of u and im not mad at anyone!
X
quote:
Originally posted by xkellyxmichellex:
Jealous wasnt a good word to use, Bitter however, Was the correct word and what i should of wrote. I feel like there are alot of people on here who from there own experiences just think every one similar to is the same and is going to turn out bad.
I know i am going to get critized etc for what i write and i can take it, But let me have my opinion to! I have read what everyone else thinks and i have said thats fine but i have an opinion also and i want to tell you all that..
And i know there are people on here who support others and i will be one of those people who will try to help to but i understand why you all think as you do but when i say i dont agree with any of you it doesnt mean im not letting any one have there comments or opinions im giving mine back.
I know i write like im in love and i wont listen to anyone else, i admit i do - I wont listen to anyone else until he has proven me wrong because i believe in innocent until found guilty especially in this case. I will except his kids and his first wife, I am going on what he says because i trust him like he does with me. If there wasnt trust in a long distance relationship i wouldnt have one! So i trust him and i believe what he is saying, I agree that i should be very wary of him and find out what i am getting myself in to first but i will not judge him based on his past - I would hate someone to do that to me. He lives alone, away from his family he sees them maybe 6 times a year for a week each time. When i return i WILL be haveing words with his first wife and until then i still believe what he says, If things look doubtful and i find out hes been lying then i will go ballistic :| And that will be the end but there are plenty more fish in the sea!! Im serious enough about him to wait until i can go back and we can discuss and sort things out and stick with him and what he says. For now.
I met him in Sharm, He is a cab driver but owns his own business its a car rental place and he runs it with his friend. He told me he loved me and cried and cried and cried when i left towards the end of the holiday, He had been honest from the start about his wife and kids and all things he had never lied to any of me and my family. He got on very well with my dad and before he had told me he loved me he told my dad the day before he needed to speak with him about me but anyway, it was to tell my dad first, i said no and it pretty much went like that. I knew him for 3 weeks and spent the last 1 and a half weeks with him because he had then told me, he told me it was love at first sight - He had seen me arrive at the hotel although i had not seen him or anyone. I did not fall in love with him as soon as he did with me it took me a few weeks maybe over a month but i can honestly say i do love him so much now and im happy with that. I have not seen him since April this year but i am going back because of money matters more than anything in Jan, New year. It is all booked now and i am staying with him a while before we marry i am meeting his family and friends etc then we will hopefully wed if all troubles are solved and settled. I have never done anything so crazy in my life but then im 19, I know its crazy but i love it all. And i love him. We may live in england or egypt it looks like Egypt will be where we live but we might well split the year up and do half in 1 country then in the others???
His family live in Cairo yes, Mohamed is i think its 15 years older than me hes 35 in Jan im 20 in March.
His dad was not in Sharm but we travelled to visit his apartment i am not certain of the name all i know is that it took about 3 hours in the car to get there and its still in Sinai, His mother i am not sure about but i will be speaking with her for a second time when i return to Sharm as we are travelling around Egypt. If i work in Sharm i will be working with my boyfriend for his business, His friend has an english wife already who is ALOT older than him they have like 25 years apart who is currently working for there business but they are both moveing to england and Mohamed will have his own business in Sharm alone.Penny thats great i would love to talk with you
Thanx 2 all of u and im not mad at anyone!
X
You are 19, you have known him a few weeks, you are prepared to accept being a second wife but you haven't meet his first wife, he is a cab driver, he currently supports his wife and children and now he will support you out of a cab drivers money, how will you cope when he can't afford A/C and it is 48 degrees. what about when he is always leaving you because his wife phones and the children are ill. You haven't met his mother, THE most important female in an Egyptian mans life. If she doesn't like you then you are doomed, totally.
I have tell you I think you will last about 3 months out here. My honest opinion and it is not based on a bitter experience. I was married 12 years to a Syrian until he died and now 2 years to an Egyptian. I love being married and living out here. You have not got a clue about the life you are going to live.
Can I suggest you read this story and tell me if you will cope better than this
lady when she has religious reasons for being here. http://www.egyptsearch.com/forums/Forum2/HTML/004215.html Do you see what kind of life you will have and imagine spliting that money between two families.
