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What Christopher Ehret really thinks about the origins of Afoasiatic speakers
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[QUOTE]Originally posted by dana marniche: [QB] [QUOTE]Originally posted by Djehuti: [qb] [QUOTE]Originally posted by dana marniche: [qb] I think I need to start paying attention to some of the people posting things on this site out of context. Some poster from last year had me believing Christopher Ehret believed Afroasiatics or Afrasians and more specifically Semites didn't come from Africa. I hope others weren't misled as well. [/qb][/QUOTE]I take it you are referring to this thread [URL=http://www.egyptsearch.com/forums/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=8;t=007071]here[/URL]. No, I at least was not mislead since the idiotic troll who created the thread shows a map by Ehret which specifically shows Proto-Afrisian [i]in[/i] Africa. [IMG]http://i56.tinypic.com/29270jo.png[/IMG] ^ Note that Proto-Afrasian according to Ehret did indeed lie along the Erythrean (Red) Sea hill area. [QUOTE][qb][i]The ancestor of the Semitic, Chado-Berber and Egyptian is considered to be Proto-Afrasian and to have emerged in the Erythraean highlands.[/i][/qb][/QUOTE]I find it interesting that Ehret postulates the ancestor of proto-Berber to be the same as that of proto-Chadic. I notice many Euronuts tend to keep quiet about Chadic no doubt because many of its speakers conform to the 'true negroid' type. [b]LOL[/b] Only recently have scholars like geneticist Fulvio Cruciani try to postulate a non-African origin for Chadic speakers due to some of them possessing of R1 haplogroups as discussed [URL=http://www.egyptsearch.com/forums/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=15;t=002456]here[/URL]. The only problem though is that the frequency of R1* and its diversity is greatest in central Western Africa where Chadic speakers are a minority and Niger-Congo speakers predominate! Though there is a presence of R1* Egypt it fails to be identified with Afroasatic since the vast majority of Afroasiatic speakers in general carry hg E. [QUOTE][qb]On page 77 "[i]Among the Erythraite peoples who made Capsian civilization who made the Capsian archaelogical cultures of those areas, domestic cattle were probably present in by sometime in the 7th millenium, if not before.[/i]"[/qb][/QUOTE]I believe Ehret and others identify cattle domestication with Nilo-Saharan speakers since the vocabulary associated with cattle and pastoralism all have Nilo-Saharan roots. [i]"It is possible from this overview of the data to conclude that the limited conceptual vocabulary shared by the ancestors of contemporary Chadic-speakers (therefore also contemporary Cushitic-speakers), contemporary Nilotic-speakers and Ancient Egyptian-speakers suggests that the earliest speakers of the Egyptian language could be located to the south of Upper Egypt (Diakonoff 1998) or, earlier, in the Sahara (Wendorf 2004), where Takács (1999, 47) suggests their ‘long co-existence’ can be found. In addition, it is consistent with this view to suggest that the northern border of their homeland was further than the Wadi Howar proposed by Blench (1999, 2001), which is actually its southern border. Neither Chadics nor Cushitics existed at this time, but their ancestors lived in a homeland further north than the peripheral countries that they inhabited thereafter, to the south-west, in a Niger-Congo environment, and to the south-east, in a Nilo-Saharan environment, where they interacted and innovated in terms of language. From this perspective, the Upper Egyptian cultures were an ancient North East African ‘periphery at the crossroads’, as suggested by Dahl and Hjort-af-Ornas of the Beja (Dahl and Hjort-af-Ornas 2006). The most likely scenario could be this: some of these Saharo-Nubian populations spread southwards to Wadi Howar, Ennedi and Darfur; some stayed in the actual oases where they joined the inhabitants; and others moved towards the Nile, directed by two geographic obstacles, the western Great Sand Sea and the southern Rock Belt. Their slow perambulations led them from the area of Sprinkle Mountain (Gebel Uweinat) to the east – Bir Sahara, Nabta Playa, Gebel Ramlah, and Nekhen/Hierakonpolis (Upper Egypt), and to the north-east by way of Dakhla Oasis to Abydos (Middle Egypt).[/i]"--Anselin (2009) [i]In addition to the archeological and paleontological evidence, recent linguistic studies indicate the presence of early pastoralists in the Eastern Sahara. [b]Detailed analysis of Nilo-Saharan root words has provided "convincing evidence" that the early cultural history of that language family included a pastoralist and food producing way of life, and that this occurred in what is today the south-western Sahara and Sahel belt[/b]. The Nilo-Saharan family of languages is divided into a complex array of branches and subgroups that reflect an enormous time depth. Just one of the subgroups, Kir is as internally complex as the lndo-European family of languages and is believed to have a comparable age. The Sudanese branch is of special interest here. This is particularly true of the Northern Sudanese subfamily that includes a Saharo-Sahelian subgroup, the early homeland of which is placed in northwest Sudan and northeast Chad. Today, the groups that speak Saharo-Sahelian are dispersed from the Niger river eastward to northwestern Ethiopian highlands. The Proto-Northern Sudanic language contains root words such as "to drive," "cow, "grain,""ear of grain," and "grindstone." Any of these might apply to food production, but another root word meaning "to milk" is cetainly the most convincing evidence of incipient pastoralism. There are also root words for "temporary shelter" and "to make a pot." In the succeeding Proto-Saharo-Sahelian language, there are root words for "to cultivate", "to prepare field", to "clear" (of weeds), and "cultivated field." this is the first unambiguous linguistic evidence of cultivation. There are also words for "thombush cattle pen," "fence," "yard," "grannary," as well as "to herd" and "cattle." In the following Proto-Sahelian period, there are root words for "goat," "sheep," "ram," and "lamb," indicating the presence of small livestock. There are root words for "cow," "bull," "ox," and "young cow" or "heifer" and, indeed, a variety of terms relating to cultivation and permanent houses. On the basis of known historical changes in some of the language, Ehret estimates that the Proto-Northern Sudanic language family, [b]which includes the first root words indicating cattle pastoralism, should be dated about 10,000 years ago[/b]. He also estimates that the Proto-Saharan-Sahelian language family, which has words indicating not only more complex cattle pastroalism, but the [b]first indications of cultivation, occurred around 9,000 years ago. He places the Proto-Sahelian language at about 8,500 years ago. These age estimates are just that, and should not be used to suggest any other chronology.[/b] Nevertheless, the sequence of cultural changes is remarkably similar to that in the archeology of the Eastern Sahara and, with some minor adjustments for the beginning of cultivation and for' the inclusion of "sheep" and "goat," reasonably closely to the radiocarbon chronology.[/i] - Fred Wendorf & Romuald Schild, 1994. [QUOTE][qb]But, one wonders how the new discoveries of ancient 3rd and 4th millenium "Afro-Arabian" or "Afro-Tihama" culture in the Yemen will come to fit in with his conclusions.[/qb][/QUOTE]Interesting speculation. I believe Explorer addressed this [URL=http://www.egyptsearch.com/forums/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=15;t=004413]here[/URL] with the significance of Ethio-Semitic languages like Gurage. [/qb][/QUOTE]No, I don't take the illogical postings of the Neandernuts on this site for anything more than what they are. I am talking about a posting by someone whose thinking I actually respect alot, who (possibly not intentionally) made it seem at least to me as if Ehret had given up the idea that semitic-speakers had an African origination. This confused me for awhile. Now I see that he has definitely not given it up. [/QB][/QUOTE]
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