my husband thinks constantly about money, how to make it, how to save it, how to make more... when he speaks to his family all they talk about is "kam.....kam...."...the price of stuff and how to organize some projects. His first thoughts always turns to money. friend had an accident at work and his first reaction was "he will get compensation!" not is he doing OK? I am really fed up with this kind of thinking, especially because he is actually quite poor nonetheless (hehe). But I feel he is so materialistic. All he is interested in is the new iphone, gold, diamonds, if something is worth something. Doesn't matter what, just as long as he can sell it. Is this an Egyptian trend? Or just my husband?
Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
I have seen people like this in the UK and the trend I can see compared to what you wrote is they are all on the poor side.
Looking to make the next quick buck and then spending it on fake whatever to try to look like they are somebody they aren't!
Be careful he doesn't trade you in for the new soon to be released Blackberry
I don't think your husband is unique in his thinking... even I sometimes look at crappy Christmas gifts I receive and wonder what I could fetch on Ebay for them!
Posted by tina kamal (Member # 13845) on :
well walid is the same exact way. he was even excited that he can sell a tube if orajel that i sent for his moms teeth,you know we have so many things that are not avaliable in egypt here in the us. and when they see it its like i want iot want it. like a kid with candy.once the newness wears off he is onto somethin else.. lol.. gotta ove the enthusiasm.
Posted by anthropos (Member # 9410) on :
my husband will try to sell anything! Baby clothes, old shoes, cd's, furniture, anything electrical (well that sells actually quite well). You name it. What annoys me most though is that he is not trying to accumulate money for something. He just wants to make money to make money. It is a hobby.
Posted by tina kamal (Member # 13845) on :
quote:Originally posted by anthropos: my husband will try to sell anything! Baby clothes, old shoes, cd's, furniture, anything electrical (well that sells actually quite well). You name it. What annoys me most though is that he is not trying to accumulate money for something. He just wants to make money to make money. It is a hobby.
haha go figure. but i say let him have his fun. at least hes accumluating things and not wives hunny...
Posted by Exiiled (Member # 17278) on :
There's an Egyptian adage “ma3ak irsh tiswa irsh” (You have a piaster, you're worth a piaster). He's probably more miserialistic (ahaha 1/2 miser 1/2 materialistic). Both are bad traits and definite put offs, but a miser is worse imho.
Materialistic people are all over though, it's in urban culture in the USA and exploded after rap came on the scene. You can listen to the lyrics and it's all about “making money”, and there is this misconception that a person is deemed worthless (similarily to the Egyptian adage) if they don't have the expensive gear. The truth is only other materialistic people are attracted to such items as gold chains, expensive car rims, etc.
Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
I can be materialistic but I am not bothered with bling... I am not some rap chav in Burberry with Argos earrings and the Daily Mail under my arm!
But, I do however like to have a decent phone, the new ipod, gadgets and spend cash on nice clothes that last and don't fall apart in the wash. I like to feel good about myself.
There is nothing wrong with spoiling yourself or looking good. But in my defence I only do these things to please myself and I care so very little what others think
Judge away Posted by Mo Ning Min E (Member # 681) on :
Judge away
Judged.
Seriously, whilst I always believed that the only people in the world who are intensely materialistic are the very rich and the very poor [and the rest of us don't give a ratsass, considering it tasteless] it really IS a culture thing here.Just like the US.
Rich = good, nice, trustworthy Poor = mad bad and dangerous to know.
Sad.
Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
It depends in my eyes who are you trying to please, why do you want the money and possessions?
I think if people just have expensive taste or an addiction to gadgets (I lurve gadgets) then it is no biggy as people work hard to get the things they want and don't steal them.
If people are materialistic becasue they have a desire to make others worship them or see them as better people then that is not for me.
I don't give a rat's ass for cash but I do like my toys And why shouldn't I?
Do others here love their sofas, or laptops or cars? Are people working in the UK to pay off extortionate mrtgages on homes they cannot afford.
Are people in other countries borrowing money from banks to buy things they neither want or need becasue of conglomorate advertising on the Christmas run up that starts in September which forces children to beg endlessly to be like their friends.
OOO and relax lol...
Posted by Exiiled (Member # 17278) on :
quote:Originally posted by Cheekyferret: I can be materialistic but I am not bothered with bling... I am not some rap chav in Burberry with Argos earrings and the Daily Mail under my arm!
But, I do however like to have a decent phone, the new ipod, gadgets and spend cash on nice clothes that last and don't fall apart in the wash. I like to feel good about myself.
There is nothing wrong with spoiling yourself or looking good. But in my defence I only do these things to please myself and I care so very little what others think
Judge away
I don't think buying expensive gadgets, designer sunglasses, brand name clothes, makes a person materialistic, I think that's more style. But a person who is consumed by materialism to the point of judging other people's values by what brand names they own is materialistic. When material items dictate a person's perception of individuals and society it's definitely materialistic personality.
Posted by Exiiled (Member # 17278) on :
I'd like to add in defence of Egypt's adage - (u got a piaster you're worth a piaster) it's not really about brands. It was originally meant with regards to social status, job, apartment, car, etc. Not necessarily expensive items like clothing and accessories. So perhaps I wrongly used it in this discussion.
Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
But originally weren't they all material items?
Posted by Exiiled (Member # 17278) on :
quote:Originally posted by Cheekyferret: But originally weren't they all material items?
It's confusing because Egypt is a complex patriarchal society. Egyptians are reluctant to give their daughter's hand in marriage to men who are penniless and in the lower stratosphere of Egyptian society.
So is that materialistic?, wanting the basic things such as housing and transportation? I guess that's what I'm trying to say.
Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
But isn't materialism in Islam deemed a no no as it is self destructive?
Oh man, I am going to sleep before I start talking about external perceptions and sociology!.
Posted by Exiiled (Member # 17278) on :
Islam's bearing on Egyptian society is limited when it comes to the “irsh” / piaster It's an Egyptian thing and not Islamic in anyway. I'm not judging them but I think that adage is not blatant materialism. I think they deem it survival, owning an apartment is tantamount to survival in Egypt.
Goodnight. Yer right, I would've had us both rambling Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
I need an ipod to survive in Egypt.
Night dude Posted by Bollock (Member # 17944) on :
quote:Originally posted by anthropos: my husband thinks constantly about money, how to make it, how to save it, how to make more... when he speaks to his family all they talk about is "kam.....kam...."...the price of stuff and how to organize some projects. His first thoughts always turns to money. friend had an accident at work and his first reaction was "he will get compensation!" not is he doing OK? I am really fed up with this kind of thinking, especially because he is actually quite poor nonetheless (hehe). But I feel he is so materialistic. All he is interested in is the new iphone, gold, diamonds, if something is worth something. Doesn't matter what, just as long as he can sell it. Is this an Egyptian trend? Or just my husband?
If her egyptian husband is lazy, she complaints. Otherwise, if her egyptian husband is a money oriented man, she complaints too.
Posted by metinoot (Member # 17031) on :
quote:Originally posted by Mo Ning Min E:
Seriously, whilst I always believed that the only people in the world who are intensely materialistic are the very rich and the very poor [and the rest of us don't give a ratsass, considering it tasteless] it really IS a culture thing here. Just like the US.
Rich = good, nice, trustworthy Poor = mad bad and dangerous to know.
Sad.
Have you ever lived in the US to verify this yourself?
Posted by Mo Ning Min E (Member # 681) on :
[B]Have you ever lived in the US to verify this yourself?[B/]
Have you been living in cave for the past 20 years???
Posted by Ayisha (Member # 4713) on :
quote:Originally posted by Mo Ning Min E: [B]Have you ever lived in the US to verify this yourself?[B/]
Have you been living in cave for the past 20 years???
ROFLMAO
that was a pretty classic line from sono though, the expert on Egyptian OTC drugs and marriage in UK . Has she ever been to UK? NO, has she ever found tampons in Egypt? NO ROFLMAO
sorry back to my learning now Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
quote:Originally posted by Ayisha:
quote:Originally posted by Mo Ning Min E: [B]Have you ever lived in the US to verify this yourself?[B/]
Have you been living in cave for the past 20 years???
ROFLMAO
that was a pretty classic line from sono though, the expert on Egyptian OTC drugs and marriage in UK . Has she ever been to UK? NO, has she ever found tampons in Egypt? NO ROFLMAO
sorry back to my learning now
Learning or leaning?
Posted by Ayisha (Member # 4713) on :
quote:Originally posted by Cheekyferret:
quote:Originally posted by Ayisha:
quote:Originally posted by Mo Ning Min E: [B]Have you ever lived in the US to verify this yourself?[B/]
Have you been living in cave for the past 20 years???
ROFLMAO
that was a pretty classic line from sono though, the expert on Egyptian OTC drugs and marriage in UK . Has she ever been to UK? NO, has she ever found tampons in Egypt? NO ROFLMAO
sorry back to my learning now
Learning or leaning?
learning. I am leranngi ot ytpe Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
I thought the leg had fell off your chair Posted by Ayisha (Member # 4713) on :
quote:Originally posted by Cheekyferret: I thought the leg had fell off your chair
why do you think I can't type properly! Posted by Glassflower (Member # 17950) on :
i Tell u wot....you r all a breath of fresh air....your reaction to everyday frustations cracks me up with a huge dose of cleverness and actually caring(your hubby A shud see the need by now for a new computer chair)(I myself have been making the most of a kids tricycle and its just not the same).......back to the topic of materialism....seems to me we all just want our daily bead but with the basics taken care of too...(and a notebook and the education to use it with lots of freedom of speech)....I dont think im asking for too much....How ever...and im nearly at my point....I can remember thinking once how much does it cost me to lay my head down upon this earth each night....????? I dont think I am materalistic but it's more than I think it should be....
Posted by Ayisha (Member # 4713) on :
New chair? i am sure we can stick a brick under it to stop it leaning and who needs wheels on it really? Posted by metinoot (Member # 17031) on :
quote:Originally posted by Mo Ning Min E: [B]Have you ever lived in the US to verify this yourself?[B/]
Have you been living in cave for the past 20 years???
So you haven't lived in the USA to verify if your mythical assumptions are true.
Classic hobbit dogma.
Posted by Ayisha (Member # 4713) on :
quote:Originally posted by metinoot:
quote:Originally posted by Mo Ning Min E: [B]Have you ever lived in the US to verify this yourself?[B/]
Have you been living in cave for the past 20 years???
So you haven't lived in the USA to verify if your mythical assumptions are true.
Classic hobbit dogma.
you haven't lived in Egypt or UK but you try to tell us what's what in both, classic psycho! Posted by metinoot (Member # 17031) on :
quote:Originally posted by Ayisha:
quote:Originally posted by metinoot:
quote:Originally posted by Mo Ning Min E: [B]Have you ever lived in the US to verify this yourself?[B/]
Have you been living in cave for the past 20 years???
So you haven't lived in the USA to verify if your mythical assumptions are true.
Classic hobbit dogma.
you haven't lived in Egypt or UK but you try to tell us what's what in both, classic psycho!
When have I ever claimed to know about the UK, moreso than actual UK residents. Provide a hyperlink to the post.
Secondly who in the hell pays 17LE for 2LE worth of veggies?
Posted by Ayisha (Member # 4713) on :
quote:Originally posted by metinoot:
quote:Originally posted by Ayisha:
quote:Originally posted by metinoot:
quote:Originally posted by Mo Ning Min E: [B]Have you ever lived in the US to verify this yourself?[B/]
Have you been living in cave for the past 20 years???
So you haven't lived in the USA to verify if your mythical assumptions are true.
Classic hobbit dogma.
you haven't lived in Egypt or UK but you try to tell us what's what in both, classic psycho!
When have I ever claimed to know about the UK, moreso than actual UK residents. Provide a hyperlink to the post.
it starts a few pages back where you accused Yorkie of 'showing her privies' on her pic where you could see her knee and accused her of being married because she was wearing a ring on her left hand, and 'advertising' for a man on ES by 'showing her privies'.
quote:Secondly who in the hell pays 17LE for 2LE worth of veggies?
Again you know more about the price of veg in Egypt than me do you? If you can get Kg tomatoes for 2LE now, not including garlic, cucumber and green peppers, then please provide an address where as proof. Posted by Mo Ning Min E (Member # 681) on :
OK. i'll make it very simple for you. All my siblings live in the USA. But that is irrelevent. Contrary to your belief, just as we do not need a time machine to to study history, we do not need to actually travel the length and breadth of a place interviewing every citizen to know something about a place. You may or may not have noticed that beginning in 2007 the world began to enter a period of recession, [I'm sure you can google this, if you haven't heard of it] This began in the USA, and partly as a direct result of 'irrational exhuberance' with credit facilities, [both corporate and personal]plus US/China trade deficits, and a National 'debt' that would make your eyes water if you thought any US government ever intended to service this loan, and since that time, the rest of the world have been painfully reminded, over and over again, from Alan Greenspan [google him dear] Ben Bernanke, the IMF, even bloody Oprah, that this is the result of trying to have a materialistic consumer society. Especially one that exports hardly anything except weapons and media. Poor in the US equals BAD. You should know this. Remember the health care debate? Most countries [people, citizens] would be proud to announce that they provide healthcare for the poor, this is a FACT. In the US the very idea was OVERWHELMINGLY greeted with horror. 'Junkies, and [eek!] 'single moms'! Can you as a normal average citizen begin to grasp how AMAZED we all were at this reaction. How telling it was? No European that I know of would openly ask for the denial of healthcare [for God's sake!] to the disadvantaged. Even Marie Antoinette said 'Let them eat cake' she didn't say 'Let the lazy trash die in the streets'. This is not a personal attack, just about every American I have ever met, I found to be charming and fun. I assume that this is not because the many Americans I know travel more than most. But even a ten year old can tell you that American values are overwhelmingly, intrinsically involved with 'ownership'. Stuff. Materialistic. Not psychopaths, murderers, not Devil worshippers, not Aliens from Mars. Just materialistic for generations. I don't even think of it as an insult. Just a fact. And I'm pretty sure your response will be along the lines of 'You Brits are just plain jealous, because we got more ...., better ... stuff...'
Posted by Laura (Member # 879) on :
Ayisha, I paid 8 LE for a kilo of tomatoes (wasn't even allowed to select the ones I wanted) day before yesterday. Had to throw out about a third of them Posted by Questionmarks (Member # 12336) on :
Sop, wasted more then an hour reading old posts. :)It's the same as with any board, majority of members doesn't post anymore because the subject ( in this case Egypt) isn't part of their lifes anymore...
Posted by Ayisha (Member # 4713) on :
quote:Originally posted by Laura: Ayisha, I paid 8 LE for a kilo of tomatoes (wasn't even allowed to select the ones I wanted) day before yesterday. Had to throw out about a third of them
They were 6LE here couple of days ago Laura, and green peppers were 6LE too! I did buy a scabby looking bunch of spring onions (green onions/scallions) for 0.50 piastres though Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
Who in the hell pays 17le for 2le of veg???
PEOPLE LIVING IN EGYPT
cuckoo!
Posted by anthropos (Member # 9410) on :
The funny part is that my husband is not materialistic in that he wants to buy stuff for himself, he just wants to accumulate money and have the status "RICH". He never wants to be good to himself or to us, we are just supposed to wear second hand clothes and have second hand stuff. Sure he has now a little bit of money in the bank but we are not allowed to enjoy life. Actually he is not materialistic, he is just cheap. That is the right word.
Posted by Laura (Member # 879) on :
Who in the hell pays 17le for 2le of veg???
Is this a carry-over from another thread? Has to be.
Posted by Laura (Member # 879) on :
quote:Originally posted by anthropos: The funny part is that my husband is not materialistic in that he wants to buy stuff for himself, he just wants to accumulate money and have the status "RICH". He never wants to be good to himself or to us, we are just supposed to wear second hand clothes and have second hand stuff. Sure he has now a little bit of money in the bank but we are not allowed to enjoy life. Actually he is not materialistic, he is just cheap. That is the right word.
Don't know your husband at all, but is it just possible he is saving for the future, and all the expenses that come from having children?
Posted by anthropos (Member # 9410) on :
Yes that is the idea. Of course it is good. But it is also hard for me as a mother to have to accept to buy used clothes for my children when there is money to buy the best. Maybe he would think I am materialistic here, I don't know. He doesn't even want to buy NEW SHOES!!! And he asks what everything costs and sometimes I feel he is too cheap to buy the groceries. He thinks about every penny. It is so annoying because it consumes him.
Posted by stayingput (Member # 14989) on :
The personality trait or value or element of his character or whatever we could call it is there, so why not support and encourage him? If he wants to buy and sell, honey let him buy and sell.
It's a skill. Maybe, if he gets good at it, it could lead to a good business.
Who knows, if he's thing is gold and jewels, your personal bling quotient might just increase?
Sorry, maybe I'm not reading this correctly but I just don't see the problem.
Posted by stayingput (Member # 14989) on :
quote:Originally posted by anthropos: Yes that is the idea. Of course it is good. But it is also hard for me as a mother to have to accept to buy used clothes for my children when there is money to buy the best. Maybe he would think I am materialistic here, I don't know. He doesn't even want to buy NEW SHOES!!! And he asks what everything costs and sometimes I feel he is too cheap to buy the groceries. He thinks about every penny. It is so annoying because it consumes him.
Oh, okay. Now I understand a little more. There is nothing wrong with wanting the best for your family and it is not being materialistic. It's human nature and part and parcel to being a mother.
Maybe you should have that talk about foot funk and refuse to accept potential health threats into your home. Used shoes? Never.
Posted by Dilemma (Member # 16672) on :
I agree stayingput.
Posted by anthropos (Member # 9410) on :
He is actually good at selling and if he could make it into a good business that would be awesome, honestly! But I don't want to be the one suffering here. I want to be able to buy new wool/silk clothes for children for winter, new Ecco or timberland wintershoes, waterproof gloves etc. Btw we live in the north. But he is not willing to spend the money for that so my children have to use used stuff. I hate it.
Posted by stayingput (Member # 14989) on :
quote:Originally posted by anthropos: He is actually good at selling and if he could make it into a good business that would be awesome, honestly!
Good! Let supporting your husband's business ventures be a priority in your marriage. Make an effort to do it and you will see a huge difference in the quality of your relationship.
Can you tell I've been through this?
quote:Originally posted by anthropos: But I don't want to be the one suffering here. I want to be able to buy new wool/silk clothes for children for winter, new Ecco or timberland wintershoes, waterproof gloves etc. Btw we live in the north. But he is not willing to spend the money for that so my children have to use used stuff. I hate it.
Then it's time for a sit down, face-to-face, heart-to-heart talk. Explain to him that while you appreciate that he supports his family (this is true, is it not?) you would like him to think about the quality of the outcome (clothes that fall to pieces in the wash, etc.) and gently suggest he might invest in better garments so that he doesn't have to buy them so frequently.
It's never what you say, it's how you say it.
Posted by anthropos (Member # 9410) on :
Good point stayingput thank you for the advice.
Sometimes I just buy stuff for the kids and I don't tell him about it. Usually he doesn't notice. He would notice new shoes though.
Posted by Momma_Dukez (Member # 16037) on :
quote:Originally posted by anthropos: my husband thinks constantly about money, how to make it, how to save it, how to make more... when he speaks to his family all they talk about is "kam.....kam...."...the price of stuff and how to organize some projects. His first thoughts always turns to money. friend had an accident at work and his first reaction was "he will get compensation!" not is he doing OK? I am really fed up with this kind of thinking, especially because he is actually quite poor nonetheless (hehe). But I feel he is so materialistic. All he is interested in is the new iphone, gold, diamonds, if something is worth something. Doesn't matter what, just as long as he can sell it. Is this an Egyptian trend? Or just my husband?
No, its an Egyptian trend that I myself find very disgusting. My ex was like that...his father used to tell him all the time, 'you hold the dollar so close to your eyes that you cant see anything else around you!'
they live, breathe and dream money. If money had long hair and a kuss, they'd marry it.
My ex husbands uncle is married to a Morrocan woman my age and she said that all Egyptians care about is money. they will make themselves live like total sh*t just to save money.
but, in the long run, it ends up biting them in the ass.
ive been around these people since my early teens and seen lots of it. they hurt people for money. they are misers too. then when the day comes when they have made thei green, they have gone and pissed off so many people that they are rich yes, but very ALONE.
I have seen so many egyptians marry older western women, the women who help them make all this money, then years later she finds that he went and got himself an egyptian wife and kids back home...all obtained during his marriage to HER.
my ex's uncle Alaa did it. He married this really heavy older woman when he was a dishwasher and she was a waitress. she helped him open a diner. they had 2 kids. 5 years ago, Alaa suckered my ex out of $30,000 and so he went and whipped out photos of Alaa's new egyptian wife and baby to her as revenge.
When I worked in Alaa's diner as a teen, there was this chef named Nabil. (we all called him billy). He was married to a waitress named Dottie. Another older, yet quite pretty, woman.
Him and Dottie lived like dirt so Nabil could save money. They opened a restaurant. Well about 8 years ago, there was this big huge thing where Nabil suckered a co owner out of money. So what did the co owner do? Ratted Nabil out to Dottie and let her know he had went back to Egypt on a visit 3 years prior, married a young Egyptian girl and they had two kids...while he was married to Dottie for over ten yrs.
My ex's brother married a very ugly and very fat 38 yr old woman when he was only 20. Well, they just opened up a restuarant. He is trying to go back to Cairo, and I recently had to vouch for him at immigration. My ex told me 'of course he wants a young wife and kids (this woman had a hysterectomy after 2 kids) but he has to get his business!
