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[QUOTE]Originally posted by Djehuti: [QB] [QUOTE]Originally posted by dana marniche: [qb] I am not aware of any recent studies connecting the Lebou with Canaanites, but i have heard that some archeologists are connecting them with the Israelites. I think your assesment of the Tuareg appearance of the Lebou of the Ramessid period and of the latter with Canaanites is very insightful and probably correct. It would fit in the Tuareg claim of Canaanite and Phoenician ancestry. Personally it is my belief that like the Philistines, the later dark-skinned Lebou the Ramesid period represent people of Canaanite origin. The former however may have settled in the Aegean like the Tjeker and come in with the fairer skinned Sea People.[/qb][/QUOTE]The studies I speak of that connect Libyans with Canaanites are not recent but old. The connection in particular is not that Libyans are of Canaanite descent but that both Libyans and Canaanites share a common ancestry via the Egyptian delta. One source that I specifically remember is a book on Minoan and early Aegean civilization in which the author cites early emigration to Crete from Africa from neolithic to early Bronze Age times. He even calls the Bronze Age emigration a kind of exodus perhaps due to political upheaval of Egypt's unification under Narmer where refugees were displaced both to the west of the Delta in Libya as well as east to the Levant. We know that there is strong evidence both archaeologically as well as genetically that proto-Semtic entered Southwest Asia through the Levant which correlates with such migrations from the Egypt's Delta. Hopefully I can get my hands on that book on Minoan civilization, so I can post that info. [QUOTE][qb]I don't know about two Philistine groups. I know that people say that these Philistines from Medinet Habu are attired in Aegean wear. I also know that the Hebrews make them descendants of the Keftiu. I don't identify Crete as the sole habitat of the Keftiu or Caphturim as you say. According to Near Eastern scholars the name Keftiu may have referred to the Aegean coasts in general.[/qb][/QUOTE]Archaeologists identify two main groups historically called 'Philistines' with an earlier little known Bronze Age group and a later Iron Age group that is definitively identified as Aegean and was the very group the Isrealites waged war on. [QUOTE][qb]William Hallo and William Simpson for example wrote the name is "generally held to designate Crete and perhaps the Aegean coasts as well". They point out that the name Keftiu is associated with the name Kizzuwatna for the Cilician coast which was also called Keti by the Egyptians. The name is also supposed to be a variant of Katpatuka (Cappadocia) of Syria/Anatolia and the the name Kaphturim are associated with the Casluhet who settled in or near Pelusium near Egypt.[/qb][/QUOTE]Identifying ancient peoples based on the names of one language is hard enough, but going through all these transliterations and other names that may or may not be related I find to be a mess. All I know that Israelite records say Philistim is descendant of Casluhim and both Casluhim and Caphtorim are sons of Mizraim. The name 'Casluhim' looks most like the Casluhet. And in my opinion Kapthorim looks most like Egyptian Keftiu. If this folk tradition is true, then these peoples have their origins in Egypt. [QUOTE][qb]I believe the Musuri or Masrah of the Syro-Arabian area were a remnant of those "black Syrians" from whom had come the Kasluhim and Kafturim (Kethu or Kizzuwat), Lebou or Lehabim and Philistines or Peleset. In Hebrew texts the last 4 came from the Mitzraim which was the name of a tribe in the Levant which should not be confused with the region called Egypt today. They were all descended from one people who settled Syria and other places in the Mediterranean and Aegean during the Hyksos period. i learned from the ANE forum a long time ago that the Musri were called Meluhha while the Arabians and Hebrews called them the Amlukh or Amalekites.[/qb][/QUOTE]If you identify Mizraim with a Levantine people instead of Egypt, this where I get confused since I'm so used to associating the name with Egypt. I take it then, that Biblical Cush in this case would be Arabian instead of the African Kush. Canaan is still Levantine, so what about 'Phut'? [QUOTE][qb]As I mentioned previously these Qeti or Kethwat or Keftiu must be the Khethim of Josephus whom he claimed had colonized the Cyprus and the Mediterranean under Cethimus. The latter is most likely "Cathim the Amalekite" ruler of Arabian tradition. Thus, we find peoples named Khetim, Maketa, Ketama all over the ancient Mediterranean and Aegean, and north Africa whom are undoubtedly the "Ethiopians" who Greek tradition once said to have to the mountain of Atlas (Daris).[/qb][/QUOTE]It's tempting, but can one possibly connect this 'Cethimus' to the Cadmus of Greek legends who supposedly founded the city-state of Thebes and introduced the alphabet to Greece? According to Greek lore Cadmus was a Phoenician prince and we know that Phoenicia or ancient Canaan was also known to the Greeks as 'Aethiopia'. In the same [URL=http://Ahttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cadmus]Argive legends[/URL], Cadmus's father Agenor is the founder of Aethiopia just as his brother Belus is founder of Egypt and both are sons are Libya (Africa) by Poseidon. [QUOTE][qb]After some time in control of Egypt these Kethim or Misraim must have been pushed westward. At some point in time one group of them must have intermingled with Sea People or some other white Mediterranean population. This is most probably why there as least one figure that is sometimes said to be either Hittite and Libyan.[/qb][/QUOTE]Control of Egypt when? Are you identifying them with the Hyksos? [QUOTE][qb]As as early as the Old Kingdom early peoples of the delta and Fayum were supposedly trading through Memphis with the Sinai and Levant, and in my mind these people were related. The neolithic peoples of the Levant (Tahun of Jordan, Jericho, Neolithic B in Palestine) and Fayum were connected probably biologically or "genetically" as well. These same peoples show links to Chatal Huyuk. It may be in this way that the semitic dialects first entered the Levant. [/qb][/QUOTE]Of course. We've discussed how Semitic languages were introduced to Southwest Asia via the Levant along with African lineages plenty of times. [/QB][/QUOTE]
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