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THE PRESENCE OF AFRICAN INDIVIDUALS IN PUNIC POPULATIONS FROM THE ISLAND OF IBIZA (SPAIN): CONTRIBUTIONS FROM PHYSICAL ANTHROPOLOGY
Nicholas Márquez-Grant*
ABSTRACT: The origin of the Punic population of Ibiza has been a much debated issue, not only in the field of anthropology, but in archaeology as well. The establishment of rural settlements and the apparent demographic growth throughout the island, especially from the 4th century BC onwards, has been mainly recognised as the result of a colonization process involving a large-scale immigration of people. The material culture from this period seems to indicate that the probable origin of these immigrants was the area of the Central Mediterranean, especially Carthage. This paper compares measurements from Ibizan skulls dating from between the sixth and second centuries BC with craniometric data from modern American populations by employing the forensic discriminant functions of the FORDISC 2.0 (Ousley and Jantz, 1996) computer program. In spite of the method’s limitations, the results seem to suggest the presence of several individuals of North African and sub-Saharan ancestry in Punic Ibiza.
posted A variety of results is present above in terms of probability, typicality and group categories. Those skulls providing a high probability (>80%) and high typicality (>80%)can be identified through the American reference sample as individuals of Caucasian or sub-Saharan ancestry. This is only provided by skull PORT-V identified as ‘White female’. However, skulls VR47/U30, PCHN-H10, PORT-III, PORT-IV, CNE-5 and perhaps PCHNH7 portray convincing results, all having fairly high probabilities and typicalities. Three of these skulls were classified as ‘Black’, likely proving the presence of individuals in the Ibizan populations with sub-Saharan ancestry. Moreover, although the sample is small, it seems that both urban and rural contexts include individuals of sub-Saharan African ancestry. Both male and female skulls were classified in this group. A further discovery appears to be a clear difference between the PORT site and the CNE site in terms of results. The anthropological report for the former cemetery indicated a minimum number of 15 individuals (González-Martín and Lalueza, 1992), and the latter a minimum number of 16 adult individuals (González-Martín and Lalueza, 2001). This means that the skulls represented in the above table, the most complete ones in each sample, comprise 60% and 56.2% of each population respectively. This is insufficient to allow any final interpretation, but it may reveal a more homogenous population in the northern site (PORT) than the other site (CNE). In the PORT sample only one individual (1/9 = 11.1%) is classified as having sub-Saharan ancestry, while in the latter there are more individuals classified in this category (6/9 = 66.6%).
Evergreen Member # 12192
posted Population means from Jordanian Bedouins(Henke and Disi, 1980)provided low probabilities(under 0.500) for either group but high typicalities (over 0.900). The most complete skull from a Phoenician sample from Israel (Smith et al., 1990) provided a ‘Black male’ result with high probability but low typicality. Probabilities ranging between 0.600 and 1.000 in the category ‘Black’, with typicalities mainly under 0.400 were present in Punic skulls from Carthage (Bertholon and Chantre, 1913), Neolithic and proto-historic skulls from Sahara and sub-Saharan Africa (data collected by Chamla, 1968), and in modern African skulls measured by Barras de Aragón (1911). Most of these skulls are of known origin, although others such as the archaeological specimens from Carthage are really of unknown ancestry. However, it may be assumed that most were from that region, perhaps with some individuals from sub-Saharan Africa and the eastern Mediterranean. Many of the skulls classified as ‘Black’ revealed probabilities between 0.600 and 0.900, and low typicalities. In the light of these results, and considering the FORDISC 2.0 results from populations in Iberia, North Africa and sub-Saharan African which have not been presented here due to space limitations, it can be suggested that those Ibizan skulls classified as ‘Black’ with reasonable to high probabilities and low typicalities clearly have an African, and perhaps an Eastern Mediterranean, ancestry
Evergreen Member # 12192
posted Archaeological and historical evidence for the Punic period has revealed a possible immigration to Ibiza from African peoples. Within this framework in mind, measurements from Ibizan skulls were introduced into a forensic discriminant programme, FORDISC 2.0. A dichotomy was apparent from the crania. The results suggest the presence of individuals from both a Caucasoid and a sub-Saharan ancestry. Because Iberian, North African and present-day sub-Sahara African populations are not represented in the programme, populations from known geographical location were tested and explored in order to understand the probabilities and typicalities (see also Márquez-Grant, 2005). Those results were then compared to those deriving from the Ibizan skulls. The ‘Black’ results appearing in the African skulls indicate that the Ibizan skulls under this category, belonged to individuals that probably migrated from this continent or had an African ancestry (e.g. parents or grandparents).
akoben Member # 15244
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If "K-zoids" are dead, as rasolowitz and Co. like to claim, they better explain how this "scientific study" identifies them. Or maybe this team didn't read Bowcock (1991) to "know" that there is no such thing as "K-zoids". Grumman where are you? Seems this is another case of scientists not reading each other.
