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Were the Moors black?
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[QUOTE]Originally posted by Doug M: [QB] Mr Patriot, you are the one presenting silliness. The Greeks did not invent "civilization" as a separate and distinct activity SEPARATE from all the other civilizations of the ancient world. Their civilization was "homegrown" but with DIRECT influence from the older civilizations of the East as well as Africa. You have yet to address HOW ancient Greece is "WESTERN" when NONE of Greece is in Western Europe and the culture and identity of ancient Greece had NOTHING in common with the Western parts of Europe at the time. The culture and civilization of ancient Greece had CLOSE similarities with the EAST as it is the EAST and Africa where civilization originated. No matter how you slice it or how you try and claim it as being otherwise, Greece is NOT the birthplace of civilization. It is ONE civilization of MANY that have come along and ALL of them have DEEPLY influenced Western thought and culture. All this nonsense about Afrocentric this and that has NOTHING to do with this point. Show me how Greek culture is WESTERN when NONE of it originates IN THE WEST. NONE of it. When YOU can show me this, then I will listen to you, because you haven't got a CLUE what you are talking about. "Western" civilization is a MODERN geopolitical term referring to the MODERN cultures of Western Europe and the colonies they created. NONE of these cultures had ANY DIRECT connection to ancient Greece. NONE of them. Not Britain, Not Germany, Not France and Not the Americas. The only ones that had any contact with ancient Greece was parts of Italy and Spain. MOST of the "Greek world" was in the EAST and it is in the EAST that Greek culture had the BIGGEST impact. But this was a CONTINUATION of the activities of VARIOUS civilizations that had ALREADY been active in these regions for 3000 years. NOBODY disputes this, except you. So why don't YOU can show how the WESTERN world had DIRECT contact with ancient Greece and SIMILAR patterns of culture and thought as the Greeks? YOU CANT. There was no ancient Greece when the term "Western" civilization was created and the cultures that created it had NO contact with ancient Greece. No scholar disputes this except YOU. Influence is not direct contact. The WRITINGS of the ancient Greeks had INFLUENCE over the development of the "Western" world, but so did Egypt, China, Mesopotamia, Babylon, the Americas and many other cultures, because "Western" culture as it expanded INTERACTED with and ABSORBED many of the traditions of ALL these ANCIENT civilizations and added them to its own "cultural" framework. You need to stop spouting propaganda and start making sense. [/QB][/QUOTE]
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