EgyptSearch Forums: Hearing an 'Ancient Egyptian' speak

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Posted by Wally (Member # 2936) on :

I once had a neighbor who had a friend from Nigeria. He was from the Yoruba ethnic group. His name was Se, which was pronounced 'shay.' I had read olumide lucas' work regarding the Ancient Egyptian origin of the Yoruba. I knew that word 'Se' was also an Egyptian word meaning 'son.' Having gotten to know Se, and being curious about Lucas' thesis, I asked him once how do you say 'to wipe or to erase' in Yoruba. I knew this relatively obscure Egyptian word was written 'noo' in Egyptian. He rubbed his chin, mumbling apologetically that his own language had become faulty from speaking so much English. Then suddenly remembering, he exclaimed ''Nnuu", and sounding very nasally. I immediately thought, "Oh, my God, Lucas was right!", and so too was Budge's translation!

Since that time, it has always amused me to see people speculate on the Ancient Egyptian religion and their gods when it and they are very much alive and well in Yorubaland!
>Noo - EHD 346a
>Se - EHD 583b

Posted by Kem-Au (Member # 1820) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Wally:
I once had a neighbor who had a friend from Nigeria. He was from the Yoruba ethnic group. His name was Se, which was pronounced 'shay.' I had read olumide lucas' work regarding the Ancient Egyptian origin of the Yoruba. I knew that word 'Se' was also an Egyptian word meaning 'son.' Having gotten to know Se, and being curious about Lucas' thesis, I asked him once how do you say 'to wipe or to erase' in Yoruba. I knew this relatively obscure Egyptian word was written 'noo' in Egyptian. He rubbed his chin, mumbling apologetically that his own language had become faulty from speaking so much English. Then suddenly remembering, he exclaimed ''Nnuu", and sounding very nasally. I immediately thought, "Oh, my God, Lucas was right!", and so too was Budge's translation!
Since that time, it has always amused me to see people speculate on the Ancient Egyptian religion and their gods when it and they are very much alive and well in Yorubaland!
>Noo - EHD 346a
>Se - EHD 583b

Interesting. My doctor is from Nigeria. He told me about the Yoruba people. I plan to visit Nigeria (and Egypt) next year, so I will definitely try to learn as much as possibly I can in a few days.

BTW, if you haven't already done so, you might want to read Moustafa Gadalla's Exiled Egyptians. He makes a strong case that there are a number of populations that descend from AE's, including Sa-u, Hausa, Ghana, and others.

His argument is that West Africa was scarely populated until around the time that the Arabs invaded Africa. The Egyptians and other East Africans who fled moved deeper into Africa and formed colonies, some of which are still around today. This is why the language is still spoken.

Posted by ausar (Member # 1797) on :

Gadalla is actually correct about the population in Western and Central Africa being so small that it barely supported anybody. If you study deeply the pre-history of Western Africa we don't witness large populations untill about 1500 B.C. with the rising of the Kintampo culture. What little population existed in the Western Africa was mostly around areas like Southern Mauritania and other areas in Mali.

The Greco-Roman historians only record little small pgmy type people that lived in caves or other types or other types of people like the Khoi-san. No where does any Greco-Roman historian mention tall people living any where near Western Africa. Study the archeology of Western Africa and you will see the exact point. People have been living there since about 15,000 B.C. but in small pockets.

Matter of fact,most Western Africans themselve have stories in their folklore about meeting little small people and either driving them out or mixing with them.

Posted by Marcus (Member # 3035) on :

I wouldn't be surprised if the Hausa have Ancient Egyptian ancestry, but to suggest a straight AE lineage is silly (skull measurements for one). Interesting topic.

By the way, Kem-Au, have you been to Nigeria before? I found Lagos to be overwhelming. What part(s) of Nigeria are you visiting?

Posted by Kem-Au (Member # 1820) on :

quote:
Originally posted by Marcus:
I wouldn't be surprised if the Hausa have Ancient Egyptian ancestry, but to suggest a straight AE lineage is silly (skull measurements for one). Interesting topic.
By the way, Kem-Au, have you been to Nigeria before? I found Lagos to be overwhelming. What part(s) of Nigeria are you visiting?

No, I've never been Nigeria. And he did say that Lagos is a very big city, similar to NY. But I live right next to NY, so I'm used to that. But I don't plan to spend all my time in Lagos, though that probably will be the first.

It would probably be foolish to assume I could visit a people like the Yoruba. Though I've heard that they are very friendly people, they are said to be very tribal and I doubt these transportation that would take me there, but who knows.

As I found this comment interesting:

"but to suggest a straight AE lineage is silly (skull measurements for one)"

I don't see the connection. West Africans are a very diverse people, and most scholars like Gadalla and Diop who write about AE movements into other parts of Africa document their findings with cultural and linguistic characteristics that still survive today.

To say that skull measurements could refute the their arguments is shaky. Where were these skulls taken from? Is there a uniform skull type in AE, or in other African cultures? Doubtful. The African population is very diverse, and always has been. Even amongst people in the same groups.

[This message has been edited by Kem-Au (edited 15 February 2004).]

Posted by Marcus (Member # 3035) on :

quote:
And he did say that Lagos is a very big city, similar to NY. But I live right next to NY, so I'm used to that. But I don't plan to spend all my time in Lagos, though that probably will be the first.

I expected it to be a more urban, larger version of Accra, Ghana..it wasn't JUST because of its size. (I've travelled extensively so I'm used to big city environments.)

quote:
Is there a uniform skull type in AE, or in other African cultures? Doubtful. The African population is very diverse, and always has been. Even amongst people in the same groups.

Good point.

quote:
I don't see the connection. West Africans are a very diverse people, and most scholars like Gadalla and Diop who write about AE movements into other parts of Africa document their findings with cultural and linguistic characteristics that still survive today.

Cultural and linguistic evidence doesn't necessarily = straight AE lineage.

I'm not disputing their findings. Like I said, it's likely the Hausa have AE ancestry. By the way, I don't think there are many (if any) pure blooded Egyptians left.

[This message has been edited by Marcus (edited 17 February 2004).]

Posted by ausar (Member # 1797) on :

Personally,I feel that people from Upper Egypt are about the purest desendants of the ancinet Egyptians you are going to get. Most have been isolated from foreigners most of their existence with the exception of some mixing with Arabs mostly in Middle Egypt.

Posted by Kem-Au (Member # 1820) on :

i don't think there's a such thing as pure blooded anything that existed thousands of years ago. people mix and always will. i agree with ausar that the upper egyptians are basically the same people that have inhabited the land since dynastic times.

i can't prove this, but i'd guess any AE migrants would've mixed with someone along the way. but that's just a guess. but there are a number of groups that bear a stiking resemblance to AE's.