------------------
Jane Akshar UK Co-owner of www.flatsinluxor.co.uk Appartments and Tours in Luxor
I have been going out with an egyptian man for a year and have spent several months with him,but I do not feel I know him well enough yet to marry him.I love him dearly.
People on this forum are only trying to advise you, there is not anything better than a happy love story.When you know all the facts you will decide for yourself.You seem to be very much in love with this man and I wish you every happiness for the future.Are you going to live in Sharm?
quote:
Originally posted by Jacqueline:
I dont wish to burst anyones bubble here but regardless of a casual acceptance of orfi marriages ( this is where you go to a lawyer and get a contract even though he has no legal authority to perform marriage because he is not a registrar ie mazoon)between egyptians and non-egyptians by local authorities, the state of egypt does not legally recognise such relationships as marriages. I am sorry akshar i dont know you and i have no wish to offend you but you are not married, you are living in a state of adultery with a married man. I have gone into great detail in previous postings about why the orfi marriage is neither legally valid nor islamically valid in egypt or anywhere else. I have said this until i am blue in the face but i will say it again, the state of egypt does not legally recognise any relationship between an egyptian and a non-egyptian unless a marriage is performed by the mazoon (registrar)at the ministry of justice in lazoughly square in cairo. If you were not married by one of the mazoons at lazoughly in cairo then you are not married it is as simple as that. Dont take my word for it, go to the mazoon at lazoughly, go to the british embassy in cairo, go to the egyptian embassy in london, and they will all tell you what i am telling you.
The State of Egypt does accept a marriage between a foreigner and an Egyptian that is not performed at the Ministry/Embassy otherwise I would not be able to enter the country without a visa stamp. Production of my marriage papers was sufficient for the immigration in cairo. It is also sufficient for an application of citizenship.
The British government however does not accept the same marriage. I completely accept that the UK/US/Europe consider me to be living in sin but fortunately that is not the case in Egypt. Here i am a respectable married woman with an Islamically acceptable marriage.
There are many polygamous wives in Egypt who have to accept marriage by local law only and no Embassy involvement. Their marriage is only valid in Egypt.
You are right to warn about Orfi marriages but that is not what mine is. Orfi is by definition an unregistered marriage. Mine is very much registered.
Likewise don't take my word for it but check with a lawyer here in Egypt. Use one of the embassy ones so you can be sure of independent advice.
------------------
Jane Akshar UK Co-owner of www.flatsinluxor.co.uk Appartments and Tours in Luxor
quote:
Originally posted by Jacqueline:
Akshar i see that we will have to agree to differ about the legality of your 'marriage by lawyer' in egypt. I am aware of the practice of getting lawyers papers stamped by local court officials in luxor but this is not the same thing as marriage registration. Dont be fooled by this. Having a marriage registered is where after you get the marriage certificate from the mazoon you take it to the records office in cairo and have the marriage legally recorded in the states record office. By the way good advice for everyone is dont trust any lawyer in egypt even if they are on the embassies approved list. Go to the embassy to confirm my information. There are many mazoons (marriage registrars)all over egypt and when an egyptian wants to marry another egyptian they can marry by any mazoon anywhere in egypt and this is perfectly legal. I would like to ask akshar to go to any mazoon in luxor and ask him to marry her to her 'husband' and come back and tell me what happened. I am sure he will refuse to marry you and tell you that you have to go to the mazoon at lazoughly in cairo. Why does every non-egyptian in luxor get married by lawyer? Because the mazoon in luxor cannot and will not marry you because it is illegal for him to do so. The reason why you are only allowed to marry at lazoughly is because this is close to all the embassies and they have to provide proof that you are free to marry and give permission for the marriage. Lawyers in luxor have no procedures for verifying that a non-egyptian woman is free to marry.
That is fine if you are the first wife but if you are a second wife no embassy is going to touch you. The embassy (of a country that only recognises monogamous marriages) CAN NOT give permission because they don't recognise polygamous marriages. They will not provide statury declarations if the Egyptian man is married.
