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OT: 100 things you SHOULD know about Africa
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[QUOTE]Originally posted by Supercar: [QB] [QUOTE]Originally posted by Mustafino: [QUOTE]You'll have to show a source for your claim about #5, I think you're lying, Europeans weren't even white at the time anyways. I believe this to be the era of the Gramaldi Black Man.[/QUOTE]One, Grimaldi man was actually a boy and his mother. They were found among Cor-Magnon. An outlier. So they were hardly the majority. Finally we have no clue as to Grimaldi's skin color. Back on topic. Whatever colors Europeans had at the time, they were still European.[/QUOTE]Do you think that the Cro-magnon crania look like those of contemporary Europeans? [QUOTE]Mustafino: [QUOTE] #9 Nubia has already been confirmed as the first Monarchy in history, this is indisputable. No need to obscure the facts. http://www.homestead.com/wysinger/qustul.html [/QUOTE]Not quite Abydos and Naqada predate Qustul http://xoomer.alice.it/francescoraf/hesyra/dynasty00.htm http://www.narmer.pl/dyn/00en.htm [/QUOTE]The Abydos royal tomps are in what was part of the "Nagadan complex". You use them separately as if you didn't know that; but then, you likely didn't. Those Royal Tombs are 'contemporaneous' with those found in Ta-Seti group burials at Qustul. The former doesn't precede the latter. [QUOTE]Mustafino: While you are at it, look up: Bruce B. Williams, The Qustul Incense Burner and the Case for a Nubian Origin of Ancient Egyptian Kingship; Joseph W. Wegner or just read this [URL=http://groups.google.com/group/alt.history.ancient-egypt/msg/06821b92af4eb822?]response[/URL][/QUOTE]Actually Wegner offered very little rebuttal in way of William's claim, and in fact, William even responded to such critiques by demonstrating how they misquote him, and engage in strawman argumentation. You can read Bruce William in his own words here: http://wysinger.homestead.com/menes.pdf ...instead of reading critiques who have no clue about what they are talking about. From the horse's mouth: [i]At the heart of Adams’s [b]objections[/b] is his assertion that “Lost Pharaohs” claimed a Nubian origin for the “immemorial” pharaonic monarchy. [b]No such claim was made in that article or in any other publication which has had my advance approval.[/b] More specifically, the words “participation” and “helped” [b]fashion pharaonic civilization” were used.[/b][/i] - Bruce Williams, [i][b]Forebears of Menes in Nubia: Myth or Reality?[/b][/i] That the Ta-Seti elites would have been instrumental in the lead up to the formation of the Egyptian state, is without doubt; the importance of the "white crown" regalia throughout dynastic Egypt is evidence enough of this. This point, as raised by Williams, has not been refuted! ^It is supported by studies like: [i]"A biological affinities study based on frequencies of cranial nonmetric traits in skeletal samples from three [b]cemeteries at predynastic Naqada[/b], Egypt, confirms the results of a recent nonmetric dental morphological analysis. Both cranial and dental traits analyses indicate that the [b]individuals buried in a cemetery characterized archaeologically as high status are significantly different from individuals buried in two other, apparently nonelite cemeteries and that the nonelite samples are not significantly different from each other.[/b] [b]A comparison with neighboring Nile Valley skeletal samples suggests that the [b]high status cemetery represents an endogamous ruling or elite segment of the local population at Naqada, which is more closely related to populations in northern Nubia than to neighboring populations in southern Egypt.[/b][/i] Extract from: American Journal of Physical Anthropology, Vol. 101, Issue 2, October 1996, Pages: 237-246 [QUOTE]Mustafino: [QUOTE] #10, this would seem to suggest a "sub-saharan" body plan, as north Africa is not in the "Tropics" idiot. You must of missed the phrase "Black African", even though we all know there were no "White" Africans at that time anyways. Here's the actual study. http://www.homestead.com/wysinger/egyptian_body_proportions.pdf [/QUOTE]Already read the study. I remember a part in the abstract. "The change found in body plan is suggested to be the result of the later groups having a more tropical (Nilotic) form than the preceding populations." The White claim is of course a strawman. The fact remains earlier groups had a less tropical form.[/QUOTE]It's relative, and nothing to do with earlier Nile Valley groups not having tropical body plans. Simply put, S. Zakrzewski said that: [i]The nature of the body plan was also investigated by comparing the intermembral, brachial, and crural indices for these samples with values obtained from the literature. No significant differences were found in either index through time for either sex. The raw values in Table 6 suggest that Egyptians had the “super-Negroid” body plan described by Robins (1983). The values for the brachial and crural indices show that the distal segments of each limb are longer relative to the proximal segments than in many “African” populations ( data from Aiello and Dean, 1990 ). This pattern is supported by Figure 7 ( a plot of population mean femoral and tibial lengths; data from Ruff, 1994 ), which indicates that the [b]Egyptians generally have tropical body plans.[/b] Of the Egyptian samples, [b]only the Badarian and Early Dynastic[/b] period populations have shorter tibiae than predicted from femoral length. [b]Despite these differences, **all samples** lie relatively **clustered together** as compared to the other populations."[/b][/i] [QUOTE]Mustafino: Also, let's not forget that Dr. Kamal from the Cairo Med school sampled DNA from construction workers at the pyramids and stated they were similar in pattern to that of modern Egyptians. Multi ethnic.[/QUOTE]...and what specific lineages did Dr. Kamal find from "ancient Specimens", which remarkably survived DNA contamination? [QUOTE]Mustafino: [QUOTE]The Meroitic script is an alphabet of Egyptian hieroglyphic and Demotic origin that was used to write the Meroitic language of the Kingdom of Meroë by at least c. 200 BC — and possibly also the Nubian language of the successor Nubian kingdoms, that was later written in a Greek uncial alphabet which adopted three of the old Meroitic glyphs. Being primarily alphabetic, the Meroitic script worked in quite a different way from Egyptian hieroglyphs. Some scholars, e.g. Haarmann, believe that the Greek alphabet played a role in its development, primarily because Meroitic had letters for vowels; although in other respects it did not function much like Greek.[/QUOTE][/QUOTE]Greeks had no role whatsoever in the development of Meroitic script. It used Egyptic scripts as a basis, i.e. the demotic script, and remotely with the Heratic script, with local Meroitic developments infused to make it a unique and original script in its own right. The script has nothing to do with Europeans or Indians, and you haven't produced any shred of evidence of this. [QUOTE]Mustafino: [QUOTE] #45. Everything about Timbuktu is confirmed and documented, it would be a real stretch to say that these facts are fabricated, you can read about Timbuktu any where. [/QUOTE]Interesting how it reached it's zenith in the 16th century bot only a population of 40,000 http://worldheritage.heindorffhus.dk/frame-MaliTimbuktu.htm While London has been estimated from 50 to 100 thousand during the 14th century. [/QUOTE]During the height of Mali's wealth, no European country could compare, and especially not London. Mali was so wealthy and on the map of the world then, that European artists actually painted cartoons of the Malian leader, identified as Mansa Musa. Mansa Musa was known in Southern Europe, and of course, the southwest Asian world, which was having a gloden era under the 'Arab' mantle. London was not quite on the economic map of known parts of the world during the height of Malian wealth. BTW, on what "primary texts" dating back to the height of Malian wealth, are you basing the population numbers...written by whom, and where at the time? [/QB][/QUOTE]
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