My own ex is now with a 50 yr old women whose kids are crackheads. When we got a divorce, he said to me that we can get back together after 3 yrs when he got his business built, then he can sell it and we can go back to egypt. i told him once hes out that door theres no way im waiting for him....and he left anyway. this women is fed to teeth with him. in one yr, he is gonna sell the business, leave HER with the debts and fly back home forever.
i said it once, ill say its more...WATCH THESE MEN!!! MONEY IS THE ONLY THING THAT THEY LIVE FOR! most of you women here just know the egyptian way cuz your husbands that you met. i know it because ive lived in this culture since i was 12. i seen things you will NEVER see........yet you all notice and ask about.
why do u think they hop online in egypt and hunt down older western women to marry? because there is a shortage of females in egypt? because they dont like egyptian women? no and NO! its because they cant afford to marry the woman they want to marry in egypt. trust me, they ALL have the one egyptian girl they are in love with and cant marry because they got NO money. so how do they marry her? they have to find a way to get into the states, make money, and go back with much to offer her PLUS by now he is an egyptian citizen which means big respect over there.
none of them want to stay in the west forever! none of them want to be married to an older woman forever and not have his children speaking and living egypt!
dont you women get it by now!
when i go there, all i hear is the american dream this....and how they share ideas of how to gain wealth to bring back home.
its all about the MONEY! marriage and all!
however my ex's family is pissed off big time at him for what he did to me. everytime him and aleya go thee, i have to hear stories from aleya and get phone calls from his sister rahab (who is like my bff), of how the family is fighting with him for leaving and bringing this old hag to their home. his father moves out of the house each time he goes there because hes so disgusted with his son.
and this is something that all the families feel...yet they smile in the face of the older wife cuz after all, she IS the reason they now have a better lifestyle!
you know how many western union receipts I found hidden in the attic after he left? receipts of $1000 and more sent every month to cairo! while he made me and aleya live in poverty!? i once found $10,000 hidden away in the house...at the same time he made me go on WIC just to buy formula for our newborn baby cuz he was too cheap to buy it! when i was pregnant...he made me work full time up to 2 days before the due date. he would take all my money then refused to buy groceries. i was literally a starving pregnant woman who ended up going to her moms house for dinner at night.
it got so bad, my dad had enough and ripped my ex out of his car and beat his ass up in the street.
look, long story short, they are experts at living a double life.
Posted by metinoot (Member # 17031) on :
quote:Originally posted by Mo Ning Min E: OK. i'll make it very simple for you. All my siblings live in the USA. But that is irrelevent. Contrary to your belief, just as we do not need a time machine to to study history, we do not need to actually travel the length and breadth of a place interviewing every citizen to know something about a place. You may or may not have noticed that beginning in 2007 the world began to enter a period of recession, [I'm sure you can google this, if you haven't heard of it] This began in the USA, and partly as a direct result of 'irrational exhuberance' with credit facilities, [both corporate and personal]plus US/China trade deficits, and a National 'debt' that would make your eyes water if you thought any US government ever intended to service this loan, and since that time, the rest of the world have been painfully reminded, over and over again, from Alan Greenspan [google him dear] Ben Bernanke, the IMF, even bloody Oprah, that this is the result of trying to have a materialistic consumer society. Especially one that exports hardly anything except weapons and media. Poor in the US equals BAD. You should know this. Remember the health care debate? Most countries [people, citizens] would be proud to announce that they provide healthcare for the poor, this is a FACT. In the US the very idea was OVERWHELMINGLY greeted with horror. 'Junkies, and [eek!] 'single moms'! Can you as a normal average citizen begin to grasp how AMAZED we all were at this reaction. How telling it was? No European that I know of would openly ask for the denial of healthcare [for God's sake!] to the disadvantaged. Even Marie Antoinette said 'Let them eat cake' she didn't say 'Let the lazy trash die in the streets'. This is not a personal attack, just about every American I have ever met, I found to be charming and fun. I assume that this is not because the many Americans I know travel more than most. But even a ten year old can tell you that American values are overwhelmingly, intrinsically involved with 'ownership'. Stuff. Materialistic. Not psychopaths, murderers, not Devil worshippers, not Aliens from Mars. Just materialistic for generations. I don't even think of it as an insult. Just a fact. And I'm pretty sure your response will be along the lines of 'You Brits are just plain jealous, because we got more ...., better ... stuff...'
Still this sounds like a load of crap.
Americans by and large are not materialistic. You just want them to be so you can feel superior to them in some manner.
Its okay I understand there are tons of positives about Americans and not everyone is going to appreciate any good in Americans.
Its okay, at least you don't live in America and thats the blessing!
Posted by Ayisha (Member # 4713) on :
quote:Originally posted by metinoot: Still this sounds like a load of crap.
Americans by and large are not materialistic.
so you know sweet FA about UK, sweet FA about Egypt and also sweet FA about America. You need to get out more sono. Posted by anthropos (Member # 9410) on :
Momma Dukez I am in shock having read your post.
Now I am even getting paranoid as well because I am not allowed to ask about his past. He always says "my past is my own".
hmmm...
Posted by *Dalia* (Member # 13012) on :
quote:Originally posted by anthropos: Sure he has now a little bit of money in the bank but we are not allowed to enjoy life.
But it is also hard for me as a mother to have to accept to buy used clothes for my children when there is money to buy the best.
I don't understand why you are using expressions like he is "not allowing" you to enjoy life or that you "have to accept" to buy used clothes for your kids.
Who is forcing you to accept all this? Why do you allow him to assume control over your life? Posted by Mrs Hassan (Member # 15069) on :
Normally I would not respond to something like this but here I go................I am assuming that your living in Egypt and not anywhere else? that anthrops does not work? and he works and brings in the money? If this is the case, why not ask him for an allowance each week, or if this is not going to happen, then ask for little extra at a time when paying for anything and keep the extra. With the extra you could save by doing something like gamaya. people maybe in your area give money to one person each month and all this money goes to each of the person's who is in the plan. each month, so for eg: if you save 500 egp and there are 10 of you in this plan you could take 5000 egp in a lump sum. This way you have money for your kids...
However if you are both working, then share the living expenses etc.. and save some of your own money, dont tell him exactly what you earn... women do keep certain secrets in marriage you know
My husband has certain traits of saving money, but thanks god, he also agrees we need to enjoy the life as well. I do tend to buy the kids stuff that he may not agree with or feel is a waste, so I make it him take them out when they need anything, then he appreciates what kids and things for kids cost...... (Oh and by the way I tend not to shop in the big Malls, I'm a souk kind of gal!)
Posted by *Dalia* (Member # 13012) on :
quote:Originally posted by Mrs Hassan: I am assuming that your living in Egypt and not anywhere else? that anthrops does not work?
They live in her homecountry and she works.
Posted by samaka (Member # 9228) on :
quote:Originally posted by Momma_Dukez:
quote:Originally posted by anthropos: my husband thinks constantly about money, how to make it, how to save it, how to make more... when he speaks to his family all they talk about is "kam.....kam...."...the price of stuff and how to organize some projects. His first thoughts always turns to money. friend had an accident at work and his first reaction was "he will get compensation!" not is he doing OK? I am really fed up with this kind of thinking, especially because he is actually quite poor nonetheless (hehe). But I feel he is so materialistic. All he is interested in is the new iphone, gold, diamonds, if something is worth something. Doesn't matter what, just as long as he can sell it. Is this an Egyptian trend? Or just my husband?
No, its an Egyptian trend that I myself find very disgusting. My ex was like that...his father used to tell him all the time, 'you hold the dollar so close to your eyes that you cant see anything else around you!'
they live, breathe and dream money. If money had long hair and a kuss, they'd marry it.
My ex husbands uncle is married to a Morrocan woman my age and she said that all Egyptians care about is money. they will make themselves live like total sh*t just to save money.
but, in the long run, it ends up biting them in the ass.
ive been around these people since my early teens and seen lots of it. they hurt people for money. they are misers too. then when the day comes when they have made thei green, they have gone and pissed off so many people that they are rich yes, but very ALONE.
I have seen so many egyptians marry older western women, the women who help them make all this money, then years later she finds that he went and got himself an egyptian wife and kids back home...all obtained during his marriage to HER.
my ex's uncle Alaa did it. He married this really heavy older woman when he was a dishwasher and she was a waitress. she helped him open a diner. they had 2 kids. 5 years ago, Alaa suckered my ex out of $30,000 and so he went and whipped out photos of Alaa's new egyptian wife and baby to her as revenge.
When I worked in Alaa's diner as a teen, there was this chef named Nabil. (we all called him billy). He was married to a waitress named Dottie. Another older, yet quite pretty, woman.
Him and Dottie lived like dirt so Nabil could save money. They opened a restaurant. Well about 8 years ago, there was this big huge thing where Nabil suckered a co owner out of money. So what did the co owner do? Ratted Nabil out to Dottie and let her know he had went back to Egypt on a visit 3 years prior, married a young Egyptian girl and they had two kids...while he was married to Dottie for over ten yrs.
My ex's brother married a very ugly and very fat 38 yr old woman when he was only 20. Well, they just opened up a restuarant. He is trying to go back to Cairo, and I recently had to vouch for him at immigration. My ex told me 'of course he wants a young wife and kids (this woman had a hysterectomy after 2 kids) but he has to get his business!
My own ex is now with a 50 yr old women whose kids are crackheads. When we got a divorce, he said to me that we can get back together after 3 yrs when he got his business built, then he can sell it and we can go back to egypt. i told him once hes out that door theres no way im waiting for him....and he left anyway. this women is fed to teeth with him. in one yr, he is gonna sell the business, leave HER with the debts and fly back home forever.
i said it once, ill say its more...WATCH THESE MEN!!! MONEY IS THE ONLY THING THAT THEY LIVE FOR! most of you women here just know the egyptian way cuz your husbands that you met. i know it because ive lived in this culture since i was 12. i seen things you will NEVER see........yet you all notice and ask about.
why do u think they hop online in egypt and hunt down older western women to marry? because there is a shortage of females in egypt? because they dont like egyptian women? no and NO! its because they cant afford to marry the woman they want to marry in egypt. trust me, they ALL have the one egyptian girl they are in love with and cant marry because they got NO money. so how do they marry her? they have to find a way to get into the states, make money, and go back with much to offer her PLUS by now he is an egyptian citizen which means big respect over there.
none of them want to stay in the west forever! none of them want to be married to an older woman forever and not have his children speaking and living egypt!
dont you women get it by now!
when i go there, all i hear is the american dream this....and how they share ideas of how to gain wealth to bring back home.
its all about the MONEY! marriage and all!
however my ex's family is pissed off big time at him for what he did to me. everytime him and aleya go thee, i have to hear stories from aleya and get phone calls from his sister rahab (who is like my bff), of how the family is fighting with him for leaving and bringing this old hag to their home. his father moves out of the house each time he goes there because hes so disgusted with his son.
and this is something that all the families feel...yet they smile in the face of the older wife cuz after all, she IS the reason they now have a better lifestyle!
you know how many western union receipts I found hidden in the attic after he left? receipts of $1000 and more sent every month to cairo! while he made me and aleya live in poverty!? i once found $10,000 hidden away in the house...at the same time he made me go on WIC just to buy formula for our newborn baby cuz he was too cheap to buy it! when i was pregnant...he made me work full time up to 2 days before the due date. he would take all my money then refused to buy groceries. i was literally a starving pregnant woman who ended up going to her moms house for dinner at night.
it got so bad, my dad had enough and ripped my ex out of his car and beat his ass up in the street.
look, long story short, they are experts at living a double life.
MD this is the best post on ES I have read in a long time. Sadly, it is so true of the majority of Egyptian men.
Posted by Mo Ning Min E (Member # 681) on :
Samaka. have to agree with you. Excellent post MD, i will certainly read your stuff more carefully in future. It is a story you hear so often. God knows how families even tacitly collude with their 'proud Egyptian' sons to behave like this. 'Haram' doesn't even cover it, does it? Brings shame on these people. How on earth do they pray????
Posted by Miss_Tigerlily (Member # 3567) on :
What are you expecting if you hang out with scum???
MD, why were you never able to bag an educated and wealthy (of course ) Arab??????
Posted by Exiiled (Member # 17278) on :
I'll share about marriage finances. First a little background which I think is necessary because I think employment/income as well as age plays a big role in the way people handle their finances. I'm in my early 30s and my wife is younger. We both don't work, but we are fine financially.
An allowance for both of us is very important. We both learned that it is fair when our own money is used for things that we like individually. Straight up I am a spender and if there is anyone who would infringe on our overall budget it would be me. I can easily spend $200-$300 per weekend night, although $100-$150 is average. A jug of beer and a plate of fresh oysters for example is $25, and I can easily have 2 such orders. Then there's taxi one way to down town @ $7 but coming home after midnight it is double. Then there's taxis when going from place to place downtown, they almost never use the meter and each small trip is like $5-$8. Add in more beer and a fresh seafood late night dinner and you can see how easily money goes. This doesn't even include buying something here and there.
So for tonight as in Friday night which is only a few hours away, my allowance is all used up because I unwisely spent my allowance the first three weeks of the month. I think I have like $50 - $75 left. So this is where I can be bad and infringe on the budget. I can ask my wife for money from our cash at home, or I can use the ATM and withdraw money. Either way I would be infringing and I don't think I could do that because just yesterday my wife commended me for not spending money for an entire day.
My point is very simple. The “home” should have a budget including savings if that is where you are in your lives. But money/allowance should be allocated to both husband and wife. The allowance money could be used for whatever the person chooses. If the OP wants to buy herself some nice clothes then so be it. I guess it's more complicated with children but the OP should not have to use her money to get them things they need. The kids too should have an allowance to get them things the OP wants because it would be unfair to use the OP money for those things.
So for the evening I have no idea what I'm going to do but most likely I will chill at home. Maybe go out and bowl a game or two. Maybe ask for an advance from next month's allowance. HA! HA! That would be the stupidest thing because same time next month I'll be in the same situation as I am now.
Anyway that's how we do things. We allocate money for our home budget, traveling, holidays(eid) and even for when we go out together to dinner or whatever and we deduct that from the home budget. But when it comes to my spending or my wife buying a new dress/shoes or whatever, all those expenses are paid from our own allowances.
I don't know how people might perceive such a budget, but ever since we started it and done away with indiscriminate spending our budget stabilized. I think it is vital for the each partner to have that spending money in their pockets. I mean we're humans, and when an allowance is in to play it eliminates many problems, such as the one discussed in this thread.
Time for my broke ass to check out the TV guide. Posted by Miss_Tigerlily (Member # 3567) on :
Rather a materialistic husband at work than a lazy bum on the couch at home.
Posted by Ayisha (Member # 4713) on :
quote:Originally posted by Mo Ning Min E: Samaka. have to agree with you. Excellent post MD, i will certainly read your stuff more carefully in future.
you should, there are occasionally some wise words comes out of MD's keyboard!
quote:It is a story you hear so often.
yes, but not only in Egypt or Egyptians
quote:God knows how families even tacitly collude with their 'proud Egyptian' sons to behave like this. 'Haram' doesn't even cover it, does it? Brings shame on these people. How on earth do they pray????
Some are taught it's not haram to rip off a foreigner, yes by their parents who pray 5 times a day! Posted by Questionmarks (Member # 12336) on :
So, for some reason your parents and the parents of your wife as well, never had to teach both of you that effort is needed in order to reach a goal, Exiiled? Or don't I understand you well enough? You and your wife both get an allowance big enough to cover all expenses even rather luxurious ones? In fact the only thing you two have to keep in mind is that the allowance is, however exquisite, limited to a certain amount? Is this for the rest of your life? If you should have children, how would you raise them? It's a quite extraordinary situation...
Posted by samaka (Member # 9228) on :
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Miss_Tigerlily: [QB] What are you expecting if you hang out with scum???
Interestingly, I was talking to one of my Egyptian friends the other day (she is 33, has three lovely kids and a PhD in Architecture.) She said, "If only Egyptian men didn't let this country down so badly!" (We were talking about a man with a prestigious position in Cairo.)
It is not just the Saedis, it is a problem with the men across the whole of Egyptian society. I swear if the educated women were in control of Egypt, it wouldn't be Third World, it would be a country Egyptians could be proud of.
Posted by Miss_Tigerlily (Member # 3567) on :
Lol if Egypt is a third world country by all means I wanna live there!! Posted by Exiiled (Member # 17278) on :
quote:Originally posted by Questionmarks: So, for some reason your parents and the parents of your wife as well, never had to teach both of you that effort is needed in order to reach a goal, Exiiled? Or don't I understand you well enough? You and your wife both get an allowance big enough to cover all expenses even rather luxurious ones? In fact the only thing you two have to keep in mind is that the allowance is, however exquisite, limited to a certain amount? Is this for the rest of your life? If you should have children, how would you raise them? It's a quite extraordinary situation...
Our total budget including my wife's allowance comes from my income. My wife on occasions (eid, birthday, etc) receives money from her family, those are just merely monetary gifts. I really don't think that our lifestyle and budget differs from anyone else. The only difference is me as a breadwinner does not have to work for a salary. I do have plans to set up my own business because too much free time, sometimes gets me in trouble. But basically that is my life. I could also get another degree and that's what I wanted originally to be a “student for life”, but I'm more inclined to start my own business, I think to earn my own hard earned money would be cool, I know I could do it.
If a child comes along, our goal is to give him/her a good education and we'll take it from there.
Posted by Questionmarks (Member # 12336) on :
It's pretty different as what I am used to, Exiiled. Even members of the royal family, as a kid, have to offer something ( their effort) in order to receive something. You know, it feels good to work for a salary high enough to lead the life you like to live. On the other side, education can also be a challenge... May I ask what your father teached you as a child? What did you have to do to get his appreciation?
Posted by anthropos (Member # 9410) on :
What is the big deal Questionmarks? Obviously Exiled is filthy rich and doesn't need to work. To say that working is good for you is just us being jealous of those that are so lucky to not have to work. I wish I was in his position.
Posted by Dubai Girl (Member # 15488) on :
quote:Originally posted by anthropos: What is the big deal Questionmarks? Obviously Exiled is filthy rich and doesn't need to work. To say that working is good for you is just us being jealous of those that are so lucky to not have to work. I wish I was in his position.
I disagree anthropos, I know many people dream of not having to go to work everyday and to have a comfortable lifestyle without having to work, it sounds nice and it is for a bit but then it gets boring. I have always worked full time and supported myself. Since November 2009 I have not worked and my husband has supported me. To be fair it' because I was pregnant that I quit my job as I had to travel around the gulf a lot and was concerned about flying so much when pregnant. I could have got another job, but we didn't really need the extra income as Sam was doing well with his company. For the first couple of months it was great but then it became boring. I was living in Dubai, the lifestyle over there is very nice, we had our own swimming pool etc. lots of nice restaurants and malls but there really is only so much eating out and shopping you can do.
When i was a child we didnt have much money but my parents always worked. i had to "work" for my pocket money, doing chores etc. I was always horse mad and my dream was to have a horse of my own. My dad said he would match whatever I managed to save towards buying a horse. From the age of 12 upwards I had various part time jobs from newspaper girl to dog walker at a boarding kennels to cleaning out other peoples horse stables and after three year I had saved enough to buy myself horse. I still remember that feeling and considered it to be my biggest achievement for a long time.
I think we, as humans need to work to feel valued, we all need to feel as though we are achieving things and have our place in the world and i think it's a great satisfaction when you get your pay cheque each month knowing that you have earned it. I worked to targets so my salary always depended how much effort I put in.
I miss that feeling. I am going back to work full time in January 2011 even though I know it will be hard to leave my daughter I know i have to do it for me. We could manage on one salary but we want to buy a house in the UK and we already have a mortgage in Cairo. We want to be able to put our daughter into private education so we both need to work to achieve these goals.
I am s proud of my husband. He has been in the UK since this June and it took him 6 weeks to find a job.He was looking everyday until he found one. We were prepared to move anywhere in the country if needs be, but he found one in Newcastle which is not too far.It was an adjustment for him to be an employee again as he is used to being his own boss. He has been forunate to get a job in his field (structural steel) and has walked straight into a management position with a multnational company.That was pure luck because his particular skill set is so specific but he was prepared to start at the bottom if he had to. He leaves for work at 6.15am and comes in around 7.30pm and this is 6 days a week. He never complains because he has so many things he wants to achieve. He has one of the strongest work ethics in anyone I ever met and his drive and ambition is one of the things I find most attractive about him. I know for a fact there are other women on this forum who are married to equally hardworking egyptian men.
Posted by Miss_Tigerlily (Member # 3567) on :
Amen to that, DG. Excellent post. Posted by Dubai Girl (Member # 15488) on :
Just to add....I think staying home with a child/children is much harder than going out to work at a job, my baby is only three months and she is now starting to cry when i leave the room. I am having to learn to do stuff one handed (grace being in my other arm) and I dont know how people with several children manage!She barely naps in the day and some days I barely have time to clean my teeth!! (I am breastfeeding and she never goes longer than 2 hours between feeds so my life is broken into slots between feeds)Between the baby and Daisy our kalba baladi we brought from Dubai they take up all my time as the dog is still young and demands attention. Roll on January!!! I am lucky that my mother and my favourite auntie are going to split the childcare between them so I can work. Daycare is extortionate in the UK. It costs around 600 GBP per month per child for full time care!
Posted by Miss_Tigerlily (Member # 3567) on :
DG, I went back to work when my oldest children were only 2.5 and 1 year old. The salary at NATO was great but the whole situation was too hard to handle. I suffered and I felt so guilty of leaving my babies in care with somebody else. I did not see them in the morning when I had to leave to go to work and I came home about two hours before they had to go to bed in the evening. I felt I was not in their lives. We decided to have another baby so when it was time to deliver I stayed home permanently.... and our family grew since then even more. I am grateful that I have been able to make this decision. We are not financially strained; neither I miss sitting my time up in an office. My kids mean everything to me - and my dog. Ouch forgot to add hubby. Posted by Dubai Girl (Member # 15488) on :
TL from what I have heard from friends with children the guilt of being at work while someone else takes care of them is one of the most difficult things for a mother. I am hoping that it wont be so bad for me because she will be with my mother for three days a weel and they have a lovely bond, my mother came to my house everyday to see grace for the first two months and she is in spain now and texts me every day asking how she is and because my mother talks and talks and talks to Grace she will be talking herself in no time!
Posted by Exiiled (Member # 17278) on :
Questionmarks – I'm sure you've heard the saying “not all fingers are alike.” This is the way that I choose to live my life and I love it. As far as what my dad instilled in his children, good grades/respect elders/usual stuff, that's what he instilled. I have brothers who pretty much work all day, that's their prerogative. I remember having a discussion with my brother about him traveling with me, his answer was he can't imagine a life where he doesn't go to the office everyday. I have another brother who only talks about business, my dad started him off, but I can say he made his own millions. His life now in turmoil, rocky marriage, my niece keeps nagging her parents about moving to live with me and my wife for a year or two, she thinks were "cool."
Anthropos – You're funny but I am not filthy rich. I would say I'm upper middle class.
Dubai Girl – I think life can get boring for anyone regardless if they work or don't. Personally I love not having to work. My dream to set up my own business is really because of a complex I have. I think that maybe I have to prove something. So to me it's about a challenge, although I know I don't have to prove anything to anyone. But it's there in the back of mind, so I will set out and do that.