------------------
Jane Akshar UK Co-owner of www.flatsinluxor.co.uk Appartments and Tours in Luxor
Although I don’t have actual practical experience of this, when I enquired in the British Embassy about the possibility of getting married in polygynous situation I was, as you said, advised that the Embassy would not give approval for a marriage if the man was already married or intended to take another wife. This would be the case even if the British woman was free to marry, as it would be a bigamous marriage under British law and they would therefore not recognise the marriage. This is the reason for the need for a letter of approval from the British Embassy, to say whether the marriage would likely be recognized in Britain (and I assume many other countries too). So if someone was not worried about their marriage being recognized as a legal marriage outside Egypt this process is not necessary.
However, when I told them that I was a Muslim they advised me that I could have a legal marriage in Egypt through a mazoom, and that would be a legal marriage in Egypt and accepted in other countries that accept polygyny. It would give all the same legal rights and responsibilities as an Egyptian wife would have. So I am wondering why you are now saying that it is illegal for a mazoom to marry a foreigner to an Egyptian as Muslims can marry “women of the book” so it is not just for Muslim women. Also, if the procedure with a lawyer meets the basic Islamic criteria: 2 witnesses, an offer and an acceptance, a wali for an previously unmarried woman (under Hanafi law) and any woman under the other schools of law, the mahr is mentioned, and the marriage is announced, then it would be Islamically correct too.
It does seem that Akshar’s marriage is legal in Egypt if the immigration department accepts her marriage certificate and she can apply for citizenship as the wife of an Egyptian, how much more legal does a marriage need to be?
[This message has been edited by AnotherNewMember (edited 14 October 2004).]
If what you are saying is true this does not explain why the Deputy Consul of the British Embassy recommended that I could get married through a mazoom, although they would not give a “no objection letter” if the man was already married. This implied that this letter was not necessary for a legal civil marriage, that was also Islamically valid, outside the Ministry of Justice.
As a slight side issue, if the Embassies have to issue a letter to show that a woman is legally divorced or widowed to satisfy the requirements for iddah, is any proof required for a woman who says that she has never been married to verify this, other than a sworn statement? If not how can it be proven by anyone that she is telling the truth and is eligible to be married? As the majority of marriages performed here in Egypt certainly at the moment, are for previously unmarried women, is a document required to prove that a woman is eligible for marriage under Egyptian law, either by virtue of a completed iddah or never having been married or do they do it through some central register? I am just trying to work out the conflict in the advice given here and what was given by the Embassy.
What I mean about an Islamic marriage is one that is valid by the laws of Allah, even though the laws of the state may not agree. Most Muslim countries have put additional requirements over Islamic law for a marriage to be recognized by the countries laws that are not conditions for an Islamically valid marriage. For example, Islamic law doesn’t require that a woman or man prove that that they are eligible under Islamic law to marry, nor does it require documentation to prove that the marriage has taken place, nor does it have to be performed by a recognized official. These are man-made additions that, although they are intended to safeguard the parties, are not Islamic requirements for a valid marriage, similar to the declaration of faith to become a Muslim. Allah does not require this to be done in front of witnesses and certified for it to be valid. It’s between you and Him.
[This message has been edited by AnotherNewMember (edited 14 October 2004).]
You were all right, i was wrong. There is hiw wife, kids, and plenty of other women Arabic and from other countries too he is with. After all we talked about and argued about very much and now i know all of it was a pack of lies for real this time. He will not get a divorce, he is a liar and promise-breaker. I didnt believe it because i knew i was way to good for him, i still cant believe he did this to me actually - Im to young for this **** anyway i was throwing my life away for a lying control freak. I knew this yesterday when alot of things happened that its probably best i dont go into as im alittle upset and he responded when we are married next year you could come to sharm every year if you want to. So yes, something in that whole sentence proves he doesnt want me around enough - Hes useing me. I should of known better because im so smart, Egyptian men tried to warn me of him and i didnt believe them and they knew him!! So yes, im glad but sad right now ill probably take the day off today as i dont feel like cleaning 14 hotel rooms right now :| And then go back to my old normal english life with out his interference as i did 8 months ago. I was looking forward to it so much i had brought everything for the wedding How stupid was i! I believe there are some loving Egyptian men out there some where, some over-loving ones to but some genuine ones who i will now treat as friends if and when i return by myself and with myself or friends. Oh well, plenty more fish in the sea not like im 50 is it so i guess im lucky i caught on to his game at this stage in my life. Thanks you guys i will still come on here for support for anyone else and little chats its a nice forum
Take care
quote:
Originally posted by newcomer:
Hi Jacqueline!......................
