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The Dinka Nubian Connection
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[QUOTE]Originally posted by astenb: [QB] [QUOTE]Originally posted by Red, White, and Blue + Christian: [qb] What does the DNA Analysis tell us? From: Y Chromosome Variation Among the Sudanese 2008, The Nilotic groups possess the most ancient lineages of A M13, B M60 and also E M78. While the Beja and Copts and other AfroAsiatic Speakers have many lineages including J1 and R1b! Small amounts of A and B Y chromosomes exist with AfroAsiatic speaking Sudanese groups. BTW, African Men according to a Hammer 2005 .pdf possess A M13 and B M60 at 1.1% and 0.8% respectively. The people who are the so-called "Nubians" carry 8 different Y chromosome lineages including I, J1. J2 and R1b! ------------------------------------------------- The Ancient Nubians in AE paintings are usually jet Black in color with Negroid features. The modern "Nubians" are mixed. [b] A and B are the oldest lineages for living men period. The earliest inhabitants of the Nile were the ancestors of the Nilotics. The earliest Egyptians were Nilotic[/b] . The Ancient Egyptians called themselves Kememu because they were jet Black in color. The gods of Kemet were deified individuals who actual lived in the remote past. [b]usar was a jet Black Nilotic man.[/b] A The original old Kingdom pharaohs were very Black with Negroid features. I've seen it in books that I could not scan at the time. [b]The people of the Oryx, the followers of Set were reddish brown like the modern Somalians and Beja[/b] . They made war against the original jet Black Egyptians who followed Ausar. That's what the Ausar/Set story was probably really about. The war is between men over the patrilineages even today. The women were spared. The women were native Africans as well. Auset, Neith and Hetheru lived on. Consequently, the followers of Set won. The People of the Black Rock - the Nilotic MEN are being hunted and killed even as I write in South Sudan and Darfur. The women are captured for the other side. Even New Kingdom TaSeti pharaohs had jet Black wives. Nothing has changed. [b]Not only have paintings and statues been altered, but the true physical legacy of the first Kememu is being wiped out without a true understanding of how they fit into the AE framework. THE NILOTICS ARE THE REAL NUBIANS AND FIRST ANCIENT EGYPTIANS.[/b] [/qb][/QUOTE]^ This. Forth coming evidence proves some of this is very true. The situation in the Nile Valley as far as peopling is very similar to many other areas around the world. In Europe E-M78, and G2a were some of the earliest lineages in Western Europe, no ancient sample of R1b1b exists....but it was most definitely the most successful late comer. The new data from Otzi the Ice man is more Southern European than even modern Southern Europeans...the people in that area are quite different. In East Asia many of the lineages found in the south Haplogroups K, M, P, S etc are the earliest lineages. Haplogroup O, typical if most East Asians today is the most successful late comer to East Asia. This is clearly the case with YAP lineages (Haplogroup D) that were in Asia prior to the existence of any of these other lineages. This is also the case of Maternal lineage D being an the American founder followed by A, B, C, and X which are more numerous today. And of course in much of Sub Saharan Africa below the equator E1b1a / E-m2 lineages predominate in areas where they may not have been present prior to expansion for areas further North. And in North West Africa we have early E1a and A1a lineages replace by an successful E-M81 founder effect. In Modern Egypt and Sudan The main lineages for the most part are A, B, E and J. Haplogroup J seems to be the mos recent and very successful latecomer , particularly in ALL of Egypt. Then we have E lineages, mainly E-M78 and E-M35. That leaves us with A and B lineages which are likely the earliest. Looking at the Nile Valley today there is no reason to believe that those Earliest inhabitants would NOT have a Genetic profile that is Predominantly A and/or B.....and to a lesser extent E. For those that TRULY look at the Egyptians as migrants from "The South" or Egyptian culture being a "Sudanese Transplant".............taking a look at Sudanese Y profiles which group would we think would parallel the first Egyptians? [URL=http://mathildasanthropologyblog.files.wordpress.com/2008/07/sudan-y-chr.png]Here[/URL] Would it not be the Dinka, Shillk, Nuer and Nuba? When looking at 18th Dynasty results did they resemble the Dinka, Shillk, Nuer and Nuba? Or where they more like E-M78 carriers : Oromo, Beja? When analyzing the idea of Egyptians have origins in "The South" - OTHER THAN PHYSICAL REMAINS, this is stated because those ancestors are still in the South and somewhat intact. In reality those people that are in "The South" likely come FROM the Sahara. It is better then to replace Egyptians "Southern" connections to "Saharan" Connections, those of which who's ancestors now live in the Upper Nile Valley... or Chad, Niger etc. This is not "Admixture", this is a component of the Egyptian mixing pot. [IMG]http://i204.photobucket.com/albums/bb178/beyoku/Loanwords.png[/IMG] [IMG]http://i204.photobucket.com/albums/bb178/beyoku/2740482970_38035536ea_b.jpg[/IMG] [IMG]http://i204.photobucket.com/albums/bb178/beyoku/2730394830_5fafdefc26_o.jpg[/IMG] [IMG]http://i204.photobucket.com/albums/bb178/beyoku/Blench001.png[/IMG] [IMG]http://i204.photobucket.com/albums/bb178/beyoku/NabtaPottery1.png[/IMG] So when looking at Predynastics who is who? Are we looking at the "Erythreans" or the Nilo-Saharans? Notice how far north the "unknown Nilo-Saharan languages on the Nile" are , You can somewhat get a hint but this is not conclusive. Compare the cluster of Naqada, Badari, and A-Group Nubians. Then compare them to Upper and Lower Nile groups. Next compare them with Modern populations. Nagada/Tigre is somewhat telling with the Tigre inhabiting the red sea as "Erythreans". Again this is not conclusive though. [IMG]http://i371.photobucket.com/albums/oo160/brandonpilcher/dendrogram2.jpg[/IMG] The cultural aspect, particularly that which deals with Cattle has been kept intact nearly in its entirety with Upper Nile Nilo-Saharan speakers: [IMG]http://cdn2.all-art.org/Architecture/images/52.jpg[/IMG] [IMG]http://www.ursulagropper.com/images/artists_src/small/SS_Dinka_Cattle_Camp-Sudan_2006.jpg[/IMG] [/QB][/QUOTE]
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