I love to chill all day, waking up whenever, I love traveling, I travel flashpack throughout Cambodia in November. I'm trying to convince my wife for us to travel throughout south east asia on motorcycle. There is so much a person can do. I spent about three years of not working getting a graduate degree. There are a lot of exciting things and challenges one can do while not working. This is like 6th place we lived in past 6 years and that's about the only thing that annoys my wife. She wants one country, one home and that's that. Tomorrow we're going to the planetarium, hang out in KL's central park area, Sunday it's off to IKEA again, there are just many things to do. I've become a pro at not working, I think people who get bored are the ones who feel like a fish out a water. From me it would be the other way around.
But I am adamant about starting my own business, after all I did open a business from scratch in Cairo. And as teen was manager in one of my dad's business. Yes even as a teenager I had complete control on weekends and summers.
There was also a time when I didn't have anything for personal reasons. I was cool with that too, but now it's my income, my money. And what am I supposed to do. Go out get a job when I don't need one? Get bossed around, wake up at 7am to be at work by 9? That's not me, if I have to I would. If I wasn't living the life I wanted or if my wife was asking for things I couldn't provide, yes I'd go out there and apply for job after job.
So I guess it's what someone is comfortable with. I also get to take time and learn my cooking, tonight I might make Tum Khaa Khai. Later I'm hoping there's some live baseball. Posted by *Dalia* (Member # 13012) on :
Dubai Girl, I feel the same way about work as you do.
Posted by Shanta Qadeama (Member # 9889) on :
I don't think it's so much about having a 'job' in the normal sense of the word as having a 'focus' or something to interest you.
Some people are very able to fill their days with interesting things - whether it be reading, crafts, studying (with or without a formal course), going out on 'adventures' or whatever - while others completely turn to a braindead mush without the external stimulus of paid employment.
So if you have no formal employment, yet are able to do stimulating things by your own inner motivation - great. If, on the other hand, you start watching daytime TV at 9am and sit on the couch all day with Oprah Winfrey, Jerry Springer, '60 Minute Makeover', "location location location" etc etc, then your brain will be fried to a crisp within days.
When I quit work to go back to Uni full time to do my PhD (nature of my research meant I could 'work at home' most of the time), my golden rule was 'no tv before 6pm except weekends, bank holidays and official sick leave' and it has stood me in good stead.
It's different living here because life as we know is topsy turvy in Egypt so I have to do tricks like take whole days of no tv or no computer to balance things out. Although now I'm older, I'm more able to motivate myself than I used to be.
It also depends on the nature of your work. If you have interesting, professional type work or if you are someone happy with the work you do, then that's a big plus.
If, however, like many people you are stuck in a job you loathe and hate but feel you have no choice because of high unemployment, mouths to feed or whatever, then it's not so great having a job.
And big fat generalisation coming: I have found throughout my working life that men are very happy to sit and do nowt all day so long as they have a fancy title and a pay check, but a woman in the same situation will be looking around her office or whatever for things to do to occupy herself so it does depend on the possibility of doing that wherever you work. Women don't like being bored. Men seem to have a much greater tolerance for it.
A few weeks after I arrived here, I started to get extremely stressed because it would get to sundown and I would feel that I had achieved nothing, accomplished nothing, all day. Someone said to me "how can that be stressful?" Well believe me it is for someone like me - I have to give myself goals, targets, action lists etc to keep healthy and happy.
Posted by Exiiled (Member # 17278) on :
I liked the way Shanta Q put it. Explanatory but definitely objective. She placed an emphasis on motivation, and also discipline that people who don't work must eventually adhere too. Unfortunately for one reason or another society as evinced by some members here are unable grasp lifestyles that differ from what they're accustomed to. It's as if a person has to conform to the way they perceive life. I had a conversation with a gentlemen once, a man of leisure very much like myself, and he said when people ask him what he does for a living, he just lies, and says he's an accountant or some other mundane job. He realized that people in general must be able to identify with the person in order to eventually accept that person. Their minds must accept a person, if not, they place a big question mark on it, this in turn leads to labels being created by their minds to identify that person. These labels are often not very nice.
Posted by shalamar (Member # 16507) on :
moma dukes your post i hope opens up the eyes of those in need of waking up
Posted by stayingput (Member # 14989) on :
quote:Originally posted by Exiiled: Their minds must accept a person, if not, they place a big question mark on it, this in turn leads to labels being created by their minds to identify that person. These labels are often not very nice.
Standing and clapping, standing and clapping, standing and clapping!
That is people in general - a human trait.
In our need to make order out of what doesn't make sense, we categorize but not necessarily matching all of the characteristics.
For example:
Lerv stung western woman. Her Egyptian lerv must be one of those giggalos, just because he was Egyptian and left her.
It's not her fault.
She didn't understand the religion or the culture or the language and had nothing in common with him to begin with, other than they could both say each other's names, but it's his fault because he was Egyptian and he left her.
Classic ES label.
Posted by Questionmarks (Member # 12336) on :
quote:Originally posted by Exiiled: I liked the way Shanta Q put it. Explanatory but definitely objective. She placed an emphasis on motivation, and also discipline that people who don't work must eventually adhere too. Unfortunately for one reason or another society as evinced by some members here are unable grasp lifestyles that differ from what they're accustomed to. It's as if a person has to conform to the way they perceive life. I had a conversation with a gentlemen once, a man of leisure very much like myself, and he said when people ask him what he does for a living, he just lies, and says he's an accountant or some other mundane job. He realized that people in general must be able to identify with the person in order to eventually accept that person. Their minds must accept a person, if not, they place a big question mark on it, this in turn leads to labels being created by their minds to identify that person. These labels are often not very nice.
Yes, perhaps this makes sense. I thought about it, and it's strange because it has to do with feeling valued. It seems that feeling valued is connected with being succesfull in professional life. But why do people need to feel valued? Perhaps because they don't have enough selfesteem, and then somone couldintroduce himself as an accountant, while he isn't. I am managing the season finals at the moment, and yesterdaynight after the matches were played, all the tennis association members were chatting with each other and the subject was work. One man, guess he's around 60, quitted working because of a huge disagreement with his employer. Protected by law he received a large sum and decided to quit. He is at home while his wife is working fulltime. We tend to think about this kind of situations as a rather meaningless life. A man who is at home all day, cleaning the house, washin the laundry, cooking the food, that's not something to be jealous at for a man. It's okay for a woman, but not for a man. Of course it's not the right way to think, but that's how people think, here. My husband was at home for a few years, but he didn't feel right about it. To be clear: This is not about same fingers on one hand, or about jealousy or shortsightenedness. It's about common opinions, attitudes, way of life. Exiiled's way of living is unusual to me, and to most of my fellow compatriots, even the queen is working as I said earlier. That doesn't mean it's the one and only right way to live, I just want to understand. Where do you feel proud about? Or your parents? Don't they have any problems with this way of life? I cannot imagine that, when a father has worked all his life as a businessman, agrees in having a son needing financial support all his life, because he doesn't have plans to work. I would worry about him!
Posted by Questionmarks (Member # 12336) on :
quote:Originally posted by stayingput:
quote:Originally posted by Exiiled: Their minds must accept a person, if not, they place a big question mark on it, this in turn leads to labels being created by their minds to identify that person. These labels are often not very nice.
Standing and clapping, standing and clapping, standing and clapping!
That is people in general - a human trait.
In our need to make order out of what doesn't make sense, we categorize but not necessarily matching all of the characteristics.
For example:
Lerv stung western woman. Her Egyptian lerv must be one of those giggalos, just because he was Egyptian and left her.
It's not her fault.
She didn't understand the religion or the culture or the language and had nothing in common with him to begin with, other than they could both say each other's names, but it's his fault because he was Egyptian and he left her.
Classic ES label.
I don't know what 'lerv stung' means, but you're right about the cause of the that muched failed intercultural relationship: It will always be HIS fault, while she doesn't understand anything about their way of life. At the same time HE is doing exactly the same: their relationship failed because of exactly the same stereotypical characteristics as SHE uses to complain about HIM. And perhaps that's human...or perhaps it has to do with thinking levels... Exilled has choosed a total different way to live and it makes me curious. He still is in his 30's and I would like to know how he would feel about his life when he is 50, or 60 etc. His place in the family, in society... It doesn't mean anything negative...
Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
I want Exiileds life!
Dude, you can have mine which is ace but I wanna go backpacking in Cambodia!!! That sounds AWESOME.
I know many women here who don't have to work and not one of them complains about it... lucky flunkers!
Posted by Exiiled (Member # 17278) on :
quote:Originally posted by Questionmarks:
quote:Originally posted by Exiiled: I liked the way Shanta Q put it. Explanatory but definitely objective. She placed an emphasis on motivation, and also discipline that people who don't work must eventually adhere too. Unfortunately for one reason or another society as evinced by some members here are unable grasp lifestyles that differ from what they're accustomed to. It's as if a person has to conform to the way they perceive life. I had a conversation with a gentlemen once, a man of leisure very much like myself, and he said when people ask him what he does for a living, he just lies, and says he's an accountant or some other mundane job. He realized that people in general must be able to identify with the person in order to eventually accept that person. Their minds must accept a person, if not, they place a big question mark on it, this in turn leads to labels being created by their minds to identify that person. These labels are often not very nice.
Yes, perhaps this makes sense. I thought about it, and it's strange because it has to do with feeling valued. It seems that feeling valued is connected with being succesfull in professional life. But why do people need to feel valued? Perhaps because they don't have enough selfesteem, and then somone couldintroduce himself as an accountant, while he isn't. I am managing the season finals at the moment, and yesterdaynight after the matches were played, all the tennis association members were chatting with each other and the subject was work. One man, guess he's around 60, quitted working because of a huge disagreement with his employer. Protected by law he received a large sum and decided to quit. He is at home while his wife is working fulltime. We tend to think about this kind of situations as a rather meaningless life. A man who is at home all day, cleaning the house, washin the laundry, cooking the food, that's not something to be jealous at for a man. It's okay for a woman, but not for a man. Of course it's not the right way to think, but that's how people think, here. My husband was at home for a few years, but he didn't feel right about it. To be clear: This is not about same fingers on one hand, or about jealousy or shortsightenedness. It's about common opinions, attitudes, way of life. Exiiled's way of living is unusual to me, and to most of my fellow compatriots, even the queen is working as I said earlier. That doesn't mean it's the one and only right way to live, I just want to understand. Where do you feel proud about? Or your parents? Don't they have any problems with this way of life? I cannot imagine that, when a father has worked all his life as a businessman, agrees in having a son needing financial support all his life, because he doesn't have plans to work. I would worry about him!
You completely missed the point. It's not about feeling valued at all. The man opts to tell people he's an accountant because apparently he meets people like you who fail to accept and understand lifestyles that don't include work. I guess he's annoyed by having to explain his life. There's also the issue of contempt that some people have for people who are set for life. I'm sure when he meets open minded people and people he feels comfortable with he divulges the truth. It's not easy saying something like “I don't need to work” to strangers, but I personally found the title “man of leisure” to be somewhat okay, it's smoother that's for sure.
People such as myself as I have reiterated are just like everyone else minus work. We're not a secret society of some sort. Some have inherited money and live off it, some live off estates and trusts, some are born wealthy, some have property and live off the rent. One thing that I have observed however is that such people and I'm also speaking from experience, have matured a little slower than people who work. I believe this immaturity hails from lack of responsibility gained from work and career.
I know a young lady who has to be dragged out of bed in order to do anything before 6pm, but come evening she's a riot. I also know a dude who does nothing but watch hindi movies all day. Now these two might be seen as lost cases but I think it's lack of motivation and also lack of discipline as was pointed out by Shanta. They also need to grow up.
You say it's not about jealousy or “shortsightedness” but rather it's about “common opinions” and “way of life.” Such an attitude is one of intolerance, even if there is a consensus, because we are all different. Some people have been dealt a unique set of cards in life but each person is the star of his or her own life. Living to appease society is a mistake but you feel it's necessary as that's the normal way and apparently because the almighty Queen Beatrix does it too. You mention that I need financial support all my life, you are assuming that, and I understand because it's probably due to my vagueness. Try to understand that I have assets and I live off dividends from those assets, before two years ago yes it was direct support. But these assets are now mine and their value as well as the dividends appreciate. Should we have a child then I'll pass the assets to him/her.
My mom is always busting my ass. She basically believes that idle hands lead to trouble, and wants me to work so I can stay out of trouble or so trouble doesn't find me. She stresses a lot, she watches the news and sees flooding on TV and calls me, even though it's like 1000 miles away. She's a mom she worries, like all moms do.. My dad gave up. He tried everything in the book including disowning me at one point. We're cool now. Love that man.
Posted by Exiiled (Member # 17278) on :
quote:Originally posted by Cheekyferret: I want Exiileds life!
Dude, you can have mine which is ace but I wanna go backpacking in Cambodia!!! That sounds AWESOME.
I know many women here who don't have to work and not one of them complains about it... lucky flunkers!
Cheeky tells it like it is.
I am so looking forward to Cambodia especially Siam Reap and the river boat ride through the jungle to get there from Phnom Phen. Maybe even eat fried snake. ahaha NOT!!! I actually had to rebook the flight to November so I can be there quicker. Thankfully everything here has settled down, the condo is 80% furnished, adjusted well to new neighborhood, only thing left is to lease a car.
But yeah it's time to put on the backpack, guess what this backpack has in common with Cairo? I bought it years ago from Sports Mall in Mohandesseen. It had to sew some rips here and there but it's still great but it's perfect midsize backpack for a 2-3 week trip.
Posted by Mo Ning Min E (Member # 681) on :
I'm sorry TL, I'm sure you wrote with anger, and not thought, but your remark equating scum with poverty, and 'why didn't you find someone rich' really does make a point about materialism doesn't it? No RICH scum eh?
Posted by Miss_Tigerlily (Member # 3567) on :
quote:Originally posted by Mo Ning Min E: I'm sorry TL, I'm sure you wrote with anger, and not thought, but your remark equating scum with poverty, and 'why didn't you find someone rich' really does make a point about materialism doesn't it? No RICH scum eh?
Anger? No thought???
Reread MD's post and all you can think of is uneducated scum .
I am still puzzled why so many ladies complain about how things went wrong with their Egyptians when rationally thinking it all makes sense.
IMHO if you hang out with such losers and thieves don't be surprised if the path gets too hard to walk on one day. Enough bad stories are out for years and still each single woman believes it doesn't happen to her because her relationship is oh so special and love will conquer all - a love which is unfortunately only one-sided.
Really foreign women are only able to bag guys living on the poverty line which they find in and around the hotels while on vacation and wonder later on why they gotten taken for a nasty ride by them.
Now if a financially well-off Egyptian (which goes hand in hand with education and education is very expensive in Egypt) marries a foreign woman he really means it. He doesn't have to lie to get what he wants. A man like this won't go looking on the internet for a marriage match either. His family most likely suggested through connections and approved and there is no wife hiding involved, no visa hunting, no extortion of money etc. And believe me these cases happen rather rarely.
After all foreign ladies who fall in love with an exotic looking Mohamed on vacation should think twice what they are perhaps getting themselves into and have a change of heart that f.e. Paul from the nearby pub back home, not so exotic looking but honest in his intentions, isn't such a bad match after all.
So yes the social class which comes with MONEY is extremely important for Egyptians when the sign is set for marriage. That's why you don't find Egyptians marrying other Egyptians underneath their own social class. Only naive foreign women don't mind because they marry for love and then you read all the heartbreaking stories on ES and other internet sites.
Just remember ladies, we have the year 2010 and still thousands of Egyptians try each year to migrate illegally to the West with boats over the Mediterranean and risking their lives. That's how harsh it is. Poor Egyptians will try anything to improve their way of living including sham marriages.
Now if you pick a waiter from an Egyptian resort as your spouse and go through all the hurdles to get him a visa to your country and then when he's there you gotta support him and before long you realize he's not the person you thought he was, his sweet talking stops, he has no intention of working (because all what he would get anyway would be 'lower jobs' - really what was he expecting with his education????), his controlling behavior escalates and perhaps you find out he is already married back home or he intends to marry his cousin or another young lovely Muslima from his hometown within the next few years etc. In the end you just wished you could turn back the clock so you would have never met him - just keep in mind Tigerlily wrote about exactly that here on ES before.
Make yourself a favor and really really think hard and long about the pros and cons before you elect a spouse from Egypt (or any other developing country in this matter). There are not only language barriers and culture and religion differences to conquer but perhaps dealing with the Egyptian mentality as a whole is something what you might underestimate. Throw in a guy who sees you only as the golden ticket to the Western world and you are so doomed. Is it worth taking such a risk? Safe yourself the heartache and the drama.
Posted by Ayisha (Member # 4713) on :
so uneducated = scum educated = financially secure, not scum
I disagree. I have met scum with money and education and I have met decent people with no education and no money.
Posted by Miss_Tigerlily (Member # 3567) on :
quote:Originally posted by Ayisha: so uneducated = scum educated = financially secure, not scum
I disagree. I have met scum with money and education and I have met decent people with no education and no money.
And I am sure you have met many decent people with education and money and uneducated thieves who had no manners and conscience either as we all have but that's not the point here.
The point is that an Egyptian who has less education has less opportunities in his own country so he might go extreme ways to improve his lifestyle which includes entering marriage with a foreign woman for his own advantage. But I already wrote about this, see above.
Posted by Ayisha (Member # 4713) on :
quote:Originally posted by Miss_Tigerlily:
quote:Originally posted by Ayisha: so uneducated = scum educated = financially secure, not scum
I disagree. I have met scum with money and education and I have met decent people with no education and no money.
And I am sure you have met many decent people with education and money and uneducated thieves who had no manners and conscience either as we all have but that's not the point here.
The point is that an Egyptian who has less education has less opportunities in his own country so he might go extreme ways to improve his lifestyle which includes entering marriage with a foreign woman for his own advantage. But I already wrote about this, see above.
yes he might, as might anyone else in any other country.
Posted by anthropos (Member # 9410) on :
It is capitalism, consumerism, protestant Christianity and individualism that has made us think that we are only worth something if we are making money. I am speaking here from an Euro/American standpoint. I think that someone like Exiled is a breath of fresh air.
Posted by Questionmarks (Member # 12336) on :
I didn't give any personal opinion as that I don't understand and that I am willing to understand...
Posted by Questionmarks (Member # 12336) on :
quote:Originally posted by Ayisha:
quote:Originally posted by Miss_Tigerlily:
quote:Originally posted by Ayisha: so uneducated = scum educated = financially secure, not scum
I disagree. I have met scum with money and education and I have met decent people with no education and no money.
And I am sure you have met many decent people with education and money and uneducated thieves who had no manners and conscience either as we all have but that's not the point here.
The point is that an Egyptian who has less education has less opportunities in his own country so he might go extreme ways to improve his lifestyle which includes entering marriage with a foreign woman for his own advantage. But I already wrote about this, see above.
yes he might, as might anyone else in any other country.
Of course, it has to do with poverty. I can remember we were kind of shocked when a poor man in my own country told us about a stone he has sold someone, and made it look like it was a valuable stone, so that the buyer became greedy and insisted on buying it. It was a normal stone he had found in his garden.... In fact it's swindling, but he didn't see it that way. I guess you could see it the same way. There are even families considering the unequal marriage of their son as a sacrifice, as he should be a kind of martyr: He is offering his young life in order to get his family a better life. It just is an opportunity, and they can be taken...
Posted by anthropos (Member # 9410) on :
I agree Questionmarks and to be honest I totally understand why they do it and perhaps I even admire them a little. If it is not possible for you to get an education, a decent job and not even marry within your own social status because you cannot buy an apartment etc. then being able to "fool" a foreign woman into marrying them is by far the best choice for them. I honestly think that for many of them they have some feelings for those women, being Western is one attribute of them that is attractive, just as people in the West or anywhere consider good education, good family etc. to be good attributes even though those facts have nothing to do with their character. How often is the first question we put forward to other people "What do you do for a living?"
Posted by Exiiled (Member # 17278) on :
quote:Originally posted by Questionmarks: I didn't give any personal opinion as that I don't understand and that I am willing to understand...
You say that but your were sure quick to give an opinion about the “accountant” by labeling him as having no self esteem. I don't blame you questionmarks because I know your mentality was conditioned by your parents and society. We all know that as humans we are born on clean slate. The only two innate feelings we have as infants are fear of falling and fear of loud noises.
Everything else we learn through family and society. But sometimes family and society might retard our capacity to understand and accept people who are different. I'm not bashing society whether it's Western or Eastern nor am antisocial.
My point is very simple: Mankind is diverse and it's such a beautiful world because of that diversity. An intolerant viewpoint by society towards something/someone different shouldn't mean individuals must succumb and adhere to such intolerance. Peace-Out.
Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
That was post 666 Exiile... just an observation A very good post though.
I know some very educated stupid people so having a good education doesn't always indicate they have much common sense!!!
Exiiled, I have often found people who are well travelled are the most accepting and understanding of others. The University of Life - priceless.
As a person who is passionate about volunteering and charity work, you don't have to get a pay cheque to feel worthy and valued in life. Some of us get that great feeling just by giving time and quality of life to others. Posted by Exiiled (Member # 17278) on :
quote:Originally posted by Cheekyferret: That was post 666 Exiile... just an observation A very good post though.
I know some very educated stupid people so having a good education doesn't always indicate they have much common sense!!!
Exiiled, I have often found people who are well travelled are the most accepting and understanding of others. The University of Life - priceless.
As a person who is passionate about volunteering and charity work, you don't have to get a pay cheque to feel worthy and valued in life. Some of us get that great feeling just by giving time and quality of life to others.
“666” Hold up let me find a dictionary
I totally agree with you Cheeky. I'm glad you used the word “well traveled” because people who travel or visit only 1 or 2 places might actually hate those places and arrive at a distorted view of the word. I think when a person travels for prolonged periods of time they are bound to find not just the bad but also the good.
To actually delve into cultures, I know some people here despise Arabs and Muslims, but I know for a fact that some of them are some of the most beautiful hearted people. The same with Indians, Asians, Europeans, etc. I'm under the impression that Brits/Europeans are much kinder abroad, but I know it's because of my limited interaction with them in their own countries. I believe that.