It does seem that Akshar’s marriage is legal in Egypt if the immigration department accepts her marriage certificate and she can apply for citizenship as the wife of an Egyptian, how much more legal does a marriage need to be?
Bearing in mind your comments I would love an answer to this Jacqueline.
You also say my marriage can't be registered, but it is. So why has the court accepted and registered it?
BTW I am not unique in this, just the only one prepared to come out in public.
------------------
Jane Akshar UK Co-owner of www.flatsinluxor.co.uk Appartments and Tours in Luxor
quote:
Originally posted by xkellyxmichellex:
Weddings OFF!!!You were all right, i was wrong. There is hiw wife, kids, and plenty of other women Arabic and from other countries too he is with. After all we talked about and argued about very much and now i know all of it was a pack of lies for real this time. He will not get a divorce, he is a liar and promise-breaker. I didnt believe it because i knew i was way to good for him, i still cant believe he did this to me actually - Im to young for this **** anyway i was throwing my life away for a lying control freak. I knew this yesterday when alot of things happened that its probably best i dont go into as im alittle upset and he responded when we are married next year you could come to sharm every year if you want to. So yes, something in that whole sentence proves he doesnt want me around enough - Hes useing me. I should of known better because im so smart, Egyptian men tried to warn me of him and i didnt believe them and they knew him!! So yes, im glad but sad right now ill probably take the day off today as i dont feel like cleaning 14 hotel rooms right now :| And then go back to my old normal english life with out his interference as i did 8 months ago. I was looking forward to it so much i had brought everything for the wedding How stupid was i! I believe there are some loving Egyptian men out there some where, some over-loving ones to but some genuine ones who i will now treat as friends if and when i return by myself and with myself or friends. Oh well, plenty more fish in the sea not like im 50 is it so i guess im lucky i caught on to his game at this stage in my life. Thanks you guys i will still come on here for support for anyone else and little chats its a nice forum
Take care
I am thankful we were able to spare you further heartache but even so you must be devastated. As you say you are young and there are plenty more fish in the sea but that doesn't help right now when you feel let down and deceived. I wish I could give you a hug.
------------------
Jane Akshar UK Co-owner of www.flatsinluxor.co.uk Appartments and Tours in Luxor
Like you say you are too young for all this s**t in your life. I'm glad you found out now before you got even more hurt and that you were so strong and told him exactly where to go. I know it hurts so dam much to be taken in like this, I get so sick and tired of seeing the games these men play. Who the hell do they think they are that they can muck up peoples lives in this way.
Keep busy and get back to your old life as fast as possible.
Take care of yourself, it will get better.
Love Penny
I wish you luck.You are only 19 you have your whole life ahead.Where are you in England? Keep smiling.
Its a good bloodey job I am a tough cookie!! For a while there i turned into a bit of i Shirley Valentine i think! ! ! I did love him, very much though. I am so fed up of the lying and story after story which were all built up on lies, he has called my dad so many times today bothering him about me, What i dont get is what i mean to him, How can i mean that much to him - Im just another 'wife' - After he had the cheek to tell me and warn me of Most Egyptian men how they have Wives and Girlfriends etc etc!! What a prick im so glad i caught him this early, Its sad because for the past 8 months although he has not been here he has had my heart and been with me in my mind and on the phone everyday, But in time i know i will fall back in love again with the country when this is all settled and go back out there for a good holiday and visit Aswan and Egypt doesnt just end in Sharm, I will see it all one day! I dont need him, i pitty him actually. I feel bad for his first wife i remember how he described her to me and looking back on some of the **** he fed me i cant believe i fell for it.. "Oh no my wife she said to me, just have another wife i dont mind, All i want is to take care of the kids thats all i want in my life are the children" - I mean, for a start if thats the case why wouldnt they divorce then? Ahh so many things, Its all behind me now. Maybe its a good job we dont live in the same country - Else id be ringing his neck right now!!!!!!!
Thanx 2 all
Ill start back for some chats regular -This forums wikid 
[This message has been edited by AnotherNewMember (edited 14 October 2004).]
