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who were the MOORS
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[QUOTE]Originally posted by kawashkar: [QB] [QUOTE] 1. How do you define a 'caucasoid'' What > exactly makes a caucasoid a caucasoid and how > does it apply to the Berbers?[/QUOTE]Impossible. If you things in a broader sense all humans belong to the same race. Now, Berbers look like Southern Europeans with some "admixture". What exist between Germany and Ghana is a "cline". A gradient of phenotypes that goes between German blonds to dark skinned Subsaharian Africans. The point is. Where do you make the cut? In Gibraltar or in the Sahara desert? As the matter of fact the change in complexion is more abrupt crossing the Sahara than crossing the Gibraltar strait. [QUOTE] The physical apperance of one French Algerian soccer player is a non-sequitir. I asked you to define ''caucasoid'' and from what criteria of ''caucasoid'' do Berber speakers fit such a label? What evidence do you have that ties Spainards in with Berber speaking people? [/QUOTE]The point is quite clear. Spaniards, Portugueses, Italians and Southern French have a high degree of admixture with North Africans. So, it does not matter how you define "Caucasian". The fact is they belong to a population that is closely related between themselves rather than with both Northern Europeans or Subsaharian Africans. See the distances in the map and you will figure it out. North Africa is right besides Spain, Italy and France, and a lot closser than Ghana or Russia. [QUOTE] Could you please cite examples. Which literature are you referencing? Arabic literature or Spainard literature? What specifically do such writers use to differentiate Berbers,Arabs, or sub-Saharans? [/QUOTE]Spanish classical literature. In there the descriptions of Moors are quite amazing. Most of them are brown but many rulers are blond. Actually Moors have a fascination with slav women so they were usually the favorites. King Alphonse X the wise, for instance, once describe with a lot of surprise a Black general of the Moors armies. That was not something common to see. In classicals like Mio Cid you can see how Moors and Christians were the same people, plus some upper classes comming mainly from the Middle east and a low class Moor minority comming from North Afric. [QUOTE] [QUOTE]Yes, but they were the first that brought a subsaharian army, drums included, to Spain. And Yes, but they were the first that brought a subsaharian army, drums included, to Spain. And that was the last drop that initiated the reconquest of Spain by the Christians[/QUOTE]Ausar responds: This is not true. Ever since the conquest of Spain some Western Africans groups were part of both the Arabic and Berber forces. [/QUOTE]That's is really true. It is written in the Mio Cid. The XII Century classic. The first invaders of the 7th Century were Berbers and Arabs, but in the 12th Century the new fanatic muslims, who at those times had invaded Subsaharian Africa, brough for the first time an army formed by Subsaharians whose drums spread terror in the civil population. That was one of the causes the Christian knight got serious with the reconquest. And you can see that was the beginning of the end of Al-Andalus. KAWASHKAR [/QB][/QUOTE]
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