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[QUOTE]Originally posted by Mystery Solver: [QB] [QUOTE]Originally posted by Asar Imhotep: We can associate "Kaa" or it's varients "Kha" with blackening, a fire process, like all other Bantu words because it is attested to in the Egyptian language itself.[/QUOTE]Well, you may proceed with doing that with Bantu "Kaa", but you'll have to have more objective evidence that Egyptic "kem" means anything else but 'black'; not "blacker", "blackening" or "blackened", but just plainly "black". [QUOTE]Originally posted by Asar Imhotep: Budge - Hieroglyphic Dictionary /ch/ or /kh/ which is phonetically consistent with /k/. Remember vowels are passive... pg 285 M'Kha - fire, flame, to burn up pg 385 Kha - furnace, fire place, cauldron, pg 531 Khaam - heat, fire, hot, feaver Gods pg 526 Khe-t-uat-en-Ra -- A FIRE goddess Khe-t-em-Amentiu --- the FIRE gods of Amenti Khe-t-ankh-am-f -- a FIERY serpent goddess Khe-ti -- FIRE spitting serpent Other pg. 526 Khe-t -- fire, flame, heat, to burn pg 572 Khamm - to blaze, to be hot Kha-t -- heated, excited Kha-t -- people, mankind (attested to in Ferg Somo's essay on Km.t) ****************************** All of the above (save the last entry) deal with a fire process and is attested to in the various Bantu languages already mentioned. The word Km.t is just a play and a agglutination with the word "kaa" or "kha." [/QUOTE]You do realize that you aren't challenging the meaning of "Kem" as the equivalent of English "black", i.e. the color of "black", "charcoal", or "complete darkness" - right? [QUOTE]Originally posted by Asar Imhotep: [QUOTE] But supposedly used in analytical documents of the time, like say, the Kahun papyrus? Matter of fact, doesn't seem that the pharaonic system of governance was separated from ideas of spirituality. What do you suppose all that talk of the living pharaoh symbolizing Horus, while the passed away Pharaoh symbolized the person of Ausar, was all about? [/QUOTE]I don't see what you are trying to get at when my argument has partly been about the priesthood of Ta-Meri.[/QUOTE]If you don't see the point, maybe you should try reading the comment the quote above was addressing. [QUOTE]Originally posted by Asar Imhotep: You could not (as in all indigenous African societies) hold any place of government without being initiated into the priesthood. So if a governmental official uses "priestly" language, it would fit given the fact he's in the priesthood.[/QUOTE]See above, so as to respond appropriately. [QUOTE]Originally posted by Asar Imhotep: [QUOTE] How do you square this with claims that it appears in the "Book of the Dead", which is believed to have been authored sometime by the first Dynasty? [/QUOTE]Article titled "Kemet and Other Egyptian Terms for Their Land" written by Ogden Goelet in: * Ki Baruch Hu: Ancient Near Eastern, Biblical, and Judaic Studies in Honor of Baruch A. Levine by R. Chazan, W. W. Hallo, L. H. Schiffman[/QUOTE]...and this addresses what you're quoting above in what way? [QUOTE]Originally posted by Asar Imhotep: [QUOTE] Quite simply, it is "blackness" or "complete darkness" that is considered "sacred", and generally associated with longivity, fertility, and other traits of strength embodying 'renewal' and eternity. [/QUOTE]Once again refer to the other references already cited. [/QUOTE]They are immaterial - they don't address anything I've raised. [QUOTE]Originally posted by Asar Imhotep: [QUOTE] None of which were "Bantu" speakers; you have yet to establish this. [/QUOTE]Once again, this has already been established numerous times on this board[/QUOTE]Where? [QUOTE]Originally posted by Asar Imhotep: in several different post about the Bantu vocabulary in Egyptian Language. Scholars like Obenga in "Les Peuples Bantu, Tome Ii : Migrations, Expansion Et Identité Culturelle" & Les Bantu: Langues, peuples, civilisations (Unknown Binding). Ferg Somo has done numerous work on cognates that haven't been published. Also my own research on Bantu spiritual and ritual concepts in Ancient Ta-Meri places the Bantu people in Egypt. Their oral traditions place them in Egypt and the Sahara pre desertification. The Bantu presence in Ta-Meri is established.[/QUOTE]I've asked ad infinitum for Obenga's supposed establishment of closer relationship of the Bantu subphylum and the Niger-Congo superphylum in general to Egyptic than that of Egyptic to the Afrasan superphylum, and nothing to date has been produced. I've already asked you to address those pressing issues I raised about the supposed lexical cognates shared between Egyptic and Kiswahili, along with *elaborate* grammatical cognates shared between Egyptic and that language and other Bantu languages, but your response to that is still pending. No Bantu language is spoken in the lower Nile Valley [Egypt-Sudan], and there is no indication of Bantu speakers being in the Sahara. In fact, Ancient Egyptian language is deemed to be older than Bantu, since *proto-Bantu* has only been dated back to 5000 years ago *at the most* and 3000 years ago at the least. The homeland of this *proto-Bantu* language is traced back to the region straddling Nigeria and Cameroon, which makes sense when one looks at the linguistic map presented earlier. If proto-Bantu language, from which Kiswahali ultimately derived, is not even as old as Egyptic, then how can Egyptic have derived its terms from Kiswahili [as pointed out in your Freg citation], which wasn't even "born" at the turn of pre-dynastic period. So no, neither you or anybody else has established Bantu presence in either predynastic or dynastic Egypt. [QUOTE]Originally posted by Asar Imhotep: A few concepts to demonstrate Nkwa - life - Akan Nkwa - life/living - Kongo Nkwa kimoyo (a priest)- life (one who is life (fire starter) in the community)- Kongo Nkwi-ki - living - Kongo bantu Ankh (nkwa) - life - Ta-Meri The root of all of these is /nk/. The /wa/ is a passive suffix which indicates that the subject is being acted upon by an agent. The Ankh symbol is a Bantu symbol for someone who has graduated from the priesthood (an Nganga/ Nkwa-moyo). Another term dUa.t = place deceased spirits go, home of asar. Proto-Bantu dUa - meaning island In the Egyptian dua.t, all of the land inside the dua.t is referred to as an "island." I could go on for days on the conceptual ideas expressed in Ta-Merrian culture, but it would take too much space on a message board. [/QUOTE]I am sure you could go on for days on conceptual ideas and other things, but how about first addressing those things I raised about your Freg citation? Other points will be discussed in good time, and space is not an issue - bringing this Bantu in Egypt thesis to its logical conclusion is what counts. [/QB][/QUOTE]
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