Haven't done voluntary work in a while. I did love teaching Iraqi refugees English, I just get too caught up with my own BS, that I actually forget, becoming too selfish doing nothing. Good for you though and I hope you continue. Posted by metinoot (Member # 17031) on :
quote:Originally posted by Ayisha:
quote:Originally posted by metinoot: Still this sounds like a load of crap.
Americans by and large are not materialistic.
so you know sweet FA about UK, sweet FA about Egypt and also sweet FA about America. You need to get out more sono.
Never claimed to know anything substantial about the UK, you on the otherhand make numerous claims about America and like Mo Ning Min E put enormous effort applying politics to the everyday habits/lifestyle of Americans.
By the way I have yet to see any other Egyptian username signify that there is "balady" and "foreign" vegetables.
Obviously a slipup on your part divulging how and the exactly how you are duped regularly by your love interest.
Posted by Ayisha (Member # 4713) on :
quote:Originally posted by metinoot:
quote:Originally posted by Ayisha:
quote:Originally posted by metinoot: Still this sounds like a load of crap.
Americans by and large are not materialistic.
so you know sweet FA about UK, sweet FA about Egypt and also sweet FA about America. You need to get out more sono.
Never claimed to know anything substantial about the UK, you on the otherhand make numerous claims about America and like Mo Ning Min E put enormous effort applying politics to the everyday habits/lifestyle of Americans.
By the way I have yet to see any other Egyptian username signify that there is "balady" and "foreign" vegetables.
Obviously a slipup on your part divulging how and the exactly how you are duped regularly by your love interest.
Any chance of getting this in English? Posted by metinoot (Member # 17031) on :
quote:Originally posted by Ayisha:
quote:Originally posted by metinoot:
quote:Originally posted by Ayisha:
quote:Originally posted by metinoot: Still this sounds like a load of crap.
Americans by and large are not materialistic.
so you know sweet FA about UK, sweet FA about Egypt and also sweet FA about America. You need to get out more sono.
Never claimed to know anything substantial about the UK, you on the otherhand make numerous claims about America and like Mo Ning Min E put enormous effort applying politics to the everyday habits/lifestyle of Americans.
By the way I have yet to see any other Egyptian username signify that there is "balady" and "foreign" vegetables.
Obviously a slipup on your part divulging how and the exactly how you are duped regularly by your love interest.
Any chance of getting this in English?
What are you being sold "English" garlic at double the price of "Foreign" garlic now? How much did the "English" garlic cost you? 15LE?
Posted by Questionmarks (Member # 12336) on :
quote:Originally posted by Exiiled:
quote:Originally posted by Cheekyferret: That was post 666 Exiile... just an observation A very good post though.
I know some very educated stupid people so having a good education doesn't always indicate they have much common sense!!!
Exiiled, I have often found people who are well travelled are the most accepting and understanding of others. The University of Life - priceless.
As a person who is passionate about volunteering and charity work, you don't have to get a pay cheque to feel worthy and valued in life. Some of us get that great feeling just by giving time and quality of life to others.
“666” Hold up let me find a dictionary
I totally agree with you Cheeky. I'm glad you used the word “well traveled” because people who travel or visit only 1 or 2 places might actually hate those places and arrive at a distorted view of the word. I think when a person travels for prolonged periods of time they are bound to find not just the bad but also the good.
To actually delve into cultures, I know some people here despise Arabs and Muslims, but I know for a fact that some of them are some of the most beautiful hearted people. The same with Indians, Asians, Europeans, etc. I'm under the impression that Brits/Europeans are much kinder abroad, but I know it's because of my limited interaction with them in their own countries. I believe that.
Haven't done voluntary work in a while. I did love teaching Iraqi refugees English, I just get too caught up with my own BS, that I actually forget, becoming too selfish doing nothing. Good for you though and I hope you continue.
Voluntairy work or a payed job, that doesn't matter, but as I asked relier, it seems to me that a person needs to feel valued. I think someone without will feel useless after a while. About the well traveled people, think it depends on what kind of travel expierences; a sand-sea-holidayresort in country number that much doesn't bring anything about the country itsselve....
Posted by Ayisha (Member # 4713) on :
quote:Originally posted by metinoot:
quote:Originally posted by Ayisha:
quote:Originally posted by metinoot:
quote:Originally posted by Ayisha:
quote:Originally posted by metinoot: Still this sounds like a load of crap.
Americans by and large are not materialistic.
so you know sweet FA about UK, sweet FA about Egypt and also sweet FA about America. You need to get out more sono.
Never claimed to know anything substantial about the UK, you on the otherhand make numerous claims about America and like Mo Ning Min E put enormous effort applying politics to the everyday habits/lifestyle of Americans.
By the way I have yet to see any other Egyptian username signify that there is "balady" and "foreign" vegetables.
Obviously a slipup on your part divulging how and the exactly how you are duped regularly by your love interest.
Any chance of getting this in English?
What are you being sold "English" garlic at double the price of "Foreign" garlic now? How much did the "English" garlic cost you? 15LE?
if you lived here you would know there is imported Garlic and there is balady Garlic, dumbo. Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
That is why I said well travelled.
I value myself and that matters more to me than anything else.
Ayisha, face it, whatever you say you are wrong, us living her know nothing!!!
Posted by Ayisha (Member # 4713) on :
yes ferret i know you're right, just baffles me how someone can be so fecking dumb! I mean I ask for her to translate her psycho babble into English now she bangs on about English garlic, wtf is she on?
Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
Disbelieving what 3 people mentioned about the price of stuff here is clearly just someone being an arse!
Food costs need to stabilise or reduce or Momma Ferret will have to grow her own dinner Posted by samaka (Member # 9228) on :
quote:Originally posted by metinoot:
quote:Originally posted by Ayisha:
quote:Originally posted by metinoot:
quote:Originally posted by Ayisha:
quote:Originally posted by metinoot: Still this sounds like a load of crap.
Americans by and large are not materialistic.
so you know sweet FA about UK, sweet FA about Egypt and also sweet FA about America. You need to get out more sono.
Never claimed to know anything substantial about the UK, you on the otherhand make numerous claims about America and like Mo Ning Min E put enormous effort applying politics to the everyday habits/lifestyle of Americans.
By the way I have yet to see any other Egyptian username signify that there is "balady" and "foreign" vegetables.
Obviously a slipup on your part divulging how and the exactly how you are duped regularly by your love interest.
Any chance of getting this in English?
What are you being sold "English" garlic at double the price of "Foreign" garlic now? How much did the "English" garlic cost you? 15LE?
Posted by samaka (Member # 9228) on :
quote:Originally posted by samaka:
quote:Originally posted by metinoot:
quote:Originally posted by Ayisha:
quote:Originally posted by metinoot:
quote:Originally posted by Ayisha:
quote:Originally posted by metinoot: Still this sounds like a load of crap.
Americans by and large are not materialistic.
so you know sweet FA about UK, sweet FA about Egypt and also sweet FA about America. You need to get out more sono.
Never claimed to know anything substantial about the UK, you on the otherhand make numerous claims about America and like Mo Ning Min E put enormous effort applying politics to the everyday habits/lifestyle of Americans.
By the way I have yet to see any other Egyptian username signify that there is "balady" and "foreign" vegetables.
Obviously a slipup on your part divulging how and the exactly how you are duped regularly by your love interest.
Any chance of getting this in English?
What are you being sold "English" garlic at double the price of "Foreign" garlic now? How much did the "English" garlic cost you? 15LE?
Long string of garlic cost 35le at Carrefour two days ago. No idea where it came from, must have been a long way to cost that much.
Posted by anthropos (Member # 9410) on :
What really surpsrised me when I came to Egypt and even more when I learned more about it is that lots of people put a real effort and money into looking "middle class" and they are really "low class" and come from slum areas. In this context I mean that people have very nice and expensive mobiles for example, among other things. For me that seems really stupid if you have a hard time getting food even! But maybe it is vital in Egyptian society, recieving somekind of respect.It is such a status symbol I suppose.
Posted by Miss_Tigerlily (Member # 3567) on :
quote:Originally posted by anthropos: It is such a status symbol I suppose.
Just like foreign wives.
Posted by anthropos (Member # 9410) on :
really? I thought that everybody looked down on guys with foreign wives and that everybody "saw through" it all.
Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
EEEh... this site is depressing!
I am just glad I am right where I want to be doing what I want to be doing with exactly the right people!!! Priceless.
Posted by Exiiled (Member # 17278) on :
quote:Originally posted by Questionmarks:
quote:Originally posted by Exiiled:
quote:Originally posted by Cheekyferret: That was post 666 Exiile... just an observation A very good post though.
I know some very educated stupid people so having a good education doesn't always indicate they have much common sense!!!
Exiiled, I have often found people who are well travelled are the most accepting and understanding of others. The University of Life - priceless.
As a person who is passionate about volunteering and charity work, you don't have to get a pay cheque to feel worthy and valued in life. Some of us get that great feeling just by giving time and quality of life to others.
“666” Hold up let me find a dictionary
I totally agree with you Cheeky. I'm glad you used the word “well traveled” because people who travel or visit only 1 or 2 places might actually hate those places and arrive at a distorted view of the word. I think when a person travels for prolonged periods of time they are bound to find not just the bad but also the good.
To actually delve into cultures, I know some people here despise Arabs and Muslims, but I know for a fact that some of them are some of the most beautiful hearted people. The same with Indians, Asians, Europeans, etc. I'm under the impression that Brits/Europeans are much kinder abroad, but I know it's because of my limited interaction with them in their own countries. I believe that.
Haven't done voluntary work in a while. I did love teaching Iraqi refugees English, I just get too caught up with my own BS, that I actually forget, becoming too selfish doing nothing. Good for you though and I hope you continue.
Voluntairy work or a payed job, that doesn't matter, but as I asked relier, it seems to me that a person needs to feel valued. I think someone without will feel useless after a while. About the well traveled people, think it depends on what kind of travel expierences; a sand-sea-holidayresort in country number that much doesn't bring anything about the country itsselve....
Have you every heard the saying “you can't teach an old dog new tricks”? That's you in an ideal sense. You obvious feel that work makes a person feel valuable. When you hear women (some on ES as well) say they are proud of their husbands working. What they're really saying is that they are proud that their husbands bring home money, put bread on the table. Some of us do not need to work. I don't equate value with work, or work with value, it's merely money that people need, whether you have to work for money or not, the end result is the same, money.
I value myself because I am a human being with two feet, two hands, two eyes with great intellect. I value myself being a good husband, good uncle, good brother, good friend, and thankfully now a very good son. I value myself for my tolerance and my ability to look at people beyond the color of their skin or their monetary worth. Some of these things that I have stated have increased more with time, such a being a better son. Simply put my value increases the more I become a better human being.
I mean my god the mentality that some people have here. The value of person is being a good human being, with good manners, respect for people, love for mankind. Akhalaaq. That's the value of a human being.
Your perception of value definitely differs from the way I percieve life, and I'm totally gratfeul that. You also have a working ant mentality, I'm sure Queen Beatrix is proud of you.
Now run along before I get all 666 on you. Posted by *Dalia* (Member # 13012) on :
quote:Originally posted by samaka: Long string of garlic cost 35le at Carrefour two days ago. No idea where it came from, must have been a long way to cost that much.
Most of the garlic you get in Cairo at the moment is imported from China. I've been trying to find local garlic for a couple of weeks now – to no avail.
Posted by Ayisha (Member # 4713) on :
quote:Originally posted by *Dalia*:
quote:Originally posted by samaka: Long string of garlic cost 35le at Carrefour two days ago. No idea where it came from, must have been a long way to cost that much.
Most of the garlic you get in Cairo at the moment is imported from China. I've been trying to find local garlic for a couple of weeks now – to no avail.
not long now I think. Then we see truck loads of it for 1-2le kg Posted by marydot (Member # 15932) on :
Many Egyptian families think that just because their sons who are living in the west, think that they should be treated with respect and have a hign status back home. wrong!!!
When in fact they are acting like dogs living in the west.
Posted by Ayisha (Member # 4713) on :
quote:Originally posted by anthropos: really? I thought that everybody looked down on guys with foreign wives and that everybody "saw through" it all.
depends which way the wind is blowing.
Posted by Mo Ning Min E (Member # 681) on :
Sorry folks, I'm with Exiled on this thing about the nobility of human toil. It IS a very Anglo Saxon concept. It is nice to get paid for what you do, if what you do gives you pleasure and satisfaction, and I would never denigrate people who derive a sense of achievment from working. But personally, I have NEVER EVER in my adult life, despised people who either do not need, nor choose not, to work. At what point does one's tolerance, or even admiration for a person become judged on not only the fact of them working, but how well rewarded they are? We hear the the phrase often, 'He's got a really good job' less so we hear 'he's got a job which he really loves even though the pay is lousy' Many many many people judge, and are judged by their income I think.Not simply be how simply nice they are. I quite enjoyed working, on the whole.But I do recognise that there are some people just not psychologically wired to feel as I do. So what? My taxes have gone to people who some call lazy? Better than paying for missiles. Never noticed taxes reduced along with unemployment figures. It IS just social conditioning at the end of the day really, I could never make someone feel ashamed because thay choose a different lifestyle, and if they live in a society whereby they can survive on benefits, without resorting to crime, who am I to judge?
Different strokes for different folks.
Posted by Glassflower (Member # 17950) on :
Well said MoNing Min E. I grew up in a very rich part of UK and always had an ethical point of view to try and fit in with what job I wanted to find...its probably more ethical to receive benefits and do lots for others with no pay than to be a rich bank Ceo. I also had to fit in something that fitted with looking after children...art was an avenue that I felt comfortable with. I read recently that a cleaner was better value in a society than an accountant! That made me smile....
Posted by Ayisha (Member # 4713) on :
quote:Originally posted by Glassflower: Well said MoNing Min E. I grew up in a very rich part of UK and always had an ethical point of view to try and fit in with what job I wanted to find...its probably more ethical to receive benefits and do lots for others with no pay than to be a rich bank Ceo. I also had to fit in something that fitted with looking after children...art was an avenue that I felt comfortable with. I read recently that a cleaner was better value in a society than an accountant! That made me smile....
been both and fully agree!
I work to live but if I didnt have to work to live how I want then I have plenty of other things I could be doing! I am never lazy or idle and very incredibly rarely bored.
Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
I am now between the two notions as yes, I whole heartedly agree that happinness and satisfaction from life are above salary and income and your stance in society.
However, I despise arseholes in the UK who won't take a days work but will lounge around moaning about how the Polish come over and take their jobs while living in houses that my taxes subsidise.
People who do not work through choice (the lazy) should not be given Government assistance. Unless there is a VALID reason why that person cannot work then money should be stopped. It is then their choice to work or not without an income. Why should I pay for a lazy gits house?
Some people do not have to work and can afford not to... fine, as long as you can afford not to
Lastly before I hop off, don't we choose our own jobs and roles, if you hate it or aren't happy don't you have the power to change it?
Same as westerners living in Egypt who hate it, change it!
Life is what we make it, no-one owes anybody any favours! We all control our own destiny at the end of the day.
Posted by Glassflower (Member # 17950) on :
Some people do not have to work and can afford not to... fine, as long as you can afford not to . [/QB][/QUOTE] ....and hopefully the investments those people live off are ethical!
Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
Some couuld have won lotto, inherited, sold business or property etc...
Posted by Exiiled (Member # 17278) on :
quote:Originally posted by Mo Ning Min E: Sorry folks, I'm with Exiled on this thing about the nobility of human toil. It IS a very Anglo Saxon concept. It is nice to get paid for what you do, if what you do gives you pleasure and satisfaction, and I would never denigrate people who derive a sense of achievment from working. But personally, I have NEVER EVER in my adult life, despised people who either do not need, nor choose not, to work. At what point does one's tolerance, or even admiration for a person become judged on not only the fact of them working, but how well rewarded they are? We hear the the phrase often, 'He's got a really good job' less so we hear 'he's got a job which he really loves even though the pay is lousy' Many many many people judge, and are judged by their income I think.Not simply be how simply nice they are. I quite enjoyed working, on the whole.But I do recognise that there are some people just not psychologically wired to feel as I do. So what? My taxes have gone to people who some call lazy? Better than paying for missiles. Never noticed taxes reduced along with unemployment figures. It IS just social conditioning at the end of the day really, I could never make someone feel ashamed because thay choose a different lifestyle, and if they live in a society whereby they can survive on benefits, without resorting to crime, who am I to judge?
Different strokes for different folks.
I like the way you think, It's a very humanistic. And you shouldn't apologize to people if you believe in something that you know deep down they are wrong. I am not completely sure about welfare recipients because I know they are a strain on society. But I would have to agree with you that perhaps giving them the money instead of military spending might be for the best. I think it makes sense, because with military spending, jobs are created but the bulk of the profits are gained by greedy corporations.
Most welfare recipients spend their benefits on everything from groceries to beer to cigarettes. This kind of spending in urban areas greatly benefits small businesses. Many such small businesses survive from the income gained from the purchases of welfare folk. It would be interesting if a study was performed using this two metrics (military & welfare).
Posted by Questionmarks (Member # 12336) on :
quote:Originally posted by Exiiled:
quote:Originally posted by Questionmarks:
quote:Originally posted by Exiiled:
quote:Originally posted by Cheekyferret: That was post 666 Exiile... just an observation A very good post though.
I know some very educated stupid people so having a good education doesn't always indicate they have much common sense!!!
Exiiled, I have often found people who are well travelled are the most accepting and understanding of others. The University of Life - priceless.
As a person who is passionate about volunteering and charity work, you don't have to get a pay cheque to feel worthy and valued in life. Some of us get that great feeling just by giving time and quality of life to others.
“666” Hold up let me find a dictionary
I totally agree with you Cheeky. I'm glad you used the word “well traveled” because people who travel or visit only 1 or 2 places might actually hate those places and arrive at a distorted view of the word. I think when a person travels for prolonged periods of time they are bound to find not just the bad but also the good.
To actually delve into cultures, I know some people here despise Arabs and Muslims, but I know for a fact that some of them are some of the most beautiful hearted people. The same with Indians, Asians, Europeans, etc. I'm under the impression that Brits/Europeans are much kinder abroad, but I know it's because of my limited interaction with them in their own countries. I believe that.
Haven't done voluntary work in a while. I did love teaching Iraqi refugees English, I just get too caught up with my own BS, that I actually forget, becoming too selfish doing nothing. Good for you though and I hope you continue.
Voluntairy work or a payed job, that doesn't matter, but as I asked relier, it seems to me that a person needs to feel valued. I think someone without will feel useless after a while. About the well traveled people, think it depends on what kind of travel expierences; a sand-sea-holidayresort in country number that much doesn't bring anything about the country itsselve....
Have you every heard the saying “you can't teach an old dog new tricks”? That's you in an ideal sense. You obvious feel that work makes a person feel valuable. When you hear women (some on ES as well) say they are proud of their husbands working. What they're really saying is that they are proud that their husbands bring home money, put bread on the table. Some of us do not need to work. I don't equate value with work, or work with value, it's merely money that people need, whether you have to work for money or not, the end result is the same, money.
I value myself because I am a human being with two feet, two hands, two eyes with great intellect. I value myself being a good husband, good uncle, good brother, good friend, and thankfully now a very good son. I value myself for my tolerance and my ability to look at people beyond the color of their skin or their monetary worth. Some of these things that I have stated have increased more with time, such a being a better son. Simply put my value increases the more I become a better human being.
I mean my god the mentality that some people have here. The value of person is being a good human being, with good manners, respect for people, love for mankind. Akhalaaq. That's the value of a human being.
Your perception of value definitely differs from the way I percieve life, and I'm totally gratfeul that. You also have a working ant mentality, I'm sure Queen Beatrix is proud of you.
Now run along before I get all 666 on you.
And you are proud of your tolerance? Whats the difference between me; having a hard time understanding that someone can feel good about himself whitout working for his money and you; making cynical remarks about people like me. For how I see it, you are doing the same now... Please explain me my intolerance and your tolerance. Think you make a mistake....
Posted by Questionmarks (Member # 12336) on :
quote:Originally posted by Cheekyferret: I am now between the two notions as yes, I whole heartedly agree that happinness and satisfaction from life are above salary and income and your stance in society.
However, I despise arseholes in the UK who won't take a days work but will lounge around moaning about how the Polish come over and take their jobs while living in houses that my taxes subsidise.
People who do not work through choice (the lazy) should not be given Government assistance. Unless there is a VALID reason why that person cannot work then money should be stopped. It is then their choice to work or not without an income. Why should I pay for a lazy gits house?
Some people do not have to work and can afford not to... fine, as long as you can afford not to
Lastly before I hop off, don't we choose our own jobs and roles, if you hate it or aren't happy don't you have the power to change it?
Same as westerners living in Egypt who hate it, change it!
Life is what we make it, no-one owes anybody any favours! We all control our own destiny at the end of the day.
Abusing social welfare wasn't really part of the discussion. I was curious about the life of a young man without work and a monthly payment from his father for the rest of his life. First of all, I cannot understand the father. The father is working, makes a lot of money, and for some reason hasn't a problem with this. Then the young man himself. It started with asking his opinion about all this: does he feel valued? His wife? His parents? To me it all sounds rather strange, and I really doubt that somebody can spend the rest of his life in this way...
Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
the topic was materialism but why split hairs!
Wish my parents gave me cash!!!! If the father is happy to give and the son has a happy life then I don't see the big deal.
Posted by Miss_Tigerlily (Member # 3567) on :
People who don't want to work
I don’t understand able bodied people who do not want to work. Not long ago, I was approached by two men in a parking lot who “needed some gas money“. They both looked healthy enough to work but instead were begging for change from people buying groceries for their families. ”Why can’t they work?”, I thought to myself as I walked to the car.
How many times have you seen people standing at the bottom of a freeway ramp begging for money? They can stand up all day and hold a sign, but are unable to work. What’s wrong with this picture?
I wake up every morning and go to the same job, at the same place, dealing with the same issues. It gets old and there are days when I’d rather just stay home. Doesn’t everyone feel this way at times? The reality is that work is part of being an adult and living in society–we all need to be productive. Why is it that some people think that they should be able to live a comfortable life without working?
As adults, we all get to make choices and live with the consequences. Some people decide not to work and then try to escape the consequences by looking to others for support! They do this by asking for money at the supermarket, applying for government welfare programs, or just living off the generosity of others.