FaithTest Member # 10819
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Good findings.
While genetic Caucasians don't really exist, as don't racial crania, these findings of Africoid crania are reliable.
1.) The closer to Africa you get the more cranial diversity, meaning diversity that isn't apparent the further one gets.
akoben Member # 15244
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These scientists seem to think they do exist cranially. It would be interesting to find out if they are in fact misclassifying those "Caucasoids" in the classic Hamitc sense.
Djehuti Member # 6698
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^ Either way it is further proof whatever your beef with Bowcock that your people (Europeans) are mixed with Africans from ancient to prehistoric times. We know that pains you, but get over it.
xyyman Member # 13597
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A lot of these studies were posted in Marc's thread on " new to Europe".
There has always been Africans on both sides of the Mediterranean. It makes sense. You can walk from one continent to the other.
The more important question is. . . what happened to these Africans and where these depigmeneted people came from. They are certainly NOT natural to the Mediterranean (either side) since it below the 45th parallel . . . and coastal ie lots of fish
xyyman Member # 13597
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Hey DJ this is getting old. Try something new.
quote: Bowcock that your people (Europeans). . .
xyyman Member # 13597
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Their conclusion most times is always hilarous. They should stick to presenting the data . . .and very little else. I guess these Africans left their parents/grandparents behind and took a steamship or passenger plane to Europe. They don't realize (or pretend or lie) that these people arrive there through demic migration. They didn't emigrate to Europe leaving their parents behind in Africa. Their parents ARE with them. This happened several thousand years ago.
quote:Originally posted by Evergreen: . . . . The ‘Black’ results appearing in the African skulls indicate that the Ibizan skulls under this category, belonged to individuals that probably migrated from this continent or had an African ancestry (e.g. parents or grandparents).
Evergreen Member # 12192
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quote:Originally posted by Evergreen: Archaeological and historical evidence for the Punic period has revealed a possible immigration to Ibiza from African peoples. Within this framework in mind, measurements from Ibizan skulls were introduced into a forensic discriminant programme, FORDISC 2.0. A dichotomy was apparent from the crania. The results suggest the presence of individuals from both a Caucasoid and a sub-Saharan ancestry. Because Iberian, North African and present-day sub-Sahara African populations are not represented in the programme, populations from known geographical location were tested and explored in order to understand the probabilities and typicalities (see also Márquez-Grant, 2005). Those results were then compared to those deriving from the Ibizan skulls. The ‘Black’ results appearing in the African skulls indicate that the Ibizan skulls under this category, belonged to individuals that probably migrated from this continent or had an African ancestry (e.g. parents or grandparents).
Evergreen Writes: This seems to be the most parsimonious explanation for the introduction of mtDNA H lineages into NW Africa. Punic civlization was a civilization of two shores.
Post-last glacial maximum expansion from Iberia to North Africa revealed by fine characterization of mtDNA H haplogroup in Tunisia.
Cherni et al.
Am J Phys Anthropol. 2008 Dec 17;139(2):253-260.
The first large-scale fine characterization of Tunisian H lineages clarifies that the post-Last glacial maximum expansion originating in Iberia not only led to the resettlement of Europe but also of North Africa. We found that 46% of 81 Tunisian H lineages subscreened for 1,580 bp in mtDNA coding region were affiliated with H1 and H3 subhaplogroups, which are known to have originated in Iberia. Although no signs of local expansion were detected, which would allow a clear dating of their introduction, the younger and less diverse Tunisian H1 and H3 lineages indicate Iberia as the radiating centre. Major contributions from historical migrations to this Iberian genetic imprint in Tunisia were ruled out by the mtDNA gene pool similarity between Berber/Arab/cosmopolitan samples and some "Andalusian" communities, settled by the descendents of the "Moors" who once lived in Iberia for 10 centuries (between 8th and 17th centuries), before being expelled to Tunisia.
xyyman Member # 13597
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On “where they came from” , Mike and Marc to have a point on they coming from the Asian Steppes.
