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Iran - Ahmadinejad in hot water over SIN!
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[QUOTE]Originally posted by the lioness,: [QB] [QUOTE]Originally posted by Djehuti: [qb] ^ You guys are still talking about this? Let's face it. Not only is Iran run by Islamic radicals, its rulers are also radical [i]perverts[/i]! [QUOTE]Originally posted by the lyinass,: [qb] ^ Mikes "real Arabs", janjaweed etc, [IMG]http://www.ephotobay.com/image/picture-25-14.png[/IMG] A fifteenth century Persian manuscript depicts pilgrims praying at Mecca in the mosque surrounding the Ka'ba [/qb][/QUOTE]How are you going to dismiss Mike's Arabs as 'Janjaweed' when most of the folks he showed aren't even from Sudan but in the Arabian Peninsula?? Also, why do you keep touting that 15th century (about 800 years after Muhammad) painting by recently converted Persians when despite Shia, the majority Sunnis in Arabia proper would probably not even allow a fellow Muslim to depict folks going around the Kaaba?? [/qb][/QUOTE]You are criticizing me for posting 15th c while Mike posts 19th c European orientalist art of the Ottoman Turkish period. The 15th century is not a period of recently converted Persians. The Mulsim conquest of Persia was 642-644. By the late 11th century, the majority of Persians had become Muslim. Though Iran is known today as a stronghold of the Shi'a Muslim faith, it did not become so until much later, around the 15th century.. The Safavid dynasty made Shi'a Islam the official state religion in the early sixteenth century and aggressively proselytized on its behalf. It is also believed that by the mid-seventeenth century most people in Iran had become Shi'as, an affiliation that has continued. The Quran does not explicitly forbid images of Muhammad, but there are a few hadith (supplemental teachings) which have explicitly prohibited Muslims from creating visual depictions of figures. an figure is central to the Persian miniature and other traditions such as the Ottoman miniature and Mughal painting, and represents a good deal of the attractiveness of Islamic art for non-Muslims.The Persian miniature tradition began when Persian courts were Sunni, and continued after the Shia Safavid dynasty took power. Shah Tahmasp I of Persia began as a keen patron and amateur artist himself, but turned against painting and other forbidden activities after a religious crisis in mid-life. From the 13th to 17th century depictions of Muhammad, in later examples usually veiled,) and other prophets or Biblical characters, like Adam (Adem), Abraham (Ibrahim)[ or Jesus (Isa)[ and Solomon (Sulaymān)[ and Alexander the Great (often identified as Dhul-Qarnayn, a figure in the Quran), became common in painted manuscripts from Persia, India and Turkey. The Islamic Golden Age is an Abbasid historical period lasting until the Mongol conquest of Baghdad in 1258. The golden age of Islamic (and/or Muslim) art lasted from 750 to the 16th century, when ceramics (especially lusterware), glass, metalwork, textiles, illuminated manuscripts, and woodwork flourished.[citation needed] Manuscript illumination became an important and greatly respected art, and portrait miniature painting flourished in Persia.Depictions of Muhammad date back to the start of the tradition of Persian miniatures as illustrations in books. The illustrated book from the Persianate world (Warka and Gulshah, Topkapi Palace Library H. 841, attributed to Konya 1200-1250) contains the two earliest known Islamic depictions of the Prophet.[30] This book dates to before or just around the time of the Mongol invasion of Anatolia in the 1240s, and before the campaigns against Persia and Iraq of the 1250s. Depictions of Muhammad are also found in Persian manuscripts in the following Timurid and Safavid dynasties, and Turkish Ottoman art in the 14th to 17th centuries, and beyond. Figurative art in Islam goes back to the Bagdad school and the House of Wisdom of the Abassids. [QUOTE]Originally posted by Djehuti: the majority Sunnis in Arabia proper would probably not even allow a fellow Muslim to depict folks going around the Kaaba[/QUOTE]the religious hadith point of view is irrelevant to the fact that some 15th c. Persian muslims made this painting depicting the Haajj The 19th century orientalist painters whom Mike posts weren't even Muslim. But the point is irrelevant [/QB][/QUOTE]
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