When people don’t work, they are not contributing to society. This puts a burden on responsible working adults who end up paying for them in the long run. These people are living off the labor of others. I recently discovered a blog where someone was asking for ”milk and diaper money“. They even had a link to Pay-Pal on their site. Well meaning people are giving them money–too bad.
I can think of other troubling situations like husbands who make their wives support them or wives who stay home and play when their husbands are slaving away (although this doesn’t affect me unless they are applying for welfare). I also am troubled by people who depend on frivolous law suits, bogus insurance claims, or other scams for their income. These people put a lot of energy into figuring out how to not work. Wouldn’t it just be better if they put that same energy into finding a job and keeping it?
Don’t get me wrong, I believe in being charitable–in fact, we all have a responsibility to help others in need. It feels good to help a family that is really struggling, or someone with health issues, or the elderly, etc. Sometimes people just end up in difficult circumstances and need help–I completely understand this.
With all of that said, I believe that we are actually doing harm by helping those who choose not to work. We are enabling them, the same way we are enabling an alcoholic or a drug user. I’m not talking about homeless people, those who are disabled, the elderly, or special needs people. I’m talking about normal people who are lazy and just don’t want to work. These are able bodied people who want others to pay their way and are very good at figuring out ways to work the system. If these people don’t want to work, they should have to live with the consequences. Hunger can be a great motivator! What do you think?
Ah exiiled you non productive potential drunk lmao.
Posted by Questionmarks (Member # 12336) on :
I think it's one of the universal basic human believes: people need to work in order to be able to live the life they like to live. It's considered as inappropriate to live on someone elses expenses. Nevertheless I don't have problems with someone who is living in another way: as long as both parties agree... The point is that I cannot imagine that any father will agree in working every day sponsoring his son who doesn't want to work! And when father should like his son to work for his money then it is not a matter of tolerance anymore!!!
Posted by anthropos (Member # 9410) on :
QM we come from a mentality where it is HONORABLE (yes the West has also honor) to work for your own money, to be independent, to move as soon as possible away from the parents and stand on your own two feet. The Middle Eastern mentality is different I think, there is not the inherent desire to do something with one's time, to be productive, not be lazy, not be slow. People are happy to stay in their parents home until they are forty or even longer. In the West the general trend is: If you don't work, you study. For many in the ME it is different, of course due to some economic restrictions for some, and maybe also lack of interest from others, fx girls who only want a husband to take care of them.
Posted by Ayisha (Member # 4713) on :
so all those housewives living off thier husbands are lazy and unproductive? Posted by Penny (Member # 1925) on :
quote:Originally posted by Questionmarks:
quote:Originally posted by Cheekyferret: I am now between the two notions as yes, I whole heartedly agree that happinness and satisfaction from life are above salary and income and your stance in society.
However, I despise arseholes in the UK who won't take a days work but will lounge around moaning about how the Polish come over and take their jobs while living in houses that my taxes subsidise.
People who do not work through choice (the lazy) should not be given Government assistance. Unless there is a VALID reason why that person cannot work then money should be stopped. It is then their choice to work or not without an income. Why should I pay for a lazy gits house?
Some people do not have to work and can afford not to... fine, as long as you can afford not to
Lastly before I hop off, don't we choose our own jobs and roles, if you hate it or aren't happy don't you have the power to change it?
Same as westerners living in Egypt who hate it, change it!
Life is what we make it, no-one owes anybody any favours! We all control our own destiny at the end of the day.
Abusing social welfare wasn't really part of the discussion. I was curious about the life of a young man without work and a monthly payment from his father for the rest of his life. First of all, I cannot understand the father. The father is working, makes a lot of money, and for some reason hasn't a problem with this. Then the young man himself. It started with asking his opinion about all this: does he feel valued? His wife? His parents? To me it all sounds rather strange, and I really doubt that somebody can spend the rest of his life in this way...
It seems to happen alot when a father has worked hard and been very sucessful,that the next generation seem to think they can sit back and loaf off the earnings. Maybe the father was too busy making his fortune and didn't spend the time with his son intilling the work ethic and other values of what being a productive member of society is all about.
Mohammed El Fayed and his son Doddi are a good example of this. Doddi thought his role in life was just to be an international play boy but from what I have read he was a very unhappy young man.
Whilst I agree with the comments that a person should not be valued by what they do in life, I am firmly in the camp that we all have to work in some way to contribute to this world we have been born into. Nobody has a god given right to sit back on their bum all day.
I bought my own son up, as my mother did me, with the full knowledge that he would have to work and could never expect to depend on others. I have to say I would be ashamed of him if he did not and feel I had failed in my role as a mother. Thankfully the reality is quite the opposite and I have every reason to be a very proud Mum. Whilst I do respect and value what he does, its not about the job title its all about his attitude and the fact he is playing an active role as a valuable member of society.
Posted by anthropos (Member # 9410) on :
Good point Ayisha, I was just going to add to my comment about this part. Due to this extreme pressure on people to be productive, independent, and make money; hence achieve the honor all other occupations that are not directly creating wealth are considered low class and almost meaningless from society. These jobs indeed include housewives, but also kindergarten teachers and all nurturing jobs because they are in their nature more a service to the all money-making structure in society rather than being the direct money-maker. Somehow it has also developed that these jobs are mostly occupied by women so it is also clear that masculine jobs are valued higher in Western society. The struggle of women and feminists to achieve equal status in society has often revolved around stepping into this masculine side of society and by and large it has been successful but at the same time it has backfired on them because not only are women expected now to give birth and take care of their children and home (the nurturing job), they are also supposed to work outside the home (masculine side). This of course is very hard for almost all women. But the problem is with the values in society.
Posted by anthropos (Member # 9410) on :
In my country which is in Scandinavia people usually retort with "She is only going to stay at home?" if somebody decides to be a housewife. It is indeed considered basically strange. And I think that it is difficult for most women here to accept total dependance financially on their husband. At the same time there is huge pressure for women to breastfeed for at least 6 months, ideally to 2 years and be the mainprovider for the child. As indeed nature planned but society has now been structured thus that it is almost impossible for a family to have only one breadwinner and made it a shame to be "only" a housewife.
Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
And what about those who have worked damn hard in the past and have money to sit back all day? Should they just keep working to conform to the beliefs of those not in a position to do it themselves?
Posted by Questionmarks (Member # 12336) on :
Then it must differ by country, typical female jobs as a hairdresser, a kindergarten teacher, beauty specialist are not considered as low class where I live. They are classified by the level of education, somethink like that. You don't need an IQ of >100 to be a hairdresser, a teacher is higher classified. That doesn't have anything to do with being valued as. As long as somebody is working for a salary, there is a certain value connected top it. People who are living on the cost of society for a long time are lower valued. They are considered as to lazy to have a job. It is honourable to work in a job below the own level instead as living on wellfare... My children had to work in a student by McDonalds as soon as they were 16. Because there they learn to work in a team, to be friendly even when you don't feel like, to work in systems, in a certain discipline, and the payment is that louzy that it will be a lesson for the future: I don't want to spend my life there, so it's better to study and work in a better job...
Posted by anthropos (Member # 9410) on :
Typical female jobs are valued sure. But take an elementary teacher (mostly women) and compare his salary to that of a stock broker (mostly men). And then think which job does more for society on the whole.
Posted by Questionmarks (Member # 12336) on :
quote:Originally posted by Cheekyferret: And what about those who have worked damn hard in the past and have money to sit back all day? Should they just keep working to conform to the beliefs of those not in a position to do it themselves?
I don't know any. The ones who are that rich, spend their days in the way they like to. But in common in a active way. Some are busy with sports daily, some are working voluntairily. I don't know anyone who spends his/her life with traveling and going out.
Posted by Questionmarks (Member # 12336) on :
quote:Originally posted by anthropos: Typical female jobs are valued sure. But take an elementary teacher (mostly women) and compare his salary to that of a stock broker (mostly men). And then think which job does more for society on the whole.
Think they work on bonusses, like salesmen. I don't know how it is in Scandinavia, but I cannot say that its a high valued job here. It has a kind of stigma on it, money is on the first order of rank in that job, and thats not appreciated here.
Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
And what about expats wives who have no need to work, should they make the un-necessary effort so not to be deemed worthless by those who have never experience this way of life before?
Posted by Penny (Member # 1925) on :
quote:Originally posted by Questionmarks: My children had to work in a student by McDonalds as soon as they were 16. Because there they learn to work in a team, to be friendly even when you don't feel like, to work in systems, in a certain discipline, and the payment is that louzy that it will be a lesson for the future: I don't want to spend my life there, so it's better to study and work in a better job...
So right LOL... it was one year at a supermaket and 2 years in a computer store while studying at college that ensured my son then worked hard at University to be able to get a job he enjoyed.
My mother also did the same to me, worked in a shop, cleaned offices, and then as a garage forecourt attendant.
I will never understand parents that wrap their children up in cotton wool and shield them from the realities of life.
Posted by Questionmarks (Member # 12336) on :
quote:Originally posted by Cheekyferret: And what about expats wives who have no need to work, should they make the un-necessary effort so not to be deemed worthless by those who have never experience this way of life before?
I don't deem them, I was asking exploinations to Exiiled because I cannot imagine this is for real. I cannot imagine a father agrees in paying his son for the rest of his life while the father has to work... For the expat wifes; I don't think they all life on the costs of their husband. It depends on the country where they are sended to, and it can be difficult or impossible to work. I also have heard that it can be difficult for the women because they feel useless there. Ther have servants, enough money and too much free time, so they have to spend their days at the club, shopping, etc. It is boring after a while...
Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
As my good ole gran used to say... only boring people get bored!
Speaking for the expat wags I know here in Egypt none of them are bored with the lavish lifestyles and the pamperings and pool trips that their partners salaries bring in. And speaking personally. I never tire of going to the pool and swimming and reading a good book!!! I have never sat in the sun wishing I was behind an office desk!!!
As for Exiiled, will your Father adopt me please?
Posted by Questionmarks (Member # 12336) on :
You live the kind of life Exiiled lives? Maybe it's a new race.... lol! Any idea how the world will be able to survive on such people? Sitting at the pool with a book for a living? There aren't enough working people willing to finance this...
Posted by anthropos (Member # 9410) on :
QM this race has existed always. I know an anthropoloigst who conducted a field research in Green Cape Islands (are they called that in English?) and he had a hard time accepting the mentality of the islanders. Half the population was starving basically and still the fishermen stayed everymorning chilling and didn't go out to fish until after lunch. For the ant mentality this is pure laziness. Btw there was plenty of fish as this was some 30 years ago.
Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
Why are you worried how the world will survive because there are a few people not part of the machine?
Sitting at the pool reading a book for a living... HELL YEAH My dog days are over!!! and this time next week I will be on the beach
If the option to work or not is a freedom of choice then what is your problem with those who choose not to? They have no impact on you whatsoever and if they are taking money from the Government they do not affect the state either!
No one willingly finances me btw, I willingly finance myself.
Posted by Exiiled (Member # 17278) on :
It's quite interesting reading some members' posts. I don't think it's logical comparing upbringings when the socioeconomic circumstances differ. It's convenient to judge, isn't it, and to base other peoples lives on your own upbringing. But doing so is like comparing apples with oranges.
I'll share something about my dad. He never used nor uses the world “mine”, but always the word “ours”. My dad has instilled family unity, A One For All, All For One mentality for as long as I can remember. When I was in high school, he called for a family meeting and announced with me becoming an adult that I would be givne a certain property business. I lead my life from that point onwards believing that property would eventually be mine. It had a huge impact on me, and ultimately lead me to live the life that I wanted and living now.
My dad's generosity extends beyond me and my siblings, he also looked out for my grandfather(r.i.p) his brothers and even my grandmother from my moms side. One of my uncles died in a car accident and my dad built a family home for his nephews and nieces and supported them as they grew up. There is so much more goodwill that my dad has done. When newcomers were coming to the States, my dad housed many of them in some of his apartments that he has for his employees.
I saw an old man kissing my father's shoes and crying, saying that his own sons abandoned him, and he was grateful for my dad helping him. My dad helped a woman and her daughter when her husband abandoned them. I can go on and on and on. I remember late at night a dude named Richie and his girlfriend showed up at our front door and told my dad that they had no where to sleep. My dad took them to his employees apartment and told the workers staying there that one bedroom was to be given to ritchie and his lady.
That's my dad. I have stated previously, that my income is mine, it comes from assets under my name, but an ignoramus member chooses to repeat and delude herself that I receive money from my dad. Some of my dad's generoisty has rubbed off on me as I helped an ex get get on her feet. I have a friend who has a baby daughter and I don't want to embarrass him, but I want to tell him that I want him to set up a bank account for his daughter so I can deposit $50 a month to her account for college. It's not much but should be something by the time she is 18.My brothers also use their money to help people.
People here are comparing apples with oranges.
Posted by Ayisha (Member # 4713) on :
I do think it's a certain amount of 'how come he has this life and I cant' too. If you had a job these people would then decide which 'class box' to put you in depending on salary and 'contribution to society' that they decide you are worth.
Posted by Exiiled (Member # 17278) on :
quote:Originally posted by Ayisha: I do think it's a certain amount of 'how come he has this life and I cant' too. If you had a job these people would then decide which 'class box' to put you in depending on salary and 'contribution to society' that they decide you are worth.
Bingo. I think so to.
I guess the impulse to judge never escapes some people. I think it's a unhealthy trait, it's evident here judging by some posts, that some members deem this the acceptable norm.
Not me.
Posted by metinoot (Member # 17031) on :
quote:Originally posted by *Dalia*:
quote:Originally posted by samaka: Long string of garlic cost 35le at Carrefour two days ago. No idea where it came from, must have been a long way to cost that much.
Most of the garlic you get in Cairo at the moment is imported from China. I've been trying to find local garlic for a couple of weeks now – to no avail.
Carrefour is a far cry from a Luxor souk, prices are always 5 times more in a western supermarket.
I never know when Dalia is in Egypt or in Germany. Changes upon the context of the post.
Posted by Two (Member # 17234) on :
Why does page one look like page three Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
quote:Originally posted by Two: Why does page one look like page three
Because the hard of thinking need to be told something several times before they accept something to be fact.
Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
Oh and let's just clear this up:
People in Egypt buying produce in Egypt is a better poker hand than somebody not even on the continent!
Posted by anthropos (Member # 9410) on :
here we have an example of perfect clash of civilizations. The individualism of the West clashes with the collective identity of the East. Children in the East never really leave the nest and the parents don't want them to either. In the West they want to fly off and are pushed by the parents and not really welcomed back. their nook in the nest is the computer room now.
Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
That is true Anthropos, the minute you move out your room is either a study or a gym lol...
But I was pushed by my family to fulfil my dreams and travel and fly away and not and sit and stagnate like I have seen friends do.
I went to a school reunion last summer, one girl was horrified that I have never married or had kids as she has 6 kids... when I told her all have done since we left school she confessed she wished she had done what I have, I have never wanted her life.
My point is, it is easy to judge others if they do not lead the life expected of them, but it does not make them wrong. It makes them different.
Posted by Dilemma (Member # 16672) on :
I agree with u Cheeky.
Posted by Questionmarks (Member # 12336) on :
My point is that everybody is judging. You're just not aware of it! If Exiiled, Cheekyferret or Ayisha is judging others about how THESE people are, they are doing exactly the same as the ones they accusing...
Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
I was simply defending the right not to be called lazy, worthless or of no value.
And without trawling the over dramatised posts about civilisation collapsing if more people read books by a pool for a living (really, I need a better job title) I am quite certain that exiiled was spoken to like a piece of crap by some and if he retaliated then folk should learn to take what they give
And I do work for a living btw, you just never happened to ask. I just let folk ride with their vivid imaginations I just am not a lil hamster in a wheel and have a dream job.
Posted by anthropos (Member # 9410) on :
I believe the accurate term for the occupation known as "reading books by a pool" is either "book critic" or "scholar" .....
Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
Oh, that would be fradulent of me as I read for pleasure lol. But I wouldn't mind being paid to read books by a pool! I would love even more the role of sunblock tester!!!
I am currently reading a book btw called 'Playing cards in Cairo' by a guy who some old hat ex pats may know. I am loving it.
Anyway, I digress Posted by Laura (Member # 879) on :
quote:Originally posted by metinoot: Carrefour is a far cry from a Luxor souk, prices are always 5 times more in a western supermarket.
Not true at all. If you lived here, you would know that most times prices in Carrefour are cheaper than in local markets. Local markets can't buy in the quantities that large chains do, and therefore charge "convenience store" prices.
As for the rest of this, I feel that if you are financially well off enough to not have to work, and are happy with your lifestyle, who cares?!
Sidenote to Exiled and CF: Instead of waiting till the expiration date is due on items you bought and don't want, and then throwing it away, why not give them to some poor hungry person.
Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
Becasue like we said, we buy things with all good will and intention of eating them and never do and then when they are off we bin them.
If I binned them or gave them away in good nick I would probably wanna eat it!
One of those psychologial things!
I buy fruit and never eat it as well! I always think that I will fancy some the next meal and never do!
Posted by Ayisha (Member # 4713) on :
quote:Originally posted by metinoot:
quote:Originally posted by *Dalia*:
quote:Originally posted by samaka: Long string of garlic cost 35le at Carrefour two days ago. No idea where it came from, must have been a long way to cost that much.
Most of the garlic you get in Cairo at the moment is imported from China. I've been trying to find local garlic for a couple of weeks now – to no avail.
Carrefour is a far cry from a Luxor souk, prices are always 5 times more in a western supermarket.
What a stupid statement. It is a damn sight cheaper in Carrefour than Luxor souk or shop. Prices in general are cheaper in Cairo than Luxor anyway as we have to get things brought from Cairo. But if you had ever been here you might know that, unless you would also go telling the traders they are wrong too.
quote:I never know when Dalia is in Egypt or in Germany. Changes upon the context of the post.
Not really your business or anything to do with the price of veg in Egypt is it.
Posted by Dalia* (Member # 10593) on :
quote:Originally posted by metinoot: Carrefour is a far cry from a Luxor souk, prices are always 5 times more in a western supermarket.
I am speaking about local vegetable sellers, not Western supermarkets.
And Laura and Ayisha are correct – many things are actually cheaper at Carrefour.
Posted by Penny (Member # 1925) on :
quote:Originally posted by Cheekyferret: Oh, that would be fradulent of me as I read for pleasure lol. But I wouldn't mind being paid to read books by a pool! I would love even more the role of sunblock tester!!!
I am currently reading a book btw called 'Playing cards in Cairo' by a guy who some old hat ex pats may know. I am loving it.
Anyway, I digress
Great book, read it earlier this year on my first proper holiday in years stuck up a mountain in pouring rain. Was very thankful for that book....Now where am I going wrong!
Do think people need to lighten up a bit here though, and accept we all have different opinions....but congrats to ES for a proper discussion....first one in a long time Posted by Questionmarks (Member # 12336) on :
I can imagine Exiiled feels accused by me. He knows the way Europeans use to think, so a young man living this way is not appreciated in their point of view. Well, the Europeans in common don't accept this and will call it lazy, while he doesn't accept the way of thinking from the europeans and call them shortsighted and other not-so-nice names. They both do the same thing don't accept each other! So, what about intolerance???
Posted by Glassflower (Member # 17950) on :
I have always thought it would be better to invest in my children while they were alive rather than to just leave money in a will(like my mum has) so I could see and even influence what happens,so to me Exiles dad was wise.What a top bloke. I have liked seeing in Australia how the greek and Italian families work together as families ...My mother has always been disappointed that I didnt have a 'proper job' I think as she was part of that english work ethic...My dad came from a more bohemian theatre background... Im just happy I can work when I want to work and when the inspiration fits in with the washing up and dont have to work five days a week...always thought we need at least a 3 day weekend...,
Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
Have I missed something?
Exiileds family are a success... Good on them!
QM, are you including the British in the European mentality of being against anybody who is different?
He is far from lazy; more on the border line genius end of the spectrum.
I am not jealous of people who succeed, I am inspired by them
I always have a 3 day weekend... Posted by Questionmarks (Member # 12336) on :
I have no idea CF, don't know that much Brits. Have you met Exiiled? I never did, so I cannot have an opinion about him. Maybe he is lazy, maybe he is not. Unimportant, also. I just wanted to know more about the life he has, because it seems unusual to me. He must have heard this more, because he didn't like it...
Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
Sorry, it is just the way you use the Queen as an example of 'working' for a living in previous posts. I thought maybe you thought all us English think like you as well.
You did have an opinion about him though lmao!!! Hence the initial debate. Shall we go over his worth in life, his value and how others could view him. The damn lazy sad
It is not so unusual to have family support. Perhaps to you but not unusual in the West. There are millions of Indians and Asians in the West with family businesses that are proportioned out to members of the family. If on member sells his... mabrouk!!! He has cash!
GF had a valid point, his Dad could pass on and leave Exiiled a lump sum, or divide it out while he is alive to see his son happy with a wife living in a country he clearly enjoys.
Posted by Dilemma (Member # 16672) on :
As far as family support, I know of many Filipinos in the states that their extended family live with them in a big house and they all pay the mortgage on the house until the house is paid off then they do the same for another family member until the entire extended family have a home.
Posted by metinoot (Member # 17031) on :
quote:Originally posted by Dalia*:
quote:Originally posted by metinoot: Carrefour is a far cry from a Luxor souk, prices are always 5 times more in a western supermarket.
I am speaking about local vegetable sellers, not Western supermarkets.
And Laura and Ayisha are correct – many things are actually cheaper at Carrefour.
First time anyone on ES stated "cheap" at Carrefour, especially if its imported.
But I did state my confusion of your current residence.
Posted by Questionmarks (Member # 12336) on :
quote:Originally posted by Cheekyferret: Sorry, it is just the way you use the Queen as an example of 'working' for a living in previous posts. I thought maybe you thought all us English think like you as well.
You did have an opinion about him though lmao!!! Hence the initial debate. Shall we go over his worth in life, his value and how others could view him. The damn lazy sad
It is not so unusual to have family support. Perhaps to you but not unusual in the West. There are millions of Indians and Asians in the West with family businesses that are proportioned out to members of the family. If on member sells his... mabrouk!!! He has cash!
GF had a valid point, his Dad could pass on and leave Exiiled a lump sum, or divide it out while he is alive to see his son happy with a wife living in a country he clearly enjoys.