If they are two-thirds Asian and one-third African then.. . .yes. . .Asian Steppes origin makes sense. They evolved in Asia and migrated to Greater Africa (ie Europe) where they met Africans living there who they admixed with. Result two-third Asian and one-third African autosomal genes.
Apocalypse Member # 8587
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quote:Their conclusion most times is always hilarous. They should stick to presenting the data . . .and very little else. I guess these Africans left their parents/grandparents behind and took a steamship or passenger plane to Europe. They don't realize (or pretend or lie) that these people arrive there through demic migration. They don't emigrate to Europe leaving their parents behind in Africa. Their parents are with them. This happened several thousand years ago.
FaithTest Member # 10819
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^roflmao I think someone on here said they know that guy and he's on meth.
quote:Originally posted by akoben: These scientists seem to think they do exist cranially. It would be interesting to find out if they are in fact misclassifying those "Caucasoids" in the classic Hamitc sense.
Actually, it's definitely not impossible to identify patterns with which to compare two populations. It's just that cranio-facially we have to be careful not to be too declarative with the "Mathilda"-type measurement classification that has grouped skulls belonging to indigenous ancient Iberian and indigenous ancient Sudanese series to populations as geographically disparate as melanesia australia and the americans.
Such racial anthropology was so simple they were not far past asking the skulls "do you have eyes?" or weighing them and recording it in whole numbers and just guessing.
Evergreen Member # 12192
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quote:Originally posted by Evergreen: THE PRESENCE OF AFRICAN INDIVIDUALS IN PUNIC POPULATIONS FROM THE ISLAND OF IBIZA (SPAIN): CONTRIBUTIONS FROM PHYSICAL ANTHROPOLOGY
Nicholas Márquez-Grant*
ABSTRACT: The origin of the Punic population of Ibiza has been a much debated issue, not only in the field of anthropology, but in archaeology as well. The establishment of rural settlements and the apparent demographic growth throughout the island, especially from the 4th century BC onwards, has been mainly recognised as the result of a colonization process involving a large-scale immigration of people. The material culture from this period seems to indicate that the probable origin of these immigrants was the area of the Central Mediterranean, especially Carthage. This paper compares measurements from Ibizan skulls dating from between the sixth and second centuries BC with craniometric data from modern American populations by employing the forensic discriminant functions of the FORDISC 2.0 (Ousley and Jantz, 1996) computer program. In spite of the method’s limitations, the results seem to suggest the presence of several individuals of North African and sub-Saharan ancestry in Punic Ibiza.
quote:Originally posted by Evergreen: THE PRESENCE OF AFRICAN INDIVIDUALS IN PUNIC POPULATIONS FROM THE ISLAND OF IBIZA (SPAIN): CONTRIBUTIONS FROM PHYSICAL ANTHROPOLOGY
Nicholas Márquez-Grant*
ABSTRACT: The origin of the Punic population of Ibiza has been a much debated issue, not only in the field of anthropology, but in archaeology as well. The establishment of rural settlements and the apparent demographic growth throughout the island, especially from the 4th century BC onwards, has been mainly recognised as the result of a colonization process involving a large-scale immigration of people. The material culture from this period seems to indicate that the probable origin of these immigrants was the area of the Central Mediterranean, especially Carthage. This paper compares measurements from Ibizan skulls dating from between the sixth and second centuries BC with craniometric data from modern American populations by employing the forensic discriminant functions of the FORDISC 2.0 (Ousley and Jantz, 1996) computer program. In spite of the method’s limitations, the results seem to suggest the presence of several individuals of North African and sub-Saharan ancestry in Punic Ibiza.
quote:Originally posted by Evergreen: THE PRESENCE OF AFRICAN INDIVIDUALS IN PUNIC POPULATIONS FROM THE ISLAND OF IBIZA (SPAIN): CONTRIBUTIONS FROM PHYSICAL ANTHROPOLOGY
Nicholas Márquez-Grant*
ABSTRACT: The origin of the Punic population of Ibiza has been a much debated issue, not only in the field of anthropology, but in archaeology as well. The establishment of rural settlements and the apparent demographic growth throughout the island, especially from the 4th century BC onwards, has been mainly recognised as the result of a colonization process involving a large-scale immigration of people. The material culture from this period seems to indicate that the probable origin of these immigrants was the area of the Central Mediterranean, especially Carthage. This paper compares measurements from Ibizan skulls dating from between the sixth and second centuries BC with craniometric data from modern American populations by employing the forensic discriminant functions of the FORDISC 2.0 (Ousley and Jantz, 1996) computer program. In spite of the method’s limitations, the results seem to suggest the presence of several individuals of North African and sub-Saharan ancestry in Punic Ibiza.