I am just checking in, having been gone from here for several months... I was very dubious when reading your first few posts. I was sure you were headed into one BIG mistake, but you found out that the others here were just trying to save you much grief. Congratulations, you have just taken one big leap into growing up.... seeing that you were about to make a mistake, stopping yourself, and most importantly, ADMITTING it. You're doin' great!
ps... I am American, married to a wonderful Egyptian from Helwan (outside Cairo), living in the US, awaiting his visa to come to me from Kuwait where we met last July and married in March.
quote:
Originally posted by xkellyxmichellex:
Jealous wasnt a good word to use, Bitter however, Was the correct word and what i should of wrote. I feel like there are alot of people on here who from there own experiences just think every one similar to is the same and is going to turn out bad.
I know i am going to get critized etc for what i write and i can take it, But let me have my opinion to! I have read what everyone else thinks and i have said thats fine but i have an opinion also and i want to tell you all that..
And i know there are people on here who support others and i will be one of those people who will try to help to but i understand why you all think as you do but when i say i dont agree with any of you it doesnt mean im not letting any one have there comments or opinions im giving mine back.
I know i write like im in love and i wont listen to anyone else, i admit i do - I wont listen to anyone else until he has proven me wrong because i believe in innocent until found guilty especially in this case. I will except his kids and his first wife, I am going on what he says because i trust him like he does with me. If there wasnt trust in a long distance relationship i wouldnt have one! So i trust him and i believe what he is saying, I agree that i should be very wary of him and find out what i am getting myself in to first but i will not judge him based on his past - I would hate someone to do that to me. He lives alone, away from his family he sees them maybe 6 times a year for a week each time. When i return i WILL be haveing words with his first wife and until then i still believe what he says, If things look doubtful and i find out hes been lying then i will go ballistic :| And that will be the end but there are plenty more fish in the sea!! Im serious enough about him to wait until i can go back and we can discuss and sort things out and stick with him and what he says. For now.
I met him in Sharm, He is a cab driver but owns his own business its a car rental place and he runs it with his friend. He told me he loved me and cried and cried and cried when i left towards the end of the holiday, He had been honest from the start about his wife and kids and all things he had never lied to any of me and my family. He got on very well with my dad and before he had told me he loved me he told my dad the day before he needed to speak with him about me but anyway, it was to tell my dad first, i said no and it pretty much went like that. I knew him for 3 weeks and spent the last 1 and a half weeks with him because he had then told me, he told me it was love at first sight - He had seen me arrive at the hotel although i had not seen him or anyone. I did not fall in love with him as soon as he did with me it took me a few weeks maybe over a month but i can honestly say i do love him so much now and im happy with that. I have not seen him since April this year but i am going back because of money matters more than anything in Jan, New year. It is all booked now and i am staying with him a while before we marry i am meeting his family and friends etc then we will hopefully wed if all troubles are solved and settled. I have never done anything so crazy in my life but then im 19, I know its crazy but i love it all. And i love him. We may live in england or egypt it looks like Egypt will be where we live but we might well split the year up and do half in 1 country then in the others???
His family live in Cairo yes, Mohamed is i think its 15 years older than me hes 35 in Jan im 20 in March.
His dad was not in Sharm but we travelled to visit his apartment i am not certain of the name all i know is that it took about 3 hours in the car to get there and its still in Sinai, His mother i am not sure about but i will be speaking with her for a second time when i return to Sharm as we are travelling around Egypt. If i work in Sharm i will be working with my boyfriend for his business, His friend has an english wife already who is ALOT older than him they have like 25 years apart who is currently working for there business but they are both moveing to england and Mohamed will have his own business in Sharm alone.Penny thats great i would love to talk with you
Thanx 2 all of u and im not mad at anyone!
X
it is allowed& accepted to marry 1-4 wives in islam& arab countries.but once a man does-especially to a foreigner-then he doesn not have intentions of settling with her-infact thats why he chose her in first place,an egyptian woman wouldnt agree,unless its for critical reasons.
i am awfully sorry to say this,but many(not all but majority) of egyptian men dont actaully respect forein women,they know that they can easily be someone else/do things and never be caught out-due to their lack of knowledge.
please be careful,ask for more opinion,esp from people who went through it,and to tell u the truth,being in sharm and 19,it would be a shame getting married! best of luck.
) in the sea; they all say hi to you waving their fins and tails seducingly. Take care and chin up girl - my good wishes are right behind u.