Anything can happen to him, to his dad or to his family. Nobody can look into the future, also Exiiled can't. So yes, he can loose it all. But also a job can get lost. Is his own responsebility... I was talking about the queen of my own country btw. She is 72, and yes: still working! Posted by Ayisha (Member # 4713) on :
quote:Originally posted by metinoot:
quote:Originally posted by Dalia*:
quote:Originally posted by metinoot: Carrefour is a far cry from a Luxor souk, prices are always 5 times more in a western supermarket.
I am speaking about local vegetable sellers, not Western supermarkets.
And Laura and Ayisha are correct – many things are actually cheaper at Carrefour.
First time anyone on ES stated "cheap" at Carrefour, especially if its imported.
But I did state my confusion of your current residence.
file it, it might come up again in the future.
Posted by nevermind (Member # 6674) on :
I think most who have more try to give to and help those who have less. And most of them never boast about it, they find it kind of elementary.
And it is also not about who someone's fathers or mothers or siblings are – it is about who YOU youself personally are. I think we tend to give more respect to the survivor kind of people who work hard or at least can show they are able to work hard and get themselves out of any situation, any rut. Because they are the ones thanks to whom the mankind has worked itself out of rut and into the comforts we now can enjoy. Those who survive.. they just survive, living for themselves. There is nothing despisable in that, just that there is not so much worth of respect either. Kind of half-useless members of society. Free bulk?
But at the same time the direction of inheritance in the East is 180 grades different from the West. In the West we often start our lives with nothing, and work ourselves up, and expect our children do the same. We want them to have the ability even if technically they do not need it.
While in the East, or at least here in Arab countries, the parents started their lives supplied with everything they needed.. by their parents. Obviously, they do not need much effort for themselves – covering the daily costs of living does not require much effort really. So it seems only logical they help the next generation instead. So you can only "judge" one who gets it all from "papy" when you see how he behaves with his offspring - he supports them similarly, or no?
And so it continues, from generation to generation and it is indeed difficult to say which way is the wiser – because et the same time the fast start most young families here get certainly helps them also start producing the offspring faster. You get young families with a stronger basis that way. But on the other hand it does produce grown-up baby type of people, if they go overboard with it, who expect to get everything handed to them on a tray, also by the government then, for example. I'd call them "unproven people". Because they are only all well until they are cared for... Should daddy cut off the monthly feeding line, or should anything happen to the family fortune – then what?? You can trust a man, or woman, who has shown he can emerge as a survivor from any situation. This kind of person you will gladly choose as your life partner or your friend because you know you can depend on him or her, that he will not become a burden, and - of course - you can respect him for the ability to stand strong. While what would you think of a man who instead of working, when bad times happen, or otherwise fighting to support himself and the family, lets his wife pawn her valuables, to help them both out? A baby? - A baby! I for one perfer to give birth to babies, but to marry a man.
Nothing wrong in judging. This is how the general morals and ethics of the society are formed and evolve - by us judging each other and trying to figure out what is bad and what is good. But you do not judge persons. You judge their behaviour, their values... everything that is really not them and what they can well choose to change, if want. In this way the standards are set that we do not even discuss so often because they are there already - we've learned them from watching the world and the others. Plus that intelligent, developed people usually do not mind being judged, or discussed. What is irrelevant you shrug off, while it is always good for self-development to have a multitude of opinions. Don't you need to know your weak points or how you come over?
I therefore pretty much hate those "I scratch your back then will you scratch mine?" type of "clubs" where the above goes lost. But they are an often forecoming reality. Man is still so weak, mostly, and very few can stand the truth, esp. about themselves.
Posted by metinoot (Member # 17031) on :
quote:Originally posted by Ayisha:
quote:Originally posted by metinoot:
quote:Originally posted by Dalia*:
quote:Originally posted by metinoot: Carrefour is a far cry from a Luxor souk, prices are always 5 times more in a western supermarket.
I am speaking about local vegetable sellers, not Western supermarkets.
And Laura and Ayisha are correct – many things are actually cheaper at Carrefour.
First time anyone on ES stated "cheap" at Carrefour, especially if its imported.
But I did state my confusion of your current residence.
file it, it might come up again in the future.
like you and tigerweed cannot get my child's birthday and birth year right?
Like how stine contacted my former landlord?
Posted by Two (Member # 17234) on :
quote:Originally posted by Exiiled: You also have a working ant mentality, I'm sure Queen Beatrix is proud of you.
Now run along before I get all 666 on you.
“Have you ever stood and stared at it? Marveled at its beauty; its genius? Billions of people, just living out their lives -- oblivious.”
Posted by anthropos (Member # 9410) on :
quote:Originally posted by metinoot:
quote:Originally posted by Ayisha:
quote:Originally posted by metinoot:
quote:Originally posted by Dalia*:
quote:Originally posted by metinoot: Carrefour is a far cry from a Luxor souk, prices are always 5 times more in a western supermarket.
I am speaking about local vegetable sellers, not Western supermarkets.
And Laura and Ayisha are correct – many things are actually cheaper at Carrefour.
First time anyone on ES stated "cheap" at Carrefour, especially if its imported.
But I did state my confusion of your current residence.
file it, it might come up again in the future.
like you and tigerweed cannot get my child's birthday and birth year right?
Like how stine contacted my former landlord?
She wants us to start writing about her daughter. Posted by Exiiled (Member # 17278) on :
quote:Originally posted by anthropos: here we have an example of perfect clash of civilizations. The individualism of the West clashes with the collective identity of the East. Children in the East never really leave the nest and the parents don't want them to either. In the West they want to fly off and are pushed by the parents and not really welcomed back. their nook in the nest is the computer room now.
You should post more. I think both offer something special to society. There is positivity with advocating individual freedom but it shouldn't amount to forsaking family. I think that's a dilemma that some people have a hard time accepting.
Posted by Exiiled (Member # 17278) on :
quote:Originally posted by Cheekyferret: That is true Anthropos, the minute you move out your room is either a study or a gym lol...
But I was pushed by my family to fulfil my dreams and travel and fly away and not and sit and stagnate like I have seen friends do.
I went to a school reunion last summer, one girl was horrified that I have never married or had kids as she has 6 kids... when I told her all have done since we left school she confessed she wished she had done what I have, I have never wanted her life.
My point is, it is easy to judge others if they do not lead the life expected of them, but it does not make them wrong. It makes them different.
Parents scheming on their child's room - “it's a doggy dog world.” I think questionmarks has such a room, let's call it 'the intolerance room', every time she reads or hears something different, she'll enter the room for solace, eventually exiting it as intolerant as ever. Posted by Exiiled (Member # 17278) on :
quote:Originally posted by Questionmarks: My point is that everybody is judging. You're just not aware of it! If Exiiled, Cheekyferret or Ayisha is judging others about how THESE people are, they are doing exactly the same as the ones they accusing...
I'll share a quote by the late Supreme Court Justice Oliver Wendall Homes Jr:
“The mind of the bigot is like the pupil of the eye, the more light you pour upon it the more it will contract”
That pretty much sums up the type of mentality you have. The more it is obvious that people are different the more you become intolerant and even justifying it as you are attempting now.
Rather than accept that people are different, you are now crying foul that people are intolerant of your intolerance. You deserve to have your own oxymoron coined.
Posted by Questionmarks (Member # 12336) on :
Nice post, Nevermind.
Posted by Ayisha (Member # 4713) on :
quote:Originally posted by metinoot:
quote:Originally posted by Ayisha:
quote:Originally posted by metinoot:
quote:Originally posted by Dalia*:
quote:Originally posted by metinoot: Carrefour is a far cry from a Luxor souk, prices are always 5 times more in a western supermarket.
I am speaking about local vegetable sellers, not Western supermarkets.
And Laura and Ayisha are correct – many things are actually cheaper at Carrefour.
First time anyone on ES stated "cheap" at Carrefour, especially if its imported.
But I did state my confusion of your current residence.
file it, it might come up again in the future.
like you and tigerweed cannot get my child's birthday and birth year right?
Like how stine contacted my former landlord?
i have never quoted your ex-childs birthdate year or anything, I don't know it and I care even less about it.
who the hell is stine? I have no idea what meds you are on but they need adjusting or changing........or is it you're not taking them?
First time you have mentioned anyone contacting a landlord. We've had mother and husband, I think, but not landlord.
Posted by Miss_Tigerlily (Member # 3567) on :
quote:Originally posted by Questionmarks: Nice post, Nevermind.
Yes I agree. Unfortunately Exiled decided not to respond to it.
Now here is an excellent article on Bill Gates and why his kids won't inherit most of his money. He still wants them to work.
Not wishing to join any "club" but will say I do enjoy reading both Questionmarks and Neverminds posts. They both come across as thoughtful, intelligent, caring women.
I may not always agree with them, but certainly respect the way they present their thoughts and ideas.
Posted by Questionmarks (Member # 12336) on :
I once talked with somebody who blamed his father for not giving his three children a house to live, or an appartment. The whole family lived in a familyhouse, each one floor, sharing the only bedroom with all the (adult) children. Father had 2 jobs, daughter worked two jobs also,but wasn't married because the family asked to much money, and the (adult) son spended his days in his bed. During the night he hung around on the streets with friends, doing everything God has forbidden. Anyway, thát son blamed his father.
I couldn't believe my ears. Why didn't he work for it himself? He still lived at home on the costs of his father with these two low payed jobs...Why wasn't he ashamed of his life, living as a parasite, while father and sister were working?
The funny is, this isn't Middle Eastern! The young man should liked me to believe that, but also the sisters were complaining about the brother, called him useless and a parasite. Also there it's honourable to work for the family! Or for wife and children...
Also in the Middle east you won't meet many people who are living their life like Exiiled does: no job, traveling, sometimes studieng, having a wife traveling with him. I know a doctor who owns >100 private clinics, but his son has to work. As he does, and he is almost 65...
TBH, I don't believe the story of Exiiled, so it isn't even worth the discussion. He can write whatever he likes...
Posted by Two (Member # 17234) on :
quote:Originally posted by Exiiled:
quote:Originally posted by Questionmarks: My point is that everybody is judging. You're just not aware of it! If Exiiled, Cheekyferret or Ayisha is judging others about how THESE people are, they are doing exactly the same as the ones they accusing...
I'll share a quote by the late Supreme Court Justice Oliver Wendall Homes Jr:
“The mind of the bigot is like the pupil of the eye, the more light you pour upon it the more it will contract”
That pretty much sums up the type of mentality you have. The more it is obvious that people are different the more you become intolerant and even justifying it as you are attempting now.
Rather than accept that people are different, you are now crying foul that people are intolerant of your intolerance. You deserve to have your own oxymoron coined.
It is not bigotry nor intolerance, it is indoctrination. We judge, ourselves and others, using the only system of reference we know. In schools we were not celebrated for our individuality but compared to one another on the basis of conformity. We were rated based on our acceptance of rules and ideas not questioning them, and on our ability to regurgitate them. We went to school to get high grades to go to university to get a degree that would lead to a good job. An easy system to measure success and failure. A mouse in a cage can be measured against another by how fast they get to the cheese. You never think of comparing a caged mouse to one who escapes the cage, the latter is just breaking the rules.
Posted by Two (Member # 17234) on :
quote:Originally posted by Questionmarks:
I couldn't believe my ears. Why didn't he work for it himself? He still lived at home on the costs of his father with these two low payed jobs...Why wasn't he ashamed of his life, living as a parasite, while father and sister were working?
I remember wondering about that too when "exiled" complained a while back (may be long time back) about his father not giving him what was rightfully his. I think he called it his "birth right". I never understood what system of belief made it his birth right.
Posted by Laura (Member # 879) on :
quote:Originally posted by Two:
quote:Originally posted by Exiiled:
quote:Originally posted by Questionmarks: My point is that everybody is judging. You're just not aware of it! If Exiiled, Cheekyferret or Ayisha is judging others about how THESE people are, they are doing exactly the same as the ones they accusing...
I'll share a quote by the late Supreme Court Justice Oliver Wendall Homes Jr:
“The mind of the bigot is like the pupil of the eye, the more light you pour upon it the more it will contract”
That pretty much sums up the type of mentality you have. The more it is obvious that people are different the more you become intolerant and even justifying it as you are attempting now.
Rather than accept that people are different, you are now crying foul that people are intolerant of your intolerance. You deserve to have your own oxymoron coined.
It is not bigotry nor intolerance, it is indoctrination. We judge, ourselves and others, using the only system of reference we know. In schools we were not celebrated for our individuality but compared to one another on the basis of conformity. We were rated based on our acceptance of rules and ideas not questioning them, and on our ability to regurgitate them. We went to school to get high grades to go to university to get a degree that would lead to a good job. An easy system to measure success and failure. A mouse in a cage can be measured against another by how fast they get to the cheese. You never think of comparing a caged mouse to one who escapes the cage, the latter is just breaking the rules.
I believe you are describing the Egyptian School System (sad indeed), and you are the only mouse on this thread that attended one. Correct me if I am wrong.
Posted by Two (Member # 17234) on :
quote:Originally posted by Laura:
quote:Originally posted by Two:
quote:Originally posted by Exiiled:
quote:Originally posted by Questionmarks: My point is that everybody is judging. You're just not aware of it! If Exiiled, Cheekyferret or Ayisha is judging others about how THESE people are, they are doing exactly the same as the ones they accusing...
I'll share a quote by the late Supreme Court Justice Oliver Wendall Homes Jr:
“The mind of the bigot is like the pupil of the eye, the more light you pour upon it the more it will contract”
That pretty much sums up the type of mentality you have. The more it is obvious that people are different the more you become intolerant and even justifying it as you are attempting now.
Rather than accept that people are different, you are now crying foul that people are intolerant of your intolerance. You deserve to have your own oxymoron coined.
It is not bigotry nor intolerance, it is indoctrination. We judge, ourselves and others, using the only system of reference we know. In schools we were not celebrated for our individuality but compared to one another on the basis of conformity. We were rated based on our acceptance of rules and ideas not questioning them, and on our ability to regurgitate them. We went to school to get high grades to go to university to get a degree that would lead to a good job. An easy system to measure success and failure. A mouse in a cage can be measured against another by how fast they get to the cheese. You never think of comparing a caged mouse to one who escapes the cage, the latter is just breaking the rules.
I believe you are describing the Egyptian School System (sad indeed), and you are the only mouse on this thread that attended one. Correct me if I am wrong.
I believe the vast majority of education systems are a system of indoctrination and it is only one part of a larger system. It just reinforces the belief that the only way to education is the standard school then college chain. Everything around us revolves around the rating system where university degrees are a measure of success.
Just a small example, for the longest time it was necessary when applying for a Canadian passport to have two "professionals" sign as guarantors. We had to pick from a list of "professions" that included lawyers, doctors, accountants and a few others. By inference, my barber is unprofessional and lacking in integrity. This is just a small example the entire judicial system is another that would completely fall apart if it people did not accept and abides by a system of rules that is totally illogical and laughable.
I did go to Egyptian schools but I do not know what mean if I was the only one. The only one on this board? In this thread? You know? Alive? Insane?
Posted by Exiiled (Member # 17278) on :
What's apparent is that members here will make up their own minds, accordingly. This is something that is most welcome. The progression of this thread started with my input about how my wife and I deal with finances to antropos post.
Questionmarks then asked questions, I obliged by answering them. She then asked some more, and again I obliged, then she blatantly lied about not giving an opinion, yet she was quick to use the words, no value, and no self esteem.
She then continued saying she did not understand how a working father could support a son. I thought she was sincere and proceeded to describe my father in the hopes of making the ignoramus understand. I am sure she used the words “I don't understand” more than a half dozen times.
It seems she wants to hear what she wants to hear. When I simply answer it's as if I was electrocuting her brain cells.
There's also an assumption that I was out of order by describing my dads merits. How many years have I been posting on ET, EM, ES and have never bragged. Sure I am proud of my father, but my previous post about his merits, was to show the kind of father that I had and why I am this way, which I am grateful for and especially greatful my parents are nothing like the parents that raised questionmarks. Yes I am proud.
Posted by Laura (Member # 879) on :
Two, your previous post was referring to school systems, not judicial ones.
I was under the impression you were trying to make a point based on that information and your lead in, to the mouse example, in reference to what has been said on this thread.
Off to finish packing and a well deserved 5 day vacation! Carry on.
Posted by Exiiled (Member # 17278) on :
quote:Originally posted by Two:
quote:Originally posted by Questionmarks:
I couldn't believe my ears. Why didn't he work for it himself? He still lived at home on the costs of his father with these two low payed jobs...Why wasn't he ashamed of his life, living as a parasite, while father and sister were working?
I remember wondering about that too when "exiled" complained a while back (may be long time back) about his father not giving him what was rightfully his. I think he called it his "birth right". I never understood what system of belief made it his birth right.
That was when me and my dad had a falling out back in 2005. He chastised me and reneged on his promises to give me what he promised me. He gave some great property to my oldest brother, including giving him huge start up capital (a lot of money). He gave my little brother assets as well, and me he showed me the door at the time. I thought I was back stabbed because in all my years traveling, I never asked about anything be put in my name, I was more than happy to see a deposit every month. So yeah I was hurt and furious. That was then, though.
The system of belief is very simple, my dad raised me and my brothers with the belief that everything he is doing is for us. That what he has is ours. You feed a kid that, you better deliever.
Again that was then. Posted by Questionmarks (Member # 12336) on :
quote:Originally posted by Exiiled: What's apparent is that members here will make up their own minds, accordingly. This is something that is most welcome. The progression of this thread started with my input about how my wife and I deal with finances to antropos post.
Questionmarks then asked questions, I obliged by answering them. She then asked some more, and again I obliged, then she blatantly lied about not giving an opinion, yet she was quick to use the words, no value, and no self esteem.
She then continued saying she did not understand how a working father could support a son. I thought she was sincere and proceeded to describe my father in the hopes of making the ignoramus understand. I am sure she used the words “I don't understand” more than a half dozen times.
It seems she wants to hear what she wants to hear. When I simply answer it's as if I was electrocuting her brain cells.
There's also an assumption that I was out of order by describing my dads merits. How many years have I been posting on ET, EM, ES and have never bragged. Sure I am proud of my father, but my previous post about his merits, was to show the kind of father that I had and why I am this way, which I am grateful for and especially greatful my parents are nothing like the parents that raised questionmarks. Yes I am proud.
It's not about you anymore, Exiiled. You have told us a story and ours the choice to believe it or not. I have asked questions indeed, because I thought it was rather unbelievable but at the moment you started to talk nasty, I didn't wanted to hear any more. I had no intentions to insult you,but I guess you took my questions or remarks in the negative. No problem for me anyhow, as long as you're a anonymous on the internet: go on as you like and let us make our own decisions and opinions.
Posted by Exiiled (Member # 17278) on :
quote:Originally posted by Questionmarks:
quote:Originally posted by Exiiled: What's apparent is that members here will make up their own minds, accordingly. This is something that is most welcome. The progression of this thread started with my input about how my wife and I deal with finances to antropos post.
Questionmarks then asked questions, I obliged by answering them. She then asked some more, and again I obliged, then she blatantly lied about not giving an opinion, yet she was quick to use the words, no value, and no self esteem.
She then continued saying she did not understand how a working father could support a son. I thought she was sincere and proceeded to describe my father in the hopes of making the ignoramus understand. I am sure she used the words “I don't understand” more than a half dozen times.
It seems she wants to hear what she wants to hear. When I simply answer it's as if I was electrocuting her brain cells.
There's also an assumption that I was out of order by describing my dads merits. How many years have I been posting on ET, EM, ES and have never bragged. Sure I am proud of my father, but my previous post about his merits, was to show the kind of father that I had and why I am this way, which I am grateful for and especially greatful my parents are nothing like the parents that raised questionmarks. Yes I am proud.
It's not about you anymore, Exiiled. You have told us a story and ours the choice to believe it or not. I have asked questions indeed, because I thought it was rather unbelievable but at the moment you started to talk nasty, I didn't wanted to hear any more. I had no intentions to insult you,but I guess you took my questions or remarks in the negative. No problem for me anyhow, as long as you're a anonymous on the internet: go on as you like and let us make our own decisions and opinions.
I don't care what you believe or don't believe. Nor do I care what anyone else believes. This is a forum of discussion, nothing more and nothing else.
But I will say this -you reap what you sow, so when writing about nastiness, look inward first, we all live in glass houses. And I can be very respectful, but can also get 666. You want respect, earn it.
Posted by Miss_Tigerlily (Member # 3567) on :
You want money, earn it.
Posted by Exiiled (Member # 17278) on :
double post
Posted by Exiiled (Member # 17278) on :
quote:Originally posted by Two:
quote:Originally posted by Exiiled:
quote:Originally posted by Questionmarks: My point is that everybody is judging. You're just not aware of it! If Exiiled, Cheekyferret or Ayisha is judging others about how THESE people are, they are doing exactly the same as the ones they accusing...
I'll share a quote by the late Supreme Court Justice Oliver Wendall Homes Jr:
“The mind of the bigot is like the pupil of the eye, the more light you pour upon it the more it will contract”
That pretty much sums up the type of mentality you have. The more it is obvious that people are different the more you become intolerant and even justifying it as you are attempting now.
Rather than accept that people are different, you are now crying foul that people are intolerant of your intolerance. You deserve to have your own oxymoron coined.
It is not bigotry nor intolerance, it is indoctrination. We judge, ourselves and others, using the only system of reference we know. In schools we were not celebrated for our individuality but compared to one another on the basis of conformity. We were rated based on our acceptance of rules and ideas not questioning them, and on our ability to regurgitate them. We went to school to get high grades to go to university to get a degree that would lead to a good job. An easy system to measure success and failure. A mouse in a cage can be measured against another by how fast they get to the cheese. You never think of comparing a caged mouse to one who escapes the cage, the latter is just breaking the rules.
This is the Brillant Post ... the caged mouse analogy. Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
I have to laugh that Exiiled has now gone from lazy to a liar.
Not having a great day are ya lol.
Ah well, why they are all out working robotically we can just sit back and get over it Posted by Exiiled (Member # 17278) on :
Cheeky – You're my hero. I'm awaiting the next label that conditioned minds generate. Well I hope they can save some of those labels until I get back tonight. Posted by Questionmarks (Member # 12336) on :
Well, at least it seems that I bring both of you a reason to have some fun. I never heard the expression : You can get 666. In my country 666 is somehow connected to the devil. Once, the footballresults were published on txt page 666 here. They changed it, because 666 was supposed to be the number of the devil.