quote:Originally posted by Evergreen: THE PRESENCE OF AFRICAN INDIVIDUALS IN PUNIC POPULATIONS FROM THE ISLAND OF IBIZA (SPAIN): CONTRIBUTIONS FROM PHYSICAL ANTHROPOLOGY
Nicholas Márquez-Grant*
ABSTRACT: The origin of the Punic population of Ibiza has been a much debated issue, not only in the field of anthropology, but in archaeology as well. The establishment of rural settlements and the apparent demographic growth throughout the island, especially from the 4th century BC onwards, has been mainly recognised as the result of a colonization process involving a large-scale immigration of people. The material culture from this period seems to indicate that the probable origin of these immigrants was the area of the Central Mediterranean, especially Carthage. This paper compares measurements from Ibizan skulls dating from between the sixth and second centuries BC with craniometric data from modern American populations by employing the forensic discriminant functions of the FORDISC 2.0 (Ousley and Jantz, 1996) computer program. In spite of the method’s limitations, the results seem to suggest the presence of several individuals of North African and sub-Saharan ancestry in Punic Ibiza.
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Excellent work Evergreen. It helps restore this forum to its former heights of scholarly enquiry.
Evergreen Member # 12192
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quote:Originally posted by alTakruri: Excellent work Evergreen. It helps restore this forum to its former heights of scholarly enquiry.
Thank you.
akoben Member # 15244
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quote:Originally posted by alTakruri: Excellent work Evergreen. It helps restore this forum to its former heights of scholarly enquiry.
I don't understand you sometimes Great Jew. I thought your position on ancient Carthage was of the Snowden-type: the blacks on the familiar coins were "riders". Didn't you try to pass of some white figured coins as somehow more authentic?
Brada-Anansi Member # 16371
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GOOOD Work Evergreen,the carvings should put to rest,that Blacks were never present in Kart-Haddast,much less Pre-Islamic Spain. Respect.
alTakruri Member # 10195
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Yettu Gueno!!!
quote:Originally posted by akoben: [QUOTE]I don't understand you
akoben Member # 15244
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^ is that cracker Jew talk or something?
Djehuti Member # 6698
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^ Takes one to know one oh great sodomized cracka!
Moving on...
I agree Evergreen. This is excellent work and a prime example of interdisciplinary study showing not only the black presence of North Africa but Europe as well. No doubt this is what has Wakoben's panties in a bunch!
alTakruri Member # 10195
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It's not Yiddish, JackAssOpen, it's something you'll never ever understand or comprehend.
Sorry Sundjata, I don't often entertain trolls but ol' yeeso wamnde here of course does not recognize Fulfulde when he reads it nor know the difference between a cracker and an Iraqi. Just about what I'd expect from a heritageless wanker who's so ignorant he thinks Jew = Ashkenazi.
quote:Originally posted by akoben: ^ is that cracker Jew talk or something?
akoben Member # 15244
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quote:Just about what I'd expect from a heritageless wanker
Oh please great jew, stop your projecting. You're the one clinging to non-African murder cults (in the words of the great John H. Clarke) for an identity. lol
alTakruri Member # 10195
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Excellent work Evergreen. It helps restore this forum to its former heights of scholarly enquiry.
akoben Member # 15244
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^ yeh but no thanks to you it's soiled with picture spams of misguided negro Zionists such as yourself.
alTakruri Member # 10195
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There was one actual Phoenician skull reported on. "The most complete skull from a Phoenician sample from Israel (Smith et al., 1990) provided a ‘Black male’ result with high probability but low typicality."
Now let's see probability and typicality figures for that Phoenician and some modern west Africans.
The sampled Phoenician has higher 'black' probability and typicality figures than do Fante, Mandinka, or Fulani. Probability and typicality based on Black American males.
Whatbox Member # 10819
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So he was more probable and typical a black based on black American males, than are Mandinkas & Fulanis, but less so than was a Carthaginian and a Portuguese descended African.
Given the high probabilities in each of these instances I would say that could place the individual phenetically between those Central SSAs and black Americans.
Djehuti Member # 6698
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^ I believe typicality refers to the typical set mathematics in statistical data, but I too am interested in the presence of black Phoenicians.
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