Posted by Penny (Member # 1925) on :
There are very false views of western families being given here. When the world was a different place back in the 80's and 90's it was easy for young adults to step out into the world and make it on their own. Jobs were readily available, homes could be bought at prices within their reach.
Things are very different these days and if you talk to parents now you will find it is almost the norm now that young adults return to live back home after university and many many families are remortgaging their own homes to help their sons/daughters get a first foot on the property ownership ladder.
Western families may bring their children up to to work towards independance but they are just as loving and give support where it is needed as any Eastern family.
One of the really big differences is though, that help and support is freely given, it is not given with the expectation that it ties the children to the family and that it then gives the parents the right to demand things back from the children in the future.
Posted by Questionmarks (Member # 12336) on :
Most of the children here have to do it on their own. They have the choice to buy or rent. Buying indeed has become expensive, and there are parents rich enough to give them a start. Most of the parents are not able to do so, and in that case the young people rent or start with a special type of housing: Smarterbuying. They pay 70% of the value and when they sell it they receive 70% of that amount back.
Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
Parents giving children a lump sum start is no different from Exiileds Father dividing cash out into monthly amounts!
Dress it up as you please, parents who have the capability to help their children do!
Posted by Questionmarks (Member # 12336) on :
Most parents would, but most of them in another way. Frankly I don't care what that father did of still is doing, and what's the history behind that situation. It has become clear that my noseyness was too much to him, so I stop asking. I would be pleased if you don't throw oil on the fire, CF. I was talking to Penny about housing, and I wasn't dressing up anything.
Posted by Dilemma (Member # 16672) on :
You are so right Penny. My brother finished college last year with a Master degree in Science and moved back with my parents.
Lastly, I don't understand why Exiled story is unbelievable. My parents paid for all my schooling and living expenses while I was getting my degree for Petroleum Engineering. They only wanted me focusing on my studies and I am thankful and in return I paid for my brother schooling and living expenses.
Posted by Exiiled (Member # 17278) on :
quote:Originally posted by Questionmarks: Most parents would, but most of them in another way. Frankly I don't care what that father did of still is doing, and what's the history behind that situation. It has become clear that my noseyness was too much to him, so I stop asking. I would be pleased if you don't throw oil on the fire, CF. I was talking to Penny about housing, and I wasn't dressing up anything.
HA!
You are delusional, first it was of no-value, then lazy, then lying, now it's I'm afraid of your questions. It became abundantly clear that you have contempt for people like me. You are simply creepy, and here let me explain.
First go look in the mirror, you see those intolerant eyes with a narrow world view staring back at you? Well above them is the forehead, it's part of the cranium that houses the brain. A centimeter or so inward from the surface of your forehead lies the frontal lobe. This is the part of your brain that your parents (& society) obviously did a number on. It's also part of the brain that handles cognitive functions of which yours appears askew.
You are for the life of you, unable to self identify such a discussion as being a two way street. All you had to do was simply ask the questions you wanted but instead your contempt seethed and judged me every step of the way, creating labels and just being creepy. A Q & A requires sincerity, you weren't sincere at all. Your conditioned nastiness reeks in this thread but your mind delusively fails to see it.
Posted by Questionmarks (Member # 12336) on :
Is this 666??? And: Does it make you feel good???
Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
Dilemma, you have a point.... in Egypt parents have to pay thousands annually for a child to get a good basic education. Private schooling is not cheap here but parents who want the best for their kids pay the fees.
That is what parents with the ability to do so do.
Posted by Penny (Member # 1925) on :
quote:Originally posted by Exiiled:
quote:Originally posted by Questionmarks: Most parents would, but most of them in another way. Frankly I don't care what that father did of still is doing, and what's the history behind that situation. It has become clear that my noseyness was too much to him, so I stop asking. I would be pleased if you don't throw oil on the fire, CF. I was talking to Penny about housing, and I wasn't dressing up anything.
HA!
You are delusional, first it was of no-value, then lazy, then lying, now it's I'm afraid of your questions. It became abundantly clear that you have contempt for people like me. You are simply creepy, and here let me explain.
First go look in the mirror, you see those intolerant eyes with a narrow world view staring back at you? Well above them is the forehead, it's part of the cranium that houses the brain. A centimeter or so inward from the surface of your forehead lies the frontal lobe. This is the part of your brain that your parents (& society) obviously did a number on. It's also part of the brain that handles cognitive functions of which yours appears askew.
You are for the life of you, unable to self identify such a discussion as being a two way street. All you had to do was simply ask the questions you wanted but instead your contempt seethed and judged me every step of the way, creating labels and just being creepy. A Q & A requires sincerity, you weren't sincere at all. Your conditioned nastiness reeks in this thread but your mind delusively fails to see it.
QM is no different to your own mother and father, by your own admission in the earlier part of this thread neither of them are happy about the way you have chosen to live your life but obviously as the loving parents that they are, they have come to accept you are free to live your life as you choose.
So keep your toys in the pram and quit dishing out the personal slanders on people. I think it was you yourself that said your lifestyle meant grew up more slowly.
QM is not judging you as person but just as probably 95% of the rest of the world finds your lifestyle hard to understand when your income comes from the sucess and hard work done by earlier generations of your family. When you start the company/business your are planning on in the future you will then be in a postion to understand where QM is coming from. In the meantime just accept she is older and has more experience of life than you, same way your Mum and Dad have.
Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
Ah Penny... being older doesn't mean being wiser.
I am nigh on the same age as Exiiled, should I just accept the opinions of all those older. I think not!
Posted by samaka (Member # 9228) on :
quote:Originally posted by Cheekyferret: Dilemma, you have a point.... in Egypt parents have to pay thousands annually for a child to get a good basic education. Private schooling is not cheap here but parents who want the best for their kids pay the fees.
That is what parents with the ability to do so do.
They do this so that their children will get the best jobs with very good salaries to enable them to support themselves and their own children when they marry.
Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
quote:Originally posted by samaka:
quote:Originally posted by Cheekyferret: Dilemma, you have a point.... in Egypt parents have to pay thousands annually for a child to get a good basic education. Private schooling is not cheap here but parents who want the best for their kids pay the fees.
That is what parents with the ability to do so do.
They do this so that their children will get the best jobs with very good salaries to enable them to support themselves and their own children when they marry.
As opposed to?
Posted by Penny (Member # 1925) on :
quote:Originally posted by Cheekyferret: Ah Penny... being older doesn't mean being wiser.
I am nigh on the same age as Exiiled, should I just accept the opinions of all those older. I think not!
Of course not but people should accept everyone is entiled to their own opinions and be wise enough to agree to differ...politely.
Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
Ok, I just wondered why you said Exiiled should just accept QM is older with more experience of life.
Just sounded patronising.
Posted by samaka (Member # 9228) on :
quote:Originally posted by Cheekyferret:
quote:Originally posted by samaka:
quote:Originally posted by Cheekyferret: Dilemma, you have a point.... in Egypt parents have to pay thousands annually for a child to get a good basic education. Private schooling is not cheap here but parents who want the best for their kids pay the fees.
That is what parents with the ability to do so do.
They do this so that their children will get the best jobs with very good salaries to enable them to support themselves and their own children when they marry.
As opposed to?
What do you want me to oppose it to? Middle to upper-middle class Brits who do exactly the same as the Egyptians I know ie sacrifice everything to pay the fees for an expensive education to support their children before they make their OWN life.
Posted by Penny (Member # 1925) on :
quote:Originally posted by Cheekyferret: Ok, I just wondered why you said Exiiled should just accept QM is older with more experience of life.
Just sounded patronising.
I don't mean to sound patronising what i mean is Exiled should just have a bit of respect for QM's right to have an opinion that is not the same as his own, given that she has been on this earth a bit longer and by her experiences understands as NM wrote so well about the satisfation that self achievement brings to a persons life. Exiled has already stated he wants to start his own company so maybe he is feeling he wants that in his life, but for some reason does not want to admit this and is determined to start a fight and slander QM.
You yourself are your own self made woman and seem to have achieved that great thing many of us strive for...work/life balance. You have earned yourself those days in the sun by the pool with a good book.......so I don't understand why you are so determined to defend the opposite of what you have so worked hard for.
Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
I don't understand what you are getting at.
I can see you are stating the obvious but I don't see why.
Posted by Penny (Member # 1925) on :
ok I will just stick with my housework then, but if can't see Exiled's last post is very offensive then read it again.
Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
quote:Originally posted by Penny:
quote:Originally posted by Cheekyferret: Ok, I just wondered why you said Exiiled should just accept QM is older with more experience of life.
Just sounded patronising.
I don't mean to sound patronising what i mean is Exiled should just have a bit of respect for QM's right to have an opinion that is not the same as his own, given that she has been on this earth a bit longer and by her experiences understands as NM wrote so well about the satisfation that self achievement brings to a persons life. Exiled has already stated he wants to start his own company so maybe he is feeling he wants that in his life, but for some reason does not want to admit this and is determined to start a fight and slander QM.
You yourself are your own self made woman and seem to have achieved that great thing many of us strive for...work/life balance. You have earned yourself those days in the sun by the pool with a good book.......so I don't understand why you are so determined to defend the opposite of what you have so worked hard for.
Good explanation. Much respect But in contrast I think perhaps those who have been around a lot longer should be more tolerant of opinions that differ as well Exiileds story is not so unique... I know lots of parents who have given their children (in their 40's) lump sums of cash to clear debt. What is the difference?
I am not defending the opposite, I was defending the comments made about people who do not work are lazy, lack worth and have no value in society! Who the hell died and made someone so important enough to make such a statement.
When I am round the pool with my now excellent book... am I lazy, worthless or lacking in value?
ERM!!!
Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
quote:Originally posted by Penny: ok I will just stick with my housework then, but if can't see Exiled's last post is very offensive then read it again.
I should use quotation marks more to indicate whose comments i am referring to
I didn't understand what samaka was trying to get at.
Exiileds post was rude... but if someone called me lazy, worthless and lacking in value I am sure I would have also retaliated.
Posted by Penny (Member # 1925) on :
quote:Originally posted by Cheekyferret:
quote:Originally posted by Penny: ok I will just stick with my housework then, but if can't see Exiled's last post is very offensive then read it again.
I should use quotation marks more to indicate whose comments i am referring to
I didn't understand what samaka was trying to get at.
Exiileds post was rude... but if someone called me lazy, worthless and lacking in value I am sure I would have also retaliated.
No probs ...having a quick cofee between pushing the vacumn cleaner around....have yet to achieve work life balance
Nowhere did QM call him any of those things in fact she tried to understand things from his viewpoint. The fact he is spouting them now makes me wonder what insecurities he has probably built up from his parents saying those words to him.
Leopards don't change their spots the old Dunes may have grown up a bit into Exiiled but inside he is still the same person. He is just winding up here for one of his full blown attacks.
Posted by Mo Ning Min E (Member # 681) on :
I do suspect that in Egypt [as in most emerging economy countries] those people outside the highest socio-economic groups struggle to pay for a good education for their children partly as a form of insurance for old age. Also, a lot of these average guys will, when they get their career going, help out with school fees for younger siblings.
Certainly in the UK, we've been used to a culture of individual independence, and no doubt it has been horrifying during this recession, for adult children being obliged to give financial help to their parents whose nesteggs/share portfolios/company pensions etc have fallen off a cliff. And this IS happening! You may think you don't know anyone in that position, but they may not tell you, 'for shame!' How ridiculous is that? Criticising someone who chooses not to carry water, nor hew wood, just on some post depression era quaint idea about the nobility of human toil, heaping shame on them is just daft. If you can afford to not work, cool. If people like this spend, they help the economy by keeping others in employment, as do the unemployed. Ramsey McDonald [?]knew this, it was a cunning plan.[Bloody Ronald McDonald knows it too!] If 3 people in your office got laid off in the past few months, do you cut them dead? Of course not. Have YOU ever worked with colleagues who were plain bone idle [and maybe in senior positions and getting paid more?] I certainly have. Long term unemployed people are not threatening society by their 'idleness'. Thank God they are not offering to do your job for half the pay. The real recipients of social welfare benefits are greedy landlords [financed by greedy banks offering 'buy-to-let motgages] charging outrageous rents that hardly anyone could hope to pay out of normal unskilled wages. In the great scheme of fiscal policies, unemployed people are a necessity, and good luck to them, once my taxes are paid, it's not MY place to decide where it goes.
Posted by Penny (Member # 1925) on :
quote:Originally posted by Mo Ning Min E: The real recipients of social welfare benefits are greedy landlords [financed by greedy banks offering 'buy-to-let motgages] charging outrageous rents that hardly anyone could hope to pay out of normal unskilled wages.
Oh you mean families with large property porfolios, whose sons and daughters can then afford to live off those rents on a permanent gap year having fun.
Good point Posted by Mo Ning Min E (Member # 681) on :
Seriously Penny, I don't mean old money, big players.Those banks were pushing buy-to-lets really hard to anyone who'd got a bit of equity, around the time I came here. Part of the sell [I was told by a friend who got one - and he wasn't a rich guy!] was 'rent to housing benefit recipients, you can charge way over the going rate, no hassle with late payers...' etc etc] And now one of my daughters, who is divorcing, is struggling to pay an outrageous rent out of her wages.[and one false step, and they'll throw out her and her children, and get a dole family in, for even more!]
Posted by Penny (Member # 1925) on :
quote:Originally posted by Mo Ning Min E: Seriously Penny, I don't mean old money, big players.Those banks were pushing buy-to-lets really hard to anyone who'd got a bit of equity, around the time I came here. Part of the sell [I was told by a friend who got one - and he wasn't a rich guy!] was 'rent to housing benefit recipients, you can charge way over the going rate, no hassle with late payers...' etc etc] And now one of my daughters, who is divorcing, is struggling to pay an outrageous rent out of her wages.[and one false step, and they'll throw out her and her children, and get a dole family in, for even more!]
I know MN but thats the governments own fault too, they sold off the council housing stock and left themselves wide open to the private landlords. These things along with other factors have pushed the price of houses sky high and make it impossible for our young folk to buy a house now. I'm afraid though that alot of the type of landlords you are refering to are the Asian families and they do little to maintain the houses in good condition. The whole thing is a huge can of worms and there are many more factors than just the banks and buy to let that have caused it.
Posted by Questionmarks (Member # 12336) on :
Some people are born with advantages most of us don't have. They are smarter, prettier or just more wealthy. We are not created all the same, and in some aspects it's hard to understand each other. For example : an excellent sportsman never can be an excellent trainer; simply because he cannot imagine how an average player thinks, he is thát gifted that it is his nature. In this case an anonymous claims to be born thát wealthy that he never has to work for the rest of his life. That's not the same as parents paying a debt: in this case he never had to worry about money, and he never will have to worry or think it over. Money simply is not an issue, it never was and it never will be. That's rather unusual as I said earlier. Also unusual is that his father , who has worked for all this> seems to have no problem with it. To me that was strange. Also wealthy kids have to learn the value of putting time and energy in something, in order to reach a goal. Then it doesn't matter if it is a payed job or a voluntairy one. I am not born with a silver spoon in my mouth, and nothing has been presented on a silver plate. I'm a lot older as Exiiled is, and I still am not in the position that I never have to work.
Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
And if you didn't have to work would you?
Posted by ExptinCAI (Member # 1439) on :
quote:Originally posted by Exiiled:
quote:Originally posted by Questionmarks: Most parents would, but most of them in another way. Frankly I don't care what that father did of still is doing, and what's the history behind that situation. It has become clear that my noseyness was too much to him, so I stop asking. I would be pleased if you don't throw oil on the fire, CF. I was talking to Penny about housing, and I wasn't dressing up anything.
HA!
You are delusional, first it was of no-value, then lazy, then lying, now it's I'm afraid of your questions. It became abundantly clear that you have contempt for people like me. You are simply creepy, and here let me explain.
First go look in the mirror, you see those intolerant eyes with a narrow world view staring back at you? Well above them is the forehead, it's part of the cranium that houses the brain. A centimeter or so inward from the surface of your forehead lies the frontal lobe. This is the part of your brain that your parents (& society) obviously did a number on. It's also part of the brain that handles cognitive functions of which yours appears askew.
You are for the life of you, unable to self identify such a discussion as being a two way street. All you had to do was simply ask the questions you wanted but instead your contempt seethed and judged me every step of the way, creating labels and just being creepy. A Q & A requires sincerity, you weren't sincere at all. Your conditioned nastiness reeks in this thread but your mind delusively fails to see it.
Sadly, you haven't changed much from when you posted on here as Dunes, and you use to brag about how many Egyptian women you'd "date".
You should consider a career as a spin doctor, as you've always been full of it, and quick to attack anyone who catches on to you.
Posted by Questionmarks (Member # 12336) on :
quote:Originally posted by Cheekyferret: And if you didn't have to work would you?
Yes, of course. I would be a bit more selective, but I would work.
Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
So that works for you then...
I wouldn't. And if I win Lotto tonight I would be bloody over the moon.
Posted by Penny (Member # 1925) on :
quote:Originally posted by Cheekyferret: So that works for you then...
I wouldn't. And if I win Lotto tonight I would be bloody over the moon.
Me tooooooo oh heck but have never done the lottery....but think I have served my time when its comes to work.
Posted by Two (Member # 17234) on :
quote:Originally posted by Exiiled:
quote:Originally posted by Questionmarks: Most parents would, but most of them in another way. Frankly I don't care what that father did of still is doing, and what's the history behind that situation. It has become clear that my noseyness was too much to him, so I stop asking. I would be pleased if you don't throw oil on the fire, CF. I was talking to Penny about housing, and I wasn't dressing up anything.
HA!
You are delusional, first it was of no-value, then lazy, then lying, now it's I'm afraid of your questions. It became abundantly clear that you have contempt for people like me. You are simply creepy, and here let me explain.
First go look in the mirror, you see those intolerant eyes with a narrow world view staring back at you? Well above them is the forehead, it's part of the cranium that houses the brain. A centimeter or so inward from the surface of your forehead lies the frontal lobe. This is the part of your brain that your parents (& society) obviously did a number on. It's also part of the brain that handles cognitive functions of which yours appears askew.
You are for the life of you, unable to self identify such a discussion as being a two way street. All you had to do was simply ask the questions you wanted but instead your contempt seethed and judged me every step of the way, creating labels and just being creepy. A Q & A requires sincerity, you weren't sincere at all. Your conditioned nastiness reeks in this thread but your mind delusively fails to see it.
I had to go back and read QM's posts to find out whey people are attacking you. It looks to me that she asked you reasonable questions and did not insult you. She repeatedly explained that those where her views and how she perceived things. She could and obviously still can not understand your lifestyle. The insults you read were only in you mind.
Posted by Two (Member # 17234) on :
quote:Originally posted by Questionmarks:
quote:Originally posted by Cheekyferret: And if you didn't have to work would you?
Yes, of course. I would be a bit more selective, but I would work.
What does work do for you?
Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
I don't have a job It is illegal to work in Egypt on a touristic visa Posted by Dzosser (Member # 9572) on :
Man was not created to work..machines are doing most of the work nowadays...one must enjoy life to the utmost.
If you're poor..well that's too bad..go to work and miss all the fun tough luck I guess. Posted by Questionmarks (Member # 12336) on :
quote:Originally posted by Two:
quote:Originally posted by Questionmarks:
quote:Originally posted by Cheekyferret: And if you didn't have to work would you?
Yes, of course. I would be a bit more selective, but I would work.
What does work do for you?
Well,I have two kinds of work. A payed one and a unpayed one. The unpayed one offers more to me, and it has perspectives for the future. I would focous on that job and try to make it bigger as it is now.
Posted by Two (Member # 17234) on :
Imagine that you do not have to do the first kind of work that pays and you are free to do as much as you like of the one that you enjoy. Wouldn't that be great for you?
Posted by Questionmarks (Member # 12336) on :
Right now it would be nice. I have a history of working behind me, and then at a higher age I would have reached the luxury position that I didn't have to work in order to get money. Just like people from 65 get a pension in my country: they have worked enough and they saved monthly to come in this position. It would be a complete different story when I never had worked before. I wouldn't know the difference. Above that; it would feel wrong to me when I wouldn't have to do anything in order to get money. It would feel as if I didn't deserve that. Maybe that's the point: effort->deserve. When a team doesn't play with enough effort and energy, they don't deserve to win. When a person doesn't put effort, time and energy in his working carreer, and still get rewared, he doesn't deserve that. Like Paris Hilton; she lives her life from the money her family earned. People see that as something she doesn't deserve.
Posted by Exiiled (Member # 17278) on :
quote:Originally posted by Questionmarks: Is this 666??? And: Does it make you feel good???
Not it wasn't. Makes me feel good.
Your post was however a bit funny. Didn't think you had it in you. Posted by Exiiled (Member # 17278) on :
quote:Originally posted by Penny:
quote:Originally posted by Cheekyferret:
quote:Originally posted by Penny: ok I will just stick with my housework then, but if can't see Exiled's last post is very offensive then read it again.
I should use quotation marks more to indicate whose comments i am referring to
I didn't understand what samaka was trying to get at.
Exiileds post was rude... but if someone called me lazy, worthless and lacking in value I am sure I would have also retaliated.
No probs ...having a quick cofee between pushing the vacumn cleaner around....have yet to achieve work life balance
Nowhere did QM call him any of those things in fact she tried to understand things from his viewpoint. The fact he is spouting them now makes me wonder what insecurities he has probably built up from his parents saying those words to him.
Leopards don't change their spots the old Dunes may have grown up a bit into Exiiled but inside he is still the same person. He is just winding up here for one of his full blown attacks.
I love my spots and think they are maturing splendidly. But your anticipation might be disappointed, however, I'm sure it won't be the first time. Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
Paris Hilton also gets paid a lot for what she does. Sure, she is famous for being famous but her TV shows and film appearances are her now job!
Posh spice is the same, famous for being famous but her tv appearances and photo shoots still make her a high earner. She still has a job.
I would love a job like that, where I am the one in total control and others do as I tell them. MUHAHAHA
I hate working under people!
Posted by Questionmarks (Member # 12336) on :
quote:Originally posted by Exiiled:
quote:Originally posted by Questionmarks: Is this 666??? And: Does it make you feel good???
Not it wasn't. Makes me feel good.
Your post was however a bit funny. Didn't think you had it in you.
Have you ever read an old topic of yourself and felt embarrassed by the way you treated others?
Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
Nothing like being the mature one and just letting bygones be bygones.
Posted by Exiiled (Member # 17278) on :
quote:Originally posted by Questionmarks:
quote:Originally posted by Exiiled:
quote:Originally posted by Questionmarks: Is this 666??? And: Does it make you feel good???
Not it wasn't. Makes me feel good.
Your post was however a bit funny. Didn't think you had it in you.
Have you ever read an old topic of yourself and felt embarrassed by the way you treated others?
Never liked pettiness. I think you can learn a lot from Cheeky's last post. There's a lot of wisdom there.
Posted by Questionmarks (Member # 12336) on :
Yeah. I think Cheeky looks like her granny... And you?
Posted by Exiiled (Member # 17278) on :
quote:Originally posted by Questionmarks: Yeah. I think Cheeky looks like her granny... And you?
A human being. What about you?
Posted by Questionmarks (Member # 12336) on :
Me? I am relieved that you still are hostile and nasty. So I understood it right...
Posted by Exiiled (Member # 17278) on :
quote:Originally posted by Questionmarks: Me? I am relieved that you still are hostile and nasty. So I understood it right...
You didn't quite answer my question did you. Posted by Questionmarks (Member # 12336) on :
Retoric questions aren't meant to be answered, aren't they?
Posted by Exiiled (Member # 17278) on :
quote:Originally posted by Questionmarks: Retoric questions aren't meant to be answered, aren't they?
ok, sure, whatever.
Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
My Granny died 9 years ago.
Posted by Two (Member # 17234) on :
quote:Originally posted by Questionmarks: Right now it would be nice. I have a history of working behind me, and then at a higher age I would have reached the luxury position that I didn't have to work in order to get money. Just like people from 65 get a pension in my country: they have worked enough and they saved monthly to come in this position. It would be a complete different story when I never had worked before. I wouldn't know the difference. Above that; it would feel wrong to me when I wouldn't have to do anything in order to get money. It would feel as if I didn't deserve that. Maybe that's the point: effort->deserve. When a team doesn't play with enough effort and energy, they don't deserve to win. When a person doesn't put effort, time and energy in his working carreer, and still get rewared, he doesn't deserve that. Like Paris Hilton; she lives her life from the money her family earned. People see that as something she doesn't deserve.
I believe you're mixing up money with happiness and satisfaction. My question was to imagine if you did not have to take a job that was not satisfying and did the work that made you happy. Having money can give you the freedom to do the work you enjoy most. You do it because you enjoy it. You would not care if you get paid or not as it would be beside the point. Remember you said you have one job that paid you money and another that you enjoyed which means that the money you got from your first job was not rewarding. It did not make you happy. At the matter of fact you're being punished by having to work a job that is not enjoyable and satisfying to you. Having money would allow you to end the punishment and do the work you enjoy and because you enjoy it, you will be more productive and make others happy. Money is great at ending misery and giving you the opportunity to find your own happiness.
Your arguments here and in other posts have a lot in common with religion. That is without "work for money" (blind faith in the case of religion) one can not learn discipline (ethics and good moral values) and does not deserve happiness and that those who comply, by promise of reward or threat of punishment, lead a model life.
Posted by Questionmarks (Member # 12336) on :
It's not that black and white. The payed job doesn't make me unhappy, I never feel bad that I have to go to work; I simply like the unpayed one more. I am afraid I don't understand your remark about religion compared to work because again, it's not that black and white. I think people have to find a balance in life. Work is a substantial part of it, but also friendship is, or a roof above yr head...
Posted by Two (Member # 17234) on :
Work for money is not substantial part of life. Work as in engaging in life and interacting with people is. But best of luck with yours.
Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
Work isn't a substantial part of my life.
QM, you make such general statements.
Posted by Questionmarks (Member # 12336) on :
So, this really is a big difference. As far as I know, work is an important factor in the lives of all the people I know. Their aim is to get a job that gives them: *mental satisfaction *enough payment to live the life they want *for some also a certain status The biggest part of the day is filled with work, so it's important enough to make sure at least thát part is okay. It's the base of their lifes. From that base they build further: a house, a car, a family. I had no idea that even Western people could see it as not substantial. With no job or no income everything stops,
Posted by Two (Member # 17234) on :
You really don't read much do you? You've been going round and round in circles to no end.
IF YOU HAVE THE MONEY THEN YOU DO NOT HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT:
1-ENOUGH PAYMENT TO LIVE THE LIFE THEY WANT. 2-CERTAIN STATUS 3-HOUSE, A CAR, A FAMILY (I take it you mean they can afford raising a family not going to buy one)
You get it. We are assuming they have all the money they need, do they still have to work for money? GET ITTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTT.
Posted by Questionmarks (Member # 12336) on :
No. They get the money every month. There is no sum on the bank to get such kind of life.
Posted by Two (Member # 17234) on :
IF
I take it you're just playing stupid now not being your usual self. (also stupid )
Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
Christ on a bike!
I already gave you examples of the kinds of folk who do not have to work.
And I even missed out retired people, some of whom are only in their early 50's. Work is not the base of their lives.
Posted by Mo Ning Min E (Member # 681) on :
People DO get uncomfortable discussing a subject like this. [which was 'materialism' remember] You meet many people here in Egypt, expat workers, men mostly, who travel the world earning good money to 'provide for their families' and really regret missing out on family life, hardly know their own kids. Doing your best to raise a family, or provide for your own needs is intrinsic, cave dwellers did it ...... but .... in recent times it's come down to 'We've got a better cave than Ugg next door, the boys need better clubs to chase girls with' and as a consequence loads of people unknowingly driven by 'the system' are made to feel less than adequate unless they keep getting more of this, better that and so on. A fulfilling happy life can be financed by many means, and family money is one of those, idle happiness financed by state benefits is just another life choice, and if the drones out there try to make one feel guilty, remember .. the system has a plan, we've all been brainwashed in Western society to be obsessed by income.
I read an economist recently, he believes that raising the retirement age in Europe has a twofold benefit; The governments can hang onto your pension for longer and [proven] the more years you work, the more chance of dying earlier. It certainly also makes sure a younger unemployed person can't step into your job, so it's not to help with unemployment is it? 'Hard work never killed anyone'?
Don't make me laugh.
RESIST that 3D tv. And all those various i 'pods, pads, puds, and so on. Buy books on economics, know thy enemy.
Posted by Dzosser (Member # 9572) on :
The whole thing depends on the personality, if you're well off and go to work then you're ambitious and if you say I'm fine with what I've got then you're a loser..end of story.
BTW, I belong to the second lot, that's coz I can afford to do that and don't give a rat's ass to what people think of me, as long as I'm doing what I want, anytime I want. Posted by Ayisha (Member # 4713) on :
quote:Originally posted by Questionmarks: So, this really is a big difference. As far as I know, work is an important factor in the lives of all the people I know. Their aim is to get a job that gives them: *mental satisfaction *enough payment to live the life they want *for some also a certain status The biggest part of the day is filled with work, so it's important enough to make sure at least thát part is okay. It's the base of their lifes. From that base they build further: a house, a car, a family. I had no idea that even Western people could see it as not substantial. With no job or no income everything stops,
All based on the people she knows and what she assumes about them.
QM, there are many different people in the world different to the ones you know, not all are the same.
Like minded people normally befriend like minded people, so the reason this is based on those you know is because you have not branched out and met people not like yourself who may have the means to live without putting in what appears to you to be the 'effort' to earn the money.
Posted by samaka (Member # 9228) on :
One thing I admire about Questionmarks is she keeps her dignity throughout this discussion. This lady is more mature and really has style. Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
quote:Originally posted by Questionmarks: Yeah. I think Cheeky looks like her granny... And you?
Maturity and dignity.... Aaaaaaah that docile remark has made my day. If you think that comment is mature and dignified then there is something wrong with you
Posted by ExptinCAI (Member # 1439) on :
surely for a well-traveled, cosmopolitan gal such as you write you are, you can recognize a joke that doesn't translate into english/your culture.
Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
Oh that was a joke... oooooooooooo forgive me I am used to more intelligent humour
Where was the humour actually... I don't recall feeling that emotion rise in the slightest. Perhaps it was too intelligent for me and went over my head!
Has QM ever seen me? Or was it a joked based on my obvious maturity for someone much younger.
Answers on a postcard!
Address:
Ferret Cairo...
Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
Or were you talking about Samaka making a joke? Because if you were I saw the humour in that for sure. That tickled me pink all afternoon.
Posted by samaka (Member # 9228) on :
quote:Originally posted by Cheekyferret:
quote:Originally posted by Questionmarks: Yeah. I think Cheeky looks like her granny... And you?
Maturity and dignity.... Aaaaaaah that docile remark has made my day. If you think that comment is mature and dignified then there is something wrong with you
You are perfectly entitled to think there is something wrong with me. Fortunately, I don't worry about other people's opinions of me, I know my own character. Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
Oh I don't care what others think, but it was humerous you called her mature and dignified. It was rather ironic.
But if it was a joke on her behalf then excuse me, it must be a generation thing!
Posted by samaka (Member # 9228) on :
Why turn it into a joke? If I think someone makes good posts on ES, I say so.
It is a generation thing, we get older and hopefully get wiser, we learn not to attack other people in order to score points or, inflate our egos. We are here in this world to learn, do you agree?
Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
Ok, I am now SO confused!!!
No, I do not agree. Being older does not mean wiser, more dignified and based on the comment about my appearance, it definately does not mean being more mature.
At what exact age am I allowed to make child like remarks and have it deemed dignified and mature?
Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
I read an Emotional Psychology book last year that showed Emotional Intelligence (EQ) and age are not linked.
It showed older people may possess more self awareness but it stated that younger people can and do possess the same EQ compared to older people totally disproving the 'older means wiser'
Just thought I would mention that as it seems ES has a rather biased ageist view
Now as this thread has shown, we all have different opinions on the necessity of work. some believe it gives you self worth, value in society, money and something to do with your time (if you have a substantial amount of nothing else to do).
It seems while some are prepared to accept others way of life some simply don't have that tolerance for others.
When I work I did it for money to buy a nice life. Now I just have a nice life. But I still have my self worth (I have high self esteem) I still feel valued (by those who matter) and have a million and one things to be doing with my time. (a substantial amount doing things that make me very happy)
Posted by Questionmarks (Member # 12336) on :
quote:
Cheekyferret
Member Member # 15263
Rate Member posted 29 September, 2010 08:33 AM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- As my good ole gran used to say... only boring people get bored!
Speaking for the expat wags I know here in Egypt none of them are bored with the lavish lifestyles and the pamperings and pool trips that their partners salaries bring in. And speaking personally. I never tire of going to the pool and swimming and reading a good book!!! I have never sat in the sun wishing I was behind an office desk!!!
As for Exiiled, will your Father adopt me please?
Originally posted by Exiiled:
quote:Originally posted by Questionmarks:
quote:Originally posted by Exiiled:
quote:Originally posted by Questionmarks: Is this 666??? And: Does it make you feel good???
Not it wasn't. Makes me feel good.
Your post was however a bit funny. Didn't think you had it in you.
Have you ever read an old topic of yourself and felt embarrassed by the way you treated others?
Never liked pettiness. I think you can learn a lot from Cheeky's last post. There's a lot of wisdom there.
So, Miss says that her granny always said that only boring people get bored, Mr. thinks there is a lot of wisdom in her post, and this was reason for me to react that Miss must look like her granny. Big deal! Miss takes it out of the context and starts a fight because of that so called nasty remark. It is just looking for trouble... Posted by samaka (Member # 9228) on :
quote:Originally posted by Cheekyferret: Ok, I am now SO confused!!!
No, I do not agree. Being older does not mean wiser, more dignified and based on the comment about my appearance, it definately does not mean being more mature.
At what exact age am I allowed to make child like remarks and have it deemed dignified and mature?
I said hopefully as we get older we get wiser.
You can make childlike remarks for ever if you wish. I really do not think that saying you look like your granny was a serious comment.
You are not confused, you are just sidestepping the issue.
Do you think you are as mature as you will ever be, right now, or have you closed your mind and decided at 30 something you know everything there is to know?
Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
So it was an unfunny joke... aaah! back to sq 1.
'Side stepping' it by discussing it... ok, we seem to have different views on the meaning of 'side stepping' here.
Oh no, I love to learn, but only from those whose minds did not close 20 years ago. I read a lot, I mingle a lot and as sarcastically stated prior I have travelled... A LOT. My education is continual but generally I listen to wise people of any age.
My Grandma did state only boring people get bored.... aaah, you are calling me boring lol! Oh, she also said all men were either bastards or ugly lol...
And calling me 'it'... well, I now look up to your maturity and wisdom.
Wow, I have the song 'true colours' playing in my head, not the original obviously, I am too young for that Posted by samaka (Member # 9228) on :
quote:Originally posted by Cheekyferret: I read an Emotional Psychology book last year that showed Emotional Intelligence (EQ) and age are not linked.
It showed older people may possess more self awareness but it stated that younger people can and do possess the same EQ compared to older people totally disproving the 'older means wiser'
Just thought I would mention that as it seems ES has a rather biased ageist view
Now as this thread has shown, we all have different opinions on the necessity of work. some believe it gives you self worth, value in society, money and something to do with your time (if you have a substantial amount of nothing else to do).
It seems while some are prepared to accept others way of life some simply don't have that tolerance for others.
When I work I did it for money to buy a nice life. Now I just have a nice life. But I still have my self worth (I have high self esteem) I still feel valued (by those who matter) and have a million and one things to be doing with my time. (a substantial amount doing things that make me very happy)
CF you do not have to believe everything you read, after all everyone who reads this book is going to have a different point of view. You want to believe this because it suits your agenda right now.
I wasn't the one to mention age first, you were. I don't think ES has a biased view on age.
I never mentioned anything about what you do with your life and how happy you are because it is not my business. I simply said I thought QM made a good post.
Finally, you are the one who has shown a substantial degree of intolerance, by attacking those who do not agree with your point of view.
Can we leave this now please.
Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
Give me a pill ffs!
Penny first mentioned age. Then I think you tagged on. I first reacted to an off the cuff comment days ago.
I never attacked QM. I simply disagreed with her philosphy and opinions of people who do not have to work. Being a non-worker forgive me for defending my right to not be referred to in a negative manner.
And finally, I would rather believe an intellectual read written by psychologists than most of the drivel printed on here by people with tunnel vision.
Now... no one knows what I do with my life as times they are a changing but you are right, it is not your business.
QM does write some good posts... but I do not happen to just agree with everything one poster says based purely on their screen name.
Now, back to materialism, shall we talk about all Exiileds money that he doesn't have to work for Posted by samaka (Member # 9228) on :
quote:Originally posted by Cheekyferret: So it was an unfunny joke... aaah! back to sq 1.
'Side stepping' it by discussing it... ok, we seem to have different views on the meaning of 'side stepping' here.
Oh no, I love to learn, but only from those whose minds did not close 20 years ago. I read a lot, I mingle a lot and as sarcastically stated prior I have travelled... A LOT. My education is continual but generally I listen to wise people of any age.
My Grandma did state only boring people get bored.... aaah, you are calling me boring lol! Oh, she also said all men were either bastards or ugly lol...
And calling me 'it'... well, I now look up to your maturity and wisdom.
Wow, I have the song 'true colours' playing in my head, not the original obviously, I am too young for that
Read what you have just written about, now tell me it is a mature post?
Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
I would say line 1 was factual.
Line 2 was stating the obvious.
Line 3 would be considered 'mature' as I have the ability to develop my own opinions based on facts and not just follow the crowd or announcing I am speaking for the masses in an attempt to gain respect.
Line 4 was me remembering the words of a lovely old lass who made me laugh with her words.
Line 5 was an observation of someone's immaturity
and finally, Line 6 was sarcasm. Or more a pun based on the obvious ageism flying around.
There would have been a line 7 but I rose above it.
Now, do you want to analyse it and give me your point of view?
Posted by samaka (Member # 9228) on :
No, I want to take this opportunity to say that anyone who ever made judgement on the British from CF's numerous posts on ES, had the opportunity tonight to see that we are all very different. I wanted to say that for a long time. My final word. Posted by Cheekyferret (Member # 15263) on :
Oh Amen to that! And thank God as well.
But I am quite sure I was trying to point out way back in the thread that judging others based on a common bond was futile and ignorant. (People who do not work being the subject).
But it is nice you spelled out the obvious again.
And mabrouk for typing what you wanted to type for so long, I think you just discovered the actual meaning of 'side stepping'.
Posted by anthropos (Member # 9410) on :
hmmm....and not one word about my problem.
Posted by Exiiled (Member # 17278) on :
quote:Originally posted by Cheekyferret: Oh Amen to that! And thank God as well.
But I am quite sure I was trying to point out way back in the thread that judging others based on a common bond was futile and ignorant. (People who do not work being the subject).
But it is nice you spelled out the obvious again.
And mabrouk for typing what you wanted to type for so long, **I think you just discovered the actual meaning of 'side stepping'**.
Good one, Cheeky.
I mean hell, I mean some members here try to use every dirty trick in the book to bind a person. Personally I love a little bondage but I mean come on. Seriously they'll throw out the age thing, and say something like hey young man/ young woman, you are having a discussion with someone older, more mature, show some respect.
I respect older people. But when an old hen/rooster is continuously pecking away at my toes, I'll eventually kick it to the side. After all we are all adults. I think some members here are closer to dementia than they think. Because clearly, they are unable to identify the nastiness in their own threads. Such petty mentalities.
Hey when I choose to be rude, I purposely do it, often in retaliation, because I can't be magnanimous all the time. At I don't mask my rudeness like some “mature” folk here.
Posted by stayingput (Member # 14989) on :
quote:Originally posted by anthropos: hmmm....and not one word about my problem.
Posted by Ayisha (Member # 4713) on :
quote:Originally posted by samaka:
Finally, you are the one who has shown a substantial degree of intolerance, by attacking those who do not agree with your point of view.
I disagree. Ferret has all along tried to be allowed a viewpoint and has tried to point out people are different and for QM to see that without throwing negative insults about. QM was actually the one who wanted 'an explanation' from exiled about his situation, which he's given and been questioned on, he's even had to explain his father! That is intolerance.
Posted by Mo Ning Min E (Member # 681) on :
I think some members here are closer to dementia than they think.
Oh s**t, forgot what I was going to write..... Posted by Exiiled (Member # 17278) on :
quote:Originally posted by Mo Ning Min E: I think some members here are closer to dementia than they think.
Oh s**t, forgot what I was going to write.....
Is Ok. On occasion happens to me too. Posted by Miss_Tigerlily (Member # 3567) on :
quote:Originally posted by Exiiled: I mean hell, I mean some members here try to use every dirty trick in the book to bind a person. Personally I love a little bondage but I mean come on. Seriously they'll throw out the age thing, and say something like hey young man/ young woman, you are having a discussion with someone older, more mature, show some respect.
I respect older people. But when an old hen/rooster is continuously pecking away at my toes, I'll eventually kick it to the side. After all we are all adults. I think some members here are closer to dementia than they think. Because clearly, they are unable to identify the nastiness in their own threads. Such petty mentalities.
Hey when I choose to be rude, I purposely do it, often in retaliation, because I can't be magnanimous all the time. At I don't mask my rudeness like some “mature” folk here.
Hellooooooo???
This is an internet forum and as far as I remember anyone can give his opinion about anything. It comes down to you not to give with a ratsass about what someone writes; you don't have to like it.
If you wouldn't have bragged about your so different lifestyle you are leading - than the rest of us - in the first place this thread would have never gotten out of hand like this.
IMHO there is nothing wrong with you having so much money in life that you perhaps never have to work but to brag about it and to look basically down on people who working hard with their own hands to make a living is a totally different story.
I do hope that if you have a son or daughter one day you will change your ways. Believe me children change people for the better. The focus in life will switch from you to your offspring and you only wan't the best for them. I hope one day you'll be able to say to them: "Work hard to live a decent life - just like your father".
EOS
Posted by metinoot (Member # 17031) on :
really surprised for tigerweed to make such a statement/rant; especially since she's so proud of the fact that she doesn't have to work to support her family the US tax payer does.
Can't forget the times she went on about how other ESers were jealous of how she doesn't have to work, but can sit on her ass all day parked in front of the internet.
Posted by Miss_Tigerlily (Member # 3567) on :
quote:Originally posted by metinoot: really surprised for tigerweed to make such a statement/rant; especially since she's so proud of the fact that she doesn't have to work to support her family the US tax payer does.
Can't forget the times she went on about how other ESers were jealous of how she doesn't have to work, but can sit on her ass all day parked in front of the internet.
Jealous, Sonomod????
Jealous because I have a loving and supportive husband, a great family life and enough money to raise 6 children??
You don't have to. Remember you reap what you sow. In your case you abandoned your daughter when she was just a toddler and your work ethic isn't much to be admired either as you are constantly unemployed. Be proud of yourself really.... what a waste.
Posted by metinoot (Member # 17031) on :
quote:Originally posted by Miss_Tigerlily:
quote:Originally posted by metinoot: really surprised for tigerweed to make such a statement/rant; especially since she's so proud of the fact that she doesn't have to work to support her family the US tax payer does.
Can't forget the times she went on about how other ESers were jealous of how she doesn't have to work, but can sit on her ass all day parked in front of the internet.
Jealous, Sonomod????
Jealous because I have a loving and supportive husband, a great family life and enough money to raise 6 children??
You don't have to. Remember you reap what you sow. In your case you abandoned your daughter when she was just a toddler and your work ethic isn't much to be admired either as you are constantly unemployed. Be proud of yourself really.... what a waste.
Why would I be jealous of a lass who spent 10 years raising her children on her own while her hubby was off killing Muslim civilians?
My tax dollars paid for a war and your expenses.
I work. You on other hand, there is no way to verify anything you claimed in your pre-marriage fantasy past is true.
For all ES knows you were a hussy who worked hard to pick up GIs and get on the American dole.
Why would anyone be jealous of you, you even dropped of East German high school and had no father growing up. No wonder you live in a fantasy world. Posted by anthropos (Member # 9410) on :
"no father growing up"
???
Says the woman who has a daughter who has no mother growing up.
Posted by Questionmarks (Member # 12336) on :
And so we all seem to have something inside us what the other one does not seem to appreciate. We all express this in another way. Some sound embarassing.... Posted by Ayisha (Member # 4713) on :
quote:Originally posted by metinoot:
My tax dollars paid for a war and your expenses.
she's right TL, thank her for working and paying enough tax to buy a pencil for Army issue.
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